The Times finally gets around to the torture report from last week:
Now, a bipartisan report by the Senate Armed Services Committee has made what amounts to a strong case for bringing criminal charges against former Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld; his legal counsel, William J. Haynes; and potentially other top officials, including the former White House counsel Alberto Gonzales and David Addington, Vice President Dick Cheney’s former chief of staff.
The report shows how actions by these men “led directly” to what happened at Abu Ghraib, in Afghanistan, in Guantánamo Bay, Cuba, and in secret C.I.A. prisons.
It said these top officials, charged with defending the Constitution and America’s standing in the world, methodically introduced interrogation practices based on illegal tortures devised by Chinese agents during the Korean War. Until the Bush administration, their only use in the United States was to train soldiers to resist what might be done to them if they were captured by a lawless enemy.
The officials then issued legally and morally bankrupt documents to justify their actions, starting with a presidential order saying that the Geneva Conventions did not apply to prisoners of the “war on terror” — the first time any democratic nation had unilaterally reinterpreted the conventions.
But, but, but… According to John King, what is important is that Obama tell us if anyone on his staff talked with Blagojevich!
Zifnab
Liberal Media! Liberal Media!
Brian J
I really like the idea that Rahm Emmanuel is neutered for the time being even though there’s no evidence he’s done anything wrong in regards to Blagojevich. Because when there’s no signal anything wrong was done, that still leaves many unanswered questions!
r€nato
I’ll be amazed if any senior Bush regime official is ever tried for war crimes or torture. That’s simply taboo in this country.
However, if I were one of them, I would limit my foreign travels to reliably right-wing nations.
r€nato
if there’s no sign that anything illegal was done, that simply means Obama bin Hussein did a really good job of covering up his crimes.
kid bitzer
"their only use in the United States was to train soldiers to resist what might be done to them if they were captured by a lawless enemy"
might be worth adding–to train soldiers *who volunteered to undergo it*.
for some reason, there was a wing-nut meme a while back that if you condemned the use of water-boarding as torture, but sere training involved voluntarily undergoing water-boarding, then you had to be in favor of jailing the entire u.s. army. or something like that–it was that confused.
it was almost as though they don’t understand that certain acts are legal and moral when done between consenting adults, but are illegal and immoral when one party forces it on another without their consent.
oh yeah–they wouldn’t get that difference, would they….
Comrade Stuck
I am currently on a boycott of cable news. There is only so much moranity I can stand before headaches and constipation set in. My teevee news is now limited to TDS and Newshour until further notice, or until somebody reboots King et al. Not hopeful this will happen, until a sacrificial lamb is slaughtered on the alter of stoopid.
Zifnab
Eric Holder is currently a hotly contested appointment for heading the Justice Department specifically because he has been more aggressive at ferreting out government corruption than the current political base is used to.
Are we going to see Bush and Cheney, side by side, wearing pinstripes in Gitmo by the end of ’09? Probably not. But I wouldn’t mind seeing a host of second string cronies tossed into pens for the thousands of other crimes committed on Bush’s watch.
I want to see SOMEONE go to jail. Preferably a lot of someones. We’ll see how it pans out.
ATinNM
Not. Gonna. Happen.
Nobody in the upper reaches of D.C. gives a shit about the Constitution and they certainly don’t care if the military and intelligence agencies tortures "terrorists."
WereBear
When you don’t make any moral decisions yourself, relying on Teh Authorities…
it shows.
p.a.
Don’t forget, when it comes to past Republican wrongdoing,
it’s time to move on (heh) and look forward, not engage in partisan witch hunts. (Not that this stuff is all past-tense, of course).
Odds are almost 100% the Dem congress won’t have the stones to do anything besides issue reports, wag a few fingers, and announce how deeply disappointed they are with some people. Maybe they can subsidize the costume jewelry industry a bit by appropriating some $$$ for the ‘Medal of Shame’, as a nice shelf-mate to some of the Medals of Freedom that have been given out recently. Would be the first award GW has actually earned in his life. (Or the 2nd if the sewerage plant rename is complete).
cleek
Harry Reid, the spineless douche who can’t even bring himself to make Republicans actually do the talking when they threaten a filibuster, Nancy "impeachment is off the table" Pelosi, and Barack "post-partisan" Obama are not going to investigate a fucking thing.
anyone hoping otherwise would do well to give up that dream.
Chuck Carlson
Do we have to keep looking at Dr. Old Perfesser’s and Malkin’s faces on the sidebar?
On the other hand, Go Stillers!
Keith
Ouch! Does this mean Rumsfeld is eligible for TARP money now? Bankrupt? Check! Not a union member? Check! Wears a suit to work? Check!
Brian J
Speaking of stupidity (as represented not by you, but by the people who would make a statement like the one you made as a joke), did anyone see that Sean Hannity won Misinformer of the Year for 2008 from Media Matters? A more deserving winner will probably never be found, at least until Hannity wins it next year.
MattF
There are a bunch of people inside the Beltway (and ex- inside the Beltway) who wish that the ‘torture thing’ would go away– but I think now it’s going to keep coming back. Bipartisan and unanimous here is a surprise to me, and a very big deal– all these politicians would not be agreeing to these forthright findings without a real fear of what would happen to their reputations if they tried to be partisan about it.
Shygetz
It’ll never happen…but why not? As long as Obama distances himself from it, referring it to a putatively non-partisan prosecutor, then what’s the down-side? It’ll draw some fire away from his policy, keep the Republican abuses in the political spotlight, and perhaps even manage to serve a little justice.
4tehlulz
OT: Paul Weyrich just died.
gnomedad
John has explained why he stays with PJ Media, but it sure is weird seeing the wingnut memes in the left column. I console myself imagining that occasionally a winger arrives here unexpectedly and his skull detonates.
Shygetz
@4tehlulz: If you can’t say anything nice…how ’bout them Stillers?
Zifnab
@4tehlulz:
But Norquist lives on. When Weyrich bit it, was he passed out in a bathtub at the time? Because I might LOL at that.
grendelkhan
I think I can do the NABA dance. Let’s give it a shot.
Ah, but you don’t see these so-called "Senators" standing up to the Chinese, do you? It’s a testament to how open and honest our government is that we’re willing to flagellate ourselves over minor infractions which aren’t a hundredth as bad as what the Communists did with a song in their shriveled hearts… even when it may cost us victory in this existential struggle. I’d like to see any of these supposedly brave truth-tellers even try their tired schtick in Iran, or North Korea. I wonder where they were when Saddam was feeding people feet-first into wood chippers, eh? Eh?
… and now I need to go wash my hands.
Atanarjuat
Speaking of torture — or better put, embarrassingly painful — have you Liberal Hive Minders seen those just-released photos of Barack Obama back in his college days?
http://www.nypost.com/seven/12182008/news/politics/o_was_cig_man_on_campus_144729.htm
Yeah, he sure was Supahfly, alright! Big pimpin’ in Cali, and all that…
Xecky Gilchrist
It said these top officials, charged with defending the Constitution and America’s standing in the world, methodically introduced interrogation practices…
And the American press called anyone who protested it a DFH traitor.
I so do not miss the insanity of 2002-2005.
Cris
Bipartisan witch hunt!
grendelkhan
Amateur! I present to you someone claiming that if someone, somewhere, has consented to something, it’s not torture:
At the time, I didn’t think to tell him to enjoy his rigorous transverse-colon fisting, but it is quite an image, isn’t it?
GSD
Did they find Weyrich in the bathtub?
-GSD
Balconesfault
@Atanarjuat:
Wow … when Barack was 20, he acted like a kid.
Which puts him about 20 years behind GW, who was wiping the white stuff off his nose at 40.
Gus
And what of the wetsuits? And dildos?
Reverend Dennis
How many wetsuits was he wearing when they found him?
TenguPhule
I’m afraid the tr0lls are weak today.
John PM
@r€nato: #3
I do not even know how safe the right-wing nations would be. After all, wouldn’t it be worth it to some third-world authoritarian regime to hand over Cheney in exchange for additional foreign aid from Europe?
Atanarjuat
C’mon, TenguPhule, you just know you liked those pics of Barry in all his jivin’ and stylin’ glory.
Xenos
@Atanarjuat: What is the big deal with the pictures? Wearing a hat and smoking a cigarette makes him a pimp? Would wearing a white shirt make you a Klan member?
Atanarjuat
Xenos, I didn’t say Obama is/was an actual pimp, I said he was big pimpin’ back then. If you don’t know the diff between the two, I’m afraid that you’ve got some culture-catchup you’d best endeavor.
Xenos
I have better cultures to catch up with than yours.
So Obama was "big pimpin’"? And you are not "big klannin’"?
bootlegger
@Atanarjuat: Good morning Attanut. For real evidence of the hive mind you should check out the raging circle jerk on Obama’s choice of Warren to pray at the inauguration. Yessireebob, we surely do all agree.
And what’s with the racist reference to Barry’s duds?
joe from Lowell
Poor Barack Obama.
I’ll bet he had a lot of trouble meeting women in college.
And Lord knows, he’s no good at talking or charming people into things.
Must have been a lonely time for him.
heh
ThymeZoneThePlumber
Torture is having to read the fauxrage today on the Warren thing. Who is going to jail for that? Who?
Atanarjuat
Xenos said:
I didn’t realize that I was culturally aligned with Jay-Z, because that’s exactly who you just lumped me in with.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plUy7Me_fZQ
Ha! :-D
You know, after looking at those high-fivin’ photos again, it occurs to me that if they were shot a decade earlier, Obama would be wearing a floppy hat and shouting, "Dyn-O-Mite!"
I’m really starting to like this side of the Great Redistributionist. Definitely lots of skeletons in that closet of his.
[rubbing hands with anticipation]
Zifnab
A decade? Really? Wasn’t that show from the seventies? You’re snark would be more effective if you at least knew what generation you were in.
Also worth noting, those pictures were not – in fact – taken in "Cali". He is a Hawaiian native, however. No "Surf’s up dude!" "Tubular!" "Hang ten!" "Narly!" "Radicalicious!!" quotes to pass around? Amateur.
bago
Dude.
Atanarjuat
Zifnab quoted, then said:
Ummm… Zifnab, reading for comprehension is part of what RIF is all about. You DID read the article that accompanied the photos, right?
So, Occidental College was NOT in Los Angeles in 1980? Here’s the relevant quote; pay close attention this time:
Guess what "Cali" is short for, Zifnab? And guess what state Los Angeles is located in? As for the "decade earlier" I referred to which and which you sneered at, can you figure out what year 10 minus 1980 would be? You know, a a full decade less… if you’ve finally got all this figured out — especially with an embarrassing amount of hand-holding — then congratulate yourself with a big "Dyn-O-Mite!"
bago
It must have taken a shrewd wit to discover that they kept Cali in California.
neddie jingo
@joe from Lowell: Yeah, it’s not going too far out on a limb to speculate that Obama had no trouble with the ladies during his college years. My wife, looking at those photos last night, was…effusive… in her admiration.
Atanarjuat, crawl back under your rock.
Atanarjuat
neddie jingo said:
For redistributing these stylin’ photos of the Great Redistributionist back in his dame-dazzlin’ days?
Boy, you sure are conflicted.
Arakasi
Hmmm.. wasn’t the point of John’s last sentence that Republicans are worried about trivial crap when there are real issues to be dealt with?
And look, here comes Atanarjuat to prove his point.
Sean
I haven’t heard anything on NPR about this yet either. Are they waiting for another news organization or government official to talk about it – thus making it "news" ?
I wrote to the NPR ombudsman asking about it… their happy email robot seemed very pleased about something… possibly itself.
-S