You know, having Sarah (I – AK for Palin) siphon off the votes of, well, anyone who would still vote for Sarah Palin strikes me as an aggregate win for everyone else. If I was a non-fruitcake Republican (assuming those still exist in the wild) I’d feel pretty good if I could stop pandering to those drooling idiots.
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steve s
problem:
linky.
So if you don’t want to pander to the drooling idiots, the best thing to do might be to register as a Democrat.
General Winfield Stuck
Thom Franks has a pretty good dissection of the Palin Mystique in the WSJ today.
Eric U.
doesn’t leave enough people to get elected in most districts. Reminds me of Adlai Stevenson
JK
@General Winfield Stuck:
Another great column by Thomas Frank.
steve s
I’m not being glib here, I’ve spent a fair amount of time trying to think about how the GOP can de-tardify themselves. I don’t have any easy answers, because the tard is now so integral to who they are.
arguingwithsignposts
I’m not being glib here. someone please tell me why i should keep going. all smiles off. all snark killed. i’m in a really bad place, and looking for some help. sorry if this throws off your thread. mock if you want. i’m circling the drain.
Michael D.
John, how can you let Tim diss on Sarah Palin? Looks like from your BlogAds that the lady is paying the bills around these parts!!
The Grand Panjandrum
Palin is a dumbed-down Ross Perot without the bank account.
JenJen
You know, you really only need 28-32% to win all the marbles in the GOP Primary. I think she could make a good run at it.
And the rest of us would rejoice as President Obama picks up a few extra states! I wonder how many states he’d have to win before Joe Scarborough would admit it was a landslide? I’m thinking 64.
Dennis-SGMM
@arguingwithsignposts:
Not knowing what put you into such a bad place I can only suggest that you take a long walk. That’s about the only thing that pulls me out of my occasional bouts of despair. Wish I had more to offer.
Leelee for Obama
@arguingwithsignposts: Not sure if I can help, arguing, but seriously, what’s bothering you? That post gave me a really bad feeling.
General Winfield Stuck
@arguingwithsignposts:
Depression is an awful thing, regardless what caused it. If your as low as you sound, get some help. Nothing is bad as it seems at the time.
arguingwithsignposts
@Leelee for Obama:
yeah, i’m sorry to disrupt the snark. i’m hurtin’ bad, and this sh*t with the major just pushed it farther. too many details to go into, except I’m really wishing I had a quick way out. i’ve got three kids, though, so it’s not like i’m cut and dried.
if you want to keep the thread without my bitchin’ and moanin’ then be my guest. i’m sorry all the way around. (these are tears)
Tim F.
@arguingwithsignposts:
We don’t have much to work with here, but speaking as generally as possible people almost always feel more positive about life in general when they have something external to engage their focus.
That is to say, without knowing anything at all about you the one safe recommendation is to find something that makes you happy and focus like hell on it. A dog is a frequent winner.
Also, I shit you not, stuff like this and this is supposed to be therapeutic for depressives. Speaking as someone who has had intense bouts of depression myself, I can say that they work a hell of a lot better than self-affirmation.
Also, meditation. Not kidding. Lot of experience with that as well, highly recommend it.
Brian J
Assuming he’s not fighting for his political life in a couple of years, I can’t see how Obama is going to lose. Tell me, who can both (a) win the Republican nomination without some massive split of the vote between a ton of candidates and (b) not start off the race by being almost certain to lose 35-40 states? Okay, someone like Gingrich might be able to eek out a victory in Texas and Georgia, but aside from states like Oklahoma and Alabama, what constitutes a base for them next time around? Assuming he has enough money to do so, I fully expect Obama’s reelection campaign to mount a full assault on the Republicans in any state that he didn’t lose by 15 points. No, it might not be easy to win Texas, but with the right resources, he’ll force them to waste so many resources defending it they have no realistic shot of trying to win back Ohio and Florida, let alone Minnesota and Iowa.
Laura W
@arguingwithsignposts: Well, this is probably really trite and inappropriate, but it never ever fails to lift my spirits when I’m down.
These Are Days.
Brian J
@arguingwithsignposts:
If you’d like to elaborate, I’m all ears.
General Winfield Stuck
@arguingwithsignposts:
You have nothing to be sorry about. Many here have been in really bad places, and don’t joke when someone is hurting. If they do, I for one will punch them in the face, virtually that is.
You need to talk to an actual person, maybe a clinical social worker and take it from there.
Dennis-SGMM
@arguingwithsignposts:
See a doctor. Now, not tomorrow, now. Go to the ER and be very honest with them. You are contemplating a very permanent solution for a temporary problem. Get some relief immediately and then sort things out later. It doesn’t have to be this way.
El Cid
Why won’t they let Say-ruh be Say-ruh?
General Winfield Stuck
@Dennis-SGMM:
What Dennis said
arguingwithsignposts
@Laura W:
thanks, i’m a natmerch fan.
i’m sorry folks, because i don’t know how to spin out of this. this world seems so fucked, and yet these people don’t seem to care. i look at my kids and i weep. i am as fucked up as any, but they don’t deserve more shite from the bankers. i’m looking at a 6 yo who has to survive the banking crisis and all that entails? Where did I go wrong?
there’s a major splitting the army because he doesn’t want to deal with the cic? Fuck you, motherfucker!! i would actually give anything to be able to serve my country honorably and this jackass is pulling this shite?
like i said, i’m hurting. i’m sorry for threadjacking. peace unto you all. this is one of the funniest blogs i’ve ever read. i hope jc is making enough to make it worthwhile.
Leelee for Obama
@arguingwithsignposts:
Couldn’t care less about the thread—if you are depressed, I can relate. Just know that there are people who will listen, and like TimF said, focus like hell on something that makes you feel better. Talk to your kids, play with a puppy, laugh at a stupid movie that normally wouldn’t be on your list.
The Major story is just another lump in the never never ending shitpile that the losers will build while they lick their wounds. Don’t let their stupid push you into misery, they don’t deserve that much power.
El Cid
@arguingwithsignposts: I’ve been there a few times. Believe it or not, the worst moments are temporary, you’re actually tough enough to endure, and somewhere on the other end are enough good moments to make sticking it out worthwhile. But don’t make yourself do it alone, it’s unfair and nobody at a happier point got there by themselves anyway — all the people who appear self-reliant just look that way.
Dennis-SGMM
@arguingwithsignposts:
You are not responsible for the condition of the world. It has been fucked before and it will be fucked again and all that most of us can do is hold our part of it together. Now go see a doctor, okay?
Josh Huaco
@arguingwithsignposts:
Please elaborate.
KG
@5: someone once said, “there are no easy answers, but there are simple ones.” I forget who said it, but I’m pretty sure he use to be very popular among conservatives, Roland Teagan, maybe… something like that.
The first thing they need to do, and I say this as an admitted libertarian, is drop the bastardized version of libertarianism that they cling to that says, always and in all circumstances that government is bad. The second thing they need to do is stop trying to fight a culture war and recognize that people don’t have to live up to impossibly high standards like “not having sex with someone other than the person (preferably of the opposite sex) they are married to.” Third, I would suggest shutting up about foreign policy for at least two years, and just watching and listening to what happens. Then after two years, they can decide whether they still want to be imperialists or if they want to go back to being realists, or even slightly idealistic.
Or you know, admitting that you have a problem is a good start. Also.
General Winfield Stuck
@arguingwithsignposts:
You have three kids who love and depend on you. Everything else is small stuff.
KG
@20: if Huckabee wants to run again, I would think that he’d want Palin not in the party because I would think there’d be a lot of cross over voters there. Of course, if he’s actually shrewd, this is exactly what he would say right now.
freelancer
Is “I’m not being glib here…” a new meme, also too?
Fuck. I need to be less of an asshole and read the whole thread.
I second “Go to the ER, and be honest with them.”
Ennui can be turned around, permanence can’t.
Laura W
@arguingwithsignposts:
So one more then.
arguingwithsignposts
@Laura W:
That is one of my favorites. i feel so lost and alone at the moment. everything hurts. i wish there was a pill that would make this go away. you know, like a headache medicine or something. instead, it’s a lot of poking around and charging your insurance for “listening.”
RedKitten
Thread, schmed — you need to take care of yourself. It’s damn hard not to get overwhelmed and depressed about all the awful shit in the world, especially when you’re bringing kids into it. It’s hard not to get beaten down by how awful we humans can be to each other. But there’s a lot of good stuff going on too — we just don’t hear about it as often.
Listen to Dennis. Get your butt to the ER now. Don’t be embarrassed, don’t be ashamed, and don’t apologize. If you had broken your leg, you’d go. This is even more detrimental to your health. So go.
Chuck Butcher
@arguingwithsignposts:
Contact info on my blog sidebar – talk to me. I have very real personal reasons not like what I’m hearing.
unabogie
arguing, every last one of us goes through shit. It’s unavoidable and it sucks. But as others have pointed out, it passes. Things change. No matter what, nothing endures. In the end, you have the total capacity to control your outlook, if not your circumstance.
First thing, go give each of your kids a hug and tell them you love them.
Done?
Now, get on the phone and get to a doctor because those kids’ll need you for the rest of their lives, and you are strong enough and kind enough to do that for them.
And keep us posted.
Max
@arguingwithsignposts: Not to sound too new age’ey, but there are herbs that help with depression, St John’s Wort comes to mind, but I’m should the Google can provide other tips.
Food allergies can also trigger depression, so you may want to look at your diet.
Taking a nice walk, or some other form of exercise that you enjoy can also trigger endorphins that will lift your spirits.
You can also try massage therapy or acupuncture.
The most important thing is to give yourself permission to be sad and to not beat up on yourself over it.
freelancer
@arguingwithsignposts:
Talk to anyone, but I very much suggest Chuck.
Leelee for Obama
@arguingwithsignposts:
Let them charge your insurance, it’s the reason you have it. Thank God you do. You’re not alone, you see how many people on here took a moment to reach out, and we’re only virtual. Do not forget that things have been so much more miserable than they are in the country right now. Nothing is easy, but things are changing a bit and we’ve only started to change course. Your six-year old has no idea what the banking mess or the birther crap or Major Dipshit are about, but she/he knows what you mean to them. That’s what matters and you need to focus on that.
I don’t want to make a mistake and have you think I’m not serious here, but my son once told me when I was too sad to breathe,”Don’t sweat the petty stuff, and don’t pet the sweaty stuff.” I think of that whenever I feel down, and it makes me chuckle enough to start feeling better.
Cat Lady
@arguingwithsignposts:
You sound so frantic. Pay attention to your breathing, it will slow things down. This is temporary and you’ll get through it, and we’ll all help. OK?
These are the days of miracle and wonder
This is the long distance call
The way the camera follows us in slo-mo
The way we look to us all
The way we look to a distant constellation
That’s dying in a corner of the sky
These are the days of miracle and wonder
And don’t cry baby, don’t cry
Don’t cry
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDWoytFFVGY
lotus
What Chuck, freelancer, and Leelee said, arguing. And feel all our virtual hands in yours (also a good kneading from Tunch and slurp from Lily). We your peeps.
gnomedad
@arguingwithsignposts:
I don’t know your situation, but if I could say something to myself of 9 years ago, I would say “Please believe your brain can be out of whack, and that you can be helped. You can be you again. Your emotions may not let you believe it now, so just take it on the testimony of someone who’s been there and keep seeking help. Persist.”
I couldn’t believe I would ever be me again, but I made it.
arguingwithsignposts
These are things I don’t understand. I’m crying in front of the computer right now, because of the care shown by anonymous people on a blog. i’m sorry to burden you all. i wish i was well. apparently i’m not.
where is house when you need him, right?
seriously, i appreciate the thoughts. i’m hurting so much, it’s not funny. i don’t feel worth the effort.
JGabriel
arguingwithsignposts:
Precarious sentience. It’s a phrase from Lester Bangs’ essay on / interview with Richard Hell: Death Means Never Having To Say You’re Incomplete.
The full paragraph goes:
As someone who is frequently despairing and suicidal, that phrase is one that reminds me of how precious our lives are, how precarious our sentience. If not for yourself, think of how much pain it would cause those who love you to be deprived of it.
And if you have plan of action to hurt or kill yourself, go to the hospital now.
.
freelancer
Feeling has nothing to do with it, YOU ARE WORTH THE EFFORT.
mai naem
@arguingwithsignposts:
Go to the ER, call a suicide hotline(1-800-SUICIDE), talk to somebody, get some help now.
JGabriel
@arguingwithsignposts:
If I remember the end of the season correctly, House is in a mental institution right now. But hey, he’d probably just decide that your depression / guilt was caused by a lack of vitamin B and that it meant you must have an South American parasite in your gut sucking up all the nutrients.
Then House would walk into the operating room while the doctors were searching your insides for something else, stick his hands in your intestines without washing up first, and pull out a 30′ worm.
All in all, I’d guess you’re probably better off with your local doctors / hospital than going to House.
.
lotus
Scoot right to the ER, arguing, but have someone else take you there, don’t drive yourself. We need you to survive this, and lord knows, so do your kids.
Stick Around
@arguingwithsignposts:
Like many here, I have been there. And after months of crying alone, I went to talk to someone. Worst therapist ever, stopped after 3 sessions, but it was what I needed.
Talk to this Chuck person, or find someone else tonight or first thing tomorrow morning.
You wouldn’t want to miss Cheney in handcuffs, would you? It could happen…be there!
Leelee for Obama
@arguingwithsignposts:
We are, each of us, worth the effort. There is no more important thing a person can do than to reach out to another when they are needed. I really hope you’ll go to a hospital, or at least talk to Chuck. You really need to know that you are important in this world-some people depend on you, but all of us would be diminished by your absence, even those of us who don’t know you.
Laura W
@arguingwithsignposts:
You are worth the effort.
That is the one and only thing you need to cling to tonight. Take the rest for what it’s worth to you…all the advice and sympathy and empathy.
The main thing to get is that You Are Worth The Effort.
Let that be enough for tonight. Try to sleep. Check back in the morning, and don’t be too embarrassed or ashamed to check back.
We have ALL been in your shoes. Some of us more than thrice. It sucks ass, and hurts like hell, but if you hang in and tough your way out through the other end, it will pass. We all promise.
One more for you…
RedKitten
You’re not burdening us at all. You are a human being, and you’re one of us, and you’re hurting badly, so we want to help in any way we can. Many of us have been down that dark hole and know what it’s like to not even be able to see the sunlight anymore. But it IS still there, and we’re all here to help you back up so that you can see it again. And you are absolutely worth the effort.
Ellie
Not a burden, arguingwithsignposts. Seriously, listen to Chuck.
lotus
BESIDES which, dang it, I’m quite likely to be the next in your boat, and I’m gonna need your help when it’s my turn. (How many of us are thinking that at the moment, hm? Nod your head.)
Jen R
@arguingwithsignposts:
What gnomedad said @41.
Sometimes your brain is out of whack. This sounds very much like one of those times.
A lot of people take drugs to give them an altered view of reality. I take drugs so that I see reality. When I don’t take them, my brain tells me lies about myself and about the world. The worst lie of all may be that what it’s telling me is true.
Please consider that your brain might be telling you lies. It happens. It doesn’t mean that you’re bad or weak. It can get better.
Laura W
@arguingwithsignposts: I said the footwear word in my post at #50 which is now stuck in moderation, of course, because I SUCK and I’m stoopid.
So you’ll have to wait around till I’m freed from mod jail because there is a really super awesome natmerch song linked in the post.
The next-to-last samurai
Signposts, you are worth it and we do care very much. Make sure the kidrs have a caretaker while you are not feeling well, and then get thee to the ER. You sound like you have a chemical imbalance in your brain that is affecting your judgment. There are treatments. Please go to the ER ASAP.
HRA
Arguingwithsignposts:
What everyone above has told you.
Please get in touch with Chuck at #34. Click onto his name and do as he directed you.
White House Department of Law (fmrly Jim-Bob)
32@
I share your skepticism about psychology (and to a lesser extent, psychiatry), but from experience, I’ve learned that having someone trained, qualified, and sincerely devoted listen can help put your troubles into perspective, and possibly recommend a course of action.
Like the many here smarter than I said: permanent solution, temporary problems, blah-bla. Please accept the advice of concerned strangers, and seek help.
Stay away from talk radio. Also.
lotus
Let’s hope arguing and Chuck are on the phone right now.
jenniebee
Not to get carried away, but this is how realignments happen. Or not. Also.
slag
Looks like David Corn is formulating a corollary to Peak Wingnut: http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/davidcorn/2009/07/sonia-sotomayor-and-the-end-of.html. Yeah. Good luck with that, David.
White House Department of Law (fmrly Jim-Bob)
Chuck, Leelee, et al:
I know it may seem awkward, but this old SNL sketch kind of reminds me of this virtual intervention.
I really admire the support and outreach from this board. Signposts: If you get this kind of concern from a virtual room full of strangers, just imagine how much you mean to the people who are actually in your life.
JGabriel
arguingwithsignposts:
By the way, if it helps at all, that fucker got fired today. So, y’know, there’s at least some justice in the world.
.
arguingwithsignposts
To all:
i want to thank you for your concern. i’ve e-mailed with john and chuck. i would give you all a big wet kiss if i could. i’m still hurting. i won’t lie. again, i am amazed at the “compassion” of this commentariat.
i am still grappling. will probably be grappling for a while. that sucks, doesn’t it? why can’t we all just function as perfectly as mapped out?
I would give anything to start over, to be hugged, to be something other than what I feel.
peace.
Ruckus
@arguingwithsignposts:
In a previous life I was a councilor in a neighborhood mental health program. All the advice you have received is what to do.
Call someone now. You have reached out and that is the first and hardest step. You are asking for help and there is a world of it out there.
All of the crap of life is temporary, even though it does not always feel like it.
And I always feel like the good parts of the intertubes are that we get to have many, many friends, even if we never met them in person. So many of us here have been in the same boat we can see the progression of the problem and know that asking for help seems like the overwhelming part. But you’ve done that. Good first step, now make the next one, call the hotline in your area or get to an ER and take it one step at a time.
And please let us know how you are doing. We care a great deal.
General Winfield Stuck
@Laura W:
I’m a natmerch fan too, but don’t tell anybody. I mostly like her recent stuff, and Carnival, but also of her music. She’s underated imo.
Bubba Dave
The world is fucked up, and all we can do is unfuck our little piece of it a bit at a time– but we make progress.
Fifty years ago our President wouldn’t be able to drink from the same water fountains I do in Dallas. Your kids will grow up with the knowledge that anyone can be President. One hundred years ago our Secretary of State wouldn’t have been allowed to vote. In your children’s lifetimes we’ll have a female President. One hundred fifty years ago Americans owned other human beings. We are making progress; we are unfucking things for the next generation; there is hope.
That said– there is rational depression because times are bad, and there is clinical depression because your brain chemicals are imbalanced. If there is any doubt in your mind which you are experiencing, get thee to a doctor posthaste. If you have a nasty sinus infection you don’t try to tough it out, you take the antibiotics. Mental illness is no different– if you’re sick, you need to get better, and that means you see the doctor and you take the medicines. Not only do your kids need you, but those of us who are trying to unfuck the world need every co-unfucker we can get. So do what you need to do to get your head straight so we can put you to work. :^)
lotus
Aw, arguing, it’s you tonight, but it could be any of us next, more’n likely. I swear, some days — most days — I click on memeorandum and it’s all I can do not to go screeching headfirst through the window.
Delayed reaction to the Bush years is a big part of it, I surmise. Can you BELIEVE we actually survived that? So often I couldn’t imagine how we’d make it to January 20, 2009. And look: we did. Your resilience is still there, it’s just hiding from you tonight down in those roiled brain chemicals that prolly need a squirt of something to get back in balance.
Ash Can
@arguingwithsignposts: Know what? You rock. Really. Keep talking to all those great people around you. You’re doing the right thing.
Plus, those medical folks that the other posters have said you should talk to — they LIVE to talk to you, and people like you. You’ll make them SO happy if you give them a call. They love it when people like you are brave enough to come to them. Go on. Be a hero.
RedKitten
I’m glad to hear you got in touch with John and Chuck. They’re both wise and are good people off of whom to bounce your thoughts. Please don’t ever feel like you’re alone. We’re all here to help, anytime, threadjacks be damned.
And I wouldn’t promise big wet kisses if I were you. For all you know, we could all look like the love children of Mickey Kaus and his goat. ; )
Leelee for Obama
@Bubba Dave:
I wish I knew you for real. I said many of the same things during the primaries, and being a co-unfucker sounds like a great way to spend time with friends.
There is always a sunrise-even when it’s raining.
If you’re reading this, signposts, just remember that the map-maker you referred to also made the platypus. WTF was in that punchbowl?!
freelancer
I, for one, don’t.
But I’d hug you if I could right now, man.
gnomedad
@White House Department of Law (fmrly Jim-Bob):
Ah, yes, back when it was cool, as well as funny, to have someone smart in the White House. Fortunately, it seems to be coming back into style.
cbear
@arguingwithsignposts:
I have been exactly where you are several times in my life Arguing, and although it is hard to know what to say–I hope you will feel the love and caring from so many of us here and realize that you are not alone in your pain and not alone in this world.
You have within you the power to find your way through this, my brother (or my sister).
Just take a step, one step, back from where you are and toward something better. There are many, many people willing to help you along this road. There are people at your local ER who will be there for you. There are people here at 1-800-273-TALK who will be there for you. We are here for you. Just take one step. You are not alone.
Peace,
Chris
JenJen
Dear, sweet, arguingwithsignposts,
I do hope that you are either speaking with Chuck or with a physician, but if you’re still wondering what to do, you can call me. Just click on JenJen which will take you to my blog and email me; give me your phone number or I’ll give you mine.
I am by no means a doctor, but if you find it easier, I’m a damn good bartender, and if there’s one thing I truly excel at, it’s listening. Bartenders are rather expert at this, it’s not just a cliche. I’ve listened to people in their darkest despair, and I’d rather you call me than go get a drink, trust me on that one. And if talking doesn’t work, I will help you find the professional help you need (although I do hope you’re already on that path, because this is precarious and tender and as hard as it is to ask for help, I do think you and your precious babies would benefit from it).
Oh, sweetheart, I have SO been there. If you want to talk, I’m here for you. Many of us are. Just know the world is full of good people, it’s just hard to see them in the dark.
Xecklothxayyquou Gilchrist
@arguingwithsignposts: Late to this party, but I wish you all the best and hope that things get looking up.
gnomedad
@Bubba Dave:
I would add that the rational and clinical varieties can easily occur together. When I was messed up, I had a “good reason”. But, to paraphrase a fave Thomas Carlyle quote, there are two reasons for everything: a good reason, and the real reason.
lotus
Talk aboutcher “darkest before the dawn,” kids: W00T!!!
lotus
Dang blog ate my exclaimers — three of ’em.
Leelee for Obama
@lotus:
Like I said upthread, the ship is beginning a MAJOR course correction. I may sleep smiling like the Cheshire Cat tonight! Margaret Mead was right when she said the only thing that has ever changed the world was a small group of determined people. They work in the West Wing, and I love them all.
JenJen
@White House Department of Law (fmrly Jim-Bob):
Sweet arguingwithsignposts, that is a very wise thing that is written above.
FWIW, I am very moved and touched by this group tonight. You see? So much goodness in this world, yet so hard to see sometimes.
Leelee for Obama
@White House Department of Law (fmrly Jim-Bob):
Yeah, I like that one. It makes me remember why I voted for the man-even if SNL was snarking.
lotus
Yaymen, Leelee!
Mary G
Don’t know if I’m doing this right, but signposts, I am crying for you now and agree with everything everyone has said. I had done it all – hospitalizations, therapy, exercise, meditation, biofeedback, pets, booze, food, the whole nine yards, and was still “visited by the black dog” of despair, as Churchill called it, way more often than not. It started when I was two or three years old and went on whether my life was good or bad.
Finally at the age of 40 I saw my umpteenth psychiatrist who was department head at a large teaching hospital. He put me on three different anti-depressants. I had been on more of them than I could count and objected to trying yet another expensive regimen. He looked at me through his glasses and told me that he wore trifocals because he couldn’t see near, far or in-between and I was exactly the same.
He was right. It has been 13 years and I have not had that “It would be so nice if I was just dead” feeling more than two or three times since. Keep trying things until you find what works. Your children will never be the same if you do something to hurt yourself.
mai naem
And even for all the concession that Buckrus made to the republicans it was a straight party line vote in the committee. What was the point of compromising? Furthermore, I understand the public option doesn’t kick in till 2013. I don’t get that at all. If the Dems want votes they better have it in effect by 2012. That is what will give Obama his margin of victory.
ellie
arguingwithspots:
I have been there. Depression is the worst and I wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy. Drive yourself to the emergency room. I had to once.
As for the problems in the world, there have always been crazies, thanks to the 24-hour news cycle and the Internet you just hear about them more. They are idiots with their big mouths and they will fade away.
This country has been in worse situations. I think about the stories my parents told me about growing up in the Great Depression where there were no social safety nets. What a nightmare. My dad’s family was so poor that he was grateful to receive an orange for Christmas and his father died because of poor medical care. I can’t even imagine living like that. Think about the Dust Bowl farmers who were forced off their land and had to move, packing all of their possessions in rickety cars and driving to parts unknown where they weren’t wanted.
There is an ebb and flow always and I hope we are emerging from the shadow of selfishness that has been around since Nixon. Fuck Republicans. Fuck their selfishness wrapped up in their Christianity. Fuck them all to hell. They, too, will fade away.
Fern
@JenJen:
JenJen – I recommend a little caution here.
Dennis-SGMM
@mai naem:
Compromising with Republicans is like pissing your pants; it may give you a warm feeling for a while but it doesn’t really help you.
JenJen
@Fern: I am being cautious.
By the way everyone, don’t miss this piece by the always-magnificent Ta-Nehesi Coates. Subject? Pat Buchanan. Point? Spot-on.
Seebach
I second the recommendation to talk to someone. I was very hurt and in a bad way two weeks ago. For about three solid days I had to fight from crying at every moment. After I talked about it for about 45 minutes, it really lifted a lot of the weight off.
Bubba Dave
Some of ’em work in the West Wing. Some of ’em work on Capitol Hill. Some of them knocked on doors in swing states and got called traitors to their race by bitter bigots. Some of them scrimped and saved to donate money to a political campaign that they thought could change the world for the better. Some of them blogged ’til their fingers hurt trying to educate and inform and cajole and encourage. Some of them just went to their polling place and waited in line for hours so they could cast a vote. Some of them went to town hall meetings and some of them called their Senators and congressperson and demanded action.
We are the ones we’ve been waiting for. We are the ones who can change the world. Some of the most visible of the co-unfuckers work in the West Wing, but if we don’t do our part all we’ll have is 1993 redux.
lotus
Bubba Dave, you’re so ON tonight, you gleam. Bravo.
JenJen
@Bubba Dave:
Hey! Were you here during the Ohio Primary, too?
Really great writing, Dave. Thank you for that.
Fern
@JenJen:
Okay. Cautious was the wrong word.
AhabTRuler
arguing: Hang in there and keep talking.
Gordon, The Big Express Engine
Great advice from everyone above and here’s something else I was reminded of now by the posters above who were putting things in historical perspective about our society improving over the decades:
On ESPN today, they showed the clip of President Obama and Willie Mays on Air Force One heading down to the All-Star Game this week. Mays tells Obama how proud he is of him and Obama then thanks Mays (and Jackie Robinson and others) and tells him that his being President was made possible by their ground and barrier breaking efforts decades ago. Brought a tear to my eye.
The anchor said Mays was quoted saying he cried all night on Election Day…
We have lots of missteps as a society (huge understatement), but I can’t help feeling the trajectory we’re on is the right one.
Crashman06
arguingwithsignposts,
Not sure what I can add that the wonderful folks here haven’t already said. Hang in there, talk to someone and know that your not alone. My advice for when you’re feeling a little better: buy a good pair of running shoes and start pounding the pavement until all you can think about is where your foot is supposed to land next. It’s helped me out a bit.
Bubba Dave
@JenJen: Nope, just the closing weeks of the general election, in eastern Ohio along the Pennsylvania border. But it was an experience I’ll treasure all my life.
Violet
@arguingwithsignposts:
Late to the party, but agreeing with everyone else. Definitely get some help during this challenging time. It’s okay to as for help and okay to receive it.
Just wanted to second that food and supplements and things like that can really wreak havoc. I took some doctor-recommended supplements last December and within a few days I was crying for no reason at all. My moods were all over the map until I figured out it was the supplements. Nowhere did I read anything with warnings about affecting mood, although eventually I found a blog post where someone had the same reaction I did. Even if something you are eating or taking isn’t supposed to cause a reaction, it can. Might be something to consider, if this sort of reaction seems unexpected and out of character.
Wishing you all the best. Let us know you’re okay.
JenJen
@Bubba Dave: Well, it was a wild ride here, that’s for sure. And if you were one of those wonderful, amazing, fantastic people who came to my state to work your asses off with us during the general election, then I owe you a big kiss, or a drink, or both. Thank you!!
Original Lee
@arguingwithsignposts: If you’re still here, hon, keep on talking to John and/or Chuck. If you have an ER nearby, make the necessary childcare arrangements and get over there, talking to John and/or Chuck the whole way. You are totally worth all this effort. Emotional pain is the hardest kind of pain there is, because there’s nowhere to get away from it if you are alone. But you’re not really alone now – you’ve got your kids, and you’ve got us, and there are people not too far away who are trained to deal with people in pain. (((((virtual big hug))))))
Bubba Dave
@JenJen:
Well, it’s not like I was gonna do any good here in Texas. And I was only there for a couple weeks– a lot of people did a lot more than I did. That said, if you ever make it down to Dallas I’ll take you up on that drink and the big kiss. :^)
Indylib
Damn, this is quite a group. No wonder I feel at home here. I’ve been there with the depression, too. Still fight it at times. I hope you get some relief tonight, arguingwithposts, and I will echo what the others have said about getting some professional help as soon as possible, with the caveat of suggesting that you look for someone who has been where you are. The best counselors I’ve had have had training, but haven’t necessarily had any degrees, just the willingness to help others who are where they have been – they have empathy and experience. And if a counselor suggests you that you need meds don’t go looking for anti-depressants from an MD, unless you have no other choice. Go to a psychiatrist who will have a better chance to proscribe appropriate meds for what you are going through.
You aren’t alone. Make the choice to seek help.
ethan salto
This is a special place.
Bubba Dave
@Indylib:
Not to nitpick, but psychiatrists ARE M.D.s; otherwise they wouldn’t be able to prescribe medications.
Indylib
@Bubba Dave: Oh, hell – I meant to say GP. Thanks for catching that.
Cain
@Stick Around:
Chuck would be a very good person to talk to. Take Chuck up on your offer, arguing. Seriously. He’s on the west coast so lateness of the hour is not going to be a big deal.
cain
GregB
After hearing that Glenn Beck meltdown and listening to Limbaugh babble on and watching St. Sarah of the Icebergs shoot her foot off and seeing the GOP taking a hatchet Judge Sotomayor, I believe that we are in the wingularity and that peak wingnut is nigh.
-G
gex
@GregB: You say this like right now is just off the charts with the crazy. But really, a month from now you’ll see what’s happened since and think this is just background noise level crazy. That’s the beauty of the GOP. They find a way to make infinity seem small.
GregB
Gex,
I hope the wingularity meter goes to eleven.
-G
jrg
Hear, Hear. A lot of places on the internet don’t care. Reading the top few posts on this thread make me proud to be a member of the commentariat.
Nothing is perfect. We all have struggles. If you feel depressed, please don’t feel alone.
arguingwithsignposts
UPDATE: i spent quite a while talking to chuck, and got some e-mails from folks who really seemed concerned. i want to thank you all. I especially want to thank chuck who spent way more time than he should have talking and listening. wow. people who don’t know me from adam care enough to drop a comment or reach out via e-mail or even talk on the phone.
yeah, this is a special place. i’m still not “okay” in the sense that entails, but I’m humbled by your concern and hope to be back to full strength sometime soon dropping the snark and laughing with everyone.
DonnaInMichigan
Palin/Sanford 2012-2014 1/2.
gex
@arguingwithsignposts: Hope you’re out of the worst of it. Hang in there. We’ll be looking forward enjoying and being targeted by your snark. I’ll be thinking of you.
Anne Laurie
@arguingwithsignposts: Congratulations, you took the first hard step by admitting that you are in pain. Late as I am, I wanted to reiterate what Ash Can said: Sometimes raw adrenaline keeps us pushing through the really dangerous ten-minutes-to-midnight shite. Then, once The Immediate Worst is over, our overtaxed brain metabolites send us crashing, and at the same time the annoying logic robot in our forebrain beeps why now? why now? Ignore the robot, go see a medical professional, and remember that you’ve got at least a couple dozen people all over the country sending good thoughts in your direction.
We no longer expect to lose a predictable chunk of our sisters, cousins, and female friends in childbirth. We don’t assume that every woman will have six or eight or fourteen babies and bury half of them before they’re grown. One of these days — and we’ve made great strides towards this even in the last few years — we’ll have sufficient medical understanding that we won’t let our own brains kill us.
If nothing else, remember the old Irish mantra: You don’t want to give your enemies, those bastvrds, the satisfaction!
Tattoosydney
@arguingwithsignposts:
Arguing,
I’ve never met Chuck, but he’s one of the BJers who I think is very special. I’m glad that you spoke to him, and that he could help you feel a little less desperate.
For all the snarking and fighting and name calling on here (or perhaps partly because of it), Balloon Juicers are always happy to talk or listen. Even at 1am, there’s usually a few of us here who don’t sleep, or live on the other side of the world, and who would be happy to chat, if we can help.
The black dog that’s biting you is apparently one that many of us on here have had visit, and talking about it sometimes makes it a little more bearable. I don’t think it makes the depression go away (I know that it never goes away entirely), but I hope it helps to know that there are people who understand and care (even if they are just “internet” people).
General Winfield Stuck
@arguingwithsignposts:
Takes a while, and sometimes just saying “I hurt” and asking for help is the hardest part. Like several folks here tonight, I’ve had my own bouts with the thousand days of night. One thing I learned, feelings are fleeting and they too shall pass.:)
arguingwithsignposts
@Tattoosydney:
hey, those internet people are who i’m leaning on these days. :) Chuck was great. JC even e-mailed to check on me. I can’t say that I’m in the best state of mind, but the care shown by the BJers has definitely helped more than I could have imagined.
cbear
@arguingwithsignposts: Of course we care my friend, you’re part of our community—and as fractious and as dysfunctional as that community may be, we do have empathy for our fellow human beings.
That is what separates us from the goopers.
As trite as it may sound, tomorrow is a new day and I hope it will be a better one for you.
arguingwithsignposts
@cbear:
thanks cbear. i hope so. i hope so.
DougL (frmrly: Conservatively Liberal)
I am glad to see that arguing is getting help from some of the great people here. I hope everything works out for you arguing, your kids need you and you need to care for yourself if you are to be able to care for them. Life can be rough and at times it can seem like we are all alone even while we are surrounded by people. I am glad you asked for help and I am happy to see the responses here.
You people are truly good and I am proud to be associated with this place.
arguingwithsignposts
@DougL (frmrly: Conservatively Liberal):
Yeah, that’s some crazy shite, isn’t it? I only reached out for … i don’t know why, honestly. i just hoped someone would listen. what a shock to me that so many people cared.
freelancer
Arguing:
Me from New Years Eve 2009:
I was sugar coating it that night. I was staying at my parent’s house from the 17th to like February because the house I was living in at the time didn’t have a bathroom on the same level as my office and bedroom. So lying in my niece’s bed in a pitch black house where everyone I knew was out doing something, it was the loneliest moment I’d had in the last 2 or 3 years. I felt forgotten and irrelevant.
Since then, I’ve relocated to a spot closer to my current work. In lieu of jogging, I fallen in love with cycling to work and many other places. (I’ve spent $20 on gas in the last 2 months). In between now and then, I’ve also had a couple shaky moments, felt alone right after the move. I recently got rejected by a Young Earth Creationist who was crazy about me save for the fact that I’m not fundie enough to fit into her life. That feels a little embarrassing, but it’s nowhere near as embarrassing as when I was 19, I got dumped by a girl who was a civil war re-enacter.
Update on your Birther Major that was pissing you off, Ackermann or someone has it that he’s now known in his unit as a Blue Falcon. (UrbanDic)
I know in my past at times like this, people have shared that they admire me, that I have taken for granted things in my life that people envy. And my response was always a scoffing, “What the hell would anyone envy me for?!”
Let me just state this, I envy you for among other things, your fatherhood. I hope one day to be a father, but if I keep hearing “I can’t see you because you’re a ______”, that is going to be a tough order to fill.
Hang in there, see a Pro, get your mind right, and keep coming back here.
Indylib
@arguingwithsignposts:
Glad to hear that you got through the immediate crisis. If you need a place to vent that is about as non-judgemental as you can probably find in the real world you might consider checking out a 12-step meeting of some sort. I didn’t know this but evidently there is an Emotions Anonymous and an Emotional Health Anonymous. I have no idea what they are like, because I didn’t even know they existed until 5 minutes ago, but I do know that the people in AA saved me time and time again when I was dealing with the worst of my depression and the mess my life was when I started to come out of it. An AA meeting is the least judgemental place I’ve ever interacted with other people face to face and it was like that consistently for years, no matter where I was. Depression has been described as anger focused inward, and being surrounded by people who know what it feels like and can tell stories about how they handle it and won’t judge you or your own stories can be an unbelievable relief.
Tattoosydney
@arguingwithsignposts:
I always thought the worst thing about being depressed was that there isn’t anything rational about it. The “reasons” why I was depressed were always objectively stupid, but having my rational brain tell me that didn’t help… I was still depressed.
People who haven’t been there don’t understand why you can’t just move past it, why “things will get better” doesn’t help.
Even worse, they are (in part) right… things will get better, no matter how awful life feels, even if it’s just waking up one morning and feeling the sun on your face, or hugging someone you love, or patting a dog.
I never got close to the stage of wanting to end things, but the things that got me through were the little joys (god this sounds trite), and telling myself (and finally believing) that no matter how bad things are, there can still be moments of pure happiness in the simplest things, and that if you have enough of those, they somehow add up to a life you can live.
arguingwithsignposts
@Tattoosydney:
Wow. too true. i honestly couldn’t get out of bed for the last few days. just sat here contemplating. it is no way to live, and the farther into it you get, the more hopeless it seems. not rational at all. there’s always been a part of me that was saying “hey, snap out of it. you’ve got to move on.” but that din’t work out quite right.
Chuck Butcher
I’d like to add my compliments to the BJ community, you’re quite the bunch.
(edit) I have my own reasons for appreciating that.
Ruckus
@arguingwithsignposts:
Those of us who have experienced depression first hand and worked through it know that it takes many forms and happens for many reasons. We don’t always know what triggers it or why it hits us but we know it hurts. Please don’t feel alone.
Indylib may be right about it being anger focused inward. As you can see there are many here who feel your pain and have great compassion for that. There are people everywhere who have that compassion and can help. You asked and you received. Life is good after all and it gets better, I swear it does.
I’m glad you found Chuck’s help.
Please let us know how you are doing.
We want to know.
You can email me if you want to. I have not worked in the field for a long time but I have been through depression myself in the last decade and maybe I can give you some insights.
Ruckus
Not fast enough on the edit, it is late after all.
Other than me posting or JC giving you my email (which is OK) we can talk through here.
Tattoosydney
@arguingwithsignposts:
Well, you did the right thing, and reached out… somehow it’s never so bad as when it’s just you and your thoughts, because then often the only way is down. At least when you are speaking to other people, there’s a bit of a circuit breaker which might stop you getting to the very bottom.
Tattoosydney
@Chuck Butcher:
Chuck – you are, as ever, a gentleman of the highest order.
BethanyAnne
I read some at the top, and skipped down here to the bottom. It looks like the immediate bit is past, but know that lots of us here have fought depression. I wish the word for it described the problem better. People think depression is feeling down, but it’s not. It’s the functions of your life, the ability to feel at all, being pushed down, or depressed. It’s a lowering of not your ability to feel good, but your ability to feel at all. As well as to function at all. If we understood that it was that lowering of one’s capabilities, rather than one’s spirit, we’d treat it more seriously, and we wouldn’t blame ourselves for it. I medicate against mine. The new drugs are wonderful. It took me years to get over the thought of “I can pull out of this my own damn self”, and to start being grateful for the meds. And I am grateful. I don’t expect to “get over” an infection without meds, and I no longer expect to get over a serotonin deficiency without them either. Thank you for reaching out – that’s the hardest damn bit.
Chuck Butcher
@Tattoosydney:
Now I’m blushing…
Anne Laurie
Yah, that’s the part of my brain I call the Logic Robot. It’s a very useful servant, but a lousy boss — let it trick you into ignoring the messages you’re getting from the other 85% of your brain, and the little basturd can kill you.
arguingwithsignposts
@Tattoosydney:
yeah, that’s the bitch, right there. i’ve been listening to my own thoughts for far too damn long.
@Anne Laurie:
logic robot, indeed. i still feel “tender” when I think about certain things. i can’t say that I’m out of the woods. But the BJ community has helped a lot. I feel like a weak fool (more logic robot) for blubbering on your virtual shoulders. Thanks for everything, again.
Tattoosydney
@arguingwithsignposts:
See that’s your problem – you’re listening to the thoughts of a depressed person and we all know how damn unreliable THEY are!
I’m glad that collectively we might have helped to get you through tonight.
If you are clinically depressed (and it’s probably a good guess that you are), then the woods you are in are dark and forbidding and it will probably take a while to get out of them – I hate to say it but you might wake up tomorrow, or the day after, feeling even worse. Just remember that there is help if you need it, and happiness somewhere out there if you look for it.
Don’t feel weak or stupid for seeking help and wanting to talk to people – just keep talking, keep reaching out, go and see a good doctor – pills might be the answer, or you might be lucky like me and not need them, but this is not something you can, or need to, or should, get through on your own…
arguingwithsignposts
@Tattoosydney:
You know, that’s the worst part of the whole thing to me. my whole life has been spent with the “suck it up” mentality of Americana, where you just go on. I dread going to a doctor for a “normal” illness. I’ve been to psych pros before, and it seemed like so much shite. poke, prod, pretend to listen, prescribe some pills. if those don’t work, well, wait a few weeks and we’ll give you a diff. flavor.
is it any wonder i don’t keep going?
but it’s hard to overcome that inclination to bite the lip and soldier on. our country doesn’t look kindly on weakness of any kind, and a man who cries for what he’s lost? well, that’s just too much for most.
don’t know what i’m saying with that, but there it is.
Tattoosydney
@arguingwithsignposts:
All of that is true. It’s not easy to admit that you can’t fix all of your problems yourself, particularly when we are culturally indoctrinated to think that we need to – it’s just as bad here on the other side of the Pacific, I promise. Sometimes the people who should help, like doctors, aren’t the answer, because you are just another patient to them. Unfortunately, sometimes you need to keep looking until you find the doctor or a therapist who understands the help you actually need…
The sun is going to rise in the morning – you just have to make sure you are there to see it.
I have to head off home – it’s the end of the work day here… I hope that you’ll be ok. Just keep posting if you need to, and I’m sure one of the other BJ minions will be there for you – if necessary, wake Chuck up! *grin* . I’ll check in later.
Indylib
@arguingwithsignposts:
No doubt that is the prevailing mentality in this country, where what is on the surface seems to be taken so much more seriously than what is beneath the surface. All the stuff we bitch about here every day is part of that. But as anyone here that has dealt with this stuff will tell you, it’s so much harder to make the choice to reach out and get help. Ignoring it, “soldiering on” and pretending nothing is wrong is the easier choice. It takes a strong person in this society to admit to any kind of weakness. In the end it doesn’t matter if anyone but you realize the strength it takes to actively combat this. Don’t worry about what other people think – they aren’t living your life or feeling your pain.
It sounds like you’ve been through the cycle before, the professional help and the meds, so you know what doesn’t work for you. Don’t give up, keep reaching out and searching until you find a fit that’s good for you – it’s out there.
Ruckus
@arguingwithsignposts:
You said it very well.
There are many sides and twists to depression.
Tattoosydney has it spot on as well, it’s not a straight line to the depths and it’s not a straight line out either.
Indylib talked about AA and 12 step programs in general because they work by not being judgmental and allowing you to talk openly about your issues. That’s also what I feel all of us here have been saying. No one is here to judge you in any way and that can include you as well, not judging yourself.
A Mom Anon
I can’t really add much to the above,just keep reaching out and talking to people til you get what you need. There’s no shame in that. Your kiddos need you well,the legacy of suicide or untreated depression is not healthy for them. But,your recovery and treatment is really all about you,you have to find the thing(s)that fit for you and your situation. There’s no one size fits all thing and the path to health isn’t straight or perfect,it’s full of twists and turns and progress and steps backward. Try to be gentle to yourself,you’re not a failure,reaching out is super brave,even if you don’t feel especially courageous.
I hope you feel better soon, ((((gentle hugs)))).
RedKitten
Well, we’re an exception to that, but we’re all a little weird anyway (grin).
Seriously, though, I echo what everybody else said. Listening only to your own brain is not going to help at all, as your brain is one seriously unreliable narrator right now. Keep seeking help, and keep talking to us anytime you need to. Chuck is a prince among men, and the rest of us will definitely be happy to drop everything and listen — I think every single one of us has either been there, or has had someone close to us wrestle with that awful black dog. So you’re not going to get any judging here, kiddo.
bob h
I’d prefer the nutbags to go for Palin because that is better than their getting behind Huckabee, who could be dangerous because he has a functioning organ in his head.
lotus
Good morning to all! That’s my story and I’m sticking to it, dammit.
Ruckus
@arguingwithsignposts:
I have been trying to remember how I figured my way out and it came back to me. So I want to tell a story, a parable. I have heard this a number of different ways, this is mine.
I was waking down a very narrow steep flight of stairs. It’s so far down that I can’t see the bottom, but it’s too narrow and steep to turn around, so I keep going. At what feels like it must be the bottom of the stairs I stop because I have no idea what to do. It’s pitch black and the only sounds I can hear are in my head. Not knowing what to do I murmur, a whisper at best. And I see a faint light come on, far away. And then another and another. I still can’t see very much and I can only hear murmurs, no real voices. So I call out louder and more lights come on. I’m in a huge room and it’s full of people I’ve never met. Everyone there has some kind of a switch in their hands. As they turn them on it gets brighter and brighter until it’s like daylight. And as I ask the people around me what they are doing there they tell me – we’re here to show you the lights so you can find your way out. And I can see the stairs that I thought were narrow, steep and long are not so much and that I can climb back up. And I know that if I find myself on those stairs again there will be people and light to show me the way out.
Rey
@arguingwithsignposts:
I was in a deep emotional valley myself yesterday and not able to concentrate. Came across your post and I didn’t feel so alone. Hope things are brighter this morning for you. It’s raining cats and dogs in my area right now, reading the concern and outreach from all of the wonderful Ballon Juicers brought the tears again. Whatever it is just know, that this is just a delay and not a denial. Take care of yourself, those kids need you- I have to remind myself of that everyday.
inkadu
@arguingwithsignposts: Hey, just wanted to add my voice to the chorus: I have been there, too… you’re not alone in any of this.
And your brain is just like your heart or you liver — sometimes it gets sick and needs time to get back to proper functioning. But unlike our liver or hearts, our brain is sensitive to what we experience. You’re not any weaker of a person for being depressed — it’s normal, and it’s temporary. It will get better.
chopper
@Chuck Butcher:
indeed. as the commercials say, talk to chuck.
One sick twisted hippie
@arguingwithsignposts: Shortly after turning on my tv on 9/11, I sat and wept over my 9 month old baby. I felt guilty and scared for the world he would have to grow up in. We talk so much about the way things used to be, trying to put ourselves in simpler times-a time that our children will have no notion of.
8 years later, I still think about that, but I know there are atleast 2 little boys that will make the world a better place-all we can hope for our children is better than what we had ourselves.
chopper
@arguingwithsignposts:
you and me both, kid. hell, the last therapist i saw would fall asleep in the middle of our sessions. yeah, that made me feel better. and i come from a conservative ‘suck it up’ family.
then again, i married a psychologist.
luckily the more intense bouts of depression i’ve had are long behind me, which is good because i have a 6 month old. but in the same manner sometimes i look at her and imagine what the world is going to be like when she’s 20 and i get scared half to death.
i’m glad to see you still posting this AM.
HRA
Arguing, I was very glad you came back here to respond to these caring wonderful people.
I could write a book on my past and even current experiences about my life. Right now I choose to tell you what I found to be helpful to me. In my darkest moments, it was therapeutic to slowly make changes in my lifestyle. I chose to walk the few miles to work. Things I would not have seen and appreciated otherwise were there to give me a boost or a smile. It may have been a bird, a flower or even an unusual cloud formation to be studied. It may have been a good morning greeting with a smile from a stranger. By the time I entered my workplace I felt invigorated and much different from when I started out.
I do understand everyone has to find what works best for themselves. Mine is only one example of many available to all of us. You have to find one for yourself.
Hope
DBrown
@arguingwithsignposts: Very good posts – so much good advice. Depression is common and can be caused by a host of health issues that family/economic problems only bring out. As most people here say – get professional help!
But until then, remember that diet and exercise can help but getting treatment is important.
Someone said something about B vitamins – good idea (I believe B3 (Niacin) is very good at helping depression (and it will lower LDL levels (the bad stuff) a great deal and raise HDL levels too (the good stuff).) BUT B3 is one of the few vitamins that is HIGHLY toxic above the therapeutic level (boy, did I find out the hard way … not fun). Also, at these levels it can cause birth defeats in animals so never take extra niacin if pregnant.
In any case, good luck and hang in there!
canuckistani
@arguingwithsignposts:
Late to the party as always, and I have nothing important to add, except to say – don’t despair. Get help, volunteer somewhere, take the kids to the park; do something to break the status quo. The hard part is taking that first active step; trust me, I know. But once you do, the second step is easier.
arguingwithsignposts
Thanks to all again. i’m still here today thanks in no small part to your presence last night. still down, but trying to stay up. And I’ve read every one of your messages several times. from the bottom of this cynical heart, thanks.
A Mom Anon
Oh good,I just came back to check on you. I’m SO glad you’re hanging in there. It does get better,I know it’s hard now,but it will. Please fight,and remember,you are NEVER alone.
SiubhanDuinne
@arguingwithsignposts: I am very glad you’re here, signposts. I didn’t post yesterday, but please know you were in my thoughts all last evening and through the night and when I woke up this morning.