This seems like a positive development:
The Bush administration is embroiled in a sharp internal debate over whether a new set of Defense Department standards for handling terror suspects should adopt language from the Geneva Conventions prohibiting “cruel,” “humiliating” and “degrading” treatment, administration officials say.
Advocates of that approach, who include some Defense and State Department officials and senior military lawyers, contend that moving the military’s detention policies closer to international law would prevent further abuses and build support overseas for the fight against Islamic extremists, officials said.
Their opponents, who include aides to Vice President Dick Cheney and some senior Pentagon officials, have argued strongly that the proposed language is vague, would tie the government’s hands in combating terrorists and still would not satisfy America’s critics, officials said.
At least they are having the damned debate. Just a little too late.
SomeCallMeTim
After that, maybe they can discuss keeping an American citizen, captured on American soil, in jail without a charge for three years. And then maybe basic notions of due process. And even, one hopes, tyranny of the majority and why simply winning an election isn’t enough to simply make your wish the law of the land.
Gee, soon Republicans will be able get a D in a basic high school civics class.
Lines
John,
do you see this as propaganda? I just noticed that its a little too well written and too pointed towards an actual issue that is plaguing America. But in reality, this issue doesn’t poll well for either “side”, so doing a propaganda attack on a non-issue just seems like inviting critisism that will uncover it in an Armstrong Williams type of circus.
Or is it now that the DoD doesn’t feel they have to lock-step with the WH opinion, they have decided to start taking measures to keep our troops safe, improve our standing in the world and come out on top of the argument instead of at the sewage pit of slime the White House has continued to put us into.
Is it so bad to keep asking why?
Oh wait, I’m contributing to the cesspool of fucktards that Jeffy Goldylocks doesn’t like, arn’t I?
Here, just to balance my post: WOW! This just shows what a great leader Bush is turning out to be. Now all those liberals running our campuses and the idiot Kossacks can suck our tiny little units!
Steve S
Doesn’t Cheney kind of remind you of Baron Vladimir Harkonnen from the Dune books?
It’s just hard to believe that someone would derive such pleasure over the torturing of human beings.
John Cole
I don’t honestly think Cheney derives pleasure from torturing people- I think he legitimately believes that the government should not have its hands tied and that some level of coercive interrogation works.
And, in one regard, he is right- nothing will satisfy some critics, btoh foreign and domestic.
However, IMO, he is just wrong on the larger issue.
norbizness
It seems like Cheney has an interesting approach. Nothing will satisfy some critics, therefore do exactly that. Nothing.
I have read enough of these debates that I think I can construct a justification for the North Vietnamese torturing John McCain: “What if he had knowledge of an imminent bombing raid on Hanoi?”
Kimmitt
And here is where we disagree — both Cheney and Bush obviously derive pleasure from torturing people. I mean, the ONE threatened veto in five years of the Executive? Their priorities are pretty clear.
Ancient Purple
It goes beyond the torture issue. The man is a misanthrope, with the possible exception of other wealthy, power-broker Americans.
Paddy O'Shea
That Team Torture has to have a discussion on the topic of prisoner abuse and whether or not it is acceptable to engage in such practices is just about as nasty an indication of how morally depraved a lot they truly are.
The political right in this country has quite obviously lost its collective mind.
p.lukasiak
Or is it now that the DoD doesn’t feel they have to lock-step with the WH opinion, they have decided to start taking measures to keep our troops safe, improve our standing in the world and come out on top of the argument instead of at the sewage pit of slime the White House has continued to put us into.
Lines, don’t get your hopes up. The story refers to “some Defense and State Department officials and senior military lawyers”; the JAG corps have always been opposed to Team Torture’s policies, and the lack of any qualifier (e.g. “Senior”) for “Defense officials” indicates that Rummy’s crew is still on board the torture policy.
I don’t honestly think Cheney derives pleasure from torturing people-
Cheney derives pleasure from the exercise of absolute (or near absolute) power, and the power to torture people falls within that description.
Jane Finch
And today we can read about the CIA’s super secret prisons in torture-friendly countries…doesn’t do much to shore up American moral authority to clean up the rest of the world.
val
They’re only having a debate because there was a veto proof, 90-9 vote in the Senate. I’ll believe they’ve changed their minds when they call the House leadership and tell them to keep it in the final bill
Skip
“At least they are having the damned debate. Just a little too late.”
Too late for the Nürnberg trails, you mean?