The Politico, so for those of you avoiding clicks, you’ve been warned:
In the jittery days following Scott Brown’s Senate victory, Nancy Pelosi was eager to resurrect comprehensive health reform. But first, she had to get past longtime ally Rahm Emanuel, who was counseling President Barack Obama to consider a smaller, piecemeal approach.
During a mid-February conference call with top House Democrats, Pelosi made it clear she would accept nothing short of a big-bang health care push – dismissing the White House chief of staff as an “incrementalist.”
Pelosi even coined a term to describe Emanuel’s scaled-down approach: “Kiddie Care,” according to a person privy to the call.
Pelosi’s remark was more than just a diss. It sent a clear signal to House leadership that Pelosi wouldn’t compromise – and it coincided with Obama’s own decision to renew his push for an all-encompassing bill after weeks of confusion and discussion.
So… Do you think you’d be seeing puff pieces in Dick Cheney’s personal diary, the Politico, if the bill had failed? And puff pieces about Nancy Pelosi, of all people?
This is what I have never understood about those who voted yes the first time around but were then spooked on purely political matters (and not the actual content of the bill). The Republicans simply are going to oppose you no matter what (as Blanche Lincoln is learning, years of tongue-kisses to the GOP doesn’t amount to a bucket of warm spit), and if the bill passes, the entire narrative changes. For everyone. And the way the teabaggers are playing along, throwing out racial epithets and yelling faggot while screaming about taking matters into their own hands, they are providing the perfect frame for this comeback story.
As an aside, I think when people feel comfortable to talk on record, meaning years from now, I think it is going to turn out that the toughness of Nancy Pelosi and the patience of Obama are what saved his Presidency. She might turn out to be the best partner he has in all of DC, and will probably, depending on what happens, go down as one of the greatest speakers in recent memory. Every time she needs the votes, she gets them.
lamh31
WORD!
Sarah in Brooklyn
so so true. i am incredibly proud of Pelosi. she’s showing everyone how it’s done.
mistersnrub
Pelosi is the anti-Palin.
Ash Can
Take it to the bank — Republicans will be claiming responsibility for HCR back in their districts, just like they did with the stimulus. The only question is whether anyone — aside from Barack Obama and Rachel Maddow — will call them on it.
Joseph Nobles
LOL, the Google ad I’m getting is for a page purporting to describe how much Pelosi’s district hates the health care bill.
cleek
yeah, but
10 thousand – 100,000 – a milliontwo-hundred billion teabaggers marched on the Capitol yesterday. so, um, i think this means the GOP wins.Betty Cracker
I agree 100% about Pelosi. She doesn’t get nearly the credit she deserves for being tough and effective and for standing up fearlessly in the face of withering demonization by her opponents. It’s especially striking to me how many so-called feminists who trumpeted the historical nature of Hillary Clinton’s presidential run are mostly silent about Pelosi’s accomplishments. I guess they can’t get past her endorsement of Obama.
beltane
Pelsosi was also a great ally of Obama’s during the primary, although in a behind-the-scenes kind of way. I remember her saying that the convention was “her place” and that she refused to be bullied by Clinton operatives (remember Harold Ickes threatening to bring the nomination to the convention floor?)
Nancy Pelosi’s background as the daughter of an old FDR-era Dem has probably helped her out. She still has memories of the time when Democrats got things done.
General Egali Tarian Stuck
Can’t wait for Immigration Reform to queue up. A big ole giant monkey wrench in the Wingnut Wurlizter between the Country Club wing of the GOP and the tea bagging xenophobe/racist wing. It will be like watching a couple of rabid Badgers go at. Dems will have the usual purity wars over tactics and compromises, but the wingnuts will rip each others throats out. And the Evangelicals will likely mostly fall on the Country Club side, I think, though without cheap labor and extra profit motivating them. Though I may be wrong about that.
Obama and dems ought to start it dually with Finance Reform in May or June. Politico won’t know whether to shit or go blind on which side to suck up to.
General Egali Tarian Stuck
@Betty Cracker: Her opponents being republicans are not the only ones demonizing her. Some sizable chunks of the left internet have been just as guilty of that, and still are to a degree.
beltane
@General Egali Tarian Stuck: The best part of the immigration debate will be the plethora of signs written by illiterate teabaggers exhorting everyone to speak English or die.
Warren Terra
She doesn’t court attention like Newt or some other pols, maybe because she knows the abuse that gets heaped on visible strong women – but she Gets Things Done, and good things. I think she’s great.
lemma
TPM says Kaptur is a yes!
Uloborus
I just hope she earns her reputation. Come on, health care reform!
El Cid
Pelosi is simply one of the best political leaders this country has had in several decades. (Note that this does not imply ‘walk on water’ holy perfection. One of the best, i.e., a subset of ‘political leaders’.)
On the other hand, she clearly should be in jail ’cause she violated the LOGAN ACT and WENT TO SYRIA and also talked about SLAUGHTERING THE CONSTUSHUN with the DEMON PASS.
So there is that.
freelancer
Okay, the GOP meme for today is “Double accounting”. Jot it down.
beltane
@freelancer: Ha. That type of meme never resonates with the public. Lord knows the Democrats have tried it often enough over the years.
MattF
It’s just possible that the Rethugs have known about Pelosi’s toughness from the very beginning– that would explain the relentless, no-holds-barred effort to demonize her that’s been going on since she rose to a leadership position. They saw her coming, tried everything they could think of to stop her, and failed.
Cat Lady
I wonder what Nancy’s doing right now about Loretta Sanchez being AWOL? I wouldn’t want to be Loretta unless she’s a yes. That shit won’t fly.
SN
I think the President’s presidency was never in jeopardy in the real world (and I’m wrong about that, God help us all). And I think that the President’s fulfilling various campaign promises and actually seeking to solve a variety of crazy crazy problems the likes of which no President in U.S. history has every faced before and doing a pretty damn good job staying the bleeding of it is while remaining a sane, TOUGH AS FUCK, intelligent adult through Congressional clusterfuck after clusterfuck, and whinefest after whinefest is what has made his Presidency successful.
And it has been successful (both in achieving some short term goals and in achieving a hell of a lot of long term goals), it’s obvious provided you don’t pay attention to what the MSM says, which thankfully he and his peeps try not to do.
I agree Nancy has seemingly been a great ally, but honestly, I get frustrated when people try to undermine the President’s accomplishments by saying it was Rahm or Nancy that came/come up with the good ideas and how to implement them, when clearly while they are a factor, the President is the main force fighting tooth and nail (both behind the scenes and in front) to get his agenda achieved and to change the trajectory of the country.
Mike Kay
It isn’t over until
JaneTwiggy sings!We can still Kill the Bill — Keep calling!!
eemom
@General Egali Tarian Stuck:
Suspect there’ll be a lot more of that now that word’s leaking out that SHE’s running the show and not Raaaaaahm.
“OMG, you guys…..we’ve got the wrong demon! Quick, get Grover on the phone!”
sgwhiteinfla
I have a question. We all know that gridlock in the Senate has helped to keep a lot of legislation from moving forward but we also know that in the meantime Speaker Pelosi has still been holding votes and getting major legislation passed out of the House. I think I saw a number somewhere in the hundreds when it comes to how many bills the House has passed that are now waiting for the Senate to take up. And I mean these run the gamut of today’s big issues like banking reform and climate change. So my question is this, has any other Speaker of the House pushed through that many bills in this amount of time? I realize that she has a huge majority and that its not really all that remarkable to get bills through the House that never become law, still you gotta give her props for doing HER part, right?
lamh31
@Cat Lady:
Seriously, what’s up with this Lorretta Sanchez from CA? She’s MIA, and no one can reach her? WTF!
Seriously, TMZ can find Tiger in an Arizone rehab, and the Enquirer can takes photos of John Edwards meeting his baby mama in the wee hours of the morning, but NO ONE can find this woman. It’s ridiculous
If nothing is wrong, then why the hell is she hiding? Who the hell plays hookie from work at such an importan time like this.
Seriously, some of these elected officials are just children.
Maybe we SHOULD put TMZ on the case!
Anya
Nancy P. is great and I think Obama values their partnership. The only way Mrs P. will disappoint me is if Stupack and his stupid 6 are not punished.
SN
@SN:
2nd line should be “and IF I’m wrong about that, God help us all.”
YellowJournalism
@Ash Can:
Just saw Michelle Bachmann on Fox (I know.) talking with a Dem and Generic Blonde Anchorwoman about the bill. She said something along the lines of, “This is a Democrat (insert exasperated sigh by me) bill all the way. There is no Republican input..all behind closed doors…blah blah wah wah.” My first thought was that she won’t be saying all this when it’s shown that the bill is helping Americans in her district, just like she turned down the crazy about the Census once it was realized that she’d lose her job over people not filling it out.
The meme for now, though, is that this bill is going to be a disaster and that the Democrats get all the blame for any little hiccup that happens along the way, which there will be quite a few as the program starts out. And from what I heard today from Bachmann, the Republicans are going after the IRS angle, saying that the IRS is going to be sharing your information and the IRS is going to come pounding at your door monthly to make sure you’ve bought insurance. Right in time for tax season! I’m sure that kind of rhetoric is not going to cause problems for the poor guy on the IRS help line this year.
Mike Kay
If HCR passes, then it’s time to primary Pelosi!
GregB
It is funny that Pelosi brings out such animosity among the wingnuts. I mean she really does keep a low profile. God, Gingrich was on TV every two minutes with a new outrage or gimmick and Speaker Pelosi rarely makes the rounds on talks shows and such.
Ah the poor wingnuts they are stuck dealing with the fact that the most powerful man in America is an African-American and the second most powerful person is a woman.
No wonder they are going so batshit.
beltane
@MattF: They don’t put so much energy into demonizing Harry Reid. Why would they.
TR
This is what the death throes of movement conservatism looks like, courtesy of a first-hand report sent from the Capitol to Steve Benen:
El Cid
I don’t remember the various occasions, but I recall a few times over the past years when Pelosi would do something good and liberals would organize sending flowers or roses to Pelosi.
I think if HCR passes there should be something like this, just, maybe better coordinated so that staff and aides don’t have to deal with a floral nightmare in their offices.
El Cid
I hope our nation’s civil defense and public health services are working together to deploy adult diapers throughout our nation’s streets so as to protect our air and waters from the simultaneous involuntary release our TeaTardican citizens are about to experience this afternoon.
Citizen_X
Who does Pelosi think she is, Dick Cheney?
Oh, and Solomon Ortiz is a definite yes!
kansi
I agree it is great and to his everlasting credit that President Obama didn’t turn tail and run after the MA election, when many were saying time to move on from health care. (Is Politico saying one of those was Rahmbo?)
But Obama put the health care legislation squarely in the laps of the legislators, so it is imperative to give Nancy Pelosi credit for getting the heavy lifting done, in the face of such vehement and dishonest opposition.
What do you get when you cross a Pelosi freak with an Obamabot?
Alan
Isn’t Pelosi the demon communist/marxist that when her name is spoken by a rightwinger their face twists in disgust. Wouldn’t this piece be more accurately described as blame casting than puff? :)
JGabriel
John Cole @ Top:
I made the same point last night to a friend who was still skeptical that HCR would pass today. It’s about time she started getting some praise and credit for it.
.
beltane
@El Cid: A giant “Thank You Madame Speaker” is definitely in order.
YellowJournalism
Oh, no. This person was mistaken. The sign was an announcement of its author’s state of mind. The poor fellow just didn’t know where else to post it.
But, seriously, “I am stupid” above a person’s nameplate? Are these the type of people who think “kick me” signs are still a clever way of bullying people? Where’s the creativity? For example: “This man blows goats. I have proof.”
JGabriel
Joseph Nobles:
Click on it! Waste their money!
.
Ailuridae
@freelancer:
At least they have decided to drop the Doc Fix line.
lamh31
Republicans denounce racist and anti-gay slurs
By Matt DeLong
“Following reports yesterday that black and openly gay Democratic lawmakers were subjected to spitting and epithets from anti-health care reform protesters outside the Capitol, Republican leaders said Sunday that such incidents were “isolated” and “reprehensible.”
On CNN’s “State of the Union,” Rep. Mike Pence (R-Ind.) denounced the use of such slurs “in the strongest terms possible.”
House Minority Leader John Boehner (R-Ohio), said on NBC’s “Meet the Press” that the “isolated incidents” were “reprehensible.”
Later on the same program, Michael Steele, the Republican National Committee’s first black chairman, agreed that the incidents were “reprehensible,” and added, “we do not support that.”
“What you had out there yesterday were a handful of people who just got stupid and said some ignorant things,” Steele said.”
Kristine
@eemom:
I wonder how long it will take for the narrative to warp into “Obama is pussywhipped.” Because Republicans need to keep the Pelosi-as-bitch and Obama-as-Carter memes rolling.
It ain’t over until the votes are counted, but number me among those awed by Pelosi’s persistence, patience, and negotiating abilities. In her place, I would have been wandering the halls with a fire axe muttering “Red Rum Red Rum” back in August.
Sarah in Brooklyn
@El Cid: i love that idea!!! i’m in!
bemused
@TR:
I don’t imagine there have been any republicans denouncing this disgusting behavior which should tell anyone what they need to know about the R party’s Christian values or attitudes on basic human decency. They have none.
beltane
Breaking: We have 222 votes for HCR http://dailykos.com/story/2010/3/21/848550/-Breaking:-222-w-Stupak-8,-WH-exec-order-on-abortion-to-be-released-at-12:30-p.m.-EST
I will wait until they actually take the vote to celebrate, but I will say that I am extremely thrilled.
Cat Lady
Just? I don’t think that word means what he thinks it means.
Steele calling the base ignorant – popcorn, please!
jeffreyw
mikefromtexas:
If you are still around, many thanks, dude.
beltane
@bemused: With their suits off, the Republican party is just a collection of spare tires, love handles, and skidmarked underwear.
Snarky Pickles
@sgwhiteinfla:
Absolutely. Important to note that every piece of major legislation the Obama administration put forward has passed the House, including cap-and-trade. If all goes well today, this will be the second time HCR has passed the house.
bemused
@lamh31:
Ah, there have been a few short obligatory comments that won’t get much, if any, play in Faux world.
Belafon (formerly anonevent)
@El Cid: I believe the correct way would be a donation to a progressive candidate in her name.
JGabriel
@freelancer:
In the tradition of GOP projection, double-accounting is a practice they know well. It’s just double-standards with 11 columns.
.
JGabriel
MattF:
Bingo! Give the man a prize.
.
geg6
I thank the FSM for our black hipster president and ball-busting female Speaker. May he enfold them in his noodly appendages as they make history today. The black and female part drive their enemies to self-destruction and their tears and lamentations are sweet to behold.
Snarky Pickles
@beltane:
Here’s the Kos link.
Madeline
@El Cid: Yes, yes, yes. I’ve been looking for some organized effort like this – Pelosi has been magnificent and we need to do something for her.
Corner Stone
@El Cid:
My guess is she’d prefer something like a donation to her favorite charity, or maybe Fisher House, etc in her name or something similar.
Just throwing spitballs out there.
ETA – or what Belafon @ 51 suggested. My thought is NP would want something done that could help others.
Ailuridae
@beltane:
Wow. I just started crying.
Veteran, Great War of Yankee Aggression
Its amazing how courage and self confidence can change the momentum and narrative.
The upside of the Village idiocy and culture of courtiership is that a few wins by the Dems may inspire a meme of a “center-left” nation.
By the way- I called my congresswoman Loretta Sanchez twice- no answer. Either no one is there or they turned the phones off. But I will try again just for kicks.
Snarky Pickles
I caught a glimpse of Boehner on the TeeVee machine this morning, and it looked like the color had drained from his face. Which is saying something.
Sentient Puddle
@freelancer:
In that case, a quick primer for everyone. When your GOP relative tries to throw this meme at you, you can drop a train on ’em.
Rhoda
I love Nancy, but that title rubbed me the wrong way. Especially since, when you read it, there’s a paragraph saying Obama was inclined to go big bang but w/Rahm opposing it he listened and thought through the arguments on the other side and then went with Nancy and his own inclinations.
I love Pelosi and think she was a huge part of why we are here; but the President didn’t just throw this in her lap. He had to change her mind to get her to go first, she’s dropped the deem and pass that the WH wasn’t sold on, and he created a lot of this political space w/that health care meeting that everyone dissed but ended up playing a huge role in this whole thing.
But leaving all that aside; it’s awesome to think that we’re getting a foundation for health care laid w/this reform. And this win cues up momentum for doing financial reform on a party line basis. Getting a win like this means a lot.
SiubhanDuinne
I’m going to call Pelosi’s office, just to say thanks. Hoyer’s too, why not?
Snarky Pickles
@lamh31:
Good. Although I suspect in each case it was in response to a question, rather than volunteered.
beltane
@Snarky Pickles: That is saying something. I always thought he had a whole-body orange tattoo.
RedKitten
@geg6:
Hear, hear!
Joey Maloney
@Kristine:
At Bart Stupak’s office door. “Heeeeeeeeeeeere’s NANCY!”
Veteran, Great War of Yankee Aggression
O/T…a tweet from Glenn Greenwald:
“John Hinderaker: The most overrated man of the 20th Century was Gandhi. Nelson Mandela is a runner-up.”
Help me out BJers- isn’t Hinderocket the guy who wrote something about GWB being a genius unappreciated in his time? does anyone have that quote?
Ash Can
@lamh31: I foresee GOP leaders (other than Rush Limbaugh) having to make these CYA non-apologies for their teabagger wing early and often as the national political spotlight shifts from HCR to other big issues, especially immigration reform. I hope they enjoy trotting out the “reprehensible” and “isolated incidents” tropes this morning, because they’re going to be doing a lot of it in the future. Which begs the question of how many “isolated” incidents have to take place before the various reporters and pundits begin questioning how “isolated” they really are.
Snarky Pickles
@beltane:
That’s a widespread misconception. I do understand, however, that in his younger days he was a stunt double for Oompa-loompa No. 6 in Willy Wonka.
JenJen
@Veteran, Great War of Yankee Aggression: Here ya go, July 28, 2005:
Whole thing’s good for a laugh. For what it’s worth, Assrocket insists the whole thing was tongue-in-cheek.
elmo
STOP IT. Stop it stop it stop it. Jesus! Aren’t any of you people even a little bit supersitious?
We don’t have the votes yet. So you can’t say that she gets the votes when she needs them, because we haven’t had the vote yet.
You are going to tempt the wrath of the whatever from high atop the thing, so KNOCK IT OFF.
SiubhanDuinne
@SN:
All this, and he does it with great good humour. I love the way he breaks into a huge instant smile whenever something amuses him, or he’s just really happy about something. I see that smile and I just melt, every time, like a cheap plastic cereal dish in a microwave oven.
Anya
The Daily Beast is an example of the changing narrative. For months they had post after post talking about the end of Dems and Obama’s presidency. Now all they talk about is brilliant strategy and strategists who brought us here.
I like this article by Peter Beinart. He is arguing that for years whenever Democrats were faced with defeat they retreated to being centrists, Beinart, argues that has ended. According to him, after the election of Scott Brown, the president sided with the dems who were arguing fight for our principles against those who were saying DLC all the way. Here’s the link (hope it works).
http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2010-03-15/the-decision-that-changed-the-dems/
coelacanth
@beltane: RAmen.
Here’s a parallel: Pelosi and LBJ–both children of politicians.
Ming
I’m afraid to believe it can really pass. It sounds like chances are really good, but still. (yes, I’ve made my calls/written.)
At the same time… man! if we pull this off, what will the young Obots think?! will they think they can do *whatever the fuck* they put their mind to? elect a black man with the middle name Hussein to POTUS? pass legislation that no one’s been able to pass for a century? shape history? my experience of so much of national politics has been about the other side winning.
will this generation really believe Yes, we can?
fucking crazy.
Snarky Pickles
@beltane:
The Prsident, at last year’s WH Correspondents’ dinner:
bemused
@JenJen:
That quote ranks as one of my all time favorites in idiotic wingnuttery. Yeah, right, it was ‘tongue in cheek’. I’m sure he really meant it but had to feign a little to cover his adulation.
You could substitute Sarah Palin for Bush in that quote & her groupies would yell, hell yes.
Bill H
Are you going to be so happy about that when she is pushing a bill you don’t like?
You still going to be happy that we have a United States of Nancy Pelosi?
Anya
@Anya: I don’t know where the rest of that post went but the two blockquotes are not from the same link.
Citizen_X
@Bill H: Yes, I’m glad you’re recognizing that Nancy Pelosi is becoming the Supreme Nazi Soviet Muslim Czar of Amerika.
Oh, if only there were some part of the government that could stand up to her, one that represented all of the people equally, one where the people’s representatives were elected every, say, two years or so! Then Nancy Pelosi would truly be faced with the will of the people, and would not be able to shove her big fat strap-on agenda down America’s throat.
gwangung
I think some of this is from the over-emphasis on the daily news cycle. Too many people think that’s the only game in town.
That’s not shared by Obama and probably Pelosi.
JenJen
@Citizen_X: FTW.
JGabriel
@El Cid:
On the other hand, it would make a good “movie moment” for the whole Capitol Building to be overwhelmed and festooned with floral arrangements thanking Pelosi and the House Reps for health insurance reform.
Would kinda suck for people with hay fever, like me, though.
.
Joel
These clowns just want to roll with the winners.
I say we go all Brian Scalabrine on them.
SiubhanDuinne
I’m a Pelobot.
Brandon
As for Reid, you can’t put lipstick on a pig. I cannot conceive the idea of anyone fluffing him because getting the balls to move towards reconcilliation to pass the same bill that was passed under normal order is not leadership. He’s a failed leader presiding over a failed institution.
Brandon
@Anya:
Holy moly. Peter Beinart is on board with the new narrative? Can’t get more villager CW than that.
ksmiami
Hee Hee – I feel so vindicated that I recognized the tea bagging morons for what they were way back before they got the attention of the MSM… And I knew that they would seriously overplay their hand and start scaring the normal people. All you have to do to discredit these jerks is give them face time, their bad grammar and hate will take care of the rest. And now onward to sanity.
slag
This one seems like a gimme.
She’s definitely getting a thank-you gift if this thing passes.
Glen Tomkins
The crux of the matter
“…if the bill passes, the entire narrative changes.”
You don’t have to be a public option die-hard to oppose this plan they’re voting on today, and from the Left. In fact, I think that the public option suffers from the same fundamental problem as the exchange in this plan we have facing a vote today. Neither gets us social insurance for health care insitutionalized in ways that, like Social Security and Medicare, actually do change the entire narrative, actually do entrench reform in politically unassailable form.
If we were doing Medicare for All, premiums could start being collected by adjusting the payroll deductions higher, and the first check paying a claim could be cut the afternoon the thing is signed into law. Medicare already has a collections sytem in place, it already has a nationwide network of providers in place, and it already has an established regulatory regime covering both. Both the public option and these exchanges would need many years to set up their collection systems and provider networks, and the regulations to govern it all, before they even begin to change the narrative for anyone. A lot can happen politically to strangle either in its cradle between now and those many years in the future before either plan could even begin to entrench itself politically.
It gets even worse. If it were just a matter of delay, but there was a clear benefit for a clear majority of the electorate at the end of the rainbow, well, maybe you coud beleive that a coalition could be held together to keep the reform plan from being strangled in its cradle. But neither plan does what social insurance plans, like Medicare or SocSec, do, and give all the voters one common interest, get them all into the same boat. What this exchange scheme will do is to set the interests of people with pre-existing conditions agaist those of the majority who have no pre-existings. The plan has the pious intention of requiring the private insurers to not discriminate, to offer insurance to all at the same price, but, after we’ve put in a mandate, and chained the healthy majority to the oars of the industry and its products, how are we going to muster the political will to force this majority of the working poor to pay higher premiums so that the insurers can steal from them to help pay the higher costs for people who have pre-existings? People are used to paying lower premiums for car insurance if their demographics and driving record suggests htey’re better risks. We’re going to keep them form deriving the same advantages on their health insurance? Really? Maybe we’ll square that circle with ever more massive subsidies for people with pre-existings, and people otherwise unable to pay their own freight. Because, you know, welfare programs, where the majority pay higher taxes so some minority can enjoy a benefit, are so popular, so politically unassailable, that a subsidies regime will be politically invulnerable. Right.
I’m not against the public option and this exchange scheme because I will only accept the perfect, and reject with scorn half-way solutions that only get us half-way to the goal, that have to be built on in the future to get us the whole way there. I’m against these schemes precisely because neither will move us, at all, even part way in the right direction, or make future progress anything but harder than it is now. Neither plan changes the narrative. Neither gets us towards the social insurance model for health care that is not only the right policy, but is also the only defensible politics for it.
Island in Alabama
@Betty Cracker:
Pelosi may not get enough credit from some quarters, but judging by how much she is feared and hated/demonized by my wing nut neighbors, I think there’s plenty of ‘credit’ given on the other side, even if it’s largely expressed using NSFW language