• Menu
  • Skip to primary navigation
  • Skip to main content
  • Skip to primary sidebar

Before Header

  • About Us
  • Lexicon
  • Contact Us
  • Our Store
  • ↑
  • ↓
  • ←
  • →

Balloon Juice

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

This chaos was totally avoidable.

This blog will pay for itself.

If you don’t believe freedom is for everybody, then the thing you love isn’t freedom, it is privilege.

This country desperately needs a functioning fourth estate.

If rights aren’t universal, they are privilege, not rights.

He seems like a smart guy, but JFC, what a dick!

Donald Trump found guilty as fuck – May 30, 2024!

They were going to turn on one another at some point. It was inevitable.

We will not go quietly into the night; we will not vanish without a fight.

Sometimes the world just tells you your cat is here.

It’s a good piece. click on over. but then come back!!

“A king is only a king if we bow down.” – Rev. William Barber

He wakes up lying, and he lies all day.

You are either for trump or for democracy. Pick one.

You can’t attract Republican voters. You can only out organize them.

We will not go back.

They want us to be overwhelmed and exhausted. Focus. Resist. Oppose.

If you’re gonna whine, it’s time to resign!

Hi god, it’s us. Thanks a heap, you’re having a great week and it’s only Thursday!

Let’s not be the monsters we hate.

The republican caucus is covering themselves with something, and it is not glory.

Books are my comfort food!

There are some who say that there are too many strawmen arguments on this blog.

Never entrust democracy to any process that requires republicans to act in good faith.

Mobile Menu

  • Seattle Meet-up Post
  • 2025 Activism
  • Targeted Political Fundraising
  • Donate with Venmo, Zelle & PayPal
  • Site Feedback
  • War in Ukraine
  • Submit Photos to On the Road
  • Politics
  • On The Road
  • Open Threads
  • Topics
  • COVID-19
  • Authors
  • About Us
  • Contact Us
  • Lexicon
  • Our Store
  • Politics
  • Open Threads
  • 2025 Activism
  • Garden Chats
  • On The Road
  • Targeted Fundraising!
You are here: Home / Foreign Affairs / Military / At Least They Are Having The Debate

At Least They Are Having The Debate

by John Cole|  November 2, 200512:03 am| 12 Comments

This post is in: Military, War on Terror aka GSAVE®

FacebookTweetEmail

This seems like a positive development:

The Bush administration is embroiled in a sharp internal debate over whether a new set of Defense Department standards for handling terror suspects should adopt language from the Geneva Conventions prohibiting “cruel,” “humiliating” and “degrading” treatment, administration officials say.

Advocates of that approach, who include some Defense and State Department officials and senior military lawyers, contend that moving the military’s detention policies closer to international law would prevent further abuses and build support overseas for the fight against Islamic extremists, officials said.

Their opponents, who include aides to Vice President Dick Cheney and some senior Pentagon officials, have argued strongly that the proposed language is vague, would tie the government’s hands in combating terrorists and still would not satisfy America’s critics, officials said.

At least they are having the damned debate. Just a little too late.

FacebookTweetEmail
Previous Post: « Closed Session
Next Post: Tone It Down or Don’t Let the Door Hit You in the Ass »

Reader Interactions

12Comments

  1. 1.

    SomeCallMeTim

    November 2, 2005 at 12:20 am

    After that, maybe they can discuss keeping an American citizen, captured on American soil, in jail without a charge for three years. And then maybe basic notions of due process. And even, one hopes, tyranny of the majority and why simply winning an election isn’t enough to simply make your wish the law of the land.

    Gee, soon Republicans will be able get a D in a basic high school civics class.

  2. 2.

    Lines

    November 2, 2005 at 12:22 am

    John,
    do you see this as propaganda? I just noticed that its a little too well written and too pointed towards an actual issue that is plaguing America. But in reality, this issue doesn’t poll well for either “side”, so doing a propaganda attack on a non-issue just seems like inviting critisism that will uncover it in an Armstrong Williams type of circus.

    Or is it now that the DoD doesn’t feel they have to lock-step with the WH opinion, they have decided to start taking measures to keep our troops safe, improve our standing in the world and come out on top of the argument instead of at the sewage pit of slime the White House has continued to put us into.

    Is it so bad to keep asking why?

    Oh wait, I’m contributing to the cesspool of fucktards that Jeffy Goldylocks doesn’t like, arn’t I?

    Here, just to balance my post: WOW! This just shows what a great leader Bush is turning out to be. Now all those liberals running our campuses and the idiot Kossacks can suck our tiny little units!

  3. 3.

    Steve S

    November 2, 2005 at 12:31 am

    Doesn’t Cheney kind of remind you of Baron Vladimir Harkonnen from the Dune books?

    It’s just hard to believe that someone would derive such pleasure over the torturing of human beings.

  4. 4.

    John Cole

    November 2, 2005 at 12:38 am

    I don’t honestly think Cheney derives pleasure from torturing people- I think he legitimately believes that the government should not have its hands tied and that some level of coercive interrogation works.

    And, in one regard, he is right- nothing will satisfy some critics, btoh foreign and domestic.

    However, IMO, he is just wrong on the larger issue.

  5. 5.

    norbizness

    November 2, 2005 at 12:42 am

    It seems like Cheney has an interesting approach. Nothing will satisfy some critics, therefore do exactly that. Nothing.

    I have read enough of these debates that I think I can construct a justification for the North Vietnamese torturing John McCain: “What if he had knowledge of an imminent bombing raid on Hanoi?”

  6. 6.

    Kimmitt

    November 2, 2005 at 12:26 am

    I don’t honestly think Cheney derives pleasure from torturing people

    And here is where we disagree — both Cheney and Bush obviously derive pleasure from torturing people. I mean, the ONE threatened veto in five years of the Executive? Their priorities are pretty clear.

  7. 7.

    Ancient Purple

    November 2, 2005 at 2:03 am

    I don’t honestly think Cheney derives pleasure from torturing people

    It goes beyond the torture issue. The man is a misanthrope, with the possible exception of other wealthy, power-broker Americans.

  8. 8.

    Paddy O'Shea

    November 2, 2005 at 4:11 am

    That Team Torture has to have a discussion on the topic of prisoner abuse and whether or not it is acceptable to engage in such practices is just about as nasty an indication of how morally depraved a lot they truly are.

    The political right in this country has quite obviously lost its collective mind.

  9. 9.

    p.lukasiak

    November 2, 2005 at 7:10 am

    Or is it now that the DoD doesn’t feel they have to lock-step with the WH opinion, they have decided to start taking measures to keep our troops safe, improve our standing in the world and come out on top of the argument instead of at the sewage pit of slime the White House has continued to put us into.

    Lines, don’t get your hopes up. The story refers to “some Defense and State Department officials and senior military lawyers”; the JAG corps have always been opposed to Team Torture’s policies, and the lack of any qualifier (e.g. “Senior”) for “Defense officials” indicates that Rummy’s crew is still on board the torture policy.

    I don’t honestly think Cheney derives pleasure from torturing people-

    Cheney derives pleasure from the exercise of absolute (or near absolute) power, and the power to torture people falls within that description.

  10. 10.

    Jane Finch

    November 2, 2005 at 7:46 am

    And today we can read about the CIA’s super secret prisons in torture-friendly countries…doesn’t do much to shore up American moral authority to clean up the rest of the world.

  11. 11.

    val

    November 2, 2005 at 9:20 am

    They’re only having a debate because there was a veto proof, 90-9 vote in the Senate. I’ll believe they’ve changed their minds when they call the House leadership and tell them to keep it in the final bill

  12. 12.

    Skip

    November 3, 2005 at 11:48 am

    “At least they are having the damned debate. Just a little too late.”

    Too late for the Nürnberg trails, you mean?

Comments are closed.

Primary Sidebar

On The Road - Winter Wren - Point Lobos State Natural Reserve 3
Image by Winter Wren (7/31/25)

World Central Kitchen

Donate

Recent Comments

  • Ruckus on Wednesday Night Open Thread (Jul 10, 2025 @ 10:37am)
  • Baud on Justice Brown Jackson Will Not Be Silenced (Jul 10, 2025 @ 10:34am)
  • Omnes Omnibus on Justice Brown Jackson Will Not Be Silenced (Jul 10, 2025 @ 10:34am)
  • Jeffro on GOP Venality Open Thread: May Van Orden Be the First of Many Defections… (Jul 10, 2025 @ 10:33am)
  • Jeffro on GOP Venality Open Thread: May Van Orden Be the First of Many Defections… (Jul 10, 2025 @ 10:32am)

Balloon Juice Posts

View by Topic
View by Author
View by Month & Year
View by Past Author

Featuring

Medium Cool
Artists in Our Midst
Authors in Our Midst
No Kings Protests June 14 2025

🎈Keep Balloon Juice Ad Free

Become a Balloon Juice Patreon
Donate with Venmo, Zelle or PayPal

Calling All Jackals

Site Feedback
Nominate a Rotating Tag
Submit Photos to On the Road
Balloon Juice Anniversary (All Links)
Balloon Juice Anniversary (All Posts)
Fix Nyms with Apostrophes

Social Media

Balloon Juice
WaterGirl
TaMara
John Cole
DougJ (aka NYT Pitchbot)
Betty Cracker
Tom Levenson
David Anderson
Major Major Major Major
DougJ NYT Pitchbot
mistermix

Keeping Track

Legal Challenges (Lawfare)
Republicans Fleeing Town Halls (TPM)
21 Letters (to Borrow or Steal)
Search Donations from a Brand

Feeling Defeated?  If We Give Up, It's Game Over

Site Footer

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

  • Facebook
  • RSS
  • Twitter
  • YouTube
  • Comment Policy
  • Our Authors
  • Blogroll
  • Our Artists
  • Privacy Policy

Copyright © 2025 Dev Balloon Juice · All Rights Reserved · Powered by BizBudding Inc

Share this ArticleLike this article? Email it to a friend!

Email sent!