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You are here: Home / The last word on Ford

The last word on Ford

by DougJ|  February 17, 201010:39 pm| 110 Comments

This post is in: Going Galt, Good News For Conservatives

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For all the trashing of TNR I’ve done lately, I think Jon Chait’s article on Harold Ford is the best one I’ve seen so far:

Casting about for a champion, Wall Street’s eyes turned to Ford.

The Tennessee expatriate turned out to be the perfect man for the job. He already had a foothold in the city through his financial services committee connections, a $1.8 million East Hampton vacation home his father had purchased in 2003, and a lucrative part-time job at Merrill Lynch. Ford breakfasts regularly at the Regency and relaxes at upper-class redoubts like the Waverly Inn. “Ford started hearing about [the backlash] at cocktail parties,” reports Politico.

[….]

Ford’s candidacy is an epiphenomenon of Wall Street’s retreat into a fantasy world. In this alternate reality, the titans of finance are innocent victims of a freakish accident, the Democrats’ struggles result from their hostility to these victims, and the people are clamoring for a leader who will openly cater to their demands. The notion that Democratic primary voters in New York will embrace Ford may be more fantastical than the wildest investment scheme that predated the crash.

I was talking with a few bankster friends of mine a few weeks ago and the whining about the proposed bank tax was unbelievable. These assholes really and truly believe that they are the engines of our economy, that they are being treated badly, and that if they hold their breath long enough, they’ll get their way. I’m not for scapegoating anyone unfairly, but they really are living in an alternate universe.

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Reader Interactions

110Comments

  1. 1.

    danimal

    February 17, 2010 at 10:45 pm

    Damn, all those bonuses buy an alternate universe? One in which Harold Ford instantly attracts New York Senatorial votes.

    That’s some serious cash right there.

  2. 2.

    Xantar

    February 17, 2010 at 10:49 pm

    I have to ask: who are these banker friends of yours, and if they’re so deluded, why are they your friends?

  3. 3.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    February 17, 2010 at 10:51 pm

    Harold Ford Sr served in Congress until 1997 and bought a 1.8 million dollar vacation home six years later? I know the funeral home business has a steady client base, but that’s some scratch.

    Isn’t Chait pretty much the best of a very weird, if not all bad, lot over at TNR?

  4. 4.

    John Cole

    February 17, 2010 at 10:51 pm

    I don’t want to scapegoat them.

    I want to shoot them.

  5. 5.

    General Winfield Stuck

    February 17, 2010 at 10:51 pm

    The last word on Ford

    Yeah right.

    and that if they hold their breath long enough, they’ll get their way.

    Unless Obama and dem cc’ers re regulate their flaky asses, they just might get their way. We got one fork of the GOP tongue complaining Obama shouldn’t have bailed them out, and the other fork doing everything they can to stop meaningful reform that will guarantee the recent economic disaster repeated.

    I”m about ready to give the south permission to secede because they are doing their damndest to see we all go down with the Union ship they are drilling holes in round the clock. If I thought they would behave and not nuke some third world country for fun and start the Apocalypse, I’d say give ’em their walking papers and be done with it.

  6. 6.

    kommrade reproductive vigor

    February 17, 2010 at 10:51 pm

    In this alternate reality, the titans of finance ^Republicans are innocent victims of a freakish accident, the Democrats’ struggles result from their hostility to these victims, and the people are clamoring for a leader who will openly cater to their demands.

    fxd

  7. 7.

    John Cole

    February 17, 2010 at 10:52 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Chait is awesome, although he has some weird forays into suck. His defense of that jackass that trashed Sotomayor was laughable.

  8. 8.

    Robin G.

    February 17, 2010 at 10:55 pm

    @Xantar: This.

    John, this word, ‘friend’? I do not think it means what you think it means.

  9. 9.

    mr. whipple

    February 17, 2010 at 10:57 pm

    Ford: Because Wall Street Needs Love, Too.

  10. 10.

    Dave C

    February 17, 2010 at 10:58 pm

    @John Cole:

    In that case, John, you might find this to be a cathartic read during your recuperation.

    h/t to Ezra Klein for the book recommendation.

  11. 11.

    slag

    February 17, 2010 at 10:59 pm

    These assholes really and truly believe that they are the engines of our economy, that they are being treated badly, and that if they hold their breath long enough, they’ll get their way.

    This sounds like every Republican I’ve ever met. Including my parents.

  12. 12.

    Brian J

    February 17, 2010 at 11:01 pm

    At the risk of butchering a metaphor about the engines of our economy and regular tune ups or speed limits, I’ll just stick with facts. I know there are many different plans out there, and as I imagine is the case with most who don’t work in the industry, I don’t understand all of them as well as I should. That said, I think I get the basic thrust of each policy, which is to stop or limit the pain one particular firm’s actions can have on other firms and on the economy as a whole and to have firms account for the various backstops that the government provides. As far as I can tell, none of the practices that people are questioning are banned outright. It’s just that they are more heavily regulated and/or taxed in some way.

    To me at least, this seems pretty reasonable, just as it would seem reasonable to let someone drive a car that gets lousy MPH as long as they paid for their pollution through a carbon or gas tax. But why the financial industry sees this as so awful is beyond me. Are they going to make that much less money from this?

  13. 13.

    Belafon (formerly anonevent)

    February 17, 2010 at 11:02 pm

    I liked a number of the TNR writers. Were they always right? No, but Chait and a couple of others were really good at their favorite topics. Marty thankfully had his own webpage that you never had to go to. There was that one other poster that I couldn’t stand; thankfully I’ve been away long enough I no longer remember his name. I think I finally got tired of paying for Marty, though.

  14. 14.

    zhak

    February 17, 2010 at 11:03 pm

    A couple of things:

    After the big crash in ’29, the masters of the universe of their day knew they’d been wrong, had done wrong, and were capable of feeling guilt. Some committed suicide. But there was, from all I’ve read anyway (I wasn’t alive then, though I sometimes feel that old), a palpable sense of guilt.

    I’ve not encountered a single mea culpa from anyone associated with their roles in the latest debacle, despite the wide-ranging number of people who should be feeling guilty.

    So what’s changed?

    How about several decades of people in power getting away with illegal acts and never having to say you’re sorry, much less pay any sort of price for wrong-doing? Hell, people in power screw up now & we bail them out. And they think it’s their just due.

    Start with Nixon’s pardon, work up through Reagan’s Iran Contra mess (& the subsequent pardons).

    And then move to Bush II and his VP proudly stating his fondness for torture.

    It’s humbling for me to realize that the country that I have always thought was great, despite its shortcomings, isn’t great at all. I’d like to think there was a time when people in power could be held accountable for their actions in this country. It’s one of the things that (formerly) made us great & helped us to stand apart from so many other countries.

    We’re not just dysfunctional, we’ve actually stopped being a functioning Democracy. And blame isn’t just to be laid at the feet of Republicans. Clinton played a big role in deregulating Wall Street, didn’t he? And nowadays, how many Democrats can you name that are not wholly owned by monied interests? We’d be so much better off, individually & collectively, if that were not the case.

  15. 15.

    Joseph Nobles

    February 17, 2010 at 11:03 pm

    Chait is right: the very idea that these guys are whispering in Ford’s ear should cause us to question their sanity.

    And let’s call the banker bonus tax exactly what it is: an asshole tax. Just for the sheer fact that we have to put up with these guys is reason enough to plunk this tax on them.

  16. 16.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    February 17, 2010 at 11:05 pm

    Kind of on-topic: I heard a good ad today on TV–in the next room cooking when it ran, I didn’t see it or who ran it–about the bank bailouts being caused by assholes making bets about bets on bets. A nice counterweight to that schlock that some Frank Lutz inspired (IIRC) group has been running on the reform bill. Anyone else see it, or know who’s running it?

  17. 17.

    Church Lady

    February 17, 2010 at 11:09 pm

    Something tells me that your “bankster friends” aren’t going to be your friends anymore, if they read this blog.

  18. 18.

    jenniebee

    February 17, 2010 at 11:10 pm

    I hope you didn’t discourage them from giving that breath-holding thing a try.

  19. 19.

    mr. whipple

    February 17, 2010 at 11:14 pm

    Flying Tomato is Epic.

  20. 20.

    BB

    February 17, 2010 at 11:15 pm

    The thing about the Harold Ford narrative is that it’s absolutely fair and absolutely correct. He really does live from his corporate towncar, his reality truly has been shaped by the banker bubble that adopted him.

    The confluence of moneyed Manhattanites and NYC media trying like hell to make someone like Harold happen is scary and its failure thus far has been very satisfying.

    Gillibrand has been a great Senator and has a quiet but very liberal voting record. It still bugs me to see certain folks wail about her rhetoric on gun issues prior to joining the Senate when Russ Feingolds’ votes go unscrutinized.

    Oh wait, what was the topic?

    Ah yes. Harold Ford is just awful. Gaze into his dead-ass zombie eyes. He makes Putin look downright soulful.

  21. 21.

    Keith G

    February 17, 2010 at 11:16 pm

    @John Cole: Goldman Sachs are more destructive than most terrorist cells could ever dream to be. In light of that, as I mentioned in a previous thread, Goldman’s HQ needs to be targeted with a drone-launched Hellfire just like any other enemy combatant cell.

  22. 22.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    February 17, 2010 at 11:19 pm

    @BB:

    The thing about the Harold Ford narrative is that it’s absolutely fair and absolutely correct. He really does live from his corporate towncar, his reality truly has been shaped by the banker bubble that adopted him.

    I’m betting at least sympathetic phone call has been exchanged between Harold and Evan, and probably Jowly Joe on a three-way (“on”, I said “on”, not “in”).

    I hope Gillibrand gets some props for sticking up for the PO. One of the most interesting things about that is that the original four are almost all freshmen, or at least very junior.

  23. 23.

    Brick Oven Bill

    February 17, 2010 at 11:20 pm

    DougJ; President Obama appointed Mark Patterson, Goldman Sachs lobbyist, to be Geithner’s Chief of Staff. Geithner owns the printing presses.

    Geithner’s best man at his wedding was his dad.

  24. 24.

    sfinny

    February 17, 2010 at 11:21 pm

    My boss related a conversation with a friend who has a hedge fund/trading operation, who was complaining that new regulations would make him have to move 50 jobs overseas. So therefore the push for new regulations are just making unemployment worse.

    Yeah, those 50 jobs would really make things worse for the country. /s

  25. 25.

    danimal

    February 17, 2010 at 11:23 pm

    @Keith G: The drone attack on Goldman Sachs can be called a big, fat mistake after the fact. Kind of like when we took out the Chinese embassy in Belgrade back in the day. Oopsy.

  26. 26.

    bago

    February 17, 2010 at 11:24 pm

    CFPA appears dead in the senate. 0 republican votes, of course.

  27. 27.

    Midnight Marauder

    February 17, 2010 at 11:25 pm

    @John Cole:

    I don’t want to scapegoat them.
    __
    I want to shoot them.

    If you put that on a mug, those babies will sell like hotcakes. I can promise you that, good sir.

  28. 28.

    Citizen_X

    February 17, 2010 at 11:27 pm

    a friend who has a hedge fund/trading operation, who was complaining that new regulations would make him have to move 50 jobs overseas.

    Hmm. 50 Hedge fund traders.

    Can we arrange to have them moved to the bottom of the sea?

  29. 29.

    Church Lady

    February 17, 2010 at 11:29 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Sr. doesn’t have any interest in the family funeral home anymore and caskets didn’t pay for his spread in the Hamptons. A Florida resident now, he has been a lobbyist since he left Congress, raking in some pretty good dough. But, I think Jr. is raking in more.

  30. 30.

    mr. whipple

    February 17, 2010 at 11:31 pm

    CFPA appears dead in the senate. 0 republican votes, of course.

    And the Democrats aren’t making any headway with the electorate? WTF is going on?

  31. 31.

    sfinny

    February 17, 2010 at 11:34 pm

    @Citizen_X: Apparently they will have to suffer in Malta or the Caymans. :-)

  32. 32.

    Comrade Luke

    February 17, 2010 at 11:36 pm

    In what possible way can a bank or any investment institution be an engine of an economy?

    And why does it take an economist to answer that question?

  33. 33.

    slag

    February 17, 2010 at 11:37 pm

    @John Cole: If it makes you feel any better, here are some former bankers on your side:

    “You draw a line that is too tight,” Mr. Brady said. “That does not bother me a bit.”
    __
    Nor does it bother John S. Reed, a former Citigroup co-chairman, who played a role in building Citi into a powerhouse that mingled commercial banking and all sorts of trading activities. That mix helped to precipitate the current credit crisis, requiring a costly federal bailout of Citigroup, among others, in 2008.
    __
    Mr. Reed, now 71, was long gone by then, and from retirement he has second thoughts. He even thinks about resurrecting the Glass-Steagall Act of 1933, which prevented banks from engaging in any sort of trading activity involving stocks and bonds. (It was revoked in 1999, partly at the behest of Citigroup, then run by Sanford I. Weill.)

    Give it up for the old dudes who may have learned a little something!

  34. 34.

    DougL (frmrly: Conservatively Liberal)

    February 17, 2010 at 11:41 pm

    These assholes really and truly believe that they are the engines of our economy…

    Any proper high performance engine has controls on it that help to ensure that you don’t over-boost or over-rev and blow it to smithereens. These fuckers had the head mechanic remove the rev-limiter and disable the wastegates, allowing them to get stupid and blow it up. They want it rebuilt but are refusing any controls that would help to prevent another blown engine. I guess it’s more fun for them to joy ride in the car without restrictions. Hey, as long as they have the head mechanic in their pocket, why worry? They pay him and if he doesn’t do what they say they will just fire him and get another head mechanic who will do what they want.

    One other note is that unfortunately the engine that they built is all horsepower and no torque. Looks good on paper but it only runs with the pedal to the floor. Let up on the gas and it falls flat on its face. That’s what happens when you run a poorly designed engine with a rich mixture and no controls.

  35. 35.

    jack-of-all-thumbs

    February 17, 2010 at 11:53 pm

    @General Winfield Stuck:

    As a Southerner, I appreciate your frustration. But if I must live in a country where the DeMints and the Coburns hold some degree of power, can I at least have some statesmen in the mix to provide balance? If you cut us loose, I’m doomed!

  36. 36.

    Violet

    February 17, 2010 at 11:54 pm

    @John Cole:
    But first they should have to endure a painful shoulder injury like yours. Then shoot them. It’s only fair.

  37. 37.

    Brian J

    February 17, 2010 at 11:55 pm

    @sfinny:

    Why would he have to move those jobs overseas? It’s not entirely obvious to me. Do those companies have different regulations or something?

  38. 38.

    darryl

    February 17, 2010 at 11:56 pm

    In what possible way can a bank or any investment institution be an engine of an economy?
    And why does it take an economist to answer that question?

    Learn about how Commercial Paper works and get back with us.

  39. 39.

    General Winfield Stuck

    February 17, 2010 at 11:57 pm

    @jack-of-all-thumbs:

    If you cut us loose, I’m doomed!

    LOL. relax. I was just howling at the moon for the therapeutic effect. Leaving all those wingnuts down there to their own devices is not an option.

  40. 40.

    jack-of-all-thumbs

    February 18, 2010 at 12:00 am

    @

    Well said indeed.

  41. 41.

    Comrade Luke

    February 18, 2010 at 12:00 am

    @darryl:

    Oh ha ha. I learned how commercial paper works when the entire economy collapsed due to these fuckers reckless gambling, but thanks for the suggestion.

    They all think they’re king of the world, and it’s bullshit. They all think they’re John Galt. Apparently you agree with them.

  42. 42.

    Norbrook

    February 18, 2010 at 12:02 am

    There’s actually two groups who were pushing Harold forward. The first is the Wall Street group, but there’s a second group that keeps casting around. They’re the moneyed Manhattan liberals, They were really upset that their original favorite, “one of them” Caroline Kennedy ended up leaving (or being pushed) instead of being appointed.

    Then (horrors!) Governor Paterson had the effrontery to not consult them before he picked Gillibrand – who was “not one of them,” and even worse, an Upstater. Ford is the third candidate they’ve egged into “considering” a run. The problem with the previous two is that reality set in – that they weren’t electable outside of Manhattan.

    Neither is Ford, but in their fantasy world, he’s their remaining hope.

  43. 43.

    MagicPanda

    February 18, 2010 at 12:13 am

    Bankers make me want to hurl.

    If:
    a) 20% of our national GDP comes from the financial industry, and
    b) all they do is move money around (as opposed to building widgets), and
    c) most of their paper profit ended up being illusory,

    doesn’t that mean that:
    d) it was all bullshit and our GDP growth for the last 10 years was probably somewhere close to 0%, and
    e) all the “smartest” people from the top universities over the last 10 years have been working on the equivalent of an email scam?

    Thanks, bankers!

  44. 44.

    mclaren

    February 18, 2010 at 12:13 am

    You know, the Mexican cartels have started cutting peoples’ heads off and using ’em as bowling balls in bowling alleys as a form of intimidation.

    You have to wonder what would happen if the American people starting cutting off the heads of large financial firm CEOs and using ’em as bowling balls.

    I’m not suggesting anything, mind you. But it would be irresponsible not to speculate.

  45. 45.

    sfinny

    February 18, 2010 at 12:14 am

    @Brian J: I don’t actually know what proposed regulations he referenced. As there aren’t any actual new regulations in place I saw it more as posturing, and a strange attempt to play victim as if they are the populist flag bearers. Unfortunately the mindset is around here alot (in the insurance/finance industry) that they really are being very put upon, and have done nothing wrong.

    The sense of entitlement and persecution is overwhelming these days.

  46. 46.

    Brian J

    February 18, 2010 at 12:28 am

    @Comrade Luke:

    Read this page and it should give you some idea of what they do.

  47. 47.

    Sly

    February 18, 2010 at 12:28 am

    These assholes really and truly believe that they are the engines of our economy, that they are being treated badly, and that if they hold their breath long enough, they’ll get their way.

    Banks are the true economic middlemen. And like all middlemen, they think the entire system falls apart if their needs aren’t exclusively catered to. But as they indignantly proclaim that they would have been appreciated for the dynamic and synergistic little snowflakes that they are if only they’d taken the gig as Junior Vice President of Interdivision Relations at another firm, they’re boss is calculating how much money he’d save if he just farmed out that bozo’s job to a temp agency.

  48. 48.

    Brian J

    February 18, 2010 at 12:30 am

    @sfinny:

    I’m sure it is.

  49. 49.

    Silver Owl

    February 18, 2010 at 12:37 am

    I’m out of the big bank and Wall Street arena. Those rabid dogs can feed on themselves. If and when they decide to jump into reality only then will I even consider them a viable option to handle money. Since I pulled what I had left out I have slept much better.

    My philosophy is, I don’t toss thousands of dollars to crack addicts. Banksters and Wall Street are just like crack addicts in my opinion.

  50. 50.

    sfinny

    February 18, 2010 at 12:39 am

    @Brian J: The general sense that I get is that many in the industry don’t see how the activities that they engaged in added to the systemic risk of the overall economy. They were producing products and inovation that produced profits so of course they should share in those profits. That the profits were based on a bubble and never really existed never enters their minds. They made their firms money, and should therefore rightfully share in the profits. Nobody looks at the systemic failure as their responsibility.

  51. 51.

    JGabriel

    February 18, 2010 at 12:45 am

    mclaren:

    You have to wonder what would happen if the American people starting cutting off the heads of large financial firm CEOs and using ‘em as bowling balls.

    Bowling scores would probably go down. It’s very difficult to aim a misshapen, lumpy, semi-sphere like the human skull.

    I mean, I guess. I’m not speaking from experience. Or anything like that.

    .

  52. 52.

    General Winfield Stuck

    February 18, 2010 at 12:53 am

    OT

    This is your (Dis) loyal opposition at work.

    U.S. Sen. Mike Enzi, R-Wyo., twice on Monday took credit for blocking Democrats’ comprehensive changes to the nation’s health care system.

    “If I hadn’t been a part of the debate, you would already have universal health care,” Enzi told local business leaders at a Casper Area Chamber of Commerce luncheon Monday.

    If this doesn’t light a fire under senate dems asses to take HCR to reconciliation and shove Enzi’s bullshit back down his fat piehole, then they should just pack it up and go home, and leave the senate to the wingnuts.

  53. 53.

    Dave

    February 18, 2010 at 12:53 am

    So let me get this straight: Wall Street now sees itself as a special interest, and … picked someone to REPRESENT it? What happened to good old-fashioned lobbying? They don’t have the money for it any more?

  54. 54.

    Mike Kay

    February 18, 2010 at 12:56 am

    This seems like the appropriate thread: Happy 29th Birthday shout out to Paris Hilton!

  55. 55.

    Mike Kay

    February 18, 2010 at 1:03 am

    @General Winfield Stuck:

    The problem is there about 10 corrupt dems (think Harold Ford Sr.) who are heavily indebted to the insurance industry. I mean, Kent Conrad isn’t gonna buy a multimillion dollar East Hampton summer home on the salary of a senator.

    While we concentrate on the show boats like Loseman, Lincoln (Sen from Walmart), Landrieu, and Nelson, the problem is deeper. The worst of the entire lot is/was Max “good time” Baucus.

    So it’s always been very difficult to drag these crooks (kicking and screaming) across he finish line (50 votes).

  56. 56.

    Dave C

    February 18, 2010 at 1:06 am

    Completely off topic: has there ever been a US Congressman who looked like more of an asshole than John Boehner?

    Edit: Or perhaps I should rephrase my question: Has there ever been a Congressman whose looks matched his dickish personality as well as John Boehner’s?

  57. 57.

    freelancer

    February 18, 2010 at 1:08 am

    Sigh. I’m done with politics for the night. Anyone else think that the truth behind the man in black on LOST is that he’s some kind of version of Cthulhu?

  58. 58.

    slag

    February 18, 2010 at 1:09 am

    @Mike Kay: You can be kind of an asshole.

  59. 59.

    Mike Kay

    February 18, 2010 at 1:10 am

    @slag:

    are you the same slag that comments on Ezra’s blog?

  60. 60.

    MagicPanda

    February 18, 2010 at 1:13 am

    @freelancer: best theory I’ve heard so far is that the island was built as a prison for the smoke cloud / man in black and that Jacob is the warden. Could be wrong, of course.

  61. 61.

    freelancer

    February 18, 2010 at 1:21 am

    @MagicPanda:

    Right, that’s kind of what I’m getting at. He’s the only one who wants to fervently leave, and he’s evil, but maybe not really, just indifferent.

  62. 62.

    inkadu

    February 18, 2010 at 1:46 am

    @Violet: If there is a hell, it consists of fleeing bankers, a fully stocked quiver, a hunting bow and a cast on your left arm.

  63. 63.

    DougL (frmrly: Conservatively Liberal)

    February 18, 2010 at 1:50 am

    If you are looking for a laugh then check out this diary at the GoS regarding a Freeper asking fellow Freepers their opinions about getting prescriptions from Canada, any problems there might be and what online pharmacies in Canada are reputable to deal with. They can’t afford the prices for their drugs here at home and are looking into buying them from Canada. Judging from the Freeper responses it seems that this is a popular way to save money and avoiding having to pay the exorbitant prices that are charged here. One of the Freeper responders points out that drugs in Canada go to generic faster than they do here so you can save even more money!

    They are against any and all healthcare reform here but have no problem with taking advantage of Canada’s (soshulist!) system to save money? Lets block all drug importation and see how long it takes until these ‘patriots’ start screaming for blood.

    These people are so fucking stupid I bet they have to be reminded to keep breathing or they would die.

  64. 64.

    inkadu

    February 18, 2010 at 1:51 am

    @MagicPanda: There’s too much of a balance between Jacob and Smoke Monster for one to be the warden. The black and white stones, the rules about not killing each other, the debates about human nature…

    What I am most disappointed about is that everything cloud boy says about Jacob being a dick are absolutely true, but Jacob is shaping up to be some sort of saint of sacrificial lamb or good god. I’ve already had childish views of monotheism fuck up BSG, I don’t want it infecting Lost, too.

  65. 65.

    Calvin Jones and the 13th Apostle

    February 18, 2010 at 2:00 am

    Is it me or has TNR been on fire lately. And is it any wonder that we haven’t heard a peep in that time from Peretz or his lapdog Kirchick?

  66. 66.

    Chuck Butcher

    February 18, 2010 at 2:09 am

    This last summer I asked a Senator in a private conversation if he thought it would be bad if the American public decided the Senate was a wholly owned subsidiary of the banking and insurance industries. He said that would be a bad thing.

    I wonder what he has to say now?

    He hasn’t asked me for any help yet, so I haven’t had the opportunity to tell him that he and his colleagues can f… themselves. He is one of the better ones.

  67. 67.

    VladCat

    February 18, 2010 at 2:11 am

    With the proper seasoning and a long grill on a spit, I’m sure they are quite nice.

  68. 68.

    Darkrose

    February 18, 2010 at 2:17 am

    @mr. whipple:

    Flying Tomato is Epic.

    Indeed he is. That was awesome.

  69. 69.

    asiangrrlMN

    February 18, 2010 at 2:17 am

    @Chuck Butcher: Gotta ask, which one? I know you can’t tell me, but I have to ask, anyway.

    DougJ, I wasn’t sure if you meant that your banker friends were part of the group whining about being victims. If so, I second Xantar in asking why are you friends with them?

  70. 70.

    freelancer

    February 18, 2010 at 2:22 am

    @asiangrrlMN:

    Maybe it’s an even longer con.

  71. 71.

    Ripley

    February 18, 2010 at 2:31 am

    @DougL: Nice analogy, it’s clarifying. Cheers.

  72. 72.

    Chuck Butcher

    February 18, 2010 at 2:31 am

    @asiangrrlMN:
    It would be rude to have a private conversation and then repeat names and the gist of it.

    The mess of the last six months isn’t directly his fault or that of quite a few of them, but they had the numbers to to make a play or pay for it scenario and they were too clubby to do it, so it is their fault.

  73. 73.

    MagicPanda

    February 18, 2010 at 2:44 am

    @inkadu: I see what you’re getting at. Still, what’s with Jacob finding a candidate? Is anti-Jacob also looking for candidates to replace him?

    @freelancer: I suppose. It’s hard to say with godlike creatures what constitues evil. Does a godlike creature have to “know it’s being bad” or “want to be bad” in order to be bad? Or does the mere fact that it does stuff that causes horrible things to happen to humans qualify it as evil?

    In the latter construction, Cthulu would be evil, right?

  74. 74.

    asiangrrlMN

    February 18, 2010 at 2:45 am

    @freelancer: That sounds like something DougJ would do!

    @Chuck Butcher: Yeah, I know. I didn’t expect you to tell me.

    @Darkrose: I just watched. Shaun White is amazing!

  75. 75.

    Veritas78

    February 18, 2010 at 2:45 am

    Happily, Ford can’t beat Gillibrand. She’s an authentic up-stater and Greenwich is in Connecticut. Plus, Ford’s a reverse carpetbagger, and his entitlement is only going to get more irritating.

  76. 76.

    MagicPanda

    February 18, 2010 at 2:46 am

    As a side note to the previous post.. Perhaps that just proves that Cthulu is a Republican. Just shambles around causing pain and destruction while remaining indifferent to the suffering of humanity.

  77. 77.

    inkadu

    February 18, 2010 at 2:52 am

    @MagicPanda: I dont think we have enough information to even speculate on what being a candidate means. I hope the real John Locke comes up out of the smoke monster. He and Linus are by far the best characters; Smoke Monster Locke is just annoyingly arrogant.

  78. 78.

    MagicPanda

    February 18, 2010 at 2:53 am

    @inkadu: Oh right. We don’t know what a candidate means. I am getting to the point where I am forgetting what came from the show and what is just in my head. *sigh*

  79. 79.

    gwangung

    February 18, 2010 at 3:07 am

    Perhaps that just proves that Cthulu is a Republican. Just shambles around causing pain and destruction while remaining indifferent to the suffering of humanity.

    Of course Cthulu is a Republican; Glenn Beck’s a follower, remember?

  80. 80.

    Yutsano

    February 18, 2010 at 3:19 am

    @gwangung: Oh yeah…

    @asiangrrlMN: Hi hon. Not staying long. Have made cookies (amazingly enough the male ones turned out fantastic, the female ones not so much, not sure why) and in the morning baked butternut squash risotto. Yeah we’re potlucking at work why do you ask?

    Oh and I’m a little bit less upset about the promotion. The guy they gave it to is one of the two I decided I wouldn’t mind losing it to. He’s pretty awesome honestly, and one of their reasonings is linguistic skill (he’s bilingual Spanish), so at least they didn’t pick the fucktard I was worried about.

  81. 81.

    freelancer

    February 18, 2010 at 3:20 am

    @gwangung:

    Tell me you saw maddow address his talk radio antics.

    It was a sight to be seen.

    http://thegreatamericandesert.wordpress.com/2010/02/17/like-nailing-jello-to-a-wall/

    @Yutsano:

    The guy they gave it to is one of the two I decided I wouldn’t mind losing it to. He’s pretty awesome honestly, and one of their reasonings is linguistic skill (he’s bilingual Spanish), so at least they didn’t pick the fucktard I was worried about.

    I was wishing you luck with the promotion, and even though you didn’t get it, it looks like my wish came true. you have no idea how soul-crushing it is to work for someone who is utterly incompetant and makes every aspect of your job a truly living hell.

  82. 82.

    MTiffany

    February 18, 2010 at 4:16 am

    I’m not for scapegoating anyone unfairly..

    Is there a fair way to scapegoat someone?

  83. 83.

    Lupin

    February 18, 2010 at 4:36 am

    I have started to refer to Goldman-Sachs and their ilk as “financial terrorists”.

    I hope that meme catches on.

  84. 84.

    kay

    February 18, 2010 at 5:17 am

    What’s been surprising (and amusing) to me is how sensitive bankers are.

    This generation of robber barons aren’t even worthy villains. They’re sort of whiny and needy. They want to pillage and be loved by their victims.

    Purchasing a Senator isn’t going to satisfy them, any more than those ridiculous, bloated, ever-increasing pay packages have.

  85. 85.

    DougJ

    February 18, 2010 at 6:40 am

    @asiangrrlMN:

    DougJ, I wasn’t sure if you meant that your banker friends were part of the group whining about being victims. If so, I second Xantar in asking why are you friends with them?

    They have a lot of other good qualities. And nobody’s perfect.

  86. 86.

    bob h

    February 18, 2010 at 7:22 am

    Ford’s candidacy is an epiphenomenon of Wall Street’s retreat into a fantasy world.

    Interesting that we have this phenomenon in both Wall St. and in Washington, DC. Both are in the grip of solipsism.

  87. 87.

    DougJ

    February 18, 2010 at 7:38 am

    @Church Lady:

    I’m not sure this would bother them that much.

  88. 88.

    RSR

    February 18, 2010 at 7:44 am

    I have a brother-in-law whose only answer to the oversized bonuses is ‘that’s the way the system works.’ Then when you say, okay, let’s change the system going forward, he says it’s the basis for the whole economy.

    It’s really frustrating that so many are still letting themselves be ruled by morning-in-America-type propoganda decades later, and after so much evidence to the contrary.

  89. 89.

    bystander

    February 18, 2010 at 9:20 am

    These assholes really and truly believe that they are the engines of our economy…

    Please deliver a message to your bankster friends for me, DougJ. They could be financial wizards, although the empirical evidence argues against, but they don’t know jack about economics or the economy. They’re not living in an alternative universe, they’re Wylie Coyote having gone off the cliff but not yet looked down. There is nothing underneath their feet. Or, that economic engine that they think they’re priming with US taxpayer funds isn’t that of the US, but of some other country. In which case, they’re either too ignorant to see it, or too deceitful/ashamed to admit it.

  90. 90.

    Barry

    February 18, 2010 at 9:45 am

    Dougj: “These assholes really and truly believe that they are the engines of our economy, that they are being treated badly, and that if they hold their breath long enough, they’ll get their way. I’m not for scapegoating anyone unfairly, but they really are living in an alternate universe.”

    Replace ‘if they hold their breath long enough, they’ll get their way’ with ‘if they pay large enough bribes, they’ll get their way’, and their view of the universe is straight on.

  91. 91.

    mcd410x

    February 18, 2010 at 10:29 am

    @zhak:

    Start with Nixon’s pardon, work up through Reagan’s Iran Contra mess (& the subsequent pardons). And then move to Bush II and his VP proudly stating his fondness for torture.

    Much like you can’t have a country that tortures a little, you either have a country of laws or you do not.

    And, yes, the Democrats are complicit in this.

    (Hats off to Andrew Sullivan for his posts condemning torture yesterday: I’ll put up with whatever if he continues to clamor against that).

  92. 92.

    MagicPanda

    February 18, 2010 at 10:50 am

    @RSR: While I don’t agree with your brother in law, I can understand his position. It’s hard to know how that world works and it’s tempting to just throw your hands up.

    That having been said, I feel the opposite way about tax cuts. I’m just curious: is your brother in law in favor of cutting taxes for these guys?What I don’t get is the insistence of the GOP in giving the ultra rich more and more sweetheart tax deals.

  93. 93.

    Bob (Not B.o.B.)

    February 18, 2010 at 11:04 am

    The bankers who believe that they are and can be the engine of our economy are the same fools who have convinced the majority of our government and the general public that we can increase our standard of living without a manufacturing base and without exporting anything.

    This is a huge crock as is our trade policies.

  94. 94.

    Redshift

    February 18, 2010 at 11:21 am

    Is it scapegoating if it really is their fault?

  95. 95.

    Professor Fate

    February 18, 2010 at 11:33 am

    Being of a slightly paranoid vein sometimes, I can’t help speculating that the reason Wall Street has encouraged this buffoon to mount a primary challange is simply to ease the way for whoever the GOP runs.

    At the very least he’s going to force the incumbent to spend money to defeat him and there’s always the chance that the primary will be such a brusing affair that Senator Gilliband will be seriously weakened in the general.

    I don’t think they would seriously expect him to win the Primary just muddy the waters, but if somehow he did win, it would only be to be beaten like a gong by the GOP cannidate.

    it’s not like they don’t have the money to do this yes?

    Thus ends the paranoid minute for today.

  96. 96.

    Bob S

    February 18, 2010 at 12:43 pm

    “I was talking with a few bankster friends of mine a few weeks ago”
    Assuming you converse face to face and not over the phone, I can show you surface landmarks for the carotid or femoral arteries.

  97. 97.

    liberal

    February 18, 2010 at 1:14 pm

    I’m not for scapegoating anyone unfairly…

    I’m not, either. I just think having a few of them meet their end hanging from a lamppost would do a good deal towards fixing all these moral hazzard problems.

    :-)

  98. 98.

    liberal

    February 18, 2010 at 1:14 pm

    @Bob S:
    Heh.

  99. 99.

    liberal

    February 18, 2010 at 1:18 pm

    @MagicPanda:

    What I don’t get is the insistence of the GOP in giving the ultra rich more and more sweetheart tax deals.

    Partly it’s just plain old evil.

    Partly it’s the insistence that the rich are deservedly so, in place of the accurate characterization that the vast majority of the rich are just parasitic rent-collectors. But to understand that, they’d have to have enough intelligence and knowledge to understand economic rent.

  100. 100.

    liberal

    February 18, 2010 at 1:19 pm

    @Bob (Not B.o.B.):

    This is a huge crock as is our trade policies.

    There are a reasonable number of economists out there (e.g. Krugman) who understand the part about the banksters, but not very many who understand the part about a manufacturing base and trade policies (I’d wager Krugman doesn’t).

  101. 101.

    jake the snake

    February 18, 2010 at 1:21 pm

    Great little paraphrase of Nietzsche from Driftglass.

    Man is a rope stretched between the animal and the Chairman of Goldman Sachs.

    — F.W. Nietzsche, Chief Process Improvement Visioneer,
    “Overman, Overman & Zarathustra

    http://driftglass.blogspot.com/2010/02/two-commandments-ctd.html

  102. 102.

    liberal

    February 18, 2010 at 1:21 pm

    @DougJ:

    They have a lot of other good qualities. And nobody’s perfect.

    Given that the evidence that their compensation is almost pure economic rent (read: stolen from the rest of us), I’d say that’s a long way from perfect.

  103. 103.

    liberal

    February 18, 2010 at 1:27 pm

    @MagicPanda:

    d) it was all bullshit and our GDP growth for the last 10 years was probably somewhere close to 0%,

    I haven’t run the numbers, but I’ve been wondering the same thing.

    John Cole posted some numbers or a graph showing the fraction of GDP eaten up by the finance sector (or maybe FIRE more generally) has gone up a lot since about 1980. Main point was that this seems like an awfully large price for supposedly making the capital markets a little bit more efficient. (Of course with the Crash the latter part is a bad joke now.)

    But I’m also wondering about GDP since 1980.

  104. 104.

    liberal

    February 18, 2010 at 1:30 pm

    @darryl:

    Learn about how Commercial Paper works and get back with us.

    As one of the commenters above alluded, how well does it work w/o a government backstop when the shit comes crashing down?

  105. 105.

    liberal

    February 18, 2010 at 1:31 pm

    @jack-of-all-thumbs:

    If you cut us loose, I’m doomed!

    You could migrate north, like all the productive and/or reasonable would.

  106. 106.

    liberal

    February 18, 2010 at 1:38 pm

    @zhak:

    After the big crash in ‘29, the masters of the universe of their day knew they’d been wrong, had done wrong, and were capable of feeling guilt. Some committed suicide.

    I think it’s pretty reasonable to argue that if you had to pick a single individual as most responsible for the recent implosion, it would be Alan Greenspan.

    Anyone who wasn’t a pure sociopath would have offed himself by now, but I guess Greenspan is either a sociopath, or some kind of robot.

  107. 107.

    liberal

    February 18, 2010 at 1:41 pm

    @General Winfield Stuck:

    If I thought they would behave and not nuke some third world country for fun and start the Apocalypse, I’d say give ‘em their walking papers and be done with it.

    Uh, given their rather interesting views on the Apocalypse, I think we in the north had better retain control of all the nukes, thank you very much.

  108. 108.

    Xanthippas

    February 18, 2010 at 1:50 pm

    It’s stuff like this that makes you think the Bolsheviks kinda had a point.

  109. 109.

    EconWatcher

    February 18, 2010 at 3:22 pm

    @liberal:

    Greenspan is the only big player I have ever heard express what seemed to be genuine remorse. In a film clip I saw of him testifying before Congress, he looked and sounded like a broken man, and said something suggesting that his whole world view had been shaken byt the financial meltdown.

    That was a while ago, and he may have recovered since then from his moment of clarity and humanity. But I found it simultaneously pathetic and a bit moving at the time. And it’s certainly more than we’ve ever heard from the likes of Blankfein, Paulson, or George W. Bush.

  110. 110.

    Amanda

    February 18, 2010 at 4:50 pm

    “Southern voters are interested in solutions,” said Harold Ford Jr. in 2003. “They can spot a fake.” Perhaps this explains Ford’s subsequent decision to decamp from the South in search of a more gullible electorate.

    Ouch! Spot on…

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