Here’s the Times panel on Obama’s SOTU (via TBogg):
* Jeff Shesol, a speechwriter to President Bill Clinton
* Lisa Schiffren, a speechwriter to Vice President Dan Quayle
* Alan Schroeder, journalism professor
* William F. Gavin, a speechwriter to President Richard Nixon
* Jonah Goldberg, National Review
I guess Lanny Davis and Dick Morris were unavailable.
Short Bus Bully
Once again, definitive proof of the overwhelming librul media conspiracy.
I’m not sure which is more hilarious. Jonah Goldberg or “a speechwriter for Dan Quayle”.
Either way, this looks fairly milquetoast to me. Not ragingly liberal or conservative, just very establishment D.C. insider.
Speechwriters, journalism professor, and a doughy wankload. Where are the policy-type people (you know, those who have real experience implementing real ideas–or who have a historical grounding in how these things might work)?
The Village must burn.
That’s about as fair as me against Michael Moore in a fat-eating contest.
Any panel with the Doughty Pantload on it, I give a pass.
Hey, Jeff Shesol. He used to write a fairly amusing comic strip called “Thatch.” It was a bit of a wannabe Doonesbury, but it had its moments.
Brick Oven Bill
In my opinion, the New York Times would be very smart to add Rachel Maddow to their list of contributors.
Why do I imagine they assembled this panel by going out into the street and kicking over some trash cans, some bits of cardboard, and the odd economy size package of cheetos to find the drunken, abandoned, mumbling remnants of these former regimes? Somebody’s rolodex is way out of touch.
The British government has learned that the National Review recently sought significant quantities of cheetos from Africa.
[edit: dammit, aimai beat me to it]
Jesus, what kind of masochistic, self-hating idjit goes around promoting himself as Quayle’s speechwriter?
@Brick Oven Bill:
You like-a the gays, dontcha?
Did you read Goldberg’s “contribution”? SOTU speeches are boring, but I guess we should keep them, although I really don’t see the point. Anyway, presidents aren’t going to get rid of them, and especially not this one who (is it responsible to speculate? it would be irresponsible not to!) probably only wanted to be president in the first place because he likes being on TV so much. Not that it matters, because 1/19 changed everything. Off-year mid-term special elections have consequences, bitchez!
Ann B. Nonymous
I suppose the first four are glad they weren’t in the same room as Goldberg, whom I always picture as demurely lifting his leg whenever his internal pressure reaches a critical limit.
Bill E Pilgrim
They’re known as “even the New York Times” (ETNYT).
As in “See? Even the liberal New York Times agrees that (insert right wing meme du jour)”
Along with “even The New Republic” and, perhaps most repulsive of all, “even Camille Paglia”, the favorite character in the Wingnut house of mirrors that loves to quote some supposed “liberal” spouting extreme right wing talking points right from Dick Cheney’s last interview.
“Meme du jour”, that was a movie with Catherine Deneuve and Marcel Marceau? I think so.
Any actual attempt to balance against the Doughy Pantload alone would require an actual Trotskyite, not a Clinton speechwriter. The Grey Lady doesn’t understand what “DLC” means.
Conservatism is dying because all of their frames (such as liberal media) are stale holdovers from the 60s, 70s and 80s. Their economic agenda is almost entirely devoted to solving the problems of high taxation and excessive inflation. Their cultural agenda is steeped in fighting the after effects of the sexual revolution, affirmative action/anti-discrimination laws and the loss of influence for the church. Their foreign agenda is still shaped by Vietnam and the Cold War.
Almost all of these problems are gone or have diminished in relevance, but conservatism hasn’t adjusted. They just turn up the volume. Gripes about the liberal NYT don’t even move the goalposts anymore, they just reveal the complainer for who he/she is.
Bill E Pilgrim
@jayjaybear: That’s what cracks me up when Fred Hiatt actually mounts a defense of all of the dozens of leading Neocons and ex-Bush speechwriters and Fox pundits writing for the WAPO, he cites that they have the same on “the other side” because they have ultra leftist liberals like er, Michael Kinsley..
You’d have to have Noam Chomsky cloned into about fourteen op-ed regulars to even start “balancing” that extreme right wing propaganda organ at this point.
And of course even having him once would be wayyyy too extreme for them, oh dear no.
You’d think they’d go into Witness Protection…
@Mike E: Kissenger isn’t on there anywhere.
The Grand Panjandrum
I guess Marc Thiessen was unavailable.
Where the fuck is Bill Frist with my nuclear option?
Well, CNN had already snatched up Erick Erickson.
@danimal: You got that right. For people older than myself, “tax and spend” means the Great Society and Congress’s failure to adjust tax brackets during stagflation. For people age 40 and younger, it means that Congress is raising the money before it spends it.
Am I the only one (also, too) who thinks that the time may be coming when the Defense budget won’t be such a sacred cow? It’s been packing on lard since at least 1980, and I just don’t see today’s young people being convinced that we have to maintain an army large enough to stop a Soviet tank push through West Germany when our real enemy today is a hundred guys in Bumfuck Pakistan who are probably best dealt with by a dozen scary mo-fos in a special forces unit.
Conservatism is a marketing slogan, it never was a unified theory of anything, or a coherent set of ideas. Maybe on paper, but never in practice.
The so-called proponents of it don’t even know what it is. Reagan blew the cover with his “Are you better off than you were four years ago?” rhetoric.
Well, if government is the problem, then is the way to be better off to just have government that does less, and then everything will work better? The idea is so moronic, it makes Creationism look good by comparison.
And that’s their core belief. Their core idea is whack. How do you build a unified theory of government, and then implement it, when the foundation is just crazy?
I suppose if you think collapsing bridges, foul air, and interstate highways becoming undriveable due to potholes and ruts to be the measures of “better off than you were” then you think conservatism has a lot of promise.
OT: Halperin calls himself dumb; water calls itself wet
I’d leave “speechwriter for Dan Quayle” off of my resume, personally, even if it meant bumping up barista.
Bill E Pilgrim
@jenniebee: I didn’t realize that Pakistan used the same term for little flyover towns in the middle of nowhere as we do.
Though “flyover” may have taken on a different meaning these days over there.
3 cons, a neutral and an outdated dem, seems about right for the liberal media!
Didn’t you just make a long drawn out comment yesterday that if you were playing a board game you would pick their side because it’s easier to win with their beliefs?
President Brown got a mandate from the people of the USA, how dare you mock the 320 million people who stand behind him.
H/T Atrios – Culture of Truth hits the high notes of the SOTU:
Culture of Truth
Well…. the mainstream media are jumping onto the blog-train, so they invite people like Nate Silver and Ezra Klein into their shows. So I guess it’s only fair that they give the same favor to people like Erik Eriksson or Jonah Goldberg. But I have to wonder how you can not be convinced after watching them that there is one side with the brains and the arguments, and the other side with the frat-boy jokes and the yelling.
@jibeaux: LOL-made my morning with that one-well done!
Paul in KY
What! Alan Keyes wasn’t available?
Lisa Schiffren is a contributer to the Corner, Sister Katherine Jean’s holy newsletter and mash note to Mitt Romney and Scott Brown. That’s where Jonah does his dirty pantload work. That the Times would use two writers from one blog on a panel of five is batshit insane. They need to hear about this.
El DoPa is also all mad that target=”_blank”>actual historians are calling his book of ahistorical bullshit a bunch of ahistorical bullshit.
I don’t know. I think I’m as old as you and I just don’t feel as hopeful as you do about the defense budget. What is astonishing to me is that it seemed like, for decades, the military budget grew because the government/presidents of both parties pushed and pushed for it to grow to fight wars, or stave off the soviet threat–that is, they actually sort of had to have an excuse for it. Now I feel like we had five seconds of the imaginary “peace dividend” and we’ve gone right back to automatically approving defense increases without our leaders ever even presenting a rationale. Just as most americans don’t have the faintest idea how *little* we spend on foreign aid or welfare, I think most americans don’t even grasp how much we spend on the military. So they don’t imagine we can or will ever cut it.
A-yup. The ZOMG inflation’s gonna git uuuu + taxes=death by bufu schtick is getting really quaint. Note to teh Right – nobody under the age of 40 cares about scary stories from the 1970s, because that is ancient history. You might as well be lecturing them about the Fall of the Roman Empire. Hearing this stuff now is like reading comic books from the 1950s where SuperBoy helps the neighborhood kids fix up their bikes and turns them away from the menace of juvenile delinquency: playing cards and chewing gum. WTF?
Brick Oven Bill
In the beginning, Balloon Juice psychoanalyzed Barack’s childhood abandonment, and studied how his want of acceptance affects his policy decisions. Then, last week, Glenn Beck did the same thing. As I key this in, Rush Limbaugh is now following in due form.
Notice the trend. Balloon Juice also beat Drudge by several days with the climate emails. And accurately predicted the outcome of the Brown election.
The New York Times now employs a guy to watch Glenn Beck, as I understand, to get the news. Should a certain cable news commentary show on MSNBC want to get the straight scoop, un-diluted, she knows where to go. No charge.
The Grand Panjandrum
@aimai: To round out the irony it is now the Republicans making political hay over the Senate HCR bill because it makes an attempt to slow down Medicare spending. It really is quite difficult to know who is on what side until you actually get these guys on tape. Gosh, one might be lead to believe that we are in an epic battle to see who the last poseur standing is.
I’ll go even further into the ridiculous. From a local hearing a couple of nights ago in lovely Whatcom County, WA. Had a room full of screaming Cascade rural folks..”The government should stay out of our septic systems and not tell us to stop living in our own shit. We LIKE living and know what we are doing to keep it that way and would like to make sure everyone has some of my shit too.”
Seriously. More and more closure of recreational shellfishing and contamination of drinking water risk but not to worry…we knows what we are doing and we can’t afford to correct it anyway.
The County Council, just recently taken over by the righties, moved to stop enforcing the septic system oversight by the County Public Health Department…
What do you expect from the NY Times? To their everlasting shame they hired Maureen Dowd.
Ta-Nehisi Coates: “I Just Remembered Chris Matthews Was White”
I’d like to see companies legally required to breakdown the taxes coming out of each paycheck, at a high level: so much for military, so much for medicare, so much for health insurance, so much for government overhead, etc.
Or maybe have the IRS send out a yearly breakdown, that might be better.
I suspect you might see some rather immediate changes to our country’s spending priorities.
Brilliant. Just brilliant.
How’s the public water supply looking?
Fixt. Eisenhower was the greatest prophet this country has had in the last 100 years. And like most great prophets, he was totally ignored.
licensed to kill time
B.O.B. : You and your comments =/= Balloon Juice.
So far, no outbreaks but this is mostly in rural Whatcom County and some of these folks have wells. This summer will be the tell.
I just do not understand what is happening to common sense. Do you really want to have people who have no respect for why this is important, running these sorts of decisions that impact so many? I mean, cutting of your nose to spite your face can have real consequences here that impact human health and safety…
This wont be the end of it, the caldron is boiling and not sure that they will be allowed to do this but its still interesting how crazy people get and how far they will take a belief system that as Don Purgatorio states, is built on complete foundation of crazy…
OT J.D. Salinger has died
They just did. Why a paper of the Times’ reputation would give any platform to the talentless testament to nepotism Jonah Goldberg is beyond me.
Can you imagine the NY Post or Washington Times having a board made up of Naomi Wolf, Richard Wolff and Chris Kofinis??
Brick Oven Bill
Licensed to kill time is, of course, correct, as my conclusions are almost always accurate, being based solely in our Five Senses and the Seven Liberal Arts and Sciences. Conclusions made in the absence of self-interest, or outside funding sources, with their undisclosed agendas.
But I am a generous man, eager to share credit.
The official ‘Balloon Juice’ had Scott Brown losing, not winning by two points as the unauthorized ‘Balloon Juice’ predicted.
Oh, 4chan, you’ve fooled me with that one too many times already.
@Chyron HR: No, He’s right.
Obama speaking in Florida.
Just saw that. Always loved his reclusiveness.
Jonah Goldberg is an awesomely stupid person.
That would be awesome. They already send out that Social Security update. They could just add in a “how your tax money is being spent” update. That would wake up a few folks.
I just googled it: Yes, J.D. Salinger has died. Aged 91.
@Tomlinson: Love the idea. A yearly statement from the government would probably work best. Last year, $15,000 of your tax money went to the military, $200 went to foreign aid, etc.
As a related measure, I’ve often wondered if what would happen if companies were required to include the cost of health care when communicating salary information.
“Joe, your salary is $64,000 a year, but $15,000 is going toward your health care, so your take home is $49,000.
One of the biggest problems in the health care debate right now is that no one knows how much anyone is paying for health care today.
licensed to kill time
RIP J.D. Salinger. I remember reading Catcher In The Rye for the first time when I was 10, standing on my bed reading by the front porch light after bedtime, because I’d heard there were dirty bits.
I stayed for the excellent writing and subsequently read everything he ever wrote (my parents had all his books) and reread them all over the years.
Where do the ducks go in winter? No fucking ducks!
It won’t happen anytime in the near future, but the best way to attack military spending is to hammer on the point that we spend 40% of the world’s total, and no one else is even close. Who the hell are we planning on fighting?
This should be required as well. Imagine the hue and cry if this kind of thing were implemented.
You are exactly right that no one knows how much health care costs. The best assessment people can make is that is costs $x per paycheck – whatever is deducted – plus the cost of co-pays. That’s it. Otherwise it’s just an invisible cost.
Of course they’d have to figure out how to include the cost of tax deductions for the corporations into that as well for it to tell the whole story. Complicated.
@jenniebee: Jenniebee, I dream of a day when the immense size of the defense budget becomes a legitimate topic of conversation. Someday there will be a realization that we don’t need everything we have.
Michael Moore is fat.
@JK: This is why I hate the month of January. Too many times the death of someone important to the world or important to me has happened around the end of this month.
Also OT, the President just made a joke in Florida about taking your shoes off to get on airplanes. Why does the President hate America? (Or does he just hate the TSA?)
@Brick Oven Bill: for suitable definitions of “almost always accurate”
The fact that you’re not really blinking at the right-wing nature of this panel is part of the problem.
@Elie: Republicans in our county (Delaware County, PA) have managed to prevent the very existence of a County Health Department.
OT, it looks like some FReaks were out along the route in Tampa, protesting Obama.
What is up with these dipshits carting signs around with misspelled words?
@Mike E: I think BOB is convinced that because Rachel is a lesbian that she probably has hairy armpits. It’s kinda his thing.
@JK: I’m surprised MoDo was left off the list.
How could any SOTU review be complete without a detailed analysis of how the speech was ok but would have been so much better if our President had been a hybridized version of Don Draper, Ward Cleaver, and Danny Zuko?
Oh well. I guess they didn’t want to give anyone the homefield advantage.
The Federal Government? “Madating” fines? Taxes? PENALTIES? That couldn’t possibly be constitutional!
Of course, TBogg is wadding his panties for no real reason here. The question before this panel was not “How awesome/retarded do you think Obama is?” The questions were
This wasn’t “the Times panel on the SOTU.” It was mostly dry, historical stuff (with a very few partisan lines) about how boring it is to have a SOTU address in these “24hr news cycle” times when we’ve seen this same stuff every day for a month.
Contrast that with the rest of the Times’ Opinion tab on the website, which reads much like, well, the front page of Balloon Juice.
I think it’s because Rachel reminds BoB of Tucker Carlson, hubba x2.
You’d think they’d go into
I thought all the hotsky-Trotskys went neocon. Guess I missed something; have to check in with the wild-eyed Commie wife for the latest.
Why don’t more progressives run for local offices like school boards and city councils? I think it’s a real problem for dems that they have such a shallow bench.
Yes, I have heard Jonah “Liberal Fascism” Goldberg is a real middle of the road kind of guy.