Bradley Smith might be on to something here:
Now that Specter’s gone, we can turn to the real enemy – Susan Collins and Olympia Snowe! Then the only thing between us and victory will be Graham, Lugar, McCain, Murkowski, Grassley, Hatch, and some of the RINOs in the House. And the Governors, like Crist and Douglas and Lingle and anyone not named Palin or Jindal. And the Supreme Court Justices like the radical Kennedy. But time is on our side. If we get small enough, voters will finally see true conservatism, and then we’ll have to win.
Go read Red State and Hot Air and other “conservative” bloggers and tell me Smith’s sarcasm is wrong.
*** Update ***
The anti-Snowe movement gains momentum:
But while she wants the Republican party to be accepting of her positions on the other issues, she seems to forget that often she doesn’t even pass the “litmus test” of core economic issues. She, like Specter, voted for the stimulus bill package.
I don’t understand well all the consequences of Specter’s defection to the other side, but it seems to me that no matter how painful it might be, that’s probably what the Republican party needs.
She’s a witch!
JK
Big Bad John Cornyn and Mitch McConnell will never let Snowe or Collins defect to the Dem side because they’d be acting on principle not poll numbers like Specter.
Just Some Fuckhead
That was sarcasm?
Bubblegum Tate
It could be posted verbatim on a wingnut blog and get all sorts of kudos in the comments for being right on the money. Hell, look at these comments from my wingnut blog of choice:
Zifnab
There will come a day when you can recognize a Republican by the fact that he is actually running around in a jump suite, carrying a little red book of Regan Mantras, and making plans to visit the land of Conservative Values by drinking his magic bottle of kool-aid.
:-p
nikkos
No doubt. Somebody needs to tell the right-wing nuts that the voices inside their heads do not add up to a Silent Majority. Nor can they vote.
Just Some Fuckhead
We need to come to some sorta detente soon. I got no problem with people deciding to stop being Republicans but we got enough fucking blue dog democrats already.
Michael
Perry-DeMint ’12
Secession’s not Dirty; We’ll Get by with Thirty!
TenguPhule
We’ll draw the line at dogfuckers, at least.
Balconesfault
Don’t forget Rick Perry on your list of preferred Governors. He’s got enough stupid to fuel that big GOP machine for months, all by himself!
stickler
Nikkos, not so fast:
See, the thing is, the wingnutterie really, truly believes that they’re among the majority. Read the rightwing blogs — they’re convinced that the country really is coming around to their way of thinking. The teabaggery earlier this month was confirmation of this. Somehow.
If the country really were shocked by Obama’s policies, becoming a more-pure conservative party might make sense for the Republicans. Of course this isn’t what’s happening, but to the crazed ideologues it seems plausible. That, and Rush Limbaugh tells them so.
jrg
Well, Republicans were dumb enough to believe that Iraq did not go well because of the dirty hippies and their dissent. At the time I thought it was just a talking point, but now it looks like these people really do think that’s true.
I’m going to be all over the CNN message boards tomorrow claiming that Snowe and Collins were responsible for last year’s trouncing.
TenguPhule
Lingle can go DIAF.
Between her trying to steal education money to balance the budget and her sloppy seconds with known torture supporters, we’d be better off without her.
Mr. Stuck
When Ronald Reagan returns, you’ll see, YOU”LL SEE ,all you flouride drinking RINOS!
Just a suggestion for the NEW GOP dream banner.
El Cid
@Mr. Stuck: The problem is that many people do not know whether the holy passages mean that Ronald Reagan will physically return, or whether His way will be restored upon the Urf.
Calouste
@Bubblegum Tate:
“Both” in that quote of course refers to the number of people left in the GOP.
Martin
“Not until the false believers have been purged from the body can Saint Reagan return from the heavens to his place on earth to rule until the end of time. ”
So it has been written. Gingrich 11:17
SpotWeld
There must be an Aesop’s story about this.
A very angry elephant kicks out all the other animals until it’s all alone on a deserted island, and then it drowns while attempting to charge it’s down reflection or something…
Well there is that episode of star trek with those half white / half black (and half black / half white ) aliens….
Martin
Good luck getting any Republicans to admit that they’re half black, though.
r€nato
christ, just read the comments to his post. Most of them are not buying it.
I guess nothing less than losing the next two or three elections by wide margins will get the point across.
DeMint may well get the 30-seat Senate minority he’s wishing for.
Bootlegger
I’ve wanted to kick this idea around here before. What do y’all think of the chances of a new party rising? Not one of the left or right wingnut parties, but a centrist party. Most of the world’s democracies have a “centrist” party in addition to the lefties and righties and regional parties (don’t forget my favorite, the Beer Parties.)
I recall Bloomberg inviting a bunch of centrists to some meeting last year and it attracted a lot of attention. Chafee’s running as an Independent for RI’s senate seat.
Sociology’s social movement people have a “political opportunity theory” that argues that movements are successful at various times because of opportunity more so than grass roots organizing, funding or principles. Republicans are fading and will soon be purely conservative, progressives/liberals are getting more and more irritated by the Blue Dogs. With mounting problems out there people are open to the whole “change” mantra.
What do you think Juicers?
TenguPhule
They can’t hear you over the voices in their head.
Third Eye Open
SPLITT’AS!
By the bye…I think Crist is at the very least an acceptable Governor and in the Senate would probably, on net, hand Democrats more legislative wins than say an Alan Boyd. Admittedly, this is setting the bar very, very low
Alan
I never read Red State but that post would be received as perfectly sane at Hot Air. Of the two hosts at HA, Allah used to strike me as the more sane. But hell, yesterday Allah called Specter a liar for stating the obvious–that the GOP has been taken over by the hard right. These guys haven’t any self awareness.
What’s most comical is how Capt Ed has become the voice of the Religious Right. When back after the ’06 loss his blog’s consensus was the right should tone down the RR rhetoric. Yet he doubles down.
The best reading though is at LGF. It’s fun watching Charles surrounded by the RW zealots he cultivated.
r€nato
@Bootlegger:
historically, third parties fizzle out in the US well before they get the chance to become significant players because:
a) the system is tilted towards a 2-party system. There are all sorts of built-in advantages for the existing major parties.
b) usually one of the two major parties co-opts one or more of the central motivating ideas behind the third party.
c) we don’t have a parliamentary system where minor parties actually get a chance to govern without winning 50%+1 of the vote in an election.
(of course I am ignoring the case where the 3rd party simply does not have wide appeal and never will, such as the Communist Party USA)
The Republican party already has an existing infrastructure; it would make far more sense for somebody or somebodies to take it over. Of course, they’ll have to kick out the fundies and bigots and morons running it now, and who knows how long that will take. Only death and retirement it seems will bring a badly-needed dose of fresh blood into the GOP.
Corner Stone
@SpotWeld:
Those guys just flat hated each other man! That was sad.
I mean, they were basically exactly alike in every way except the side that was a different color! They should’ve learned to look past that superficial differe…uh..wait a second.
Corner Stone
@r€nato:
And I contend that the mentality of all the Repubs left is akin to the passage from Good Will Hunting where he’s telling Robin Williams about how he was abused and he says:
Will: He used to just put a belt, a stick, and a wrench on the kitchen table and say, “Choose.”
Sean: Well, I gotta go with the belt there.
Will: I used to go with the wrench.
Sean: Why?
Will: Cause fuck him, that’ why.
They’re enjoying this in a really sick and twisted way.
Bootlegger
@r€nato: I know these explanations well, and they are certainly political obstacles. But can we really imagine that the only two political parties we’ll ever have, forever and ever, are D’s and R’s? Yes, the hill is steep, that ‘s why it will only happen if there is merging political opportunities. Also, some parties have come close in the past, surely one will get over the hump.
freelancer
Sadly No, yesterday:
Add Captain Ed in an eye patch, sword raised, yelling “Porkulus!”, as the Crow’s Nest submerges and the image is complete.
demkat620
I knew this would be entertaining but damn, these guys have taken their comedy act to a whole ‘nother level.
Why stop at thirty? Why not make it a rule that just like commandments there can only be 10 GOP senators?
Comrade Dread
Yeah, I honestly don’t get it, their plan seems to consist of:
1. Alienate minorities
2. Alienate libertarians, paleocons, Paulites, corporate cons, fiscal conservative/Social liberals, pro-abortionists, gays, non-interventionists, and anyone who thinks we should compromise on anything at all until we have pure distilled wingnutters.
3. ???
4. Win national elections and retake all branches of government.
I’ve asked repeatedly for some explanation as to what step 3 is, because once you’ve succeeding in pissing off 40% of the electorate saying you don’t need them and they’re a liability, it will make it a little difficult to talk them back into the fold.
Near as I could fathom, their entire plan hinges on step 3 being ‘huddle in basement with guns hoping that Democrats implode and the nation begs us to come back and help them in the post-apocalyptic world from the rampaging mutant gay squirrels.’
Balconesfault
@Bootlegger:
Sheesh – the Harry Reid/Diane Feinstein Democratic Party IS centrist … if not center-right.
The abortion debate has so f**ed up American politics. Someone can favor women’s rights to choose, and be well to the right on a list of economic and geopolitical issues, and they’re still going to get called liberal by our media.
Mr. Stuck
@El Cid:
It’s the dream that counts. The details are for Infidels.
Sasha
hattip to your Monty Pythonism.
r€nato
@Bootlegger:
the closest I’ve ever see to real third party emerging was Ross Perot in 1992 and he might have pulled it off if it hadn’t been so tightly wedded to Perot himself and if Perot had not turned out to be a tinfoil-hat nutter and a flake.
There was some real momentum there which could have been handed off to a party rather than left in the hands of a single person.
No, I don’t think we will see a genuine third party emerge in the US in our lifetimes. I don’t think the GOP will go away and be replaced either; the party will just look dead for quite a while.
wobbly
Your enemies are your neighbors who vote for these fools time after time.
Can you persuade them to do otherwise? Do you have the skills? The spare time to knock on doors….
…and persuade the desperate people who answer to CONVERT?
I’ve seen Jehovah’s Witnesses do this. I’ve seen Mormons do this. I have seen the late and great Malcolm X do this.
Dirty fucking hippies actually don’t do this stuff all that well.
GP
How old is Specter?? I would not vote for any ol’ fart like him No matter who’s side he’s on..
Bootlegger
@Balconesfault: Exactly my point. Either progressives split off or the Blue Dogs split off and join the remaining GOP refugees, one group keeps the name in the divorce or both change.
JK
A look back to when the Republican party possessed a viable sanity wing
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2001/05/24/politics/main293218.shtml
someguy
What about Reagan values actually worked? Keeping women and Blacks down? Hatin’ on teh queers? Exempting rich bastards from paying taxes? Making random war against peaceful, weaker countries? Magical missile defense to shoot down imaginary threats? Declaring war on Islam? Letting the Masters of the Universe own everything and bankrupt us all? Making sure that the number of people without health care – even in our shitass healthcare system – keeps climbing?
So remind me, why is it again we’re supposed to revere Reagan? Oh yeah, that’s right. Because senility is cute.
Jon H
@r€nato: “The Republican party already has an existing infrastructure; it would make far more sense for somebody or somebodies to take it over.”
That’s only true to a point. If it gets small enough, taking over the GOP would make as little sense as taking over the Libertarian party.
The thing is, what you call infrastructure is actually just experienced and connected people. If enough campaign-experienced moderate Republicans get driven out of the GOP, they and their rolodexes and checkbooks would make a good start at a new party.
And if they had enough ex-GOP boldfaced names (Chaffee, Hagel, etc) under their banner, they’d be taken pretty seriously.
Bootlegger
From Kleinfeld at the NYT.
How long can the Democrats last like this?
Gus
I’m sure the point has been made, but that party exists, and it’s called the Democratic Party. There is no left party in this country.
comrade scott's agenda of rage
SPLITTTTUH!!!!!!
Collins will never switch–she’s a helluva lot more conservative than the Villagers report her to be.
Snowe comes from an old Maine family with a lot of old Maine family connections. All Repup. She won’t switch either. And Maine’s GOP doesn’t seem to be completely full of batshit, crazy wingnuts, thus, they seem safe from being primaried out of existence.
Lee
I live in an affulent northern suburb of Dallas. My local messageboard is a frightening echo chamber of wingnuts.
These people really do not understand they are looking at the collapse of their party as a national party.
binzinerator
@freelancer:
Thanks, freelancer, for a good laugh at the end the day!
harlana pepper
PLEASE, I have got to stop laughing!
stickler
Bootlegger:
I agree with Renato; we’re not likely to see the GOP go away. Hell, they survived their twenty years of Outer Darkness from 1932-52; they’ll probably survive this. Remember, in 1937 they had a grand total of 16 seats in the Senate. Sixteen.
However, we’re closer to a total GOP implosion than at any time in the last sixty years. It’s worse now than it was in 1974, even. There’s no party leadership, and worse, there’s no intellectual leadership. Worst of all, the GOP is now hunkered down in the South, and even if the Southrons weren’t all anti-modern Morans, that’s still a big cultural drag on the party elsewhere. Southerners (especially GOP diehards) seem to have not a clue as to how different they are from much of the rest of the country. The social “conservatism” of the Texas GOP (gays, guns, God, abortion, panty-sniffing), for example, makes for shitty politics west of the Rockies, especially when it’s being peddled by a blow-dried jackass with a Dixie drawl. And it makes moderate Republicans vote Democratic.
So who knows? I don’t think the GOP will die. But it’s in bad shape, and this country is set up to have two main parties. If the GOP isn’t one of them, well, something else will take its place.
harlana pepper
blunk drogging:
have i ever told you guys how much i luv you guys!
I love you, man!! I mean, i reellyy luv u!!
aimai
I don’t know about Snowe–if the national republicans really treat her like shit I think she and her entire family could end up splitting from the party. The thing which we have to keep in mind is that the actual people she interacts with on a daily basis–the other senators–are bat shit crazy at this point. One of them is going to say or do something that is totally over the top awful to her, or in front of her, that in the end she isnt going to be able to stomach. They have lost all sense of propriety and courtesy and they are going to lash out at their last remaining moderates. And I don’t care how long her family has been republicans they are a higher class than the category now running the party. Plenty of those old line northeastern republicans have already gone dem.
aimai
harlana pepper
Specter is one shriveled old asshole whom I would never trust as far as I could throw his shrivled old ass. What am I to expect from this, I mean, in the larger scheme of things?
Mr. Stuck
@harlana pepper:
Stella! Stelllllla!
TenguPhule
Step 3: Use our guns to overthrow liberal government! Yeah!! Wolverines!!!
smiley
Heh. No one expected the 2nd amendment inquisition! Heh, indeed.
Tsulagi
You can’t, in fact you can’t parody these dorks nearly as well or to the extent they do to themselves.
A minor example: Moe Lane has a RS post up now featuring a clip of Obama at a townhall type meeting today during which he mentioned…
Moe’s takeaway and keen analysis? Since President Obama made light of tea bag wavers, according to Gandhi they’re now only two steps away from victory. A commenter mentioned Moe misspelled Gandhi’s name, but of course you know that in no way detracts from his channeling of another guy in diapers.
Also, it would appear the teabaggers, wounded from the insensitive joking about tea parties and bagging attendees, have a new manly logo for a tea party later this year. One RS commenter said it looks a little old Soviet for his taste. But hey, if there’s going to be a marriage of Beckerheads and Tea Baggers, why not borrow something for the nuptials? The logo is partly blue. Fits.
Yep, their RSSF fighting spirit is being rekindled. A rallying cry from one of the RS commenters in the thread exhorting his fellow teabaggers: “Tea Baggers to Obama: …Bring it ON!!; Let’s roll!!”
Think you can out-parody these guys? Nope. All you can do is sit back and watch the masters.
LD50
HOW ABOUT A HUG? ? ? ?
JK
@Balconesfault:
From James Moore, co-author of “Bush‘s Brain.” speaking on Countdown 4/15/09: As George W. Bush was leaving Texas to go to Washington, there was a joke making the rounds in the Texas capitol press corps that his car had a bumper sticker that said, “If you think I was bad, wait until you see the guy who replaces me.”
ksmiami
Hell – I met Nancy Reagan a few times and even she was more left (liked CA, Hollywood and animals). Goldwater hated the fundies and was pro-choice, Nixon started the EPA and was a big proponent of science. The purity tests for the current GOP would even drive these former luminaries into the Democratic youth hostel. I mean total nutso drinking nonstop highballs with lsd chaser crazy. And the worst part is that it really is like a 15 car pile-up that you hate to watch, but just can’t help but stare agog…
I need more hobbies.
omen
@LD50:
maybe that’s the answer to world peace: keep everybody drunk.
edit: suddenly i’m thirsty.
harlana pepper
Laura W, if you’re on here, I just figured it out – the guy is pro-life (former Catholic, attends Baptist church)
–thunks forehead–
Actually, it’s a relief. He looked a lil uptight to me – too squeaky clean. boooorrrriiinnnggg
I like my men a little mussed. Heh.
r€nato
@aimai:
Can’t say I know all that much about Maine politics and Snowe/Collins, but it seems as if they would not so much bolt the GOP for the Dems, as they would bolt the GOP for ‘Independent’ but caucus with the Dems.
I don’t at all put it past the Incredible Shrinking GOP to do their best to force them out of the party, even if they really don’t want to leave it.
Stabetha
I think they are working that Gandhi quote backwards:
“First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win.”
Instead, they won first, in 2000 and 2004. Then, we fought them. Now we are ridiculing them. Pretty soon we will be ignoring them.
Calouste
@Stabetha:
FTW!
Anne Elk (Miss)
She turned me into a Newt!
CJ
@wobbly: Where do you live? Granted, I live in a liberal neighborhood, but the DFH’s are all over the knocking on doors around here.
kormgar
Man oh man…
I am just loving the schadenfreude
Loooviiing it
Still…this worries me. Even in the best of times, the nation desperately needs a vigorous and rational opposition party. In a time when crises are stacking together like the nastiest nesting doll ever, well…the last thing we need is to have the opposition drooling all over legislation while it poops itself in the corner
chrome agnomen
balconesfault@31
i had the same thought–you mean a party that’s way to the left of the current democratic party???
Incertus
@Anne Elk (Miss):
That’s because she wanted a divorce, and figured you’d run off with a younger woman if she did.
kormgar
@TenguPhule:
True…on the other hand if the Dems pick up enough RINO defections then it should get progressively easier to end filibusters, blue dogs or no.
Let’s say you’ve got 50 solid dems and then some blue dog coalition that is wavering. There is a tremendous difference between convincing 10 out of 12 to go along than 10 out of 10.
jake 4 that 1
If I may be serious for .5 seconds, I wish that the GOPers who have finally realized their bedfellows have shat their sleeping place and then set on fire would form their own damn party.
Having two sets of America Hating Traitors to deal with would render the remaining loons catatonic.
chrome agnomen
harlana pepper—like chiquita banana, only hotter.
Chuck Butcher
In order to form a third Party you’d have to do it in a Presidential election with a charismatic candidate who doesn’t mind losing and a pretty large slate of charismatic Congressional candidates – that’s a large order. You’d absoluely have to have a national figure to front for such a thing, money is important and national draw is the only way to generate it for the downstream candidates. National media is the other piece that is covered by a national candidate.
I don’t see either happening, but that doesn’t mean those kinds of characters can’t emerge over short time spans.
People like to point to the numbers of NA voters as a source, what they forget is that those are disaffected with both Parties and that is about all they have truly in common. Thinking there is a big resevoir of votes there is wishful thinking.
Kdrtoona
Does anyone have a duck?
zoe kentucky
I haven’t been over to LittleGreenFootballs in years– it’s scary how sane and reasonable Charles has become. If he’s suddenly a moderating voice in the rw blogosphere they are seriously fuckity-fucked-fucked.
Brandon T.
You should spend some time in San Francisco. Democrats have a 5-10 fold voter advantage here, so Republicans are essentially irrelevant. It doesn’t make it any less acrimonious or more united–it just means you have the DiFi/Gavin Newsom centrist Democrats fighting the Boxer/Chris Daly/etc DFHers with an occasional love-in by the anarchists/greens. Just because you belong to the same party doesn’t mean you have to have a remotely similar view on practicalities in politics.
The primaries become the elections, and otherwise it’s just as if you had two parties. I don’t understand this whole “oh noes, two parties or our democracy will collapse” paranoia.
Anne Elk (Miss)
Who are you, that you are so wise in the ways of science?
r€nato
@Brandon T.:
When it comes to politics, people will always split into factions. Being a semi-serious student of the Renaissance, I sometimes amuse myself by reading up on the Guelphs and the Ghibellines, the 14th-century equivalent of Democrats and Republicans. Guelphs were nominally supporters of Papal power, while Ghibellines were nominally supporters of the Holy Roman Emperor’s power.
However once you get down into the weeds of which cities or families were Guelph and which where Ghibelline, it often appeared simply a matter of being the opposite of those guys you don’t like in that rival family or rival city.
…for your further amusement in case you care:
Roger the Cabin Boy
@Ann Elk (Miss)
So you’re now a fat, hypocritical, twice-divorced, serial adultering right-wing blowhard?
Burn her!
(btw you just beat me to posting that!)
MNPundit
@TenguPhule: Yeah but enough of them and then the space will open up for a new second party in America–to the left of the Democrats who will effectively become the (sane) Republicans.
2liberal
@bootlegger
chaffees looking at running for governor, not senator.
from the wiki page:
kormgar
@Brandon T.:
Well it’s partly my experience in the Bay Area that leads me to that conclusion. I’m in Berkeley at the moment, but I spent most of the past decade living in the city…SF is one of my favorite places in the world (absolutely loved living in Cole Valley), but the politics can get a wee bit nuts.
I remember, back when Mayor Newsom was just candidate Newsom, being called a corporatist fascist for daring to suggest that he would have been considered a fairly liberal candidate anywhere else. Ah memories.
That’s sort of the problem…most political fights in SF are nasty incestuous affairs.
Corner Stone
@Tsulagi:
To me the logo says, “Hey, we tried a little teabagging and it just didn’t do it for enough of us. Let’s move on to fisting!”
neo
What about People’s Front of Judea?
Wile E. Quixote
@nikkos
FTW.
I’d like to see Pelosi really fuck with the Republicans next year by implementing the Wyoming Rule for congressional apportionment and increasing the size of the House of Representatives. 2010 would be an ideal time to do it as it’s a census year, the House would increase to 570 representatives from it’s current size of 435 and the wingnuts would be even further marginalized.
Ricky
While Obama’s cautious centrist approach (and his Bush-lite pro-corporate approach to the banks) has been maddening, it is perhaps the most important feature in keeping a viable third party from forming because it limits the prospects of a viable centrist national candidate. For instance, a three way race between Obama, Palin, and Crist still seems almost certain to end up in an Obama victory since Crist really doesn’t represent the center. The 25% wingnut base will vote for Palin, Obama will get most Democrats which would probably put him close to 40% without considering any Independents. That only leaves at most 35% of the libertarian former Repug and other right-leaning independents for a right-of-center candidate. Even if Obama doesn’t score a majority of the popular vote, it is hard to see how he wouldn’t win an Electoral College landslide. Now 2016 could be ripe for a political reshuffling since Biden won’t likely fill the incumbent role.
el ranchero
You can say that again.
IceNine
Another third party model
I have developed an unusual model for how a viable and resilient third party might emerge. It is, unfortunately, not likely to occur because it requires a special set of preconditions combining in a Perfect Storm: (1) One party becomes so marginalized that its appeal is largely sectional; (2) a group of like-minded and bold individuals in the majority party; and (3) a triggering crisis to move them to action.
I think a third party might emerge by a collective decision of group of majority-party congressional and/or state-office incumbents who jump together. They would already have name recognition and a base of support with their constituencies–a prior “comfort level.” They would have access to donors. They would have experience as veteran campaigners and legislators. Until the party gets established, there is no need to run a Presidential candidate.
The core group could form in now-existing congressional caucuses. The important thing is to jump together, so that they can’t be picked off individually by the R-D machines closing ranks to kill it off. Once returned, they would have enough voting power to thwart any organizing resolution that tried to inhibit their acquired seniority or limit committee assignments.
I think this is much more likely model that a now-existing minor party suddenly breaking through.
Only one element of the pre-conditions seems to be forming: One party has become so self-limiting and self-restrictive that it may become a marginalized regional political force. As of yet, I see no signs of bold leadership capable of bringing off The Break. And the Triggering Event can’t even be imagined until it arrives.
So it is all very unlikely, at least in the near future. But as a citizen who despises the two-party system, I can always hope…