Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Trump’s legal defense is going to be a dumpster fire inside a clown car on a derailing train.

But frankly mr. cole, I’ll be happier when you get back to telling us to go fuck ourselves.

Jesus, Mary, & Joseph how is that election even close?

You are so fucked. Still, I wish you the best of luck.

Republicans: slavery is when you own me. freedom is when I own you.

If you are still in the GOP, you are an extremist.

Let’s finish the job.

Speaking of republicans, is there a way for a political party to declare intellectual bankruptcy?

Republicans seem to think life begins at the candlelight dinner the night before.

Accused of treason; bitches about the ratings. I am in awe.

Insiders who complain to politico: please report to the white house office of shut the fuck up.

They are lying in pursuit of an agenda.

It’s a doggy dog world.

A thin legal pretext to veneer over their personal religious and political desires

Battle won, war still ongoing.

Too often we confuse noise with substance. too often we confuse setbacks with defeat.

Ah, the different things are different argument.

“That’s what the insurrection act is for!”

“Everybody’s entitled to be an idiot.”

Cole is on a roll !

I wonder if trump will be tried as an adult.

Sadly, there is no cure for stupid.

Republicans are radicals, not conservatives.

I’m sure you banged some questionable people yourself.

You are here: Home / Open Threads / SOTU Open Thread #2

Reader Interactions

271Comments

  6. 6.

    ruemara

    Dammit, Barack! All silky smooth and saying what’s right and hitting the right points.

    I…I just can’t quit you.

    Fucker.

    /O-bot, bloody again.

  8. 8.

    ajr22

    A few random thoughts. Fuck Alito for shaking his head, the court is A political asshole. Also, does Chuck Grassley have herpes?

  13. 13.

    Midnight Marauder

    Wow. Just fucking wow. You crazy for this one, Obama!

    And Corner Stone, your thoughts? Also.

  14. 14.

    JGabriel

    Wow, the visual of the Republicans just sitting there, stone-faced and recalcitrant, at the call for providing equal rights to all our citizens was amazing.

    They really are the party of bigotry. No surprise in itself, but the willingness to so publicly embrace it, en masse, is kind of shocking.

    .

  15. 15.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @ajr22:

    Fuck Alito for shaking his head, the court is A political asshole

    A bitter old man watching his world change as he watches the sun set.

  16. 16.

    Warren Terra

    The lecture was pretty awesome, because it was true. It obviously won’t change the behavior of a single congresscritter, and although I don’t exactly have the pulse of the people I doubt it will resonate much politically. But it was still pretty awesome.

  18. 18.

    Spork

    @mclaren: Can we outsource lobbyists? I would gladly pay illegal immigrant wages to illegally influence members of Congress. I can just see the trucks pulling up to Home Depot parking lots and loading on pickup truck loads of lobbyists as day labor.

  19. 19.

    me

    The end of the speech was weird, a five minute span where there was no applause. Was the crowd asleep or spellbound?

  20. 20.

    camchuck

    Out of the gate, Wolf Blitzer sounds sad to report that the speech had lots of detail and was long. Get ready for the post-speech buzzkill.

  23. 23.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    I’m tempted to scroll through the firebag-o-sphere to see what they found to pout about, but I’m not gonna harsh my own buzz.

  27. 27.

    Midnight Marauder

    And can I just say that I am FUCKING GIDDY for the Republican response. Bob McDonnell as the answer? You have got to be fucking kidding me! But by all means, good sir, go on…

  28. 28.

    Tomlinson

    The end of the speech was weird, a five minute span where there was no applause. Was the crowd asleep or spellbound?

    They were probably terrified he was about to drop the boom on them. And maybe a wee bit embarassed for the people who’d already had the boom dropping.

  29. 29.

    JGabriel

    mclaren:

    Schwarzenneger’s genius new idea involves outsourcing American prisons to Mexico. Maybe we could outsource American government to Mexico.

    Why not? The idea of drug importation is pretty popular, and, effectively, that’s just outsourcing the power to bargain with pharmaceutical companies to Canada instead of governing it ourselves.

    .

  30. 30.

    arguingwithsignposts

    Okay, just some first impressions: I liked the DADT shoutout. Thought it was too long, and didn’t include enough gonad kicking. The best was at the end. I got the sense of a fatherly lecture a la Leave It to Beaver toward the end. And if I don’t ever hear the word “bipartisan” again, it will be too soon.

    ETA: Bob McDonnell can blow me, also.

  31. 31.

    Sly

    I feel cheated. There was no where near the level of Hippy Punching I was told to expect.

    Will someone on the internet please tell me what to think?!

  34. 34.

    Joe Beese

    That’s the money shot? “I will work with Congress” to end DADT?

    WTF? We’re supposed to thank him for not working against Congress?

  36. 36.

    Comrade Mary

    Tweety: “I forgot he was black tonight for an hour. We completely forgot about it.”

    Words fail me.

  38. 38.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    Oh my god. Oh my god. Oh. My. Fucking. God.

    Tweety: “For an hour I forgot he was black tonight, this African-American speaking in front of a bunch of white men.” Not an exact quote.

    ‘He sounded like a real American.’

  42. 42.

    inkadu

    Does Chris Matthews always talk like he is simultaneously masturbating? Honest question. I don’t watch network tv.

  47. 47.

    Cain

    What I really loved was the silence. It kind of reminds me when I got in trouble and my dad would talk to me and there would be this silence and that was what it was like. It was kind of eerie, like we need to listen and understand how to get back on the right track.

    cain

  50. 50.

    WereBear

    To me, that just shows how driven-like-rats-to-the-push-bar our media is. They leap around and try to grab talking points out of thin air, and cling to a metaphor until all the life is beaten out of it.

    If they were common friggin’ citizens trying to hang in there… they might get it.

    But they must not.

  51. 51.

    Midnight Marauder

    @Max:

    I’m not liking Rachel tonight. She’s very bitchy.

    I just caught a brief moment of MSNBC after the speech (to get an idea of how the “left” channel would react) and immediately I hear Rachel talking about how his speech wasn’t “left-wing” enough? Disappointing, to say the least.

  53. 53.

    Ash Can

    @me: Everybody was probably thinking, “Oh shit, am I gonna be next?”

    ETA: I see Tomlinson @#28 beat me to it!

  65. 65.

    mr. whipple

    “Rachel and KO can barely contain their contempt.”

    Pretty much why I stopped watching all political TV months ago.

  70. 70.

    Midnight Marauder

    @Joe Beese:

    That’s the money shot? “I will work with Congress” to end DADT?
    __
    WTF? We’re supposed to thank him for not working against Congress?

    You never cease to amaze me with your worthlessness.

  73. 73.

    inkadu

    @MysticalChick: “I totally forgot what a total racist I am for almost twenty minutes!” – Tweety

    Republican Response: Lower taxes. Smaller government.

    What a surprise.

  74. 74.

    Violet

    The Virginian Governor is acting like he’s the President with the setting in the legislative building and having an audience.

  76. 76.

    JGabriel

    If I were a VA Democrat, I’d be pretty pissed about the governor using the well of the statehouse for a partisan political response to the POTUS.

    .

  80. 80.

    Michael

    Y’know, I haven’t watched Tweety or anybody on MSNBC for a couple of months now, and feel better for it. My only news shows are the occasional Haiti specials on CNN, Robin Meade (yummy) in the AM on HNN and my local newscast.

    Cutting off cable punditry has dropped my blood pressure by 10 points.

  81. 81.

    Anne Laurie

    Guv Bob McDonnell has a fine ReThug SmugMug(tm) goin’ on, yes?

    Altho, hith lispth not politically inspirational.

  83. 83.

    Admiral_Komack

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist
    Oh my god. Oh my god. Oh. My. Fucking. God.

    Tweety: “For an hour I forgot he was black tonight, this African-American speaking in front of a bunch of white men.” Not an exact quote.

    ‘He sounded like a real American.’

    -I watched the President’s SOTU address on CSPAN.
    Thank God for CSPAN.

  84. 84.

    Davis X. Machina

    Republican Response: Lower taxes. Smaller government.

    If the president in Independence Day were GOP, that’d be the response to the alien attacks…

  85. 85.

    Joe Beese

    @mcc : A “likely” from Barney Frank ranks about a 2.3 on the Reassure-O-Meter.

    And it goes up to 100.

  87. 87.

    Cain

    Man, this guy sucks. What a let down. I could write a better response than this guy.

    cain

    ps why does he keep smiling like that? reminds me of edwards.

  94. 94.

    Martin

    I’m Bob McDonnell, and I’m going to pretend I’m an important national figure for the next 10 minutes. Please join in by pretending the last 90 minutes never happened and clapping for my too risqué for Family Circle jokes.

  95. 95.

    mr. whipple

    I think the audience is a mistake.

    You knew it was coming after Jindal in the hall/front door debacle.

    Count on goopers for prime stratergizing.

  96. 96.

    jenniebee

    OK, Tweety is obsessed with race. and he just called McConnell a “chuckleface.” And he’s making a Godfather reference.

    Oh nice, I’m so glad they’re showing some of the restoration work we did on the capitol building, it really is some lovely workmanship.

    You realize that he’s “creating new jobs” by selling off the publicly owned liquor stores. Because apparently, there are innovations in liquor distribution that we’re stifling by not allowing drive-thru booze stores.

    Oh shit, he’s still speaking on deficit reduction. Might as well bitch about volcano monitoring.

    They welcome our ideas? How about get with the program or STFU?

  97. 97.

    Max

    The GOP should really schedule their response next year for a day or two after the SOTU.

    You just can’t follow Obama without looking like an idiot.

  99. 99.

    Warren Terra

    The Virginia Gov speech is of course deeply nonsensical in its content, but the decision to do it in front of a crowd was very, very savvy.

  100. 100.

    Midnight Marauder

    What the fuck is with this audience for McDonnell? And wow, the Republican bench is thin. I mean, Calista Flockhart on Ally McBeal thin.

    “We are blessed here in America with vast natural resources and we must use them all.”

    What.a.joke.

    And how much do you think they paid that Asian guy and that black lady to stand behind him? Like they’re decorative pieces or something. Oh Republicans, your worldview is so increasingly obsolete.

    +8

  103. 103.

    Violet

    He keeps saying things that Obama has already said he’s for – nuclear energy, better education….

  105. 105.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @TooManyJens:
    No! Seriously? Drill baby drill? they are too sad.

    And I see at least one uniform at this highly partisan bit of bad stagecraft.

  106. 106.

    Annie

    Obama was awesome…So awesome that the CNN crowd is shitting themselves trying to find something negative and controversial to say…I loved all the shots of McCain. What a sorry old man.

    Obama even shot down Lady Sarah by using the word phrase “common sense” several times. OMG, the guy is smart.

  107. 107.

    Comrade Luke

    Black woman, white woman, military guy, asian guy.

    We’re a big tent, people! And with your support we’ll soon be able to take back the majority and further erode the rights of the people seated right behind me!

  109. 109.

    Delia

    I think the rethug is better than Kenneth the Page. He lies every time he opens his mouth and what he says has no relation to Obama’s speech, but what do you expect from a gooper?

    Edit: I just noticed: he lisps.

  111. 111.

    Ash Can

    So Tweety really said that, eh? Oh my. Someone just bought himself a little unwanted publicity, didn’t he?

  113. 113.

    Anne Laurie

    Wag finger, smirk, call for nuclear energy expansion and ‘natural gas exploration’ off-shore the VA coast. Crowd actually yells WOOT! Well, at least he pronounced nuclear correctly.

  114. 114.

    Jimmm

    @Comrade Mary:

    Tweety: “I forgot he was black tonight for an hour. We completely forgot about it.”

    Tweety: “Because usually I can’t stop thinking about how there’s a black guy talking from behind the Presidential podium. You know, because I’m a working class Irish American. And he’s black.”

  115. 115.

    jenniebee

    @SiubhanDuinne: We’re sorry, too.

    But hey, what do you expect from a state that elected first George Allen and then Jim Gilmore? And if you think this guy’s a tool, you don’t know Jim Gilmore.

  116. 116.

    McGeorge Bundy

    @mr. whipple: Nah, not quite FDR-ian, not if you mean in terms of confrontational rhetoric. But not too far off, either. Certainly closer than I’d have expected from Obama.

  117. 117.

    inkadu

    I forgot for a minute that the Governor of VA is white.

    Did he just say we should torture people? What a fucking ASSHOLE. Somebody throw a pie!

  119. 119.

    me

    He looks very uncomfortable and the applause is very unnatural. It’s better than Jindal was though.

  120. 120.

    Comrade Luke

    In all seriousness, Obama just pissed off every single constituency he needs to work with to get anything done. I don’t know how this ends well.

  121. 121.

    Sly

    @arguingwithsignposts:

    If you already stopped watching CNN and Fox, you should secretly hope that he keeps his job. Cable News is bad for your brain. “Good” Cable News is like “Good” Amoebic Dysentery.

  122. 122.

    Admiral_Komack

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist

    “Rachel and KO can barely contain their contempt.”

    -I’m shocked, SHOCKED, I tell you!”/snark

  123. 123.

    Violet

    @Warren Terra:
    Really? I think it looks kind of stupid. I think it makes him look weak because he needs a cheering section to get through it, rather than making him look strong.

  124. 124.

    DonBelacquaDelPurgatorio

    Is it just me, or is this Repub response guy just making the same points Obama made an hour ago, only worse?

  125. 125.

    lamh31

    Ambinder reported that Obama expects to fill 2 vacancies in the SC this summer, which is why his admonishment of the SC was appropos

  126. 126.

    Poopyman

    I’m backing Comrade Mary 100%, ’cause Mrs. P and I had the same response. And I believe ” I forgot he was black” is an exact quote.

    But he went on from there! You’ll have to find the video, ’cause I was just “shutupshutupshutupshutUP!”, but he didn’t. And KO couldn’t do anything besides “Uh huh…..uh huh”?

    It was awesome in its own way.

  128. 128.

    JGabriel

    McDonnell saying the Christmas bomber stopped giving info when we didn’t torture him. Is that a new lie, or has that extension of the “we should torture him!” argument been going around for a while? It’s the first time I’ve heard it.

    .

  129. 129.

    Cain

    I wish he would stop fucking smiling at me. It is creeping me out. God I’m just drinking now..this response sucks. The ideas are the same fucking ideas for the past 10 years. Jeezus. There is NOTHING NEW about this speech. Shit.

    cain

  130. 130.

    McGeorge Bundy

    This is the most monotonous speech I have ever heard from a politician, in content and delivery.

  132. 132.

    Comrade Luke

    It’s beyond comical that he has all his minorities covered in the background, and when they show the view of the people watching him, it’s 95% white men and 5% white women.

  133. 133.

    mcc

    And how much do you think they paid that Asian guy and that black lady to stand behind him? Like they’re decorative pieces or something. Oh Republicans, your worldview is so increasingly obsolete.

    We were carefully counting the number of nonwhites in the actual audience before the Republican response started and we turned off the TV…

    …we counted one.

  134. 134.

    Warren Terra

    Oh, god. It causes me actual physical pain that this whole “don’t give the evil terrorists rights” line, which goes against everything I was taught in elementary school Civics, apparently has political resonance.

  135. 135.

    RandomChick

    I thought sociopaths were supposed to be charismatic. You’d think the Republicans could find SOMEBODY with some zing for these gigs.

  136. 136.

    geg6

    Wow, that McConnell dude sucks so bad the equipment decided it’d had enough and cut the fuck out.

  137. 137.

    lamh31

    As an African American, I’m spellbound by the fact that there only seems to be 2 African Americans in the room and what luck them seems to be sitting behind Mr McDonnell for maximjum effect!

  138. 138.

    Admiral_Komack

    @Comrade Luke

    “In all seriousness, Obama just pissed off every single constituency he needs to work with to get anything done. I don’t know how this ends well.”

    -It’s worked great so far…oh, wait…

  139. 139.

    max

    Whoops, Obama just pledged to “work with Congress” to repeal DADT…

    More excellent!

    88: @Everyone who lives in Virginia: I’m really sorry.

    I voted agin him! Nothin’ doin’ tho.

    max
    [‘I hear Maryland is a different state.’]

  143. 143.

    Martin

    I keep waiting for CNN to cut away and Wolf proclaiming “We’re going to do this guy a favor and get back to talking about the President’s speech.”

  144. 144.

    SIA

    As I just said on the last thread (before I once again looked around and everyone had gone to the other party) McDonnell reminds me of the frat boys at UGA.

    Now he’s lisping out some scripture. Holy Mother of FSM. This is the alternative.

  145. 145.

    KDP

    McDonnell on C-Span now: Ahh, how folksy, his sons gave him 10 minutes.

    Don’t pile on more taxation, regulation, legislation that will keep us rich folk from socking it away from you all. They promised more jobs immediately.

    Dems – deficit spending – no mention of the size of the deficit when Obama took office. It’s all the Dems of course.

    Restore ‘proper limited role of government at every level.’ Gee then why did it grow so much under Reagan, Bush, Bush…

    “We want cooperation, not partisanship. ” Cooperation takes mutual involvement.

    We’re honored with vast natural resources, and we. must. use. them. all.

    Education: Yes, education is necessary. Opportunity by intellect and work, not zip code, but NOTHING about how to help people enter and complete college without taking on tens of thousands of dollars in debt.

    ooo, there we are, Obama’s a soshulist. Took over the car companies, banks…

    Make opportunity open to everyone. How?

    Founders, lives and fortunes to make this country, we should leave it better than we found it.

  149. 149.

    The Grand Panjandrum

    I hope whoever wrote this speech can get a refund on some of that college tuition. Sheesh. Not even a good speech for an undergraduate speech class. Sounds like someone printed out the talking points from the RNC website and this clown read them.

  150. 150.

    Brian J

    I don’t think McDonnell’s speech was horrible, just so mediocre that it’s not likely to make a difference. So unless flat is the new up, he didn’t do anything special.

  151. 151.

    Warren Terra

    @Violet:
    In fairness, I’m listening to the radio, not watching TV. Maybe it plays worse on TV. I just think that past responses, from either side, have typically been too monotonous and dull, and a cheering crowd makes even this guy sound like he’s exciting someone.

  152. 152.

    dr. bloor

    @Max:

    The GOP should really schedule their response next year for a day or two after the SOTU.
    …
    You just can’t follow Obama without looking like an idiot.

    I never tire of watching them try.

  156. 156.

    JGabriel

    Anyone else think that McDonnell’s delivery sounds like a particularly bland and milquetoast Sunday morning televangelist?

    .

  159. 159.

    Violet

    Well the VA Gov. didn’t suck like Jindal did last year. He was blandly forgettable. Which is probably a net plus for him, given that he had to follow that tour de force by Obama.

  165. 165.

    Admiral_Komack

    @Comrade Mary:

    Tweety: “I forgot he was black tonight for an hour. We completely forgot about it.”

    Tweety: “Because usually I can’t stop thinking about how there’s a black guy talking from behind the Presidential podium. You know, because I’m a working class Irish American. And he’s black.”

    -Guess Tweety didn’t learn anything from that “MSNBC OIbama & Race” snooze-fest.

  167. 167.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    This is weird. Olberman just turned on a dime from “greatest speech evah” to “Harry Reid was seen yawning”. In about 11 seconds. I’m waiting for the livelink with Kos.

  168. 168.

    Davis X. Machina

    Now he’s lisping out some scripture. Holy Mother of FSM. This is the alternative.

    There’s a hundred million people in this country whom that makes positively tingly.

    Think about that and try to sleep…

  171. 171.

    camchuck

    Meh, the rebuttal never means shit. What matters most is what narratives from O’s speech take hold over the next couple days.

  173. 173.

    Cain

    The problem with McDonnell’s speech was that it was totally aimed at Republicans not at everyone. He convinced no one.

    cain

  175. 175.

    MikeJ

    @SIA:

    Now let’s just cuddle and savor. Mmmmm.

    Peggy Noonan:

    I do not know what the Democratic Party spent, in toto, on the 2004 election, but what they seem to have gotten for it is Barack Obama. Let us savor.

    I don’t think she’s savoring as much now.

  176. 176.

    Corner Stone

    @Midnight Marauder:

    And Corner Stone, your thoughts? Also.

    I got into it. Didn’t agree with everything but really, just gave in part way through and started drinking my balls off.
    He nailed a bunch of it.

    You win this round you dirty fucking O-bot.

    *Or maybe we both win since I’m hip deep with my friends Jim, Jack, Crown and Smirnoff.

  177. 177.

    Cat Lady

    @Comrade Luke:

    Do you have kids? He treated them like the spoiled children they are. If you don’t, you get 0 respect. 0. We’ve been yelling here all week for him to come out swinging, and he took some good swings.

  181. 181.

    inkadu

    @TooManyJens: Something like, “We have to stop giving terrorist the rights of american citizens. We took that terrorist off the plane, and gave him rights, and he stopped giving vital information.”

    Implied: Torture or threat of torture makes terrorists talk.

  182. 182.

    Warren Terra

    And as long as I’m posting things from Yglesias’s twitter feed, a link to this Think Progress post:

    However, he first addressed right-wing criticisms that he is overseeing out-of-control spending by noting the situation he faced when he took office …. The camera then cut to Sen. John McCain (R-AZ), who leaned over to Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-SC) and appeared to whisper, “Blame it on Bush.” The two men then laughed

    and

    When Obama criticized the Supreme Court’s recent decision rolling back restrictions for corporations to influence political campaigns (“Last week, the Supreme Court reversed a century of law to open the floodgates for special interests — including foreign corporations– to spend without limit in our elections”), Supreme Court Justice Samuel Alito was seen shaking his head and appeared to mouth, “Not true.”

  183. 183.

    Corner Stone

    @DougJ:

    I loved the smack down of SCOTUS. Loved it.

    Oh man. if I could have a framed picture of their fucking faces when he dropped it right in their laps…I’d pay for that shit.
    Those motherfuckers.

  186. 186.

    JAHILL10

    Chris Matthews should be fired. Obama’s speech was great (he called out EVERYONE) and I can’t watch any of the puditizing distorting what I just heard with my own ears. Thanks for filtering for me!

  187. 187.

    Irony Abounds

    @Comrade Luke: As if trying to please all the constituencies has worked up until now? I like the approach – tell everyone to get off their fucking ME ME ME and work out a solution that works for EVERYONE.

    As for the SCOTUS, it is truly frightening. You see how young and vigorous all the Republican corporate fellators on the court are and how frail Breyer, Ginsberg and Stevens are and the future does not look good. Roberts and Alito will be on the Court for another 30 years.

  188. 188.

    JK

    @arguingwithsignposts:

    Admiral_Komack

    Chris Matthews is the only person in the world who could see Obama’s personality bearing a strong resemblance to the characters portrayed by Ray Milland. Matthews is a fucking idiot.

  189. 189.

    Spork

    @Comrade Luke: Yeah. Yeah I do. The system is fucking broke now. Decent legislation with broad support can’t pass a dysfunctional congress. Making a public case, and calling out the bad actors in the only constitutionally mandated speech has a chance of turning public opinion and breaking some current logjams. Yes, there are some potential bad consequences, but the status quo is right there with worst case if he pisses off congress. So yeah, throwing rocks at the beehive makes me happy. Stir that shit up, and make it public by directly calling them out.

  192. 192.

    Lev

    I hung in for McDonnell’s speech as long as I could, but his cadence wasn’t that of an engaging, charismatic politician. It was the cadence of a play-by-play baseball announcer. I opened a few more tabs and my mind practically heard him say, “Thirty three thousand people in attendance…we will use all of our natural resources!…three and two, with Maddux on the mound, the pitch…smaller government threatens our liberty…caught by Jones, that’s two away.” And the whole staging-this-like-the-SOTU thing was a little embarrassing.

    But, admittedly, much better than Jindal.

  193. 193.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    I don’t think she’s savoring as much now.

    I think La Nooners spends a lot of time savoring sauvignon blanc

  194. 194.

    Comrade Kevin

    @Warren Terra: In Scalia-land, corporations aren’t “special interests”. Only pesky minorities, poor people and women are “special interests”.

  197. 197.

    oh really

    The Republican response looked and sounded like a slick infomercial.

    After the last year, Obama’s speech struck me as empty rhetoric. As Eugene Robinson wrote on the WaPo Op-Ed page, “Barack Obama will regain the political initiative with action, not words or populist style.”

    Anyone who was “persuaded” by tonight’s speech probably would have been persuaded if Obama had read a shopping list off a teleprompter…oh, wait.

    But it doesn’t matter what any of us thought of the speech; what will matter will be what Obama does. So far, he’s given me no reason to believe he will actually fight for anything worthwhile. If he finally realizes what leadership is, then this speech won’t have mattered. If he doesn’t, then, again, the speech won’t make any difference.

  199. 199.

    JGabriel

    TooManyJens:

    I missed the torture reference; what did he say?

    Don’t have the exact words, but McDonnell whinged about the Undiebomber refusing to provide any more info after getting legal counsel or some bullshit like that.

    Since there’s obviously no way McDonnell could know that, and since all the reports I’ve read indicated that the Undiebomber talked/ranted pretty freely — obviating any need for more aggressive questioning — I’m wondering if it’s a lie McDonnell came up with himself, or, if not, where he got it from.

    .

  200. 200.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @oh really:

    Anyone who was “persuaded” by tonight’s speech probably would have been persuaded if Obama had read a shopping list off a teleprompter…oh, wait.

    Ho! “Teleprompter”! ZING!

  201. 201.

    General Winfield Stuck

    @oh really:

    So far, he’s given me no reason to believe he will actually fight for anything worthwhile

    That’s what you always say PUMA,

  203. 203.

    Cain

    @oh really:

    The Republican response looked and sounded like a slick infomercial.

    Edit: This only for the for the first paragraph. Otherwise, meh.

    cain

    cain

  204. 204.

    Martin

    So far, he’s given me no reason to believe he will actually fight for anything worthwhile.

    Maybe if he had brought his birth certificate?

  206. 206.

    JGabriel

    Lev:

    I hung in for McDonnell’s speech as long as I could, but his cadence wasn’t that of an engaging, charismatic politician. It was the cadence of a play-by-play baseball announcer.

    Not really. A baseball announcer usually sounds more excited. McDonnell sounded more like someone serenely reminding his flock to put donations in the plate being passed around so the baby Jesus won’t be sad and disappointed.

    .

  207. 207.

    Delia

    Hmm . . . . Howard Fineman thinks Obama’s speech was brilliant.

    As to the rethug: as I reconsider I think I prefer Jindal. At least his Kenneth the Page impression was memorable. Now ten minutes after this clown’s speech I can’t remember a single thing he said. It was just boiler plate gooper-talk. I can barely remember what he looks like.

  208. 208.

    Ana Gama

    I loved how he reminded the Repubs how budgeting is done.

    I loved him telling the Repubs they should be clapping at his tax cuts.

    I really loved the SCOTUS smackdown.

    I am happy that Michelle is going to champion childhood obesity.

    I’m not listening to any pundits. Not a single one.

  213. 213.

    Cain

    @Delia: <blockquoteremember a single thing he said. It was just boiler plate gooper-talk. I can barely remember what he looks like.

    The only thing I remember was the smile, like the cheshire cat.

    cain

  216. 216.

    Comrade Luke

    @DaBomb:

    Well to be fair, it’s just a speech. I don’t want to piss everyone off with “Just words”, but we need action here.

    My hope is that this at least shook things up a little. Because things needed to be shaken up.

  218. 218.

    Martin

    @General Winfield Stuck: Well, I’m outraged. Obama threw us under the bus. He embraced right-wing framing. He’s turning into a Hooverite. Nothing but triangulating. After this speech I think Rahm needs to be fired.

  219. 219.

    Ash

    Why the hell is President McCain going to be on Larry king live? Do we really need to see two corpses discussing this?

  220. 220.

    Uriel

    @Poopyman:

    But he went on from there! You’ll have to find the video, ‘cause I was just “shutupshutupshutupshutUP!”, but he didn’t.

    You people obviously don’t get it- That’s what Tweety does! That’s his bag, his shtick, that inexplicable something that makes him such a hot commodity!

    Look, Julia Childs can cook. So what does she do when someone sticks her in front of a camera? She grabs some eggs and she grabs some milk and she makes a goddamn cake, that’s what! She doesn’t build a house or price antiques because PBS has already got guys who do that! She plays to her strengths!

    Same with Tweety- sure there’s lot of guys who blabblahblah about “oh, look, Cantor’s got on a red tie! wonder what that means!” and other stupid crap. But the thing that sets Tweety apart is the uncanny ability to root around in his brain-full of un-doubtedly useful experiences with lightning speed, before near-instantaneously deciding that the thing to do is toss all that possibly interesting stuff in the crapper, grab the most, embarrassing, irrelelvent and un-selfaware thing that’s rolling around in there tonight and- this is the part that makes him political gold- say it out loud! Not just once, but dozens of times! He’ll even it out shout over his guests answers again and again, proudly, just to drive home the fact that even if he had the vaguest notion what he was talking about, he’d run with this idiocy he’s babbling about now.

    The man is like gold plated platinum covered in Dove chocolate. He’s that good.

  221. 221.

    Corner Stone

    @Comrade Luke:

    Well to be fair, it’s just a speech

    No one ever denied the President could give a good speech. But now – whoever you want to put it on – Obama, Pelosi, Reid, the voters – legislation HAS to happen.
    There HAS to be a win somewhere here. Whatever the outcome is, something has to be passed and signed.
    It’s not about what Obama can or can’t do anymore. No more boundaries. He called the tune tonight. In fact, he called a bunch of motherfuckers out.
    I loved it. I love his speeches. But that’s what this is til we see a legislative or policy outcome.
    He doesn’t write the laws. We all get that. But it’s now or never for his admin.

    ETA – and I’ll be the first to admit I was wrong about the SOTU and he nailed a lot of shit that made me giddy. But that lasts about as long as a good comedy routine. Outcomes. Outcomes.

  222. 222.

    General Winfield Stuck

    @DaBomb: Nothing has changed for me. First year in the job, shit happens, political realities changes, BO thinks on his feet and comes at things from a different direction. Why do people doubt this guys pol savvy? Getting the stim bill passed and all the R and D money flowing for a better future with new technologies to create new markets down the line. that was enough for moi for first year success, maybe even two years worth. People don’t think, they just react to the moments passions. Oh well.:)

  226. 226.

    Notorious P.A.T.

    Sounds like a good speech. Now let’s see if he actually DOES ANYTHING. You know, like calling the Senate and telling Lieberman “I saved your ass, how about paying me back?” or firing Geithner or something.

  228. 228.

    Jason Bylinowski

    I like the reaction I’m hearing to this speech, wish I’d had the chance to see it live. Sullivan seems to like it, although he seemed a bit incoherent in the live-blog (maybe he’s drunk?). I also hear that he did not say to pass the HCR bill, specifically, though. What did you guys take from the HCR portion of the speech?

  229. 229.

    DaBomb

    @General Winfield Stuck: Exactly. I don’t get the excessive doubting either. Especially on leaks of information or from anonymous sources.

    I like how he mentioned, that he is governing 300 million people and that it was never going to be easy, and he will essentially need our help as well. I think he just trying to bring people back down to earth.

  230. 230.

    celticdragonchick

    @Davis X. Machina:

    If

    the president in Independence Day were GOP, that’d be the response to the alien attacks…

    Not quite. The GOP response there would be to torture any of them we could capture, and keep torturing them even after we find out they don’t understand the questions and the whole thing is a waste of time. Then, dump the body under one of the mother ships and claim we have no idea what happened. To wrap it up, instead of figuring out how to effectively attack their ships, we go and bomb Iran.

    Also, we invade Iraq again on general principle.

  231. 231.

    DaBomb

    @Jason Bylinowski: He basically lectured Ccongress about running for hills when things get tough. And he wants them to pass HCR. He reinforced the fact, that Congress and Senate have came to far along to not pass it.

  233. 233.

    General Winfield Stuck

    @Notorious P.A.T.: I wish that would work on Lieberman. The smarmy little shit can’t be reached, I fear. Doesn’t matter now so much since the mirage of a fili proof majority is gone. The silver lining is now obama can take it to the wingnuts who are now responsible for their obstruction having 41 votes and the dems 59. sounds like O started that tonight.

  234. 234.

    Notorious P.A.T.

    Why do people doubt this guys pol savvy? Getting the stim bill passed that was enough for moi for first year success, maybe even two years worth. People don’t think, they just react to the moments passions.

    Well, he negotiated against himself with that stimulus. Then he negotiated against himself with health care reform. Now, with his unsolicited spending freeze he has negotiated against himself on government finance. I don’t know about anyone else, but my anger at Obama is not a spur-of-the-moment thing.

  235. 235.

    Notorious P.A.T.

    I wish that would work on Lieberman. The smarmy little shit can’t be reached, I fear. Doesn’t matter now so much since the mirage of a fili proof majority is gone. The silver lining is now obama can take it to the wingnuts who are now responsible for their obstruction having 41 votes and the dems 59. sounds like O started that tonight.

    Maybe Lieberman couldn’t be reached. We’ll never know now! As for shame not working on him, no way it will work on the Republicans. “oooh, we feel so bad about not letting anything get done. . . by the government we would dismantle if we could”.

    Obama’s hands-off “leadership” squandered a 60-vote supermajority. That is unforgivable.

    Hey spellcheck, “supermajority” is a word!

  236. 236.

    General Winfield Stuck

    @Notorious P.A.T.:

    but my anger at Obama is not a spur-of-the-moment thing.

    I know, and I think your type of dissent is responsible. I don’t agree, but you don’t usually go overboard either, :)

  237. 237.

    Lev

    @Notorious P.A.T.: I’m imagining a universe in which Martha Coakley eked out a victory and Obama decided to play the same inside game on financial reform that he did on health care. Know what? I’m not sure that’s a better universe at this point.

  238. 238.

    General Winfield Stuck

    Obama’s hands-off “leadership” squandered a 60-vote supermajority.

    Never had a democratic 60 vote majority. And Lieberman voted and campaigned for the other guy. Nope, nothing Obama could have done to get joes 60th vote, nothing at all. at least that was legal.

  239. 239.

    SixStringFanatic

    @Notorious P.A.T.:
    “He negotiated against himself with that stimulus.”
    So that was Obama’s hand up Olympia Snowe’s ass every time she said the overall bill should be smaller?

  240. 240.

    mcc

    I’m imagining a universe in which Martha Coakley eked out a victory and Obama decided to play the same inside game on financial reform that he did on health care. Know what? I’m not sure that’s a better universe at this point.

    I’m beginning to think we need a corollary to the “everything is good news for republicans” rule

  241. 241.

    BDeevDad

    CNN focus group seriously are saying the President and Dems are not being bipartisan enough. Actually, had an African American Republican say Obama should veto any bill that had no Republicans voting for it.

    WTF

  242. 242.

    Cain

    @BDeevDad:

    CNN focus group seriously are saying the President and Dems are not being bipartisan enough. Actually, had an African American Republican say Obama should veto any bill that had no Republicans voting for it.

    A wingnut. Probably not popular with a lot of liberals. I don’t know what the fuck is great about bipartisan when one party just obstructs everything. Thank God, Obama called them out on that.

    cain

  243. 243.

    General Winfield Stuck

    @BDeevDad: There are a lot of voters out there who think this, especially independent ones, something of a fetish with them among other similar nutty notions. I know cause I was one for twenty years and had my share of such odd ideas about politics. I viewed it like my family I think, so as no one would feel left out or something silly like that. Really dumb way to approach politics and lawmaking, but there you have it. It’s what low info creates, I suspect.

  245. 245.

    Elie

    @General Winfield Stuck:

    You were right.

    It was an amazing speech and more than the words or delivery, I am linked in again to the underlying person with the values and the leadership. That was who I voted for and who I supported (though admittedly, I wavered here recently)

    God help us and let us all find the courage to do or support “what needs to be done”…

  246. 246.

    Wile E. Quixote

    @celticdragonchick:

    @Davis X. Machina:

    If
    __
    the president in Independence Day were GOP, that’d be the response to the alien attacks…

    Not quite. The GOP response there would be to torture any of them we could capture, and keep torturing them even after we find out they don’t understand the questions and the whole thing is a waste of time. Then, dump the body under one of the mother ships and claim we have no idea what happened. To wrap it up, instead of figuring out how to effectively attack their ships, we go and bomb Iran.

    There would also be a picture of Donald Rumsfeld meeting with the alien leader, and it would turn out that the Reagan administration knew about the alien invasion but chose not to do anything about it.

  248. 248.

    Cain

    @Elie: <blockquoteIt was an amazing speech and more than the words or delivery, I am linked in again to the underlying person with the values and the leadership. That was who I voted for and who I supported (though admittedly, I wavered here recently

    I think the reason is that he didn’t hedge on anything. He called out everyone who was causing trouble and scolded them. That’s essentially what we wanted at our emotional core. We wanted to lash out at senators and house members and he did it for us.

    That’s what I wanted. To have my rage and frustration channeled by someone they would listen to. I’m not disappointed.

    cain

  250. 250.

    Will

    @BDeevDad:

    The only response to a statement like that is to remind them that a bill that gets any Republican votes, gets all of them, or none of them. That’s how lockstep they are now. So they’re saying that Obama should only sign bills with 100% backing of the entire Congress. Governing by criminal jury trial.

  251. 251.

    Elie

    @DaBomb:

    Giggle giggle, yeah — you are right. I AM embarrassed.

    I am weak but I mean well and I want so much for our country. Its been a long hard road…

  257. 257.

    Wile E. Quixote

    @JGabriel:

    Re: SCOTUS
    __
    How common is it for SC Justices to skip the SOTU? Looking at the audience shots, it appears that Scalia, Thomas, and Kennedy are no-shows.

    They’ve got a regular gig, along with Ross Douthat, working as a Village People tribute band at a club called “The Gothic Asshole” every other Wednesday.

  260. 260.

    DaBomb

    @Elie: I know you mean well. It’s okay to waver, but just don’t succomb to name calling and screaming at someone who genuinely seems to be on our side.

    Wait for all of the information to come out fully.
    He reminded us again of what we should be doing, to help him.

    That’s all.

  263. 263.

    Wile E. Quixote

    @Will:

    Don’t a few justices always miss it on purpose, in case of a catastrophic attack on the Capitol, etc.? Same with a few cabinet members, if I’m not mistaken.

    Yeah, that’s what Scalia, Thomas and Kennedy would like you to think.

  264. 264.

    Elie

    @DaBomb:

    “don’t succomb to name calling and screaming at someone who genuinely seems to be on our side.”

    Did I miss something? I know that you must have had an example in mind, so lets hear it if you can present it. I try hard not to be a name caller unless I am provoked or name called, but I am imperfect, so may have. Would help to know so that I can apologize to that person

  265. 265.

    Wile E. Quixote

    @Will:

    @General Winfield Stuck:

    Nope, nothing Obama could have done to get joes 60th vote, nothing at all. at least that was legal.

    I was always in favor of the dead horse or dead hooker approach when it came to Joe, myself.

    I’m not sure if that would work. Joe strikes me as the kind of guy who would be really into either one of those.

  266. 266.

    Will

    @Wile E. Quixote:

    Yeah, that’s what Scalia, Thomas and Kennedy would like you to think.

    Ok, here’s Wiki on the matter. While I was right that a cabinet member intentionally misses the speech, it says nothing about USSCJ’s missing. Dicks.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_of_the_Union_address

    Sitting near the front of the chamber are the Justices of the Supreme Court, the members of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and members of the President’s Cabinet. Customarily, one cabinet member (the designated survivor) does not attend, in order to provide continuity in the line of succession in the event that a catastrophe disables the President, the Vice President, and other succeeding officers gathered in the House chamber.

  267. 267.

    Elie

    @DaBomb:

    Ohhh — I think that you meant me calling Obama names?

    I dont think that I called him names, but I may have labeled his behavior quite negatively —

    Okay (if that was the examples you meant)

    Hmmm. Dunno.

    I was pretty damned angry and that anger was justified at the time given what I knew. I could have been more patient, but then, HE and his team also made a few mistakes – what seemed BIG mistakes. I get pissed off at people I care about and I do yell a bit. Am I going to stay calm and cool in the future? Hopefully but can’t promise. I was pretty upset and I will not deny the validity of that emotion so — while I hear your point…

  268. 268.

    MJ

    @Elie:
    and
    @SIA:

    Don’t you just love that poem! I’ve had that in my youtube favorites folder forever. I think I originally heard about it on a post at jackandjillpolitics.com. It’s crazy how prescient this artist was about the fight in the liberal soul between Barack Obama, hope & cynicism.

  269. 269.

    Elie

    @MJ:

    I agree. Wow! It will be good to keep this and remember if times get hard again — and I am sure that they will

  270. 270.

    MJ

    @Elie:

    Word! But right now, it feels good to remember why we elected that “Pretty Mothaf**ker” in November of 2008.

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