Via TalkLeft, here is a Molly Ivins piece on what she believes is wrong with Texas justice, and I am not going to comment on what she believes is wrong- it is Molly, and you can read the piece and sort things out for yourself. However, she does have this up, which I had never heard before, and I was wondering if any of you had ever heard anything about it:
But in the small towns and rural areas where heavy crime is rare, a D.A. has to whup on whoever gets caught. Sometime in the ’80s, a guy in Lubbock stole 12 frozen turkeys. They were recovered, still frozen. Not only no damage, but no defrost. The guy bought 75 years, which works out to 6.3 years per bird. Don’t steal a turkey in Lubbock.
there has to be more to this story, and I believe the ‘three strikes and your out” phenomenon started in the 90’s. Anyone know anything about this?
Jeff
“Anybody know anything about this”.
My guess is that Molly is putting Jack Daniels on her Cornflakes again.
Slinky
I thought I had the mystery solved. The Nation had a 1985 article about the turkey thief, but it costs $$$ to subscribe to the archives. {{sad smiley}}
jeff
Just a tip, there’s a site called bug me not (www.bugmenot.com) and you can cut-and-paste in the address that requires a subscription, and if there’s a login in their database, you can use it for free. Bug me not? Don’t mind if I do…
Jeff
Kimmitt
My guess is that Molly is putting Jack Daniels on her Cornflakes again.
My guess is that you’re slandering a very nice lady.
Jeff
Oh get off your high-horse, Kimmitt. It was a joke. She likes the sauce.
But, I’ll try and be nice and call her a Nazi next time.
cminus
Texas has had a three-strikes law since way before they were popular. I’m not sure how long they’ve had one, but in 1980 the Supreme Court upheld the constitutionality of Texas’ three-strikes law in Rummel v. Estelle, where Rummel stole $230 in three separate nonviolent incidents between 1963 and 1978. So Ivins’ Lubbock turkey story could easily be absolutely true if the guy was a repeat offender.
ppgaz
Well, there has been a lot of chatter about the dismal failure of the Three Strikes rule. One of the first victims of this draconian rule, as reported in California some years ago, was a hapless chap who stole some groceries from a church kitchen. Third felony, lock ’em away and throw away the key.
It’s all part and parcel of the Zero Tolerance approach to law and order. This blog has already commented on the general efficacy of that approach. In a word, it sucks. And Three Strikes is proving to clog courts and jails without doing much to achieve its original stated purpose, which was to reduce violent crime. It may very well be making a mockery of justice.
Here’s a read:
igs.berkeley.edu/library/htThreeStrikesProp66.htm
Yeah, I know, that’s not the right way to put up a link. But until somebody points me to the closely guarded secret for doing it — I posted my real email address yesterday for this purpose — that’s the best I can do.
jcricket
ppgaz – One easy way is to use actual HTML. If you click “View Source” while reading these comments and see how your name is surrounded with HTML code/tags. Here’s another example
Example of a link
RSA
If your outrage meter needs recharging, here’s another interesting case from North Carolina:
cnn.com/2005/LAW/05/28/television.jail.ap/
Blurb: After 35 years in prison for stealing a black-and-white television set Junior Allen is a free man.
Rick
Oh, cricket. Now you’ve gone and done the equivalent of handing nitro-glycerin to a howler monkey. Thanks a bunch.
Cordially…
Nancy
ppqaz,
here is the code to show a link (http address) with associated text
You must use the quotation marks.
<a href= "copy the http address here ">associated text here</a>
This example shows the words associated text linked to Balloon Juice
associated text
Stormy70
Don’t mess with Texas. I’m from Amarillo, and I do not remember anything about this Turkey story in the 80s. Molly is a saucy lady, so I’ll need actual proof for this. Texans kicked the Dems out of office partly because of a perceived “softness on crime”. Hell, our Governors aren’t allowed to commute anyone’s sentence unless the Texas Board of Pardons and Paroles sign off on it. Judges also must be tough on crime or they will not be reelected for office.
ppgaz
Thanks to all for the assitance.
Let’s try it out:
3Strikes read here
Oooh, doggies.
ppgaz
As a bleeding heart, die-hard liberal, I haven o problem with toughness on crime. Especially violent crime, crime involving weapons, etc.
I do have a problem with mandatory sentencing, because it puts sentencing in the hands of morons and crazy people, namely, state legislators.
I think lower court judges should stand for voter approval, and I think that the so-called War on Drugs is mostly a war on citizens, especially if it involves marijuana, which I find no more, and maybe less, dangerous to health and public safety than alcohol.
I also think that the North should have gone ahead and let the South secede from the Union, but hey, I can’t be popular all the time ;-)
Just kidding. Or am I??
Stormy70
ppqaz – I agreed with most of that, but not the last part about seccession. Oh – and I am not a bleeding heart liberal (shudder), although I do have a few in my family. I like to get them riled up during the holidays, after several glasses of the good scotch.
ppgaz
After several glasses of good scotch, or bad scotch for that matter, you could get me to agree to just about anything. Frist for President! etc
Of course, then comes the hangover….
Stormy70
If you drink the good scotch, there will be no hangover.
ppgaz
Now you tell me!
Kimmitt
There are days that I really, really hate Andrew Johnson.
Crow
The theft statutes in Texas are set up by amount stolen. For instance, theft of less than $50 is a class C (like a traffic ticket), $50 to $500 is a Class B misdemeanor punishable by probation or confinement up to 180 days. It goes up from there. To outright qualify for 75 years, a defendant has to steal $200,000 or more.
Thefts may be enhanced. A third misdemeanor theft can become a state jail theft punishable by confinement up to 2 years. Now, it doesn’t matter how many thefts a defendant has. If that’s the only offense, and the thefts are state jail amounts or misdemeanor amounts, the defendant is never looking at more than 2 years in the state jail.
Even back then, the scheme was similar. The difference between then and now was that prior state jail thefts could keep enhancing thefts until the defendant was looking at serious time. If the defendant was enhanced up to a state jail theft and then had two prior state jails, the defendant was looking at 2 to 10. With a state jail and a pen trip, he was 2 to 20. A defendant still would not have been eligible for 75 years under that scheme unless he had two other pen trips – which would have meant a boat load of thefts or burglaries, drug convictions, murder, etc.
Compuglobalhypermeganet
Are you seriously believing that anything Molly Ivins writes has even a passing acquaintance with the truth? To me, she seems about as crazy as a crazy-box full of crazy-glued crazy-birds. Renee Zellweger’s impression of her on Saturday Night Live (“If a coyote’s chewing on your boot, you better cowboy Alamo six-shooter tumbleweed rodeo moustache wax, partner!”) was only a SLIGHT exaggeration.
Stormy 70
Test
here!
Stormy 70
Another test
click here
Law Student
Just some things to think about: 1) Texas Criminal law in the 1980’s was very different than it is now. The average conviction yielded the equivalent to 1 month per year of sentencing. Thus, the defendant probably only served about 5 years and the jury would have been aware of this. 2)The defendant was a repeat offender (for thefts). Molly, was just giving you the tip of the iceberg. 3)The sentence was upheld through multiple appeals. 4) If Texas is such a racist place, then how can Molly write an article about the harshness of punishents towards white men. Again, cool-aid…