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You are here: Home / Politics / Another One Down

Another One Down

by John Cole|  June 4, 200710:47 am| 80 Comments

This post is in: Politics, Republican Stupidity

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Mark Levin makes a courageous break from the President:

take from Mark Steyn and Jonah Goldberg’s comments that conservatives have been tolerant of President Bush for a long time, given his embrace of big-government from the start. And they have. But I don’t think the issue is that conservatives are generally surprised that the president is a big-government Republican. I just think they’ve had enough of it. In return for their support, the GOP no longer controls Congress and is adrift.

***

However, many conservatives believe an intervention is necessary now or in 2008 the Democrats may well retain Congress and pick up the presidency. President Bush is the leader of the party, in charge of the RNC, and for the most part sets the national agenda. And apart from the war (although there’s a growing voice of dissent in that regard) much of the national agenda is seen as misplaced (amnesty) and reactive (global warming).

A real profile in courage- waiting until Bush is at 26% with a few months left in his election to call him out. Bravo, Mark. I am not sure what is more depressing, the fact that it took these “intellectuals” until now to realize what a failure this administration has been, or that what really appears to be motivating him is the possibility of a Democratic President in 2008. I guess I shouldn’t be too smug- it took me until 2004-2005 to realize the smelly dirty hippies were right all along.

Much more here.

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Reader Interactions

80Comments

  1. 1.

    dslak

    June 4, 2007 at 10:54 am

    That’s Mark Levin, not Mark Steyn. But he does mention Steyn. That’s probably the source of the mix-up.

  2. 2.

    Rome Again

    June 4, 2007 at 10:55 am

    or that what really appears to be motivating him is the possibility of a Democratic President in 2008

    I fear they would have been perfectly happy with this president’s policies so long as they weren’t facing a fairly predictable defeat in 2008. I think you are absolutely correct to question this.

  3. 3.

    DougJ

    June 4, 2007 at 10:57 am

    I have to quibble a little bit here. Although he leaves it til the end, the “amnesty” issue is huge for these nuts. Let’s remember: the contemporary national Republican party was built on opposition to civil rights for African-Americans. That means that a large portion of the most xenophobic, anti-immigrant voters support Republicans.

    Without that bloc, there is no Republicans majority. And it’s not just southerners either — ethnic working class voters in the northeast (like my Irish-American uncles) are extremely anti-immigrant as well. They’re also poster boys for people who need help from the government at times (unemployment benefits, etc.) but hate “liberals.” Much of this is based on racism, whether they’d admit it or not.

  4. 4.

    Jake

    June 4, 2007 at 10:59 am

    …conservatives have been tolerant of President Bush for a long time…

    Tolerant? Hmm. Let’s check the old Oxford Desk Dictionary & Thesaurus.

    1. Disposed to tolerate; 2. Enduring or patient.

    Tolerate: 1. Allow the existence or occurence of without interference. 2. Endure (suffering, etc) 3. Be able to take (a drug, radiation, etc) without harm.

    Call me a word nerd but I don’t think non-stop cheerleading, daily fluffer sessions and savage attacks against those who disagree fits the definition of “Tolerant.”

    A real profile in courage- waiting until Bush is at 26% with a few months left in his election to call him out ^say “Oh that guy? I don’t really like him. I just put up with him because … well … he’s not as bad as that dude over there.”

    Fixed. Steyn is a pathetic little fink who desperately wants to be cool. He’s ditching his geek friend after the popular kids laugh at him a few too many times. Courage indeed.

  5. 5.

    demimondian

    June 4, 2007 at 11:05 am

    From TFA:

    They rallied to him especially after 9/11, especially at a time of war, and especially given that the anti-war movement (led by the Democratic party) is so extreme and dangerous.

    Oh, yeah, Mark, you’re so brave — you can still call Democrats traitors using nice words.

    Thousands of dead American soldiers and Marines, tens of thousands of wounded troops, Iraq turned into a breeding and staging ground for terrorists, and every bit of America’s prestige thrown away, and the Democrats are “extreme and dangerous”?

  6. 6.

    Andrew

    June 4, 2007 at 11:18 am

    Mark Steyn doesn’t have time to break with Bush. The Islamists are out reproducing the Europeans, after all, and there are movie reviews to be written.

  7. 7.

    Zombie Santa Claus

    June 4, 2007 at 11:18 am

    Without that bloc, there is no Republicans majority. And it’s not just southerners either—ethnic working class voters in the northeast (like my Irish-American uncles) are extremely anti-immigrant as well. They’re also poster boys for people who need help from the government at times (unemployment benefits, etc.) but hate “liberals.” Much of this is based on racism, whether they’d admit it or not

    Reagan Democrats. School busing was a big issue for people like this, too. Keep my kids away from the black/brown/yellow people!

    This is why the GOP will probably strengthen its hold in places like Ohio along with the Deep South. However, it will continue to lose support in places like the Rockies and the Upper South, and faces the very real possibility of losing Texas as well. The shift in political strength will probably end up slightly in the Democrats’ favor. More importantly in the short term, anyone who votes for a Republican in 2008 is patently insane.

    (I know the polls show Giuliani in a theoretical dead heat in a theoretical match-up with Hillary, but if Giuliani actually won the nomination I’m pretty sure any Democratic candidate, even Hillary, could thrash him quite soundly. They haven’t yet begun to scratch the surface of the dirt on that guy. The ferret-hating police-sodomizer-torture-supporter who thought it’d be a good idea to put NYC’s emergency center underneath the #1 terror target in NYC. His aides are all corrupt mobsters, and his mistresses and social liberalism would make sure that the most extreme elements of his party’s base would turn out in droves to vote for a third party candidacy by Tom Tancredo.)

  8. 8.

    Zombie Santa Claus

    June 4, 2007 at 11:20 am

    Fixed. Steyn is a pathetic little fink who desperately wants to be cool. He’s ditching his geek friend after the popular kids laugh at him a few too many times. Courage indeed.

    Rats fleeing a sinking ship. They think this makes them brave.

  9. 9.

    Jake

    June 4, 2007 at 11:21 am

    ‘Tis true demimondian! The Democratic Party is so extreme and dangerous that putting too many leaders in one spot can cause earthquakes!

    Unless that was God’s Wrath at the civil unions bill? Hard to tell what causes these things, but you can be sure some sort of Unwashed Librul Democratic hijinks are involved.

  10. 10.

    spoosmith

    June 4, 2007 at 11:26 am

    Glenn Greenwald has a great article up on this very issue. He does a great job of pointing out the absolute hypocrisy of the “conservative” backlash against “he once was our hero, but not at 28%” crowd.

    http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/

    Sorry for the archaic link, but I’m embarrassed to admint that

    1) I can’t figure out how to embed the links
    2) I can’t figure out how to embed quotes

    So sorry for the crappy formatting.

  11. 11.

    Tim F.

    June 4, 2007 at 11:29 am

    Thousands of dead American soldiers and Marines, tens of thousands of wounded troops, Iraq turned into a breeding and staging ground for terrorists, and every bit of America’s prestige thrown away, and the Democrats are “extreme and dangerous”?

    It’s easy to make alternative A look ridiculously, prohibitively expensive when you hand-wave the costs of alternative B.

  12. 12.

    The Other Steve

    June 4, 2007 at 11:32 am

    Thank God, Bush restored Dignity and Honor to the Whitehouse!

  13. 13.

    Wilfred

    June 4, 2007 at 11:55 am

    Yeah, but don’t forget Bush’s ace in the hole: Attack Iran. A nice Fox News cum shot of wogs bursting in air will go a long way to soothing any hurt feelings. It’s an easy political calculus where the number of dead brown people is a function of how many illegal immigrants are let into the country.

  14. 14.

    HyperIon

    June 4, 2007 at 11:55 am

    I found this at WaPo in the comments on Will’s latest column. The problem is the strategy they used to get there. Well, yeah.

    The traditional Republican leadership, and conservatives like Will, have always had a primarily economic agenda: restoring the wealth and power of a tiny economic elite whose priveleges had been eroded by a century of progressive legislation. And they’ve been remarkably successful at this since Reagan, as demonstrated by the widening income inequality in the U.S., and tax rates on the rich at their lowest levels since the Hoover administration.

    The problem is the strategy they used to get there. If your intent is to enrich a tiny minority at the expense of everyone else, how do you get the votes to do it? By targeting a very specific demographic: the monomaniacs who ignore every other issue, as long as the party supports the one they care most deeply about. And this is exactly what the Republicans did. They started with the low-hanging fruit (racists disaffected by Democratic support for civil rights legislation) with Nixon’s “southern strategy.” But the real prize was the religious fundamentalists. Over the last 30 years or so, the Republicans leadership managed to turn the vast majority of religious conservatives into reliable Republican voters, and unfortunately for that leadership, into the party’s most passionate. Especially at the grass-roots level that determines which candidates the party actually runs. Yeats’ line that “The best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity.” comes to mind. The unintended consequence of this (and how conservatives love to crow about the unintended consequences of progressive legislation) is that Republican candidates are increasingly likely to reflect the desires of the social conservatives. They are far more likely to nominate a George Bush than a Theordore Roosevelt. And the control exerted by the social conservatives of the far right (and this control is still increasing), and the likelihood of ending up with yet more Bush-league incompetents as candidates, has scared away the more moderate Republicans who are absolutely necessary for Republican electoral success. And this is what has Will scared to death.

    Every time I find myself about to say that I can’t imagine a more incompetent President than Bush, I have to stop myself — because I can imagine one. And the Republican party, as currently consituted, is very likely to deliver such a president. The fact that Bush’s approval rating is still at 30% (rather than, say, 2%) and that 3 out of the 10 Republican presidential candidates was actually willing to stand in front of national TV cameras and announce that they don’t believe in evolution is all the proof I need of that.

  15. 15.

    Tsulagi

    June 4, 2007 at 12:09 pm

    what really appears to be motivating him is the possibility of a Democratic President in 2008.

    That would be it.

    It’s pathetic to watch these conservatives now whine they’ve been victimized. The ‘deep thinkers’ who after the midterms have now come to the realization that it’s HIS fault.

    Not shared by a Republican controlled Congress that rubberstamped virtually everything a retarded spoiled brat would demand. Not by the ‘fiscal adults’ who over six years put the country well over $2T in debt while engaging in a gold rush mentality to get theirs first when not getting it for their big campaign contributors. Oh, and certainly not by the deep thinkers during six years whose abilities to clap louder while their asses levitated up for Bush and their men in office like DeLay.

    Nope, not that at all. The Pub intellectual warriors were at worst naive innocents. At most their responsibility maxes out at possibly some gullibility in trusting Bush to the extent they did. Their hearts were too pure. Yes, the Sisters of Perpetual Victimhood have decided: it’s Bush’s fault. They man-up like that.

  16. 16.

    Rome Again

    June 4, 2007 at 12:13 pm

    On Earthquakes:

    Hard to tell what causes these things

    Uh… how about the gradual movement of plate tectonics? Just an idea. ;)

  17. 17.

    DougJ

    June 4, 2007 at 12:20 pm

    Uh… how about the gradual movement of plate tectonics? Just an idea. ;)

    True conservatives favor the idea of intelligent shaking. Remember: plate tectonics is just a theory.

  18. 18.

    Bubblegum Tate

    June 4, 2007 at 12:28 pm

    Uh… how about the gradual movement of plate tectonics?

    Plate tectonics? That’s God-hating mumbo-jumbo invented by Darwinists in order to re-murder Jesus! The real cause is Intelligent Ground-shaking.

  19. 19.

    Bubblegum Tate

    June 4, 2007 at 12:32 pm

    Damn, DougJ beat me to it.

  20. 20.

    dslak

    June 4, 2007 at 12:36 pm

    This kind of “We were victims, too!” mindset recently came to the fore in Germany as part of what’s called the Historikerstreit. Essentially, the conservatives argued that the Germans were also victims of the Nazis and so ought not to be stigmatized for letting them come to power.

    In the end, the liberals won the PR battle, and the conservatives came off looking like asses. If our country is as sane as modern Germany, the results should be the same.

  21. 21.

    Rome Again

    June 4, 2007 at 12:44 pm

    In the end, the liberals won the PR battle, and the conservatives came off looking like asses. If our country is as sane as modern Germany, the results should be the same.

    Does that include the events sandwiched in between? I really don’t want my country to go there.

  22. 22.

    The Commissar

    June 4, 2007 at 12:51 pm

    John,

    I’m reminded of the motorist who complains that there are two kinds of drivers out there: maniacs who drive faster than him, and morons who drive slower.

    That’s how I look at the “Bush is an Idiot Awakening.”

    There are two kinds of commentators out there: Moonbats who realized this sooner than I did, and Wingnuts who are slower to catch on.

    And that makes you a Moonbat, I guess.

  23. 23.

    dslak

    June 4, 2007 at 12:58 pm

    Does that include the events sandwiched in between? I really don’t want my country to go there.

    Well, I was referring to the debate, not the historical events that led to it. So, no.

  24. 24.

    ThymeZone

    June 4, 2007 at 1:41 pm

    it took me until 2004-2005 to realize the smelly dirty hippies were right all along.

    Peace out, man :)

  25. 25.

    les

    June 4, 2007 at 2:04 pm

    smelly dirty hippies

    A touch of word-smithing. It should be “dirty fuckin’ hippies.” John’s formulation leaves out the best part of hippiedom. As best I can remember. Due to the other best part.

  26. 26.

    Rome Again

    June 4, 2007 at 2:10 pm

    Well, it’s my impression that TZ smells quite nice, actually… and I smell just fine, but, really, it’s okay if I’m not the finest smelling thing in Blogostan, since, I’m an Independent! ;)

  27. 27.

    Andrew

    June 4, 2007 at 2:31 pm

    Maybe we can douse the RNC with a huge flood patchouli. Just for ironic fun.

  28. 28.

    Geoff

    June 4, 2007 at 2:31 pm

    This is sort of besides the point, John. The reason it took until 26% for Mark to jump ship is because he’s a PART of that percentage.

    Look at the issues the Levin breaks on: immigration (where he assails “amnesty”) and global warming (where he thinks the President’s toothless proposal isn’t toothless enough). Levin is part of that tiny portion of the electorate that thinks the biggest problem with the Bush presidency is that it’s too liberal. The people who decided that it was generally incompetent, hyperpoliticized, and policy-bankrupt left the party way back in the 40%’s and 50%’s.

  29. 29.

    Richard Bottoms

    June 4, 2007 at 2:31 pm

    It must given John some satisfaction to see the ‘Oh My God’ moment happening to the Kool-Aide kids.

    I’ll give him props for coming Jesus long enough ago for it to be real. As for these other fuckers, still more of the same ‘but the Democrats would surely be worse’ horseshit.

    Me, I am still quite happily saying we fucking told you so.

    November 2008 will be such an enormous ass-kicking sufficient almost for it to be worth this mess we are in.

  30. 30.

    Rome Again

    June 4, 2007 at 2:39 pm

    Maybe we can douse the RNC with a huge flood patchouli. Just for ironic fun.

    I say we nix the patchouli and go with passionfruit instad, more appropriate.

  31. 31.

    Dreggas

    June 4, 2007 at 2:42 pm

    I ain’t no dirty fucking hippy.

    But I agree with them…from a distance…oh and upwind.

  32. 32.

    semper fubar

    June 4, 2007 at 2:42 pm

    The insane thing is they STILL think a democratic presidency would be worse than what we have now. Let’s see — a war with a newly announced 50-year timeline, spiralling deficits, an American city destroyed and never re-built, a justice department acting like Luca Brasi, food, gas, health care and education prices going up up up, the Constitution shredded…. yeah, I can see how having Hillary in the WH would be a disaster compared to this state of nirvana we’re living in now.

  33. 33.

    Rome Again

    June 4, 2007 at 2:46 pm

    The insane thing is they STILL think a democratic presidency would be worse than what we have now. Let’s see—a war with a newly announced 50-year timeline, spiralling deficits, an American city destroyed and never re-built, a justice department acting like Luca Brasi, food, gas, health care and education prices going up up up, the Constitution shredded…. yeah, I can see how having Hillary in the WH would be a disaster compared to this state of nirvana we’re living in now.

    Absolutely amazing isn’t it? I wonder what their children will say? Oh, that’s right, their children are all going to be raptured off the earth and leave us here to suffer the harshest global warming consquences alone. Hehe, NOT!

  34. 34.

    grumpy realist

    June 4, 2007 at 3:42 pm

    Don’t we have 40% of Americans they believe Jeebus is gonna return “during their lifetimes”?

    When you have that, there’s not much left you can do to keep your empire from decaying into irrelevance–both political and economical. Clap your hands and pray to the Great Sky Fairy; we don’t have to plan for anything in the future.

    I’m starting to believe there’s a close link between percentage of religious nuts in a country and that country’s quick decline into historical irrelevance.

  35. 35.

    Dreggas

    June 4, 2007 at 3:49 pm

    Rome Again

    Absolutely amazing isn’t it? I wonder what their children will say? Oh, that’s right, their children are all going to be raptured off the earth and leave us here to suffer the harshest global warming consquences alone. Hehe, NOT!

    Their children won’t say much, after all most are probably in a persistant vegetative state which is why so many of them sympathize with Terry Schiavo…

  36. 36.

    Chuck Butcher

    June 4, 2007 at 3:52 pm

    It might pay the Left to notice that the biggest losers in this illegal immigration mess and the amnesty are the American workers. I give a rat’s patoot if they’re brown, white, or purple martians, creating a labor glut is flat out plutocratic agenda. So while you whine racism you indulge yourselves in classism, screw them workers – shoulda gone to kollyge.

  37. 37.

    Chuck Butcher

    June 4, 2007 at 3:52 pm

    It might pay the Left to notice that the biggest losers in this illegal immigration mess and the amnesty are the American workers. I give a rat’s patoot if they’re brown, white, or purple martians, creating a labor glut is flat out plutocratic agenda. So while you whine racism you indulge yourselves in classism, screw them workers – shoulda gone to kollyge.

  38. 38.

    Dreggas

    June 4, 2007 at 4:01 pm

    Chuck Butcher Says:

    It might pay the Left to notice that the biggest losers in this illegal immigration mess and the amnesty are the American workers. I give a rat’s patoot if they’re brown, white, or purple martians, creating a labor glut is flat out plutocratic agenda. So while you whine racism you indulge yourselves in classism, screw them workers – shoulda gone to kollyge.

    And the right hasn’t been screwing the working class these past oh…12 or so years? Quite frankly I couldn’t give a rats ass about immigration. We’ve survived it before and we’ll survive it again. The ones who’ve really been screwing the “American Worker” over are the ones outsourcing their jobs to other countries, the ones who hire the illegal immigrants to work in their factories and, not trivially either, the American worker who wants those low low every day prices so they shop at Wal-Mart which gets a lot of their products from China. Let’s not even go into the layoffs in the auto industry caused because no one wants to buy an SUV anymore because of the fact that gas costs a small fortune but it wasn’t long ago that Americans demanded their SUV’s.

    There’s plenty of blame to go around as to who most hurts the “American Worker” and the whole idea that 12 million people are going to tank this country just doesn’t fly.

  39. 39.

    ThymeZone

    June 4, 2007 at 4:02 pm

    creating a labor glut is flat out

    A glut of cheap labor is a boon to the middle class, for crissakes. Can you say “Wal-Mart?” Can you say $7 cotton tee shirts and $49 microwave ovens?

    Get a clue, man. Cheap labor handles the commoditized tasks, because expensive labor — that’s you and me, amigo — will not do so. That’s why you can live so cheap and so well in this country.

    There is nothing better for your pocketbook that cheap labor. Except maybe the removal of the Republican government that has sold you out to the corporate interests.

  40. 40.

    ThymeZone

    June 4, 2007 at 4:15 pm

    Why are Americans fo frigging dense about the ecconomic realities of the world they live in?

    Here’s an exercise for you, Butcher-spoof:

    Go to Google. Type in “Nogales, AZ” and hit enter.

    First result you see is the Google map.

    Click on it and drill down.

    Keep going until you get to about 4 index marks shy of the full drilldown. Notice that the Mexico side of the border is blank on the map.

    Now switch to the “satellite” view.

    What do you see? Look south of the border. That’s Mexico. That’s Nogales, Sonora, Mexico.

    Notice anything different about the Mexican city as compared to the American one? IT IS HUGE AND COVERED WITH FACTORIES AND WAREHOUSES. That is your “glut of cheap labor” at work.

    Now go back to the center of the map you started with, and look at Highway 19, the divided expressway leading up from the main border crossing, west of Nogales AZ and up to Tucson.

    Now go a little further to your left, to the West.

    Another huge highway! Parallel to Highway 19.

    Notice anything? All big trucks. Those are the trucks bringing the goods in from Mexico. The cheap goods that keep your prices down.

    Please get a grip on reality. Mexico is already a deeply embedded part of the American economy. It keeps your cost of living low.

  41. 41.

    ATS

    June 4, 2007 at 4:36 pm

    Mark Levin hung on, like so many necons did, because GW kissed Israel’s ring. For many of them, that is the only issue that matters. As with right to lifers, NRA zealots, and other one-track looney tunes, the interests of the United State are ancillary.

    With neolibs like Nat Hentoff it is much the same.

  42. 42.

    Andrew

    June 4, 2007 at 4:37 pm

    Please get a grip on reality. Mexico is already a deeply embedded part of the American economy. It keeps your cost of living low.

    Dennis Kucinich hates you.

  43. 43.

    ThymeZone

    June 4, 2007 at 4:39 pm

    Dennis Kucinich hates you.

    Why? I said his wife was hot.

  44. 44.

    Zombie Santa Claus

    June 4, 2007 at 4:43 pm

    Why? I said his wife was hot.

    He’s probably a jealous husband.

  45. 45.

    Jake

    June 4, 2007 at 4:52 pm

    I’m starting to believe there’s a close link between percentage of religious nuts in a country and that country’s quick decline into historical irrelevance.

    I think history will bear you out. However, historical irrelevance is the nicest thing that happens. Before that, people get pissed off and throw things. Fortunately most Americans are protected from falling in with the nuts by a thick layer of hedonistic librul ooze.

  46. 46.

    Dreggas

    June 4, 2007 at 4:56 pm

    Jake Says:

    I think history will bear you out. However, historical irrelevance is the nicest thing that happens. Before that, people get pissed off and throw things. Fortunately most Americans are protected from falling in with the nuts by a thick layer of hedonistic librul ooze.

    You mean KY, the jelly not the state?

  47. 47.

    ThymeZone

    June 4, 2007 at 5:05 pm

    You mean KY, the jelly not the state?

    Succor! Once again I have spit my coffee on a perfectly good keyboard.

  48. 48.

    Rome Again

    June 4, 2007 at 5:15 pm

    Succor! Once again I have spit my coffee on a perfectly good keyboard.

    All three ounces, eh? ;)

  49. 49.

    Krista

    June 4, 2007 at 5:28 pm

    I’m starting to believe there’s a close link between percentage of religious nuts in a country and that country’s quick decline into historical irrelevance.

    I think you’re right. On one hand, you’ve got a frighteningly large number of religious nuts. On the other hand, you’ve a culture where fine arts and good music receive not even 2% of the airtime and print space given to Lindsay Lohan’s latest drunken escapade.

    I fear the end is nigh…

  50. 50.

    Dreggas

    June 4, 2007 at 5:30 pm

    ThymeZone Says:

    Succor! Once again I have spit my coffee on a perfectly good keyboard.

    *bows*

  51. 51.

    Dreggas

    June 4, 2007 at 5:45 pm

    ThymeZone Says:

    Succor! Once again I have spit my coffee on a perfectly good keyboard.

    It’s a logical conclusion, after all KY is advertising a new massage oil that also doubles as a personal lubricant. Perhaps we should invest in some and proclaim ourselves annointed by this new an holy oil which protects us from the believers who drink the heathen kool-aid?

  52. 52.

    Rome Again

    June 4, 2007 at 6:14 pm

    It’s a logical conclusion, after all KY is advertising a new massage oil that also doubles as a personal lubricant. Perhaps we should invest in some and proclaim ourselves annointed by this new an holy oil which protects us from the believers who drink the heathen kool-aid?

    Oh, can’t we just sip tea instead? I would like to leave my sex life ideologically virginal, please. Otherwise, I may end up with some kind of hang up and stop climaxing altogether.

  53. 53.

    Rome Again

    June 4, 2007 at 6:16 pm

    Oh, can’t we just sip tea instead? I would like to leave my sex life ideologically virginal, please. Otherwise, I may end up with some kind of hang up and stop climaxing altogether.

    And if I happen to notice any performance issues in the near future, I’m blaming YOU Dreggas! Oh God, lQQk what you’ve gone and done.

  54. 54.

    BrianM

    June 4, 2007 at 6:36 pm

    I’m starting to believe there’s a close link between percentage of religious nuts in a country and that country’s quick decline into historical irrelevance.

    That’s one of the three arguments in American Theocracy. (The other two are dependence on a superseded energy source – wind for the Dutch, coal for Britain – and a shift of the economy from manufacturing to finance, especially debt-driven finance.) On the bright side, life’s not so bad after the decline from empire, so long as the replacement empire is benign. It’s not so bad being Dutch. The decline itself can be unpleasant.

  55. 55.

    ThymeZone

    June 4, 2007 at 6:47 pm

    KY is advertising a new massage oil that also doubles as a personal lubricant.

    You know, I want to get behind it. So to speak.

    But really, if they’d come out with a product that can also be burned for fuel in my car, then we would really be getting somewhere. Literally, getting somewhere.

  56. 56.

    ThymeZone

    June 4, 2007 at 6:48 pm

    I may end up with some kind of hang up and stop climaxing altogether.

    Oh, come, come.

  57. 57.

    Rome Again

    June 4, 2007 at 7:23 pm

    Oh, come, come.

    Where are we going? Sorry, I don’t think I can, Dreggas has ruined it for me.

  58. 58.

    Rome Again

    June 4, 2007 at 7:31 pm

    and a shift of the economy from manufacturing to finance, especially debt-driven finance

    Aren’t we already on that road? Of course, we’re just borrowing more and more and giving it back with interest to usurious corporations. There are few winners in that game. I think the US is turning into an upside down pyramid scheme.

  59. 59.

    Dreggas

    June 4, 2007 at 7:57 pm

    Rome Again Says:

    Where are we going? Sorry, I don’t think I can, Dreggas has ruined it for me.

    *coughs*bull shit*coughs*

  60. 60.

    Rome Again

    June 4, 2007 at 8:26 pm

    *coughs* bull shit *coughs*

    Don’t drop the Baal now Dreggas, you started this!

  61. 61.

    Andrew

    June 4, 2007 at 9:04 pm

    Don’t drop the Baal now Dreggas, you started this!

    Is that Ba`al Zebûb, Ba`al of Carthage, or a rabbi Ba`al as in medieval Judaism?

    What, exactly, are you saying about Dreggas?

  62. 62.

    jake

    June 4, 2007 at 9:12 pm

    Perhaps we should invest in some and proclaim ourselves annointed by this new an holy oil which protects us from the believers who drink the heathen kool-aid?

    Amen! It should be easy to replace marriage with the new sacrament since liberals (luberals?) never bother with such things. Unless they’re gay. And then they just do it to destroy marriage.

    But in the interests of tradition I think we should keep the name of the new holy oil as close to the current name as possible. Maybe something that rhymes…

  63. 63.

    Rome Again

    June 4, 2007 at 9:13 pm

    Ba’al the enemy of the bible God.

  64. 64.

    Andrew

    June 4, 2007 at 9:42 pm

    I can has froggy crown?

  65. 65.

    Dreggas

    June 4, 2007 at 10:53 pm

    Rome Again Says:

    Ba’al the enemy of the bible God.

    You say it like it’s a bad thing…really I’ve just been given a bad rap.

  66. 66.

    Chuck Butcher

    June 5, 2007 at 3:04 am

    Be careful you don’t get any calluses while typing and calling me a -spoof. 30% of my industry, construction, employees are illegal. I hire legal, I pay the best wages I can in the face of declining $/sq ft and I know exactly where the give is in contracting prices, it’s labor you spoof. Oh yeah, low wages are just goddam great, while these guys get ready to slip off the edge they teeter on Walmart is a wonderful benefit. The actual beneficiaries of the out-source/in-source policies are the plutocrats, if you think I’m somewhere on the right, you’re an ass. Being on the side of the worker does not make me a right wing rascist xenophobe, but backing BushCo on this one makes you a tool of the wealthy elite. That is particularly ignorant. For god’s sake, if George II is for it what makes you think it’s any good?

    Mexico is a damn mess because of the Mexican government, it is corrupt, xenophobic, racist, and statist so we should be the solution to their dissatisfied populous, if they stayed there maybe they’d revolt and fix it, not with us – US – as an out. While you’re admiring your maps, maybe you ought to run some that show climate, resources, and geography, the place ought to be real nice – it ain’t.

  67. 67.

    Chuck Butcher

    June 5, 2007 at 3:08 am

    Cross outs are nice, I only wonder where they came from

  68. 68.

    Zombie Santa Claus

    June 5, 2007 at 6:23 am

    Mexico is a damn mess because of the Mexican government, it is corrupt, xenophobic, racist, and statist so we should be the solution to their dissatisfied populous, if they stayed there maybe they’d revolt and fix it, not with us – US – as an out. While you’re admiring your maps, maybe you ought to run some that show climate, resources, and geography, the place ought to be real nice – it ain’t.

    We should conquer them now, conquer them now while they’re weak and we still have the muscle to do it. Then, we’ll absorb them into the US, first splitting them up into 2 or 3 states so that they don’t overwhelm the Electoral College. Then we’ll get our manufacturing back, solve our border problem, and have a shorter frontier to build our fence along (the Yucatan) if those pesky Guatemalans ever start stealing our jobs.

    Ho ho ho, bitches!

  69. 69.

    Andrew

    June 5, 2007 at 9:24 am

    It will just be easier to go all of the way to the panama canal, because then we won’t need a fence, just sharks with lasers.

  70. 70.

    ThymeZone

    June 5, 2007 at 10:01 am

    Yes, Mr Butcher, I see how you roll. Shown a map with information you can use, you refer to the exercise as “admiring” the map. Dismissive and condescending.

    The map teaches you. And a trip to Wal Mart teaches you. Your cost of living is tied directly to the “glut of cheap labor” you decry above.

    Decry it all you want, it works for you, it’s a permanent part of the economic system you live in, and it ain’t goin away.

    If you actually want to talk about that reality, send a signal. America is not going to “get back our manufacturing” unless we can compete with cheap labor. In this world, labor flows like capital, wherever it is needed. You can’t dam it up any more. Get used to it.

  71. 71.

    Sam Hutcheson

    June 5, 2007 at 10:32 am

    I have to quibble a little bit here. Although he leaves it til the end, the “amnesty” issue is huge for these nuts.

    I agree with DougJ.

    Did I really just type that?

    Oh well. So be it. If you’re looking for a barometer for these people’s moral standing just reflect on the fact that endorsing torture, repealing habeas corpus and instituting spying procedures on citizens didn’t move them to question Dear Leader. No, what gives them pause and worry is the idea that Mexican laborers might gain some status as real people and that the administration might actually opt for science over superstition. What bothers Mark Levin isn’t the war in Iraq, isn’t torture, isn’t extraordinary rendition or suspension of basic civil rights into perpetuity or a theory of executive power that claims the right to disappear anyone for any reason the president deems worthwhile. No, what bothers Mark Levin is “amnesty” and “reactionary” policies around global warming.

    Batshit insane. Still.

  72. 72.

    jg

    June 5, 2007 at 10:33 am

    You can’t say the tactic doesn’t work. Some of my more rabid Bush loving friends are also starting to turn against Bush. While also declaring themselves to be strong conservatives.

  73. 73.

    BrianM

    June 5, 2007 at 12:06 pm

    and a shift of the economy from manufacturing to finance, especially debt-driven finance

    Aren’t we already on that road? Of course, we’re just borrowing more and more and giving it back with interest to usurious corporations. There are few winners in that game. I think the US is turning into an upside down pyramid scheme.

    Being doggedly serious: Yes, that’s one of the three claims in the book.

  74. 74.

    Rome Again

    June 5, 2007 at 12:09 pm

    Cross outs are nice, I only wonder where they came from

    The fate of the gods?

  75. 75.

    Rome Again

    June 5, 2007 at 12:40 pm

    Yes, that’s one of the three claims in the book.

    BrianM, did he actually take it through the process and show what happens at the end of that? The corporate windfall and the rest of us screwed?

  76. 76.

    TDaulnay

    June 5, 2007 at 6:08 pm

    I’ll start taking these ‘conservative’ changes of heart seriously when they start working to 1) rescind the Military Commissions act, 2) condemn and end the signing statements abuses, 3) condemn and end torture and indefinite imprisonment, and 4) end unfettered governmental spying on our citizens. Until then, they are hardly conservatives, nor are they really Americans as I was raised to understand the term (in Gerry Ford country).

  77. 77.

    Chuck Butcher

    June 5, 2007 at 6:16 pm

    TZ, I can read a map. I’ve watched in horror for the last 2 administrations as they just shrugged off what they are doing to our country and those who work with their hands.

    I don’t have to get used to it and cheap labor doesn’t do a thing for me. Fuck You is the plutocrats response, nice to see you echoing it. We can follow your shoulder shrug for a few more years, things will get a little tougher down on the lower rungs and it will start to sting in the middle, but at some point the wheels come off. The national debt is already insane, the trade deficits are already insane, and the condition of the bottom 30% of earners can’t get much worse without things going bad.

    The statistical trends are disasterous if they’re followed. Immigration isn’t the biggest problem by any means, but it has a huge and direct effect on lower blue collar income. The labor rates in my industry are now below poverty. Those cheap wages you tout are one of the driving forces for all the poverty services the government provides and somebody pays that bill – sooner or later.

    BTW, re-read your post regarding the person who is dismissive. Spoof yourself, TZ. I mentioned the Left ought to take a look, the Right couldn’t be bothered. You take umbrage and tell me – so what? Fuck your so what. Things got this way and will stay this way because of “so what.” I’m not Darrell, and you may bite off more than you can chew. I don’t say, “so what” not ever, and I don’t do, “so what” not ever. I’ve already spent the time, energy, and money – mine and others – to make a Congressional run, I work like a dog to make a living and then I turn around and do Democratic work. But then, some of us can at least work up to snarky comments.

  78. 78.

    Ydef

    June 13, 2007 at 4:36 am

    While I love seeing all this unbridled optimism from the left (yeah, it’s about fuqn time the rest of the country recoils at the message of the burning shrub) I can’t help but still be too profoundly concerned about the possibility of the whitehouse being hijacked by forces on the right next year to be able to write-off as a forgone conclusion a democratic presidency as many of you here so easily do.

    Why?

    There still are so many unsettling issues brandishing huge red flags to be very worried about. Consider that despite bush sinking to unprecedented levels of depravity never experienced before by a modern president you still have Guiliani beating Clinton in polls by at least 5%. Any democrat should be ANNIHILATING considering the way things are for the conservative party right now. It also reveals how effective the right wing spin machine still is even now in influencing people that Hillary is an unelectable figure . Of course it’s something she can overcome, but it gives you an idea of the forces she’s up against and the fact that if there’s one candidate that social conservatives will still turn out in droves to support Guiliani, it’s a Clinton ticket. There still exists the very effective Faux News fountain of misinformation that serves as the central spoke of the axis of the pathetically complicit and sheeplike American MSM. And perhaps most frightening to me is that the highly secretive, proprietary voting machine infrastructure manufactured by the same right leaning, crypto-fascist organizations that delivered the questionable shenanigans of 2002 and 2004 are not only still intact but multiplying with as little oversight as ever. It would be a huge mistake to become complacent over the 2006 results since the manufacturers remain staunchly on the right with little to no oversight. In fact they are even complemented with a justice department and voting division of the civil rights department, two bodies with traditional roles of ensuring free and fair elections that are now packed with loyal republican stooges willing to take any means necessary to maintain their party’s hold of the executive branch. With as much outright corruption that’s occurred the past six years without having to be held to account it’s hard to see how any sensible democrat can be that satisfied at the demise of GWB enough to say that there’s no way a republican will be elected in ’08.

Comments are closed.

Trackbacks

  1. Predicting the Pundits: ESP or Psychology? » The Adventures of Tobasco da Gama says:
    June 4, 2007 at 2:55 pm

    […] Update: I like what John Cole of Balloon Juice has to say about the phenomenon. It’s shorter and punchier than Greenwald’s article, as well, if you’re into that sort of thing. […]

  2. More Conservatives Break With Bush « Michael P.F. van der Galiën says:
    June 4, 2007 at 3:17 pm

    […] John Cole comments: “A real profile in courage- waiting until Bush is at 26% with a few months left in his election to call him out. Bravo, Mark.” […]

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