I think when we look back, we can just laugh at the fact that the crowning achievement of this Congress and this administration was the passage of a bill that created a 700 mile fence on a several thousand mile border.
I know I feel safer.
Reader Interactions
112Comments
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Pixie
I agree, I think we should just build a huge wall around this country’s borders and there will be nothing to worry about…we can also top it off by building the largest school desk ever that reaches from california to the atlantic shores to fend off any nuke-yoo-lar attacks.
(on a side note- I would be interested in knowing just how much this fence costs, because you know, it’s not like they would just tunnel under it or anything )
Zifnab
I forgot. Did the bill say they were actually going to build the fence, or that they would like to build the fence if only they had the money?
Todd
Maybe it’ll be one of those ‘ol timey, redwood storm fences people used to put up before the braid-molded, orange plastic jobs took over. That would also justify taking out the last California redwood stands, too!
Dan Coyle
Proposed name for fence: The Trichinosis Line.
tBone
I still like my idea of building a wall around Capitol Hill. Let the illegal immigrants run the country instead – they couldn’t do much worse.
VidaLoca
Zifnab,
Really, what does it matter? When has not having the money stopped them from doing anything they thought was politically expedient? If they don’t have the money, they’ll borrow it; someone else will pay off the loans.
The whole idea of budgets is so pre-9/11.
Zifnab
Sometimes. Other times they start up Departments of Faith Based Initiatives and just write alot of IOUs, then bitch about how Medicare and Social Security and Black People On Welfare are taking up all the money that could be put towards a good cause. Alternately, if you ask where the funding will come from, they tell you to stop raising taxes.
Pixie
Zifnab Says:
I forgot. Did the bill say they were actually going to build the fence, or that they would like to build the fence if only they had the money?
No doubt they will have to use cheap labor to build the thing…hmmm I wonder where they could get that…
Zifnab
They’ll just be required to build the fence from the reverse side.
JoeTx
don’t forget that bill to outlaw eating horses!
Punchy
I remember reading an article (and posting here???) about how impossible it is to actually build this. Like, over creeks, for example. How can you build it over a creek without allowing illegals to swim under it, unless you fence it, which you cannot becuase it’d collect all sorts of debris and act like a dam….so the fencing has to be very “large”, meaning any illegal worth his waders could slip thru….
And, as said above…show me a wall, and I’ll show two very rich ladder and shovel salesmen…
jcricket
What’s even better are all the more detailed examinations of the bill that show it says we should build a 700 mile fence, but actually earmarks the money for other stuff more border patrols, unmanned drones, and security cameras.
So they’re sole legislative success is not even going to do anything like what they said it would, despite the rhetoric. Now where have I seen that before?
Oh yeah, everything the Republicans do that involves money (Medicare Plan D, SS Privatization, Iraq war paying for itself, costs of Iraq war, abstinence-only education, No Child Left behind, etc.). The Republican party is quite clearly the party of lies and fiscal irresponsibility, as demonstrated by their 6 years of total political control. What more evidence do you want?
Perhaps we should wait until we’ve spent all the money? (Or all the money people are willing to lend us?) But even then, polling and scientific methodologies have a liberal bias, so the facts you gather won’t be trustworthy.
Halffasthero
I would laugh if the joke were not so ridiculously cruel. In the dictionary under “pathetic” will be this congress (and this preident). It will go down as the worst in history.
RSA
I was going to put up a chain link fence all the way around my property, but I decided it would work just as well if I just installed a two-foot gate. People will see it and think, “I wonder what invisible measures he’s taken to protect his property?”
Mr Furious
Not to worry, when the Democrats get elected, they’ll build the other 1,500 miles of fence out of fetuses.
Davebo
I prefer Governor Rick Perry’s idea to place webcams all along the border and then let people go online and watch for immigrants crossing, and call an 800 number if they see any.
It’s brilliant! And, if we can convince female immigrants to cross the border topless it could even become a pay per view site generating revenue for the state!
Talk about thinking outside of the box.
VidaLoca
Talk about thinking outside of the box — this is the bestest!
You could have all the people on one side of the fence with nothing better to do, sitting and watching their monitors with those 1-800 numbers on speed dial. You could have all the people on the other side of the fence sitting and watching their monitors, trying to figure out where the web cams are. In between there would be a growth industry for replacement web cams, web cam installers…
Or with all the new traffic, you could build a casino! Or two, or three! I tell you, people, the desert is gonna bloom!
Filthy McNasty
Typically sarcastic post from Cole. We receive no better from the man any longer.
Would he have accepted a fence protecting the entire 2000-mile border with Mexico? (It’s not “several thousand miles” long.) Or is it just a convenient opportunity to take a cheap shot at the GOP, and gain camaraderie with the unemployed lefty commenters who encircle him adoringly here at BJ?
See, the fence is a step forward. It makes a statement that we’re gonna put the screws to illegal immigrants. Do I wish it was a 2000-mile fence?….sure I do. But I’ll take it at 1/3 the distance, considering that much of the terrain is unfriendly to coyotes who bring the immigrants across. Now it’ll be harder, and more expensive, and more dangerous, to cross our border. This, combined with the obviousness of the message the fence sends south of the border, should at least begin turning back the tide.
What fucking solution do you propose? Nothing. Nothing to offer, nothing to trust, nothing to bank on, nothing to advance society here other than taking cheap shots at the GOP and whine that you can’t marry your cat. Stop saying that you can’t believe you voted GOP in the past. Nobody cares. You’ve extricated yourself from the family.
What will be left of you all when Bush is gone from office? What will feed your extreme anger and hostility then? Is it a healthy way to live and structure a democracy upon? It must suck being you.
Faux News
Me too John. This 700 mile fence combined with the internet gambling ban has made me throw away my Ambien! Of course that might piss off the Pharm. companies, but that is another thread I guess.
craigie
I bet he can do that in Mexico. Unless there’s a wall, I guess.
craigie
Wouldn’t it be cheaper just to make Mexico the 51st state?
Andrew
Jeez, filthy, that was an excellent spoof. Real feeling, no giveaway spoof-buzz phrases!
But this is straight up gold:
Seriously, most of the posts here are better than 99.44% of the comedy done by “professionals” these days. Heck, it’s better than the Daily Show. I think that there should be a Balloon Juice TV sketch comedy show. Anyone live in LA and know some producers?
Jimmmm
What will be left of you all when Bush is gone from office?
At the present rate, not much.
Why won’t the GOP go after the demand for cheap labor? Start with the meat packers and WalMarts of America that don’t scrutinzed applicants for much more than a heartbeat?
Curb the demand, and the supply will follow suit. Oh, I forgot: Only supply-side cures need apply.
RSA
Think farther outside the box:
This would be more difficult than point-and-shoot Web hunting, in that you’d have to avoid the topless women, but it’s still consistent with the basic brilliant idea.
Face
Everytime I picture this, I just bust out laughing. So…when 2,500 Computer Cops all simultaneously see the same illegal at the same time, they all call the Real Cops at the same time, not knowing that 2,499 other people are all doing it, too.
So, the Local 5-0 gets 2,500+ phone calls all at once. Yeah, that’ll work. And since they cross the border…oh…lets say…every few minutes, I’m guessing…multiply the 2,500 by 6 for the “per hour” approximation.
Pb
Actually, if we could grow enough embryonic stem cells, we could just add them onto each end of the fence, and maybe we’d magically finish the #$&* thing!
Punchy
Next, Filthy is going to propose building jail cells with just 1/3 the wall coverage, because, you know, the prisoners won’t escape out the other 2/3rds of the empty space becuase the cement floor on those sides is “unfriendly”….
Pb
This is the internet, man, automate it. Have them vote on the site. Maybe even add in categories…
( ) Not a damned thing
( ) ILLEGALS!
( ) Drug runners
( ) Nekkid chicks
( ) Tourists
( ) Rush Limbaugh
[REPORT!]
Richard 23
How about enforcing existing laws, such as prosecuting and jailing employers who knowingly hire illegal aliens? That would be much cheaper and more effective than an ugly piece of shit Berlin wall. Once employers start ending up in the slammer others will find the price of cheap labor too steep.
Try attacking the demand rather than the unlimited supply.
Now who’s offering nothing and taking cheap shots, dummy?
It’s his blog. You don’t have to read it. Although your comments are sometimes amusing. You’re funny when you’re bitter.
No. That’s why we want the bums thrown out. Duh.
Likewise. How do you live with yourself, Filthy McProjection?
capelza
What’s next…a horse head in his bed tommorrow morning?
As for no ideas..as was said above, instead of an imagninary fence (because it won’t be built, you tool) go after the employers in this country that hire illegals. Seems simple to me.
Zifnab
I was going to collapse and implode on myself in a bitter culmination of angst and loathing. Then maybe I’d have an abortion. Guys can still get those, right?
Jimmmm
Filthy: My cat is already married. Are you suggesting that I destroy a healthy union, just to fulful some twisted GOP fantasy?
I think the US should build a fence around you.
YellowJournalism
So many dirty comments about “whine that you can’t marry your cat”, so little time…
Krista
You folks have some real useful coyotes down there…ours just kill rabbits and howl at the moon.
Filthy McNasty
I’m all for enforcing existing laws. Those existing laws, dipshit, address both the hiring of non-citizens and entering the country in an illegal means. I’m willing to enforce all laws, unlike you, a self-serving illiterate like the proprietor of this li’l blog.
And, speaking of self-serving dipshit illiterates, the wall is not like a “Berlin wall”, you fool. One was built to keep people in who wanted to get out. The other is to keep people out who want to get in. This serves to illustrate why your like-minded politicians cannot get elected. You’re fucking idiots.
Rusty Shackleford
Uh oh, Filthy Mac’Darrell is getting upset.
Quick, someone get Filthy Mac’Darrell some pie.
Jimmmm
Filthy:
Do you blow your mother with that mouth?
John Cole
Filthy is a spoof, but if you really want to top illegal immigration, you could start with enforcing laws that make it an offense to hire them.
But then you might have to worry about more Republicans chaining their illegal nannies to the floor of the basement.
Zifnab
And once we have the laws in place, we can rest easy knowing that we aren’t going to spend any money enforcing them. Kinda like how we aren’t going to spend any money building a wall.
You’re right, of course. This wall doesn’t look Mexicans INTO Mexico. It just locks them OUT of the US. The Mexicans could, for instance, bypass the US entirely and go to Canada. They’ll just go through… um… err… Can anyone remind me what part of the northern Mexican boarder touches Canada? Anyone? Beuller?
Bombadil
Ah, crap, you blew it. And you were doing so well right up to then.
Mr Furious
LOL! Now THAT is pure gold, Andrew.
Jimmmm
Thanks, Furious.
But who’s Andrew?
VidaLoca
And this all matters exactly … how? The only difference I can see so far is that the original model had the guards and guard towers with machine guns; the East Germans would shoot the people who were trying to cross to the other side — and given time (and if we actually build a real wall, not just a wall of rhetoric and cheap illusions) we’ll have the guns too. Just building a damned wall won’t work — so when we figure that one out, along will come some room-temperature intellect to suggest that we have to turn it into a killing field to honor the dollars that were already spent.
Face
Ah, shit, THAT’S why the Berlin wall didn’t work! They built it facing THE WRONG DIRECTION!! They should have turned it around, and then East Berlin would have prospered. And that damn tunnel would have been worthless, or something.
Thanks, Filth. So, just to be clear, what direction should THIS wall face? Should the North side face North, or South? Which side gets the razor wire on top? Should we plant the landmines on Mexio’s side, so they can clean up their own body parts, or should we set them on our side, so we can take the assorted arms and legs and strip them of all their gold jewelry?
ET
Yesterday on CNN they started this on CNN
Will fencing out illegal immigrants crossing from Mexico solve the U.S. immigration problem?
Well here are the numbers for then:
Yes 17% 9387 votes
No 83% 47112 votes
Here are the numbers when I took it a little while ago:
Yes 16% 23972 votes
No 84% 122483 votes
Apparantly there are 23,972 (and counting) people who would likely disagree with you. And there are 23,972 (and counting) idiots out there.
And then there is this from CNN:
Although a majority of Americans support increasing the number of Border Patrol agents along the U.S.-Mexico border, most do not support building a 700-mile fence along the border, according to a CNN poll released Wednesday.
Seventy-four percent of 1,013 poll respondents said they would be in favor of more U.S. agents along the border. But only 45 percent said they wanted a border fence built, according to the survey conducted by Opinion Research Corp. on behalf of CNN.
Filthy McNasty
I have news for you, Cole. Just as many liberals in this big city of mine hire illegals as conservatives do.
You folks sounds like this Hamas guy regarding Israel’s fence:
Poor baby. But he sounds much like the liberal open-borders lightweights here in the U.S. and Mexico. Interesting bedfellows you have these days.
Andrew
Well played, McNasty. Cole is a Hamas lover. Well played.
Richard 23
Who cares? It’s not a partisan issue. Lock ’em up (employers) and we won’t have to lock ’em out (with a stupid wall).
tBone
Ditto, except I’m also going to try to squeeze in a gay marriage to an illegal terrorist immigrant. And his cat, if he has one.
Excellent work, Mr. McNasty. No links, no references, just pure unadulterated truthiness. Keep sticking it to these leftard moonbats!
Zifnab
Does it get a slow clap?
Like, a “Mark Foley (D)” slow clap?
Richard 23
Make the cost of hiring illegal immigrants and getting caught vastly more expensive than simply hiring legal migrant workers and American citizens and the jobs for illegals will dry up. Beef up enforcement manpower and give that enforcement teeth. No exceptions.
Drive repeat violators out of business. Take away their coporation and business privileges.
Once the demand for illegal labor dries up and illegal immigrants no longer are assured a job as a reward for the trouble of violating our border they will stop coming here. Others who are already here who have no intention of becoming citizens will go home.
An incomplete boondoggle of wall or an ozymandius statue will accomplish none of this.
Darrell
I do think there needs to be beefed up border security, but Richard23 is absolutely right in saying that more vigorous enforcement aimed at employers of illegal aliens would reduce the number of illegals flowing into the country.
Of course John, only Republicans hire illegals. I think that was such an informed, fair minded comment.
Darrell
Damn right. I don’t think I’ve ever agreed with Richard23 on anything before, but on this point, holy sh*t he nails it. Crack down on employers of illegal aliens with a vengeance..
Tony Alva
How ’bout enforcing existing laws to the letter AND building the fence. I could do without Filthy’s vitriol, but I can’t stand the do nothing dead end solutions being proffered here by those on both sides of the isle. Most more than likely are completely unaffected by runaway ILLEGAL immigration and are jumping on GOP bashing bandwagons before the elections. Fine, the GOP deserves it, but frankly, I don’t give a shit whose administration develops and implements a solution, but for Christ sake let’s someone come up with SOME solution vs. doing nothing, which is EXACTLY what this country’s been doing for the last 50 years when it comes to immigration.
Davebo
What’s up with that freaking spread?
Now I can see why they didn’t bother to fund the project. They have no idea what it’s going to cost!
tBone
I agree 100%, Darrell. Group hug.
Mr Furious
Exactly Darrell and Richard23. A fence is a supply-side “solution” and we all know how well that shit works. Eliminate the demand and the supply goes away.
tBone
Phssstt. Like that ever stopped them before.
Davebo
There’s a simple reason for that. For completely different reasons neither party wants to do anything about illegal immigration.
Conversely, the areas most affected by illegal immigration don’t seem to want to do anything about it either.
I’ve seen no evidence to conclude that illegal immigration is any worse now than it was five years ago have you?
And by the way, you can have my housekeeper when you pry her from my cold dead hands!
Mr Furious
Andrew had earlier creditied me with a “pure gold” comment, and I was merely pointing him to yours.
Zifnab
We need to pass an illegal immigrant minimum wage. And then set it well above the actual minimum wage. That would be deliciously ironic.
Mr Furious
Keep up with current events, dummy.
DAvebo, you can have Jim Gibbons’ Housekeeper when you pry her from his cold, hard basement floor.
Faux News
And I suspect Cole is an internet gambler as well! Good thing the anti-nanny state GOP took care of THAT little problem of his!
AnonE.Mouse
Does anyone here object to us waiting until my kids are old enough to cut the grass before we lock out the Mexicans?
Faux News
Has scs weighed in yet on Gay illegal Mexican immigrants walking around the 700 mile fence on their way to New Jersey to get married?
Pity they can’t get married in Vegas. It would save them the long trip.
The Other Steve
There’s not going to be a fence. They already cut funding for it.
This was just a wedge issue bill to motivate the Republican base, with no actual point of enforcement.
The Other Steve
What’s this got to do with the price of tea in china?
Zifnab
That would be the proverbial match hitting the powder keg for the Christian Right, no doubt.
Zifnab
That should be the campaign slogan of every border state Democrat with half a mind to win in ’06.
Punchy
Yes, because all my friend with college degrees have been BEGGING to pick lettuce, work outside in 100+ heat, make $5.15 an hour, and live 15 to an apartment becuase of my pay.
Of course, I’ve always wanted to eat lettuce while working, so I’m looking foward to the opportunity.
Richard 23
Well good. There are things that even polar opposites can agree upon. I suspect that if we were to seriously punish employers who knowingly violate the law (and not just a tap on the wrist and a cost-of-doing-business fine) a solve-nothing eyesore along the southern border would be seen as obviously unnecessary.
Fines for corporate lawbreaking are often factored in as a cost of doing business which are passed on to consumers. Therefore the potential for losing one’s business for flagrant violations must be an option.
Cheap labor is exploited by business and we all suffer as a result of the downward pressure on wages. Lower prices maybe, but lower wages is not an acceptable trade off.
Unfortunately business is seen as a cash cow for politicians so they will do nothing to discourage them from making hefty political contributions. Other than the occasional token bust we get nothing but handwringing and shrill rhetoric.
Business as usual.
Filthy McNasty
Links to what, dickshine? You want me to support every statement made with links, while you do nothing of the sort? My statement was common sense anyhow, unless you honestly believe that only conservatives hire illegal aliens. Fool.
If and when enforcement of employers comes in with a vengeance, the liberal left will cry foul or racism, because the law enforcement actions are unduly affecting poor immigrants who only want to enjoy our way of life, do jobs that we don’t want to do, and happily pay taxes like we do. They talk out of both sides of their mouth. they’re hypocrites who have no desire for enforcement of any kind. If a Democrat came forward who honestly wished to enforce immigration laws, I would vote for him or her without blinking. That candidate will never be seen in my lifetime, because s/he panders to groups who wish to keep the borders open, although different from the groups the conservatives pander to. Either way, we get the same result.
HyperIon
exactly.
but i think the citizens are as conflicted. we all want to feel secure. we all want cheap housekeeper/gardeners. we all hate hard choices.
Filthy McNasty
No, we don’t. That’s a canard just like the one that states “if we crack down on illegal immigrants, we’ll all be eating $20 heads of lettuce!!”.
DecidedFenceSitter
According to NPR this evening –
The Minute Men are building a similar fence to what is being proposed, fiber-optic cables, double layer metal, for about 1 million a mile. They are doing it on private land.
The Government’s estimates are at 2-8 million a mile for the fence itself.
John S.
Because they have to make sure that this fence is accessible to the residents of Alaska. In fact, I hear they are thinking of calling it the Don Young Fence…
Richard 23
Apparently you don’t talk out of your mouth at all. Who holds both houses of Congress and the Presidency? The liberals? Hah! The principled conservatives are too scared of “the liberal left” crying over cracking down on businesses that break the law? Give me a break.
What has the Republican party done to crack down on employers? They have the majority, they have the power and have had it for nearly six long years. What have they done? Demagogue. And passed a bullshit Secure Fence Act which does nothing but waste money.
tBone
Nope, I don’t believe that only conservatives hire illegal aliens. I do believe it’s funny when you get all pissy about being called on your mock-authoritative statements, though.
By the way, in my city, conservatives who chain their illegal immigrants in the basement outnumber liberals who chain their illegal immigrants in the basement 3 to 1.
Davebo
Look guys, before you can crack down on employers, you’ve got to give them the tools to prevent inadvertently hiring illegals.
Right now employers are required to complete an I-9 stating that they’ve seen the proper identification to allow a person to work in the US. They aren’t required to determine the validity of that identification, and shouldn’t be required to do so. It’s not a companies job to sniff out phoney Social Security cards, etc. And the current Social Security card is ridiculously easy to conterfeit.
Most companies will photocopy the documents provided just to cover themselves but even that isn’t required by law.
So what do we do? An online database of Social Security documents that any employer can log onto to verify eligibility? That’s pretty concerning to me.
Tsulagi
And that’s solely why The Deciderator pushes so hard for his guest worker program. It’s those big, burly omnipotent liberals. He’s forced to impotently go along so they don’t beat up on him. Nasty libruls, that’s what it is.
Couldn’t be the retard king doesn’t enforce existing employer laws because he’s an equal-time suck boy not only to Dobson/Falwell but also big campaign contributors, right? Naw. He’s just on his vision quest. The decent paying jobs that can’t be outsourced, well, let’s just insource them. Better living in America through lower pay and costs to A-list contributors. Neo-Republican gospel.
Jimitha
I’m far more concerned with outsourcing my job to India for $10/hr or the Phillippines for $3/hr than with immigrants taking shit jobs no one else will take. This wall is not about protecting American jobs, but about fear of brown people.
The Other Steve
National ID cards proving you are a citizen, and vote REpublican!
Only then can we insure jobs go to the right people.
Pooh
More pertinently he likes pie with that mouth.
Dave
Why not just hire the illegals to keep an eye out for terrorists?
BadTux
In European countries, you are given a work card by the government that contains your photo and fingerprints and such if you’re legally authorized to work in the country, similar to our social security card. However, this work card has an embedded microchip. Employers are required to buy a terminal that connects to the central employment authority. When someone comes in and asks for a job, employers are required to stick the work card in the terminal, which then calls up the central employment authority and displays the picture of the person to whom the card belongs (thanks to reading the microchip and transmitting that ID info to the central computer). If the picture and general demographic info doesn’t match the person sitting in the employer’s office, it’s no job. This is a whole lot harder to fake than a driver’s license and social security card, the latter of which can be faked with a simple color copier.
This does not, of course, eliminate illegal immigration into European countries. Immigrants are driven by a number of things that are unaffected by whether they’ll be able to get a job, such as, say, the fact that their home government is oppressive or that they’re starving in their home country due to drought and overpopulation and government corruption or their home country is violent or whatever. It does, however, reduce immigration from countries that aren’t utter hell-holes, and drives employment of said immigrants underground where it doesn’t take jobs away from citizens of the country. And it’d certainly be a whole lot more effective than a 700 mile fence to cover a 2000 mile border — where not a dime has been allocated to build said fence.
BadTux
PS — my proposal is of course impossible, because Republicans would *never* vote for a “national ID card” — even though they’ve turned driver’s licenses into a de-facto one already.
Pooh
Being against a national ID card is pre 9/11 thinking.
Gary Ruppert
The fact is that liberals oppose this wall because they intend to illegally register every Mexican who crosses the border to vote as a Democrat. Nobody else will vote for the party with no ideas, no morals, and no spine.
rachel
So, what I’m wondering is: if this fence ever gets built, would crossing it be like making it “home” in a game of hide-n-seek? I mean, we’d have a fence to keep them out, so wouldn’t we need Department of Immigration personnel stationed anywhere but along the fence any more. (OK, we’d still need some for the ports and airports, but those guys aren’t there to keep the Mexicans out.) Employers inside the fence wouldn’t have to check employees IDs, undocumented laborers who had the smarts and drive to make it across the fence–people who who are assets to any society–wouldn’t need to worry about being rounded up in ‘migra raids and sent back. Everybody could relax and settle down and get some work done.
And as an added bonus, the Department of Immigration employs some of the nastiest and most unreasonable bastards you’d ever hope to meet. Seriously, they piss off law-abiding foreign tourists and make the USA look bad. Round those ones up and send them out to patrol the Texas/Mexico border until they learn some manners. It could only make society more pleasant for the rest of us.
tBone
We’re also going to gay marry them, convert them to Islam, and then teach them to perform involuntary abortions. Didn’t you get the memo?
Richard 23
Gary, are you really a 12 year old illegal mexican immigrant working for the GOP?
Gary es puto! Sadly, yes!
ImJohnGalt
Fuck that. If lettuce costs $20.00 a head, we won’t *all* be eating it. I’ll be eating Captain Crunch and Shamrock Shakes.
Newport 9
The solution to the illegal immigration problem is obvious. Repeal the minimum wage law and the child labor laws, outlaw labor unions, and wait for wages to drop to 3rd world levels. After that, no there’ll be no incentive for illegals to enter the US.
We can applaud Wal-Mart for its innovative attempt to implement this policy all on its own.
scarshapedstar
This is, to date, the best take I’ve heard on the issue.
Marie
Wow. This is some really adolescent debating. So, when does the partisan crybaby stuff stop and real solutions begin? Reminds me of all the political commercials being played today.
tBone
Please feel free to enlighten us with your “real solutions.”
Marie
Please feel free to enlighten us with your “real solutions.”
First off, voter registration reform would be the first order of business. If you can stop the illegals from voting, then maybe you can get a bipartisan bill passed.
Unless, of course, you feel that illegals should be allowed to vote?
ImJohnGalt
That’s a great idea. Let’s take it one step further. In addition to stopping illegals from voting, perhaps we can ensure that blacks can vote, instead of routinely disenfranchising them in states with Republican election boards.
But back to the point. Are you seriously arguing that if we’d only better police the voter registration rolls, that we’d nip illegal immigration in the bud? Are you suggesting that one of the parties doesn’t want to do anything about illegals because illegals voting are the only reason they get elected, and if illegals couldn’t vote, they’d be happy to do something about illegal immigration?
Wow. I thought I was a cynic.
Punchy
I LOVE shamrock shakes.
Marie
ImJohnGalt,
Sorry, I stil haven’t figured out how to quote your post.
Regarding your comment about illegal immigrants voting, yes I believe our dear leaders do depend on their votes and if I remember right, the original bill in the house was turned down because they were afraid if they took a stand, they would disenfranchise those voters. It’s really too bad. Cynical? No. I prefer to call it being realistic.
As far as your comment about black voters, I believe they are smart enough to be able to figure out how to vote on their own.
ImJohnGalt
Sure a belief like this has to come from some bit of substantiated reporting or press releases, no? Making assertions like this generally requires a source. If this outrageous claim were true, I’m sure we’d still be hearing about it. Any elected representative that said “I can’t pass this legislation because then these illegal residents couldn’t vote for me” would be signing their electoral death warrant.
Which is why after every recent election (see:Ohio) we’ve read stories about too few voting machines in black districts, and flyers being put up in those same districts giving incorrect information as to voting dates and locations. Not to mention the purges from the voter rolls of many blacks in Florida who were absolutely entitled to vote. I can find links to all of these stories if you’d like.
tBone
This is your Real Solution™? You’re arguing that the illegal immigrant voting bloc is so powerful that Congress can’t act on reform?
Yeah, I wonder why we enjoy “adolescent debating” instead of the calm, serious analysis you bring to the table.
Marie
I’m sure if we search we can find many stories about voter fraud issues in a lot of different states. Does that mean it’s a coordinated effort to stop black people from voting? I doubt it. If I remember right, there was a shortage of voting machines in districts that were NOT black districts. It sounds to me like you’re cherry picking voter fraud information to try to make a point.
By the way, have you ever seen the final report in regard to your comments regarding the incidents you’re referring to in Florida? It seems to me that many of the grievances are based more on perception than fact. What is a “long line” in terms of time? What causes black to “believe” their votes were not properly counted?
You’re right thought that I can’t prove that Dems and Repubs alike depend on those illegal votes. So, it shouldn’t be a problem then to get this reform going, then should it?
Marie
Tbone,
Yes, it’s a start. What’s your suggestion?
tBone
Go after employers. Cut off demand and the supply will dry up. I think that’s a better place to start than trying to eliminate an imaginary power bloc controlling our Congress, but that’s just me.
RSA
Or not:
It’s nice to have boogeymen to blame (illegal immigrant voters, dead-enders in Iraq, liberals in America) for all of our problems, but hiding under the bedsheets won’t really help matters.
ImJohnGalt
From the Sacremento Bee (registration required)
The Tradition of Disenfranchisement
Selected quotes (and yes, I recognize this is an opinion piece, but it was a pretty decent summary of some of the issues that were raised)
ImJohnGalt
And a more in-depth look into black voter disenfranchisement
We Who Believe In Freedom . .
bud
To address the original post- (wow, what a concept!)…
The journey of two thousand miles begins with a single step.
OR
What do you call 700 lawyers at the bottom of the ocean?
A good start!
ImJohnGalt
Unless they are the lawyers defending any of the Republicans currently under investigation. Then they’re the *good* kind.
Gary Farber
I do actually wonder why, if the issue is, as so many claim, “security,” and nothing whatever to do with race, why, exactly, the same people seem so unconcerned about the thousands of miles of open, unfenced, border with Canada. If it’s al Qaeda and friends that are allegedly the concern, shouldn’t we be fencing off the Canadian border?
And, personally, I’ve known more than a few undocumented Canadians working illegally in the U.S. We do we let these unwashed masses steal American jobs?!?
“Fine, the GOP deserves it, but frankly, I don’t give a shit whose administration develops and implements a solution, but for Christ sake let’s someone come up with SOME solution vs. doing nothing, which is EXACTLY what this country’s been doing for the last 50 years when it comes to immigration.”
Kinda like the first 100 years of the country; gosh, that turned out terribly, didn’t it? (Well, okay, for the people who were here 600 years ago, it did; but they aren’t the ancestors of most of the people in hysterics about an alleged immigration problem.)
Aaron
We should slash farmer welfare so that Mexican farmers can compete.
Farm Welfare is 3/4 corporate welfare.