I have a lot going on. If anything interesting is happening, throw it in the comments and maybe we can talk about it later (in other words, you do the blogging, I’ll take credit for it).
Open Thread
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cleek
(copied from other thread)
the DNC is nearly broke:
that can’t be a good thing
Jake
Why is the Department of Labor emboldening the terrists?
Also, if someone could explain to me why this (from the same story) isn’t utter and complete bullshit, and little more than a way to keep the CEOs of bank institutions happy, I would be appreciative:
chopper
i dunno, jake. maybe they could get some of that cash from the bank CEOs.
Incertus
As I recall, the DNC has a pretty high burn rate thanks to all the organizing they’ve been doing in states that didn’t have much after the 90s, so there’s more emphasis on GOTV than on money for ads and such. Plus, the congressional committees have been kicking major ass against their competitors, so overall, it’s a wash, especially when you factor in the way Obama and Clinton are swamping McCain in fundraising.
But along those lines, Bill Nelson needs to just shut up about Florida’s primaries.
4tehlulz
Panic? In my Federal Reserve?
It’s more likely than you think.
Billy K
She’s a Monster!
Blue Neponset
John you just got served by the boys over at Sadly No.
TheFountainHead
I see that no one but Olbermann has picked up on Clinton’s CaNAFTAda hypocrisy. Guess not a whole lot has changed in that industry since they led us, drooling, into the Shock and Awe campaign.
chopper
why must i cry?
Billy K
Wha….what IS that? And why would they do that to us? What’s WRONG with those people?
Incertus
I’ll be sending you a bill for my therapy costs, chopper.
Krista
By the way, I’d like to take this opportunity to apologize on behalf of my country. I did not vote for Harper, and would love nothing more than for him to lose his job over this. Interfering in another country’s elections is beyond inexcusable. I don’t know if Harper’s going to apologize, but I wanted to as well.
jcricket
Great. What we need now is another land war with Iran and perhaps one with Venezuela and Columbia to spice things up a bit.
$300 oil here we come!
Xenos
For the Florida issue that will not die, would it make sense for Obama to tell Clinton to stfu already and have her 30 net delegates? It is not nearly enough to put her over the top, and it is a way for Obama to get past a divisive issue in a menschy way that could redound to his advantage in MI and PA.
He has got to get control of the media narrative again, and this might well do it. Worth the price in delegates, and in terms of the risk he is caving?
Kyle E. Moore
How about some more reasons Clintonistas should back off of the Rezko trial and maybe release some tax records?
http://commentsfromleftfield.com/2008/03/abandon-all-hope-ye-who-enter-here
I rarely do the self promote thing anymore but I wanted to get some eyeballs on this. I’m tired of Clinton tossing the kitchen sink and not getting the vetting she deserves.
Kyle E. Moore
Krista, what’s wrong with interfering with other country’s elections? We do it all the time.
Xenos
Krista –
no need to apologize. It is good for us Yanks to have the tables turned on us once in a while – we need the perspective.
As for Harper, I can’t figure out what he is doing up there. I thought the arrangement was for you to export your right wing creeps to the US so we could give them sinecures in our think tanks and then mock them relentlessly. Fire Harper so we can follow through on our part.
Krista
Gladly. My local MP was booted out of the Conservative Caucus (’cause he’s cool like that), so a vote for him does NOT mean a vote for Harper. Now if we can just get them to call an election, or get the media worked up enough about this that he’s made to resign….
chopper
he could offer to pay for the contests in MI and FL. whether or not it would actually happen (do to rules etc) he has the cash, and that would definitely sap any of clinton’s ‘i’m the one that wanted your votes to count’ shtick in FL.
and bring much of the media narrative back in his corner.
as much as clinton could argue that such an offer is some cynical political ploy, it wouldn’t work too well. like “so, hillary, first you wanted them seated, then you wanted a do-over, now you want a do-over only if it’s a do-over that goes exactly your way, without you having to do any real work to get it to happen” etc etc. suddenly clinton comes off as the ‘all talk’ candidate while obama comes off as the ‘guy who actually gets shit done’ candidate.
i dunno. the dude raised heck of dollars this last month.
Xenos
I wonder how many superdelegates would be willing to commit to Obama in order to make the problem go away…
Kyle E. Moore
That’s a helluva idea.
It’s like the scene in Dusk Till Dawn. “I’m gonna count to three. One…”
“Two.”
Call her bluff, call it hard.
lutton
Where’s the beef?
Chris Matthews says it’s in Pennsylvania!
http://mediamatters.org/items/200803060011
h/t Will Bunch
chopper
there might be trouble with a candidate offering up money from their own campaign, surely. of course, given that obama can raise like a billion dollars in a day, he could just ask his supporters this month to send their donations directly to the DNC instead. by the end of the month i’m sure his supporters would have raised enough cash. shit, he’s sitting on over 55 million, he can afford to take a few weeks off from raising money for his own campaign.
Kyle E. Moore
Xenos,
It’s unclear, one thing we do know is that Obama had as many as fifty Supers lined up to endorse after Ohio and Texas, but they’ve since backed down because primarily of Hillary’s big win in Ohio.
It’s going to have to result in a breaking point scenario now. Solid delegate pick ups on Saturday and Tuesday will help, but the only way the Supers are going to put an end to it is if Hillary REALLY goes off the deep end, we’re talking about polishing McCain’s shoes and serving him breakfast deep end.
I think right now they’re paralyzed. Overturning the will of the pledged delegates is dangerous as hell, but so is cutting off the Clintonista campaign while too many people still don’t realize she’s already dead.
Cyrus
Well, you are Canadian, so you have the practice.
My reflex is to say that “beyond inexcusable” is putting it too strongly — it’s not like Harper broke any law, or even lied as far as I know — but I’m an American, so even the liberals among us are conditioned to be sympathetic to getting involved in other countries’ elections. Pushing for an election in Palestine led to Hamas getting elected and was therefore considered bad, all kinds of meddling in Central America and South America are now a fait accompli and anyways it was the middle of the Cold War so we can’t really blame people for taking desperate measures, etc.
A lot of us would be ecstatic if our government — hell, our public, our country — limited ourselves to what is “beyond inexcusable” to a Canadian.
Kyle E. Moore
Chopper: Yeah.. and February was a short month. Two whole days extra this month. That’s like four million more dollars.
According to some of the estimates I’ve seen, Obama could come close to funding both Michigan and Florida primaries with less than a week’s worth of fundraising.
tom.a
Where’s the beef? Chris Matthews says it’s in Pennsylvania!
Tweety is normally quite annoying but the fact that PA is going to be the focus for the next 6 weeks is going to make him unbearable.
On that note, enough politics, do some beer blogging, me thirsty!
Zifnab
Bush has done more for alternative energy in the last seven years than any other President since Jimmy Carter. Take THAT Al Gore!
Kyle E. Moore
Zifnab just broke my brain.
demimondian
Krista — if you want to be rid of Harper, get your local press to focus on the his party’s Vote of Confidence in Cancer, not Character. Meddling in other country’s politics is distasteful, but really par for the course in international relations. Bribing you own dying people to vote a particular way…not so much.
p.a.
I saw this epigram on a sports site thread. If it’s original the guy’s a genius, if not, does anyone out there recognize it? (He was off the thread when I saw it).
South Park Uncut
Okay that’s a start, now what about Bryan Adams?
ThymeZone
We have always been at war with Pennsylvania.
And Canada.
The Grand Panjandrum
Blog Whore Warning! I put this post up on my blog as a possible solution to the MI and FL problem. I’ll paste it here to save you the trouble of clicking the link.
I originally posted this on my TPMCafe diary last night then I put it up at my place this morning.
The Grand Panjandrum
I’ve got my CDS tamped down a bit today so I’m going to ignore Demi today. I really hate being suckered into a rant, but props to you Demi (even though I’m ignoring you.) Touche!
Krista
The Cadman affair? Trust me, it’s getting lots of press attention both locally and nationally. Although right now, the NAFTA debacle is getting more coverage. Still, two nasty scandals for our governing party, one right after the other — hopefully Shark-Eyes Stevie won’t be able to shrug this off too easily.
Dennis - SGMM
Go ahead and laugh, but if we keep on the Bush/Cheney energy policy then we’ll soon have flying cars powered by hydrogen. We’ll have hydrogen-powered robots to do all the work for us too.
All we have to do is keep cutting taxes and never, ever, end the tax breaks, subsidies, and sweetheart royalty deals for the big oil companies. If we should raise taxes on anyone, or reduce oil company profits in any way whatsoever then you’ll never have your flying car or your robots. Consider yourself warned.
Skalite
Samantha Power resigns
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/03/power_resigns_over_hillaryismo.php
jcricket
So what you’re saying is that he’s the real manchurian candidate, right? Sent in by Democrats, posing as a conservative, to completely discredit the Republican party.
Sneaky!
The Grand Panjandrum
Something else I posted but will just cut and paste here:
TheFountainHead
This is really too bad, the woman was a powerhouse of pragmatic foreign policy philosophy in my opinion. I don’t know what the hell she was thinking, letting her anger vent like that, and her resignation is the only option, but I hope that should Obama pull this out and win a general election he finds his way back to her.
Hard to fault her for saying what I’ve been thinking for months now, but such is the game.
demimondian
Historically, international relations scandals don’t have legs. There’s a case to be made that Harper has a responsibility to get the most Canada-friendly government possible elected in the U.S. One could debate whether a Republican government would satisfy that criterion, but either way, it’s not a crime.
The only crime is getting caught and exposed — that’s a serious blow to international relations.
But, of course, you’re right; two scandals, one domestic, and the other international, and with an important ally, to boot, should bring his government down with a thud.
ThymeZone
As unfortunate as it is, this is a good thing … it shows that the Obama campaign is keeping to a standard of behavior and acting quickly to enforce that standard.
If only the Clinton campaign would do the same.
The Grand Panjandrum
I remember John Kerry being scoffed at for wanting to raise the gas tax by 50 cents a gallon prior to the Iraq invasion. But why pay for a war when we can kick the can down the road so our kids pay the bills we run up?
Morfydd
Krista, you said, “I did not vote for Harper, and would love nothing more than for him to lose his job over this. Interfering in another country’s elections is beyond inexcusable.”
Perhaps I’m not understanding the controversy. If he (or an underling) had knowledge that Obama was lying (or being agreesively nuanced, or whatever) about NAFTA, why is it wrong to speak up about it?
If he made it up I understand the scandal, but otherwise I’m a big fan of truthtelling, even if it is inconvenient.
(usual caveats: I caucused for Obama, my bf is an alt delegate for Obama, I adore Canada greatly and don’t get how you elected a schmuck like Harper.)
D-Chance.
Ron Paul is out. So long, sanity left in the elections. Have fun with McCain, Nader, and Oba/llary.
jcricket
Isn’t he canceled out by Alanis?
AkaDad
One thing Canadians should have learned by now is that you don’t piss off Americans, especially when you have oil.
demimondian
Ah, praise from the praise-worthy…I live for it.
Of course, instead of ignoring me, you can always use the pie filter. It makes my postings funnier, and makes them make more sense.
demimondian
jcricket — two words: Celine. Dion.
Billy K
Do not worry, Krista. We will liberate you soon, and liberate you hard!
Purple finger, here you come!
Nikki
Captain Ed and Phil are about to go into spasms.
ThymeZone
I don’t know you well enough to know whether you are kidding.
demimondian
D-Chance? I hope he’s a spoof, but I’m seriously afraid that he’s as much of a loser as he appears.
Krista
The reason why it’s wrong is because from what I’ve since read, Obama was not lying, nor was he being aggressively nuanced. There was a bit of nuance in play, but it was depicted as being much worse than it was.
To be frank, I think that CTV bears much more of the blame for this. The original leak by the Harper flunky said that it was Clinton’s campaign who had called to reassure them that their hard line on NAFTA was mostly political positioning, rather than statement of intent. CTV, when they ran their report, focused almost solely on Obama, not Clinton. So something is definitely weird here, and I’m hoping that in the rush to crucify Harper, that people don’t forget to take a good long look at that CTV reporter and why he chose to angle the story the way he did.
chopper
ew.
Dug Jay
Does that 15-20 minutes sound a little long for some of our more senior commenters….ThymeZone???
demimondian
Yeah, this is a weird case. I don’t think we’ve seen the bottom of this — it looks like the PM’s flunky contacted both campaigns, and then leaked that Clinton’s campaign called back. The CTV reporter then reported that Obama’s campaign had called back.
That could be true, except: (1) *both* campaigns have denied the reverse contact, and (2) that’s an unbelievably stupid mistake to make in the first place, and (3) no news organization would stand by it without documentation. I expect we’re going to find out that the there were two disinformation campaigns, and NOBODY called back.
p.lukasiak
gonna do a little blogwhoring since its an open thread…and just to annoy TZ ;-)
I broke down the SUSA tables and created lists of “safe”, battleground, “swing”, and “too close to call” for each candidate over at Corrente. (I’ve also just finished posting some tables that look at competitive races in terms of how much of the undecided vote the candidates would need to win to get to 50%+1
and while arguments for each side can be made with the data, I think that based on this data, Obama wins the “if the election were held today, who would be the better candidate?” question.
ThymeZone
I will say, if a crazy person is going to use the presidential election cycle as a soapbox, then doing it in the primary is at least honorable. It keeps the other candidates on their toes, exposes a few things that need exposing.
Running as an independent, like Nader, is downright evil as far as I’m concerned.
Morfydd
OK, I understand the outrage then.
Go Dion!
L Boom
Yep. Its been proven incontrovertibly that Canada has been illegally exporting a quebecoise of mass bad taste. Between that and the oil, I’m sure pretty the case for invasion would be a SLAM DUNK!
Jake
Uh huh, and what sort of people ride bicycles in a crowded city instead of driving? That’s right, tree hugging tofu smokers! Quick, we must round up all the bike messengers
and give their contracts to a big delivery corporationfor the safety of the children!p.lukasiak
as someone else has noted, the DNC has been spending the money doing what its supposed to do — organization.
And I don’t think ‘being nearly broke’ is all that bad — especially when you announce it in a year like this. People thought that the party was flush with cash, and now that they see there is a need, they are more likely to give.
Pb
p.lukasiak,
Wow, I’m impressed. So what did you think of poblano’s analysis?
SGEW
Somethin’ in this link reminded me of the Times Square thread the other day:
From CNN today:
Win.
Jamey
I have no problem with Celine Dion … except that she married Papa Smurf (seen here without hat): http://uhec.net/b/images/20070523.jpg
ThymeZone
Maybe, we don’t know the whole story. But in terms of reassuring the Canadians that election year politics should not be taken to mean that the US is likely to try to unravel NAFTA any time soon, probably a good idea.
Whatever one thinks of NAFTA, and I personally have no strong opinion about it one way or the other, it’s an agreement that has effects way down into the economies of other countries, and shouldn’t be talked about as if we are about to pull the plug on it.
With all due respect to people who live in Ohio, including my own relatives who live there, I am not convinced that Ohio is smart enough to find its way out of a paper bag with both hands, a flashlight, a GPS device, and pictorial instructions. If Ohio is losing jobs, it might just be because Ohio is in the vacuum tube business and hasn’t figured out that transistors replaced vacuum tubes a long time ago.
chopper
union square? with the huge farmer’s market chock-full of granola-eating hippies?? my god, they’ll be killed!
Andrew
You know she sings, right?
Also, Obama won Texas by 3 delegates…
RSA
Think Progress flags Ollie North blaming Pelosi and the expiration of the Protect America Act for the Times Square bombing. Because, of course, it’s inconceivable that a guy riding a bike and carrying homemade bombs could have executed his mission without first making a few overseas phone calls.
zzyzx
I’m impressed that you came to that conclusion. I don’t know how much anything matters this far out, but it’s good to see that you’re not as blinded as some of us (e.g. me ;) ) thought you were.
The Grand Panjandrum
Yum pie! I loves me some pie. But I’m still ignoring you! See watch me as I ignore you.
But, I’m still laughing at myself after yesterday’s thread. I had a few fine Belgian-style Abbey Ales, a few shots of excellent tequila and all is well now. Cheers!
OK, I’m ignoring you now.
ThymeZone
Slowly but surely, little by little, these people are driving the last of the sane and rational voters away from themselves with their cockamamie bullshit. I mean, bull waste.
I like Ollie North, I have always thought he was a great poster boy for why we should be Democrats.
John S.
There’s only one way to kill Zombie-Clinton:
Aim for the head.
chopper
obviously, we need to listen in to every phone call bike messengers make. without a warrant.
ThymeZone
Wow, I am genuinely impressed that you would say that. my faith in you is restored.
And I think, that conclusion is right, and is borne out by the recent polling on that question.
However, if we agree that either Clinton or Obama can beat the hapless, feckless, drab, nutcase of a candidate that the GOP has put up …. and I think we probably do … then this probably all comes down to liking one of our candidates more than the other. I mean, in terms of what goes on here, at BJ.
Out there in the real world, who knows what sways people in these things, really? I am not a true believer in the “data” that attends to these things, I am not sure that pollsters have idea what the fudge (no cuss week) they are doing.
Anyway, stop by, bring your pals, drinks are on me.
dougie smooth
Re: Powers — I think this photo of an HRC presser nicely illustrates that Hillary is, in fact, a monster.
Billy K
You, sir, are a liar. I know, because you and Chris Matthews are saying opposite things. Chris Matthews is a respected political journalist. You hang out on “blogs.” Therefore – liar.
Andrew
The intelligent thing to say would have been, “We’re not concerned about free trade with Canada, because they have strong worker and environmental protections, and we have always had an incredibly important and prosperous trading relationship with our Northern neighbors. We are concerned about unregulated free trade with Mexico, because we don’t want to see pollution and poor labor practices simply shipped South of the border. We want to ensure that their workers and environment are safe because this will create a level playing field for our workers in Ohio and Texas.”
Jen
My thought on poblano’s analysis is that if I had that kind of time, I would have a seriously clean house, homemade bread, and probably an afghan or two made by now. :) Nah, it was interesting. Pb, are you excited or dismayed by the probability of an Obama presence in NC…?
Andrew
Note: That’s what I think they should have said, not what I necessarily believe.
Andrew
Obama will roll in NC. I’m going to hassle Edwards to support him next time I run into him.
Jen
Yeah, I think he’ll do well in NC too, but it’s nearly two months away and as much as I would like to go, with 19,000 of my closest friends, to see him at the Dean Dome or something, I also want him to have it wrapped up by then.
chopper
not really. if we agree that either candidate can beat mccain, then the next question should be who has longer coattails? who will bring more democrats into office on downticket races?
tBone
I saw 50%+1 and was ready to lay into you. Then you fired off a last-minute burst of objectivity.
Stop ruining my fun, dammit.
myiq2xu
Must . . . eat . . . brains!
Pb
Jen,
I’m dismayed that it’s gone this long, but I’ll be excited if/when it rolls into town here. Not that I think my chunk of Durham can get that much bluer, but it couldn’t hurt, and I’d love to see, say, Larry Kissell win his race.
Andrew
I would like to force Chris Matthews to jello wrestle a black bear.
Stop, hey what’s that sound? Obama picking up 8 more delegates in California.
Andrew
Sorry, that should be a 8 delegate swing…
ThymeZone
I posted pretty much this same thing a year and a half ago, or so ….. worth repeating in this context.
Go to Google and search on “nogales, az”
Choose the map, and open up the map.
Notice that the map sort of disappears at the Mexican border which runs right through the middle of Nogales.
Now click to the Aerial View and observe.
Take a gander at Nogales, Son, Mexico, compared to Nogales, AZ.
Un-fucking-believable, even for somebody who lives right here and has been going to Nogales for fifty years.
Look at the size of the Mexican Nogales compared to the American one, and notice the amount of commercial and industrial facilities down there.
That’s all NAFTA. Make of it what you will, NAFTA’s impact has been huge.
I’ve seen no evidence that the industrial infrastructure down there is second rate or high pollution. In fact, I bought a car a few years ago that was assembled down there and it was a fine product, very impressive.
ThymeZone
Welp, good old Google, they have added mexican map to the Nogales area. Used to be, the map just stopped at the border. Now it doesn’t.
John S.
Zombie movies are awesome, aren’t they?
zzyzx
So it looks like the Limbots will be voting en masse in Mississippi too. It’s kind of interesting to see what happens when open primaries occur when one party is completely wrapped up and the others isn’t.
The problem they’re having though is that they’re being way too obvious about it. It might hurt Clinton as much with SDs as it’s helping in the elections… or maybe not, who knows.
Billy K
I think you’re both nuts. The question is who would do a better job – e.g. who has better judgment and who has a better chance of actually enacting their policies.
Andrew
Again, I didn’t say that I believed this, merely that’s what they should say. I’m pro-NAFTA and free trade in general.
(I also own a Mexican-made car and it’s primary issue was the German engineers who designed it.)
Billy K
Duh. Gotta get ready for the N.A.U.
Andrew
Hint: It’s easier to enact your policies when there are more congresscritters from your party.
ThymeZone
Uh huh, well I think I have been pretty clear on the matter of which of them I think is grossly overstating his or her experience and judgement.
You might have picked up on it.
Dork
I have no idea what any of this means.
ThymeZone
Right, and I have no particular opinion on NAFTA myself.
It’s clearly been a boon to Mexico, it seems to me, but whether it’s a good deal for the US, I really don’t know.
If it was designed by Republicans, then it probably is not.
Jake
Make sure that you do not just go out and start decapitating zombies left and right. Do you understand? Do not start decapitating zombies left and right!
The Grand Panjandrum
Here you go John. A little something from the Motley Fool to cheer you up:
Ouch.
cleek
yuck. if housing prices fall 30%, there’s gonna be a hell of a lot of people (waves) who suddenly find themselves upside down on their mortgage.
John S.
Remember the Obama advisor that called Hillary a monster and got our Hillbots in a twist? Well, she’s out:
The MUP doesn’t fail to impress. No word on whether Clinton will ask for resignations from any of her advisors that make disgusting public remarks (Wolfson and Penn, I’m looking at you).
demimondian
Penn and Wolfson…wasn’t that a second rate magic act I read about somewhere? Much better on television than in real performance, by the way…
Krista
Ha! Basically, it would be as though a vote for your Congresscritter was translated into a vote for the leader of your Congresscritter’s party. So, if the Dems win more seats than the Republicans, then the leader of the Democratic party would automatically become President. With me so far?
My Congresscritter (i.e. my Member of Parliament), pissed off the President (i.e. Prime Minister) by voting against the budget. So he was effectively booted out of the party. He’s still my Congresscritter, but he’s an Independent now. So I can vote for him, and it won’t translate into a vote for anybody on the federal scale.
And as far as forcing an election goes, that can happen when the opposition basically puts forth a vote of “no-confidence” If enough Congresscritters vote for it, it’s game over for that PM, and time for an election, baby.
Krista
Christ, at least I think that’s how it works. I pay more attention to your political system than my own, sad to say.
John S.
Blasphemy!
Penn and Teller kick ass, and I will suffer no ill will towards them.
Jen
Shaun of the Dead….that was a good movie.
ThymeZone
Hillary Clinton is a monster.
And don’t wait up for my resignation.
Chuck Butcher
The WaPo says intelligence officials seem to want to keep the Iraq NIE secret. Hmmm.
jcricket
This post from Ezra Klein goes into a lot of detail about how both Clinton and Obama beat McCain, but in very different ways, based on current polling.
We can debate, of course, obsessively about the coattail effect and which one will have more. Obviously Obama fans believe that’s a big strong suit of his, and discount the possibility of Clinton having any coattails. I for one think differently, mainly because I think macro-level issues will have a large enough impact to bring massive coattails to the Dems this year (more so than any candidate themselves would).
demimondian
To add a couple of extra details to what Krista said: a government sits for a maximum period of time, after which time the PM is “forced to call for an election”. OTOH, the PM can, at any time “call for election”. It’s a bad idea to call for an election too frequently, but, if you’re PM and you’ve just racked up an important victory, it’s a good time to go to the polls. Conversely, no PM wants to go to the polls when his or her popularity is in the tank, since his party will get thrown out. (Hence being forced to go to the people is a bad thing; you’d never had waited so long if you’d done a decent job.)
Billy K
jcricket
First of all, you failed to provide the required translation in French of “I am the greatest singer… in de world!”
And not I hold any special brief for Canada, but I counter your Celine Dion with “You Can’t Do That on Television”!
Chuck Butcher
Iraq NIE
that seems to have worked better
jcricket
Here’s Ezra Klein again, about So-called “Unity Tickets”, echoing my thoughts exactly.
If Obama’s the nominee, Clinton will not be the VP. If Clinton is the nominee, she should really, really, really try to get him to be the VP.
Chuck Butcher
WaPO and Iraq NIE
that seems to have worked better
Chuck Butcher
I’m not real good at coding, but I thought I was better than this.
ThymeZone
That’s a good article.
I have a bet with DougJ that Obama v McCain gets McCain 34% or less of the vote total. Clinton v McCain, 39% or less for McCain (we didn’t bet on that one — I think).
Either way, McCain does a Goldwater and drags his party into oblivion via reverse coattails.
Maybe finally that will shut him up, I don’t know. One can hope.
PeterJ
McCain losing his temper…
PeterJ
How cranky would McCain be at 3:00 AM?
Dork
Thanks. Interesting.
Chuck Butcher
My thoughts on the Dream Ticket from 3/5.
Krista
Sigh…and you wonder why your country has a reputation for being overly self-centred. ;)
Jen
Puerto Bacon? You don’t like Puerto Frio better?
Billy K
Sorry. :( It was the bagged milk comment, wasn’t it? I heard you guys are really sensitive about that.
Billy K
When I think Canada, I think Bob & Doug. Which, of course makes me think of back bacon.
chopper
doesn’t matter to clinton, she wouldn’t read it either way.
Xenos
That would be the same Goldman Sachs that made billions brokering and marketing securities based on subprime and Alt-A mortgages, filling up their clients’ protfolios with crap while Golden Slacks took a Four Billion dollar hedge position?
The biggest client of Goldman’s is the partners of Goldman. And they never lose money. And under Bush the Treasury Secretary and most of his staff are Goldman people.
I would suggest that you do as Goldman does, and not as it says. Those guys make Cheney’s ethics look good.
Xenos
Oh and the Canadian bagged milk technology is great. I wish we could get it here. I wish we could get all sorts of Canadian food here.
Ever have a pork loin steak grilled medium rare? It has been 15 years since I could do that, and I sure miss it. If the future is Canadian-style socialism, it sure will be yummy.
jcricket
The comments do point out that some of the math on the polls is a little fuzzy. I don’t see Clinton losing Washington (for example). But regardless, I think the math is in both candidates favor. And I think it will get more so, as the headlines on all the papers get worse and worse about the economy. There’s just no way Republicans are gonna escape that right now.
I also read something at Kos about how the “wall-to-wall” Obama v. Clinton coverage is shutting McCain out. Perhaps those non-aligned Dems (i.e. DNC) can start pushing that narrative, as a way to protect from any perception that we’re fighting.
That’s been my opinion all along – present the prolonged campaign as an embarrassment of political riches. Talk about how both candidates are drawing more dollars and voters than the entire Republican field. You have to admit it’s impressive that two candidates are having “record breaking” seasons (as it were).
chopper
and this is the guy clinton is saying is better fit than her fellow democrat. helluva guy to hitch your wagon to.
jcricket
The whole-hearted/forced embrace of Bushie sure will help in that regard. Bush is like a giant black-hole with a massive gravitational field.
You know your party’s in trouble when your President has, basically, the worst approval ratings ever. Combined with all McCain’s other negatives and I’d be shocked if your vote total predictions weren’t conservative (for how bad he will do).
I still don’t see Dems picking up 58 or 59 Senate seats, but 55 seems like a lock now, plus a bunch of governorships, state legislatures flipping to Dem, more of a house majority and the little thing called the WH.
Xenos
Now that he is picking fights with a newspaper that buys ink by the metric kiloton, I do not want him to shut up any time soon.
demimondian
“Kiri Tekanawa”
Billy K
John S.
Yes, though I think it would be much more productive to have only one politician trying to make history at a time. Because in the end, there can be only one (no decapitations, please) and the efforts of the ‘loser’ will only end up a footnote in the pages of history.
Dug Jay
If you think that piece on McCain losing his temper is good, you ought to take a look at the tape CNN ran a day ago in which L. Ron Obama goes apeshit when reporters have the fucking temerity to ask him about NAFATGATE and his former best buddy, Tony Rezko. He stormed out of the press conference in a huge huff.
jcricket
Maybes… Depends on whether the others aligned with the “losing” candidate get on board the Dem train or not. If so I think the story will end up being “record breaking Dem primary season leads to doubly record breaking Dem win”…. and then in my dreams followed by, “Republican party in disarray, defectors leaving in droves to form irrelevant third and fourth parties”.
jcricket
BTW, you know the last person to have a record breaking February, right? John Kerry himself ($44 million raise). Sometimes making fundraising history isn’t enough.
Darkness
On the topic of yet another government department we rely on to save our lives that’s been poisoned by seven years of the Bush Administration. Add the FAA to the list:
Bob In Pacifica
I am hearing rumblings that Hillary’s great comeback on Tuesday was actually just another Republican dirty trick to, as Rush Limb said himself, “bloody Obama” for the fall.
Thom Hartmann was mentioning the possibility of 700,000 crossover Repubs in Texas, more than enough to throw the election to Clinton. Similar numbers in Ohio. Counties where twice as many people voted in the Democratic primary as there were registered voters.
In short, Hillary may not have even won those two elections, the Republicans may have stolen them to keep the circus going. Which would make the whole shift in momentum story a lot less compelling, no matter what is reported by FOX.
jenniebee
Are you kidding? This is exciting stuff. The more that every Democrat across the country feels like every vote, every where, counts for something, the better!
Stop worrying about whether McCain can make hash out of whether or not Obama has the foreign policy goods or if Hillary would really be wearing that shade of eyeshadow when she answers the phone at 3am. The ongoing primaries are energizing the Democratic base.
The Other Steve
Did you hear Hillary Clinton is a monster?
Hard to believe that one, but could it possibly be true?
The Other Steve
Are you saying John McCain might not have the appropriate temperment to be President?
I had not considered that before. Could this possibly be true?
Bob In Pacifica
Regarding Michigan and Florida, no delegates should be seated based on those two invalid primaries.
Whatever the states can arrange, so be it. If the Clinton camp, which needs the delegates she didn’t win in those faux primaries, refuses to accept whatever the states can offer, my solution is to offer delegations split right down the middle, half to Obama and half to Clinton. Those of you who’ve had Bible studies will know the story.
Asti
That’s odd, I heard this story on the radio yesterday and it was cited as 42 plans and over 22,000 flights.
Asti
plans is planes, sorry, I’m dealing with Friday braindeath.
chopper
The Bridal Feast of Beth Chedruharazzeb?
demimondian
Oh, goody. I know how accurate your interpretations usually are about events in Texas, Bob.
John S.
You missed my point entirely, Jenniebee.
I will clarify. History will only remember (hopefully) that in 2008 we elected our first black (or African-American if you prefer) or first female president. The one who fails to win the nomination will only be a footnote to that election. That doesn’t mean it isn’t exciting either way.
I would just liked to have seen these two make a run for the White House in separate years. Get it?
p.lukasiak
PB said…
I was very impressed. He made graphic what I saw by looking at the data. (are you poblano?
***************
TZ said
Well, don’t get too impressed. I wouldn’t want you to hurt yourself!
BTW, I’m looking at how the vote shifts in different demographic groups — using the states that are within the margin of error (+-4) for either candidate. Just finished the Gender tables, and the gender shift is significant more in his favor in MoE states, as well as states that are within 6 points.
demimondian
That, John S., is yet another reason we should nominate Clinton for President and Obama for Vice President. He helps her become the first woman, gets some needed grooming in handling political brickbats during campaigns, and will subsequently be elected in his own right after she leaves office.
Johnny Pez
Fixed.
Goldwater + 4 years = Nixon.
Hoover + 4 years = more FDR.
chopper
as much as having obama on the ticket would help bring in obama’s voters, it would also be somewhat difficult in other ways. if i were clinton, i wouldn’t want to have a ‘superstar’ veep who outshines me. also, obama wouldn’t cure clinton’s main hangup against mccain, which is a serious lack of experience (she has tried to make this race about experience, which unfortunately for her means mccain will pummel her on her lack of it). also, it doesn’t fix her lack of foreign policy or military bona fides.
if i were her, i’d maybe pick clark and offer obama some other important job that wouldn’t take the spotlight off of me.
Johnny Pez
Anyway, as others have suggested, I think this year is more likely to be like 1968 with the parties reversed.
jenniebee
But it isn’t like this is the only time a non-white or a non-male will ever run again. And I disagree about the historical perspective – I think it’s far more likely to remember this cycle not for the ultimate result, but for the extraordinary contest that preceded it.
It’s McCain who will be a footnote, not Hillary and Obama.
chopper
from TPM:
no comment.
4tehlulz
HAHA OH WOW
Hillary: Obama Camp Tells Americans One Thing, Foreigners Another
jenniebee
chopper, that’s such a typical Dem running scared at anything that R’s might say they like or don’t like.
chopper
i just think that mccain is savoring this ad. if i were him, i’d have a carbon copy made up to pummel hillary or obama in the general.
jcricket
Kevin Drum also posted about this, saying there isn’t any historical analogue of people using “old” (as in, used in the primary) attacks/ads against people in the general.
Doesn’t mean it couldn’t happen, but that it hasn’t yet, so McCain will likely find plenty of new stuff to attack on.
demimondian
I’d love to have mCCain run on those ads, chopper. I would so make mincemeat of him.
Script:
It’s 3 am. Your children are tucked safely in bed. The phone rings.
“Mr. President, Ahmadenijad has been calling you an bald-headed warmonger again. Do we need to respond?”
“Of course! Bomb-bomb-bomb Iran…Bomb-bomb-bomb Iran…”
John McCain — cause he’s the one with the temper to esterminate humankind.
Darkness
Asti (Spumanti?),
More:
But only(?) 6 actually had cracks. Hence the difference in number.
I copied the paragraphs with commentary about the FAA’s involvement with delaying the inspections and those parts of the article only talked about the planes with problems.
Billy K
Who “won” Texas, again?
ThymeZone
Um, it looked to me like he said he had to go, and left.
I didn’t see a storm, or a huff. Did you?
tBone
I think this calls for a “Bitch, please” from the Obama camp.
I’d also like to note that this comment was simultaneously sexist AND racist, which in my view makes me a sensible centrist.
Dennis - SGMM
The conclusion is obvious: Texas doesn’t count.
p.lukasiak
Agreed. But things are getting so polarized that I see Clinton supporters who were open to the idea a month ago now saying “no way”.
Personally, I think Obama would be perfect to do all sorts of stuff…starting out with negotiating the safe withdrawal of American troops from Iraq — and working with Iraqi factions and regional governments to ensure that Iraq is stable after we leave.
Billy K
Racist
ThymeZone
I see the positive things. His campaign took off, and The Wire finally had its last episode.
That’s change for the better …. Yes We Can!
Heh.
Halteclere
Disagreed. The last Democrat VP that was elected to the office of the President on his own, and who didn’t first come to office due to the death of the sitting President was…?
Pb
Spare me the ticket fantasies. Clinton can’t win, and Obama isn’t running again.
Dork
fucking christ, every single thread…Obama v. Clinton, ad neauseum. A Dem is a Dem.
Hypatia
Exactly. And it’s not just spin, it’s accurate. The Republican nomination process went on as long as it did because the voters were flailing around trying to find somebody decent to give their vote to. The Democratic one is prolonged because we have two good candidates that inspire strong feelings of loyalty in crucial sections of the party. Voter turnout and voter interest are at record levels. That’s a good thing. And unless things get far worse between Obama and Clinton than they have so far, it’ll continue to be a good thing.
tBone
It’s clearly bad for the Democrats.
PeterJ
Halteclere, Martin van Buren, VP to Andrew Jackson.
And that’s just because the assassination attempt on Jackson failed.
myiq2xu
Cue Elvis – “It’s now or never . . .”
chopper
a dem is a dem, ahem, ahem, (i’m sorry, my throat a bit of phlegm) that is, ahem, unless the dem is the famous unity pony!
chopper
throat has, even.
ThymeZone
Oh, Wilbur!
As Mister Ed said to Wilbur in the pilot episode, when Wilbur told the horse he just really couldn’t understand how a horse could talk ….
“Yeah, this thing is bigger than both of us.”
Without doubt, the greatest line in any tv show, ever.
D-Chance.
Peggy Noonan brings on the stupid. Sully approvingly links and calls it a “fantastic column”. Then, he quotes from her:
Can we do a re-write with a more appropriate subject?
myiq2xu
You must be one of those phlegm-phlam artists
PeterJ
Hypatia, it went overboard when Clinton started to tell people that she believed that McCain is fit to be CiC but she wasn’t sure about Obama.
Billy K
Thank you. That is EXACTLY what I thought when I read it.
(For the record, Hillary-lovers, I’m not saying Hillary is like Bush. I’m saying she’s worse than Bush. Like anti-Christ worse.)
myiq2xu
Billy? Roger Ailes called. How would you like your own show?
Dennis - SGMM
I’m just wondering what has become of the country when two doctrinaire politicians with years inside the Washington political machine have to struggle for their respective party’s nominations. The next thing you know, people will start questioning their voting records or their 180 degree changes of rhetoric on important issues or their judgment, their temperament, or their tactics. If that happens then anarchy and chaos are sure to follow. The dreaded specter of accountability will rear its ugly head.
Halteclere
Exactly my point. Not since the 8th President of the US has a Democrat VP been elected to President without the prior President’s death.
For those who say that Obama should just become Clinton’s VP and wait his turn are expecting him to transcend Democrat history. Or become a Republican – Republicans don’t dislike electing past VPs.
Hypatia
I, too, wish she hadn’t said that. I also wish that Obama hadn’t made that condescending reference to taking tea at ambassadors’ houses in respect to HRC’s foreign policy experience when he did. There are people who will say that was fair comment. I don’t think so, and it had an edge to it.
(I also wish, while we’re on the subject, that Obama wouldn’t deploy Republican talking points when speaking about healthcare, to me a far more important matter than whether Clinton or Obama gets the final nod. But I’d vote for him anyway.)
Well, Gore did get elected IMO. But a funny thing happened to him on the way to the White House.
PeterJ
Hypatia, I can’t see how you can compare what you wrote with saying that the opposing candidate is better than a candidate from your own party.
And she didn’t say it once, I think she has now said that three times…
Johnny Pez
Not necessarily. McCain will go down in history as the first white man to lose a presidential election to a woman/black man.
Lying Liars
Can you provide a link to the ‘apeshit’ version please? All I can find is the version where Barack answers 8 questions that he’s already answered dozens of times, then politely excuses himself, as he’s on a tight schedule. He’s running a Campaign you know.
South Park Uncut
Yeah, I didn’t think so. How ’bout that video of Dug Jay throwing a puppy off a cliff though? Very disturbing.
Cyrus
Sounds like projection to me. Mistaken, but totally understandable. I mean, do you think a Republican officeholder or appointee could have handled that without calling the boss to ask for directions, at the very least?
“Sorry, Ollie, did you say I should put black powder in the bomb? Or pepper?”