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You are here: Home / Foreign Affairs / Military / Why Do These Soldiers Hate America?

Why Do These Soldiers Hate America?

by John Cole|  May 31, 200710:08 am| 51 Comments

This post is in: Military, Politics, War on Terror aka GSAVE®

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We are in deep trouble if the soliders are in league with the terrorists, which is what it seems:

Spc. David Williams, 22, of Boston, Mass., had two note cards in his pocket Wednesday afternoon as he waited for Sen. Joseph Lieberman. Williams serves in the 82nd Airborne Division from Fort Bragg, N.C., the first of the five “surge” brigades to arrive in Iraq, and he was chosen to join the Independent from Connecticut for lunch at a U.S. field base in Baghdad.

The night before, 30 other soldiers crowded around him with questions for the senator.

He wrote them all down. At the top of his note card was the question he got from nearly every one of his fellow soldiers:

“When are we going to get out of here?”

***

“We’re not making any progress,” Hedin said, as he recalled a comrade who was shot by a sniper last week. “It just seems like we drive around and wait to get shot at.”

But as he waited two chairs down from where Lieberman would sit, Hedin said he’d never voice his true feelings to the senator.

“I think I’d be a private if I did,” he joked. “It’s just more troops, more targets.”

In the past two months, the unit has lost two men. In May alone, at least 120 U.S. troops died in Iraq, the bloodiest month in 2007 and the highest number since the battles of Fallujah in 2004.

Spc. Kevin Krasco, 20, of Medford, Mass., and Spc. Kevin Adams, 20, of Moosup, Conn., chimed in with their dismay before turning the conversation to baseball.

“It’s like everything else in this war,” Adams said, referring to Baghdad. “It hasn’t changed.”

***

As Lieberman walked out, he said that congressionally mandated withdrawal would be a “victory for al-Qaida and a victory for Iran.”

“They’re not Pollyannaish about this,” he said referring to the young soldiers he ate lunch with. “They know it’s not going to be solved in a day or a month.”

It isn’t clear whether Williams mentioned the last line on his note card, the one that had a star next to it.

“We don’t feel like we’re making any progress,” it said.

If you ask the soldiers, this is the most maddening thing- the visits from blowhards like Lieberman who come in, “listen” to the troops, and then go out and say whatever they planned to say, regardless what they have “learned” in their heavily guarded photo-op tours of the region. The problem for these soldiers is they just don’t understand that when they signed the contract for service, they pledged that they would die for their country. Lieberman and the other ‘stay the course’ fools just want to hold them to their word.

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Reader Interactions

51Comments

  1. 1.

    Bombadil

    May 31, 2007 at 10:13 am

    But things must be going swimmingly in Iraq, since Holy Joe can walk freely and openly in the markets, just like St. John McCain.

  2. 2.

    Tom Hilton

    May 31, 2007 at 10:29 am

    What kind of glasses was Lieberman wearing when he saw all that progress?

  3. 3.

    Andrew

    May 31, 2007 at 10:29 am

    Why can’t these soldiers just do the honorable thing and come out as gay so we can kick them out of the military?

  4. 4.

    Mr Furious

    May 31, 2007 at 10:31 am

    This comment over at Bombadil’s Think Progress link summed it up perfectly…

    Troops In Iraq to Lieberman:

    ‘When Are We Going To Get Out Of Here?

    Lieberman’s reply:

    “I don’t know about you, but I’m outta here as soon as I get my picture taken…”

  5. 5.

    Bombadil

    May 31, 2007 at 10:33 am

    What kind of glasses was Lieberman wearing when he saw all that progress?

    According to the article:

    Lieberman walked in to see the soldiers “wearing a pair of sunglasses newly purchased from an Iraqi market that the military had taken him to in southeast Baghdad.”

    Draw your own conclusions.

  6. 6.

    Barry

    May 31, 2007 at 10:38 am

    Lieberman was wearing the same glasses that he wears when he looks in the mirror, and sees the Most Moral Man In The Senate.

  7. 7.

    Pug

    May 31, 2007 at 10:44 am

    What kind of glasses was Lieberman wearing when he saw all that progress?

    OK…the obvious answer is …uh…rose colored?

  8. 8.

    ATS

    May 31, 2007 at 10:46 am

    Be it duly noted that the DHS was Joe’s moronic idea, and–according to Richard Clarke–the sole reason Bush created the added bureaucracy.

    Is Liebermann dropping by his district in Tel Aviv for supplimentary instructions from cousin Avignor?

  9. 9.

    rachel

    May 31, 2007 at 10:51 am

    Remember this little gem from TIME?

    Homesick grunts from the Army’s 3Rd Infantry Division may have ruffled Pentagon feathers last week by calling for Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld’s resignation. But it turns out the soldiers have history on their side. As long as wars have been waged, troops have complained about their work, often censuring their leaders with more than harsh words. Here’s a look at how servicemen have vented through the ages.

    Their complaints then didn’t change anything.

  10. 10.

    RSA

    May 31, 2007 at 10:57 am

    I think that the old-fashioned term “cannon fodder” is ready for a resurgence.

  11. 11.

    dslak

    May 31, 2007 at 10:57 am

    Why can’t these soldiers just do the honorable thing and come out as gay so we can kick them out of the military?

    My brother tried that, and it was even true, but he had the (mis)fortune of having a CO who cared more about his ability as a soldier than his sexual orientation. If you’re going to go that route, make sure the right homophobes find out.

  12. 12.

    Tax Analyst

    May 31, 2007 at 10:57 am

    I think “Holy Joe” probably bothers me even more than most Republicans, which is really saying something. It’s one thing for a politician to behave in a “it’s really all about me and maintaining my Office” manner…there might an exception somewhere, but I can’t really think of one off-hand. But Joe is so fucking sanctimonius about it…you know, he’s really only doing this for US, ‘cuz he’s such a Moral Beacon…no, no-no…make that THE Moral Beacon…for all of US…and by the Fate’s and their obviously sick sense of humor he holds a particular and peculiar brand of power by being the “tipping” vote in the Senate…which sort of immunizes him from the type of point-blank overt criticism I suspect he would otherwise receive from the Democratic side. Yeah, another piece-of-work that makes me want to puke…you know, if I really did puke every time I get that feeling these days the freaking veins in my throat would explode.

  13. 13.

    Bombadil

    May 31, 2007 at 11:00 am

    Their complaints then didn’t change anything.

    Why do the troops hate the troops?

  14. 14.

    Cyrus

    May 31, 2007 at 11:10 am

    dslak Says:

    My brother tried that, and it was even true, but he had the (mis)fortune of having a CO who cared more about his ability as a soldier than his sexual orientation. If you’re going to go that route, make sure the right homophobes find out.

    Shit, that’s not what I want to hear. A lot of people my parent’s age have said they’re worried about politicians bringing back the draft, but I’m complacent about it because DADT is still in place(1). My generation is tolerant enough of homosexuality that there would be massive waves of people willing to claim to be gay to get out of being drafted(2). Don’t tell me that won’t work!

    (1) I’m complacent about it for other reasons as well, like the fact that few politicians are anywhere close to dumb enough to seriously propose something so unpopular without a really fucking good reason, but still.

    (2) At least, I know I would.

  15. 15.

    Tom Hilton

    May 31, 2007 at 11:16 am

    Lieberman walked in to see the soldiers “wearing a pair of sunglasses newly purchased from an Iraqi market that the military had taken him to in southeast Baghdad.”

    If I worked in that market, I would definitely stay home for the next week or so. Remember what happened the day after McCain’s market visit.

  16. 16.

    Tsulagi

    May 31, 2007 at 11:19 am

    “We’re not making any progress,” Hedin said, as he recalled a comrade who was shot by a sniper last week. “It just seems like we drive around and wait to get shot at.”

    See, now that’s the problem with the enlisted ranks. Sometimes they just don’t see the big picture, the vision guiding the top of the chain. That vision currently focused on Jan 20, 09. The day your Commander Guy can hand this sack of shit baby democracy to the next guy to blame nurture.

    That’s the mission, soldier. We’re getting there one day at a time. There’s your progress. Stay the course.

    And your job in this mission, soldier, is not to be a mole in this reversed game of Whack-A-Mole. So if not selected for dog and pony strolls with Lieberman or McCain, while driving around, keep your head low from snipers above and your ass high from IEDs below. Because if you’re one of those whacked, and if our hate-America press reports it, your president will suffer greatly. Laura said so.

  17. 17.

    Zifnab

    May 31, 2007 at 11:29 am

    Shit, that’s not what I want to hear. A lot of people my parent’s age have said they’re worried about politicians bringing back the draft, but I’m complacent about it because DADT is still in place(1). My generation is tolerant enough of homosexuality that there would be massive waves of people willing to claim to be gay to get out of being drafted(2). Don’t tell me that won’t work!

    Canada is still really nice this time of year.

  18. 18.

    Punchy

    May 31, 2007 at 11:44 am

    From the I-can’t-make-this-shit-up department:

    U.S. military commanders are talking with Iraqi militants about cease-fires and other arrangements to try to stop the violence, the No. 2 American commander said Thursday

    Lemmie see if I understand this. Our NEW! and EXCITING! plan to stop the killing is to…wait for it…ask each group to stop killing? It’s THAT easy???

    We should thus win The War On Drugs, too, if we simply ask each person to stop doing drugs. I bet we can easily win The War On Poverty if we simply ask all the homeless to quit being so poor.

    Simple.

  19. 19.

    ThymeZone

    May 31, 2007 at 11:48 am

    The thing that dogma relies on is the ability to manipulate people into choosing against their own interests by fooling them into choosing in favor of other interests.

    These soldiers are simply making rational choices based on their interests, and on their country’s interests.

    The powers that be would prefer that the soldiers choose in favor of the powers’ interests.

    Apparently, the bullshit isn’t working as well as it did a while back. What a surprise, you ask people to put their asses on the line, and they start thinking for themselves.

  20. 20.

    ThymeZone

    May 31, 2007 at 11:50 am

    We should thus win The War On Drugs, too, if we simply ask each person to stop doing drugs

    Hey, it worked for Nancy “Just say no” Reagan.

    Dogma is a wonderful thing, if you just believe in it.

  21. 21.

    Bubblegum Tate

    May 31, 2007 at 12:39 pm

    Hey, it worked for Nancy “Just say no” Reagan.

    Well, it worked for a while–there was no drug use in the nation. Then Ice Cube came along and said, “We don’t just say no, we’re too busy saying yeah!” and all of a sudden, people started doing drugs again.

  22. 22.

    Rome Again

    May 31, 2007 at 12:51 pm

    Dogma is a wonderful thing, if you just believe in it.

    I’ll consider your dogma if you consider my catma!

  23. 23.

    ThymeZone

    May 31, 2007 at 12:55 pm

    I’ll consider your dogma if you consider my catma!

    Hooowwwl!

  24. 24.

    Andrew

    May 31, 2007 at 12:56 pm

    I’ll consider your dogma if you consider my catma!

    Minus 10 points for Hufflepuff on account of the bad pun.

  25. 25.

    Rome Again

    May 31, 2007 at 12:58 pm

    Minus 10 points for Hufflepuff on account of the bad pun.

    Fuck off, who asked you?

  26. 26.

    Tulkinghorn

    May 31, 2007 at 1:04 pm

    Hufflepuff? Them’s fighting words!

  27. 27.

    Andrew

    May 31, 2007 at 1:15 pm

    Fuck off, who asked you?

    Temper, temper. Still bitter about not getting into Gryffindor, I see.

  28. 28.

    Rome Again

    May 31, 2007 at 1:17 pm

    Temper, temper. Still bitter about not getting into Gryffindor, I see.

    Gryffindor is for twelve year olds, grow up!

  29. 29.

    Dulcie

    May 31, 2007 at 1:23 pm

    Then Ice Cube came along and said, “We don’t just say no, we’re too busy saying yeah!” and all of a sudden, people started doing drugs again.

    Why does Ice Cube hate America?

  30. 30.

    S.W. Anderson

    May 31, 2007 at 1:35 pm

    “Is Liebermann dropping by his district in Tel Aviv for supplimentary instructions from cousin Avignor?”

    A hat tip for the most insightful comment in this thread.

  31. 31.

    ImJohnGalt

    May 31, 2007 at 1:39 pm

    I think your karma just ran over my dogma.

  32. 32.

    Andrew

    May 31, 2007 at 1:48 pm

    Gryffindor is for twelve year olds, grow up!

    My, aren’t we a little Death Eater today.

  33. 33.

    Tom Hilton

    May 31, 2007 at 2:12 pm

    Lemmie see if I understand this. Our NEW! and EXCITING! plan to stop the killing is to…wait for it…ask each group to stop killing? It’s THAT easy???

    Wow…that could be almost as effective as McCain’s plan to (in his words) “sit the Shiites and the Sunnis down and say, ‘Stop the bullshit'”.

  34. 34.

    Tom S

    May 31, 2007 at 2:36 pm

    Is there any indication that the soldiers actually asked Lieberman any of the questions that Spc Williams collected? I hope they did, but it wasn’t clear to me.

  35. 35.

    The Other Steve

    May 31, 2007 at 2:49 pm

    Thank God we have Senators like Joe Liberman who are out there Supporting our Troops.

    By calling for withdrawl, you moonbats aren’t properly supporting our soldiers!

  36. 36.

    The Other Steve

    May 31, 2007 at 2:50 pm

    Is there any indication that the soldiers actually asked Lieberman any of the questions that Spc Williams collected? I hope they did, but it wasn’t clear to me.

    I think it’s clear he did not, for fear of being busted down to a private.

  37. 37.

    Shabbazz

    May 31, 2007 at 2:55 pm

    Why does Ice Cube hate Amerikkka?

    Fixed.

  38. 38.

    Rome Again

    May 31, 2007 at 3:07 pm

    My, aren’t we a little Death Eater today.

    Well, now that you mention it, yes, I might go to the theater today.

  39. 39.

    ThymeZone

    May 31, 2007 at 3:13 pm

    Well, now that you mention it, yes, I might go to the theater today.

    Clearly, point to Rome here.

    Continue ….

  40. 40.

    Tsulagi

    May 31, 2007 at 4:14 pm

    He wrote them all down. At the top of his note card was the question he got from nearly every one of his fellow soldiers:

    “When are we going to get out of here?”

    Well, this from The Dallas Morning News could give SPC Williams and his fellow soldiers an answer…

    Friends of his from Texas were shocked recently to find him nearly wild-eyed, thumping himself on the chest three times while he repeated “I am the president!” He also made it clear he was setting Iraq up so his successor could not get out of “our country’s destiny.”

  41. 41.

    ThymeZone

    May 31, 2007 at 4:18 pm

    Friends of his from Texas were shocked recently to find him nearly wild-eyed, thumping himself on the chest three times while he repeated “I am the president!” He also made it clear he was setting Iraq up so his successor could not get out of “our country’s destiny.”

    The man is clearly a lunatic.

  42. 42.

    Tsulagi

    May 31, 2007 at 4:29 pm

    The man is clearly a lunatic.

    Note to voters: No matter how much lipstick you put on a retarded, spoiled brat…No matter how well you dress him up in manly cowboy boots and Stetson…YOU STILL HAVE A RETARDED, SPOILED BRAT.

  43. 43.

    Punchy

    May 31, 2007 at 4:40 pm

    Then Ice Cube came along and said, “We don’t just say no, we’re too busy saying yeah!” and all of a sudden, people started doing drugs again.

    You must give props to the whole N.W.A. crew, lest I accuse you of denying the genius that was Easy, Ren, and Dre. And when I’m finished, I’ll bring the yellow tape.

  44. 44.

    Bubblegum Tate

    May 31, 2007 at 5:38 pm

    You must give props to the whole N.W.A. crew, lest I accuse you of denying the genius that was Easy, Ren, and Dre. And when I’m finished, I’ll bring the yellow tape.

    There are T-shirts that say in a nice, clear font:

    Cube
    Dre
    Ren
    Yella
    and Eazy

    I want one.

  45. 45.

    Krista

    May 31, 2007 at 6:04 pm

    I think your karma just ran over my dogma.

    Damn, I was all set with that one, but you beat me to it.

    Sigh…I really have to stop taking work home. Maybe then I’ll be able to keep up with you folks again.

  46. 46.

    Rome Again

    May 31, 2007 at 6:19 pm

    Sigh…I really have to stop taking work home. Maybe then I’ll be able to keep up with you folks again.

    Yes, you do! You’re sadly missed around here.

  47. 47.

    ThymeZone

    May 31, 2007 at 6:37 pm

    You’re sadly missed around here.

    Seconded!

  48. 48.

    Krista

    May 31, 2007 at 9:00 pm

    Aw thanks! No rest for the wicked, though — this next month is going to be completely nutso. Once the conference is over, I’ll be back full strength. Until then, it’ll be mostly lurking, with the odd drive-by comment.

  49. 49.

    Lee

    June 1, 2007 at 8:32 am

    Saw a interesting article that was appropriate for this thread.

    Marine to be redischarged as less than honorable for protests

  50. 50.

    Andrew

    June 1, 2007 at 8:40 am

    Marine to be redischarged as less than honorable for protests

    I say this with all due respect to the military:
    Its full of total assholes.

  51. 51.

    Tax Analyst

    June 1, 2007 at 12:03 pm

    Rome Again Says:

    Minus 10 points for Hufflepuff on account of the bad pun.

    Fuck off, who asked you?

    May 31st, 2007 at 12:58 pm

    Sorry I’m late…did I miss a catfight here? Well, my cat ma once had five kittens, they were REAL cute, too. But it was a bitch giving them away, though…you can’t keep ’em and you sure as fuck don’t want to give them to someone until you’re sure they aren’t some raving lunatic that might stick a firecracker up their ass or go around pounding their chest exclaiming, “I Am The President”. Why do I have the feeling I just might have described the same person twice?

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