The Oversight Committee has learned that over the objections of the National Archives, Vice President Cheney exempted his office from the presidential order that establishes government-wide procedures for safeguarding classified national security information. The Vice President asserts that his office is not an “entity within the executive branch.”
As described in a letter from Chairman Waxman to the Vice President, the National Archives protested the Vice President’s position in letters written in June 2006 and August 2006. When these letters were ignored, the National Archives wrote to Attorney General Alberto Gonzales in January 2007 to seek a resolution of the impasse. The Vice President’s staff responded by seeking to abolish the agency within the Archives that is responsible for implementing the President’s executive order.
Not to go all Michael Moore on you, but there is a point when simply trying these people and convicting them will not be enough to restore confidence in our system. Public executions might.
And before the howls of outburst start, I want to know what the Michelle Malkins, Rush Limbaughs, Dan Riehl’s, Hugh Hewitt’s and Red State foks might have said if this had been Vice Preisdent Gore who had extended his middle finger to the rule of law the way Dick Cheney has in this case. At some point, this administration ceased to be a political entity and morphed into the Gambino crime family. But really- they are just doing this to protect us all.
Cheney above the law? Go figure…
Impeachment just may not be enough. What did it take to push France to the point of the guillotine? ;)
As the right is so fond of saying, if you have done nothing wrong then you have nothing to hide.
Methinks he hath something to hide, Milord…
Addington has been working on this for awhile. If I were the next president, the first think I’d do is declare Addington and Yoo enemy combatants and lock them up. And then make them spend 4 years getting the Supreme Court.
Either they’re right about the Unitary Executive, and they can be locked up, or the Supremes will set them free and prove their “theories” wrong.
Oh, and if VPOTUS is a “Fourth Branch” (really!), Congress should remove his SS protection and stop paying him.
How about we line the Michelle Malkins, Rush Limbaughs, Dan Riehl’s, Hugh Hewitt’s and Red State folks up against the wall as well?
What a complete fucking idiot the host of this site has become. He doesn’t have the memory of a little baby newt; Al Gore made all sorts of claims about rules/laws/regulations that didn’t apply to him…e.g., soliciting campaign contributions from his White House office telephone.
Sure, till he needs the ol’ ‘Executive privelege to cover his ass again.
Ok, Dug Jay. Gore did that. Big deal. It is a crime what he did but it pales in comparison what Bush & Co. have done for the past 6+ years. The amount of secretive shit this admin has done is staggering.
DD makes a good point. If he’s not a part of the executive, he can’t claim executive privilege for anything, can he now? Additionally, there’s not a mention of this on CNN.com. I don’t expect Fox to cover this (but imagine the detonation if Gore had tried to pull the same stunt), but this is insane. If news can’t inform, why do they even bother? Why not just rename themselves ET/Cnn and just cover missing white women and Paris Hilton full time?
To the extent that they don’t already, I mean.
Who does Cheney think he is?
It may be interesting to see who in this thread condemns Cheney while excusing Berger in the previous.
BTW John, a President’s executive order is not a law. A law comes from Congress and is signed by the President. Civics 101. If President Bush wants to, he can amend the order to exclude himself and Cheney.
Berger was tried and convicted, what’s the problem? What are the odds of Cheney ever going before a judge, much less being convicted of anything?
Out of curiosity, if Bush and Cheney exclude themselves from the executive branch doesn’t that a. remove any claims to executive privilege? and b. who does that leave in the executive branch? Isn’t that like the legislative branch excluding congress and the senate?
The Cheney has ascended beyond the feeble constraints of quaint documents like the Constitution or other bounds. Our glorious war-time Tard has aided him in his journey with divine executive orders like 13292 giving him powers beyond this earth.
One evildoer in the always hate-America press, Byron York of NRO, ended a story on this executive order saying…
Maybe Cheney is relying on this executive order for this action. Funny, now he claims his office is not even an “entity within the executive branch.” Guess he transcended that long ago too. Known truth to The Dick. The Matrix is not powerful enough to constrain the five deferment Dick warrior.
Hey Paul – What Berger did was wrong. He pled guilty and accepted his probably insufficient sentence. I’m going to need a little help understanding how that’s supposed to parallel Cheney claiming to inhabit some extraconstitutional zone where no laws or Executive Orders apply.
I think we ought to congratulate Dick Cheney, actually. He’s become the perfect excuse to end the office of the Vice President altogether.
I mean, for how many years, teh VP has been seen as a useless office where political careers go to die. How many Vice Presidents can you recall during the 19th century (quick, name Grover Cleveland’s without reviewing Wikipedia!). Until the Cold War came along, the Vice Presidency was a political bargaining chip between intra-party factions. It was only during the 50s through the 80s that the need for an established chain of command was needed in case of nuclear disaster.
But now, we have the 25th Amendment that defines a clear succession (before that, the succession rules were muddy). We can have elected officials (Speaker of the House, Senate Pro Tem), and then officials nominated and confirmed by two branches of government (Exec and Lege). Just lop the Veep off that list, and it still works.
The only real reason to have a Veep is to break deadlocks in the Senate, in case of a 50-50 tie. But that can be easily fixed: use a Magic 8-Ball instead. Or have the House Speaker be the deciding tiebreaker.
Seriously, now is the time to get rid of a rather useless and unwarranted office of the Vice President. Our kids will thank us for it.
Nobody wants these guys gone more than I do, but let’s be careful with our language. I don’t want to see you get in trouble with the Secret Service, John.
I think you meant “elocutions.” Where we all talk about how bad they are, and stuff. Right?
How did Vice President Gore get into this? I thought the Bush/Cheney ticket was supposed to restore dignity and honor to the White House after the long national nightmare that was the sordid Clinton administration?
BWHAHA! Penguin just made a funny!
— Badtux the Humor Penguin
Clinton did it too. Remember Socksgate? Only it was worse when Clinton did it, because that’s what caused 9/11.
Even though I’m always behind proxies you didn’t see me touch that. LOL. Some people in my state have been visited by the Secret Service for less.
However, obviously what was meant was public executions as a sentence imposed after open trial by a fully constituted court with the judgment affirmed by the SCOTUS. With that being the situation, others can prayze Jesus while I pass the ammunition.
What does it say about the leadership qualities of a President whose Vice President feels free to ignore him? We’ll never get Cheney to answer questions about his behavior; I’d like to see a reporter put it bluntly to Bush: “Do you think the Vice President should be free to disobey your Executive Orders? Who’s in charge, anyway?” We all know the answer, but I’m not sure Bush thinks about it much.
Yep. Fair trial. Verdict. Rope. Just like Nuremberg.
Won’t happen, but a penguin can dream, eh?
— Badtux the Dreamin’ Penguin
Let’s stop even thinking about impeaching Bush and concentrate on impeaching Cheney instead.
Deploying Jackalope Filter.
I’m opposed to the death penalty. While I don’t doubt that some crimes merit it, I think that standards of proof have to be extraordinarily high to impose it.
That said, I think an unescorted walking tour of Baghdad is precisely the thing that the upper two or three tiers of this government need. Alumni, too — I want Wolfowitz to get a direct impression of his handiwork.
But the parent post is totally correct: These gangsters need the harshest punishments possible. What we call “our democracy” needs it, too, unless we want to see more of the same real soon…..
I’d hesitate to compare them to the Gambino’s. They might take offense at being compared to a bunch of bumbling cretins who squeal Executive Privilege every time someone looks at them funny. Only now it looks like Cheney’s claiming something else. Non-Executive Privilege? My neighbors dog told me to do it? We’re on a misson from God?
It’s almost sad watching these guys go into melt down.
I was waiting for your reaction to this John, saw it this morning and just blew my mind, all I can say is Amen.
The Other Steve
At least the Gambino crime family respected a code of behavior.
They wouldn’t have shot a friend in the face, unless that friend had betrayed the family.
Jesus Dancing Christ! He’s not part of the executive branch? When, when is someone, anyone, going to have the guts to say loudly and publicly that these people are a disgrace to this country and the offices they inhabit? It will take decades to clean out the stench the Bush administration has created. They all need to be held accountable for it!
Maybe Cheney’s hunting buddy was considering a vote for a Democrat?
The defenders of this sort of sewage are getting more frantic, judging from this thread. Dug Jay refers us to Gore’s claim that a loophole in the fund-raising law as it existed allowed him to make fund-raising calls from his office — which is hardly the same thing as claiming that he didn’t have to obey any such law simply because he was Veep. Paul L. points out that “if the President chooses, he can amend [the executive order] to exclude himself and Cheney”, without pointing out the tiny fact that Bush has never done so (which is what the entire brouhaha is about).
The logical thing for the Congressional Dems to do, of course, is simply to pass a bill requiring the Vice President and his staffers to obey executive orders, and then simply wait either for Bush to publicly veto it and make himself look like even more of a fool than he now does, or Cheney to defy it as well and place himself in Impeachment Country. (Of course, the GOP Senators might simply filibuster it, which would confirm my view that filibusters stink to Hell no matter which side is using them, but which could also be used as a campaign issue against them — as it should.)
The Disenfranchised Voter
Ya know, it’s actions like this by the Bush Administration which lead me to believe if Bush and Cheney were ever to refuse to leave office, I wouldn’t be at all surprised.
Exactly. The main thrust of the US Attorney scandal is that the process of cleansing the DOJ of insufficiently loyal foot-soldiers accelerated AFTER the losses of 11/06. They were laying the groundwork for a state-sanctioned suppression and theft of millions of votes.
Now this legalistic but obscure attempt at a coup d’etat has been stopped, I wonder what they are looking for next. There are a lot of very powerful, secretive, and unprincipled people people in government right now who are looking at the prospect of their patrons and themselves ending up with long terms in Federal Prison, or even a life-time visit to The Hague. We need to be looking for the next step, which may well be the raw exercise of paramilitary power.
Suddenly, I like the idea of the bulk of the Blackwater forces being tied up oversees. If the soldiers are left there (hello, pointless surge, anyone?)and all the mercenaries are repatriated in late 2008, everybody needs to look out.
Amen. Not part of the Executive Branch because Cheney’s also “President” of the Senate?! Who knew that the Founders intended the Office of VP to be more powerful than that of the President?
Cheney is an unhinged, malign megalomaniac who seems to think his powers are independent of, and superior to, those of anyone else in the American Government. That the man is allowed to get away with this public repudiation of the rule of law is extremely frightening. It can only happen because Bush is too stupid to see the power grab taking place right under his nose, and too weak to do anything about it.
In a prior lifetime I hated Waxman, Leahy, et al as hopeless, partisan hacks. It’s a measure of how dangerous, and out of control the Bush Administration is that I’m now cheering these Dems from the bleachers as essential guardians of our Government.
Where the hell is the press on this story? I’d love to hear Tony Snow try to explain this one away.
What do you do about Sandy Burglar, who actually admitted he stole and destroyed classified documents, as opposed to Cheney, who has been accused by a Democrat with an agenda of not obeying the rules set by some pinhead bureaucrat for handling classified documents?
Anybody on the right calling for the death penalty for Burglar? Anybody?
I thought not.
For some reason, Republicans always escape from the grandest hypothetical: if, somehow, Al Gore had been President and had managed to be as stupid, callous and oblivious as Bush Jr. and 9/11/2001 had happened the same way…
…does anyone believe that the Republo-freak caucus wouldn’t have been in front of the White House on 9/12/2001 with pitchforks and torches demanding President Gore’s resignation, trial, and possibly lynching on the spot?
Fourth branch of government my ass. They don’t believe that any part of the Constitution restricts them, nor any other law until they’re taken into custody and sent to jail personally, then somehow it all starts to seem so real to the Republicrooks.
I’m still waiting for Cheney to pardon Libby. Being the 4th branch of government and all.
I’m still waiting for Cheney to pardon Libby. Being the 4th branch of government and all.
If the logic is that his role as President of the Senate takes him out of the executive, he has no executive privilege, and is necessarily fully under the jurisdiction of Congress. I wish they could be estopped from denying this theory once they make it.
The only reason I can think of for such a stupid position is that Addington is looking for such a completely novel, idiotic, and unprecedented new legal theory that the courts will have to take over the issue, giving Shooter another few months to doge the issue. Any lawyer taking such an argument to the court is throwing his or her reputation out the window, though. Still, I would not put it beyond Ted Olsen to try it. Once you lie to a few judges and get away with it, it must come easy after a while.
Mr. Cole, perhaps its time to strike a new category. This really isn’t ‘Republican Stupidity’. Seems the ‘Bush Adminstration Criminality’ or ‘Executive Branch Hooliganism’ would be more appropriate.
For a long time I thought talk of impeachment was just a bunch of over-lattered partisanship. (not that I am immune to that).Lately I’ve come to think that impeachment might be a necessary step to saving our republic.
While I agree with Tulkinghorn’s analysis @ 7:39, I think the real delaying-game is being played for the benefit of VP Cheney, and, tangentially his boss (assuming that Shotgun Dick’s
bullshit“novel” interpretation of the Constitution even considers that the dude in the Oval Office IS, in fact, his “boss”).
But if we have seen one consistent thread of behavior from this lawless regime in the past six+ years, it is their never-failing ability to have their house lawyers hoke up some
bullshit“creative” legal opinion to find cover for whatever it is they want to do, and then run out the clock to avoid ever being called on it. Which will probably happen some time in January, 2009; whereupon whatever Congressional Republicans are still around in 1/09 will suddenly rediscover the virtues of legislative oversight. Just in time.
And I’ll also second Digital Amish’s comment as well: impeachment should go “back on the table” if the asshole in the OVP continues to defy the Congress and the Constitution. Who would miss him?
Cheney’s doing this because he can. It takes forever to get anything done in Washington when you do it the right way. So throw a wrench in the gears by making some outrageous, blatantly fraudulant claim, then when someone tries to issue a subpoena let your fellow Republicans fight and bicker and filibuster every motion and every investigation.
The news media can shout “Sandy Berger! Sandy Berger!” until everyone changes the channel or completely loses sight of the issue. And Dick sneaks back into the woods to shoot another day.
yes, but you all forget, al gore made some phone calls.
What Clinton and Gore did has nothing to do with what Cheney is doing… just what is this man hiding?
I concur with PaulW, he makes some very good points. This Vice President wants to abolish The National Archives office just because they asked for said records.
Cheney is a lying scumbag and running out of ways to hide the fact…we told you he was a fascist!
I’m glad someone mentioned “300”. Gives me a chance to repeat Sarah Silverman’s joke that the name comes from how gay it was on a scale of 1 to 10.
The expression “the zeal of a convert” comes to mind.
i tend to think of 300 as anti-american freedom.
the lead character portrayed as a hero mocks the thebians who come to help him.
he mocks the citizan soldier who’s a farmer, or a baker
far as i know, in every major war america has ever faught the heavy lifting has been done by citizen soldiers.
It can’t be just more petty cronyism, I think. He already did a big round of shredding last year, and I doubt there are many more insiders to come out with revelations we have not heard already. Could it really be worse than what we have already learned? The mind boggles at the thought.
Shouldn’t he give up his pad at the Naval Observitory then?
Its getting close to the moment when Cheney declares a suspension of the Constitution and that he will be dictator for life. Seriously, there will be a major terrorist attack secretly supported by the VP near the elections, elections are suspended in the name of national security and the xtains take over. Hitler did it, Cheney can do it too. Limbuagh, Milken et al become ministers in the Cheney Regime and the rest of can all go Fuck Ourselves.
The Other Steve
Do they have medication for Clinton Derangement Syndrome yet?
Someone need to game out the details of Teak111’s conspiracy in order to be ready for it. While I don’t put Cheney above wanting to pull something like this off, how would he get enough people behind him in order to pull off a night of long knives? Another terrorist attack, then blaming Democrats for allowing it, might not fly. I think even the most authoritarian-minded brass is too disenchanted with Bush/Cheney to allow a military-based plot to get very far. Could a group of ex-military mercenaries take over the capitol, and hold it, for very long?
On the topic of secrecy: The CIA is flaunting its “family jewels.” (Their term not mine.)
Now come on. When the spooks are more forthcoming than the Veep there is something seriously amiss in the world.
I’m wondering if there is any dirty laundry related to the son of a former CIA director in there…
If Cheney’s OVP allowed his office to be subject to the information requests up until 2003, doesn’t that mean he admitted his office was an executive entity before it wasnt? Also, all other OVP’s back to the the Carter administration were subject to these information requests and complied. There is no precedence for what Cheney is doing at all. Who the hell does he think he is? What is he hiding?
It seems to me that if someone were both a part of the executive and legislative branches, that wouldn’t nullify the expectations of either one office or the other, but magnify them both instead. His logic is faulty. He needs to be impeached fast, and before the idiot.
Good lord are we still doing the “Sandy Berger!!!” thing?
Do we have to point out yet again that (besides the fact he took copies, which doesn’t excuse, but only ameliorates):
* He admitted he was wrong (unlike many other people)
* He expressed great remorse (again, a difference)
* He was fined $50,000, when the prosecutors *and* defense had jointly proposed $10,000
* He lost his security clearance for 3 years and gave up his law license
* Plus 2 years probation *and* 100 hours community service.
It means a great deal to the judicial system for someone to say “I did it and I’m sorry” — you automatically get a lighter sentence on that. Had he fought the charge he probably would have gotten jail.
He admitted guilt, and was assessed large penalties. He did something stupid and illegal, and that was balanced against the effect of his actions (he didn’t destroy the only copies of the document, but did destroy potentially important notes).
So he was treated fairly by the legal system, and was punished pretty well, I thought.
How is that the same as the Vice President saying the laws don’t apply to him because he thinks the Constitution says he gets a special exemption from just about everything?
I have this theory about VP Cheney having suffered so many hearth problems trough his life.
First of all not enough Oxygen gets to his brain living him with misfiring Neurons and creating hallucinations and confusion. As a result the guy believes that he is a part of the Executive Branch on his good days, but on his bad ones he believes he is a member of the Blues Brothers on a Mission from God and accountable to no man.
Also, after all the suffering that his hearth problems has caused him , as well as having to coupe with “W” on a daily basis, has left him with this thirst for revange, and blood. As a result he wants to torture people, wants to make people pay more at the pump so they can’t feed their kids, wants to poison “W” dog, wants to live us in Iraq for the next 100 years, would like to expand Gitmo, wants to put Rush as a Supreme Court Justice, and goes around shooting Lawyers just for fun.
Now as a member of the Gambino family from Jersey, I can attest first hand that we only bake bread for a living and there is no Mafia any more than there’s an “Executive Branch” ….. OH, and we shoot a hell of a lot better than Mr. Cheney does…. When we go hunting of course.
I’m convinced that while concerned adults (who voted a slight Democratic majority into office) are trying to understand the ramifications of this administration’s unprecedented rearranging of the Constitution, those on the other side of the fence are more like 4th graders acting like it’s recess time:
“But Berger did it first”
“But Al Gore did worse by looking for campaign contributions on his official VP phone”
It’s the fourth graders that are going to bring this nation down to it’s knees because all they understand is childish games. They have no idea how bad this administration bodes for our nation. Thanks a lot children and fuck you very much!
Oh please. Snowjob will just bather on about “democrats are showboating” or “playing politics” or that criticisms of Cheney are “attacking the troops” and the creme de la creme of the Washington press corps will nod sagely and publish it word for word.
I think there would have been a serious attempt to on for a third term by Junior and Cheney had the war worked better, or if there is/was another devastating attack.
I think that was what Addison and Libby and Rove were trying to set out in the “permeant republican majority”… I think it’s a non started, but this is a vestige of it, mainly because these guys never know when to quit.
A guy named “Wolf Pangloss” has to be a spoof, right? I mean just has to be.
Anyone who truly believes that Cheney is offering this “not part of the executive branch” hokum as a good faith argument really needs to check themselves into the nearest mental health facility for a reality check. This is the most outrageous, vacuous nonsense I have ever heard. And Cheney knows it. He just thinks the rest of us are too stupid to realize it.
What’s with these violent solutions to everything? Jeesh. You can take the blogger out of conservatism…
“Out of curiosity, if Bush and Cheney exclude themselves from the executive branch doesn’t that a. remove any claims to executive privilege? and b. who does that leave in the executive branch?”
Actually, I could get behind that.
According to Perino, the answer is, “The Deciderator Says So“:
There you have it folks. Our president is Quick Draw McGraw. “I’ll do the thinkin’ round here and doooon’t yoooou, forget it!”
reply to beej…
it’s not that he thinks we are too stupid to realize it…it’s that he doesn’t care if we notice because at the end of the day there is no accountibility.
if the post series proves anything it’s that while dubya is off cutting brush and riding his mountain bike cheney is running the country (i would say running it into the ground…but that’s a seperate issue) and when the decider has to actually decide…well he can’t say no to dick.
“What a complete fucking idiot the host of this site has become. He doesn’t have the memory of a little baby newt; Al Gore made all sorts of claims about rules/laws/regulations that didn’t apply to him…e.g., soliciting campaign contributions from his White House office telephone.”
What a bunch of moronic asswiping scumbags the Repukeliscum have become. Cheney personally tortures children, and the Repukeliscum like this fuckbag dug jay counter this with fund raising telephone calls.
I hope that you repukeliscum morons get permanent cases of hemmorroids, because the TERMINAL STUPIDITY of your positions has become a TOTAL PAIN IN THE BUTT.
In 2008, you fuckbag Repukeliscum will lose even more seats, and then the fun will begin, as the powers accumulated by Cheney are used to put all you repukeliscum into extraordinary rendition prisons.
DENVER — Initially, the great thing about internet mapping programs was their swiftness and ease for obtaining directions, printing them and driving the course you plotted.
Now those web maps can travel with you, too. And get updated on the road. And, on some wireless handhelds, show you exactly where you are and if, say, an Ethiopian restaurant is anywhere near.
MapQuest, acquired by America Online in 2000, was the first mover and remains tops in internet cartography as it heads toward the 10th anniversary of its website in February.
“As Google is to search, [url=http://www.mapquest.avel.com.ua]MapQuest[/url] has been to mapping and driving directions,” said Greg Sterling of The Kelsey Group, which researches electronic directories and local media.
But a bevy of deep-pocketed competitors threatens. “Google, Yahoo and MSN are certainly on (its) heels,” Sterling said. “[url=http://www.mapquest-today.com]MapQuest[/url] is in danger if (it doesn’t) continue to innovate.”
Of people going to mapping sites, 71 percent visited MapQuest.com in September — about the same percentage as a year ago, according to comScore Media Metrix. Yahoo
drew 32 percent, also about the same as last year, while new arrival Google Inc. had a 25-percent share. (The numbers do not add up to 100 percent because some people visit multiple sites.)