Looks like we might one day see Rumsfeld’s handy work:
The Center for Constitutional Rights (CCR) learned today of the existence of video and audio tapes of the abusive interrogations of client Mohammed al Qahtani, the victim of the “First Special Interrogation Plan” personally overseen by former Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld.
“After the intense scrutiny of the government’s torture and interrogation of Mr. al Qahtani, it is shocking that the government has hidden the existence of these tapes from the public for so many years,” said CCR Attorney Gitanjali S. Gutierrez. “The government’s interrogation of him has been the topic of multiple military, Justice Department and congressional investigations. These tapes should have been acknowledged long ago.”
Until recently, the Government had adamantly denied that any U.S. personnel engaged in acts of torture during Mr. al Qahtani’s interrogation, but on January 14, 2009, Military Commission Convening Authority Susan Crawford conceded that by subjecting Mr. al Qahtani to systematic 20-hour interrogations, prolonged sleep deprivation, 160 days of severe isolation, forced nudity, sexual and religious humiliation, and other aggressive interrogation tactics, the government had engaged in acts of torture. Much of this information appeared in interrogation logs leaked to the press as early as 2006.
I’m surprised these have not been disappeared like the other tapes. I wonder if like waterboarding, the wingnuts are going to recreate all of these interrogations to prove torture is not torture.
Did Hannity ever get waterboarded yet?
Morbo
OT wingularity news: Conservapedia plans to do their own Jefferson bible taking out all the liberal bits like “He who is without sin cast the first stone.” Hilarity expected to ensue; film at 11.
freelancer
@Morbo:
a link for your troubles.
asiangrrlMN
Wow. Really? W. and his posse missed destroying incriminating tapes? Could this be like Watergate? Of course not, but I am still mightily intrigued. I hope we get to see and hear these tapes.
danimal
I’d pay for the PPV telecast. As long as the money went to non-wingnut charity.
geg6
Hmmmm. Could it possibly be that we might finally get that Alexander Butterfield moment of which I have dreamed?
Svensker
What, and mess up his hair?
Svensker
Blockquote fail.
Mnemosyne
@asiangrrlMN:
I wouldn’t be surprised if it was one of the interrogators who kept them. As in, “Screw it, if I’m going down for this shit, I’m taking you down with me.”
jibeaux
I’m thinking they’ve taken on the “sexual humiliation” bit sua sponte (law degree FTW!), but as for the rest…
ed
Fucking monsters.
Calvin Jones and the 13th Apostle
I’m surprised these have not been disappeared like the other tapes.
Don’t be. They preserved them for posterity figuring they’d never go to jail for it. They were/are so proud of their work(as you can likely tell).
ericblair
@Mnemosyne: I wouldn’t be surprised if it was one of the interrogators who kept them. As in, “Screw it, if I’m going down for this shit, I’m taking you down with me.”
I’m thinking in another direction. These are highly classified items which are supposed to have a heavy paper trail with them regarding who has possession of them, who disposed of them and when, and that sort of thing. If they’re destroyed properly, the person who destroyed them will have his name on the log and then gets to explain why they were destroyed outside of the normal archive procedures. If they’re destroyed improperly without documentation, the person that was supposed to have custody of them has some ‘splainin to do. The safest thing for each individual in the matter is leave them alone and hope the shitstorm goes away.
The Saff
Seeing Donald Rumsfeld in a perp walk would make me a happy camper. I’m not holding my breath, I’m just saying.
freelancer
@The Saff:
That is what he would call a “known-known”.
Zifnab
I’m still waiting for that “Whitey!” tape to emerge, myself.
Anastasius
Countdown to rogue intern who totally acted on his own accord without any kind of supervision or direction accidentally used the tapes to record Spongebob reruns.
Ash Can
I’m hoping against hope that this evidence finds its way to the right hands and justice is served. It may take a while, but if the rule of law eventually asserts itself, it would be a tremendous relief.
Penfold
You know, this reminds me of when Mancow got himself waterboarded and realized that it was most definitely torture and, among other things, went on Olbermann’s show to discuss this view and “friends” of his like Hannity, who don’t have the balls to put their money where their mouths are, jumped all over him for it.
Hannity is a megadouche.
Penfold
@The Saff:
Neither am I, but you know, I think of all the higher-level Bushies, he would be the most likely to get fed to the wolves, right after the mid-level lackies (Gonzales, et al). Not saying it’s a high probability, but I’m not sure I see a huge defense being mounted on his behalf, seeing as how they effectively threw him under the bus politically already. Though, Cheney spearhead the campaign to keep him above the law, given that they’re such longtime buddies and Cheney was opposed to his removal as Secretary of Defense anyway.
Sentient Puddle
Whoa. So would it be wrong to be all giddy over the fact that we have what appears to be a smoking gun? I mean, reading stuff like “sleep deprivation” may not sound like much to someone in the know, but having it documented on video, that’s some serious business.
Blue Raven
You meant “handiwork,” no?
Ash Can
@Morbo:
@freelancer:
“Wingularity” is right. I suppose it had to happen eventually, them taking over for God himself. Because those buttplugs at Conservapedia know so much more about ancient Middle Eastern languages than all those pointy-headed ivory-tower liberals who have been translating scripture through the centuries…
By the way, I love this site and all, but this server is really making my ass tired.
slippy
@Penfold: I think the word you’re looking for is “whimpering pussy.” Ex.,
“Sean Hannity is a whimpering pussy.”
The Grand Panjandrum
Authoritarian types are generally good record keepers so it doesn’t surprise me they still have the records. But you do have to remember that these are the same people who thought it would cost a few billion dollars to invade and occupy the country, then when they got the oil spigot turned on again it would pay for itself in no time. Not exactly prescient motherfuckers, were they? About the only thing they got right was that most of the Democrats were big enough pussies to vote for the AUMF.
Right Wing Extreme
If they release the tapes is there any way I can get a copy. I think it would be great television in between the Sunday football games. Seriously “severe” isolation, prolonged sleep dep, forced nudity humiliation? Sorry guys and gals, that is not torture. Unless they beat him or cut him, the didn’t torture the sorry bastard. Maybe if they water boarded him, but that is not so bad. Did 9 hourse of that in SERE school.
chrome agnomen
it would not surprise me if there were many copies. prime right wing authoritarian wank-fest material.
LD50
I’m so glad Republicans have resisted the temptation of moral relativism.
Right Wing Extreme
Hello again LD50,
Not a republican, conservative independent, but lets not quibble. Perhaps I am just thick, yeah yeah I know you guys will be all over that one :), but please explain to me what part of “20-hour interrogations, prolonged sleep deprivation, 160 days of severe isolation, forced nudity, sexual and religious humiliation, and other aggressive interrogation tactics” constitutes torture. I am not being snarky or even dismissive here, I want a honest opinion. I do not know if they water boarded this guy, but I will give you some non-partisan honesty on it. It is worse than the media portrays. It is terrifying, and definitely in the top 5 of worst experiences I have ever had. Words are kinda failing me on how to describe it. It is also dangerous. In a setting where the circumstances are not controlled it can be life threatening. There are some things about water boarding specifically and torture in general that all should know if they want to comment on torture. Fair warning now, this is extremely distasteful, so do not read on if you are no prepared for some grisly truth. I will keep it as clean as possible. I have never tortured anyone, but I was trained in the playbook in the military under, “don’t let this happen to you.” When you torture someone, honestly torture them, extending hope to the abused is important. I bring up this example not as justification, or or any nonsense like that, but take the beheadings that were filmed by our adversaries. Again this is not meant for moral equivalency or justification, but as something recent and widely seen. At first the victims complied with their captor’s demands, there was the hope that they might get out alive. As this went on you saw more and more defiance from the victims because hope was lost, they knew they were going to die, and fought back. Now lets enter the hypothetical. If you are say beating someone, either with fists or implements, or cutting, you must be careful to cause the maximum pain, with the minimum amount of damage. If you go to far and hurt someone beyond all hope or repair, and usually this is not a broken leg that will be deformed or some such, but true lasting, possibly lethal (eventually) harm, you subject will clam up, and they might as well be dead for all the information you will get out of them. Cutting is put to best effect for when time is of the essence, and preferably you have multiple subjects. The death of the first one or two will loosen the tongues of the subsequent subjects, and unless you are completely pathological, it is best to dehumanize your victim and think of them as the “subject” else it will really mess you up. Beatings can be used for immediate results or long term results. Fists will not produce immediate results, but implements will provide quick results. Through it all you must maintain their hope, or don’t bother. So on to water boarding. Many are familiar with the effects due to the media. It causes raised heart rate, shallow quick breathing, anxiety, fear and most importantly, the sensation of drowning. The effects of drowning are well documented and I will not go into them here as even cleaned up the above was distasteful enough that I do not wish to go into more gore. The positives, if such they can be called, short-circuit the above. The fight or flight response is in most cases, overwhelming, and you can break a subject relatively quickly. The one thing the subject, almost always, knows is that he will not die from the experience. Again, accidents happen, but in controlled circumstances there is rarely any long term physiological effects. Information is blurted out. Now there are many who say, especially the media, that a subject will say anything to make the torture stop. This is true only to a point. If the subject is to be questioned long term, then lies are severely punished and not repeated. Again, water boarding usually short-circuits this. One of the things we were taught was to focus on what we would say. This is why, among other reasons, captured soldiers give name, rank and serial number. If you are focused on something, especially something that will not get anyone killed, this is what you will blurt out in the heat of the moment. This is NOT effective for long-term questioning as you WILL be worn down eventually. This is why line soldiers, the most often captured, rarely know anything of importance beyond 48 hours. 48 hours is the time it usually takes to dust off in an emergency, and our soldiers are often trained to think on there feet to avoid getting captured en masse if they lose a comrade to the enemy. Okay, education done. Now on to experience. In SERE (Survival Evasion Resistance and Escape) you get all this training both in a classroom setting and in a scenario. I know it is Hollywood, but see G.I. Jane. Hollywood did a pretty good job on capturing the experience short of being there, minus the attempted rape. In SERE myself and 2 others were taken by instructors, and I personally was subjected to around nine hours of torture, both beatings and water boarding. I did eventually break after my left hand was broken in multiple places, but only after I was reasonably sure my unit had dusted off. Evac was approximately three hours from my capture. I held out as long as I could and long enough to reasonably expect my unit to escape. Little did I know all were captured, that being the point. As I said, the experienced sucked to say the least, but after about a week, no effects beyond the hand, physically of psychologically. As for the things reported that this scumbag suffered, so what. is is embarrassing and degrading, but so what. He lived and is most likely over the experience. Mad as hell I’m sure, but I doubt he took any lasting effects from a little rough treatment. I see nothing wrong with a little discomfort. It is nothing worse than many people go through their daily lives with so I save my sympathy for the victims of terrorism.