Open Thread by Michael D.| June 19, 200812:19 pm| 89 CommentsThis post is in: Site MaintenanceFacebookTweetEmailBecause you probably need one.
The Other Steve
Obama announced he’s not taking public funds.
McCain is outraged! OUTRAGED I TELL YOU! OUTRAGED!
McCain thus far has raised half the amount of money Bush raised in 2000/2004 by this point in the campaign.
how much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood?
Ok, real content. TPM and Kevin Drum have both reported on this. The Charlotte News-Observer is reporting that Blackwater is defending itself against a lawsuit brought by widows of three American soldiers who died in Afghanistan by saying the case should be decided by Shari’a law.
They died in a plane crash while being transported by Presidential Airlines, a sister corporation of Blackwater. Shari’a does not permit lawsuits against corporations.
This is the same outfit that says they are not liable under Iraqi law for the actions of their employees.
Jon Swift is back. Well he was back two weeks ago, but I just found out..
Hey, I’ve had about enough of your bullshit, Michael. Listen, if you want to talk like that, you can get your own site. Maybe a little less Mike D and a little more John Cole would be nicer around here.
/obligatory hate-on-Michael rant
OK, so I wasn’t first. There’s some discussion on this at Political Animal. Shari’a doesn’t recognize corporations, apparently, so it would hold individuals responsible. Do you suppose if it went through, the court would have Erik Prince beheaded?
Fxt3, now with extra pedantry
my skillz at clicking the “strike” button suck, evidently
News & Observer
I got your back Mike. One BBQ Goat coming right up!!!
I like cheese
On another note
Dems cave in
Fxt4, for supreme punctuation justice
I like McCain’s approach to the money thing.
Stuck in reverse with no money coming in, he will leverage his OUTRAGINESS into MILLIONS OF OUTRAGEY VOTES against Obama and FOR MCCAIN AND HIS POPULIST ECOMNOMIC POLICIES like tax cuts for bankers and oilmen and stuff like that and CRUSH OBAMA under the weight of the OUTRAGE.
McCain Is Aware of All Internet Fundraising Traditions and will TURN THIS INTO A LANDSLIDE VICTORY FOR GEORGE BUSH as promised.
The masthead just says “The News&Observer” with no spaces around the ampersand. Jeez.
Glenn Greenwald is already getting me bummed out about Obama
I’ll still vote for him, but I’m returning a fund raising letter he sent me with nothing but a print-out of Glenn’s post.
We could do with a little less recognition of corporations as full persons. Maybe we can learn something from Shari’a.
As we all expected, the press has its drawers in a knot over the stunt Obama’s campaign pulled with the plane at the beginning of the month. But they’re pissed because they feel like they’ve been so trustworthy and Obama betrayed that trust.
FISA cave-in looks to be happening — Glenzilla has the details here, along with phone #s to call. Also, there’s a new ActBlue donation thing spearheaded by Glenn and Jane at FDL for a campaign against the worst enablers.
It looks as tho we’re going to lose on this one, maybe as early as tomorrow. Mr. 28% still keeps winning and the Dems still keep spreading their cheeks. Or, I should say, our cheeks,cuz we’re getting screwed badly here. Again.
Call Pelosi, Hoyer & Obama!
These folks might want to send a domesticated ungulate Michael’s way.
Bush grabs a bucket and starts to bail.
My brother in law wrote a software program where you can set the time that you want it to shut you off from internet access, so you can get work done. The only way to override it is to reboot the computer. Brilliant, no?
He wrote this program while attempting to work on his doctoral thesis and feeling the constant lure of the internets and their traditions.
I just love that.
This is actually a fantastic idea. I just found a plea for funds from his campaign in my mail a few days ago. I’ll also be mailing Glenn’s post back to them.
Greenwald doesn’t allow that there could be reasons Obama likes this guy, FISA stuff aside ?
the perfect is the enemy of whatnow ?
I guess Bush’s free lunch got et by Fibbies.
LOL. They’re not getting fucked. They’re getting exactly what they want and worked hard to get.
I’ll do the same. I don’t expect that Obama will change everything about how Washington works, but I do expect him to make incremental steps towards that goal. And supporting blue dog Democrats is an intentional step in the wrong direction.
I have a Civil Union update, here.
A DoJ memo, dated from 2007, but was released last week authorizing social security benefits to children of Civil Unions in Vermont. According to DoJ, when a state law establishes a parent child relationship, federal benefits follow.
Greenwald’s like that sometimes, but he can afford to be–he’s a blogger. My guess is that Obama probably owes him one for doing the super-delegate thing when the matter was still up in the air. Barrow may have endorsed him after the Georgia primary was over, but he did it before Obama had closed out Clinton, and Obama needed every vote. Sucks sometimes, but that’s the way it is.
I just wanted to thank you all for turning me to this wonderful joke
Dennis - SGMM
Wall Street Lobbies to Protect Speculative Oil Trades
Of course, speculation in oil futures has absolutely nothing to do with the rising cost of oil:
Speculation is not solely responsible for rising oil costs. What stinks is that we’re being asked to drill in every square inch of America, environmental and aesthetic concerns be damned, to reduce the cost of a gallon of gas by a few pennies at some future date while these guys are lobbying Congress to maintain their right to add a few pennies to the cost of that same gallon now and into the future.
GA-12 is a conservative district. Simply having a Democrat in there is a win. Not supporting Barrow probably hands that district to the GOP.
Nobody said this was easy or that we’d win every fight. You do what you can do.
You’re right, that’s why I said I’m still voting for Obama and not Captain Ahab McCain. But when he goes astray and does something dumb we still need to call him on it. Who cares what other reasons he has to support this guy, it’s probably just more of the DC self-protection, I’ll scratch your ass, you scratch mine nonsense.
KevinD agreed. Accountability is a path, not a destination. We will have to work hard to make sure that a Democratic majority doesn’t become as corrupt as the Republican majority.
I think a Democratic Majority will have structural advantages to not being as corrupt as the Republican Majority, but you can’t establish accountability with trust. You establish accountability with controls.
the open thread is an internet tradition.
Probably right, Brian. Being an old guy, I’m quite acquainted with the phenomenon “buyer’s remorse” with regard to political candidates. I’ve never thought that Obama was a perfect candidate, just that he’s the best thing that’s come into the political sphere for quite some time.
He’ll make mistakes, and he’ll be vilified for not achieving a quick end to the Iraq war and so on, but I’ll take my chances with the Constitutional scholar/community organizer over the doddering, rageaholic, misogynistic war-monger any day.
Trust, but verify
Dennis - SGMM
I was disappointed when I first read about Obama’s endorsement and posted something on a thread downstairs. After re-reading the post, particularly the part about how the Blue Dog had narrowly beaten Republican opponents for the seat, I realized that a progressive probably wouldn’t stand a chance in that district. Sucks for sure but maybe Obama can get the guy to pay off his chit when he needs it.
I’m going to leave a comment Obama’s web site asking him not to join the caving on the telco immunity compromise. I can’t vote and I can’t dangle donations before him, but I can nag from afar.
On the movie front, I just recently saw “Charlie Wilson’s War” and enjoyed it. It’s not that it’s great, just informative and entertaining, in a totally sad kind of way.
I knew some of the story of our funding of the secret war to help the mujahadeen in Afghanistan, but not all of it.
Interesting stuff, in that our failure to continue helping in Afghanistan once they beat the Russians (the only time that every happened) help set the stage for what was to come in 2001.
As I said, sad.
Internet traditions, motherfucker! Are you aware of them?!
Dems capitulate? Surprise.
Fixed to acknowledge reality.
True, but that only works if the Democrat gets re-elected. Barrow won by less than 1% as an incumbent last election. I don’t think there’s enough headway in that district for housekeeping.
The comparison with Edwards/Wynn is dumb. MD-04 is a very blue district. There was little risk at losing the seat with a new candidate – and that’s where you work hardest to clean house.
Pick your battles, guys.
There’s a picture on CNN right now of Obama and McCain together, and oh boy, does McCain look bad in that. About mid 80s I’d say. It also shows the left side of his face, which you never see in McCain’s official pictures.
At first I was going to post something urging support for Dennis Kucinich’s 35 Articles of Impeachment, Rep. Conyers, and BJer’s to contact their representatives, see where they stand, and vote in favor.
But instead, I strongly urge all BJer’s to call and demand that The National Economic Security and Reformation Act immediately be implemented. NOW!
Something ate my link:
McCain team: Obama campaign lying about public financing talks
yeah, cause he’s done everything he can to stick with public funds, right?
I didn’t know that, but I can’t say I’m surprised. Greenwald needs to lay off on this one.
With the majorities we have, and are fixing to have come November, in Congress, we can start affording to be a bit pickier. If he’s got an abysmal voting record, why shore up Republican-Lite? Let the GOP have the district, act like total assholes, and lose it again in a couple of years once they’re done embarrassing themselves.
We can has volunteer to put a page up for the “internet traditions” meme at Wikipedia?
My feelings exactly, why give a guy the benefit of being in the majority party if he’s just going to vote with the other side everytime.
Also, I think we’re assuming too much about these “red” districts, what about that guy who just won Hastert’s old seat, specifically blasting the gutting of FISA and calling for us to get out of Iraq completely. EVERYONE is sick of this crap, red and blue. They’re looking for anyone who’ll stop it.
That’s it. I’m voting Republican .
The point is that he doesn’t vote with the other side every time. He votes with us most of the time, and he votes for Nancy Pelosi to be Speaker. Don’t underestimate the importance of that. Even getting him half the time is more than we’d get from a Republican in that seat.
I’d take a dozen Blue Dog Dems for 60 Senate Dems who would send Lieberman to go play in traffic.
I realize that’s not how elections work, exactly, but a girl can dream about shady back-room Congressional negotiations, right?
i’ll send him a note about this FISA thing, and i’ll send my Rep a note one too. but i’m gonna go ahead and trust Obama on this radio spot; he seems like he’s got a good handle on this whole politics thing.
Yeah. At the very least he’ll shore up the majority rolls and keep the procedural bullshit on our side. He’ll be a thorn on a number of issues, but this guy is at best a pawn, not a knight.
Seriously, we shouldn’t be worrying too much about this stuff. (accountability = good, over-reacting = not good.) Obama has done a good job backing down people like Lieberman and doing a good job of not engaging in much reciprocity that I can see. If this looks to you like enabling a pro-war dem and trading support, it’s probably worth digging a little deeper since that seems rather out of the norm.
In fact, the same thing applies to Lieberman — he’s actually more Dem the Repub, and it’ll worth remembering that come next January. (Also I’ll still support stripping him of his committee chair, since Homeland Security is just too important to be in the hands of someone who’s not a Dem, particularly after his McCain shenanigans.)
But, that said, Incertus nails it here.
The Other Steve
Look, I think it’s obvious Blackwater wasn’t at fault. After all Eric Prince wasn’t flying the plane, it was some pilot guy.
It’s the pilot’s fault that the plane crashed, and you would be a glue sniffing lunatic to claim otherwise.
So therefore it is the pilot who should be sued, not the company who simply provided the plane.
This has nothing to do with Sharia law.
Just Some Fuckhead
Half of a Democrat is better than all of a Republican.
I think it’s a brilliant PR move on Blackwater’s part. /snark
Its an unfortunate move on Obama’s part, but I’m thinking he’s just backing the person most likely to win. I understand what Zifnab is saying, but it would be good to have a Democrat win that seat and have him in Obama’s pocket. This Blue Dog will owe him. So if he was willing to be on his knees for Mr. 28%, he’d probably bend over for Obama and more things can be accomplished. This other Democratic candidate is more progressive, but it seems like she has a snowball’s chances in south Florida of winning. So it seems like the choice was help a Blue Dog win, have him owe you and preserve your majority or help someone more progressive who will more likely lose? It seems Obama took the practical way.
But I have no doubt that Obama will vote against telecom immunity. He did it already, no reason for him not to do it again.
Another side of this nomination could be a reconciliatory move towards the Democratic establishment who still resent Obama’s winning. Even Clinton standing by his side hasn’t made some of her more rabid and entrenched supporters shut up. (Slap in the face anyone?) Like someone mentioned before, they’re scared of losing power and will do all sorts of things, I think even damage Obama for November, out of their anger. These types of compromise gestures might help soothe some ruffled feathers until we can completely put their ilk out of commission.
Yes, change will happen, but it has to be in steps. I know I’d like things to be sweeping and faster but things have to go slowly, but surely, in the right direction. Otherwise there will be so much resistance and Obama will have to fight the Republicans as well as half of the Democratic party.
Are you on Facebook? Lucky you, you can now tell everyone that you are aware of internet traditions!!
Dennis - SGMM
I’ll entertain the idea of ideologically purging the Democratic Party the day after a Democratic president:
Brings the troops home from Iraq
Presides over the enactment of Universal Health Care
Puts us on a realistic path to energy self-sufficiency
Appoints two justices to the Supreme Court
Signs the repeal of the Bush tax cuts
Let’s not forget that the last political party that purged itself ideologically isn’t looking so good right now.
Incertus, love how you’ve incorporated the New Meme on your site.
Just doing my part, Kevin. :-)
I just want to reiterate that I’m still voting for Obama, and the Democratic Party.
I’m not committing seppuku here over this. I just believe we need to make a stand on some of the more important issues here. Just saying
Just Some Fuckhead
That reminds me I need to send my monthly donation to Club For Growth.
I have no problem with them being under Afghan law because the incident happened in Afghanistan as long as they are also to be tried under Iraqi law for shooting 17 civilians in that traffic circle.
Sees logical to me.
Man, I don’t even care about ideology. I’d just be happy with the return of Rule-of-Law and some basic competence
As Rumsfeld might say, “”As you know, you have to go to Congress with the Democrats you have, not the Democrats you want.”
Obama is not yet marching with a slew of new Democratic congresspersons committed to change, and it is more up to the Senate and House leadership to line up new Congressional recruits than it is up to Obama. And more to the point, it is up to the voters in their districts to blast deadwood incumbents out of their safe districts and elect a new crew if they want.
Greenwald’s little rant is a grandstanding waste of time because it has absolutely nothing to do with political reality. Even ideological purity tests work better if somebody owes you.
It’s worse than that. The Sun Queen votaries are not just a gaggle of angry bloggers, but also comprise some of Senator Clinton’s most influential donors. I am surprised that this little news item has not garnered more attention (Clinton Invites Donors To Obama Meeting):
These people appear still to be more interested in protecting Senator Clinton’s legacy than in serving the larger interests of the Democratic Party and its presumptive nominee, Obama. Worse, they hide behind a cover of charges of sexism, but clearly care about only one woman, Hillary Clinton, than other women who might become elected to Congress or choose to become part of Obama’s cabinet. They also clearly feel that they can dictate terms to Obama, and refuse to accept his leadership or authority.
Dennis - SGMM
Amen. Even those two things – even in massive amounts – will take a while to have an effect. I’m sixty and I can’t remember an administration so thoroughly fucking up every aspect of the nation.
Maybe. As KevinD says, it’s important that Obama’s supporters hold him accountable for his choices. My vote for him isn’t in doubt, but that’s all the more reason for me to let his campaign know when I don’t like what they’re doing.
Dennis - SGMM
Has calling any and every thing that Obama does “a slap in the face to Clinton” become an Internet Tradition yet?
Joined. Thank you.
That is the money quote in this blatherfest about Obama and Barrow. For sure. Politics is a complex and sticky business, deals are made, trades arranged, commitments have to be kept. It’s an art, not a science, and it’s about building and maintaining coalitions.
When your choice is between McCain and Obama, wasting time flapping your oral cavity over this endorsement is beyond dumb, it’s Republican dumb.
You know, I don’t really care about this Barrow guy or the rest of the BlueDog Congresscritters, or ideological purity of any kind. The thing that really matters is the leadership, and that includes Obama now. Do they really stand for anything? Do they just care about increasing their power and majorities? All I’m saying is, if you want my money and support, you gotta give me more then just platitudes.
Does that make me an Elitist?
An awful lot of Brits in that group…
Bush probably wont be going on any European vacations after he’s out of office.
Add one Canadian to the list.
This reminds me of the California recall election where the voters chose Governor Arnold because he promised to clean house, but then later voted for practically every damned Democratic and GOP incumbent.
If you notice, while Obama is promising a change to the way that Washington does business, the Democratic Party leadership is humming the tune, but not singing out loud and clear.
Nobody is giving you platitudes. But if you don’t find and support people from the ground up who reflect something better, then you are just shooting yourself in the foot if you hold back on supporting Obama.
It is a bit of a challenge and a compromise to try get the present bunch in Congress to go along with the tide of the new, but it is self-defeating to impose ideological purity if it ends up helping the GOP more than it gets you what you want.
Dennis - SGMM
Don’t know if you’re from California but, the politicians who draw up the districts here have spent years drawing up safe districts for themselves. It’s the only instance where the two parties co-operate. That’s why the legislature here is such a freakshow and why we send wingnuts like B-1 Bob Dornan, Jerry Lewis, and Dana Rohrbacher to Congress. The candidates have to out-fringe each other to be elected because, depending on the district, an R or a D is guaranteed the win so it’s just a matter of moving farther out than your competition.
Yeah! Because he would never stand behind one of the pushes of Bush policy or anything.
Sorry, I wasn’t referring to you with that statement. I meant that Obama has to give me(us) something substantial other then just good talk. For the rest of what you said, you’re right, I agree. Like I said before, I’ll vote Democratic no matter what. I’m not some mad Clintonian threating to vote for McCain if I don’t get what I want.
I just expect them to stand for something, once in a while.
Speaking of that, there’s a new post on the D-boys latest capitulation, let’s go see…
I’m in Southern California. You’re right that the politicians have done everything they can to draw up safe districts, but the voters, with the help of a duplicitous PR campaign, rejected an imperfect but reasonable plan for redistricting offered by the governor. And I’ve also seen that lots of folks hate every incumbent except their own, resulting in a sad, but typical stalemate.
Sometimes people want change, as long as nothing really changes.
I’m glad someone cares! *sniff*