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You are here: Home / Foreign Affairs / Chuck Hagel Hates America

Chuck Hagel Hates America

by John Cole|  November 29, 20076:54 pm| 29 Comments

This post is in: Foreign Affairs, Politics

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If you haven’t read it already, you can read Chuck Hagel’s remarks to the CFR here. Most of you are familiar with this tidbit:

I’ll give you my personal opinion. I know I’m not known for that, but — (laughter) — that’s why I’m so highly regarded at the White House. History will make that determination, as you know, Bob, more than almost anyone. And I’ll leave that to history as to its determination. As to my personal opinion, which I have not been shy about sharing, I think as most of you know in speeches or interviews, this administration in my opinion has been as unprepared as any administration I’m aware of, not only the ones that I have been somehow connected to and that’s been every administration — either I’ve been in Washington or worked within an administration or Congress or some way dealing with them since the first Nixon administration. I would rate this one the lowest in capacity, in capability, in policy, in consensus — almost every area, I would give it the lowest grade.

However, that is just a small portion of the talk, and in response to adirect question. The rest of the talk is less exciting, but still worth your time. This portion regarding the surge is particularly relevant:

But to get back on the focus of your question, it seems to me, Richard, that as we look at Iraq, we are in a situation where we have today, almost at the end of our fifth year, more troops in Iraq today than we’ve ever had. We’ve had more American casualties in Iraq this year than we’ve ever had. We have more American troops in Afghanistan than we’ve ever had. We’re at the peak of both, in our fifth and sixth years, and we’re getting ready for our sixth and seventh years.

Now, what does that mean? What can we do to go forward? Well, I asked the question of General Petraeus and Ambassador Crocker at hearings in September regarding the surge — “Give us more time” — and I said, “More time for what? What is the purpose here?”

It’s not a military tactical victory. I mean, we had most every military tactical victory in Vietnam, with the United States winning every tactical victory. We’re winning every tactical victory in Iraq. But the point is to buy time toward some resolution, some political dynamic that can set in motion enough of the requirements for the Iraqi people to govern themselves, defend themselves, support themselves, and bring some stability to a society to let them start working it through. That supposedly is the objective.

Well, yes, our casualties are down. Yes, we’ve seen progress. But what’s disconnected from that is where we go from here. You asked about General Lutz’ point. I’m not sure that we’re in a position ready to sign any kind of an agreement with Iraq. For example, there’s no oil law. There’s no de-Ba’athification law.

All the laws that we put at the front end on benchmarks — and, by the way, those days are over when people say, at least in my opinion, some of my colleagues in the Congress, “Well, let’s set up a new set of benchmarks.” No, we’ve passed the benchmark point. We’re in a whole different zone here.

And if we don’t see some progress — and even General Odierno and General Petraeus recently have said, in a very frustrated way, the military is doing their job. We never had enough troops, in my opinion, that went in there. Again, we’re not going to go back and unwind that. But the military has done a magnificent job of achieving the objectives that we’ve asked them to do and more. But we’ve not seen that translate into any political progress, which in the end is all that counts.

I have blockquoted more than enough, and Tim will bitch at me for not taking into consideration those of you reading on a laptop, so just go read the whole thing yourself.

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29Comments

  1. 1.

    horatius

    November 29, 2007 at 6:58 pm

    Somehow, all this talk never translated to a cut in funding for the war for this “maverick” senator.

  2. 2.

    Svensker

    November 29, 2007 at 7:14 pm

    Now, what does that mean? What can we do to go forward? Well, I asked the question of General Petraeus and Ambassador Crocker at hearings in September regarding the surge—“Give us more time”—and I said, “More time for what? What is the purpose here?”

    The question that should have been asked in 2002.

    Hagel seems like an intelligent, thoughtful man and it is a shame he is leaving the Senate. But where was he — where were other thoughtful conservatives — in the run-up to war? And why didn’t they kick harder when they finally realized what a crock the whole thing was? A lot of people wouldn’t be dead now if they had. The Constitution might be more whole. Our budget and economy might not be in shambles.

    When good men do nothing…

  3. 3.

    srv

    November 29, 2007 at 7:17 pm

    Chuck and McCain would never stand around and watch a woman get abused for 5 years, but when it’s done to the Army, he’ll just fret out loud about it.

  4. 4.

    maxbaer (not the original)

    November 29, 2007 at 7:30 pm

    He might make a good secretary of defense in 2009. Provided someone sane is elected, that is.

  5. 5.

    Delia

    November 29, 2007 at 7:31 pm

    Golly, maybe Hagel’s the one who’s stabbing the troops in the back.

  6. 6.

    jrg

    November 29, 2007 at 7:44 pm

    Hagel/Gingrich 2012!
    “Republicans look out for everybody. We’re just misunderstood.”

  7. 7.

    Tsulagi

    November 29, 2007 at 8:16 pm

    so just go read the whole thing yourself.

    Not much need to go read more. Everything Hagel said in your blockquote has been clear now for at least a few years.

    Even if more of the benchmarks had been made, what does that get you? Or them? The idea that Iraq will act like a New Detroit just with more brown people is ludicrous.

    There isn’t a strong central government that could enforce de-Baathification and oil laws even if they were inclined to do so. Kurds are going to do what Kurds are going to do. They don’t even fly the Iraq national flag in their provinces. Shia militias are going to do what’s in their best interests. Same with Sunni tribes. We’re encouraging that now.

    And do you really think if there were a functional central government they would observe those nation building laws more than this administration here if it was inconvenient to do so? We use executive findings, they could use fatwas, or not even bother with that and just tell critics to fuck off because they have the power. Bush/Cheney have been great democracy role models.

    Iraq is done.

  8. 8.

    Libby Spencer

    November 29, 2007 at 8:32 pm

    Somehow, all this talk never translated to a cut in funding for the war for this “maverick” senator.

    He talks a great game and I indulged in a bit of sentimental fondness for all that fine rhetoric that will be lost when he leaves myself. But then I checked his voting record and the guy hasn’t voted his talk — at all.

    I can’t remember exactly but I think he maybe made two votes in six years that I agreed with.

  9. 9.

    binzinerator

    November 29, 2007 at 9:19 pm

    When good men do nothing…

    … it means they are not as good as you thought they were.

    For however intelligent, thoughtful and decent he comes off, he has done nothing to act on those intelligent and decent thoughts. Just like the other thoughtful or maverick conservatives.

    Is a man a good man who, when seeing someone drown, thinks “I must throw him this lifebuoy” and instead does nothing? What kind of man can think that thought, and say those words, and just stand there, immobile, watching the victim drown? What kind of a man is that? What kind of man would he be if he were the lifeguard?

    I would not say “that is a bad man.” But I can’t say he is a good man, either. One would assume the lifeguards would know how to swim.

    The analogy is not perfect. It only takes a few minutes to drown, and the few minutes’ bad judgement and indecision that are fatal to the drowning man will leave the would-be rescuer ever afterward damning himself for his confusion, his delay, his crisis of courage and purpose.

    But Hagel and the rest have been in this supposed crisis for 6 years. It is therefore not a crisis of purpose, a lapse of judgment, a faltering of courage, a mental fog of indecision. It is their nature, not an aberration of it. After 6 years it is policy.

    He’s had 6 years for him (and the others) to prove there was something behind those words. And we’re still waiting.

    No, Svensker, the shame here is he was in the Senate for as long as he was, had those thoughts and questions — and did nothing. It was a character flaw, a personal lack — or failure, if you want — of virtue in the face of this adversity, a failure with terrible consequences for the public.

    Throw us a lifebuoy, Chuck. Just do something. We know you can swim, and you’ve known for a long time we’re drowning.

  10. 10.

    jcricket

    November 29, 2007 at 9:20 pm

    Golly, maybe Hagel’s the one who’s stabbing the troops in the back.

    (First, I know you were being sarcastic)

    You know the only people stabbing the troops in the back? Iraqis and Afghan insurgents with knives.

  11. 11.

    The Other Steve

    November 29, 2007 at 9:28 pm

    In all fairness, we really ought to just give them six more months. In six more months we’ll know if this thing has worked or not.

  12. 12.

    The Other Steve

    November 29, 2007 at 9:42 pm

    Wait a minute! This just in from ThinkProgress.

    Democrats Forced George Bush to go to war

    According to Karl Rove, they didn’t want to have a vote on the Iraq war before the 2002 election. The Democrats goaded them into it.

  13. 13.

    RSA

    November 29, 2007 at 9:57 pm

    Tim will bitch at me for not taking into consideration those of you reading on a laptop

    Tim should upgrade from his Osborne 1.

  14. 14.

    toolshed

    November 29, 2007 at 11:01 pm

    If fucking McCain can frame it as a political victory than a military (support the fucking troops) victory why the hell can’t Clinton or Obama frame it this way too?

    McCain would never stand around and watch a woman get abused for 5 years, but when it’s done to the Army, he’ll just fret out loud about it.

    That is some elegant damn snark sir. I feel like I should clap or something.

  15. 15.

    Delia

    November 29, 2007 at 11:26 pm

    jcricket Says:

    Golly, maybe Hagel’s the one who’s stabbing the troops in the back.

    (First, I know you were being sarcastic)

    You know the only people stabbing the troops in the back? Iraqis and Afghan insurgents with knives.

    Yeah, I guess Rummy’s about the only one who says “golly” without sarcastic intent anymore. Though I think there’s a case to be made that it’s actually the war party that’s doing the stabbing. Figuratively speaking, anyhow.

  16. 16.

    incontrolados

    November 29, 2007 at 11:38 pm

    We know you can swim, and you’ve known for a long time we’re drowning.

    And he leaves with just this. There’s more than a year left for W to listen to Kagan — a doughy historian — and whoever else W is listening to.

    For what ever reason, I decided to listen to emotive (Perfect Circle) tonight.

  17. 17.

    TenguPhule

    November 29, 2007 at 11:58 pm

    Chuck and McCain would never stand around and watch a woman get abused for 5 years unless it got them votes

    Corrected.

    Chuck Hagel would have gladly skullfucked a kitten for the Enduring Republican Majority. McCain would go for sloppy seconds in a heartbeat for a chance at the primary.

    Both of them deserve to be flogged repeatedly.

  18. 18.

    John Cole

    November 30, 2007 at 12:09 am

    It is with a tear of joy that I see the phrase “skullfuck a kitten” adopted and used.

    I am a proud daddy.

  19. 19.

    incontrolados

    November 30, 2007 at 12:10 am

    Hangover from Malkin — move on to another outrage — I guess it will be up tomorrow.

    Switched over to NIN.

  20. 20.

    tBone

    November 30, 2007 at 12:54 am

    Hagel seems like an intelligent, thoughtful man and it is a shame he is leaving the Senate. But where was he—where were other thoughtful conservatives—in the run-up to war? And why didn’t they kick harder when they finally realized what a crock the whole thing was?

    Hagel has been kicking pretty damn hard ever since the full scope of the Iraq clusterfuck became clear. He kicked hard enough to scuttle his chances of being reelected, in fact. At the end of the day, he’s just one Senator in a party full of war-mongering nutballs.

    Chuck Hagel would have gladly skullfucked a kitten for the Enduring Republican Majority. McCain would go for sloppy seconds in a heartbeat for a chance at the primary.

    Both of them deserve to be flogged repeatedly.

    McCain, sure. Hagel? Bullshit. If he was interested in an Enduring Republican Majority, he wouldn’t have continually spoken out against the administration. Because his mouth would have been too full of Bush Co. Kool-aid flavored cock to speak. You know, like McCain.

  21. 21.

    chazaroo

    November 30, 2007 at 1:02 am

    I’m a Viet Nam vet, I feel like I’m tripping. A politician, let alone a r, speaking his mind and telling the truth. Guts, Hagel knows he’ll be ostracized and villified by the wingnuts, but honesty rulled out. How refreshing. I’m to the left of Carl Marx, however, Hagel has my respect and admiration.

  22. 22.

    srv

    November 30, 2007 at 1:21 am

    It is with a tear of joy that I see the phrase “skullfuck a kitten” adopted and used.

    I appreciate your efforts with “Fluffersphere”.

  23. 23.

    incontrolados

    November 30, 2007 at 1:30 am

    I’m to the left of Carl Marx, however, Hagel has my respect and admiration.

    Coming from the same territory — Hagel — wow– he’s a little too late.

  24. 24.

    Ninerdave

    November 30, 2007 at 4:17 am

    John Cole Says:

    It is with a tear of joy that I see the phrase “skullfuck a kitten” adopted and used.

    I am a proud daddy.

    and we in the peanut galley, you know the ones with the LIBUERL GHB that we’ve been feeding you lo those many years, it wasn’t enough that we turned you Dem…we had to have Atrios himself quote you about skull fucking…

    Our job here…is…done…

    Next up…red state or malkin…can’t read my own writing any more…it’s one of those two…or maybe the corner…I need some scotch.

  25. 25.

    gypsy howell

    November 30, 2007 at 7:43 am

    If he was interested in an Enduring Republican Majority, he wouldn’t have continually spoken out against the administration.

    As noted above, talk is cheap. Where was Brave Sir Hagel when it counted? Cowering with McCain and voting for anything Bush wanted.

    Name one issue where Hagel took a principled stand against the Bush administration and then followed through with the vote to back it up.

  26. 26.

    Punchy

    November 30, 2007 at 8:59 am

    and Tim will bitch at me for not taking into consideration those of you reading on a laptop,

    No friggin clue what this means.

  27. 27.

    tBone

    November 30, 2007 at 9:31 am

    Name one issue where Hagel took a principled stand against the Bush administration and then followed through with the vote to back it up.

    Iraq troop reduction. Timeline for withdrawal in emergency appropriation bills. Habeus corpus for detainees.Time between troop deployments. Go through some of those bills and see how many other Republicans voted for them.

    I’m not going to defend Hagel’s overall voting record, which is pretty nauseating, but he did put himself out there on Iraq at least some of the time. That’s more than you can say about all but a handful of Republican senators.

  28. 28.

    gypsy howell

    November 30, 2007 at 11:27 am

    Alright tBone, I’ll concede that a few of his votes were better than the rest of those Republican jackals. But it doesn’t excuse his overall tough-talk-fold-on-the-vote pattern we’ve seen throughout the last 7 years. (Too bad, for example, he didn’t think about habeas corpus when it really counted, when he voted for the MCA in the first place. He wouldn’t be trying to fix his mistake the second time around.)

    I’m just sick of these guys grasping for redemption after fucking us over all these years.

  29. 29.

    Tax Analyst

    November 30, 2007 at 1:15 pm

    John Cole Says:

    It is with a tear of joy that I see the phrase “skullfuck a kitten” adopted and used.

    I am a proud daddy

    As well you should, JC. That’s absolutely one of the best phrases I’ve ever run across on any blog on the ‘Net.

    Wish I’d have said it.

    …envy is such a bitch.

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