Oliver still refuses to admit that the administration was not behind the ‘astroturf’ letters he accused them of writing the other day, and comments:
There’s the difference between Bush-approved astroturf as we saw before, and this sort of thing which springs up from Bush supporters as well. I never used to be skeptical of our armed forces but they have been so politicized as of late that I have a hard time believing that spontaneously a fradulent letter bolstering the administration’s line on Iraq just happened to strafe across the country. It may not have come from Rove & Co. but the apple doesn’t appear to fall far from the tree.
Was it considered politicizing soldiers when you posted a letter from ONE soldier in Iraq that was reprinted over and over again in left-wing rags, including Common Dreams, the site you used as a source, Oliver?
Soldier’s Story
One of those serving in Iraq tells a story (via Tapped)
With No Plan Apparent, GIs in Iraq Slowly Becoming Frantic
My unit processes incoming soldiers and helps soldiers redeploy for theater. We are doing a great job and are working hard to treat each soldier with care and consideration as they come past our desks. They have spread our 44 soldiers out to replace an active unit that had over 50 and to replace a National Guard unit that had over 60 soldiers. Not only are we running 24-hour operations seven days a week for these two units, but we have four of our soldiers on the redeployment side working validation for another unit! We are spread so thin and are working so hard that these knocks on our morale are devastating.
Yes, we are physically able to finish our mission, but mentally and spiritually we are dying.
If retention for the Army National Guard is of any importance, current members need to have faith in our government and our leaders. Right now, where we are, we can’t see anyone taking a stand for the soldiers (as it isn’t just us being treated this way but many, many soldiers).
This isn’t a simple board game of Axis and Allies, this is a game people are playing with real people – people with families, not robots. You have college students out here (like me) missing over a year of college to sit and get yanked around without explanation. It has been told to the officers I have spoken to that 3rd PERSCOM refers to moving soldiers as “drug deals.” You do this for me and I’ll make sure your soldiers go home, etc.
Yes, without a doubt my duty is to serve my country despite her faults. I have learned I will not be able to get education and training services while I am here and I am accepting that. I am here to serve out of obligation and duty. What I’m wondering is if there are any checks and balances for those who are making decisions here?
At some point, when people continue to regurgitate the DNC line, despite knowing it is false, they are no longer merely wrong but are now appropriately labeled as liars.
Pauly
Yeah, I responded to that post a while back and found a bunch of accounts that show both sides of the situation in Iraq so people could draw their own conclusions:
hereticalideas.com/archives/001177.html
The response? Check the comments :p
Oliver is a joke
See the left resort to the old “All she needs is a good lay” canard. Tasteful.
ucomics.com/boondocks/2003/10/14/
Oliver
John, the representation from the right of the blogosphere has been continually “all goes well in Iraq”, when that’s completely false and obvious to anyone who doesn’t have GWB blinders on. The letter I linked was actually written by a soldier in Iraq, and not the product of a PR campaign. Furthermore that story is a reprint from the Madison Capital Times, which you would have noticed if you waited a moment for your knee to quit jerking.
On one hand, an authentic letter from a soldier. On the other, a form letter that portrays the administration’s pov on Iraq and was released with soldiers names in an unauthorized fashion.
At some point when people ignore the facts because it may hurt the leader they hold so dear, it becomes a smear.
Jay Caruso
John, the representation from the right of the blogosphere has been continually “all goes well in Iraq”, when that’s completely false and obvious to anyone who doesn’t have GWB blinders on.
Oliver, that is a complete stinking load of bullsh*t. I want you to show me one of the more well known conservative bloggers who have said that “All is going well in Iraq.”
This is a standard theme for you liberals. Conservatives show you that things aren’t going as bad you say it is and you turn around and accuse us of saying everything is going great.
It’s intellectual dishonest at it’s worst.
John Cole
So a great number of letters (nbot the one you are currently lying abut) saying that things aren’t as bad as the media and the Democrats are portraying them serves as politicization of the armed forces, but your letter is just the straight dope? Try another tact.
At any rate, your politicization remark was regarding the lie about the administration being the source of the most recent letters. It has been shown that the administration was not behind this ,yet you continue to peddle this because you are simply incapable of stating “I was wrong.”
John Cole
Another thing- regarding the ‘on the one hand , an authentic letter.”
There have been thousands of letters stating positive developments in Iraq- you must have ignored them on your way to the latest Krugman piece.
RW
Let’s give OW some leeway….elections haven’t been going to his liking for quite a while & so he’s willing to adopt any stance to insure that the trend won’t continue.
The Drum bandwagon (that left rationality behind months ago, on it’s way to planet eschaton/DU) appears to be picking up passengers.
Too bad…
JKC
So how about someone saying that astroturf letters, regardless of their origin, are a bad thing?
This is the USA, after all. We’re supposed to get the facts and decide for ourselves, not read form letters from some officer bucking for a promotion. Or is it now the position of the Right that the US press should act like Pravda and print only the (GOP) party line?
Terry
Why do you guys keep reading Oliver or paying any attention to what he says on major issues such as Iraq? On substantive matters such as Iraq, Oliver has about as much gravitas as the hole in a doughnut.
RW
Actually, JKC, those are similar thoughts to what I had when I saw those elementary schoolers being instructed on what to write to their congressmen after the NEA told the teachers the talking points during the great 1995 “starving children” crusade.
It’s always an iffy situation when someone in power is instructing an underling on what to write – hence the constant harping about the current ideological monopoly in our schools of higher education.
It gets interesting when one thinks outside the box, no?
JKC
You may be shocked to know that we’re actually in agreement, more or less, RW.
I think there’s a difference between a set of talking points from a union and a “request” from a battalion commander, but it’s a matter of degree.
I’m more concerned, though, by the propaganda element of this episode. That, it seems to me, is fundamentally un-American.
David Perron
Are you attempting to stifle dissent again, JKC. Man, you Lefties are just fascists.
Said with no small amount of kidding, just to be clear.
addison
Considering I’m kept up to date on goings on in Iraq on a weekly basis by a person in an engineering unit responsible for power, water, and public works projects, I can write with some legitimacy that there is a significant amount of good along with many setbacks–some the unknown unknowns of any project and others acts of sabotage.
No one–NO ONE–has made the case that Iraq is rosy and lovely and smelling like tulips. What they want people to realize is that a significant amount of progress has been made *despite* the setbacks and intermittent attacks on troops (I do mourn their loss but must note that three troops attacked out of 200,000 is not a significant percentage).
David Perron
Glenn Reynolds just posted a link to this. But it’s probably just more Republican lies.
Nethercutt and Senor highlighted the return of electricity to Iraq, which now has a higher megawatt output than it did before the war. Reconstruction has targeted schools and hospitals, and the Americans are spending 3,500 percent more on health care than Saddam Hussein did, Senor said.
That last bit doesn’t tell us much, admittedly. Still, this has all just got to be whitewash. Wonder why Democrat congresscritters aren’t going over there to investigate the truth?
David Perron
Oh, and Aaron McGruder’s never, ever been even within shouting distance of funny. Still, he’s arguably more intelligent than Ted Rall. Not that that’s giving him much.
cameron
“Wonder why Democrat congresscritters aren’t going over there to investigate the truth?”
I think this is why…
thehill.com/news/101503/reconstruction.aspx
“On returning from a trip to Iraq and Afghanistan, a group of Senate Republicans said yesterday that the Bush administration deserves a lot more credit for successful reconstruction efforts in those war-torn nations.
Meanwhile, several Senate Democrats complained that they were denied access to a plane for a inspection tour of their own.
David Perron
I’d think so, too. The smart thing to do is send representation from both parties to Iraq to inspect progress there. Minus the side trips; without any additional information it’s possible that the logistics of the visit alone were enough to get them turned down.
Kimmitt
Ted Rall has wit, but you get lost in the unfairness. Aaron McGruder has different characters with different points of view — it’s pretty obvious that it’s not Huey who represents Mr. McGruder’s approach, it’s Michael Caesar, the liberal who buys Huey’s analysis but does not share his endless, righteous, occasionally quite unfair fury.
Besides which, Boondocks is extraordinarily funny on a regular basis. This one still cracks me up.
Okay, I’m pretty much done now; I wanted to make sure folks weren’t missing out on The Boondocks’s regular joy inducement due to any kind of error.
David Perron
It must be a completely different pattern-recognition algorithm hardwired into the brain, Kimmitt; that didn’t even get a change of expression on this side of the screen.