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You are here: Home / Open Threads / Open Thread

Open Thread

by Tim F|  July 25, 200712:15 pm| 64 Comments

This post is in: Open Threads

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Round up all the jackalopes so they don’t spill over into the other threads.

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Previous Post: « Contempt
Next Post: So Why Tell Them? »

Reader Interactions

64Comments

  1. 1.

    Krista

    July 25, 2007 at 12:28 pm

    That’s not fair, Tim. Jackalopes are meant to run free and wild. Corralling them is just plain cruel.

  2. 2.

    zzyzx

    July 25, 2007 at 12:32 pm

    I posted this in another thread but it’s still cracking me up.

    KJL (from National Review Online) on New Orleans

    Depressing News of the Week [Kathryn Jean Lopez]

    It’s not exactly breaking news, but it’s something I’ve learned this week, in response to a Monday rant: There are three Larry Flynt Hustler clubs in New Orleans (I’ll spare you links). New Orleans has a lot of issues. Larry Flynt doesn’t help them.

    Wait? There’s strip clubs in New Orleans? I’m amazed that people haven’t marched down Bourbon Street with pitchforks and torches demanding its removal. Maybe next week she’ll discover that they sell alcohol in New Orleans too. And no, that’s not satire. Her Monday post linked in that was a request that Senator Vitter (of all people) hire Disney to create billboards to hide the existence of strip clubs in New York because, y’know, some parents would appreciate that.

    So New Orleans has a problem. It only has one source of income. National Review’s solution? Destroy that industry!

  3. 3.

    HunterBlackLuna

    July 25, 2007 at 12:38 pm

    zzyzx, I am not proud to say I am absolutely not stunned by that. It’s just become… so… so EXPECTED of these idiots. It’s like proposing such a stupid concept while trying to hide your own side’s hypocracy on the subject, which is far-reaching, is the name of the game for them.

  4. 4.

    Jake

    July 25, 2007 at 12:56 pm

    Her Monday post linked in that was a request that Senator Vitter (of all people) hire Disney to create billboards to hide the existence of strip clubs in New York because, y’know, some parents would appreciate that it would make it easier for him to slip in unnoticed.

    Fixed.

  5. 5.

    Paul L.

    July 25, 2007 at 1:02 pm

    Run free Duke Lacrosse/New York Times bashing Jackalope.
    Changing Standards at the Times

    A college athlete accused of a gang rape (involving a 12-year-old girl of another race). Underage drinking acknowledged by all sides. A university (Oklahoma State) allowing the athlete to play despite the pending charges.

    Surely these developments would arouse the fury of the New York Times, triggering multiple Page One stories and denunciatory columns from the likes of Selena Roberts and Harvey Araton.

    Well, maybe not.

    This time, the athlete under suspicion is African-American; his accuser is white.

    On a related note does anyone not hate Nancy Grace?
    Check out this fark thread. Not one defender.

  6. 6.

    Jack A. Lopez

    July 25, 2007 at 1:19 pm

    Round up all the Jack A. Lopezes?

    Wait just a damned minute!

  7. 7.

    taodon

    July 25, 2007 at 1:34 pm

    We have a nickname for Nancy Grace:

    Bloody Queef.

  8. 8.

    Krista

    July 25, 2007 at 1:49 pm

    That’s gross. (Not that I have any love for Nancy Grace, mind you.)

  9. 9.

    Bubblegum Tate

    July 25, 2007 at 1:50 pm

    On a related note does anyone not hate Nancy Grace?

    I can’t think of a reason not to hate her.

  10. 10.

    ET

    July 25, 2007 at 2:10 pm

    KJL – Strip joints in NOLA ain’t exactly news. I always thought the transvestie strip joint that I had to convince someone to not go in – back in 1988 – was the best. And considering the post-Katrina lack of mental health care (along with the high rate of suicide, increasing alcoholism, and increasing drug use) I think going to strip joints is considered therapy.

    And FYI I prefer Basselopes.

  11. 11.

    Dave

    July 25, 2007 at 2:19 pm

    On a related note does anyone not hate Nancy Grace?

    Nancy Grace herself?

    taodon: yikes!

  12. 12.

    DougJ

    July 25, 2007 at 2:49 pm

    Round up all the jackalopes so they don’t spill over into the other threads.

    This may call for doubling the size of Gitmo.

  13. 13.

    Zifnab

    July 25, 2007 at 2:53 pm

    July 25, 2007 — HEADLINE News anchor Nancy Grace, who’s four months pregnant, broke her foot earlier this month while on vacation.

    You know what’s scary about this article. It implies that someone actually had sex with that harpy. Eghewghew! On so many levels.

  14. 14.

    Andrew

    July 25, 2007 at 2:55 pm

    This may call for doubling the size of Gitmo.

    Maybe we can just put them in dog carriers on top of the car.

  15. 15.

    Dave

    July 25, 2007 at 2:58 pm

    Here’s a site oriented question.

    Why in the blogroll are right and center grouped together and left all on it’s own? More to the point, when did the right claim the center as it’s own?

  16. 16.

    Krista

    July 25, 2007 at 3:04 pm

    HEADLINE News anchor Nancy Grace, who’s four months pregnant

    That poor, poor kid. We should start up a fund for his/her therapy bills now.

  17. 17.

    The Other Steve

    July 25, 2007 at 3:05 pm

    Hunter has a good Bill O’Reilly response

    Why in the blogroll are right and center grouped together and left all on it’s own? More to the point, when did the right claim the center as it’s own?

    John Cole thinks the right is closer to the center than the left. Apparently having 65% of America disapprove of right-leaning government means they’re really centrists and the public is a bunch of moonbats. Or something.

  18. 18.

    Jack A. Lopez

    July 25, 2007 at 3:20 pm

    More to the point, when did the right claim the center as it’s own?

    When they figured out that they could prop up a failed movie actor turned ersatz politician/governor and run him for president. About 28 years ago, actually.

    Their whole political model and coalition strategy is aimed at peeling off votes in the middle by demagoguery. Ergo, abortion, law and order, tax and spend, socialized medicine, war on drugs, family values, gay marriage, flag burning, faith based initiatives, war on terra.

    Welcome to the America that those marketing slogans have given you.

  19. 19.

    ThymeZone

    July 25, 2007 at 3:24 pm

    Hey, who is that Jackalope guy, stealing my material?

  20. 20.

    Cassidy

    July 25, 2007 at 3:49 pm

    http://www.omaha.com/index.php?u_page=2798&u_sid=10085220

    Interesting gem of a story. Of course, we must accomodate everyone, instead of expecting a person to find a job more suited to their lifestyle.

  21. 21.

    Rome Again

    July 25, 2007 at 3:54 pm

    Hey, who is that Jackalope guy, stealing my material?

    Ummm, TZ? I think it’s time for your meds, hon.

  22. 22.

    Rome Again

    July 25, 2007 at 3:58 pm

    Interesting gem of a story. Of course, we must accomodate everyone, instead of expecting a person to find a job more suited to their lifestyle.

    Isn’t it interesting that the so-called “Democrat” who believes in this war brought to us by “The Uniter” is trying to divide us along racial and religious lines, just like his favorite president.

    No thanks, asshole!

  23. 23.

    Krista

    July 25, 2007 at 3:59 pm

    Of course, we must accomodate everyone, instead of expecting a person to find a job more suited to their lifestyle.

    From what I read in the story, it sounds as though those who were praying were trying to find ways in which to make it as minimal a disruption as possible, but the company was having none of it. I also think it’s safe to assume that if these individuals were working shift work on a production line, any other available jobs for which they’d be qualified would not be dissimilar in nature. You’d have the same problem, just at a different company.

  24. 24.

    Cassidy

    July 25, 2007 at 4:08 pm

    shift work on a production line,

    You don’t just get to stop and pray…and hold the whole production line up…when you want to. It’s wrong to demand that a company’s production schedule be held up for domething like this. The union has negotiated break times.

  25. 25.

    Cassidy

    July 25, 2007 at 4:09 pm

    is trying to divide us along racial and religious lines, just like his favorite president.

    You don’t know a lot about Kennedy do you?

  26. 26.

    Jake

    July 25, 2007 at 4:11 pm

    On a related note does anyone not hate Nancy Grace?

    My guess? These folks love Ms. Grace.

  27. 27.

    canuckistani

    July 25, 2007 at 4:13 pm

    You’d think God could cut them some slack while they were working to feed their families.

  28. 28.

    Ryan S.

    July 25, 2007 at 4:25 pm

    You don’t just get to stop and pray…and hold the whole production line up…when you want to. It’s wrong to demand that a company’s production schedule be held up for domething like this. The union has negotiated break times.

    Because some people don’t read their own links.

    Kapitan said Swift rejected her group’s suggestion to allow the Somalis who work evenings to leave in small shifts to avoid disrupting lines. The prayer must be done within a 45-minute window surrounding sunset, according to Muslim prayer rules.

    This is prolly closer to the real reason.

    “For three days it was all good and we were praying — there was no hassle, no interference, nothing at all,” Ali Schire said through an interpreter. Schire, 30, said he was among the 70 who quit and later returned.

    “All of a sudden after three days . . . they were suspending people, they were firing people,” Schire said. “Some of the people even had to give up praying at all for fear of being fired.”

    Mohamed Rage, chairman of the Omaha Somali-American Community Organization, said: “They are treating (the Somalis) like criminals now — anyone who prays is a criminal.”

    Schire said a supervisor took his gloves, uniform and other working equipment as he prayed and threw it in the trash the day he was fired.

  29. 29.

    Jake

    July 25, 2007 at 4:33 pm

    You’d think God could cut them some slack while they were working to feed their families.

    A private institution can (within the law and reason) place a lot more restrictions on its employees than a public institution.

    If the president of my division announces that people who swear will be fired for the first offense … this place would be empty tomorrow, but we wouldn’t have legal recourse under the 1st Am. The employees at the meat packing plant would have to show that people of other religions were allowed to take prayer breaks or something like that. Individuals might have legal complaints for other issues (assault) but the praying alone?

    Nuh-uh.

  30. 30.

    Cassidy

    July 25, 2007 at 4:39 pm

    I read the link and I said what I see. My reaction to the story would be the same if it were Wiccans, or Christians, or any religious group. Freedom to practice your religion does not mean freedom to practice it whenever you feel like it and everyone must accomodate you.

    Rome…you’re projecting again. Why do you hate muslims?

  31. 31.

    Rome Again

    July 25, 2007 at 4:53 pm

    Rome…you’re projecting again. Why do you hate muslims?

    ::acknowledges that she has read Cassidy’s post and isn’t playing::

  32. 32.

    John S.

    July 25, 2007 at 5:14 pm

    I read the link and I said what I see.

    Nobody will argue your keen ability to see things that aren’t really there. I for one thing this whole flap is an unltra-liberal conspiracy who are in fact in league with the ultra-conservatives – heck, they are actually the same people (just with different bumper stickers)!

  33. 33.

    myiq2xu

    July 25, 2007 at 5:39 pm

    Any suggestions on how to cook a jackalope? Baked, fried, or grilled? Red or White wine? Domestic or imported beer?

    On another note, I hear KFC is bringing back the Hillary Clinton special – 2 small breasts, a pair of flabby thighs, and a couple of left wings.

  34. 34.

    The Other Steve

    July 25, 2007 at 5:58 pm

    Interesting gem of a story. Of course, we must accomodate everyone, instead of expecting a person to find a job more suited to their lifestyle.

    Why do you think things close down on sunday?

  35. 35.

    Rome Again

    July 25, 2007 at 6:22 pm

    Why do you think things close down on sunday?

    Certain companies like “Chik-Fil-A” tell you they don’t operate on Sunday, on purpose. I think they mean to pull in the Christian crowd. I’ve never tried their chicken, so I wasn’t missing out when I decided I’d never eat there because of that sentiment.

    And if anyone from that company happens reading this blog? The sabbath is supposed to be on Saturday, dumbasses!

  36. 36.

    myiq2xu

    July 25, 2007 at 6:29 pm

    Black Sabbath or Sabbath Bloody Sabbath? How did Ozzy get in here?

  37. 37.

    Cassidy

    July 25, 2007 at 7:07 pm

    Certain companies like “Chik-Fil-A” tell you they don’t operate on Sunday, on purpose.

    Heaven forbid the owners have a set of principles they stick by…

    It’s their business. They can close if they want. That’s a completely different subject. If a business choses to run itself based on certain beliefs, they have the right to do so. If they choose not to accommodate certain beliefs, they can choose not to as well.

    Makes me wonder if the employees in question were Christian, would you all be so quick to condemn the business.

  38. 38.

    Krista

    July 25, 2007 at 7:26 pm

    Makes me wonder if the employees in question were Christian, would you all be so quick to condemn the business.

    You know, Cassidy, I haven’t joined in with those who have berated you, because I wanted to read enough of your comments to give you a fair chance. But I think I’ve read enough to realize that you really are a bit of a dick.

  39. 39.

    Andrew

    July 25, 2007 at 7:27 pm

    I’ve never tried their chicken, so I wasn’t missing out when I decided I’d never eat there because of that sentiment.

    Consider yourself lucky. It’s the crappiest chicken in the universe, even without the Jesus sauce.

  40. 40.

    HyperIon

    July 25, 2007 at 7:47 pm

    after several days of reading threads polluted by Cassidy, i think it’s time to dig out the “i like pie” script thingy.

    who is the keeper of that sanity-preserving device?

  41. 41.

    rachel

    July 25, 2007 at 7:50 pm

    Swift made a bad decision, IMO. If they’d taken the time to work out an accomodation with the Somalis, they would have gotten the benefit of happier workers–workers who would have been less likely to grumble, malinger, pilfer or quit with 5 minutes warning. “As long as you let me pray — I will always work for you.” Yeah, sure, why not? Now, all the workers Swift have left know for a fact that this company will screw them over in a heartbeat. So why not steal the company toilet paper, or slack on the job or tell company dirt to competitors and/or government inspectors if they can get away with it? Screw them before they screw you is a life philosophy for some.

    And lets not even get into how Swift is going to have to pay their lawyers some fairly stiff money to make this silly little lawsuit go away.

    Oh, the company could have worked out an agreement between the other workers and the Somalis whereby the Somalis did some nasty job the other guys didn’t want to do in exchange for being allowed to pray when they needed to, or maybe for every Somali working at the factory, a non-Muslim doesn’t have to work the night shift or on Sundays. But, no. Working out win-win deals is too much trouble; it’s much better to get sued.

  42. 42.

    rachel

    July 25, 2007 at 8:51 pm

    What? How? What?

    Of all the editorials The New York Sun has run, the one that attracted the most response was the one under the headline “Cheney’s Chance.” The editorial, suggesting that Vice President Cheney would be an attractive presidential candidate who would bring a lot to the race, caused a furor in the blogosphere and led to the production of an entire segment on CNN. It also led to several dinner party conversations of friends or relatives of the editorial writer devoted to whether the writer had finally lost his mind…

    No, really?

    …The book quotes Senator McCain as saying, “Dick doesn’t like campaigning.” Nothing in the Hayes book suggests that Mr. Cheney is about to do it — except for that the vice president spent nearly 30 hours cooperating with the author and apparently gave the okay for many of his friends and colleagues to grant similar access. The Richard Cheney described in this book isn’t vain enough to do that simply for his reputation in history. My own guess — okay, hope — is that Mr. Cheney has taken a look at the Republican presidential field and sees an opening. If Iowa and New Hampshire Republicans start receiving copies of ” Cheney” in their mailboxes, Mr. Cheney’s popularity may yet begin to climb.

    He hopes Cheney will run? Why, so do I. :-D

  43. 43.

    Rome Again

    July 25, 2007 at 9:16 pm

    It’s their business. They can close if they want. That’s a completely different subject. If a business choses to run itself based on certain beliefs, they have the right to do so. If they choose not to accommodate certain beliefs, they can choose not to as well.

    and either way I can choose not not spend my money there too! ;)

  44. 44.

    Rome Again

    July 25, 2007 at 9:18 pm

    and either way I can choose to not spend my money there too!

    Can you tell I went out for beers with a co-worker after work? LOL

  45. 45.

    Rome Again

    July 25, 2007 at 9:19 pm

    He hopes Cheney will run? Why, so do I. :-D

    Yes, Run Cheney, Run!

  46. 46.

    Cassidy

    July 25, 2007 at 9:45 pm

    and either way I can choose not not spend my money there too!

    Absolutely. That’s how the free market works. If you don’t like a company’s policies, take your dollar elsewhere. All I’m saying is don’t begrudge them the right to set their business the way they choose.

    Swift made a bad decision, IMO.

    Maybe. But, as a private business, they get to choose what to do and what not to do. Secondly, as a business that deals with unions, they’ve already made concessions to their workers, so why should they have to make more, outside of that agreement.

  47. 47.

    Punchy

    July 25, 2007 at 11:45 pm

    I can’t think of a reason not to hate her.

    Her DSLs?

  48. 48.

    Punchy

    July 25, 2007 at 11:48 pm

    This may call for doubling the size of Gitmo.

    Nancy Grace’s fat ass causes more problems, I see….

  49. 49.

    rachel

    July 26, 2007 at 2:51 am

    Swift made a bad decision, IMO.

    Maybe. But, as a private business, they get to choose what to do and what not to do.

    I didn’t say they couldn’t; I just said it was a bad idea. And if the case gets to court, a jury and judge may find in favor of the former employees. In which case that will have been a very bad idea.

    Secondly, as a business that deals with unions, they’ve already made concessions to their workers, so why should they have to make more, outside of that agreement.

    Why foster harmony when you can simply compel obedience by your superior position? Because harmony is likely to lead to profits while disharmony will certainly lead to loss. Plus, as I explained earlier, the concessions could have been arranged between groups of laborers rather than between the Muslim laborers and management. There would have been no skin off management’s nose at all in that case.

    No, I don’t think I’ll be buying stock in Swift anytime soon. The kind of wooden-headedness they showed with this decision argues poorly for their future prospects.

  50. 50.

    John S.

    July 26, 2007 at 7:56 am

    The kind of wooden-headedness they showed with this decision argues poorly for their future prospects.

    Plus, their sasuage tastes like rubber. I’m a Jimmy Dean man, myself.

  51. 51.

    Cassidy

    July 26, 2007 at 9:51 am

    And if the case gets to court, a jury and judge may find in favor of the former employees.

    I seriously doubt that. Being that thye already have a union agreement set up, they have a very good position. The only way they’s lose in court, is if the plaintiffs can prove it’s some sort of EO issue.

    Because harmony is likely to lead to profits while disharmony will certainly lead to loss.

    Production leads to profits. Stopping production leads to loss.

    Plus, as I explained earlier, the concessions could have been arranged between groups of laborers rather than between the Muslim laborers and management. There would have been no skin off management’s nose at all in that case.

    Maybe, maybe not. The company still reserves the right to say that they can’t do that. That’s the central issue. These employees and the advocate groups that have jumped to their corner are insinuating that rights have been restricted and taken away.

  52. 52.

    Tim F.

    July 26, 2007 at 9:58 am

    Production leads to profits. Stopping production leads to loss.

    Not always true. When demand is inflexible bottlenecking supply can lead to massive profits. See: energy, petroleum.

  53. 53.

    John S.

    July 26, 2007 at 10:02 am

    Production leads to profits. Stopping production leads to loss.

    Ah, your profile continues to take shape. Clearly you can only view things as polar. There is no gray, there is no color. Hue and saturation are meaningless. Concepts only exist as black or white. And never mind the fact that your constructs often fall wide of the mark.

    That is why you receive so much ridicule around here.

  54. 54.

    Cassidy

    July 26, 2007 at 10:15 am

    Ah, your profile continues to take shape. Clearly you can only view things as polar. There is no gray, there is no color. Hue and saturation are meaningless. Concepts only exist as black or white. And never mind the fact that your constructs often fall wide of the mark.

    Irony…gotta love it.

  55. 55.

    Cassidy

    July 26, 2007 at 10:17 am

    Not always true. When demand is inflexible bottlenecking supply can lead to massive profits. See: energy, petroleum.

    Nothing is ever black and white, but creating policy or basing judgements on exceptions is not good public policy or good judgement. See: Wellfare queens

  56. 56.

    Tim F.

    July 26, 2007 at 10:45 am

    See: Wellfare queens

    Actually, I would like to. The last I heard Reagan’s Cadillac-driving bugbears were a myth. How many have you seen?

  57. 57.

    Tim F.

    July 26, 2007 at 10:47 am

    Or maybe you were saying that the “welfare queen” myth drove bad policy. It seems out of character for you to be a fan of welfare, but stranger things have happened.

  58. 58.

    Cassidy

    July 26, 2007 at 10:47 am

    That’s the point. They’re a myth, or an exception at best. But that didn’t stop the drumbeat for welfare reform in that sector of the population.

  59. 59.

    Cassidy

    July 26, 2007 at 11:01 am

    I ama fan of welfare as aprt of a social safety net to help those who have a run of misfortune. Life happens and I think any civilized society should be willing to sacrifice for it’s fellow countrymen. But I also think welfare should have an end-state, with a goal of moving the recipient to a self-reliant status. Right now, I believe the system is too open ended, not so much calling for abuse as it is fairly well regulated, but not in pushing our fellow citizens to be pro-active in improving their own lives.

  60. 60.

    John S.

    July 26, 2007 at 12:26 pm

    Irony…gotta love it.

    I don’t think that word means what you think it does.

  61. 61.

    John S.

    July 26, 2007 at 12:29 pm

    I ama fan of welfare as aprt of a social safety net to help those who have a run of misfortune.

    I don’t buy it. You clearly indicated on another thread that you subscribe to the FYIGM school of thought. Remember when you mocked Jefferson’s view of using a tiered tax system as a means of redistributing wealth to ‘promote the general welfare’?

  62. 62.

    John S.

    July 26, 2007 at 12:32 pm

    Nothing is ever black and white

    Now that’s real irony.

    Making an absolute statement that there are no absolutes? Priceless. (I thought I’d spell it out since we’ve established you don’t understand the concept of irony.)

  63. 63.

    Cassidy

    July 26, 2007 at 12:42 pm

    You clearly indicated on another thread that you subscribe to the FYIGM school of thought.

    No, I subscribe to the school of personal responsibility. Some people have misfortune. Other’s make bad decisions. For the latter group, it’s their fault. But by passing the buck to the state or them “ebil, rich people”, they are denied the oppurtunity to learn from those mistakes and not make them again.

    ‘promote the general welfare’

    I’m sorry, but stealing someone else’s money because they earned more than you is not promoting the general welfare.

  64. 64.

    John S.

    July 26, 2007 at 3:49 pm

    Some people have misfortune. Other’s make bad decisions.

    Wow, that’s some first class smugness. No doubt, you think you posess the magic 8-ball that allows you to divine the difference between on person’s misfortune and another’s bad decision.

    I’m sorry, but stealing someone else’s money because they earned more than you is not promoting the general welfare.

    That’s an interesting theory on taxation. A bit puerile, but interesting nonetheless.

    Like I said, you are a dyed in the wool follower of FYIGM – also known these days as ‘libertarian’. Your latest screed only confirms it.

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