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You are here: Home / Politics / Domestic Politics / Surprise, Surprise

Surprise, Surprise

by John Cole|  August 4, 200510:42 am| 36 Comments

This post is in: Domestic Politics

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The Texas Bible Curriculum gets a failing grade. Apparently it isn’t an ecumenical study of the bible, but instead nothing more than indoctrination of a sectarian viewpoint. Who would have thunk it? An example:

This curriculum goes beyond observing that Christians and Jews believe in the divine inspiration of the Bible. It explicitly and repeatedly endorses those beliefs by presentng such inspiration asa fact. Furthermore, the curriculum attempts to persuade teachers and students to adopt viewsof the Bible that are common in some conservative Protestat circles but are rejected by most scholars (Christian and non-Christian), other branches of Christianity, and Jews. It presents its own sectarian views as objectively true, and in many cases those views are the only ones presented…

As the report will indicate, such problems are not limited to the passages noted above [I have not included them]; thgey are present throughout the curriculum.

Read the whole report.

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36Comments

  1. 1.

    Zifnab

    August 4, 2005 at 11:03 am

    Whaaaat? Misinturpretation of the Bible? Teaching religion on public schools? Claims of moral superiority from a select group of WASPish ‘educators’? In Texas?

    I am shocked sir. Shocked and appalled.

  2. 2.

    Mithrandir

    August 4, 2005 at 11:24 am

    First Knee Jerk Reaction of the day: The Texas Freedom Network — “A mainstream Voice to Counter the Religious Right” (direct from their website).

    Call me crazy, but it sounds like they may want to find fault to begin with?

    Don’t get me wrong, I’m not trying to defend the curriculum (or blast it), but is this source objective? Now I’ll go read it …

  3. 3.

    mac Buckets

    August 4, 2005 at 11:24 am

    It’s funny how we just discussed (yesterday?) how purely partisan/ideological groups take on these non-partisan names and then release BS “reports” which slant their way so heavily that it borders on propaganda.

    Then John gives us the Texas Freedom Network. Let’s just look at their web page and…ohhhhhhh: “Yet the decisive defeat of private school vouchers and other anti-public education bills highlighted many key victories for mainstream Texans during the 79th Legislature. Not all of the news was good. Lawmakers again failed to pass school finance reform and sent to voters a divisive and unnecessary constitutional amendment that would ban same-sex marriage.”

    Oh, yeah, they don’t sound like just another special interest group with an axe to grind, do they? I’m sure their report valued fairness and accuracy above all else!

  4. 4.

    John Cole

    August 4, 2005 at 11:29 am

    I took that into account when I read the resume of the person who wrote the report. Check it out.

    There is a difference between a group whipping up its own report, and a group hiring out a job to someone. Also, I would examine the report itself, and see what it has to say.

  5. 5.

    mac Buckets

    August 4, 2005 at 11:34 am

    But would it be even remotely possible for the Texas Freedom Network to commission a study that didn’t say, well…that didn’t say exactly what we all already knew it was going to say, just by viewing the site of the group that paid for it? Not a (chortle) prayer.

    I look forward to your next post from them about the evils of school vouchers.

  6. 6.

    Defense Guy

    August 4, 2005 at 11:39 am

    I don’t find it surprising in the least. If you hire someone who has no real interest in the subject at hand, this subject perhaps especially, then you probably won’t get an accurate teaching. If you hire someone who does believe, he/she will have a most difficult time keeping the faith part out of the teaching. Your kind of screwed either way.

  7. 7.

    BinkyBoy

    August 4, 2005 at 11:44 am

    oh, thats cute, Mr. Buckets there believes that people that don’t use the public school system shouldn’t have to fund it because well, it doesn’t benefit them in any way.

    I’m sure he feels exactly the same way about Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security and other social programs. That because he isn’t benefiting directly from the moneys, he shouldn’t have to pay for them with his taxes.

    School Vouchers are just ways for those that send their kids to private schools or home schools to try to reduce their tax burden and forget out any personal community ownership. Ignore the community at your own peril, righties. A healthy, well educated community creates more money for you to line your pockets, which in turn will make your tax burden less in the future and have a more stable society to boot.

    But that doesn’t matter, does it? You just want more money NOW, screw everyone else, you have yours. Besides, those compassionate corporations take care of society just fine, thank you very much.

  8. 8.

    Brian

    August 4, 2005 at 11:57 am

    It is a little funny how we lump everything into “christianity” but “christianity” always turns out to mean a certain type of fundamentalist protestantism. Somehow I doubt they’re going to teach Armenian Orthodoxy in Texas, for example. And don’t get me started on that whole Judeo-Christian thing – what the hell is that? Find me someone who practicies Judeo-Christianity. They used to have 30 year wars over differing interpretations of the Bible. Then they decided, let’s not have religion be a concern of the state. That’s worked pretty well for 200 years.

  9. 9.

    mac Buckets

    August 4, 2005 at 12:31 pm

    When John starts a vouchers thread, I’ll be happy to discuss it with you. Suffice it to say that when my state says my urban schools are officially “failing,” then I’d appreciate the state giving me options to help my kids succeed. I will feel no guilt about it, nor should anyone.

  10. 10.

    Defense Guy

    August 4, 2005 at 12:37 pm

    Suffice it to say that when my state says my urban schools are officially “failing,” then I’d appreciate the state giving me options to help my kids succeed. I will feel no guilt about it, nor should anyone.

    Amen. I view it as a lifeline as well. It’s all well and good to talk about how to fix the schools, but all the talking in the world will not help those who are being failed right now. Here in the capital of the free world, they had to close school early last year because some schools didn’t have adequate air conditioning and attending school would have been an actual health hazard. Emergency measures are called for, IMO.

  11. 11.

    Anderson

    August 4, 2005 at 12:49 pm

    People, what is the deal with you? Who has the time/energy/resources/interest to investigate something like this curriculum?

    Pretty obviously, an antithetical special interest group.

    It’s all well and good to bear that in mind, but to act dismissive of it on that basis alone is … well, some rude word or other.

    For better or worse, we have adversarial courts and adversarial politics, on the theory that this promotes the truth’s being discovered. Overlooking this fact and assuming that one side or the other can automatically be discredited by its bias is a ticket to ignorance.

  12. 12.

    Mr.Ortiz

    August 4, 2005 at 1:04 pm

    Texas Bible Curriculum?? Hey, I just got a great idea! We’ll start teaching creationism in biology class when they start teaching atheism in bible study. Fair and balanced, and all that.

  13. 13.

    BinkyBoy

    August 4, 2005 at 1:08 pm

    Anderson,

    churches invade the schools and it will be impossible to remove it. Religion tends to take a fairly negative view on those things they don’t agree with, so forget biology, forget sex education, forget certain topics within Physics, it will all be taken out for the “interest of the children’s soul” or some such nonsense. Defending our schools against religious curriculums is a fairly decent thing to do, I’d say.

  14. 14.

    mac Buckets

    August 4, 2005 at 1:31 pm

    Religion tends to take a fairly negative view on those things they don’t agree with, so forget biology, forget sex education, forget certain topics within Physics, it will all be taken out for the “interest of the children’s soul” or some such nonsense.

    I don’t mean to destroy your “flat-earth” notions of Christianity, but it may surprise you to know that there are already many schools not only influenced by, but directly sffiliated with, Christian churches.

    And they still teach science at Notre Dame!

  15. 15.

    capelza

    August 4, 2005 at 1:45 pm

    Religion tends to take a fairly negative view on those things they don’t agree with, so forget biology, forget sex education, forget certain topics within Physics, it will all be taken out for the “interest of the children’s soul” or some such nonsense.

    I don’t mean to destroy your “flat-earth” notions of Christianity, but it may surprise you to know that there are already many schools not only influenced by, but directly sffiliated with, Christian churches.

    And they still teach science at Notre Dame!

    Amazing! They teach science at a Catholic private university. Of course they do. Catholics are not afraid of the idea of evolution or physics, etc. You missed stating that Notre Dame is a private religious institution. I doubt that the Jerry Falwell branch of Christianity would approve of the ND science curriculum.

    I have absolutely no problem believing that the TX Bible Curriculm is slanted to a very specific set of Tenets. It was like that when I was a little Catholic kid in Southern Baptist land, at the public grade school I attended. No thanks.

  16. 16.

    Dave Ruddell

    August 4, 2005 at 1:49 pm

    And they still teach science at Notre Dame!

    Yes they do. Of course, the Catholic Church doesn’t have a problem with evolution.

    Contrast this with, say, Bob Jones University (which hilariously calls itself BJU) that has on its Biology Department webpage:

    While most secular biologists are committed to evolution as the basic principle of biology, Bob Jones University trains Christian biologists who see the living world indelibly marked with the fingerprints of a God of limitless wisdom and power.

    That’s fine, BJU is a private school, and they can teach what they please. Same thing goes for Notre Dame.

    I don’t mean to destroy your “flat-earth” notions of Christianity, but it may surprise you to know that there are already many schools not only influenced by, but directly sffiliated with, Christian churches.

    Bully for them. So long as they are privately funded schools, more power to them. Of course, the curriculum being discussed here is being introduced into the public schools, and that is what makes all the difference.

  17. 17.

    Defense Guy

    August 4, 2005 at 2:18 pm

    Of course, the curriculum being discussed here is being introduced into the public schools, and that is what makes all the difference.

    So religion is to be the deciding factor. Just remember that the USSC has deemed secular humanism as a religion, so don’t be shocked when some start using that tact as a deciding factor as well. Sane compromise is apparently a thing of the past.

  18. 18.

    Doug

    August 4, 2005 at 2:23 pm

    Setting a curriculum for Bible study is just wading into a pit of vipers. Does the commandment against graven images require destruction of art work in churches? Is communion necessary? Does the wine and bread transubstantiate into flesh and blood or does it merely represent flesh and blood? Should babies be baptized or does baptism only count when it’s chosen by an individual capable of choosing? Is original sin a valid concept or was St. Augustine full of shit? Where did Cain’s wife come from? Did he have sex with his mom or just with his sister? How did Noah fit the entire animal kingdom on an ark that was only 300x 30x 50 cubits?

    People have killed and died over these questions.

  19. 19.

    Defense Guy

    August 4, 2005 at 2:26 pm

    People have killed and died over these questions.

    We are fortunate that in this country, we have moved beyond that. I am not advocating the forced education of religion to anyone, but allowing at as an elective is ok with me.

  20. 20.

    capelza

    August 4, 2005 at 2:30 pm

    Well if they are honest and call it the Texas Fundamentalist Bible Curriculum, or the Texas Catholics Might Not feel Comfortable In This Class Curriculum and it is an elective, that’s fine…

  21. 21.

    Dave Ruddell

    August 4, 2005 at 2:41 pm

    So religion is to be the deciding factor. Just remember that the USSC has deemed secular humanism as a religion, so don’t be shocked when some start using that tact as a deciding factor as well. Sane compromise is apparently a thing of the past.

    Well, when a public school starts teaching that God does not exist (rather than just not taking a position), I’ll be there to criticize them.

  22. 22.

    mac Buckets

    August 4, 2005 at 2:47 pm

    You missed stating that Notre Dame is a private religious institution. I doubt that the Jerry Falwell branch of Christianity would approve of the ND science curriculum.

    I missed nothing, but you must’ve, as Jerry Falwell was never the argument, nor was the public school/private school difference. Look at the post I quoted. Binky didn’t load up all the qualifiers that you did — he stated that, essentially, religion will attempt to stop the study of biology and physics. But as we can see from a few hundred years of history, it’s a ridiculous notion that having once “churces invade the schools,” whatever that means, the intolerance of the Church will destroy the study of biology and physics.

    My cousin studied at the Baylor (a conservative Southern Baptist private university) School of Medicine, and they weren’t teaching her about leeches and prayer circles as a cure for cancer!

  23. 23.

    Zifnab

    August 4, 2005 at 3:32 pm

    “Churches invading our schools”, for those who haven’t been informed, translates to “Fundamentalists putting their religious and political agendas ahead of actual academic study.” School-lead prayer in classrooms, prolonged tangents on how God Inspired Newtonian Physics has changed our society, and essays on how life begins at conception are not actual academic endevours but sectarian indoctrination.

    They don’t teach leeches as cures for cancer (although I know a few Baylor professors who’d probably argue prayer circles as a legitamite treatment). They do heavily integrate a very selective faith into their studies and their school policy. A few years back, a large number of students were repromanded for appearing (fully clothed) in Playboy magazine. http://intellectualize.org/archives/000229.html

    It’s this sort of facist nonsense that makes my spine curl up at the idea of Church in the classroom. I have to put up with enough high handed teachers and administrators without finding http://www.answersingenesis.org/ as a legitamite source of information or – worse still – a part of my required ciriculum.

  24. 24.

    les

    August 4, 2005 at 3:38 pm

    Has anyone actually looked at the proposed curriculum you’re supposedly talking about? Is it really cool, whether in a science or a social studies class, to teach kids that NASA has scientific evidence that god stopped the sun? That the King James Version is inerrant, and your neighbor’s bible is bullshit? You can argue all you want about the value of generic “bible study”, but this is one-view sectarian bullshit; and you don’t have to be some sort of totally impartial judge to figure it out.

  25. 25.

    Anderson

    August 4, 2005 at 4:23 pm

    Binks, I looked at my comment, and it seems pretty clear to me that I was criticizing those who were suspicious of the report faulting the Bible curriculum, just because the report was from a partisan group.

    As for your confusion of Christianity with fundamentalism, that’s been well-refuted above. An understandable mistake. Many fundamentalists make it.

  26. 26.

    BinkyBoy

    August 4, 2005 at 4:53 pm

    Anyone that lives with their faith on their sleeve is a fundamentalist to me. I don’t need to know you’re a Christian, because your faith is best placed in your home and your heart. I don’t want to know about your faith.

    But yes, right now I use Christianity and Fundamentalism interchangably, because of the sudden rise of extremist Christianity across the country. I do feel sorry for those Christians that are caught in the middle, but they can stand up for themselves and tell the world that the hypocritical Dobsonites of America don’t speak for them. Until they do that, they can just get lumped in for all I care.

  27. 27.

    Phil Smith

    August 4, 2005 at 6:36 pm

    One. This curriculum was not designed in Texas (at least not entirely), as the linked article and the piece in the NYT make it quite clear that there was a large input from North Carolina. Nor is it exclusively being used in Texas. TFN claims that it’s being used in over 1000 highschools “across the country”.

    Two. It’s an elective. HS kids who choose to take this course are either 1) looking for an easy A or 2) already bible beaters.

    Three. A cursory glance at the authors and board members of this text, and an even more cursory look at the criticisms in the linked document, are more than adequate to expose this textbook as utter codswallop. I don’t know if TFN is liberal or not, but the criticisms are

    And Binky, you clearly have no conception whatever of what the word “fundamentalist” means. By your definition, anyone who dons the hijab is a fundamentalist. Anyone who has a mezzuzza on their doorway is a fundamentalist. Anyone who show up on the day after Mardi Gras with a grey smudge on their forehead is a fundamentalist. And since you make your disdain for those of faith so obvious, you yourself are quite clearly a fundamentalist.

    Signed, your friendly neighborhood apostate.

  28. 28.

    Rome Again

    August 4, 2005 at 7:07 pm

    And since you make your disdain for those of faith so obvious, you yourself are quite clearly a fundamentalist.

    So, anyone who is upset at the extremism coming from religion these days, because it is causing an upheaval in our system is a fundamentalist? I suppose we’re all supposed to just be sheep led to the slaughter and not be angry at the fact that our way of life is being attacked by a group of people who mean to change it permanantly?

    I’m an agnostic, but apparently (according to Phil) I’m a fundamentalist agnostic. Hmmmm, whoddathunkit?

  29. 29.

    Phil Smith

    August 4, 2005 at 7:45 pm

    Rome Again, your reading comprehension is below the level of us iggerant Texans. Try again.

    Binky tells us that “Anyone that lives with their faith on their sleeve is a fundamentalist to me.” Followed by “But yes, right now I use Christianity and Fundamentalism interchangably”.

    I know plenty about fundies. I know plenty of fundies. I regard them as a genuine threat. But Binky’s constant conflation of “christian” and “fundamentalist” is un-constructive and frankly moronic.

    But it’s a wonderful electoral strategy for the left. I recommend that the left continue to denigrate all people of faith. They are obviously guilty of being fascists — by association. It worked sooooo well last year.

  30. 30.

    Beej

    August 5, 2005 at 12:59 am

    les,
    I read the report, all 20 some pages of it, and part of the appendices as well, and it is a very factual report. The point it makes, incidentally, is that this curriculum is skewed, not only to Christianity, but to one version of Christianity, the fundamentalist, Protestant version. The Jews, the Catholics, and the Orthodox get short shrift in this curriculum. Read it for yourself on John’s link.

  31. 31.

    Beej

    August 5, 2005 at 1:03 am

    Incidentally, the report makes it clear that the curriculum is not only skewed, but large sections of it are plagarized as well. Apparently the curriculum’s authors forgot to read the commandment about stealing.

  32. 32.

    Sinequanon

    August 5, 2005 at 1:22 am

    Come on down to TexAss and I’ll give you the grand neo-biblical tour of our 49th ranked school system that as of today has absolutely no finance system in place much less a reality based curriculum lately. Idiot legislators.

  33. 33.

    Stormy70

    August 5, 2005 at 5:43 am

    But yes, right now I use Christianity and Fundamentalism interchangably, because of the sudden rise of extremist Christianity across the country. I do feel sorry for those Christians that are caught in the middle, but they can stand up for themselves and tell the world that the hypocritical Dobsonites of America don’t speak for them. Until they do that, they can just get lumped in for all I care.

    Would you like to be lumped in with the left fringe, the naked Berkeley protesters or the eco-teerrorists. It seems that if you where your leftism on your sleeve, then I can lump you in with the extreme leftist kooks. This is based on your statement above.

  34. 34.

    Stormy70

    August 5, 2005 at 5:50 am

    teerorists – look at the freaking time! Why am I posting at this hour?! I’m up at the crack of cracka.

  35. 35.

    Rome Again

    August 5, 2005 at 2:15 pm

    I know plenty about fundies. I know plenty of fundies. I regard them as a genuine threat. But Binky’s constant conflation of “christian” and “fundamentalist” is un-constructive and frankly moronic.

    Actually, if you read certain books of Isaiah with any real understanding (that is without the twisting of the meanings of scripture that most people will tell you is required; but instead straight across as the Isaiah prophet had intended it to be read), you may realize we give far too good a name to Christianity. Try isaiah 24 and 45, and be especially cognizant of the “give ye” religion (tithing) that worships a “wooden” idol (I’ll let you figure this one out) to a “god who cannot save”.

    If one reads Isaiah and finds Christianity in there, they may find God considers Christianity an abomination (Christianity set up a god that is at his side, and prayed to “before him”). Christianity says it’s okay to drink blood (yet even the disciples of Jesus don’t agree with this, Paul is the one who started it), and Christianity said God didn’t keep his promise to the people of Israel so his old covenant was scrapped and his new covenant is with a whole new set of people (Chrstians). Now, tell me, first of all, would you trust in such a god if he doesn’t keep his promises, and why would a god make promises he doesn’t keep?

    At the same time, I realize there are good people who’ve been duped by the Christian religion (they don’t investigate it, they allow the belief of the environment around them to dictate what is right and follow all its tenets no matter how ludicrous they sound (just as many islamicists in the middle east do – or hindus in India even)but you know, a funny thing happns when they think they belong to the “one true religion”, they many times have a tendancy to taunt others who are “going to hell without Jesus”, and so unless they want to read the Bible straight forward themselves without the help of others (including the concordances that tell them what to believe), they can suffer the same fate.

  36. 36.

    Phil Smith

    August 5, 2005 at 3:47 pm

    And your interpretation of Isaiah has what, exactly, to do with Binky calling all professing christians “fundamentalists”, and my calling him out on it? Or your intitial failure to read my post with anything remotely resembling accuracy?

    Oh, right. Nothing whatsoever. But go ahead, indulge yourself in broad, unsupported generalizations. I’d hate for you to exercise actual individual judgement, as opposed to your quite clearly demonstrated prejudice.

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