Can we address this once and for all:
Pirates commandeered a United States-flagged container ship with 20 American crew members off the coast of Somalia on Wednesday, the first time an American-crewed ship was seized by pirates in the area.
The container ship, the Maersk Alabama, was carrying thousands of tons of relief aid to the Kenyan port of Mombasa, the company that owns the ship said.
The ship was taken by pirates at about 7:30 a.m. local time, 280 miles southeast of the Somali city of Eyl, a known haven for pirates, a spokesman for the United States Navy said. It is owned and operated by Maersk Line Limited, a United States subsidiary of A.P. Moller – Maersk Group, the Danish shipping giant.
Seriously. It is 2009 and even the Pirates of the Caribbean trilogy seems to be dead. Can’t we cut this out?
*** Update ***
I should have realized the Corner would view this as a major test of the new President:
Somali pirates have hijacked an American-flagged ship, taking hostage at least 20 Americans and their cargo — aid they were were trying to provide to the distressed Muslim people of Mombassa, Kenya. As Somali pirates have been terrorizing ships on the high seas for months now, TigerHawk is wondering why U.S. vessels haven’t been seized before now, and what our new commander-in-chief proposes to do about it.
Now that Iraq is out of the question, I guess he could invade North Korea as a response.
Rommie
Apparently paying the ransoms is still more cost-effective than forming convoys. It’s the only explanation I see for not having escorts in that area of water.
gex
Ah, you’re just mad the win in the ninth didn’t carry over to game 2. Wait, what are we talking about?
Observer
I agree, enough with the pirates.
Ninjas FTW.
ninjapirate.com/battle.html
J. Michael Neal
Any solution to this problem has to include putting an end to illegal waste dumping and illegal fishing in Somali waters.
WMass
I was under the impression that keeping our ships safe from pirates is one of the reasons we created the Navy in the first place.
Dear Navy:
Please stop jerking off over your latest massively expensive dysfunctional toy and do your fucking job.
Sincerely
The Taxpayers
TheFountainHead
I have no problem with Obama sending in the SEALs on this one.
Will
Piracy is on the rise big time worldwide. If you are a poor fishermen with no future prospects, you can pick up some guns, some buddies and take your boat out to the nearest container ship.
Kill the crew and sell the goods on the black market or ransom the ship back to the megacorp that owns it. Either way, it’s instant riches. And since the major power’s navies are more focused on waving their dicks at each other, it’s not even that risky.
Here’s a good book on the subject:
amazon.com/Outlaw-Sea-World-Freedom-Chaos/dp/0865477221/ref=pd_bbs_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1…
Stefan
The ship was taken by pirates at about 7:30 a.m. local time, 280 miles southeast of the Somali city of Eyl, a known haven for pirates, a spokesman for the United States Navy said. It is owned and operated by Maersk Line Limited, a United States subsidiary of A.P. Moller – Maersk Group, the Danish shipping giant.
How odd that the Somali city of Eyl, a known haven for pirates, is owned and operated by Maersk Line Limited, a United States subsidiary of A.P. Moller – Maersk Group, the Danish shipping giant…..
The Other Steve
Seals?
I was thinking something like the USS Iowa and off shore bombardment.
Sadly, I think all the battleships have been decommissioned.
TheFountainHead
@The Other Steve: Well, yeah, you could do that, but then you kill a lot of innocents, which gets politically sticky. Also, murder.
I’m thinking the SEALs might be more tactical.
El Tiburon
Who said the following, John Cole or George W. Bush:
"See, the irony is what they really need to do is to get Syria to get Hezbollah to stop doing this shit,"
Time to invade Somalia and shove some goddamn democracy down their throat. Will someone please call Halliburton and Blackwater please?
I am simply shocked that you still think we can simply "address this once and for all." Have the last 8-years taught you nothing?
caminovereda
Give a man a fish, he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish, he takes his boat and finds a way to pay someone else to get fish for him. While I don’t think there is an easy fix to systemic problems like this, I’m guessing trying to take them out with large military ships would be like whack-a-mole – they’d just keep popping up. There’s just too much money to be made if they’re successful.
Sam Hutcheson
It bears considering that the pirate culture is the closest thing Somalia has to an operative "free market."
If they’re not killing people and the ransom is cheaper than deploying a battlegroup, pay the damned ransom.
fester
As to why a US flagged ship has not been captured before — I submit it was mainly a matter of opportunity — the US has very few US flagged merchant vessels any more ~ 1% of the world’s total
bts.gov/publications/national_transportation_statistics/html/table_01_23.html
So this is not a grand geo-strategic state-backed challenge to Obama but a high-seas mugging and not a whole lot more than that.
John S.
We may not have any active "battleships", but we sure do have a giant fucking fleet of other vessels that can blow shit up.
toujoursdan
As long as Somalia remains a failed state, the population is going to turn to increasingly desperate measures to feed itself.
On our local French Canadian 24 hour news channel they recently had an in-depth story about the thousands of boat people fleeing Somalia for Yemen across the Gulf of Aden. These boat people are subject to all the abuses of human trafficking – high prices, indentured servitude, rape, beatings and killings by the traffickers. And it is overwhelming the local populace on the Yemen coastline, which is already poor and causing a humanitarian crisis. Hundreds of bodies are washing up there weekly.
We washed our hands of that part of the world in the 1990s but that doesn’t mean the problem has gone away. There don’t seem to be easy answers on what to do though.
J.
Here’s what I don’t get: Everyone knows there are pirates operating off the coast of Somalia. So wtf are ships tempting fate (i.e., not avoiding that area), or not being appropriately armed to combat them if they have to take that route?
Jon H
Oooh, get her.
The implication being that Obama, what, canceled the secret nuclear sub escorts that Bush had in place?
Stevan
Since the number of pirates seems to be increasing again, does that mean that global warming will start to decline in a reversal of the pirate vs global warming graph at the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster?
WJ
We need to go to the UN Security Council and talk to them. Next would be a very stern letter.
Comrade Dread
I concur with Observer. Send ninjas instead.
Alternatively, this is clearly the fault of Tehran for something something reason and they should clearly be bombed now.
Gus
No, the implication is that the pirates were afraid that George W. Bush was gonna personally go Rambo and go kick pirate ass.
Lennox
It’s so rare that I comment on here that I hate to do it to agree with the frackin’ corner, but I think it (as in the overall Somali pirate/chaos situation) is actually a test, depending on how Obama handles it. If he is able to visibly take action to improve the situation (I have no clue what that action would be, mind you) then it will be a serious feather in his cap on alot of levels. Politically, it would do more than twenty G20’s to improve his stature on the world stage. Morally, it would go along way towards progress in improving the circumstances facing so many Africans – which would also have the welcome side effect of reinforcing the political benefit. And here at home, alot of Americans of many different political persuasions would love to feel just a little bit of redemption when it comes to the topic of Somalia.
Of course, the problem is actually accomplishing an improvement is a huge task that will take more than putting some big boats off the coast. To stop the Somali pirates, one must venture inland, through proxy or with a gun. And there’s no guarantee that anything we did wouldn’t make things worse, or even possibly turn into a bay of pigs type debacle. So if he swings and misses at this one, the fallout could be huge, in all the ways listed above and more.
Now there is the safer idea of a special forces type rescue, and if anyone could pull it off, those boys could. But what happens when the next ship gets captured?
I suppose the safest bet politically would be to just take it one crisis at a time. But eventually, the fires we’ve let burn in Africa will engulf the whole world if something doesn’t change.
srv
Pirating goes on in SE Asia also, just not on the scale of supertankers and what-not.
Like everything else DoD did, they have a lot of hammers, and few tools for fly swatting. And the Somalis showed the Rangers and SEALS a good time in Mogidishu. We’ve had covert stuff going on in-country for a long time now, and all that doesn’t seem to have mitigated the pirates.
As long as the world is dumping their crap off Somalia, and we’re always trying to re-in-dis-en-de-stabalize it, I don’t think we have much reason for complaining about their profiteers.
passerby
…especially when a half-dozen pirates from a third world country, in 15 foot dinghies with outboard motors (ferchrissakes!) are pulling this off on the high seas .
Something’s going on here. And since we can smell the bullshit from half a world away but are being told Faerie Tales as explanation, we’re left with no other option than Tinfoil Hat musings.
Even the Chinese and Indians have sent naval ships to the area in response to this problem.
Dinghies with outboard motors vs any nation’s navy and the pirates win? Please, can we cut this out?
lioneagle
Referring to yourself as Tigerhawk seems so cool.
Man, lioneagle feels so much more like a warrior now.
Lennox
@Stefan: ok… wow…
I’m hoping that was an attempt at snark… But even if it was, what was that about correcting other people’s grammar?
r€nato
Rightards – who apparently have forgotten about 9/11 – are whining about Obama’s nation-building initiative in Afghanistan.
(of course, not engaging in nation-building after we helped the mujahideen kick the Soviets out of Afghanistan contributed to 9/11, but it’s awfully inconvenient for them to mention that)
Somalia is a failed state. This is what happens when politicians turn their backs on nation-building; anarchy happens and bad guys take advantage of it.
There needs to either be an international effort – including African neighbors – to re-establish rule of law and a functional government in Somalia so that people can earn a living without resorting to piracy, or else we will have to establish a medium-to-long term naval presence (along with our allies) to patrol a rather vast stretch of ocean off of Somalia.
The former is not going to happen, so either we live with a certain amount of piracy or else we start convoys for international shipping, where ships group together and sail through those waters with naval escorts. I’m sure the Pentagon has looked into it and I would imagine that it has not yet been done beyond the current scope because it would require a diversion of naval resources from other duties which are considered more important.
Lennox
@srv:
Best.word.ever.
Zandar
Logic dictates that Obama should deploy Ninjas to battle the pirates with.
El Cid
I don’t think no damn Alabama boys got no business sailin’ off the coast of Somalia any damn way. They don’t need to go way out there to get no damn bass no way.
srv
I have a great idea. Since the last Weekly Standard or National Review cruise went way over budget, let’s sponsor another one for them and have the crew sail it to Somalia.
We can even have Michael Flately coreograph the bathroom breaks.
The Grand Panjandrum
Well they don’t call it N "AAARRRRR" O for nothing, right?
passerby
Here’s a link from a Dec 18, 2008 article about how the Chinese mobilized their navy in response to Somali pirates.
And this link about the Indian navy sinking a pirate ship back on Nov 19, 2008.
So the force of navies from around the globe cannot contain some rag tag pirates. Uh Huh.
OriGuy
CBS radio is reporting that the crew of the ship have overpowered some of the pirates and thrown three of them overboard. We’re not talking Henry Morgan or Blackbeard here. It looks like part of the ship is still under the pirates’ control, though.
Robin G.
@Will: I was under the impression that the pirates weren’t generally killing anyone.
Somalia is a wreck, which is why everyone is taking advantage of their inability to police their own waters. Other nations are dumping toxic waste, engaging in fishing practices long known to be destructive, generally doing whatever they can get away with because there’s no one to stop them. The pirates aren’t being captured because as soon as they get to land, the locals hide and protect them. In the eyes of the Somalian peasants, these guys are Robin Hood and his Merry Men.
We’re not going to have a lot of luck stomping on people who are stealing from the rich to care for their families and friends. Something will have to be done to aid Somalia first before we can get anywhere.
Ed Marshall
Korfa: Taban, Do you see that American flagged vessel? Easy pickings, we couldn’t move against it when the manly, vengeful, Bush was in office, but now we are free to act.
Taban: They all belong to international corporations anyway, it’s probably heading to Liberia to re-register right now. What the hell are you talking about?
Korfa: I don’t know, I’m a pitiful creature imagined up by paint huffers at the corner, what do you want?
Lennox
@Zandar:
eff ninjas… we need Cholas
r€nato
uh-huh.
And whom do the SEALs kill? I don’t think these pirates run around looking like Jack Straw. Unless we have some intelligence on where to find the pirates (maybe we can find their super-secret clubhouse), these Rambo fantasies about surgical hit-and-run attacks are just that, fantasies.
Or maybe you knock off the guys who are hiring the pirates. Then – just like the drug lords in Mexico – another gang of pirate-masters steps up to take their place.
There’s no easy solution to this that doesn’t involve killing lots of innocents or getting too involved in Somalia’s problems.
I think Obama’s administration is looking at this as a nuisance to be contained. According to me at least, it pales in comparison to things like stabilizing Iraq so that we can withdraw our forces, ‘winning’ Afghanistan and containing Iran.
Dennis-SGMM
The CIA Factbook page for Somalia gives a lot of perspective on why this is happening and why sending in a couple of brigades of [Insert Name of Favorite Badasses] will do little to ameliorate the piracy.
Somalia is a failed state and has been one since 1991. It is broken up into a patchwork of autonomous regions in some places down to the clan level. Kenya and Ethiopia, which share the longest borders with Somalia, exert influence only to the extent of attempting to keep the fighting in Somalia from spilling over into their respective countries.
Remember "Blackhawk Down"? That was a fictionalized version of The Battle of Mogadishu, or what actually happened the last time we sent in some badasses to deal with Somalia.
Jon H
@passerby: "Dinghies with outboard motors vs any nation’s navy and the pirates win? Please, can we cut this out?"
Don’t forget – there was a Pentagon wargame back in 2002, where one Lt. Gen devastated a typical fleet using small, fast boats.
Small fast boats like the pirates use are a big problem, even for a Navy with big ships and big guns.
Lennox
Nevermind.
JenJen
In its April issue, Vanity Fair had a fantastic piece about Somali Pirates seizing a luxury French sailing ship. It was illuminating and I’d recommend it to anyone who wants to know more about how these pirates operate.
Even though they use grenade launchers and AK-47s and seem to be very intimidating, they’re really not violent and are only into the money. The part of the article I enjoyed the most was when the French crew were dining on their typical delectables, and invited their Somali captors to join in, but the Somalis were more content eating their nasty old lamb that had been brought to them by one of their compadres. In another interesting section, the French Captain had hid all the female members of crew in a hold below, and when they were discovered by the Somalis, the Somalis were offended that the French thought they might harm the women.
As much as this piracy needs to be stopped, it is not a freaking military event, and we’d be wise not to blow this out of proportion. For centuries, shipping magnates have ruled in part by taking ruthless advantage of the relatively lawless seas. In essence, piracy is a taste of their own medicine. I’m not advocating it, but it’s a fair enough point. I’m not saying their good guys; they aren’t. But like most pirates throughout history, they are absolutely apolitical.
** Atanarjuat **
Naturally, Somali pirates have become increasingly bolder.
Anyone who is not an Obama Juicer knows that the President has indisputably declared to the world that, unlike the Bush administration, we are willing to "listen," "negotiate," and take our cues from Middle East leaders (bowing to the Saudi king proves this).
For hopey-changey liberals, this is seen as homehow improving American foreign relations. Everyone else in their right mind sees this correctly as weakness.
Sensing weakness, predators always close in. First, taking down minor agents (i.e., the Maersk Alabama), then, as the Obama administration passively remains supine and "understanding" in the face of such threats to American security, our enemies will become even more strident and confident and deliver larger blows to our nation.
But remember, leftists, it’s those tea parties that should be worrying us, not anyone else who is poised to do us real harm. Nice set of priorities you’ve got there.
-A
r€nato
He’s not your commander-in-chief unless you are a member of the military.
I am really fucking tired of this euphemism for "Dear Leader".
Enough. He is the president. He is not your commander-in-chief nor mine unless you are in the military.
passerby
An impoverished people can be bought for a paltry sum. Someone’s funding this "operation". But why? For what purpose?
Dennis cites information from the CIA "Fact"book page.
CIA? , the vanguard of the MIC? Say no more.
Trollhattan
WTF is a "TigerHawk"? If there are mutant flying tigers* fluttering about issuing policy demands, then we have a much bigger problem than a pack of skinny, gun-totin’, speedboat-wheelin’, ship-climbin’ Somali pirates.
Help, a flying tiger just stole my child and dog from the backyard and instructed me to continue blockading Cuba!
(IIUC, maritime law is very murky WRT military intervention in international waters, and that you can’t simply blast speedboats out of the water even if you’re sure they’re up to no good.)
** Any reference to mid-20th century Indochina is strictly coincidental.
r€nato
Naturally. The moment Barack Hussein Osama was "elected", the pirates knew that the secret muslim in the White House would tolerate their escalation of piracy with a wink and a nod.
Thanks for reminding us why the right is at the beginning of a long, long period in the political wilderness.
AhabTRuler
Look at the expansion of the Royal Navy (hey Britty!) in the 18th c. as an example of the difficulty of anti-piracy efforts. It requires a large number of small craft and experienced and intelligent commanders. Plus, if you think that house-to-house searches are difficult, try doing boarding missions against a well-armed and motivated opponent (now with hostages!). If only there was a small, well-trained force that specialized in boarding actions?!
The fact that the pirates use small and captured/converted vessels makes target identification more difficult, and the sea is a frickin’ big place.
The Moar You Know
The Somali coastline is the size of the United States’. That’s a lot of territory to cover.
r€nato
Yes, George W. Bush never bowed to a Saudi royal. He just slipped them the tongue instead.
Stevan
If Obama bowing to the Saudi king means that we are now taking our cues from Middle East leaders, what did it mean when Bush held hands? That we were willing to, uh, ummm…
r€nato
Yeah, being a stubborn, belligerent jackass who can never admit he’s wrong about anything whatsoever sure worked wonders the last 8 years. It caused the Iraqi insurgency to throw down their weapons, it motivated the North Koreans to decommission their nuclear weapons program and likewise the Iranians.
Idiot.
me
CNN is reporting the crew has retaken the ship.
Dennis-SGMM
Most of the world’s vessels are registered either in Panama or Liberia because of the low fees and taxes offered by both of those nations. The Maersk Alabama, as an American flagged ship, was a rare exception. No matter who owns them, most of the pirated vessels are legally Panamanian or Liberian and no business of ours. The pirates are a pain in the ass to be sure, I just can’t justify taking military action in Somalia on behalf of owners who registered their vessels in other countries to dodge taxes.
Zifnab
@Ed Marshall: I was going to say… there’s your Bush-ian solution right there. Stop registering the ships as American. Vwalaa! No more problem.
Also, in accordance with the 2nd Amendment, why is every single sailor on that ship not decked out with rocket launchers and mini-guns? If everyone on board had a bandier of grenades, these attacks wouldn’t happen.
Why are we calling in the Navy when Free Market Principles(tm) can clearly be better employed to keep our merchants safe?
gex
@toujoursdan:
Fixed. Why all of you want the government to go take what these people have earned through their efforts is beyond me. /snark.
How do we get the pirates to go Galt?
r€nato
Bin Laden was sure impressed by Bush’s strength, so much so that he waited 9 whole months into his first term to commit the worst terrorist attack ever on US soil.
And when Bush followed through on his bluster and promises to capture bin Laden…
…he really showed terrorists around the world that they shouldn’t mess with the US.
…and he proved that he was truly not concerned about him, seeing as for the remaining 7 years of Bush’s time in office, OBL remained a free man.
JenJen
@Dennis-SGMM: Word.
The Bobs
Ex-Navy officer here.
The only way to stop this would be to blockade their ports. We could search every vessel leaving port (there aren’t very many of them in Somalia, maybe a dozen) to ensure they do not have weapons. I’m sure there are a lot of political problems with this idea though. Avoiding this area is not practical. The US ship just captured was going to Kenya, they had to traverse the pirated region.
Also for the wing-nuts who pointed out that this is the first US vessel captured, there are very few US flag vessels. Most shippers choose countries like Liberia or Panama to register their ships. These countries charge little and have no real standards for ship maintenance and crew training.
Sarcastro
Naturally, Somali pirates have become increasingly bolder.
That’s what happens after eight years of a failed foreign policy… dumbass.
Sarcastro
oops
wilfred
I kind of like living in a world where there are still pirates on the high seas. As far as I know they haven’t killed anyone yet, unlike what some countries did in Somalia.
Somalia is one of the most desperate places on earth. I heard from someone who would know, I think, that the amount of money they receive is pretty exaggerated but what they do get is used to offset the misery of their clans and tribes.
I guess black Africans never get to play Robin Hood.
Zifnab
@AhabTRuler:
They’re called "Pirates", Ahab. Get with the program. What have we just been talking about?
AhabTRuler
@Jon H: Just prior to the Argentine invasion of the Falklands, RN Admiral Sandy Woodward, in a wargame with a US carrier group, managed to sneak into range of the carrier and "sink" it with an Exocet. IIRC, all of the Admiral Woodward’s "fleet" were sunk in the effort, but he never had anything larger than a County anyway.
Anti-Shipping missiles are cheap. Small, fast craft are cheap. Aircraft Carriers are expensive and vulnerable. It is, in the loosest sense, the torpedo boat problem all over again.
scarshapedstar
Tax cuts for the rich would trickle down to the pirates and make them ply a more honest trade. You betcha!
AkaDad
Obama is emboldening the pirates with his inaction. He could keep his promise of decreasing nuclear warheads by dropping a few on Somalia.
AhabTRuler
Fixeteth.
You still need the craft, and it helps if your Marines aren’t getting chewed up occupying a foreign country, but whadda ya want from me, Policy?
I still think it isn’t worth the effort, but anti-piracy patrols can effective. Piracy is a business, and it incurs significant capital costs and requires structures and organization to operate (not a bunch of guys with parrots and patches). There isn’t the demand for piracy in the same way that there is for drugs, and there isn’t the same large-scale popular support as an insurgency (more of a local "Godfather" situation). I agree with others who argue that the most effective solution is to address structural instability in the region, but that is hardly the most practicable solution (would that it weren’t).
The RN reduced piracy in the 18th c. and then ate our lunch in two wars at sea using essentially the same tactics: small fast craft that could run down and destroy most any threat.
SLKRR
@The Moar You Know:
Huh?
someguy
Good luck marching your ass into a different port of call every day or two (e.g. Boston, NJ, Norfolk, Charleston, Miami, or Brest, Rotterdam, Hamburg) on an African-flagged private vessel armed to the teeth. Assuming the coastal authority let you in, you probably wouldn’t get out.
Martian Buddy
Two points:
1) The Gulf of Aden is a major shipping route, particularly for oil tankers — there’s no easy way to avoid the area.
2) The U.S. 5th fleet is, in fact, working to patrol the area as part of a U.N. effort to curb piracy. As The Moar You Know pointed out, however, there are several hundred miles of coastline to cover. Asking "why can’t we stop the pirates?" is somewhat akin to asking "why can’t we stop the drug shipments?"
Edit to add: that pirate ship that the Indian navy sank was a captured fishing trawler, with the captive fishing crew still on board. Tough luck for them.
Kyle
Tim for a ‘Petraeus Solution’. Pay the pirates gobs of money and give them gobs of weapons not to attack ships, and declare "The Pirate Surge is working" while droolers chant your name and sneer at your skeptics. Yeah, it works great as long as you keep giving them money and guns until the end of time.
wilfred
Right. They should try Gaza…oops! still under blockade.
I can’t believe anyone takes this propaganda seriously.
** Atanarjuat **
@r€nato:
Oye, r€natito, mi amiguito, I never said anything about musulmanes vis-a-vis President Obama or any Somalis, be they pirates or otherwise.
That whole Seekrit Mooslim inanity is just chaff concocted by a few hard-right idiots and rigorously amplified by liberals (here’s looking at you, cabrito) to make all conservatives look delusional and desperate. No sane conservatives believe such a thing, so the smear continues to fall flat.
Now, with that jackalope dispatched, you can jeer at the Bush administration all you want in typical leftist fashion, but let’s see what the score is so far:
American vessels seized by Somali pirates before 2009: 0.
American vessels seized by Somali pirates in 2009: 1 (and counting).
Embarrassment felt by Obama’s most ardent supporters: priceless.
-A
Zifnab
Iraq nearly landlocked. We don’t need Marines, we need our own set of Pirates. They’re fashionable, they’re self-motivated, and they work for various forms of booty.
I mean, if we wanted to be smart, we could organize convoys of Naval Ships to do escorts on large collections of US vessels. Just require that all vessels be registered as American and you kill two birds with one stone – protect the ships and collect the taxes.
I think it’s something of a fool’s errand to do patrols off a random country’s coast. Like it’s been mentioned upthread, Somalia has as much coast as the US. And if you managed to patrol all of that, you’d be spending – what? – billions of dollars to protect millions of dollars in cargo?
I mean, if you want to get serious, you address the cities that pirates operate out of. They’re all starved for work, so give them jobs. Throw a few million dollars into infrastructure projects. Upgrade their electrical grid or their docks. Then train up a bunch of guys as maintenance techs and they’ll fish for a lifetime.
A little job training and some capital can go a long way. Hell, most of them are substance farmers. Drop a few million dollars on wells or irrigation and they’ll get back to growing crops.
passerby
Since many countries have deployed their navies to the area, how much more of a problem would it be for them to provide escorts for their merchant ships? say, form a gauntlet through which they could safely pass.
Piracy is a known problem for the region, in my thinking there are too many ways prevent or suppress this activity all within maritime law.
And here’s a link to a Jan 2, 2009 article about the French navy capturing Somali Pirates.
And the Russians are coming. (From a blog that follow Piracy.)
Ok, so far we have the navies from the US, French, Russian, Chinese, Indian, and who else has gotten in on the act of supressing the Mighty Pirates of Somalia…
r€nato
bucaiolo. Sono italiano, non messicano.
Cafone.
wilfred
American vessels seized and recaptured without the wanton slaughter of hundreds/thousands/tens of thousands/hundreds of thousands of dark skinned Muslims, or American lives: 1
r€nato
@** Atanarjuat **:
American lives lost to terrorist attacks before 2009: 3,000
American lives lost to terrorist attacks after 2009: 0 (and counting)
American cities lost to natural disaster due to federal incompetence before 2009: 1
American cities lost to natural disaster due to federal incompetence after 2009: 0 (and counting)
Embarrassing your pathetic ass: priceless.
scav
Atanarjuat not understanding the small number problem in statistics: Inevitable.
Zifnab
@someguy:
Um… duh. You’re armed to the teeth. You shoot your way in and shoot your way back out again. :-p
I mean, setting aside the ridiculousness of the idea, you’d probably have to secure or off-load all the hardware before entering US waters. But, from a functional perspective, there’s no reason why you couldn’t arm up in Liberia, sail around the Horn to Kenya, sail back, unload the guns, and come back to the States again.
That’s ignoring the fact that I was kinda being snarky.
Stefan
The Somali coastline is the size of the United States’. That’s a lot of territory to cover.
No, it’s not. Just look at a map.
Dennis-SGMM
No one could have anticipated that ignoring the descent into anarchy of a state along a critical maritime corridor would lead to Bad Things.
r€nato
breaking news: the US crew has retaken the ship from the pirates.
I look forward to Atanarjuat giving credit to Obama’s steely leadership.
** Atanarjuat **
@r€nato:
Cafone?
Il tuo nonno, pigliainculo.
-A
TenguPhule
Successful Major Domestic Terrorist Attacks by foreign nationals before Bush was in charge: 0
Successful Major Domestic Terrorist Attacks by foreign nationals after Bush was in charge: 1 (possibly 2)
We can play this game all day.
Will
The Somalis aren’t killing anyone. The pirates in Southeast Asian are very much murdering the crews and dumping the bodies overboard.
toujoursdan
The Somali coastline is approx 3000 mi/4800 km long, which is about as long as the continental US is wide.
JenJen
And right on schedule, Our Lady Of Perpetual Outrage jumps on the Pirate Bandwagon. Arrrrrrr!
r€nato
@** Atanarjuat **:
your amazing ability to use the interwebz to google italian insults in a matter of mere minutes, is as impressive as the ‘arguments’ you make here.
by the way, my nonno has been dead for 15 years. If you had the nerve to insult him to my face (which you wouldn’t but let’s pretend we’re in the imaginary world where you live all the time), you’d be swallowing all of your remaining teeth. With extreme prejudice.
passerby
The Royal Navy is doing its part in the war on pirates.
And the Germans…
Zifnab
Araj, you totally left out the whole "Stock Market plunged 1400 points since Obama took office!" Cause and effect! I haz commandz ov it!
TenguPhule
The problem is not enough ships and too much ocean.
All of the money has gone to fewer, more sophisticated ships.
For anti-piracy, numbers count for a lot.
We need to start rebuilding those WW-II era destroyers for patrols.
AhabTRuler
You want to sacrifice free passage of the seas right now?
I already said: "I agree with others who argue that the most effective solution is to address structural instability in the region, but that is hardly the most practicable solution (would that it were
n’t[whoops! -ed.])."Tom65
@** Atanarjuat **:
First off, I kinda doubt the pirates give a rat’s ass about the flag of the ship they’re about to hijack. Additionally, you’ve conveniently ignored the fact – pointed out several times in this thread – that US-flagged ships comprise a miniscule percentage of the world’s fleet, so the percentages have always played in the US’ favor.
But don’t let that get in the way of a cheap shot at Obama.
Richard Bottoms
New update: Our guys retook the ship.
We’re the USA motherfucker.
** Atanarjuat **
@r€nato:
** Atanarjuat **
@r€nato:
passerby
Japanese destroyers were mobilized to the region in mid March.
As well as the navies of Greece and Spain.
By golly, we got us a bonafide WWIII in progress: All nations vs Somali Pirates. Seems a bit lopsided to me. Here’s hoping truth, justice and commerce prevails.
With so many navies jockying for a chance to vanquish the Mighty Pirates of Somalia, it’s a wonder all those battleships aren’t ramming into one another.
Punchy
I’d think by now these cargo ships that sail past Somalia would have installed 50-cal automatics in the hull and given each sailor a bazooka to fire.
Sink these fuckers’ boats with one shot. BOOM. Done. Pirates now fish food.
scav
Yep, we have to admit, we lost another opportunity for an expensive knee-jerk international and massively expensive mistake. Rat Fink.
Brick Oven Bill
Obama needs to tell this crew that they are supposed to surrender and apologize.
** Atanarjuat **
@r€nato:
Ah! An Internet tough guy!
Vaffanculo, vigliacco.
-A
Sarcastro
You mean while Obama was still rubbing his chin worriedly, awaiting a call from Riyadh for directions on how to proceed, those American crew members who were seized by Somali pirates broke free and retook their own vessel?
Yea, Bush would have already invaded…. I don’t know. New Zealand or something. That would show ’em.
That sounds more like a case of praise-worthy bravery by the American crew members, not due to any dithering by President Teleprompter.
Naturally, American sailors have become increasingly bold… (sigh) -er due to Obama’s steely determination.
milo
Odds that US DOD has no contingency plans for responding to piracy involving US flag ships.
Odds that US DOD contingency plans involve total control of large areas traversed by small craft. (See e.g. Operation Market Time)
Odds that US DOD will be totally forthcoming in regards to events on the Maersk Alabama.
I’m going with zip, zero, nada.
Dennis-SGMM
@Punchy:
Most large vessels are automated to the point that they are crewed by around twenty sailors. Radar has obviated the need for lookouts but Radar doesn’t detect the Zodiac-type boats used by the pirates. Much of the time, the first notice the crew has of an attack is when the pirates show up on the bridge.
passerby
And representing the Southern Hemisphere, our Aussy cousins have join the fight.
Hell, even the Danish navy put its dog in the fight.
So far: USA, Japan, China, India, Denmark, Germany, Great Britain, Greece, Spain, Australia, Russia, and France have mobilized their navies to the region. What a party. Who am I overlooking?
To support this Herculean effort, I’m going to do my part by planting a Victory Garden.
passerby
"NATO member states have approved the operational plan for a second anti-piracy mission to begin later this month. Seven naval vessels from Canada, Germany, the Netherlands, Portugal, Spain and the United States are expected to be on patrol in the region until early July."
Oh and Canada, of course, and how could we forget the powerful and important participation of the navies of Portugal, and the Netherlands. Anchors aweigh my boys!
Them dirty pirates were askin’ for a fight and they gonna get them a fight.
[Anyone still think the problem is Somali pirates?]
Brick Oven Bill
Obama must assign legal counsel for the families of the pirates who got thrown overboard to drown, to create a complaint against Maersk Line. Economic opportunities are very limited in Somalia, leading otherwise good men to become pirates. The pirates’ actions were a result of their circumstance, which was not their fault.
Mnemosyne
@** Atanarjuat **:
So they were supposed to wait around for the government to come help them instead of doing things on their own? What kind of conservative are you that you think that people should wait around for the government to solve their problems for them?
Dennis-SGMM
Pirates versus the Vikings! I smell mini-series!
Edit: Or a very weird sports event.
JenJen
@** Atanarjuat **: How do you know that no counter-piracy effort was launched by the United States or her allies?
Do you have Somali sources, or something? When the Somalis took the French sailing vessel Ponant captive, the French launched a military effort without the knowledge of the French captain, the Somalis, or the media. Still, the owner of the vessel paid the Somalis their ransom, and the crisis ended peacefully, much to Sarkozy’s grandstanding chagrin.
JoJo
Pirates hijacking a ship full of humanitarian aid? It’s right out of Atlas Shrugged. The wingnuts should be full of praise for these noble, downright Galtean heroes!
** Atanarjuat **
@Mnemosyne:
I hardly call using American military forces to rescue captured Americans a case of waiting "around for the government to come help them."
You’re intentionally conflating the protection of American citizens abroad — a proper function of government — with keeping Americans dependent and unable to rely on themselves — the liberal view of government.
Fortunately, the outcome worked out for the best, and it showed that individual American courage is far from dead, contrary to what leftists keep insisting on.
President Obama should personally thank those sailors for helping him dodge responsibility on this particular matter.
-A
Jon H
@Punchy: "I’d think by now these cargo ships that sail past Somalia would have installed 50-cal automatics in the hull and given each sailor a bazooka to fire."
That’d just give the pirates an incentive to shoot to kill whenever they approach any ship. As far as I know, these pirates have a pretty good record as far as not harming the crews. (SE Asian pirates, not so much.)
Put it this way: if you were driving a company car, would you really put your life on the line to defend it from a carjacker?
Brick Oven Bill
The fourth pirate will not be able to get a fair trial in Africa, and Obama needs to bring him into the US to receive a fair trial. The pirate’s jury needs to include at least three other Somalis so this trial shall be held in Minneapolis, Minnesota. A public defender proficient in the pirate’s dialect shall be provided.
When this pirate is found not guilty, he needs to be taken in as a refugee, as his village would throw goat manure at him for being overwhelmed by an unarmed crew if he was returned to Somalia. Obama need to ensure proper welfare benefits and family reunification rights are extended so that this misunderstood youth can become a productive member of American society.
Dennis-SGMM
@JoJo:
Darn tootin’! These pirates are providing a completely free market solution to their economic needs without any help from any government. Of course, the fact that they don’t have any government may have led them to choose piracy.
passerby
@Dennis-SGMM:
Ha. It’s got Reality TV written all over it. Imagine: White folk dressed in horned helmets and animal pelts armed with laser equipped axes vs black folk dressed in rags and armed to the teeth with military weaponry.
** Atanarjuat **
@JenJen:
That’s a fair question, JenJen. No one really knows (yet) what the U.S. Navy, under the supposed direct orders of President Obama, was already endeavoring to free the captured American crew members.
However, using that kind of thinking as a way to rationalize any outcome, one could conclude that almost any progress on the world stage is due to the behind-the-scenes efforts of a humble yet quietly aggressive Obama administration.
Sadly, I gave up reading comic books sometime during puberty, so I’m not as apt to cling to heroic fantasies as die-hard members Obama’s fan club.
-A
gbear
The ship’s crew has retaken control. They’ve got one pirate in custody and it sounds like the rest are ‘In the water’.
JenJen
@** Atanarjuat **: Psssst… before you start swinging dicks in celebration, the AP reports that the crew has not retaken the vessel, and that the captain remains a hostage. (Update: The Pentagon says the crew has retaken the ship, and that negotiations (read: ransom payment) are underway. But the AP disputes this report.)
At any rate, what ever happened to waiting for facts before jumping to foolish conclusions?
Edit: In response to #119, I’m not rationalizing anything. But this was not a military attack and the ship is not a naval vessel. I’m not convinced that much could be done outside of the private owner of the vessel offering or negotiating the payment of ransom, the way every one of these incidents seems to be concluded. Since when are wingnuts against private industry?
TenguPhule
BOB is obviously not familiar with the laws of the high seas.
Trollhattan
Hey great, it’s the BOB and Ahmadinejad show. Good times.
The military protocol on these siezures is quite clear (and has been so long before 1.20.09). Once pirates are aboard the first concern is to protect lives the crew, second is protect the ship and cargo. As a result, armed action isn’t really an option, as a firefight is going to get crew members killed. Period. Military intervention has to happen before a ship is taken (Ninja TigerHawks dropping on deck in the dead of night, nonwithstanding).
The ships’ owners certainly wouldn’t have it any other way.
TenguPhule
Yeah, the world navies might have something to say about that.
They tend to get nervous when foreign civilian ships start packing heat.
TenguPhule
Good, when do you plan on apologizing to Carter?
Michael Keyes
Atanarjuat,
Can you show me the primary source where the liberal government demand that individual citizens such as this crew of American sailors are told that they cannot be self reliant? As a veteran, I am not aware of any such instructions.
The Master and first mate were both graduates of the Merchant Marine Academy and I am pretty sure that they were not told to be subservient and to wait for a government bailout.
Why don’t you just look at this incident for what it really is, a well trained American crew doing its job in spite of the pirates. Any attempt to politicize this incident is an insult to this fine crew.
** Atanarjuat **
@JenJen:
That’s another good question, JenJen, and you could just as easily have asked this of your fellow liberals above my own comments on the matter.
Of course news reports are coming in and further details are still being released. I (wrongly, it seems) assumed that you knew this, and didn’t think I had to qualify my agreement with the others here with "let’s wait for the facts before jumping to conclusions." Double standards, it seems.
But to allay your deep concern that I’m somehow "swinging my dick in celebration," no, I’m hardly doing that, and I’ll be more relieved than anything when the news reports confirm without a shadow of a doubt that the crew members of the Maersk Alabama have indeed retaken their own ship and are all safe.
-A
passerby
@Jon H:
Someone else upthread also pointed this out and I agree. The impoverished Somalies don’t seem to be violent people. They’ve been co-opted by the real trouble makers with the promise of money and reward for themselves and their families/clans.
The entities funding this effort are not Somali. I’m not saying Somalia didn’t engage in piracy as commerce before, but these big league heists, I think, are the results of some puppet master who has the plan and resources to instigate this expansion.
When we stop to think about it, it’s really sad that industrialized countries don’t give a second thought about exploiting the poor for political means and/or commercial gain.
Stefan
Like it’s been mentioned upthread, Somalia has as much coast as the US.
For god’s sakes, someone, please, look at a map…..
JenJen
@** Atanarjuat **: Given the record of the Somali pirates, I have no doubt that the fine crew of this vessel is safe, that they are well-versed in the dangers of the region, and that they know what they’re doing.
And Michael Keyes made the best comment (@#126) of the thread so far; I suggest you read it. Maybe three times or so until it sinks in.
Brick Oven Bill
The law on the High Seas has been taken over by the United Nations Tenguphule. Article 110 states that navies may not fire on pirate ships but instead navies must send a boarding party to ask the pirates if they are, in fact pirates.
Back when we had Commander in Chiefs: President Jefferson, in the First Barbary War; and President Madison, in the Second Barbary War, the Commanders shelled the villages from which the pirates came. This was an effective technique and pirates went away for the better part of two centuries. They’re back though.
** Atanarjuat **
@Michael Keyes:
Michael, I’m not sure how you reached your conclusion, but please read my response to Mnemosyne once again and you’ll see that I was admonishing him or her on conflating two different views on the proper role of government.
Otherwise, I agree with your comment, 100%. The American crew members of the Maersk Alabama should be commended for their professionalism and bravery in this matter (note to JenJen: yes, I know, we don’t know all the facts yet, so you can berate Michael, too, for "jumping to foolish conclusions").
-A
Mnemosyne
@** Atanarjuat **:
Uh-huh. So you’re coming up with bogus justifications after the fact to claim that the government not helping people who don’t need it is horrible and proof that we need more government, but the government refusing to help people who do need it is horrible and proof that we need less government.
You’re really going to have to make up your mind about this: are you for more government or less government? You can’t play this namby-pamby game where you’re for some kinds of government intervention but against others. Either you’re a real conservative or you’re not.
(Edited to fix a grammar problem)
JG
Why does Andy McCarthy think that the "aid" (really, as if it is really only full of aid) will only go to the "distressed Muslims"? Can any Christians or atheists not also partake in the vats of peanut butter and guvmint cheese? I find it hilarious that he took the company’s statement – aid going to Mombasa – and made it seem like Obama should care because the aid was going to his fellow muslins.
** Atanarjuat **
@JenJen:
Good, so we’re in perfect agreement, then. Your advice to re-read Michael Keyes comment is superfluous, however, since I’ve already agreed with him.
Thank you.
-A
West of the Cascades
Sources now say the American crew is back in control of the ship and have at least one pirate in custody – huffingtonpost.com/2009/04/08/somali-pirates-hijack-shi_n_184536.html — new wingnut meme will be that Obama failed to take swift action, forcing red-blooded American patriots to take matters into their own hands.
wingnuts to iraq
why the heck do we care? Good on the pirates. They’re just showing an entrepreneurial spirit.
TenguPhule
And I call bullshit on BOB.
TenguPhule
In between your repeatedly lame attempts to link this to Obama.
Because Piracy did not exist in Somalia before 1/20/09, AMIRITE?
JenJen
@JenJen: News for you: There is nothing in this world that we are in agreement on, probably not even the color of the sky.
Your knee-jerk attempt to blame and backtrack, blame and backtrack, has been amusing to observe this afternoon though.
Brick Oven Bill
Wall Street Journal: Why Don’t We Hang Pirates Anymore?
"What about international law? Article 110 of the U.N.’s Law of the Sea Convention — ratified by most nations, but not by the U.S. — enjoins naval ships from simply firing on suspected pirates. Instead, they are required first to send over a boarding party to inquire of the pirates whether they are, in fact, pirates. A recent U.N. Security Council resolution allows foreign navies to pursue pirates into Somali waters — provided Somalia’s tottering government agrees — but the resolution expires next week. As for the idea of laying waste, Stephen Decatur-like, to the pirate’s prospering capital port city of Eyl, this too would require U.N. authorization. Yesterday, a shippers’ organization asked NATO to blockade the Somali coast. NATO promptly declined."
Thus, I call bullshit on TenguPhule’s bullshit call.
Mary
@TenguPhule:
Well done!
Article 110 outlines the ratification of the UN charter!
Well BoB, I have to admit that I looked at the wrong charter. However, reasonable belief that the ship is engaging in piracy is hardly stepping on board and asking them.
Kyle
the crew members of the Maersk Alabama have indeed retaken their own ship and are all safe.
This can only mean one thing — a wingnut call for looser gun laws inthe US.
Brick Skulled Bob — quoting the the WSJ "OMG! Obama is GUTTING defense spending by increasing it 3% and HANDING THE COUNTRY OVER to scary Islamonazi newculer terrists " isn’t exactly a mark of credibility anymore. You may as well quote Rush or Hoax News.
TenguPhule
Article 110 is the RIGHT OF VISIT.
Articles 101-107 refer to piracy.
Which makes both BOB and the WSJ dumbasses who don’t do the research.
JenJen
@Brick Oven Bill: First of all, we don’t hang anyone anymore.
Second, a breathless post by Bret "Global Warming Is A Sick-Souled Religion" Stephens doesn’t really prove anything.
Richard Bottoms
It is so much fun watching the increasing derangement of the Right over Obama’s election.
You black helicopter nuts have the same scripts you used under Clinton, this time however we have a president who is quite ready for this foolishness and en electorate way more worried about their jobs & health care.
Piss off.
ChrisB
@r€nato: Very much enjoying your posting. Thank you for handling the feeding so others don’t have to (but please mention "My Pet Goat" in responding to Atanarjuat @ #98).
There was a New York Times article in the April 1st edition pointing out how much federal involvement there was in Fargo, ND before the flood waters crested and how much that contrasted with the Bush administration’s response to Katrina. Here’s the link:
nytimes.com/2009/04/01/us/01flood.html?_r=1&scp=9&sq=fargo,%20ND&st=cse
Hob
@Zifnab: And then on your way to the next port, if you don’t need all those guns, you can always sell some of them to pirates! It’s a win-win.
JenJen
Deep Thought: Has anyone on the crew thought about throwing teabags at the pirates? I hear it’s quite effective.
Brick Oven Bill
JenJen makes a good observation that the Wall Street Journal is not a credible organization, so, to make my point more valid and compelling, here is a link from a organization which is truly credible, The United Nations.
JenJen
@Brick Oven Bill: My point was that Bret Stephens is an asshat, actually.
** Atanarjuat **
@JenJen:
Disagreeing with yourself, eh?
There are people that can help with that, you know.
Just some friendly advice.
(And yes, it’s already barkingly obvious that your knee will jerk with any opinion I might offer vis-a-vis Obama. What a non-surprise.)
-A
Zuzu's Petals
@fester:
Not only does the U.S. fleet constitute a minuscule percentage of the world fleet, I would wager that most of the U.S. fleet is working US waters:
My son, who is a merchant mariner, says the Jones Act may be the only reason there’s a U.S. fleet at all.
Jon H
@passerby: "Someone else upthread also pointed this out and I agree. The impoverished Somalies don’t seem to be violent people"
Not only that, but they’ve got a good thing going, and lots of money rolling in. The pirates are the big swingin’ dicks in town, the guys the girls want.
Too much violence would invite a violent response, and end the good times.
It’s like a virus or parasite. Too virulent and you kill the host. You want to be like regular herpes, not the herpes ‘B’ variant that gives monkeys cold sores, but gives humans fatal brain infections.
Zuzu's Petals
@wilfred:
Fixt for accuracy.
AnneLaurie
And if you position the windmills correctly, the gassy wails of outrage emanating from the rich shipowners who can no longer ‘offshore’ their earnings and their WSJ enablers will save millions of barrels of oil, too!
As many sane people have already pointed out, there are "still" pirates in Somalia for the same reason there are still muggers in New York City. New Yorkers could protect themselves from the ‘scourge’ of greedy / desperate small-scale predators by never leaving their homes, or by stationing an armed security officer at every street corner, ATM, and 7-11… but they’ve made a collective decision that below a certain threat level, it’s not worth the money or trouble. From what I’ve read, most of the "pirate-threatened" container ships are samples of the Republican Plantation Party’s wet dreams — high-profit commodities enriching a few rich owners, run by a handful of third-world serfs under the supervision of a couple of middle managers, and sailing under flags of convenience to avoid paying the owners’ fair share of the cost of keeping America in better social shape than Somalia.
TenguPhule
Read your own damn links next time BOB.
Zuzu's Petals
@Brick Oven Bill:
Wrong per usual.
Article 110 sets forth the conditions under which another ship may be boarded:
Zuzu's Petals
PS, to be perfectly clear, paragraph 2 of Article 110 is an authorization, not a requirement.
Zuzu's Petals
Interesting article:
tom p
According to "The World" (via NPR) the Pentagon says the sailors have retaken the ship. Unfortunately the captain is being held hostage on a life boat.
Svensker
@J. Michael Neal:
Yup. We destroyed their fisheries and overthrew their government (it was a successful Islamist gov’t and the Bushies couldn’t have that). So now, they are poor with no hope. Why the dirty bastards would want to be pirates when they could…well, they could…ummm….. Well, if they were decent, like white Americans, they would just pull themselves up by their bootstraps and die quietly.
MNPundit
No we can’t. The ocean is huge. Unbelievably huge and the pirates are small. Moreover they retreat back to little villages. So unless we are willing to missile villages of women and children no.
Brick Oven Bill
I apologize for the delay in responding, but I was off with my Glenn Beck militia group. It was run by a friendly mother and we discussed the first three chapters of a book. Then some of us relayed our life experiences with respect to this book, and compared and contrasted our stories with the conclusions of the book.
There was a doctor there who explained methods by which Medicaid is being abused. A French lady explained why she became a Citizen and how Dairy Queen was emblematic of her first impression of the greatness of America. People then clapped for her. So, anyway:
Section 110 authorizes a vessel suspected of piracy to be boarded. But if the search is inconclusive, the suspected pirate can extract costs from the vessel doing the searching. The only practical way for a naval vessel to determine the intent of the suspected pirate would be to board it.
So you guys are the ones who should really read my link.
TenguPhule
Go back and read sections 100-107 again, idiot.
TenguPhule
If a ship is boarded and damaged and it’s not a pirate, obviously someone is going to pay for it.
Keep digging that hole deeper, BOB. You’ll hit magma eventually.
Common Sense
@The Moar You Know:
Huh?
According to this link, the US has nearly 7 times as much coastline as Somalia. Even if one removes Alaska you are left with more than three times Somalia’s coastline just in the Continental US.
Phoebe
TigerHawk!
!!!!
!
scarshapedstar
Hi, I’m TigerHawk… in disguise! Guffaw!
Zuzu's Petals
@Brick Oven Bill:
Maybe you should do a little more research before cutting and pasting someone else’s bad information.
You and Brett claimed that a warship was REQUIRED by Article 110 to board a pirate ship and ask them if they were pirates. Nope.
First of all, in case you didn’t know it, you can’t really seize a ship and arrest its crew without boarding it. Duh.
A flag state has exclusive jurisdiction over its ships at sea and those ships may not be boarded without permission except under a few specified circumstances. One of those exceptions is suspicion of piracy. Article 110 specifically authorizes a warship to board and inspect a ship under the jurisdiction of another flag state in these circumstances, and Article 105 gives authority to seize the ship and its cargo and arrest the crew.
RememberNovember
Rush Limpballs says it’s the Libruls fault….
I hope he od’s on Oxycontin and Viagra I really do. As ye sow, so shall ye reap, Rush.
JenJen
@** Atanarjuat **: Just kicking this to see if Atanarjuat is interested in backtracking yet. :-)