Here:
Depressing.
by John Cole| 79 Comments
This post is in: Politics
Here:
Depressing.
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[…] Between the surprisingly non-conservative 300 billion dollar government mortgage buy-up that John McCain proposed on Tuesday night and the neo-conservatism light in Sarah Palin, it’s no wonder that people who are conservative for the “right” reasons are losing faith in their party and this election. I mean, we just broke the debt clock! […]
Martin
Meh. If anyone tries to collect, we’ll just nuke the fuckers. That’s what Reagan would have done.
DonnaInMichigan
Where do I send my check?
Who cares if it bounces..
I’m going to hell anyways
Comrade Fedorovich Stuck
Yea Yea Yea, we know all that, but did you know Barrack HUSSEIN Obama prays secret Mooslim prayers and is really OBL’s twin brother. Coming to Drudge soon!
Brian J
If nothing else, this will make a great talking point on the campaign. It’s both funny but also a signal, even if a weak one, that everyone can understand. I hope Obama and Biden incorporate this into their stump speeches.
ninerdave
Fuckin’ liberals and their damn spending! If it wasn’t for the liberals we’d have a surplus, have won the Iraq war, every one would be rich and the Apocalypse would not be upon us.
Commie bastards.
Oh yeah and everyone would ride ponies to work and back.
DonnaInMichigan
Oh and Comrade Fedorovich Stuck..
Don’t forget
Obama takes contributions from foreigners…"wink wink" …meaning terrorists….
Martin
Well, more and more people actually *are* riding ponies to work, what with gas prices and availability. So, are we winning?
ninerdave
To which McCain and Co, will scream Socialism, Obama’s a terrorist, and kills puppies with his bare hands.
Should make for an interesting debate tomorrow night.
John Cole
This, via the firebreathers at FDL, had me laughing;
Intermittent Gunderson Syndrome
crayz
What are we spending these days, 10-20% of our total budget just paying interest on the debt? If the national debt had a minimum payment the way credit cards do, we’d be fucked
This nation eventually needs to learn how to live within its means. You can’t cut taxes and raise spending every year
Brian J
Don’t forget the complicity of Barack Obama’s refusal to do town hall forums in this mess.
DonnaInMichigan
I would love it, if Obama turned to McCain tomorrow night…and said to him:
Senator McCain, you’ve made disparaging remarks about my character, in the last 2 days. You and your VP pick. So I would like for you to take this opportunity, to say to MY face, in front of millions of people who are watching world wide, and tell me, right here, right now, that you believe me to be an un-american, terrorist.
Please look into the camera and tell the American people this is what you believe of me. You say you’re a straight talker. So lets hear it straight from the maverick you call yourself.
Put his azz right on the spot.
Martin
19%. Snapshot from the debt clock:
Accumulated Debt/Savings In the last 105 secs.
Borrowed by the General Fund – $ 10,210,658,832,695* $ 16,673,325
Income: Income taxes. Outgo: Defense 30%, Interest 19%, …
Saved by the Social Security Trust + $ 2,337,231,510,180 $ 575,229
Income: FICA Payroll taxes. Outgo: Benefits and disability
Saved by other Gov. Trust Funds + $ 4,405,615,910,545 $ 15,340,793
Income: FICA & gas taxes. Outgo: Medicare, highways, etc.
Debt Held by the Public (net debt) – $ 5,805,042,922,149† $ 1,332,532
Gross National Debt † Debt Held by the Public Debt Clock Source Data
Brian J
So, nothing would change?
comrade sparky
you all are missing the point. we are the best because we have the biggest debt! and anytime we wanna know what it is, we have a place to look so we know what it is. none of those other "countries" have one of those!
also, isn’t it cool how fast those numbers change?
gbear
Soon we’ll be too big to fail.
TenguPhule
When you owe the bank $10,000.00, you have a problem.
When you owe the bank $10,000,000,000,000.00, they have a problem.
scarshapedstar
They’re adding two extra digits? $10 trillion, carry the one… wow, so they’re anticipating that we head into the quadrillion-dollar range. Nothing surprises me these days, though…
Max Power
Most of that debt is held by Americans, not foreigners. It’s the T-bills in mutual funds, IRAs, 401Ks, etc. It’s not a trade deficit.
The national debt is simply the amount additional taxes yet to be collected.
Fiscal conservatives used to know that government spending is taxes. George W Bush increased spending, which means by definition that he increased taxes. He’s just deferred the bill, and it’s collecting interest.
Max Power
scarshapedstar – I’d guess it’s one figure for the national debt total, and one for your family share, which looks like it’s about to roll over to six figures…
Comrade Incertus
You know how numbers sometimes get so big that they’re meaningless? Yeah, that’s where we are now, assuming we haven’t been here for a while now. I’m feeling a little Fight-Clubby tonight, and not in the fistfight way.
SamFromUtah
You know how numbers sometimes get so big that they’re meaningless?
Oh yes – cynical politicians count on it. Like McWorse going on about 3 million dollars being spent on DNA research?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!!!!1
Wingnuts don’t do the whole numericity thing. "One, two, many" is about their speed.
plus C
I think this calls for McCain to suspend his campaign and rush to Washington to negotiate a loan to pay for a new sign.
cain
I was more imagining tomorrow’s debate more like McCain being Col. Jessup with Obama trying to push him into making a mistake:
Obama: Did you order that racist ad about me and Ayres?! Did you?!
McCain: I did what I have to do to win!
Obama: Answer the question!
Moderator: You don’t have to answer that question…
McCain: No, I’ll answer the question..
Obama: I want the truth!
McCain: You can’t handle the truth! Son, we live in a world of Jesus, guns, terrorists, and abortionists! We got Osama sniffing at our panties ready to do us in, and a Iraq to save for Democracy! Whose going to save our world? Who is going to lead blessed America?! You, Sen. Obama? Don’t make me laugh. You don’t have the guts. I was a POW for five years, tortured every day. I know what the fuck I’m talking about! I have a greater ambition that you cannot comprehend! I will be president! I must be president!
Obama: Did you order the racist ad?!
McCain: You damn right I did you fucking nigger!
Yeah, maybe it won’t go down like that.. ;)
cain
SGEW
I’m telling y’all, that’s the next debate! That’s when the bomb drops and, to quoth myself, "John McCain will be reduced to a red-faced buffoon, hammering his podium, garbling his words, and spraying out racially charged insults in an ever expanding miasma of curse words and frothing spittle, while Barack Obama sadly shakes his head in deep regret over seeing such a once honorable man brought so very low by his own Macbethian ambition."
Yep yep. But you’ll have to wait ’till the 16th. The "town hall" will be the windup, the last debate’s the smack down.
nicethugbert
I wonder if there will be a display for that in the Chimpy Presidential Library.
Oh, wait, maybe not:
nicethugbert
Hmm, link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_W._Bush_Presidential_Library
Comrade Kevin
@John Cole:
Like, oh my god!
Like – totally
Encino is like so bitchin
Theres like the galleria
And like all these like really great shoe stores
I love going into like clothing stores and stuff
I like buy the neatest mini-skirts and stuff
Its like so bitchin cuz like everybodys like
Super-super nice…
Its like so bitchin…
srv
They really should change the sign to read:
The George W. Bush Deficit Memorial
Thomas Edward Theadore
Sigh, its good now to be a retiring boomer with savings in cash.
Figure I’ll go all Rockefeller in a year and buy up stuff.
You kids are on yer own.
You all really should have paid attention.
(hint: got an old grandpa or grandma still alive? An old fart who lived thru the Great Depression? Dig ’em out of the home and ask how they survived. It’ll be stuff like, " I quit school to bake and deliver bread…")
Thomas Edward Theadore
That click to edit thing is fun. Love the countdown.
40 seconds!
30 Seconds!
—-
So, in this 4 minutes and counting i can type, FUCK FUCK FUCK?
—-
Cool that only took, uh… oh shit 2 minutes, Fuckfuckfuck
wait i had something to add.. 1 minute! oh man the stress.
Okay look this edit thing blows, eat me 90 seconds…
Wait is it just gonna load itself? oh save
Thomas Edward Theadore
Anyway, I feel bad for you young-people who are deep in boomer-debt.
Here is my advice, forgo that college edumacatin stuff- buy tools and learn how to use them
-Thom
Comrade Incertus
I figure that if I stay in economic hardship deferral long enough, inflation will kick in to the point where my student loans are about a week’s pay. Now I just have to make sure I still have a job.
Dan
A quick check just told me that over SEVENTY FIVE percent of our national debt came under a president named Reagan or Bush.
SEVENTY FIVE PERCENT (and if I wasn’t too lazy to change to modern dollars, it would be even higher).
Yeah, they’re real conservative.
stickler
Does anyone else remember when (whoever is paying for this debt clock) decided to turn it off and stop paying the rent? Because … (chortle) at one point, our Republic looked as though it might be paying off the debt …
(snorft)
Sorry, I can’t go on with this comment.
I’m going to go over here, to this quiet corner, and weep for a while.
Waiter, bring me my IPA. And the Lagavulin. And that bottle of Marillenschnaps. Oh, and the cigar. Yes, the heroin, too.
No, I’ll leave the Sudafed until I have a cold or the Water Gangs come for it. Thank you.
Thomas Edward Theadore
See that sounds good, Comrade. Of course they are gonna pay down the debt with inflation, but what you gonna be left with? A degree in English Lit?
Might be better if you knew how to rebuild a V4 or grow corn, eh?
Thomas Edward Theadore
Whoa, you just now figuring that out? Comeon, thats old news. Where were you last election?
SGEW
And now the debt clock will have to been taken down so they can add another numeral to it.
You can’t make this shit up.
Thomas Edward Theadore
Let’s face it, young people don’t vote.
They didn’t last time, they won’t this time. Too busy with the self.
This election is all about getting the AARP vote.
If Obama wins Florida he wins. If not he might lose.
Youngsters will pay the bill either way.
Edit! ! minute 27 seconds Bitch!
Conservatively Liberal
I guess Sarah Palin attacking Obama isn’t enough. Her adoring audience is now going after the press at her rallies (h/t to GOS).
This is the most bizarre campaign I can ever remember.
SGEW
@Thomas Edward Theadore: Not quite. I concur (most heartily) that if Obama wins Florida, he wins period (and the chances look real good, thanks to McCain’s apparent desire to piss off every elderly person in America).
However, his electoral wins in VA, IN, NV, NC, NM, PA, CO, and OH (and possibly GA) will be partly (mostly?) attributable to the historically high young voter registration and turnout. I’ve seen numbers to this effect at 538 (too lazy/tired to rustle ’em up right now. . . um, take my word for it?), and from everything I’ve seen it appears to be true on the ground. In a way that is totally, viscerally different than 2004 or 2000. Bank on it. Th’ kids are all right – they’ll vote this time.
Oh, and as far as your "too busy with the self" line . . . don’t you have a lawn to protect by yelling at kids to get off of it right about now? :)
Common Sense
@Thomas Edward Theadore:
This lazy young whippersnapper registered 104 voters today on the last day Texans have to register to vote. What did you do?
By the way under 65 isn’t young — unless you are John McCain.
After the economic collapse combined with McCain brilliantly cutting Medicare, Obama will carry every age group except 50-65. And there just aren’t enough oppressed white yokels and postmenopausal women angry about Hillary’s snub to make up the difference this time around.
tom from ohio
OT, but if you search for the word "Ayers" on the front page of the Corner right now, you get 125 matches. (This is not an exaggeration.)
Conservatively Liberal
Good job ya young pup! ;)
Really. Excellent work!
Thomas Edward Theadore
SGEW/Common Sense
Yeah whatever. I’ll believe it when I see it. Look at the stats from the last election.
The kids are all, "Oh my god! WT7!"
Hey, John is there at WVU. Get him to disagree.
Sat on my ass watching tv? What’s your point? I’m set, I’ve been paying attention.
Common Sense
@Conservatively Liberal:
Thanks!
I think this election is going to be a monumental rout. I hate to seem cocky, but it is just amazing how effective the ground game is here. I have been working a grocery store in my neighborhood as well as my local college campus. I’ve met and canvassed with dozens of people — every other store I’ve gone to for the past few weeks has people registering outside. There were even people registering at the Kooks concert I went to over the weekend (that’s some of that Rock-and-Roll music for those of you not in the loop).
The "community organizer" smear is really going to bite the Repubs in the butt I think. After all, that’s what elections are — communities organizing from the ground up to vote.
Thomas Edward Theadore
And it will all get better. Just like when this tired old whippersnapper registered voters back in 1972.
Son, I admire your fire, but you’ll end up bitter and defeated if you keep at it. Buy tools, learn how to use them.
Thomas Edward Theadore
How many are Truthers? Be honest.
Common Sense
@Thomas Edward Theadore:
A few points:
1) The youth did show up in the primaries. It stands to reason they will be there for the real thing. Who shows up for Spring Training and skips the World Series?
2) Youth ain’t what it used to be. I’m at a loss how people have failed to notice that the young voters have been trending Democrat for nearly twenty years. The 18 year old in 1992 is 34 now — not old, I’ll admit, but hardly a teenager staying at home with the video games. Sounds more middle aged than anything to me.
3) Obama does a bit more to excite the college kids than Kerry did, and has a far more effective ground game to register and get them to vote. Kerry wasn’t sending text messages reminding people to vote. Kerry wasn’t encouraging car pools for election day or early voting — at least nowhere near as well as Obama is.
4) The kids DID show up in 2004 — the problem was that the righties showed up too. More youths voted in 2004 than ever have before, although their percentage did not increase due to other demographics showing up en masse as well. There’s a bit more dissatisfaction on the Red side of the aisle this time, you may have noticed. Finally it’s not the Dems who have the candidate whose supporters must suppress their gag reflex while they pull the lever.
Common Sense
@Thomas Edward Theadore:
Not as many as you would think. Granted I live in a part of Houston that usually trends blue, but there are usually a fair amount of GOP voters out there. I have registered mostly enthusiastic Obama fans, as well as several who refused to say how they will vote. Rough percentages I would say were 60% clearly Obama supporters, 30% undeclared, and very few McCain fans.
I am not naive enough to think Obama will win Texas, by the way. I spend most of my time trying not to squelch the hopes of other volunteers who are convinced that he’s got it in the bag. I am convinced that barring a major shakeup Obama wins the election. And I do think Texas will be closer than people think. I’m betting it’s around 51-48 McCain in the end.
Thomas Edward Theadore
Editted. And, whatever.
Dude, that’s palin-talk.
And, whatever. I’m saying the kids won’t vote just like they didn’t vote last time. If they step up and throw aside their weird "Illuminati/WT7" shit and vote, I’ll be the first to apologize and welcome them to their new longterm debt.
Thomas Edward Theadore
No offense, but i don’t think you are being honest. You claim to be registering students in a Houston college. And they are not Truthers?
Comeon, man, I am all about electing someone else, but lets not get all fibby and shit.
TenguPhule
Heh! Indeedy~!
We salute you, Mr. Punch the CEO out cold Guy!
TenguPhule
Linkie!
Sweet Justice is sweet.
Common Sense
I think you spend entirely too much time on the internet. Alex Jones doesn’t represent every teen in America. Most of them, like most Americans, are bandwagoners. When every one of a guy’s friends is voting for one guy and talking about the election daily, they will too. And anecdotally I will say that of all the Truthers I know (and I’d wager I know a few more young people than you) the vast majority are voting Obama. Maybe 1 in 5 or so max is pulling the "pox on both their houses" crap. They learned from 2000 that there is a difference between the two parties and as bad as it is they will vote for the lesser of two evils in their minds.
I am currently taking a class at Rice University on the election. One of the professors is Richard Murray, a Pollster and Statistician at the University of Houston who is one of the foremost experts in America on polling. He is predicting a 75% chance that Obama wins. He is also very concerned that pollsters are about to have another Literary Quarterly disaster.
Literary Quarterly magazine (a rival to Reader’s Digest) ran election predictions in the early 20th century. They had all of their subscribers fill out a postcard and mail it in, then used the tallies to predict the election results. In 1936, Literary Quarterly magazine published their fourth pol predicting the election. They forecasted a 20 point victory for Alf Landon over FDR. As history shows, they were off a bit. The reason? They used a poor sample. By only polling subscribers to their magazine, they ignored people who were illiterate or too poor to subscribe. By the same token, pollsters today are severely underrepresenting the cell phone voters. Around 17% of eligible voters have no land line and are unavailable for polling. They are overwhelmingly young single men who tend to break for Obama by a huge margin.
Common Sense
@Thomas Edward Theadore:
I said "college" and not "University" for a reason. Houston Community College is probably 3/4 African American. Does that give you a hint as to why there aren’t too many Truthers?
Thomas Edward Theadore
heh. indeed. Of course, I’m a retiring boomer. Nothing left but offering advise to internet whippersnappers.
Here’s my advise to you "Common Sense", no one cares about your longwinded anecdotes. If we did we’d read your blog.
Common Sense
@Thomas Edward Theadore:
I’ve had to listen to old farts tell longwinded anecdotes comparing every election to their first one 40 years ago since I was a kid. It’s your turn now. Grab an Ensure, it’s gonna be a ride.
I think your memory must be slipping if you consider a four point post longwinded. It’s pretty simple when you get down to it. All those kids from 20 years ago aren’t kids anymore. They are, however, still Democrats. And on top of that the kids voting this time are organized in a way that no Democrat in my lifetime has managed.
Thomas Edward Theadore
@Common Sense:
So how do they feel about the whole CIA/AIDs thing?
Be honest.
Common Sense
Couldn’t tell you Tom. I don’t attend the school. I just register people there. I don’t ask them whether they think the CIA is engaged in genocide while I do it. I can say with certainty that no one has ranted about the CIA killing black people while I registered them.
You have an extremely odd view of young people. Do you only meet them at George Norry listening parties or what?
Thomas Edward Theadore
Hey, you want to go all insulty, it’s your loss, Sarah.
But I remember my first election, pasting "Dean Acheson Has Eyebrows!" posters up and down Mapleton St.
Thomas Edward Theadore
I see. You are just making this shit up.
Good for you.
Common Sense
So unless young people are ranting about WT7 and the CIA inventing crack to kill black people, they are a figment of my imagination?
Kinda hard not to "go insulty" when I get nothing but toothless venom from you.
Look if you want to ignore evidence that doesn’t support your own preconceived notions of what kids are like today, and would rather base this election on what you remember kids being like in 1972, have fun with it. Doesn’t mean the work I’ve dedicated this election year was invented, it just means you don’t agree with my observations. Of course, you weren’t there, and probably aren’t in Texas either, so not to put too fine a point on it:
How the fuck would you know what black kids at Houston Community College think about this election? Have you had any contact with them at all? Do you have the slightest shred of evidence that any of your fantasy allegations that all teens are Truthers, (except the darkies who are all CIA haters) is true?
I see, you are just making all that shit up.
Good for you.
Conservatively Liberal
Dude, that is not Palin-talk because it is clear, concise and understandable. If you think that is Palin-talk then I would recommend that you get checked out for Alzheimer’s or dementia.
We’re so glad that you are willing to come in here and share your gloomy prognostications and predictions for the future because you are only wasting your time on people who could really give a shit about what you think. That is a hell of a lot better than having you go somewhere else where people might actually listen to what you have to say.
Keep jawing away at it old dude, we’ll just pretend you are chewing your cud and passing methane.
Thomas Edward Theadore
Dude, more power to you if you actually did what you claim to have done. Personally, i don’t think it will make a whits worth of difference, but if it does, then good. You rock.
See, now you are just being silly. Take your personal affrontage to your own well-traversed blog.
Thomas Edward Theadore
Don’t forget to tip the waitresses.
Conservatively Liberal
Shorter Thomas Edward Theadore: Mooooooo
Really? That’s deep.
Common Sense
In other words, you have no evidence to support your allegation. Gotcha.
Perhaps your cataclysmic prognosis would fit better on your own blog. If not, I’m sure Red State would love to hear your delusional rantings. They love thoughts completely disjointed from reality there, and they need some good news about how McCain’s got this in the bag.
One last time since you are apparently slow on the uptake.
I don’t think that teenagers will singlehandedly deliver this election, though unlike you I don’t think they’ll vote for Ron Paul. Also unlike you I actually talk to them. I think Obama will get the lion’s share of the under 40 vote (which is apparently the youth vote in Tommieland), and I think McCain is destroying his chances with the retiree vote that he HAS to get in order to have a prayer. I do not think that I or anyone else will deliver Texas to Obama. I think I am helping to get people of all ages (it’s not just teenyboppers that go to Kroger’s) involved in the political process, which will make a difference despite your blather to the contrary.
CIRCVS MAXIMVS MMVIII
That’s a pretty childish message, and you said the young voters wouldn’t come out for this election, haha!
DecidedFenceSitter
Just to chime in for the youth vote (not sure where I qualify at age 29, but I was a youth for the LAST election). Youth voting DID surge in 2004 as noted here.
The problem is that it wasn’t enough with all the GOP GOTV measures on the ballot in 2004. The old canard about youths don’t vote isn’t necessarily as true as it was – Dean organized the youths in 2004, and they still came out to vote in record numbers for the uninspiring Kerry.
Comrade Incertus
@Thomas Edward Theadore:
Good thing I learned how to grow food before I got my degrees in English. It’s possible to do both, you know.
kommrade jakevich
Is this what you call a TET offensive?
DrDave
Of that $10 trillion dollars, nearly $8 trillion was accrued during the presidencies of Reagan, Bush and Bush. Clinton is responsible for another trillion and the last trillion was accrued by all presidents between Washington and Carter.
Karmakin
Common Sense:Well, I think the cell phone theory is one reason, but I’m not expecting the polling to be accurate this year at all for other reasons, so if it does come to that I don’t think that there’s a straight link.
Obama, at least I think is going to pull votes above what he polls, and by a good deal. Part of it is organization, part of it is enthusiasm. But it’s pretty simple. Obama is going to get a higher % of his supporters to vote than McCain will.
To have a chance, McCain needs a real lead in polling going into election day. And I don’t see that happening at this point.
harlana pepper
Well, we may not be getting any bread, but the repubes have provided a spectacular circus with the McCain campaign and I appreciate the free entertainment. It has been deeply satisfying to watch them implode and ooze all over the place. I have listened to their free market bullshit for 8 years and the time for their comeuppance is long overdue. I say ‘Eat It!’
And yes, I blame repube leadership as a whole because they have done nothing to counter this disgusting, cartoonish behavior and at least put up a pretense of being offended as civilized human being. I know deep down, some are. They’re horrified but they don’t even have the guts to say anything. Fucking Pansies.
Tattoosydney
Thomas Edward Theadore is spoof of the highest order, right?
Although I think "whippersnapper" is taking it a little too far to be realistic …
and I don’t know what the hell this was supposed to be:
TheFountainHead
Ba-dum-CHING!
RustyJohn
As an actual conservative (not a "NeoCon" or "compassionate" one), I had the pleasure of watching the Republican party establishment vote for the likes of McCain and Huckabee during the caucuses in my state in lieu of Ron Paul- their rationale being that Paul was not a "real" conservative because he didn’t endorse torture or blowing up other countries.
How do you like your party know, Republicans? Thanks for the Depression and hyperinflation. I would take joy in watching the NeoCon scum get pummeled in November by a progressive- unfortunately myself and y family are now subject to the horror that will be the next few years.
How hard is this to do- Balance the Federal budget, get rid of the Federal Reserve and go on a gold standard, stop borrowing?