I was struck by this contrast. From Marc Ambinder (in what I thought was a decent piece):
The (insurance) industry concluded that reform was inevitable. In order to save their industry, they decided to partner with the White House from day one. They’ve accommodated the demands of Democrats to scrap discriminatory policies against people with pre-existing conditions, have agreed to various premium caps, have agreed to accept various different types of basic coverage plans. In exchange, the industry gets to exist; it gets millions of more Americans with a mandate to buy coverage; it gets some flexibility in terms of risk pools; it doesn’t accept onerous restrictions on its profit-to-loss ratios. So far, the White House hasn’t gotten any votes out of this arrangement, but they’ve gotten the industry to hold its fire.
From the Politico today:
The insurance lobby has urged the public to turn out for town halls, as have members of the tea party movement and the group Conservatives for Patients’ Rights, which is providing a list of upcoming public events on its website — together with videos of events that have already been disrupted.
So which is it? Is the insurance industry “holding its fire” or not?
Shinobi
Based on everything I’ve seen heard and read today, I’m going with not.
I think we need to get a rally of the uninsured together, but then I worry about someone getting injured. Eeek.
maye
Who in their right mind would trust the insurance industry?
CatStaff
The Brooks Brothers bullshit all over again.
Wonder how long the Great Unwashed are going to take this crap?
GReynoldsCT00
They’re trying to cover themselves either way?
Bootlegger
They’re playing both sides. I’m shocked! Shocked I tells ya!
General Winfield Stuck
The AMA and various other groups primary deliverers of Healthcare are holding their fire. The insurance companies sure as hell aren’t. I would guess HMO’s are with the insurers as well./
feebog
The Health Insurance industry has been spending over a million dollars a day to lobby against reform on Capitol Hill. That’s hardly “holding your fire”. They are fighting for their lives. They know if a public option is passed it is only a matter of time before the American Public figures out that they have been ripped off for years.
eric
Here is the only thing that matters right now: Will the gang of six fail to meet the 9/15 deadline? The best hope for reform is the reconciliation process. Once we head down that road, the votes are there. Chuck Schumer does not risk his neck foolishly. Nor does Rockefeller. Those guys are playas. So, the GOP will overplay its hand — as usual — and the Dems will be forced to use reconciliation and the GOP will scream foul. At that point, the Dems are all in and have to get a deal and will do it. The Blue Dogs will go alon at the end of the day because they wont want to be the ones that killed health care (insurance) reform.
This has all been one large kibuki dance by the Man From Kenya to appear bi-partisan, knowing that the GOP can never go along because they are bought and paid for.
So, in the end, are there 50 votes in the Senate? The answer is yes. Are there enough votes in the House? Again, yes.
As for the objections to reconciliation, if the MSM thinks health care debates are boring, how about explaining the ruling from the Senate parliamentarian? That is the P.R. battle that has to be won.
eric
Joshua Norton
The wingnuttier “tea-bag” factions are shipping in busloads of whackjobs with the sole purpose of disrupting Town Meetings called to discuss insurance reform. They have their little cheat sheets with screaming points and ideas on how to covertly take over the meetings so the press will report on how unpopular the reform bill is instead of reporting on how a few people are disrupting everything.
In other words, business as usual.
lamh31
Sorry OT, but I thought it was cool, so I just had to post it.
“Sesame Street Does Mad Men”
http://nymag.com/daily/entertainment/2009/08/sesame_street_does_mad_men.html
gonzone
not.
Lola
@ Eric
We don’t really need reconciliation. Any bills passed by reconciliation have to be renewed in five years. We don’t want thmt. We just need our Senate douchebags (Nelson, Lieberman, Bayh, Landrieu, Wyden) to vote for cloture. How they vote on the final bill is immaterial. If Harry Reid can’t get this done, than the White House and DNC should make it clear he will not get any support for his likely tough re-election campaign in Nevada.
JGabriel
DougJ @ Top:
Not.
But they want ‘plausible deniability’, so they’re focusing on astroturf campaigns rather than advertising, and lying to the executive branch and congressional democrats about it.
.
Janet Strange
OK, at the absolutely MUST SEE – for anyone who didn’t already – interview (or read – there’s a transcript) with Wendell Patton (former VP of Cigna), he explains this:
It’s all going according to plan. It worked in ’94. They’re doing the same thing now. Ambinder is either naive or an insurance co. tool. I vote “(b).”
leo
The moment the ‘public option’ becomes part of any bill, it’ll be ‘hit ’em with everything you’ve got’ from the insurance industry.
I mean, isn’t it obvious?
matoko_chan
Obama is initiating a new ad campaign.
I think…membah the populist outrage over the bailout bonuses?
The insurance companies are going to be royally screwed….Obama is a machiavellian pragmatist….it is better to be feared than be loved (by the insurance companies).
They were trying to play both sides of the fence, nominally supporting Obama’s plan while stirring up the teabaggers aka the “low information” base of the GOP and lobbying congress like mad.
Game ovah.
Would you like to play again?
eric
@Lola: It is game over in five years. That is what the GOP knows: once you give the people something, you cant take it away. If it is not working in five years, it deserves to die. But it will work and it will work with tweaks over that five years. That is why the GOP is so scared. Bill Kristol was right in 1994, this puts the GOP into the wilderness.
Let me say this, I do not think the Man From Kenya is a mystic, but he is a shrewd political player. He knows he has to win and he will. Ever since he began running for the WH he has been a man playing chess, while the others have played checkers. A guy like that (and his crew) just does not forget how to play.
They want to appear bi-partisan. They have bent over backwards to appear bi-partisan. And when the reconciliation moment happens and it is blessed by the Parliamentarian, then “GOP meet wilderness.”
The five years means nothing. You will never take away affordable public health care from (by then) 50 to 100 million americans. Welcome to the new third rail of American politics.
eric
JGabriel
By the way, there’s an interesting diary at DKos on keeping the teabaggers under control at town-hall meetings.
The big takeaways I got from the piece were:
* Assert your authority – have a police presence, and let the teabaggers know that you’re on to their game and that disruptive behavior will not be tolerated. Remember, the tea-baggers are authoritarians. A strong assertion of authority will help keep them in check.
* If possible, have the meeting somewhere with enough distance from from the street that noise from street demonstrations won’t be disruptive.
.
Janet Strange
@Janet Strange: Damn – forgot to tweak the blockquotes thingy. The last paragraph is my comment, obviously.
matoko_chan
I think townhalls should require attendees to prove they live in the congressmans district, with photo id.
Keep the travelling teabaggers out.
SGEW
“Holding their fire” means different things to different people.
After all, they are not literally shooting guns. That’s a positive sign, yes?
eric
@matoko_chan: You correctly noted that “Obama is a machiavellian pragmatist.”
You are exactly right, the Obama Fu is strong in that one.
eric
jwb
It’s not clear to me who is bankrolling the Brooks Brother mob franchise. There seems to be some Swiftboat money involved, which I think is more ideological than corporate, insofar as we can separate the two; I haven’t heard about any other sources of significant funding, but it all seems very shadowy, so it’s hard to say. Nevertheless, I imagine that the insurance industry is not displeased with the tea-ruptions, so long as they don’t get out of hand, if for no other reason that it focuses media attention on the government role and away from the industry, which only strengthens their bargaining power. I believe the industry wants some sort of reform, however, since, if it’s done right, it could actually be advantageous to the industry (lower margins, but higher volume and more predictable risk). This is not to say that pursuing reform in the direction the insurance industry wants is at all the way to go, it’s just that I would in fact be surprised to learn that the insurance industry was a significant protagonist in the tea-ruptions. (Encouraging people to show up at town hall meetings and encouraging them to disrupt said meetings are two separate things, which Politico sloppily, if characteristically, conflates.)
JGabriel
Wow, weird formatting. Used to be that if you put an asterisk in front of a paragraph, it formatted as a bullet point.
Apparently, it now bolds the paragraph and adds separator lines at the end.
Be nice if we were able to edit our posts, so I could fix that.
.
SGEW
@Janet Strange:
Ambinder’s wide eyed naïveté is his professional calling card. It what he do. I think it’s kind of cute, sometimes (when I’m not imagining throttling him into an acknowledgement of reality).
JGabriel
jwb:
Freedomworks is one of the major players and astroturf organizers in the anti-health insurance reform campaign. Most of the insurance companies and other winger health care opponents are funneling money through them.
They’re not the only ones, of course. But they are one of the biggest.
.
eric
@jwb: The GOP is bankrolling the mobs through every source at their disposal. They have to kill this. As bad as reform is for the insurance industry, it is worse for the GOP. The insurance companies will adapt or die — thus most will adapt. Competition will get sharper and consumers will win over time because they will have a real choice in the marketplace. If you are the CEO of an Industry player, you may not make $21M, but you will still make $13M. That is still a win. But if you are the GOP, you got nothing.
eric
Thomas Levenson
@SGEW: Ambinder is also a person working outside of his core competence. He’s really an election nerd, much more than a politics nerd. He isn’t bad (though he gets played) as someone covering the mechanics of elections.
Every single time he moves in the direction of writing about policy or, as now, the politics of policy as opposed to that of elections, he’s out of his depth.
Worse — he doesn’t know it. He lacks the reportorial chops to get behind the statements he receives from his topline sources (hardly unique here, I may say). And the result is credulousness…which combined with his usual-suspects approach to sourcing in general, produces a generic right-ward lean.
He is, in other words, a microcosm of the disaster that it is elite Washington journalism right now. IMHO, of course….
4tehlulz
Shorter Blue Cross: WHO WILL RID ME OF THESE TROUBLESOME REFORMERS?
joe from Lowell
Ambinder’s piece isn’t wrong, it’s just outdated. There really was a truce between Obama and the insurance industry, which allowed them to negotiate the goo-goo “insurance reform” elements of the bill.
It has broken down, however, over the public option. The insurance industry knows it can’t compete against a more efficient public plan, and they’ll kill the whole thing rather than accept that.
Tax Analyst
“Be nice if we were able to edit our posts, so I could fix that.”
Yeah, like that could really happen. Why that’s about as likely as a man walking on the moon. phfftt.
Ooh, wait…do I see a “Fundraiser” type thread on the “Recent Posts” list? Ooh, where’s my credit card?
SGEW
@Thomas Levenson: Very good point.
See also Todd, Chuck.
Zifnab
@eric:
I don’t know about kabuki theater or that Obama was all-knowing. He did it the traditional way to hold out the carrot, but he kept the stick in hand. Obama had all his bases covered. The Dems are getting savvy, and I appreciate that.
The GOP could have gotten on board and made the bill bipartisan. But, like Iraq, they decided to own their end of the issue. Now it’s GOP vs Dems again, and the middle ground is eroding fast. We’ve seen bills pass out of the Senate HELP committee and all the House committees. Baucus is last out the door and with the least attractive bill. He’d be in a shitty political position if he didn’t have all the right-wing and corporate support. I’m waiting for the Dems to just tell him to get paper out the door so they can mothball it and move on.
JohnR
The Ambinder piece was baloney. The insurance industry really doesn’t care too much about the details of any bill. Why should they? They’ll make sure to “negotiate in good faith” with the WH, but then why are they pumping so much money into the Blue Dogs and GOP to defeat anything? 10:1 that much of the money for the New Teabagger/Bad Demoncrats demonstrations is coming from the coffers of the Insurance Consortium. They would be foolish not to use every weapon at hand, and when it comes to a lust for profit, anything goes.
Bulworth
Ezra Klein–who’s been writing about this stuff for years–thinks Reconciliation’s a no-go, because the Republicans would in turn just shut the Senate down.
SGEW
@Zifnab:
This is funny. I laughed.
gypsy howell
eric, I really, really want to believe you. But I’ll believe it when I see it — nothing the democrats have done in the last … shit… my whole adult life… leads me to believe they won’t cave to corporate interests and money now.
Meanwhile, I’m faxing letters in support of single payer (hey, might as well go all in) to my congresscritter gerlach – big lot of help that will do. Will be firing up letters for Specter and Casey too today.
I sure hope Obama is a lot smarter and a lot stronger than I think he is – it’s our only hope. (Cripes, I sound like Princess Leia.)
Brian J
Those aren’t mutually exclusive strategies. The insurance industry can try to be part of the process so it has some say in how the legislation is shaped but then also try to create an image of what would happen if certain legislation were enacted. It’s sort of like a slimy body shop repairman going around putting nicks and dents in random cars in a town and then offering his services to fix them. In fact, it makes perfect sense that they’d do this.
Thomas Levenson
@SGEW: Re Chuckie…Yup; he’s actually a very good broadcast journalist within the field he’s ploughed in depth.
The notion that he’s a network White House correspondent is mind boggling. Sort of like moving me from science writing to the engineering faculty because (a) I’m at a school w. an engineering faculty and (b) I clean up o.k. (Well…I don’t, but go with the counterfactual for a moment.)
I could mouth the words (and equations) that others fed me…but no one coming to me for a bridge that would stand up would go home happy.
What’s wrong with accepting the limits (and license to rule) of one’s actual core competency and interest?
Comrade Dread
They’re probably doing both.
From a business standpoint, they’d be stupid not to be both concessionary (as much and as slowly as possible) with hostile Democratic lawmakers, and at the same time trying to win a PR war and stop the changes from happening at all.
That way they minimize the damage if the Democrats push ahead and pass a reform bill, and they still have a chance of killing the whole process if they can convince enough Americans that reform is an idea that will hurt individuals more than the current system.
JohnR
As for Zen-master Obama; I’ll believe it when I see the results. I think he’s being rolled; where’s LBJ when we need him?
General Winfield Stuck
He’s not the only one. Chuck Todd comes to mind.
General Winfield Stuck
SGEW beat me to it. Drat no edit.
Balconesfault
I’ve noticed that the AM radio station that talks local politics has been HAMMERING on the healthcare debate the last few days … and while usually the three-conservative group tries to have someone take a centrist/moderate position for debate sake, there’s none of that on the healthcare discussion. It’s “government healthcare – evil or worse than evil?”
I also noticed that a number of insurance groups are advertising during the show … something I’d never noticed before. My guess is that along with the $1.5 million/day that’s being spent on lobbying, they’re directing local companies to pour advertising dollars to conserva-hosts on a quid pro quo basis. It’s all in to stop any public option.
The Grand Panjandrum
@Thomas Levenson: @SGEW:
Yes.
Politico has to be fact checked like a NY Times piece on the passing of Walter Cronkite. I generally read what they have to say then I go elsewhere to see if anyone else is reporting the same story just to find out if they are even on the right track much less factually correct, or not. Poltico is just Fox News for people who like to read their news.
ellaesther
@Comrade Dread: I also have to wonder if the term “insurance industry” may not be too broad a term — I have to wonder if some players are doing one thing, while other players do another. I have no doubt that the shared goal is to continue to exist and profit handsomely, but I can’t help but think that it is unlikely that an industry that large is any more of a monolith than any other large group.
Brian J
@Thomas Levenson:
I never thought all that much of his election analysis, either. I stopped reading his blog right after the election, but during the campaign, I checked it a few times a day because it was a great source of information. He would have links that I wouldn’t have found on my own and, if memory serves me correctly, would pass along “inside information” that you wouldn’t see other places. That was awesome.
But his analysis? He wasn’t stupid, just medicore, from what I remember. Maybe it was his political leanings shining through, but I remember reading some of his posts on where the McCain campaign would be competitive and thinking “WTF? Wishful thinking if I ever saw it.”
The Bearded Blogger
@eric, no.8
I think The Man from Kenya is not so much performing Kabuki as displaying a tit-for-tat strategy; that is, trust and cooperate first, defect only when the other has defected. I think this is what happened with TARP, stimulus, etc. Obama tried to involve republicans, and only shunted them when they showed they wouldn’t cooperate. I think the same will happen here.
The Grand Panjandrum
Somewhat OT: WaPo wants viral video? They want trenchant? They got pwnd.
eric
@Bulworth: Ezra thinks it is a no-go politically. First, he says “If Democrats try to invoke reconciliation and then override the parliamentarian and rewrite the Senate rulebook on the fly, the GOP will quickly and easily close down the chamber.”
I do not think that they will have to overrule the Parliamentarian. Between Byrd, Schumer and Kennedy, there is enough experience and will to make this facially plausible.
Let the GOP shut down the Senate. That worked so well for them the last time (albeit in the House).
In addition and in response to gypsy, if this was Reid versus McConnell, then i would be worried. But, this is Obama versus the GOP and his presidency is on the line. He will win. He has no choice.
eric
Zifnab
@SGEW: Hey, I’m saying it was a physical possibility that Obama prepared for. Had some segment of the GOP wanted to come to the table – like the Ladies of Maine and Specter did on the stimulus package – Obama was ready to give them a seat.
After the RINO-hunting that blew up over the stimulus vote, it looked like defections were less and less likely. But Obama was prepared for the unexpected. I can appreciate that. And by giving the GOP a place at the table, he didn’t make it all about the Blue Dogs. Obama wasn’t afraid to go hunting for votes on the other side of the aisle, and – at the beginning – that weakened the Blue Dog hand.
Politically, I can’t say their doing it wrong. We’ve got multiple versions of the bill on the table, most of which contain the public option. The GOP has completely edged itself out of the picture and you’ve got millions of dollars flowing into Dem coffers in an attempt to fight this. Ultimately, we are doing this right.
SGEW
@The Grand Panjandrum: That is fantastic!
“WashingtonPost.com. Inadvertently revealing the dark heart of our dying industry, two minutes at a time.”
Olliander
Of course the industry is not holding their fire. They know that competing with a public option is the beginning of the end for the status quo, and that’s generally what billions and billions of dollars in lobbying buys you—the status quo. That goes for any heavily regulated industry.
To assume that the industry are is embracing the president’s “reforms” just because of some fake photo-op is nonsense.
The funny thing is that the bills coming from the House and Senate really don’t do anything towards true reform. And there is more blame for this on the Democrats side than anything else. The administration wants to make this about cost-control—there’s nothing in these bills that really address that issue.
Real reform of the industry requires our elected officials to come right out and talk to us like grown-ups, and tell the American people that “controlling costs” in healthcare is a bitter, bitter pill, and we will all have to swallow.
jwb
@Eric
The GOP is not the insurance industry. Just saying. The GOP is also ideological (or if you prefer partisan) rather than corporate, to the extent that you can separate them. And they (as well as other tea-baggers) have reasons for wanting health care defeated irrespective of what the insurance industry might want.
My sense: at this stage the industry welcomes any pressure the GOP can bring to defeat the public option but it doesn’t actually want to defeat reform completely, which is the GOP’s goal, because there is a lot of money to be made with a universal mandate. Unless the health care reform is really piss poor—not an impossibility, to be sure—the GOP will lose politically if some form of health care reform passes; that’s why I believe when all is said and done the industry’s and GOP’s goals fundamentally diverge, and why I remain skeptical that the industry would be underwriting the tea-ruptions in any direct fashion.
@JGabriel
Freedomworks seems very shadowy as well. Led by Armey, I see. A quick Google search suggests expected rightwing funding sources and some nebulous links to one insurance group.
I’m not trying to defend the insurance industry or anything, and I certainly don’t see them as being a benign or even neutral force in the debate; I’m really just trying to get a handle on the extent to which the tea-ruptions are being driven by corporate versus ideological interests (again, to the extent that they can be separated). In any case, any links that will help me sort this out would be appreciated.
SGEW
@Zifnab: I hear you. I’m just feeling extra-cynical recently. For some reason.
Lola
I also question the Obama jujitsu talk here. Obama even said himself he has struggled to sell health care to the American people. Obama needs us. Obama also needs some people to play bad cop to his good cop. Nancy Pelosi has stepped up by attacking health insurers as greedy and immoral.
Obama needs other Democratic leaders to stick their necks out, too. So far, that ain’t happening. Governing is a lot different than running a campaign. Obama is at the mercy of the Senate, and we should all be very afraid of that.
jwb
@ericNow that I reread your comment, I see that you are saying something similar. Nevermind.
burnspbesq
Haven’t read any of this guy’s stuff before, but his take on the healthcare debate is IMO worthy of being taken seriously.
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-ct-neil4-2009aug04,0,3353715.column
The Grand Panjandrum
@Zifnab: Yep. I’ll be surprised if some form of reform isn’t passed. As a matter of fact I will be shocked. Too many of us are going into Chicken Little mode before a single bill has made it out of committee.
JGabriel
The Grand Panjandrum:
Does anyone else find the existence of National Review, the Weekly Standard, and other right wing textual media rather perplexing? I mean, I always find it puzzling that people who hold such views even know how to read.
Very strange.
.
ThatLeftTurnInABQ
The insurance comanys are to us today what the big industrialists were to Weimar Germany – they are respectable and supportive of the established govt. and middle of the road policy in public while playing with fire behind the scenes to get more leverage. Of course they would never let any of this astroturfing stuff get out of control. That is unpossible, you betcha!
ironranger
It’s bizarre and sad how many retirees & senior citizens dependent on Medicare & Social Security are screaming in panic about ‘government run’ healthcare.
A writer to opinion page in a local paper responded to a retired rightwinger that distorts facts wildly in almost weekly letters to ed with a poem. A few lines:
You say that health care’s a luxury
And not a right for society.
If that’s the case, then to be fair
You ought to reject your Medicare
And in your fiscal purity
Please cancel your Social Security.
The next time I hear a younger couple not yet on Medicare or Social Security who are ranting about government taking over & ruining our fantastic health care system, I’m tempted to ask them if it isn’t time for them to tell their parents to give up their Medicare & Social Security & come live with them.
KCinDC
The Democrats need to take every opportunity to point out over and over that these teabaggers are tools of the insurance industry. People may not be fond of Congress, but they hate insurance companies even more.
eric
@Lola: Schumer just stuck his neck out with the reconciliation comment. He is as shrewd as shrewd gets in the Senate. He ran the DSCC and was “responsible” for gaining six seats in 2006. He is a player and a powerful one at that.
Obama has had problems, not with the GOP, but with the Dems that are bought and paid for. The GOP cant stop him if the Dems are on board. Were it not for Baucus, there would have been a bill out of the senate already.
The MSM is more of a problem than the GOP. The GOP trots out McCain. Really? The MSM transmits that faulty GOP talking points (i.e., lies) to distort the PR battle.
eric
matoko_chan
@ bearded
Yess!! It is tit-for-tat.
In games theory, tit-for-tat is mathematically unbeatable.
Obama is consistantly playing tit-for-tat….his first offer is always bipartisan compromise….then his next move copies the republican response. When they cheat, he cheats.
The force is strong in this one.
matoko_chan
yeah, eric….the MSM wants to sell. So they try to make it more of a contest than it is.
Like, for them the story isn’t in the details of how health-insurance reform would help america, but in the frenzied whacko opposition.
it is gladitorial bloodsport.
matoko_chan
YESSSSSS!
bearded is correct.
It is tit-for-tat.
In games theory, tit-for-tat is mathematically unbeatable.
Obama is consistantly playing tit-for-tat….his first offer is always bipartisan compromise….then his next move copies the republican response. When they cheat, he cheats.
The force is strong in this one.
matoko_chan
YESSSSSS!
bearded is correct.
In games theory, tit-for-tat is mathematically unbeatable.
Obama is consistantly playing tit-for-tat….his first offer is always bipartisan compromise….then his next move copies the republican response. When they cheat, he cheats. It is a trigger response in the iterated PD (prisoner’s dilemma)
The force is strong in this one.
JGabriel
@matoko_chan:
Yep, I was going to post something about how tit-for-tat is one of the best strategies for Prisoner’s Dilemma, and Obama seems to be playing a very high stakes game of Prisoner’s Dilemma with the GOP.
.
freelancer
OT:
But Sullivan is all over the map. Yesterday, he was sympathizing with Ambinder about the nature of the Teaparty Townhall Wreckers (OOT- I used to play bass for TTW). Today he counters a WSJ anti-marriage op-ed with something that sounds like a fledgling Cole circa March 2005 or October 2007.
Come out and play Andy, the water’s warm.
https://balloon-juice.com/?p=8971
As for Sully’s conversion, I’ll place it around the time that Obama quietly repeals DADT under everyones’ noses while the right is having a stroke about immigration and claiming Barack’s a secret Mexican or something. Q. E. D.
ThatLeftTurnInABQ
Ditto that. It is evolution of cooperation theory adapted to politics. What a strange coincidence that the guy who figured this out has as his key political strategist somebody who shares the same last name (Axelrod) as Robert A.
There is also something poetic about treating our politics using IPD theory, since it does sort of feel like we’ve been stuck in a shitty jailhouse (aka Nixonland) for decades, trying to figure out how to bargain our way out. American politics as plea-bargin negotiations – something about that metaphor seems appropriate.
matoko_chan
oops, sry for the iterated posting.
i kept taking things out to try to get it to post.
Someone should give the GOP a Games Theory schooling.
I belong to a group blog where we have been discussing Hoefstaders single shot Platonia Dilemma for like 3 years.
Games Theory rules!
I just knew Obama was a gamer.
He’s uberl33t hardcore.
Sully is just impatient. i think O is waiting for critical mass on DADT, when the milguys finally start begging him to repeal it.
and year….immigration reform is going to be so much fun.
the teabaggers protesting that will be demographic suicide, and they know it…..yet, hating on brown peoples is how they roll!
lawlz
burnspbesq
@matoko_chan:
“the teabaggers protesting that will be demographic suicide, and they know it…..yet, hating on brown peoples is how they roll!”
Which is why it’s been so much fun to watch McCain squirm before finally coming out against the Sotomayor nomination. He was well and truly faced with Hobson’s choice. He could vote for her and curry favor with Arizona’s Hispanic population (a third of registered voters) at the price of being primaried from the right, or he could vote against her, avoid the primary and seriously endanger his chances in the general.
It’s a long way to go to November 2010, but I’m willing to bet that he fucked up.
jetan
Just the insurance companies hedging their bets or pleading in the alternative. Pretty smart play. They have no intention of losing this. I think they are going to cream us again.
Sly
/mysticalshamanvoice
Yes.
The Bearded Blogger
@burnspbesq
Oh my God, I sooo hope McCain loses in 2010. At this point he is nothing more than a bitter fuck. I kind of respected the guy somewhat, right until he picked that dadaist performance artist for VP
Corner Stone
@eric:
Ahhh, but what is “win” in this context? We don’t know because Obama won’t tell us. We can infer that win means pass a bill that has “Reform” in the title, but who’s to say how that will benefit anyone at this point?
Corner Stone
@matoko_chan:
But there’s absolutely no evidence of this. Where have we seen evidence that Obama has chosen “defect”?
mcc
I’m just fascinated by the language used in these articles. The insurance industry “accommodates” demands. They “agree to” compromise “arrangements” or deals. The process is described as if it is a negotiation, as if the insurance companies and the U.S. government are equal entities. The will of the populace as determined by the Democratic process have one say, this large company gets a say, the two must be balanced. The latter does not follow laws, it “agrees to” them. Why?
Elie
As usual — why Balloon Juice is my favorite blog…very interesting and “deep” discussion and information exchange.
Thanks for all of your contributions!
slag
@Thomas Levenson: @SGEW: I want to go on record defending Ambinder. For a moment, anyway. True, he does have vast and deep level of credulity, which has a definite downside. On the other hand, I’ve seen some good stuff from him. He is one of the few people that actually reports on torture and indefinite detentions regularly. And while that reporting is often done from the WH perspective, he at least tries to make it comprehensive, including motive (which I think is all too rare in other places). He’s also done some great rebuttals of McArdle on obesity and other topics. Those rebuttals have been detailed, knowledgeable, and forthright (also too rare). And while he does do the “we report; you decide” ridiculousness a little much, at least he does so with an open comments section that enables rebuttal. All in all, he provides information and some insight that you just don’t find much of anywhere else. And that has value, in my opinion.
Anne Laurie
Given McCain’s health, I’m guessing he decided that not being yelled at by his gated-community-neighborhood bigots at this summer’s cocktail parties ranked higher than maybe risking his seat in 2010.
SGEW
@slag: I hear you, and agree (more or less). I’ve done my job trying to do half-assed apologias for Marc “Don’t Make Me Have An Opinion!” Ambinder here before.
Batocchio
The insurance companies may be better behaved than under the Clinton efforts, but they’re not behaving. Check out this NPR piece from this morning:
http://www.npr.org/templates/rundowns/rundown.php?prgId=3
http://www.npr.org/templates/transcript/transcript.php?storyId=111527054
The title should be, “Insurance Companies attack Democrats and Public Option,” but fat chance of that. Right after this piece, NPR ran a piece with Kyl complaining about MoveOn’s unfair political attack on DeMint’s Waterloo remarks. Black is white…
slag
@SGEW: Perfect. “wan snarkiness”…well-said.
Craig Pennington
My guess is that it’s Clinton all over again. The insurance industry is sending in the emissaries whose primary goal is to generate a pre-compromised final proposal. The effect this will have is to demotivate those who want actual reform while not generating any give in the opposition. On the other side, the insurance industry motivating the opposition. When the pre-compromised final proposal goes public, they will drop any but the most thin pretense of support and crank up the opposition. The only way reform can happen is if actual reform is proposed and promoted. All other roads lead to the insurance industry continuing to leech off of the least efficient health care system in the industrialized world.