Apparently you can not fool all of the people some of the time, as the most amazing poll ever has been released by ARG (via Atrios), in which no one responded that the economy is getting better:
Among Republicans, 46% approve of the way Bush is handling the economy and 48% disapprove. Among Democrats, 97% disapprove of the way Bush is handling the economy and 2% approve. Among independents, 8% approve and 87% disapprove of the way Bush is handling the economy.
No Americans say that the national economy is getting better, 13% say it is staying the same, and 82% say the national economy is getting worse.
As a comparison, polls have shown that 28-30% of the public think Bush has done a good job, a third of the country believes in ghosts, and 56% of the public believes in UFO’s.
I guess there are some hard limits to what people are willing to believe.
Is it still unpatriotic to call this a recession?
Actually, anyone who is a Christian believes in ghosts. A lot more than 30%, I would think.
Clearly this poll is good news for John McCain.
Echo without Bunnies or Men
Not surprising at all. 46% of the republicans think Bush has done a good job with the economy, that’s just fucking absurd. Are they dense, stupid, insane, unwilling to admit their Dear Leader is an incompetent moron, just what the fucking hell is their problem?
It’s the lockstep mindset; they need a figure to rally behind, to believe in, some daddy totem to tell them, it’s ok, I am in charge, you will be fine.
46% of Republicans approve of Bush’s handling of the economy?
That’s either an awful lot of rich people or an awful lot of cognitive dissonance.
Actually, the ARG poll puts W’s approval rating at a rock solid 19%.
Breaking news: A Plurality of Registered Republicans Are Stupid
By approve of Bush’s handling of the economy, I’m sure they mean “keep taxes low”.
That’s the only thing I can think of. Even “rich” people recognize that the economy is screwed now, that’s what the last two weeks have been.
OT? The wingnuts have blamed every f-up by Bush or the Bush administration on Clinton for the past 8 years, regardless of reality.
But Larison at http://www.amconmag.com takes it to the illogical end, blaming Clinton for the actual EXISTENCE of Bush: “If there is one last thing for which I blame Clinton, it is how easy he made it to despise him and his backers and how he helped pave the way for the appalling joke of a President we currently have.”
A question for those in the know:
The latest meme running around conservative circles is that back in 2005, the Republicans were poised to pass the Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005, which would have regulated Fannie and Freddie and stopped this whole mess in its tracks. The 2005 bill died in committee, though, when the Democrats voted against it on party lines and the Republicans decided they would never get it through the Senate. Now, the factual description of what happened to the bill seems accurate, but I assume the characterization that it would have regulated Fannie and Freddie and stopped the crisis is as full of shit as last week’s assertion that the entire mess can be blamed on the Community Reinvestment Act. My guess is that this is a bill that would have killed Fannie and Freddie entirely, given the Republicans’ long-standing antipathy toward those entities and their goal of facilitating loans for low-income borrowers. However, I am not knowledgable on the 2005 bill, so I’m just assuming. Anybody know the facts on this bill?
Gold Star for Robot Boy
No, the correct quote is, “You can fool all people some of the time and some people all the time, but you cannot fool all people all the time.”
What is truly stunning is the degree to which Republicans still approve of Bush’s handling of the economy. It would have been interesting to have surveyed those who approved with information about their own personal economic circumstances (lost jobs, exposure to bad mortgages, etc).
Equally troubling is some of the anecdotal stuff I see which suggests that even though people are unhappy with Bush, they persist in the delusion that Republicans are better at handling the economy than Democrats and worse, a chunk of them believe that McCain and Palin will do better with the economy than Obama/Biden.
By the way, a hint of an explanation here is that “financial markets” is an abstract, meaningless term for most people. Even discussion about a $700 billion bailout is meaningless, because a lot of people just don’t see that this is a burden that they will have to absorb personally.
But I often hear people say, “I don’t really care what the government does. It doesn’t affect me. I just don’t want them to raise my taxes.” Taxes are the most palpably real thing to these types, and “my taxes” equals “my money.”
McCain could say that he would sign an authorization allowing corporations to legally reduce everyone’s wages to $8 an hour, and there would be some people who would say, “OK, as long as you don’t raise my taxes.”
There are also people who believe that toughness equals competence. These people cheer when McCain insists that he would fire, uh, force the resignation of the chairman of the S.E.C., without offering the slightest argument for why this would mean a damn thing.
BTW, I wanted to throw a shoe at my TV screen watching McCain talk about how much he knew about the economy by serving on the Commerce committee, but was still somehow not at all responsible for the current financial mess. Typically the “60 Minutes” correspondent failed to ask any follow-up questions that would force McCain to explain this obvious contradiction.
apparently not voting for W in the first place, was not an option.
Hee hee! Hank Paulson’s telling Congress not to waste time before giving him his $700 billion in unmarked bills at his secret drop point for “unnecessary additions.”
Yeah. I don’t think you f***ers who caused this mess need to lecture anyone on what addition to your 3 page “GIMME THE F***ING MONEY” note are and aren’t “necessary”.
But… but… the fundamentals of our economy are strong!
I am a little surprised. I’m sure there has to be at least some subset of the populations – repo men, bankruptcy lawyers, undertakers for US servicemen – someone who thinks this economy has been on the ups.
That said, it’s really only a matter of time before we start hearing the Orwellian Doublespeak machine start ramping up. Those Republicans who support the President are probably convinced that Social Security and Medicare are what’s dragging down our economy. We’ve already been pitched some rather ridiculous bullshit about how deregulation can save the banking industry, and I know a fair number of people who buy it. Once the wingnut chorus breaks out into a stirring rendition of “The economy is great, and the Democrats are ruining it!” I’m sure that poll will shift.
Well you do have to admit – there’s more evidence for the existence of UFOs than there is that the economy is improving…
Well, one ghost. And it’s a Holy Ghost. And few people without a doctorate in Theology really understands the Trinity, even if they believe it’s true. So you don’t actually have to believe in “ghosts” to be a Christian – you just have to say that you believe in a single ghost, and that single ghost is actually God, somehow. Really.
Seriously. Fuck him.
Clinton deserves a lot of flack for the shit he pulled in the 90s. His people deserve some scorn for the current banking crisis we’re going through now – though he has to share it with Reagan, Bush the Elder, and Bush the Lesser. But if Larison is going to blame Clinton Derangement Syndrome on CLINTON instead of on the useless fools who suffered from it and promptly pushed the useless least scion of the House of Bush onto the people of this country, he can go Cheney himself with a rusty pipe. And the horse he rode in on.
The Moar You Know
My wife made me punch her in the face, officer.
It’s more that not voting for W in the first place didn’t change the outcome. So, um, since the election was fixed, as we now know it was, blaming Clinton for Bush’s election is, as Spock would say, illogical.
I am not familiar with this particular bill, but I am familiar enough with the subprime mess to know that Fannie and Freddie did not precipitate the crisis. In fact, the worst lending practices of Fannie and Freddie simply what was going on with private and international lenders.
However, conservative blogs are trying to re-write history to show that Fannie and Freddie were the sole mechanism of the current financial crisis, and also that John McCain (he was a POW, you know) was the sole maverick who predicted the coming economic crisis.
But this kind of crap has worked before. Just as there are people who believed that Iraq had WMDs, there are people who believe that Fannie and Freddie were the sole authors of the subprime mess.
For once, I agree. The world would be a very different place if Bubba had kept his fly zipped. Perhaps it shouldn’t have mattered, but it did, and he’s smart enough to know it.
The Moar You Know
Extreme times call for extreme solutions. This 46% is obviously immune to common sense, decency, facts or rational argument. Can we put them on barges, float them out into the Pacific, and then sink the barges?
I know it’s not cool to even think of such a thing, but damn, there is only so much I can take.
Yes, and the 50% or whatever it is of Americans who initially supported the Iraq war and now want out, it’s not their fault or bad judgment that they were for it before they were agin’ it. They couldn’t be against it at the start, because the DFH’s were already against it. And it’s physically impossible to agree with a DFH. Heads could explode.
Logic is unAmerican.
Well yes. Let’s not forget that the Republican financial policies started to bear their rotting, maggot-infested fruit right around the time that the Dems took back Congress. Therefore, to the wingnut mind, everything was peachy-keen and squeaky-clean while Bush was in charge. But as soon as those terrible Dems gained a bit of power, why lookie there — suddenly everything is falling to rat-shit!
Of course, anybody with a brain realizes that this financial meltdown did not happen overnight, and certainly had its origins farther back than 2006. But, just because of the timing of when everything started to crumble, there are many who will blame the Dems. They are convinced that if the Republicans had been allowed to completely run the show, with no opposition and no “obstruction”, then none of this mess would have happened, everybody would have a job and a roof over their heads, and America would be entering a new golden age.
That’s why part of me feels really bad for Obama. If he loses, we’re fucked. If he wins, he’s fucked, because he’ll be expected to turn things around on a dime, and there’s no way he’ll be able to get that accomplished fast enough to suit everybody.
Obama to Nation: “Fuck this shit, I’m outta here”
clearly. otherwise, how could McCain have Won The Week ?
Here is your answer
don’t you think the oceans are polluted enough already?
Shoot ’em into the sun instead.
56% of the public believes in UFO’s
On a serious note, are we really surprised that people hold contradictory beliefs colored by partisanship? I dunno, I just can’t get worked up by the fact that there’s a bunch of conservatives who believe a ridiculous thing. If the economy were going swimmingly at present, do we doubt that a decent chunk of liberals would not do the same? It’s human nature.
The Grand Panjandrum
Donald Trump endorsed John McCain on the Larry King Live show the other night. Confirmation that Donald Trump should be very happy he was born rich. He might be as fucking stupid as his hair looks.
In the last thread John said he is confused. No worries John even very smart people who understand these isssues aren’t completely sure of what all is involved in this meltdown. I am going to a talk over in the Economics department tomorrow. It will supposedly give me the mojo, wisdom and The Force when trying to understand the shitpile.
There is, in fact, good precedent for this measure. During the Terror phase of the French Revolution, recalcitrants were tied up on barges which were then towed to the middle of rivers and then cannons were used to sink the barges. They were called “Republican baptisms”, which had one meaning for them, but which would, I imagine, have quite another for us. When I first read about this I thought it was pretty extreme, but today I’m beginning to see the appeal.
The Moar You Know
There is not one word of this idea that I don’t completely love.
Even better, we could charge tickets to watch and for those who can pay, they get six shots to sink a barge and a prize if they win.
In America class warfare, the rich sink you !
Lie baby, lie!
All this proves is that 82% of the American people are on drugs. Of course the economy is improving. Everyone knows that.
The worst mortgage default and foreclosure problems are not in the GSE sponsored loans, but with the subprime and Alt-A pools. Which the proposed legislation in 2005 had nothing to do with. See calculatedrisk on the blogroll for details.
Anyone who is enthusiastically peddling this horseshit either knows about as much about the US housing market as Chinese peasants in Xinjiang*, or is a lying sack of crap who should be beaten with a lead pipe until they no longer pose a threat to humanity.
*Not intended as an insult to peasants in Xinjiang, at least some of whom probably know more about the US housing market than the GOP sock puppets who are spreading this talking point du jour.