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You are here: Home / Iraq and Mexican drug cartels

Iraq and Mexican drug cartels

by DougJ|  March 19, 20098:35 am| 101 Comments

This post is in: I Read These Morons So You Don't Have To

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If you’re like me, you find it fascinating when a new wingnut talking point appears out of nowhere. Here’s a new one: Mexico is like Iraq but possibly worse. I’m not sure why this is such a relevant comparison, but apparently it is. Here’s Lou Dobbs talking about it, here’s Bill O, and here’s the Washington Times. And you probably already know how excited Glenn Beck is about the Mexican drug cartels.

Where’s this one going? Are Mexican drug cartels ready to replace Islamofascists as public enemy number one? Or is this a flash in the Fox pan?

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101Comments

  1. 1.

    lilly Von Schtupp

    March 19, 2009 at 8:39 am

    It is one more thing to be fearful about. Fear is all they have.

  2. 2.

    cleek

    March 19, 2009 at 8:39 am

    the GOP’s like a classic rock radio station. if you listen for more than an hour or so, you’re bound to hear the same tune again.

  3. 3.

    joe from Lowell

    March 19, 2009 at 8:47 am

    OK, so if Mexico is worse than Iraq, and Philadelphia is worse than Iraq, how do Philadelphia and Mexico stack up?

    The message discipline among Republicans is astounding. Remember how they all started talking 24-7 about ACORN and voter fraud last year, and then they all simultaneously stopped when the Obama campaign sent the Justice Dept. that letter, and someone got arrested for fraudulently registering people as Republicans in California? Within about a day, all of the shock troops stopped spamming comment threads.

    It’s sort of impressive that they can turn on the message machine like that, but the way they can shut it off is downright amazing.

  4. 4.

    Wilson Heath

    March 19, 2009 at 8:47 am

    Lilly has something on maintaining the fear. The other thing is that while this has been a problem long brewing, and which people who have been paying attention have known about for years, the media hysteria is pretty new. So this is a fearful situation that can be placed in Obama’s lap and his unwillingness to invade can be contorted into a lack of interest in America’s safety. Meet the new straw man, same as the old straw man.

  5. 5.

    MattF

    March 19, 2009 at 8:48 am

    It does sorta tie in with the ‘brown-skinned evil’ trope… and the war on drugs, and how we all need to be able to buy heavy artillery at the hardware store to defend ourselves, and I’m sure there’s a NAFTA connection, somehow. It’s all good.

  6. 6.

    NonyNony

    March 19, 2009 at 8:48 am

    They’re afraid that two wars might not be enough to bankrupt the country completely, so they’re trying to gin up a war with Mexico?

    They’re annoyed that their coke dealer is jacking up the price on them and are trying to do something about it?

    They’re part of a psychological experiment to see what percentage of the American population actually derives energy from being constantly outraged?

    Dunno. If it were just Crazy Uncle Louie, I’d assume that this was just another iteration of his fear of the Mexican Brown Menace coming up from the South to steal all the jobs and the white women or something. If it were just the Times, I’d assume that it was just another plot in their plan to have their owner declared God On Earth. And BillO is a total "outrage-follower" – so if enough people are chattering about it he has to yell about it louder and longer until people think he’s the one who came up with it (see "War on Christmas", among others).

    Actually, I think "outrage follower" pretty much covers the bases. So I’ll go with that one – someone decided to get outraged, and all the rest of them are just playing the game of "more outraged than thou" that so many of these professional outrage nuts like to play.

  7. 7.

    Colonel Danite

    March 19, 2009 at 8:48 am

    The danger that Mexico poses to us is exactly the same as the threat we faced from Iraq-minimal to nonexistent. This is a huge problem for the Mexican government and Mexican people. There is also a chance that some of the violence might spill over the border or that the problem derails Mexico’s economic development. All bad things for certain. However, we shouldnt cower just because Glenn Beck sheds a tear.

  8. 8.

    pharniel

    March 19, 2009 at 8:49 am

    the message discipline is so powerful that even The Hour (a cbc show) was putting up talking points (Hoover AND FDR both made the depression worse, you have to run government like a family runs their check book etc.) from some guy named Dr. Doom.

    These guys are good, of course, it’s getting easier every time the tent gets smaller.

  9. 9.

    Ash Can

    March 19, 2009 at 8:55 am

    Sounds like a few jokers at Fox and the Times started planning their spring vacations, were unpleasantly surprised to discover that there are travelers’ warnings for Mexico, and are pissed off that they had to change their vacation plans. (As for Lou Dobbs, well, he’s all about the Brown Menace, so he doesn’t count.)

  10. 10.

    fester

    March 19, 2009 at 8:55 am

    I know the Mexican narco-insurgency has been floating around in non-conventional warfare blogs for at least the past eighteen to twenty four months (hell, I have been pushing this argument for about twelve to fifteen months on the Newshoggers, which is definately not a right wing blog) as Mexico is hitting an inflection point where the Export Land model of Peak Oil is going to hit them in the ass (40% of the Mexican federal budget is oil export revenue, and Mexico is projected to become a net importer of oil products in the next couple of years), the Nigerian model of oil sabotage is viable, and there is a massive black market with massive amounts of cash sloshing around…. analytically speaking Mexico should be a great 4th Gen. Warfare predictive case — if it destabilizes, it confirms 4GW verifiable predictions, if it stabilizes, 4GW has a massive false falsifiable prediction problem.

    Now as to why it hit the news in the past three weeks, I have no clue….

  11. 11.

    DougJ

    March 19, 2009 at 8:58 am

    @fester

    I agree that Mexican instability is a real concern. It’s just interesting that the nuts are suddenly so into it.

  12. 12.

    SpotWeld

    March 19, 2009 at 8:58 am

    It’ll probably boil down to a few of the usual things, with a few predictable results.

    1) If must be a afraid of who we tell you be afraid of, or else you are not a Patriot.

    2) Private contractors are awesome. BTW, we need a big wall.. too expensive you say, Traitor!

    3) All your problems are someone elses fault (usually a forgiener), if you disagree with me then all your problems are your own fault and you don’t deserve any help you traitorous liberal.

    4) Obama is a Muslim. You can tell because I have all these flags around me.

  13. 13.

    argh

    March 19, 2009 at 8:59 am

    Cole: "If you’re like me, you find it fascinating when a new wingnut talking point appears out of nowhere."

    I am hoping it is too obvious to explain that it is the Think Tanks set up under Reagan that issue these "talking points" which are then distributed through the various media channels owned by the corporate Establishment.

    And so it is also probably unnecessary to comment that these "talking points" are propaganda bullets which derive their power from their endless repetition until they soak into the consumers (formerly citizens) brains as conventional wisdom.

    But it has become important to say these obvious things, I think, because my nation seems to have fallen and doesn’t know why; and therefore cannot get up again.

  14. 14.

    jrosen

    March 19, 2009 at 9:01 am

    It’s good that people are starting to notice how toxic (not to say maximally irritating) Lou Dobbs is. In all the foofaraw about Rush (now that Ann Coulter seems to have, er…peaked) Dobbs sneering and pompous shtick has been largely overlooked. Occasionally I forget to switch off CNN (now that TNG reruns are back) so I hear a little of his gaseous bloviation and he seems almost as unhinged as Beck…but I think Beck really means it (God save us) and Dobbs is just playing for ratings among the tin-foil set. But he should be taken seriously, a Fox bridgehead on the relatively (but only relatively!) sane CNN.

  15. 15.

    El Cid

    March 19, 2009 at 9:06 am

    Mexican drug cartels are an enormous problem for the stability of much of Mexico.

    On the other hand, no major politicians in the U.S. have given the slightest sh*t about the stability of Mexico for decades, and think it’s just awesome to push every single destabilizing policy in Mexico and the region as possible if some company somewhere can make an extra buck.

    In January of last year, the last protected domestic food crops in Mexico of the staples of beans, corn, and dried milk products (with little refrigeration it’s necessary and cheaper) were broken via the last chapter of NAFTA.

    So you’ve got millions of indigenous subsistence farmers who now will have no way to survive and cannot compete with the over-subsidized U.S. agro-giant products flooding the market.

    A huge portion of these small producers live in the Pacific Southwest of Mexico, an astoundingly impoverished region — i.e., all the rural areas surrounding Acapulco.

    Those are also the areas in which the dominant Colombian drug dealers — the right wing narco-paramilitary death squads so closely linked repeatedly with the U.S.’ close buddies in Colombia, the conservative government & Congress and military — are making the newest links to bring their drug products in directly.

    Like always, in our names our government actively encourages the greatest amount of instability in Mexico and the region possible and then insists the only response is more soldiers, more guns, more enforcement, and new destabilizing economic programs to enrich a few uber-wealthy and corporations in the name of "economic development".

    What do we expect?

  16. 16.

    comrade thalarctos

    March 19, 2009 at 9:18 am

    Wait til Dobbs &Co decide that these are islamofascist Mexican drug cartels.

    Hellbent on fluoridating our water.

  17. 17.

    David

    March 19, 2009 at 9:18 am

    It’s a very serious problem mostly for Mexicans and Mexico. There have been hundreds and hundreds of drug cartel-related murders in the last few years in Juarez alone. Between the government and the cartels, the cartels have, by far, the better organization and weapons. In Juarez, streets are deserted at night and middle and upper class residents are abandoning their homes when they no longer feel safe. The drug cartels don’t want to freak out the Americans so Americans are pretty safe — if that’s ALL that matters but it’s really bad for the economy of both Juarez and El Paso.

    Of course, the Rightwing will make a partisan talking point out of a serious problem.

    In El Paso, there is a growing movement to legalize pot as a way of combating the cartels.

  18. 18.

    Bill H

    March 19, 2009 at 9:26 am

    I think Mexico is packaging cocaine in aerosol cans for shipment to America to be put into our water supply to corrupt our precious bodily fluids. I also saw some pictures of pilotless drones that are capable of carrying, um, something nefarious and flying at altitudes that are suspiciously just feet higher than our border fences. I know that Mexico has stockpikes of cocaine, there are 500 tons of it, and I know where it is hidden. And there are labs to make more. And Mexico is trying to buy materials from Niger to make yet even more.

    So you know what we must do. We can’t wait for the smoking gun to come in the form of mushrooms.

  19. 19.

    harlana pepper

    March 19, 2009 at 9:31 am

    @DougJ:

    Suddenly it’s a concern to these yay-hoos. It should have been a concern a long time ago. If we don’t want people crossing our borders so they can make a living wage we should take some interest in Mexico besides exploiting their work force. Apparently the only time we care about our neighbor Mexico is when their masses immigrate to our country (because there is no opportunity in their own country to make a living) or when wringing hands about drug cartels which thrive in unstable environments and rampant poverty (e.g., things that actually have a long-term effect on the society that we should have cared about long ago).

  20. 20.

    Punchy

    March 19, 2009 at 9:32 am

    Mexico is like Iraq

    Until you can show me a Fallujahian who can make me a chick ‘n’ cheese ‘rito and fish tacos, I call bullshit.

    And if this does mean we get to invade Mexy, can I volunteer to be the one who secures the beaches (and their inhabitants) in Cancun? kthxbai.

  21. 21.

    The Moar You Know

    March 19, 2009 at 9:34 am

    Until recently, I spent a fair amount of time in Mexico. I live about 20 minutes from the border.

    The situation is basically this; everyone down there is on the take. Everybody. And yes, that does run all the way up to the presidency.

    And that’s fine, the Mexicans seemed to be OK with it until now. It’s not how I would run a country but it seems to work for them.

    Now, the problem is that you’ve got two actors, both of approximately equal strength, duking it out for control. They both own the about the same number of cops, soldiers, and government folks. Result – stalemate. Hence all the public killings.

    Unfortuately for the pants-shitters, someone will eventually win this thing and it will settle down and then Dobbs and his gang of xenophobes will have to find something else to crap their collective pants about.

  22. 22.

    harlana pepper

    March 19, 2009 at 9:35 am

    commrade thelar: Islamofacist Communist-Capitalist Mexican Drug Cartels?!! Yeegods, what is NEXT!! (Glenn Beck cries softly into his blankie)

  23. 23.

    Herb

    March 19, 2009 at 9:39 am

    I agree that Mexican drug lords are a huge problem…maybe even bigger than Jihadist terrorists buttfucking Saddam Hussein…but I think the "root cause" is the Drug War itself.

    Beck and the others would probably argue that it’s due to the poor quality of Hispanic culture.

  24. 24.

    Ripley

    March 19, 2009 at 9:39 am

    If you’re like me, you find it fascinating when a new wingnut talking point appears out of nowhere.

    It’s almost as if they have some sort of group which coordinates their messages. I don’t know, some kind of phone tree or bulletin board or newsletter or something…

  25. 25.

    BenA

    March 19, 2009 at 9:42 am

    Hey wow…. criminalizing the sale of a product that is in such high demand creates violent crime? Who knew?

    Next thing you’ll tell me is that allowing banks to operate in an unregulated environment will cause an economic breakdown!

    Seriously though… the Mexican drug cartels are a major issue… but it’s not like Glenn Beck and Co. are going to do anything except make the issue worse.

  26. 26.

    chrome agnomen

    March 19, 2009 at 9:42 am

    flash in fox pan=fool’s gold

  27. 27.

    sgwhiteinfla

    March 19, 2009 at 9:43 am

    DougJ

    DUH, they are saying this so everybody can be scared of "teh illegals" Think about who we are talking about here.

    Lou Dobbs xenophobe? Check

    Bill O xenophobe? Check

    Washington Times xenophobes? Check

    Glenn Beck xenophobe and batshit crazy? Double Check

    They want people to fear Mexico so they will fear the people coming from Mexico. Thats why we need a big wall to keep them all out dontcha know?

    This is the most transparent play yet. They don’t give a shit about Mexican drug wars, they only want to use it to spark more and more backlash against Mexican immigrants, illegal or not.

  28. 28.

    Bob In Pacifica

    March 19, 2009 at 9:46 am

    El Cid hit it. NAFTA is bad for the U.S. because it’s worse for Mexico.

    The destabilization of small Mexican agriculture helped ignite the exodus off small farms and into the U.S., where illegals provide cheap labor which undermines U.S. labor. The result, Big Ag makes money, working class Americans lose jobs and bargaining rights in the "free market", there are more people buying fewer things. Suddenly the middle class disappears.

    Thanks, President Clinton.

  29. 29.

    The Other Steve

    March 19, 2009 at 9:46 am

    So you’ve got millions of indigenous subsistence farmers who now will have no way to survive and cannot compete with the over-subsidized U.S. agro-giant products flooding the market.

    I don’t think it’s magical subsidies that causes this.

    It’s John Deere.

    And probably advanced irrigation techniques and so on.

    There is just no way they’re getting 200 bushels/acre for corn down in Mexico. Just no way.

  30. 30.

    BenA

    March 19, 2009 at 9:47 am

    @Ripley:
    Anyone else actually surprised that these idiots even know what a listserv is?

  31. 31.

    Faux News

    March 19, 2009 at 9:55 am

    Now if only some right wing patriot could tie in Gay Marriage with the Mexican Drug Cartel we just might reach the promise land and get a brief glimpse of "peak wignut".

  32. 32.

    NonyNony

    March 19, 2009 at 10:06 am

    @The Other Steve:

    I don’t think it’s magical subsidies that causes this. It’s John Deere. And probably advanced irrigation techniques and so on.

    How do you think the farmers pay for John Deere, fancy irrigation techniques, new hybrid seed crops, advanced fertilizers and other things that allow for huge output while still maintaining prices at the supermarket that don’t cause a consumer revolt (while still being able to pay transportation and storage costs for a very fragile product that spoils quickly) AND still make enough of a profit to stay in business?

    Here’s a hint – start with those magical subsidies. Without the subsidies something would have to give – probably a lot of somethings. Starting with the price we pay at the grocery store and ending with a lot of farmers out of work and losing their farms. And some would probably start growing opium, marijuana, coca and other crops that would make them enough money to live on that food crops wouldn’t be able to handle.

    In other words – our country would look a lot more like Mexico. If we were serious about ending the drug trade we’d start by raising Mexico out of poverty. Our tactics with NAFTA – which were sold to many of us as a tool for doing just that – have managed to make a bad situation worse. And our agribusiness policy is only part of it.

  33. 33.

    Steve M.

    March 19, 2009 at 10:06 am

    What’s killing them is that Obama is actually being bellicose with regard to Al Qaeda and "AfPak." They can’t attack him for this. And they know they can’t get traction attacking him on "surrender" in Iraq because he’s winding down U.S. involvement slowly there, plus attacking him on Iraq conflicts with their argument that "yay! we won!" there.

    So they have to find somewhere that he’s being a sandal-wearing hippie appeaser.

  34. 34.

    Dennis-SGMM

    March 19, 2009 at 10:07 am

    It’s clear to me that the Obama administration’s failure to send troops that we don’t have to police the Mexican border will cost the Democrats dearly in 2010.
    This is just another of the things that have gone wrong since January and must therefore be laid at the feet of the Democrat president.

  35. 35.

    jibeaux

    March 19, 2009 at 10:12 am

    Let’s talk about something more fun, like the fact that Obama makes excellent bracket picks.

  36. 36.

    El Cid

    March 19, 2009 at 10:16 am

    @The Other Steve: I disagree; the U.S. corn crop is both massively subsidized and pressured into trade agreements with Mexico; and as a social phenomenon at some point you have to give a sh*t about the social consequences of blowing apart the livelihoods of a tremendous amount of the Mexican population in order to serve large exporters.

    Secondly, prices are going up for staples for the poorest Mexican consumers, and have been going up for the last few years. Partly that is a result of consumer price subsidies being removed, but partly because overall the efficiencies of large import product do not in fact trickle down to the consumer.

    This is a subject on which the important factors are actual empirical questions regarding what the producers and consumers of Mexico face, and not generalized economic theory.

  37. 37.

    Dennis-SGMM

    March 19, 2009 at 10:24 am

    @lilly Von Schtupp:
    There are the things that we know that we should fear. There are also the things that we don’t know and we should fear them too. Then there are the things that we know are unknown that we’ll fear when we find out what they are.

  38. 38.

    BongCrosby

    March 19, 2009 at 10:35 am

    Everybody knows that a *new* shiny object is much more interesting than an *old* shiny object.

  39. 39.

    John PM

    March 19, 2009 at 10:35 am

    Isn’t a logical conclusion to the concerns raised by the wingnuts to invade and annex Mexico? We would gain about five new states with a heavily Christian population, eliminate almost all illegal immigration, and have the ability to station heavily armed American police and national guard troops to fight the drug cartels directly.

    What’s that? The wingnuts are not actually serious about their concerns? Never mind, then…

  40. 40.

    Comrade Dread

    March 19, 2009 at 10:40 am

    Where’s this one going?

    Expected GOP responses:

    1. Fuck fiscal constraint and fuck your namby pamby social spending and stimulus. We need more funding for drugs and local NARC and SWAT squads, so they can more effectively beat hippies and throw minorities into jail for a decade over a possession charge.

    2. It’s the fault of these liberal hippie states like California for making medical marijuana legal.

    3. We need that border fence now to contain the violence. It’s not just about immigration anymore. It’s to keep America safe. Why do you liberals and Mexican lovers hate America?

    Are Mexican drug cartels ready to replace Islamofascists as public enemy number one?

    Americans are focused on the economy that we destroyed. We need an immediate foreign threat to make them forget that our master plan is to transfer the rest of their money and reduce them to living in tents and eating cat food.

    MEXICANS!!!! DRUGS!!! HIPPIES!!!!

    Of course, it never occurs to the true believers in the War on American Citizens that the fastest way to defund the cartels and save billions of dollars would be to let Merck or Pfizer open a narcotics division, lay off 90% of the DEA, and convert the rest of the agency to coordinating drug treatment and prevention efforts (advertising, etc.).

  41. 41.

    Ripley

    March 19, 2009 at 10:40 am

    Here’s a thought: Since we already have a National Day of Prayer (blessed be!), wouldn’t it make sense to also have a National Day of Fear?

    That way, we could just get it all out of our system on one day and be done with it. Think of the celebrations… err… panic attacks we could have. Hot dogs, balloons, carnival rides in the park, grandiose speeches by Dobbs, O’Reilly, et al.

    I’m going to call my Congressman right now! Who’s with me?

  42. 42.

    lutton

    March 19, 2009 at 10:45 am

    Well, the Drug War is a problem in general, and the Mexico situation is rapidly deteriorating. But the likelyhood that any of right wingers will promote any kind of logical or common sense approach to the issue is slim-to-nil.

    I’m sure most of their enegery will be used to call for more law enforcement, more DARE-style programs, more privately run prisons, etc.

    And watch them negatively align the Mexican drug war with the Obama administration’s new common sense approach to medical marijuana clubs. They’ll say (if they aren’t saying it already) that Obama soft on narco-terrorists.

  43. 43.

    Just Some Fuckhead

    March 19, 2009 at 10:46 am

    If you’re like me, you find it fascinating when a new wingnut talking point appears out of nowhere.

    Maybe they aren’t coming out of nowhere. Maybe there’s a cabal of wingnutty journalists wingnuts who have a secret email list something-or-other where they, ya know, conspire or something.

    Maybe Politico is on it. I mean covering the story of course.

  44. 44.

    Dave

    March 19, 2009 at 10:52 am

    Why is the right-wing so interested?
     
    Oil, baby. Oil.
     
    The narco-insurgency destabilizes a region that the US is highly dependent on for oil (3rd biggest supplier, just behind the Saudis). The majority of that oil is in the northern part of the country
     
    So we talk about the threat and the danger. And somewhere down the line, the talk will change to "Does the US need to intervene?" And then it will just be a matter of time until the US sends troops over the border to "provide security" and "end the drug wars." And all that oil will just happen to be in the same place. Serendipity!

  45. 45.

    Shade Tail

    March 19, 2009 at 10:57 am

    Well, they hate Mexicans. And they hate drugs. So the Mexican drug cartels mix two things they like to imagine they’re fighting against.

    What they ignore is that the Mexican drug cartels are so dangerous because *we* are arming them:

    http://www.markfiore.com/political/gringo-guns

  46. 46.

    AhabTRuler

    March 19, 2009 at 11:02 am

    What they ignore is that the Mexican drug cartels are so dangerous because we are arming them pretty much everything rational.

    Fixeteth.

  47. 47.

    Xanthippas

    March 19, 2009 at 11:02 am

    If you’re like me, you find it fascinating when a new wingnut talking point appears out of nowhere. Here’s a new one: Mexico is like Iraq but possibly worse. I’m not sure why this is such a relevant comparison, but apparently it is. Here’s Lou Dobbs talking about it, here’s Bill O, and here’s the Washington Times. And you probably already know how excited Glenn Beck is about the Mexican drug cartels.

    So what’s the solution for this problem? Invade, like Iraq? Or are we sticking with the old standby of deporting all Mexicans?

  48. 48.

    James Hare

    March 19, 2009 at 11:04 am

    George Will joined in today as well with his Washington Post piece. The interesting thing is he presents a great deal of information that has been publicly available but not particularly well-reported — then he offers no suggestions of how to deal with the problem. He says "some people have suggested legalizing marijuana" but says it won’t happen. I fail to see how this is evidence of some "great thinker" — which I am assured repeatedly is what Will is.

    "Conservative Intellectual" is an oxymoron and always has been one.

  49. 49.

    Michael

    March 19, 2009 at 11:05 am

    Lou Dobbs hates him some Irish and takes a big slap at St. Patrick’s day.

    http://gawker.com/5172815/lou-dobbs-a-terrible-racist-in-honor-of-st-patricks-day

    In honor of the Know Nothing riots of the 1850s, he also hates him some Eyetalianos and anybody who is Catholic because they celebrate ethnic holidays.

  50. 50.

    LV-426

    March 19, 2009 at 11:08 am

    This could adversely affect my next trip to Mexico.

  51. 51.

    valdivia

    March 19, 2009 at 11:08 am

    1. The war on drugs in Colombia is over inasmuch as it was a war against the FARC and their ranks and political and fighting power has been decimated.

    2. The US has been pushing for a similar tack in Mexico called Plan Merida, this violence makes it necessary to make this Plan a reality (which is rather stupid, typical gringo thinking that all Latin American countries are the same. Mexico is the one country in the hemisphere, aside from Costa Rica which has no army, where the army did not become a predatory independent institution at the service of the oligarchy. The influx of money will create an army that the mexican political system will have no control over. Way to go US)

    3. Criminality and violence has always been a problem in mexico, now its much much worse thanks to American gun laws which eliminated the ban on assault weapons. Where do they think these guns come from. The big issue here has to do with little state penetration in certain regions of the country, police corruption etc. This is governability issue, not a military lets fight a war issue but hey to the wingnuts everything is the same no?

    4. Good luck with making OIL a winning issue. Mexico, will never, never, never let anyone get their hands on their oil. If they have to use the narcos to fight an american army to defend their oil be sure they will (see Constitution of 1917 and Nationalization of Oil Industry under Cardenas in 1934). No Foreing presence in the Oil Industry is a religion in Mexico. Calderon has been trying to give permits to american companies to do business there and the congress has said no.

    5. Dobbs hates mexicans. here and there.

  52. 52.

    Paulie Chestnuts

    March 19, 2009 at 11:12 am

    Capitalist entrepreneurs using their 2nd Amendment Rights to reduce gubmint interference in their business?

    They should be applauded, not demonized!!!!

    ( / wingnut )

  53. 53.

    burnspbesq

    March 19, 2009 at 11:14 am

    @jibeaux:

    Nonsense. I voted for the guy, I gave money to his campaign, and he repays me by picking the damn Tarheels to win the tournament.

    Reggie needs to surreptitiously fill the presidential iPod with Barry Manilow and Cher.

    Hansbrough always walks.

    Go Devils!

  54. 54.

    Atanarjuat

    March 19, 2009 at 11:15 am

    Iraq hasn’t been a direct threat, per se, but there are definitely Jihadist elements in the Middle East who wish America great harm, and are at times successful.

    The work of the Mexican drug cartels, whom have fostered violence and addiction, have also caused America great harm.

    It’s possible to see both as a threat and not just focus on one at a time.

    I’m not sure why anyone would want to dismiss either as the latest "wingnut" talking point, unless, of course, it’s just more liberal anti-conservative posturing that’s really in effect here.

    Bah.

    -A

  55. 55.

    Mike in NC

    March 19, 2009 at 11:16 am

    The situation is basically this; everyone down there is on the take. Everybody. And yes, that does run all the way up to the presidency. Mexicans seemed to be OK with it until now. It’s not how I would run a country but it seems to work for them.

    Substitute Iraqis or Afghans for Mexicans. Pretty much the way it works everywhere in the Third World.

  56. 56.

    El Cid

    March 19, 2009 at 11:16 am

    1. The war on drugs in Colombia is over inasmuch as it was a war against the FARC and their ranks and political and fighting power has been decimated.

    It may seem so objectively, but the Colombian state is fully committed to continuing the massive U.S. military aid; and at some point, Colombians will have to confront the reality of the massive monster their government released by creating the right wing narco-paramilitary death squads to wipe out rebels and any rural poor who were barriers to landowner and conservative rule.

    The right wing narco-paramilitaries are very much still in operation. They control the vast majority of the nation’s narco-trafficking, collaborating politicians or government officials are arrested every day.

    And only a few weeks ago the nation’s Attorney General had to take over and occupy the nation’s secret intelligence agency when a weekly magazine reported that the agency was spying on government officials, judges, politicians, journalists, and other private citizens in collaboration with the paramilitaries, as well as with unaffiliated narco-traffickers and leftist guerrillas.

    We don’t know how this is going to work out, or if the Colombian state will prove either willing or capable of ruling in the paramilitary beast they released, even if FARC finally (and blessedly) gives up or is broken.

  57. 57.

    GSD

    March 19, 2009 at 11:19 am

    Funny, but shouldn’t we be constantly noting that Mexico is a Christian country full of Christians? It is 93% Catholic.

    And those Mexican-Christians are chopping off heads at a far greater clip than the Al Qaeda Muslims seemed to have ever done even during their heyday in heady days of the insurgency.

    Christianity, a religion of peace?

    -GSD

  58. 58.

    harlana pepper

    March 19, 2009 at 11:19 am

    Completely OT Celebrity Stuff: Natasha Richardson has died from her head injury.

  59. 59.

    binzinerator

    March 19, 2009 at 11:20 am

    @Bill H:

    So you know what we must do. We can’t wait for the smoking gun to come in the form of mushrooms.

    Win.

  60. 60.

    LD50

    March 19, 2009 at 11:23 am

    It does sorta tie in with the ‘brown-skinned evil’ trope… and the war on drugs, and how we all need to be able to buy heavy artillery at the hardware store to defend ourselves, and I’m sure there’s a NAFTA connection, somehow. It’s all good.

    It combines wingnut fear of Meskins and wingnut fear of terrorists in one easy-to-digest pill. So it shouldn’t surprise us that they should try this one out on the Conservative Old White Men contingent.

    One small quandary, the US has good relations with Mexico, and they aren’t Islamofascists, so this new meme may not really go anywhere. They have oil, but they’re happily selling it to us, so that won’t work.

  61. 61.

    harlana pepper

    March 19, 2009 at 11:26 am

    Michael @49: Vid would not load for me, but is there any ethnic group left to hate on now? How many of the white peepuls who watch his show have Irish ancestry?

  62. 62.

    El Cid

    March 19, 2009 at 11:26 am

    @binzinerator:

    We can’t wait for the smoking gun to come in the form of mushrooms.

    Agreed. Wonderfully awesome.

  63. 63.

    Xanthippas

    March 19, 2009 at 11:35 am

    MEXICANS! DRUGS HIPPIES!

    I’ll admit that at first glance I thought that said "herpes", which would certainly alter the character of the right-wing platform.

  64. 64.

    valdivia

    March 19, 2009 at 11:35 am

    @El Cid:

    I think maybe I did not wrote it as clearly as I meant–I totally agree with you. I was just watching in the Colombian News Channel (Caracol) an interview about the reelection bill and the pay for play allegations connected with the passing of that law (which makes it in the eyes of most consitutional experts unconstitutional) and what struck me is that as much as the US and Uribe declare the war to be over and a model to be followed in Mexico they are selling a bill of goods (my whole point about giving tons of money to the Mexican army is your point–unleashing a monster you cannot control). Yes the FARC is not what it used to be with the death of Tiro Fijo and the Amnesty Laws but my point in 1) was not to advocate for this position but to summarize how those pushing for merida see it. I have been firmly against any military aid to any Latin American country because our armies are always instruments of repression, why feed that?

  65. 65.

    The Moar You Know

    March 19, 2009 at 11:39 am

    1. Fuck fiscal constraint and fuck your namby pamby social spending and stimulus. We need more funding for drugs and local NARC and SWAT squads, so they can more effectively beat hippies and throw minorities into jail for a decade over a possession charge.

    @Comrade Dread: Hey, that one’s already happening!

  66. 66.

    Martin

    March 19, 2009 at 11:44 am

    I don’t think it’s magical subsidies that causes this.
    It’s John Deere.
    And probably advanced irrigation techniques and so on.
    There is just no way they’re getting 200 bushels/acre for corn down in Mexico. Just no way.

    BOB must be fucking dying that he can’t engage in a ‘tractors for world domination’ discussion.

  67. 67.

    Glidwrith

    March 19, 2009 at 11:50 am

    I’ll tell you why this is suddenly amonst the chattering class – last night on Discovery Channel was the program "Inside the FBI". The episode was all about the Mexican Mafia and a year-long sting operation in San Diego, complete with (gasp!) GUNS and DRUGS. You’d think we were all crouched behind our doors in fear of the violence of the gang drug wars. I’d say "Inside the FBI" came off like a combination of "Dirty Jobs" and "How It’s Made" – everyone is fascinated by it, it’s rather distasteful and you find out how the FBI operates, only without any useful facts or information.

  68. 68.

    wilfred mohammed mendoza

    March 19, 2009 at 11:51 am

    Islam is on the rise in Mexico; must be the emphasis on justice.

    Imagine the right wing hardons induced by that perfect object of fear and hatred- the MexoMuslim IslamoBeaner, crossing the border to make El Jihad.

    Goddamn.

  69. 69.

    Gus

    March 19, 2009 at 11:54 am

    Remember how they all started talking 24-7 about ACORN and voter fraud last year, and then they all simultaneously stopped

    The wingnuts who populate the discussion threads in my local papers didn’t get the memo. It’s all ACORN all the time for some of these shitheads.

  70. 70.

    Martin

    March 19, 2009 at 11:57 am

    These guys have lost their anti-immigration narrative. Nobody cares any more, so they’re just trying to resurrect the narrative by drawing an association that Mexicans are all drug criminals.

    The problems in Mexico are legitimate problems and it’s in our best interest to help Mexico sort it out, but Dobbs and company don’t care about that. They’re just looking for more things to get the audience to clutch at their pearls.

  71. 71.

    Andy

    March 19, 2009 at 12:07 pm

    > Are Mexican drug cartels ready to replace Islamofascists as public enemy number one?

    In the Dobbs-Beck-O’Reilly hivemind, quite possibly: it’s the perfect fusion of street crime, drugs and illegal immigration.

    Our governor here in Texas is pushing to send large numbers of National Guardsmen to the Texas/Mexico border. That would be great for the perennially-depressed economy down there (at least for the restaurant-, motel- and adult video store sectors of the economy), but other than that I have no idea what they’re supposed to be doing. The drug wars are horrible, to be sure, but so far it’s all happening on the other side of the border, and no one’s yet explained how the National Guard is supposed to handle that.

    Maybe a preemptive invasion is in order?

  72. 72.

    Mike in NC

    March 19, 2009 at 12:12 pm

    The correct approach to dealing with the Mexican drug cartels is obvious: Obama must appoint our former Dear Leader, AKA Jorge Arbusto, as a special envoy and send him to the border to negotiate. Problem solved!

  73. 73.

    wilfred mohammed mendoza

    March 19, 2009 at 12:15 pm

    Maybe a preemptive invasion is in order?

    Hell, yes.

    Fact: Mexicans ship drugs over the border into our schools and neighborhoods, killing Americans and creating tremendous amounts of crime. Why, it’s like shooting rockets, only instead of ones that go boom these are shoved up the asses of mules and end up killing more people.

    The Mexican Government? Hell, the Mexicans voted them in, so all of them are responsible.

    How much of this are we expected to take? How much of that drug money is used to pay for things that all the Mexicans use?

    Blow it all up, seal all the entry points into Juarez and blockade the rest of the country.

    It worked in Gaza.

  74. 74.

    r€nato

    March 19, 2009 at 12:19 pm

    There is also a chance that some of the violence might spill over the border or that the problem derails Mexico’s economic development.

    there really is an issue with the drug violence spilling over the border and the danger of the drug cartels actually controlling the Mexican government from the top down.

    But, you know, it sounds like to me that the fear-mongering right is trying to gin up an excuse for a military action ("we’ll get it right this time, for sure!").

    There’s a vast gulf between being concerned and being filled with abject fear. The right-wing – either willfully or unconsciously – doesn’t seem to know how to modulate within that range. The fear-o-meter is always cranked up to 11.

  75. 75.

    LV-426

    March 19, 2009 at 12:41 pm

    But, you know, it sounds like to me that the fear-mongering right is trying to gin up an excuse for a military action

    The right needs an enemy. That’s all. It’s how they keep the base engaged. We’d be very stupid to start a war with Mexico but that’s secondary to the rights goal of being in power.

  76. 76.

    El Cid

    March 19, 2009 at 12:48 pm

    FWIW, Laura Carlsen of the Americas Program of the International Relations Center:

    Drug War Doublespeak

    Laura Carlsen | March 9, 2009 | Americas Program, Center for International Policy (CIP)

    Through late February and early March, a blitzkrieg of declarations from U.S. government and military officials and pundits hit the media, claiming that Mexico was alternately at risk of being a failed state, on the verge of civil war, losing control of its territory, and posing a threat to U.S. national security.

    In the same breath, we’re told that President Calderon with the aid of the U.S. government is winning the war on drugs, significantly weakening organized crime, and restoring order and legality.

    None of these claims is true. Instead they are critical elements in waging the hypocritical drug war in Mexico.

    Drug-war doublespeak pervades and defines the U.S.-Mexico relationship today. The discourse aims not to win the war on drugs, but to assure funding and public support for the military model of combating illegal drug trafficking, despite the losses and overwhelming evidence that current strategies are not working.
    Sorting Reality from Hype

    Mexico, and particularly border cities and other key points along the drug routes, has a serious problem. In these places, violence characterizes daily life. But Mexico is not a failed state. It is a tragic example of the results of failed policies—on both sides of the border. Both governments want to obscure this simple fact.

    In the past, exaggerated risk assessments, amplified by the media and accompanied by dire warnings to the public, prepare the ground for military intervention. They usually pack hyperbole or outright lies, the most recent example being the "weapons of mass destruction" in Iraq.

    While military intervention in Mexico is not on the horizon, the recent hype has been accompanied by requests for military build-up on the border. Texas Governor Rick Perry jetted to Washington to ask for $135 million and 1,000 soldiers. Talk of sending more National Guard troops circulated, along with mentions of a border "surge." The Texas state government announced a rapid-mobilization plan in case Mexico "collapsed," replete with tanks and aircraft.

    After outgoing Homeland Security head Michael Chertoff spoke of a contingency plan for the border, the media wondered aloud whether incoming head Janet Napolitano would be tough enough. She responded by calling the situation a "top priority." Secretary of Defense Robert Gates called the Mexican drug war "a serious problem." He raised a maelstrom of protest in Mexico with the announcement that the disappearance of Mexico’s anti-Pentagon biases had cleared the way for tighter cooperation. The U.S. Embassy was forced to issue a press release declaring that the United States had no intention of sending troops into Mexico.

    Congress also leapt to respond to the rhetoric. Hearings have been called in both houses, including the Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee under Sen. Joe Lieberman (I-CT) who, according to news reports, will be looking for "potential implications for increased terrorist activity." The committees will likely hear testimony primarily from persons who confirm the perceived threat in lurid and imprecise terms.

    The Mexican government has responded by lobbing counter-accusations at the United States. Calderon cites the U.S. role in gun-running, money-laundering, and demand for narcotics.

    The motivations behind the recent hype vary. Alarmist cries of a Mexican collapse help clinch the passage of measures to further militarize the southern border and obtain juicy contracts for private defense and security firms. Local politicians are finding they can be a cash cow for federal aid.

    The flurry of panic about the spillover of violence from Mexico also arises just as Congress considers the latest installment of the Merida Initiative, now tucked inside the omnibus spending bill. The Merida Initiative, designed by the Bush administration, is the $1.4 billion vehicle for bolstering the war on drugs launched by Mexican President Felipe Calderon in 2006. It provides military-to-military aid for the domestic battles being waged by some 40,000 Mexican Army troops, and imposes U.S. training in policing, forensics, penal, and judicial practices.
    Deconstructing Drug War Doublespeak

    Drug war doublespeak enables the architects of the drug war to justify the military responses it promotes, despite poor or counterproductive results, and serves to spin failure as success. The language of exaggerated threats infantilizes society with fear as it clears the way for militaristic, patriarchal measures.

    Now that the hype has taken control of the media agenda and wiggled its way into the public’s perceptions, it’s important to determine the true dimensions and nature of the problem by deconstructing drug war doublespeak.

    First, the "facts" used to prove the thesis of Mexico as a failed state or national security threat are mostly wrong. Here are a few examples:

    * "Mexico had more violent deaths than Iraq in 2008." The Iraq Body Count calculates the 2008 civilian death total at between 8,315 and 9,028. The Mexican government puts the Mexico tally for the same year at 6,290, and that figure includes the deaths of soldiers and police excluded from the Iraqi count.

    * "70% of Mexicans are afraid to go outside for fear of crime." This statistic has been cited without a source. It’s ridiculous. In a recent poll Mexicans nationwide named the economic situation over crime as the biggest problem in the country by a margin of two to one. I live in Mexico City with my family and our activities are virtually unaffected.

    * "The Mexican government has lost control over broad swathes of the country." No facts are offered to back this up. There are some villages and neighborhoods where crime gangs collect payments from local business and provide services, but that does not mean there is no presence of the State and this affects a relatively small proportion of the country.

    Second, the facts used to prove that Mexican violence is "spilling over"—the phrase du jour—into the United States, when provided at all, are even more specious.

    * Phoenix now ranks second in the world in kidnappings for ransom at 366, behind Mexico City at 6,000. We’re supposed to assume that this is a per capita ranking but are not told where the ranking comes from, how it is done, or by whom. Sloppy journalism is important to propagating doublespeak.

    Beyond the lack of sources for the ranking or methodology, the inaccuracy of this claim lies in what is left unsaid. "Kidnap for ransom" conjures images of the abduction of wealthy denizens of society. Such is not the case. According to Claudine LoMonaco who covers the beat for Arizona Public Media, the vast majority of kidnappings are of undocumented workers by their own smugglers, in an attempt to extort more money from their families.

    That’s certainly a problem, and it’s certainly kidnapping. But it is a very different problem than the spill-over of Mexican drug violence as it’s being portrayed. Here, another prohibitionist policy, this time one that prohibits human beings, has created an organized crime industry that insatiably feeds even on its own goods—the migrants themselves. The double bind of the victims is perhaps the most poignant example of perverse policy results in modern times.

    The 6,000 kidnapping figure for Mexico City has equally murky origins. The figure, from the Citizens’ Institute for Crime Studies, derives from taking the number of reported violent crimes, multiplying by nearly 10 to reflect the supposed rate of under-reporting, and multiplying by .05% to sort out kidnappings form the rest of the crimes. It’s a guesstimate, not a count.

    Moreover, the statistic includes thousands of cases of a common crime we don’t ordinarily think of as kidnapping. This is the "express kidnapping," 2-3 hour abductions for the purpose of withdrawing money from cash machines. So what we really have in this number that has been picked up widely in the U.S. press and trumpeted as proof of Mexico’s descent into lawlessness, is a rough calculation, padded with the far more common robbery charge. In deconstructing drug war doublespeak, it’s important to always beware of statistics.

    Excerpt. Please follow link for full text.

  77. 77.

    Comrade Dread

    March 19, 2009 at 12:57 pm

    Hey, that one’s already happening!

    Yeah. I know. And despite his leniency toward medical marijuana, Obama is giving off some signals that he supports the idea, at least, of more enforcement, including military action of our own. Goodie.

    Security is another hot topic, following the flare-up in drug cartel violence on the U.S.-Mexican border. Mr. Obama praised Calderon’s military response to the cartels but it hadn’t done much to stop the killings that claimed about 5,300 lives in 2008, according to MSNBC. The president is considering troop deployment along the border but Calderon wants him to do something about American drug use that keeps the cartels in business, Reuters reported.

    Can’t wait to read about more poorly researched no-knock raids that result in people getting gunned down by cops.

  78. 78.

    Ella in NM

    March 19, 2009 at 12:57 pm

    It’s a very serious problem mostly for Mexicans and Mexico.

    Wrong. I live 40 miles from El Paso, TX, and I promise you: Corruption and crime in Mexico is integrally connected to crime in the US, especially for border communities. Now, it’s not the "Lou Dobbs-Islamofacists in Iraq" fantasy at all. It’s just a VERY dangerous and serious issue that we need to address in a law enforcement way.

    Even if you are lucky enough to live further away from this mess, it will touch you because the Mexican drug cartels are funding American gang activity, which is fast becoming the Mafia of the 21st century. If you live in a major metro area, it will impact the safety and security of your city in ways that you may be able to distance yourself from, but these gangs are incredibly organized, and are quickly gaining power nationwide. It’s bad enough to hear on almost a daily basis about the suffering of the Mexican people who have been so badly cared for by their crappy government, or the beheadings in Juarez, Mexico, or the crossfire killings of innocent children in the streets, or the kidnapping/murder of police leaders. If you work in a hospital or school or social service program in El Paso or nearby NM towns on the border, you are on a daily basis having to deal with refugee family members and children connected to these gangs. Which puts you in tons of danger. Even if you are not, you can still be a target of this violence.

    Where I live, "jumping parties" are increasing in number, in which young (12 yrs old and up) inductees are recruited to walk through neighborhoods in groups (supervised by adult higher ups in the gang) to seek out opportunities to assault completely uninvolved, innocent bystanders who might be sitting in their front yard on a Saturday night. Two summers ago, my son’s best friend, a white kid from a upper-middle class family just happened to be visiting one of his football teammates at his home in a low-inome area of town, and while they were walking from their car to the house, they were jumped, beaten with chains, and stabbed. My son’s friend, had to be hospitalized–a 6’3", 250lb linebacker–because they came out of nowhere and they had no time to protect themselves or fight back. That summer, the same basic scenario took place, several times a week all over our county. There were several deaths, drive by shootings and other forms of gang related violence. It continues today. Local small gang-wannabes who want to get in good with the big guys down south can do a lot of damage on this side of the border to make brownie points, then run to Mexico to continue their lucrative careers. It’s overwhelming our strained law enforcement, judicial and social service systems, who have been begging the federal government for help, yet are ignored, doing nothing at the policy or fiscal level or to compensate our local resources.

    Please, don’t assume that just because idiots like Dobbs and Beck want to make hay out of an issue, there is no reason to take a look at the underlying story.

  79. 79.

    wilfred mohammed mendoza

    March 19, 2009 at 1:00 pm

    How much more of this are we expected to take? What would your country do if they were in our position?

  80. 80.

    Comrade Dread

    March 19, 2009 at 1:10 pm

    Even if you are lucky enough to live further away from this mess, it will touch you because the Mexican drug cartels are funding American gang activity, which is fast becoming the Mafia of the 21st century.

    And the quickest way to defund them would be to legalize the market for this stuff. I’m sure some gangs would find alternate sources of illegal income, but nothing nearly as lucrative.

  81. 81.

    Will

    March 19, 2009 at 1:13 pm

    I can only assume that Mexican Drug Cartel Lords have a lot more fun than Islamofascist Theocratic Jihadists. Therefore, I am really, really supportive of our new villains.

  82. 82.

    Ella in New Mexico

    March 19, 2009 at 1:34 pm

    @Comrade Dread:

    Agreed.

  83. 83.

    Ed Drone

    March 19, 2009 at 1:48 pm

    Here’s a thought: Since we already have a National Day of Prayer (blessed be!), wouldn’t it make sense to also have a National Day of Fear?

    Well, Beck, Dobbs & Co. already do a daily "Five-minute panic," usually combined with a five-minute hate, so we’d be getting off lightly if it were restricted to one day.

    Ed

  84. 84.

    TenguPhule

    March 19, 2009 at 1:54 pm

    So what’s the solution for this problem? Invade, like Iraq? Or are we sticking with the old standby of deporting all Mexicans?

    Pay the Mexicans to take care of our AIG/BOA/ML/WF problem.

    We can outsource our lynchings and tar and feathers now.

  85. 85.

    Hedley Lamarr

    March 19, 2009 at 1:58 pm

    The Pentagon would much rather invade and occupy Mexico than Af-Pak. Logistics would be loads easier and cheaper. Many of our volunteers already speak Spanish, so what’s not to love?

  86. 86.

    El Cid

    March 19, 2009 at 2:01 pm

    @Hedley Lamarr: Although dealing with an instant influx of say, 25 to 50 million refugees might be somewhat controversial.

  87. 87.

    AnneLaurie

    March 19, 2009 at 2:17 pm

    All you smart people are overthinking this. It’s SPRING BREAK SEASON and the talking hairdos want an excuse to go hang around the pools in Cancun and Alcapulco and video the lithe, tan, hardbodied Amurkin college kids’ mating rituals. The serious, important, deeply tragic political history outlined by previous commentors was there six months ago and will be there six months from now, but I will bet a store-bought cookie that Fox News’ new concern with our Mexican neighbors’ problems will disappear before May Day.

  88. 88.

    TenguPhule

    March 19, 2009 at 2:24 pm

    And the quickest way to defund them would be to legalize the market for this stuff. I’m sure some gangs would find alternate sources of illegal income, but nothing nearly as lucrative.

    I doubt it.

    With the firepower and cash they have already, they’d still control the supply to keep prices artficially high.

    Sorta like the diamond trade.

  89. 89.

    Comrade Dread

    March 19, 2009 at 2:52 pm

    With the firepower and cash they have already, they’d still control the supply to keep prices artficially high.

    Which is why the Capone gang still has a monopoly over the liquor industry.

    With the fear of legal reprisals gone, the risk of doing business falls which would reduce price on its own.

    Factor in that more people will enter the market and downward pressure on prices continue.

    Marijuana would fall the fastest as anyone could grow the stuff and supply would probably far outpace demand.

    Cocaine, heroin, and opium would probably follow suit within a few months as more suppliers joined in trying to get a piece of the multibillion dollar market, which would likewise precipitate a severe fall in price.

  90. 90.

    gwangung

    March 19, 2009 at 2:56 pm

    With the firepower and cash they have already, they’d still control the supply to keep prices artficially high.
    Sorta like the diamond trade.

    Um, dude….you’re not able to grow diamonds in your backyard…

    And you think gang guns will have any effect? When government guns haven’t???

  91. 91.

    lou

    March 19, 2009 at 2:57 pm

    The Mexican Government? Hell, the Mexicans voted them in, so all of them are responsible.

    Actually Wilfred, the election was very close. In fact, it was a Gore/Bush scenario.

    Like, I wouldn’t blame the American electorate for Bush in 2000.

    I wonder how the State Department warnings are affecting Mexico’s tourism industry. Just giving our neighbor to the south more reasons to resent us, since the drug wars can clearly be the fault of all the gringos buying drugs illegally. No demand, no supply.

  92. 92.

    protected static

    March 19, 2009 at 3:41 pm

    What’s funny about the right-wing noise about Teh Mexican Drug War Menace! is that there’s an growing right-wing noise machine dedicated to downplaying the exact same thing. Why? Because of the talk about gun control, of course. Build a wall! Shut out the Mexicans! But don’t even think about investigating someone who purchases a dozen AR15s per month (with cash). Nope, can’t have that.

    It’s like Thunderdome for right-wing talking points: two memes enter, one meme leaves.

  93. 93.

    ChrisA

    March 19, 2009 at 6:40 pm

    They’re all just slapping jello on the wall hoping something sticks and gives them some traction.

    There are promising signs that the electorate has finally wised up. However, I’ve never been one to underestimate the stupidity of the American voter.

  94. 94.

    TenguPhule

    March 19, 2009 at 7:39 pm

    And you think gang guns will have any effect? When government guns haven’t???

    Given that these are the same gangs are kicking the ass of third world governments, yes.

  95. 95.

    TenguPhule

    March 19, 2009 at 7:44 pm

    With the fear of legal reprisals gone, the risk of doing business falls which would reduce price on its own.
    Factor in that more people will enter the market and downward pressure on prices continue.

    Which is why drug cartels have every incentive to kill/rob competitors. Thus discouraging new entries into the market.

    The Invisible stranglehold of the Free Market at work.

  96. 96.

    TenguPhule

    March 19, 2009 at 7:48 pm

    Um, dude….you’re not able to grow diamonds in your backyard…

    Actually you can make diamonds with the right equipment.
    Diamond industry worked very hard to get naturals officially labeled as such.

  97. 97.

    gwangung

    March 19, 2009 at 7:55 pm

    Actually you can make diamonds with the right equipment.

    But not the backyard.

    Which is why drug cartels have every incentive to kill/rob competitors.

    Not when a) your competitors is equivalent to your customer base and b) they’re not playing on their home field. WAAAAAY easier to smuggle people and drugs as opposed to armament. And if they try to use domestic arms, that’s a lot easier to track as well.

    Sorry, but you’re just not making sense here.

  98. 98.

    TenguPhule

    March 19, 2009 at 8:57 pm

    Sorry, but you’re just not making sense here.

    Make it abroad, the local cartels will take them over and kill off the competition.

    Make it locally, the junkies and the dealers will rob and kill them.

  99. 99.

    Immoderate

    March 19, 2009 at 9:15 pm

    Yes, in the same way that the bootlegger gangs torched breweries and shot beer truck drivers after the end of Prohibition…

  100. 100.

    TenguPhule

    March 19, 2009 at 9:30 pm

    Yes, in the same way that the bootlegger gangs torched breweries and shot beer truck drivers after the end of Prohibition…

    bootleggers didn’t have billions at stake, weren’t hooked on their own product, nor the moral compass of a hyena.

  101. 101.

    Shade Tail

    March 19, 2009 at 9:48 pm

    @TenguPhule:

    bootleggers didn’t have billions at stake, weren’t hooked on their own product, nor the moral compass of a hyena.

    If you believe that, then you know absolutely nothing about 1920’s prohibition. What do you think Al Capone was involved in, that furniture restoration business he had on his cards? Alcohol prohibition caused exactly the same problems the drug "war" has caused today. And ending prohibition made it all fizzle and die.

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