Walk away.
Just let the whole shitpile collapse. It is not your fault. And honestly, I doubt doing anything will matter, anyway.
The House Republicans came out, and their play is clear:
“We will not use taxpayer money to bail out Wall Street. We want to protect the taxpayers.”
In other words, they do not give a shit. Walk away.
Just walk away.
I should probably add one brief bit of appreciation for the House Republicans. They took Paulson’s ridiculous proposal, a three page “plan” that we give an unelected guy 700 billion dollars and then tell us to go to hell while he does whatever he wants, and came up with something worse for the taxpayers (the insurance nonsense and capital gains garabage) while branding it as protecting the taxpayers. You have to appreciate that, at some level.
KXB
I’ve been thinking along the same lines. Why should Obama tie his hands to a policy that will inhibit him from pursuing his own policies? Granted, I never expected, and did not want, everything that Obama wants to get through. But to agree to a $700 billion plan with a month to go before the election seems to shoot oneself in the foot.
mynameishusseintoo
they want to protect the taxpayers like they have been doing for the past 8 years.
They are a bunch of dumbasses….including Mr. POW,
Comrade Zifnab
Why couldn’t they have fucked up this huge on the Iraq War run up? It would have saved everyone a lot of trouble.
Arbeitsleiter Paul L.
The democrats control the house and there is no filibuster in the house. How are the Rethugs blocking the vote?
cyd
I don’t know, maybe they feel some kind of responsibility to prevent the economy from tanking?
Comrade EdTheRed
http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/152882
Jeff
Sadly No summed it up perfectly
Billy K
Holy crap – these ARE weird times. I agree with Congressional Republicans.
Somebody buy me a drink…
ElBlot
Say it again! Say it louder!! Walk away!! Hell – run away!!
Rick Taylor
I agree on all points. They were the responsible adults, they did their best. If the administration can’t even get the cooperation of their own party, that’s that.
Scott H
I am listening to money analysts and the “credit crunch” is starting to sound like banks are finally onto a thing called due diligence.
Still, I am stupid, and I am patiently waiting for Paulson or someone to come out with the 411 on this 911.
jake
If you aren’t doing anything else this weekend, there’s a good chance there will be a protest of some sort in your neck of the woods.
comrade scott
Yeah, I hear ya. I need to take a long hot shower.
On Marketplace this morning, a guy was explaining the outlines of what he understood the House Rethug’s plan to be. Essentially, it’s a bottom up plan designed to identify the actual dead mortages in the system, segregate them somehow and apply funding “help” in that area. I *think* that’s what the guy said, I’m doing this from memory. He said that it was a bottom up approach.
And that Wall Street didn’t like it because it wouldn’t act fast enough.
Right. And the funding wouldn’t trickle up to them.
So, even tho the House Repups are still a bunch of batshit, head-trauma crazy wingnuts, perhaps the koolaid supply has diminished just enough for them to get a glimpse of what’s best for the country.
Either that or they fully realize their constituents will toss em out on their asses in 6 weeks and barring that, the Club For Growth nutzos will primary em out of existence in 2010.
Kirk
Arbeitsleiter Paul L., the answer can be found in a simple two-word phrase.
Blue Dogs.
Had at least some of the Republicans supported the plan – not one or two, but enough to make a blue dog walkout immaterial – it wouldn’t have happened.
But they did, and that let the Blue Dogs waffle, and that collapsed the support.
Dennis - SGMM
Waist deep in the Big Muddy
And the big fool says to push on.
comrade scott
And another thing:
It is a strange day when House Repups are actually discussing doing something for working class ‘Murkins in terms of any proposed bailout whereas the so-called friends of the working class, yunno, feckless Democrats, are the ones working their way toward some top-down, save-Wall Street bailout.
Dogs sleeping with cats. The world’s turned upside down. Next thing you know, somebody will tell me a black man has been elected President of the USofA.
burnspbesq
I am listening to money analysts and the “credit crunch” is starting to sound like banks are finally onto a thing called due diligence.
Heck yeah. If you can securitize whatever you originate, you don’t give the first flying fuck whether the borrower can repay. On the other hand, if you can’t securitize it – if it’s going to stay on your books – you suddenly have a very real incentive to make sure that that loan is going to perform.
Mike G
Any bailout deal, if there has to be one, has to close the tax loophole whereby hedge fund kingpins classify their massive haul from investing other people’s money as ‘capital gains’ and pay only 15% tax.
Foxhunter
You know what they say Paul…when your political opponent is on fire, you don’t throw gas on them, you watch. Does that make them filty? No, it makes them savvy. Why do you think McSame hasn’t staked a position on this bailout?
Because he doesn’t
Gus
The Dems will fuck it up somehow. It’s how they roll.
Joshua Norton
You’re indignation would be a little more credible if that wasn’t the EXACT same thing the repiggies are trying to do to the Dems.
Martin
Congressional republicans have it all wrong, though.
The $700B isn’t a handout – it’s an investment. Really, it’s quite similar to when we bailed out Mexico, which immediately turned things around for them and they paid us right back.
The $700B will be used to buy around $700B worth of actually valuable stuff.
Now, as Paulson wrote the deal, it’s unworkable, but as the Dems have presented it, it’s pretty good because. Nobody on Wall Street gets rich on this, really – it just keeps companies from going under. Here’s my writeup from last night.
James F. Elliott
I love the House Republicans. Their ideology is in the midst of a catastrophic demonstration of its inefficacy, and what do they do? Double down on the orthodoxy.
You can’t make that shit up.
Democrats
Thanks, Comrade John. We were just waiting for you to weigh in before we made a final decision.
JR
If I see my neighbor’s kid playing in the street with a car driven by a blind old lady barreling down on him, and I have time to pick him up and move him out of danger, it’s “not my fault” if he gets killed. But my fault or not, I’ll still look like a piece of shit with feet.
When someone’s drowning and you have a rope to throw, you throw the fucking rope. Even if you throw like a girl.
comrade scott
Fucking duh. Pelosi made it clear from the gitgo that this would have to be a bipartisan bill, and that’s bipartisan in the Dem sense (she wanted at least 100 Repup votes), not the Repup sense (which is “cave into us on everything and we don’t really give a shit how many of you vote with us”). Since she wasn’t going to get anything close to 100 Repup votes, no bill.
Since any such bill wouldn’t be seen as bipartisan and she’s no fool, she doesn’t want to be labeled with the “Bush-Pelosi Wall Street Bail Out Package”.
So, the way the Dems frame this back is to say “we tried and we tried to craft a bipartisan bill but the Repups didn’t want to play ball”.
Then they walk away. Okay, it’s a standard bass-ackwards, weaselly way Pelosi does things but hey, if the end result is the Dems walking away, that’s okay.
Martin
They aren’t blocking it, but shit this big needs to be agreed upon broadly. It’s just not something you can jam through. Everyone needs to own this.
Dennis - SGMM
Not that the House Republicans are trying in any way to distance themselves from the administration that stood idly by while this mess built up momentum. Not that they acted as cheerleaders for every idiotic move that Bushco conjured up until there were real consequences.
A confederacy of bullies and cowards.
Joshua Norton
I’ve got the perfect solution. Sell Alaska back to Russia for $700 billion. Win, win.
ronathan richardson
It’s important to remember that the house is full of insane jackasses who don’t give a shit if their bills ever have a chance of being signed into law, as long as they make some stubborn principled statement.
NonyNony
Damn skippy. This is all about disarming the bailout as a club that Republicans can use to beat Democrats with. Republicans want to have their cake and eat it too – they want someone else to be the adult and clean up the mess but they want to be able to kick and scream and whine and blame the Democrats for stopping the party. Which, come to think of it, is what fucking happened in ’92 when Clinton came to power and started to clean up the mess that Reagan and Bush the Elder left behind.
Meanwhile, I hope the idiots on Wall Street see exactly what the government they bought for the last 30 years has got them. When you give a bunch of crazy fuckers a gun and pay them to be crazy, don’t be surprised when the gun gets pointed at your head. The political party that has always been a “friend of business” is now ready to let it all burn if it means that they can blame the conflagration on a Democrat. Awesome. I’ll bet they’d loose the nukes on Wall Street themselves if they could.
I doubt they’ll learn their lessons.
comrade scott
Only if they promise to make sure Caribou Barbie and her clan are part of the sale and we don’t give them dual citizenship.
South of I-10
They have no choice but to walk away. The Republicans know they created the problem, but want to hang it on someone else and the whole sitation has devolved into some kind of Roveian nightmare. I am inches away from becoming a tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theorist – is it real or was is it devised to win an election? The whole thing just pisses me off. I better start drinking now if I am going to make it through the debate.
The Bag of Health and Politics
The Republican proposal would eliminate the Capital Gains Tax for two years–in short, it’d make it so hedge fund managers have to pay 0% tax on their millions. Far from putting Main Street first, it’s basically welfare for CEOs. Get that straight. Just because the Republicans are opposing the bailout doesn’t mean they’re supporting what you’d like to see. They’ve come up with a plan that is even worse than the Bush plan.
dslak
Anybody know where to watch the debate tonight online?
Mike in MI
The case for a rescue bailout needs to be better explained to the public. The pols are afraid to do shit because the bailout is wildly unpopular with the voters. But when economists from Krugman to the AEI say “something” must be done, chances are pretty good that Congress would regret doing nothing.
It has to be bipartisan so neither side can exploit the other on this issue. The U.S economy is not a political football.
Not sure how this gets resolved.
The Moar You Know
Paul L:
Your party shits the bed, we clean it up. Then you blame us for shitting the bed.
Not this time. Your boys shit the bed big on this one, you can fucking lie in it for as long as you like until you feel like cleaning it up.
You must be bored today. No black strippers around for you to rape?
flounder
Perhaps this would get the point across:
Comrade Zifnab
Russia called. They say no deal. Also, whatever the Russian words are for “Fuck you”.
Foxhunter
Me thinks they are beginning to see.
Comrade Cris Ivanov
supporting link added
Jeff
Isn’t the main reason for the bailout, the “insurance” the banks took out and traded in the form of Credit Default Swaps in the first place?
Cain
I think we need to talk about the new Knight Rider tv show and how badly it sucks. It was an epic fail. One by one, they are taking my childhood away. It wasn’t enough to distract me from the financial melt down.
It still is better than McCain’s campaign.
cain
flounder
Sorry, I meant this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TL4XZdyo3g
w vincentz
This is classic “trickle down”. See the humongous-fuckin’ debt-for-asshole-decisions “trickle down” onto the idiots that allow it to happen.
It’s just like pissing down your leg after you’ve consumed eight-teen beers and you’re too drunk to unzip you pants.
Trickle down. Piss on you.
As an aside, McUnable’s campaign has already released ads stating that he won the debate tonight. I guess Sarah has a really good crystal ball or she has the gift of prophecy.
Foxhunter
Good catch, TMYK.
JL
dslak, Most of the news sites will carry it but try CSPAN first.
Foxhunter
Methinks they are beginning to see.
John
If you find yourself agreeing with House Republicans, the first step you should take is to try to go over the subject again and see what mistaken you’ve made. House Republicans are always wrong.
dslak
Thanks, JL. Hopefully they haven’t taken up the growing practice of blocking international IP addresses . . .
Comrade Stuck
At least the dems and WH want to wear a Condom when they fuck the taxpayer. The House wingnuts are proposing to do them handcuffed and bareback.
Comrade Cris Ivanov
Yes.
Sarah Palin
I agree. Really, the walking away of the thing is key, it shows the who are caring about the walking under the general umbrella of the awayness–oh, and it’s about the job creation too with the health care reform.
Comrade Va Highlander
A word from Komrade Krugman – emphasis mine:
Apologies if this has already been posted.
Laura W
Well, down here in NC underneath my turkey roasting tin foil pan hat, I still say it was devised to postpone an election.
If you started drinking at 2:30, I’ve got a lot of catching up to do. I was ready at noon.
(Apologies if this is a double post, etc etc.)
Comrade NonyNony
Heh. Thanks for the link Foxhunter. That is six shades of awesome. I wonder how many “rock ribbed” banker and finance types are gazing on in horror at what they have wrought.
Of course, they won’t take the blame on themselves. They won’t begin to realize that the constant drumbeat for more deregulation and less oversight has turned the GOP into little more than a Cargo Cult where matters of economics are concerned. But for the moment, I can just look on and smile and wonder if perhaps there are bankers all across the country who are suddenly waking up to what “faith-based” economics has gotten them.
SamFromUtah
It’s important to remember that the house is full of insane jackasses who don’t give a shit if their bills ever have a chance of being signed into law, as long as they make some stubborn principled statement.
I remember thinking, around the time that Freedom Fries and the “under God” part of the Pledge were the issues du jour, that the House had become a completely meaningless circus whose only function was to make people believe there was still a democracy in place.
Since 2006, I’ve amended that thought – now I think it’s that plus a forum for Democrats to show how subservient they are. It would be nice if they’re actually finally sacking up a bit.
gopher2b
John,
I totally disagree. They need to do what you do to someone in a trial when they object to your question: you punish them by upping the ante.
The Dems ought to pass the bill that was basically agreed to yesterday and add crazy bullshit that Main Street people will love. For instance, raise the taxes on anyone making more than 10 million per year to 75%. Tell them that everyday they delay this over bullshit they will something else. Another one, if you die and leave an estate of $25 million dollar, the government takes 75%.
Then when Bush vetoes it, they can say, we gave them everything they wanted and all we wanted to do was tax people who make over $10 million a year, and leave their worthless kids $25 million estates help to pay for it (it doesn’t matter that the math doesn’t come close)
D. Mason
I like that idea, infact I had similar thoughts about taxing capital gains at 90% unless it was re-invested in areas that create American jobs. I think any bailout should be nixed unless it makes wall-street squeal.
gopher2b
Speaking of math-I hope everyone understands why the Republican plan is so bad. Its not just that its made up bullshit 5 weeks before a campaign. It actually makes the problem worse.
The problem: financial and lending institutions do not have enough cash. As MSBs drop, and they have to pay out on CDSs, they need to raise more cash. The only way to get more cash is by selling MSBs. Everyone is trying to do so that drives the price down, which means the MSBs they hold are worth less (which means they need to raise more cash becaues they balance sheets are fucked) and so on and so forth.
The republicans solution is to (1) demand the banks USE CASH to buy insurance from the U.S. government (which obviously leaves them with less cash), and (2) sell off assets to avoid capital gains taxes. As someone pointed out, the MSB are already worth less than they were when the institutions bought them so they don’t owe CG taxes anyway. And, worse, it’s probably not a great idea to have all the banks flood the market with their only remaining good assets because that would (1) drive the price down of those assets, and (2) give companies with a lot of cash an opportunity to buy assets that actually are worth something (i.e. sure you can buy that porsche for $10,000, but I got this great gas guzzling SUV with no tires, radio, or seats over here for $8,999)
wobbly
Yeah, the Republicans are looking like heros on this and the Democrats look like cowards.
Pelosi, Frank, and Obama were on the verge of HANDING IT OVER when Shelby let out his rebel yell…
I could not believe my eyes.
wasabi gasp
I kinda agree with this sentiment. Just walking away would be a disaster.
Martin
Agreed. Dodd needs to come out and say:
“We’ve amended yesterdays plan to include Obama’s tax increases on incomes over $250K. You can come and vote on this plan or tomorrow we’ll add in a cap gain increase for incomes over $250K as well. We have no shortage of ideas to balance this budget that will still ensure the economy gets bailed out.”
Rick Taylor
In the midst of some of the hand-wringing about whether Democrats are falling into a trap, I’d like to suggest we are witnessing a catastrophe for the Republican party. It’s a break in the alliance that’s kept that in power for so many years between the wing-tips and the wing-nuts (as another commenter put it). The wing-nuts are furious with the wing-tips for trying to push a 700 billion dollar bill onto the tax payer; they’ve put up with a lot, but they can’t ignore that. Meanwhile the wing-tips are livid with the wing-nuts for putting the kibosh on the plan that was going to save their skins.
They deserve one another as far as I’m concerned; though the wing-tips are the more deserving. They exploited the wing-nuts, shouting about gay-marriage and throwing them conservative appointees where it didn’t hurt business,using them to keep power. And now right when their faced with the greatest financial crises of this generation, when they’re absolutely desperate, the monster they’ve cultivated turns on them and they’re reduced to calling to the Democrats for help. It’s such a perfect comeuppance, it almost makes me wonder if there really is a God. I’d be chortling with glee if the country wasn’t in such shape.
Comrade Scrutinizer
The odd thing is, Geore Bush the semi-lucid was right in his primary run against Reagan: the supply-side crap was voodoo economics. ‘Course Bush caved to Reagan, just like McCain caved to Bush the incredibly stupid, and here we are. Fucked.
Rick Taylor
(just read about Paulson getting on his knee before Pelosi)
nicethugbert
Too late. The trap is sprung. All that remains is for McCain and surrogates to have a national forum to spew his Hero Myth.
The Dems have to find a way to distance themselves from the Bailout while remaining engaged in the issue. Bailout = Paulson Plan = Chimpco DC. They will simply have to deal with the coming shit storm.
They have to make an alternate proposal that is unmistakably not a Wall Street Bailout. Their immediate issue is to repair their image, if they do it while repairing the economy, so much the better.
harlana pepper
If nothing else good comes from this, ‘corporate welfare’ will become a household word. And ‘socialist’ Bernie Sanders gets to rightly accuse Larry Kudlow of being a corporate socialist.
This is the type of gut level framing of the issues Dems need to do more of and now is the time. Now is the time!
harlana pepper
BTW, I realize Sanders is an Independent, but I have seen a few Dems do better on this as well. I think Robert Wexler and Joe Biden do a pretty good job. Some more are coming out of the wordwork. But it took something like this to wake them up, jeez.
El Cid
I once knew a sheriff’s deputy who pulled some woman for speeding. She got out of the car and began bitching him out.
After a while, he got tired of arguing with her, and wrote a ticket for some other violation he observed in her driving. She kept arguing. He wrote another ticket for a busted tail light. She kept going. He wrote another ticket for a cracked windshield or whatever it was.
In the end she had a stack of tickets instead of one, all of which were legit and none of which would be easy to wiggle out of.
That is what the Democrats’ approach should be.
nicethugbert
The Wing-Nuts know the Wing-Tips are Toxic Mortgages, it’s they that are getting a Bailout here. Rove is still afoot.
The Dems helped alright. Helped the Wing-Nuts distance themselves from the wing-tips. Now, Johny’s their new Dear Leader. Same shit, different crooked smile.
Birdzilla
TO THE DEMACREEPS FROM BIRDZILLA QUIT BLAMING OTHERS FOR YOUR INCOMPETENCE