• Menu
  • Skip to primary navigation
  • Skip to main content
  • Skip to primary sidebar

Before Header

  • About Us
  • Lexicon
  • Contact Us
  • Our Store
  • ↑
  • ↓
  • ←
  • →

Balloon Juice

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

The willow is too close to the house.

Never entrust democracy to any process that requires Republicans to act in good faith.

Good lord, these people are nuts.

Every one of the “Roberts Six” lied to get on the court.

The fundamental promise of conservatism all over the world is a return to an idealized past that never existed.

“Can i answer the question? No you can not!”

Hi god, it’s us. Thanks a heap, you’re having a great week and it’s only Thursday!

“Everybody’s entitled to be an idiot.”

Republicans don’t trust women.

Wow, I can’t imagine what it was like to comment in morse code.

A snarling mass of vitriolic jackals

An unpunished coup is a training exercise.

“In the name of Zandar, I will fight the Stupid!”

The Giant Orange Man Baby is having a bad day.

Is it irresponsible to speculate? It is irresponsible not to.

Perhaps you mistook them for somebody who gives a damn.

Spilling the end game before they can coat it in frankl luntz-approved dogwhistles.

In after Baud. Damn.

Republicans got rid McCarthy. Democrats chose not to save him.

Democrats have delivered the Square Deal, the New Deal, the Fair Deal, and now… the Big Joe Biden Deal.

They fucked up the fucking up of the fuckup!

“woke” is the new caravan.

Since when do we limit our critiques to things we could do better ourselves?

I’d hate to be the candidate who lost to this guy.

Mobile Menu

  • Four Directions Montana
  • Donate with Venmo, Zelle & PayPal
  • Site Feedback
  • War in Ukraine
  • Submit Photos to On the Road
  • Politics
  • On The Road
  • Open Threads
  • Topics
  • COVID-19 Coronavirus
  • Authors
  • About Us
  • Contact Us
  • Lexicon
  • Our Store
  • Politics
  • Open Threads
  • War in Ukraine
  • Garden Chats
  • On The Road
  • 2021-22 Fundraising!
You are here: Home / Politics / War on Terror / War on Terror aka GSAVE® / Iraqis and Torture

Iraqis and Torture

by John Cole|  December 13, 20051:16 pm| 24 Comments

This post is in: War on Terror aka GSAVE®

FacebookTweetEmail

This presents an interesting problem:

The Iraqi Interior Ministry insisted Monday that none of the 625 prisoners discovered last week in an Iraqi detention center had been tortured or abused, despite assertions by American officials to the contrary.

The declaration by the ministry official was delivered as early voting began in Iraq’s election for a full, four-year parliament, as soldiers, hospital patients and prison detainees across the country cast their ballots in advance of the rest of the electorate, which goes to the polls on Thursday.

The estimated 1.5 million Iraqi voters living abraod were also permitted to cast ballots at about 50 polling stations outside the country on Monday.

Maybe it was just a harmless fraternity prank?

FacebookTweetEmail
Previous Post: « Lost Update
Next Post: A Victory for Limbaugh »

Reader Interactions

24Comments

  1. 1.

    TallDave

    December 13, 2005 at 2:16 pm

    From the pictures I’ve seen, it’s apparent their treatment was deplorable. But we shouldn’t be shocked 3 years wasn’t long enough to erase every lingering vestige of a brutal police-state culture. That will take some time.

    Of course, this kind of thing does happen to some degree pretty much everywhere, even here in the U.S. (Remember Abner Louima?) The important thing is that it be exposed, investigated, punished, and prevented to the extent possible.

    As opposed to the Saddam-era solution, which was to give torturers a pat on the back and tell them “nice work, we’ll have some more dissidents for you to maim tomorrow.”

  2. 2.

    Cyrus

    December 13, 2005 at 2:21 pm

    Some would call this gratuitious Bush-bashing, and who knows, they might even be right, but let’s just say that the Iraqi Interior Ministry’s position has a precedent.

    Bybee’s interpretations guided the Bush Administration for twenty-two months. And a powerful case has been made that Bybee’s extraordinary reading of the law led to Americans engaging in torture at Abu Ghraib and elsewhere.

    The memo defines torture so narrowly that only activities resulting in “death, organ failure or the permanent impairment of a significant body function” qualify. It also claims, absurdly, that Americans can defend themselves if criminally prosecuted for torture by relying on the criminal law defenses of necessity and/or self-defense, based on the horror of the 9/11 terrorist attacks.

    If none of those 625 prisoners died or got permanently crippled, then it’s not torture, was the legal position of the Bush administration for a while.

  3. 3.

    Richard Bottoms

    December 13, 2005 at 2:33 pm

    Now, now. Calling Bush a liar or a misleader is irresponsible. He doesn’t actually “know” of any torture.

  4. 4.

    Richard Bottoms

    December 13, 2005 at 2:35 pm

    BTW, is anyone ever going to straight out ask the smirking one if waterborading is torture?

  5. 5.

    Perry Como

    December 13, 2005 at 2:35 pm

    If none of those 625 prisoners died or got permanently crippled, then it’s not torture, was the legal position of the Bush administration for a while.

    When did it change? I was under the assumption this is still the administration position.

  6. 6.

    Paddy O'Shea

    December 13, 2005 at 2:39 pm

    Funny how that torture stuff just keeps popping up, ain’t it? Almost like there is the theme to what is going on Iraq.

    And speaking of torture, it looks like Georgie’s Operation Enduring Bullshit isn’t cutting it with the citizens. 59% disapprove of his mishandling of Iraq, 58% think he doesn’t doesn’t know what he is doing.

    The last time Prince George went around making these kinds of speeches he was yapping about Social Security. That didn’t work out for him, either.

    http://edition.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/12/12/bush.iraq.poll/

  7. 7.

    TallDave

    December 13, 2005 at 2:47 pm

    Torture does seem to be the theme for leftists.

    Freedom and democracy seem to be the theme for righties.

    All depends on what’s important to you, I guess.

  8. 8.

    Steve S

    December 13, 2005 at 2:55 pm

    But we shouldn’t be shocked 3 years wasn’t long enough to erase every lingering vestige of a brutal police-state culture.

    It takes 10 times that long! Here it’s been 229 years since we through off our imperial overseers and we still have Asshats running around thinking torture is a perfectly acceptable thing to do with prisoners.

    Although the odd thing is. I was reading some history, and just the other day was the anniversary of General Orders 100 issued by Abe Lincoln back in the Civil War days. General Orders 100 became the foundation of the Geneva Conventions of 1867.

    http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/law/liebercode.htm

    Military necessity does not admit of cruelty–that is, the infliction of suffering for the sake of suffering or for revenge, nor of maiming or wounding except in fight, nor of torture to extort confessions. It does not admit of the use of poison in any way, nor of the wanton devastation of a district. It admits of deception, but disclaims acts of perfidy; and, in general, military necessity does not include any act of hostility which makes the return to peace unnecessarily difficult.

    So apparently we were making some real progress here, it’s just in the last few years we started to regress.

  9. 9.

    Retief

    December 13, 2005 at 2:56 pm

    Torture does seem to be the theme for leftists.

    Freedom and democracy seem to be the theme for righties.

    Thesis & Antithesis. Now I give Synthesis: The free and democratic government in Iraq toturing prisoners.

    (And extra-judicial killings, but that’s why we sent Negroponte in the first place, wasn’t it?)

  10. 10.

    Lines

    December 13, 2005 at 2:57 pm

    We’re going to torture you until you are free and liberated!

    I like it, Talldave. What next, waterboarding as a sport?

    Is there anything you won’t excuse? IOKYAR

  11. 11.

    Steve S

    December 13, 2005 at 3:00 pm

    Torture does seem to be the theme for leftists.

    Freedom and democracy seem to be the theme for righties.

    All depends on what’s important to you, I guess.

    Freedom pretty much implies respect for human rights.

    So apparently neither are important to you.

  12. 12.

    Mike S

    December 13, 2005 at 3:09 pm

    Torture does seem to be the theme for leftists.

    I’d like to be the first person to welcome John Cole to the Order of the Leftists.

  13. 13.

    TallDave

    December 13, 2005 at 3:17 pm

    Hehe, I knew that would get you guys riled up.

    Just remember, when our troops aren’t torturing, they’re using WMDs against civilians!

    Something to keep in mind while Iraqis exercise their right to vote in the first full-fledged Arab democracy thanks to Chimpy McHitlerBurton’s disastrous, simpleminded, incompetent, corrupt mismanagement.

  14. 14.

    Steve S

    December 13, 2005 at 3:32 pm

    Hehe, I knew that would get you guys riled up.

    Apparently TallDave is a fan of Saddam Hussein, because torture, execution and all that stuff is just no big deal.

  15. 15.

    Cyrus

    December 13, 2005 at 3:32 pm

    TallDave Says:

    Hehe, I knew that would get you guys riled up.

    Just remember, when our troops aren’t torturing, they’re using WMDs against civilians!

    Something to keep in mind while Iraqis exercise their right to vote in the first full-fledged Arab democracy thanks to Chimpy McHitlerBurton’s disastrous, simpleminded, incompetent, corrupt mismanagement.

    You know, it’s easy to laugh at us, but you haven’t actually explained why we’re wrong.

    Of course, that very first sentence implies you don’t really care if you’re right or not, you’re just saying that stuff to make waves. There’s a word for people like that, but “troll” is generally considered an insult in online fora.

  16. 16.

    Mike S

    December 13, 2005 at 3:38 pm

    You know, it’s easy to laugh at us, but you haven’t actually explained why we’re wrong.

    Davey’s just looking for advancement in the cult of the New GOP. Nothing matters more than the defence of the cult and it’s leader.

  17. 17.

    The Comish (sic)

    December 13, 2005 at 8:03 pm

    Cyrus:

    You know, it’s easy to laugh at us, but you haven’t actually explained why we’re wrong.

    Yes, it is easy to laugh at you.

    And you haven’t explained why you’re right.

  18. 18.

    Andrew J. Lazarus

    December 13, 2005 at 8:09 pm

    Torture does seem to be the theme for leftists.
    Freedom and democracy seem to be the theme for righties.
    All depends on what’s important to you, I guess.

    Quiz: Which one of these exists on the ground? Which is a chimera? Which is the Reality-Based Community?

  19. 19.

    Mike S

    December 13, 2005 at 8:10 pm

    Yes, it is easy to laugh at you.

    I just look on you with pity the same way I look at other Special Olympic contenders.

  20. 20.

    The Comish (sic)

    December 13, 2005 at 8:14 pm

    Cyrus:

    If none of those 625 prisoners died or got permanently crippled, then it’s not torture, was the legal position of the Bush administration for a while.

    It’s bad enough that you folks can’t seem to talk about issues without reverting to the Democratic talking points memo, but now you’re dragging out previously debunked claims as if they’re fresh news? Apparently, no amount of debunking will satisfy you people. Do we really need to go through this issue again? Did you really not get it from the first 100 or so times we discussed it?

  21. 21.

    The Comish (sic)

    December 13, 2005 at 8:18 pm

    Mike S:

    I just look on you with pity the same way I look at other Special Olympic contenders.

    Are you insinuating that I should be embarrassed because the “differently abled” are somehow inferior? What a jerk! Just because people have fewer arms or legs, or a lower IQ, doesn’t make them worthy of your scorn and mockery.

    (Also, extremely lame.)

  22. 22.

    Mike S

    December 13, 2005 at 8:27 pm

    Are you insinuating that I should be embarrassed because the “differently abled” are somehow inferior? What a jerk! Just because people have fewer arms or legs, or a lower IQ, doesn’t make them worthy of your scorn and mockery

    I realise pity is a foreign concept to idiots like you but that is almost sad. I guess the people more deserving of pity than you would be your parents. I’m sure they cant figure out what they did to deserve such an idiot for a son.

  23. 23.

    rachel

    December 14, 2005 at 5:46 am

    TallDave Says:

    Torture does seem to be the theme for leftists.

    Freedom and democracy seem to be the theme for righties.

    All depends on what’s important to you, I guess.

    TallDave, I’m surprised at you suggesting at you saying the righties are against freedom and democracy in the same way that lefties are against torture. Despite what so many have said, I don’t believe that. I think the righties are generally are inept rather than truely evil–except for the righties that favor waterboarding, extrodinary rendition, vote fraud, etc. I’ll grant you that those guys are evil and stupid to boot.

  24. 24.

    Steve S

    December 14, 2005 at 1:38 pm

    There is an interesting argument made by TallDave. One of Goebbel’s propaganda value.

    If lefties spent as much time talking about freedom and democracy as they do torture, the argument of the opposition would fall flat on it’s face. And the thing is, the two values are not in opposition to one another.

    You cannot be for freedom and democracy if you value torture. So it’s the people like TallDave who have distorted values.

Comments are closed.

Primary Sidebar

2024 Pet Calendars!

Order 2024 Calendars

Recent Comments

  • frosty on Monday Morning Open Thread: Holding On to Hope (Dec 4, 2023 @ 11:04am)
  • Spanky on Monday Morning Open Thread: Holding On to Hope (Dec 4, 2023 @ 11:02am)
  • Juju on Late Night Open Thread: Dean Phillips Is Huffing Serious Fumes (Dec 4, 2023 @ 11:01am)
  • Juju on Late Night Open Thread: Dean Phillips Is Huffing Serious Fumes (Dec 4, 2023 @ 10:59am)
  • Citizen Alan on Late Night Open Thread: Dean Phillips Is Huffing Serious Fumes (Dec 4, 2023 @ 10:58am)

🎈Keep Balloon Juice Ad Free

Become a Balloon Juice Patreon
Donate with Venmo, Zelle or PayPal

Balloon Juice Posts

View by Topic
View by Author
View by Month & Year
View by Past Author

Fundraising 2023-24

Wis*Dems Supreme Court + SD-8
Virginia House Races
Four Directions: Montana

Featuring

Medium Cool
Artists in Our Midst
Authors in Our Midst
We All Need A Little Kindness
What Has Biden Done for You Lately?

Calling All Jackals

Site Feedback
Nominate a Rotating Tag
Submit Photos to On the Road
Balloon Juice Mailing List Signup
Balloon Juice Anniversary (All Links)
Balloon Juice Anniversary (All Posts)

Balloon Juice for Ukraine

Donate

Twitter / Spoutible

Balloon Juice (Spoutible)
WaterGirl (Spoutible)
TaMara (Spoutible)
John Cole
DougJ (aka NYT Pitchbot)
Betty Cracker
Tom Levenson
David Anderson
Major Major Major Major
ActualCitizensUnited

Cole & Friends Learn Español

Introductory Post
Cole & Friends Learn Español

Four Directions Montana

Donate

Walter’s Fund (Athenspets)

Donate

Site Footer

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

  • Facebook
  • RSS
  • Twitter
  • YouTube
  • Comment Policy
  • Our Authors
  • Blogroll
  • Our Artists
  • Privacy Policy

Copyright © 2023 Dev Balloon Juice · All Rights Reserved · Powered by BizBudding Inc

Share this ArticleLike this article? Email it to a friend!

Email sent!