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You are here: Home / Open Threads / Lies and The Lying Liars

Lies and The Lying Liars

by John Cole|  August 16, 200412:49 pm| 26 Comments

This post is in: Open Threads

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It seems that MoveOn.Org, a 527 that the Democrats approve of, is planning to air an ad to quell the damage from the SwiftBoat commercial:

OPEN ON THE YOUNG GEORGE BUSH IN NATIONAL GUARD UNIFORM.

ANNOUNCER: George Bush used his father to get into the National Guard, and…

CUT TO BUSH’S NATIONAL GUARD MEDICAL FORM BEING STAMPED WITH “FAILURE TO APPEAR”.

ANNOUNCER: …when the chips were down, went missing.

CUT TO SHOT OF TV SHOWING “SWIFT BOAT” SPOT, THEN WORDS APPEAR ACROSS SCREEN, “FALSE ADVERTISING”.

ANNOUNCER: Now, he’s allowing false advertising that attacks John Kerry…

CUT TO FOOTAGE OF A YOUNG JOHN KERRY IN VIETNAM.

ANNOUNCER: …a man who asked to go to Viet Nam and who served with dignity and heroism.

CUT TO HALF SCREEN PICTURE OF JOHN McCAIN. HIS WORDS APPEAR ON SCREEN NEXT TO HIS PICTURE.

ANNOUNCER: Here’s what a true Republican war hero has to say about the anti-Kerry ad: “I think the ad is dishonest and dishonorable…I think the Bush campaign should specifically condemn the ad.”

CUT TO SHOT OF BUSH AND CLOSING DISCLAIMER COPY. ANNOUNCER: George Bush: Take that ad off the air. MoveOn PAC is responsible for the content of this advertisement.

When will they stop lying- Bush has nothing to do with the Swift Boat commercial and has repeatedly stated as much:

Soon after, White House spokesman Scott McClellan declined to do so and instead criticized the financing of the ad, saying the president “deplores all the unregulated soft-money activity.” McClellan said the Bush campaign had nothing to do with the ad or the group behind it. “We have not and we will not question Kerry’s service in Vietnam,” he said. McClellan used the opportunity to call on Kerry to join Bush in demanding that all soft-money groups quit running ads. The overwhelming majority of such ads have targeted Bush, often harshly. Kerry campaign spokeswoman Stephanie Cutter said Kerry will not ask the groups to stop their advertising.

I am sure Media Matters will get to the bottom of this pronto.

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Reader Interactions

26Comments

  1. 1.

    camber

    August 16, 2004 at 2:32 pm

    Bush should acknowledge the Swift boaters as much as Kerry should acknowledge Moore.

    Which is to say neither should.

  2. 2.

    Gregory Markle

    August 16, 2004 at 2:40 pm

    The real issue here is that it is basically illegal for Bush to tell the Swift Vets what to do as that could be construed as “coordination” between the RNC and a 527 group.

  3. 3.

    JKC

    August 16, 2004 at 2:58 pm

    I’d be happier with MoveOn if they tore into Bush’s actions as President- which is what the election debate should be about.

  4. 4.

    Slartibartfast

    August 16, 2004 at 3:03 pm

    “Now, he’s allowing false advertising that attacks John Kerry… ”

    Heh. MoveOn, advocating the repression of free speech?

  5. 5.

    Justin Ogren

    August 16, 2004 at 3:23 pm

    You believe he had nothing to do with the commercial, like ya prolly believe he had nothing to do with the rigged election of 2000.

  6. 6.

    Dean

    August 16, 2004 at 3:27 pm

    Justin:

    Do you think Terry McAuliffe has any idea of what Moveon.org is doing?

  7. 7.

    RW

    August 16, 2004 at 3:40 pm

    Loon alert.

  8. 8.

    Rick

    August 16, 2004 at 4:13 pm

    “Now, he’s allowing false advertising that attacks John Kerry… ”

    If the MoveOn, well, digital brownshirts, know that the criticism of Kerry is false, they should prove it.

    Because Kerry won’t (yet), for some reason.

    Cordially…

  9. 9.

    RW

    August 16, 2004 at 5:09 pm

    The media matters note is an apt one, John. Both moveon & MM are suckers on the Soros teat, so a conflict of interest won’t stop those nutjobs from acting as if they’re credible.

  10. 10.

    ?

    August 16, 2004 at 5:16 pm

    Will you be satisfied if a Kerry spokesman says the Kerry campaign had nothing to do with the ad or the group behind it. Possibly they could say, “We have not and we will not question Bush’s National Guard service here in the US during the Vietnam War.”

    After all, neither Bush nor any of his spokesmen have asked any groups to stop their advertising.

    And as Dean suggests, the campaigns can’t control the 527s.

  11. 11.

    John Cole

    August 16, 2004 at 5:27 pm

    And as Dean suggests, the campaigns can’t control the 527s.

    Then why is the Kerry campaign calling on Bush to have the adspulled? And I am not referring to the rhetoric of the MoveOn commercial, but public statements from the Kerry campaign. Statements like this one:

    “

  12. 12.

    Oliver

    August 16, 2004 at 6:23 pm

    Well, considering that Bush allows prescreened slams on Kerry to be introduced into his campaign stops – pardon me if I’m not swayed by his non-denial. But hey, if the Bush campaign is ok with giving their stamp of approval to an ad campaign run by this dirty gang – more power to you.

    By the way MMFA corrects conservative misinformation, so this bit of factual advertising by MoveOn is most likely outside of our scope.

  13. 13.

    John Cole

    August 16, 2004 at 6:56 pm

    But hey, if the Bush campaign is ok with giving their stamp of approval to an ad campaign run by this dirty gang – more power to you.

    I guess on the Planet Oliver, stating that you publicly do not question Kerry’s Vietnam record and calling for the disavowal of ALL COMMERCIALS LIKE THIS serves as a stamp of approval.

    You are a natural, Oliver.

  14. 14.

    ?

    August 16, 2004 at 6:57 pm

    John–

    I guess I’m still missing it.

    Or maybe it’s not quite there.

    Maybe what you’re referring to is this part of the quote: “McClellan used the opportunity to call on Kerry to join Bush in demanding that all soft-money groups quit running ads.”

    McClellan is not asking anyone to stop anything, he’s changing the subject–pushing it off onto Kerry.

    Bush can’t stop the ads, but he could denounce them, just like McCain did. If he had done so, Kerry would have had to denounce these ridiculous MoveOn ads.

    Facts are often inconvenient for many people. And irony never seems to go away.

  15. 15.

    John Cole

    August 16, 2004 at 7:44 pm

    I guess I’m still missing it.

    I’ll type slow so you are sure to understand.

    Mclellan called on Kerry to join bush in ending all of these types of commercials. By criticizing all commercials, Bush has de facto stated his displeasure with the ad, and all the other ones.

    Kerry and crew, on the other hand, only have a problem with one ad.

  16. 16.

    Oliver

    August 16, 2004 at 7:56 pm

    publicly do not question Kerry’s Vietnam record
    As we know with this admin – saying and doing are 2 different things. They say they don’t question his record, yet encourages questions doing just that at campaign events.

  17. 17.

    Ralph Gizzip

    August 16, 2004 at 8:10 pm

    Geez Oliver, you are like Velcro to Stupid. Saying and doing two different things describes John Kerry’s entire professional life.

  18. 18.

    ?

    August 16, 2004 at 8:15 pm

    Well, John, the President was interviewed by Larry King last week, and given a specific opportunity to to say something critical about this specific commercial.

    He declined to do so.

    Here’s the transcript:

    http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0408/12/lkl.00.html

    You might do a Ctrl+F search using the words “Well, I haven’t seen the ad, but”.

    Instead, he also puts it off onto Kerry.

    You use the expression “de facto” as if it was that obvious. It’s not.

  19. 19.

    John Cole

    August 16, 2004 at 8:48 pm

    Oliver- You are not even arguing. That last post was as close to the written form of a drool as I have ever seen.

    ?- The transcript:

    KING: Oh, so it is. But, I mean, Senator McCain has asked to be condemned, the attack on his service. What do you say to that?

    G. BUSH: Well, I say they ought to get rid of all those 527s, independent expenditures that have flooded the airwaves.

    There have been millions of dollars spent up until this point in time. I signed a law that I thought would get rid of those, and I called on the senator to — let’s just get anybody who feels like they got to run to not do so.

    KING: Do you condemn the statements made about his…

    G. BUSH: Well, I haven’t seen the ad, but what I do condemn is these unregulated, soft-money expenditures by very wealthy people, and they’ve said some bad things about me. I guess they’re saying bad things about him. And what I think we ought to do is not have them on the air. I think there ought to be full disclosure. The campaign funding law I signed I thought was going to get rid of that. But evidently the Federal Election Commission had a different view.

    Which says precisely what I have stated. He thinks they should all be gotten rid of, the one attacking Kerry, and the ones attacking him.

    Kerry, on the other hand, wants only a condemnation of the 527’s attacking him.

  20. 20.

    Scott

    August 16, 2004 at 9:08 pm

    By the way MMFA corrects conservative misinformation, so this bit of factual advertising by MoveOn is most likely outside of our scope.

    Shorter Ollie…

    I am a whore for George Soros- 2 legs bah-h-h-h-d, 4 legs good!

  21. 21.

    M. Scott Eiland

    August 17, 2004 at 1:45 am

    Give Oliver a break–trying to apologize for the many indiscretions of Senator Munchausen can’t be an easy way to make a buck.

  22. 22.

    Ken Hahn

    August 17, 2004 at 2:19 am

    Kerry made Vietnam the center of his campaign. Everything he says has now been questioned by those who served with him. The response by Kerry and his supporters has been to attack the patriotism, courage and service of his detractors. Kerry has hidden his income in his wife’s tax returns, which he refuses to release. He has hidden his lack of service in the Congress behind rules which permit him to release the records of his attendeance. He has not given permission to do so. He has invented impossible stories about Christmas in Cambodia and refused to release the military records which would clear up any questions. He got not one but three million dollar wounds which needed no treatment but got him home after a third of his tour.

    I no longer believe anything kerry says. He is a professional liar and his activities are convincing me that SBVT have a point. For Democrats to support Kerry as they did Clinton, and then accuse anyone of lying is amusing beyond belief.

  23. 23.

    ?

    August 17, 2004 at 6:56 am

    John–

    Where you see a factual, or at least “de facto”, condemnation, I see a politician trying to have it both ways.

    These 527s are legal, so they can’t “all be gotten rid of”–not by the President, not by Kerry. The President had the chance to take the high road by denouncing this particular ad, as McCain requested. He specifically declined the opportunity, given by Larry King, to do it.

    So why would anyone be surprised to see a 527 on Kerry’s side respond in kind?

    These are supposed to be serious times, yet this is where the discussion is–thirty year old military records. Not that I’m in any position to complain–here I am, taking part in it.

    Which reminds me to thank you for having free and open commments, where even someone who disagrees with you gets to have a say–several times over. Not all bloggers do that.

  24. 24.

    John Cole

    August 17, 2004 at 7:03 am

    Which reminds me to thank you for having free and open commments, where even someone who disagrees with you gets to have a say–several times over. Not all bloggers do that.

    I have thick skin. Almost as thick as my skull.

  25. 25.

    HH

    August 17, 2004 at 9:20 am

    Kerry “allowed” Kos into the DNC after “delinking,” he “allowed” MoveOn to tell lie after lie after lie in its ads, he “allowed” Michael Moore to smear the president, etc.

  26. 26.

    HH

    August 17, 2004 at 10:20 am

    “By the way MMFA corrects conservative misinformation, so this bit of factual advertising by MoveOn is most likely outside of our scope.”

    And therein lies one of the problems with it. At least Media Research Center reports when the press does things right.

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