If you didn’t see this, you really missed out. Matthews performs an abortion on Kucinich’s already feeble candidacy:
MATTHEWS: We
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Congressman Kicinich Swings and Misses on Hardball
Balloon Juice has posted this excerpt of Chris Matthews’s hardball running circles around Presidential contender Dennis Kucinich of Ohio….
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King Dweeb
I noted a while back that Joe Lieberman came in a close second to Dennis Kucinich in the dweeb category. I’ve been itching for the opportunity to post the above picture, courtesty of the gents over at Power Line….
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Ow ow ow OUCH!
Chris Matthews rips Dennis Kucinich a new one: MATTHEWS: We’re back with more “Political Buzz” with Congressman Dennis Kucinich of…
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I’m Actually Sorry I Missed This
Dennis Kucinich behind the Hard-eight-ball.
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Kuninich Gets Nailed
John Cole has a good post on Dennis Kucinich getting hammered over the abortion issue on Hardball by Chris Matthews. Read the transcript John posts, but my favorite line is at the end when Matthews goes to his other guest:…
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Kucinich and Freinds and The Radical Left
Yesterday Big Dog posted a list here of the house critters that were requesting a challenge to the ’04 Presidential election results.
One of our readers,
Andrew Lazarus
To my mind Kucinich’s candidacy is a joke, but what exactly does it mean to make abortion illegal, as many people wish to do, if not jail? A mere fine? A scarlet “A” brand?
When GWH Bush misspoke on this in a debate against Dukakis, his aides rushed out the next day to say, “No, only the doctor would go to jail.” But that doesn’t make the slightest sense under common law: the pregnant woman and the doctor have entered together into a conspiracy and under our legal principles, it should be illegal for both or neither. Now, maybe that’s not how the Scalia law would be written, but that would be consistent, and I believe also the status quo ante Roe.
John Cole
Every piece of legislation ever proposed has had criminal terms for the Doctor only. The position of the pro-life movement is that the woman having the aborton is as much a victim as the unborn.
I am unsure if there has ever been legislation proposing the woman go to jail. I am nominally pro-choice- what I find breathtaking is the absolute hypocrisy of Kucinich and the fact that he would name someone when he had no idea how the man felt.
A real weasel.
mj
Andrew:
“But that doesn’t make the slightest sense under common law: the pregnant woman and the doctor have entered together into a conspiracy and under our legal principles”
It does have legal precedent though. Many prostitution laws have been amended to remove criminal status for the prostitute. This is designed to prevent violence by allowing them to charge attackers (Johns or pimps) without facing charges themselves.
Andrew Lazarus
MJ: Can you cite a jurisdiction for this? Sure, prostitutes are promised immunity for testimony against violent johns, but that doesn’t make the act legal. Now, there are places where prostitution is legal and procuring (pimping) isn’t, but that’s a completely different matter. There isn’t any conspiracy to perform an illegal act; one party is generally acting under duress.
John, the reason that the laws are drafted against the doctor only is because that’s the only way they’ll fly politically. Bush-41 found that out debating against Dukakis. Whatever else, the Right-to-Life movement has succeeded in marginalizing “abortion doctors”. Before Roe, it was also a criminal act on the part of the expectant woman. But as a matter of legal philosophy, putting all of the onus on the doctor makes no sense at all. This is as brain-dead as prosecuting a “hit man” while not prosecuting the person who hired him.
As far as Kucinich and his abortion flip-flop, and also his lack of specificity in the interview, I am in agreement with the original post.
mj
I didn’t say it made the act legal. I stated that the prohibition is legally enforeable against one party but not the other, which of course is different from immunity.
Sorry, no jurisdiction. If I run across it again I’ll post it here.
Sean
as someone who is somewhat liberal, I must admit to being quite embarassed at this sad sack’s attempt to hijack the “progressive leader” label for himself, and the fact that some people actually buy it
he’s not very progressive. he’s sure not a leader. he’s a pathetic jackass who feeds into all the weird/embarassing/ugly/new-age/vegan/hopelessly-out-of-touch “liberal” stereotype and makes us all the worse for it. ugh. he needs to join pat robertson out on mars or something..or at least just stop opening his mouth.
so kudos to Matthews for knocking him down a peg (not that hes very high to begin with), even if Dennis’ pandering did make my good man Dean look much more moderate, sensible, and leaderly in comparison
anon
That was a hack job that reflected badly on Matthews far more than it did on Kucinich.
anon
That was a hack job that reflected badly on Matthews far more than it did on Kucinich.
M. Scott Eiland
That exchange reminded me of the SNL spoofs of “Hardball,” except that Kucinich actually managed to make the parodies of Al Sharpton, et al., seem presidential by comparison. Matthews might as well have been playing T-ball the way that Kucinich was leaving him openings to slam him. A hack job indeed–but a royal hack like Kucinich deserves no better.
greg
That was quite a beat-down. I wonder how long it’ll be before we hear about Matthews–worked for Tip O’Neill and Jimmy Carter–being a right-wing shill.
And M.Scott, those SNL bits are the best.
wallster
Matthews is a right-wing shill. Sorry but a fact is a fact. I worked for an insurance company once, but does that make me a right-winger? You are what you are now.
John Cole
Matthews is a moderate, left of center Democrat. He is a defecit hawk, he believed in the great society, yet he was virulently anti-communist.
Matthews biggest problem with left-wing viewers is that he expects more out of Democrats than he does Republicans (which is why he was so disgusted with Cliton and Gore). IF you examine his positions, though, calling him right-wing is farcical.
Andrea Markman
While Dennis Kucinich’s abortion views do indicate a significant change of heart, I find it appalling that so many of you want to call him a hack and an embarrassment, and worst yet, a pretender to the title of progressive candidate. I suggest you check his website. A reading of his platform would certainly show that he is far more progressive than Dean (death penalty? gun control?). Whether that makes him an electable candidate is up to you, but to dismiss the rest of his views seems a bit ridiculous. He is neither a hack, nor an embarrassment. He is simply far to the left. That is no reason to condemn him.
Andrew Lazarus
Yes. I read he was in tears over Gore’s excellent concession speech. (Probably wishes we’d counted all those votes now, or stopped the GOP from dropping anyone sharing the name of a felon from the voter rolls, or even run the Palm Beach Ballot by a UI engineer.)
Tatterdemalian
I voted for Gore. If those actions kept Gore from winning (or even actually took place, which is doubtful), I’m glad for it. I have no doubt that if Gore were president, he would still be apologizing to China and begging them to return the spy plane, in between negotiations to surrender to bin Laden.
Andrew Lazarus
Tatters, you seem to have missed the fact that the ace Chinese agent who was screwing the FBI’s conuter-Chinese-intelligence honcho was a REPUBLICAN fundraiser. Maybe that’s why they didn’t catch her for years despite all those clues.
Makes Gore’s China position look better.
I’m wondering how people juggle the idea Democrats would have been soft on Bin Laden with the old slure about Democrat Wars. Or for that matter, the fact that “Osama, Dead or Alive” is (another) Bush promise he hasn’t delivered.
Shawn Redden
Matthews is an ignorant hack on virtually every issue. Earlier in this same episode, he asked Joe Biden if there had been a coup in the NSC that’s calling the shots in the White House without offering a shred of proof. In the SAME episode, he gives the fascist, homophobic Rick Santorum (R-KKK) the most fawning interview in the world.
Then he comes to Kucinich — the ONLY Presidential candidate who actually organized opposition to the Iraq war, opposed the Stalinist Patriot Act, and fought against job-killing NAFTA. His positions on these issues alone make for an extended interview, but that’s not where Matthews goes. Instead, he introduces Kucinich by playing clips of the moronic, opportunistic hack Dean (who is against the war when it’s convenient and silent when it’s not), a low-blow to start. Then, after Kucinich hit the first question out of the park (about Bush’s lying, deceitful stance on Iraq), Matthews then goes into fanatic mode, screaming and ranting, refusing to allow Kucinich to answer the abortion question.
And you’ll notice the decieitful rhetorical switch Matthews pulled — changing Kucinich’s word — ‘criminilize’ (which is accurate) with ‘put in jail’ (which is not accurate) as he’s lamblasting him with a screaming, idiotic rant.
The fact of the matter is that Kucinich is the only candidate who will work to eliminate the corporate stranglehold of our government, and the corporately owned networks know this. His candidacy is a grassroots one, and it will have to operate that way, because the hostility seen in the Matthews interview will be demonstrated with a unseen relentlessness as we move forward.
Finally, the next day, the Congressman Kucinich cited, Chris Smith, went on the program and made Kucinich’s point for him.
Matthews, despite being wrong and outrageous throughout, has yet to apologize. Which, I suppose, is why his ratings are where they’re at.
And, as for Kucinich’s looks being an issue, has ANYONE looked at the Unelected Fraud in the White House lately?
Shawn Redden
Andrew Lazarus
I might add that we had dinner company last week, one of whom (unbeknownst to me) lived in Cleveland during Kucinich’s mayoralty. She said he was dreadful. I might add, she’s a very-left-liberal.
The one GOOD think about Kucinich is his presence in the race may keep his followers from organizing or helping Ralph until too late.
tom
so, chris matthews goes from being a moderate-to-left commentator to compeltely conservative because jack welch paid him too, and he’s somehow qualified to say dennis kucinich is not a serious candidate? i’d consider such criticism if it were from a serious journalist, but matthews has proven himself a loyal whore for cheney and rove. it’s sad to read comments from so many people so insecure with themselves that they feel the need to insult a humble and sincere man like kucinich.
Shawn Redden
If Kucinich was so bad in Cleveland, why did he run on the platform in 1996 against one of Newt’s boys on his mayoral platform.
He won a 2:1 Republican district in 1996 49/48.
In 98, he got 65%.
In the last 2 elections, he’s gotten 74%.
It’s amazing that NONE of his critics will address even one of his positions.
I wonder why that is.
MP
It is amazing to me that anyone could suggest that Chris Matthew’s childish, unprofessional behavior actually reflected badly on Dennis Kucinich! Kucinich may have been a little surprised by Matthews but that was probably because he was expecting Matthews to behave like a serious journalist. (which he isn’t). Those who dislike Kucinich may have their reasons, but the fact remains that he is the ONLY truly progressive candidate in the presidential race. It makes perfect sense that he will be attacked most severely by the corporate media.
WWW.KUCINICH.COM
http://WWW.KUCINICH.COM
The only reason the little troll is running for president is because (by his own admission) he is a failed congressman. This whole “campaign” is nothing more than a public relations pitch to enhance his name among the politically powerful. His modus operandi is obvious; focus on and attract those people who are so far out in left field (beyond the foul poll) so as to offer a corner of the political market to whichever democrat gets the nomination. Thankfully, in his desperate attempt to enhance his name nationally, he has diminished it locally and after the November 2004 congressional election his political career will have finally come to an end.
cartman414
“The only reason the little troll…”
Well, I guess it really does take one to know one, especially given your e-mail address. Your post makes me wonder if you even read Kucinich’s website.