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You are here: Home / Reading the Tea Leaves

Reading the Tea Leaves

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Commenter Basilisc pointed out this Bloomberg story about one of their polls. Teabaggers think the government is more socialist than capitalist (at 90% margins), but 70% of them want the government to foster job creation.

“The ideas that find nearly universal agreement among Tea Party supporters are rather vague,” says J. Ann Selzer, the pollster who created the survey. “You would think any idea that involves more government action would be anathema, and that is just not the case.”

Here’s one thing that isn’t vague: they believe batshit crazy stuff about Obama.

* 57 percent of Republicans (32 percent overall) believe that Obama is a Muslim
* 45 percent of Republicans (25 percent overall) agree with the Birthers in their belief that Obama was “not born in the United States and so is not eligible to be president”
* 38 percent of Republicans (20 percent overall) say that Obama is “doing many of the things that Hitler did”
* Scariest of all, 24 percent of Republicans (14 percent overall) say that Obama “may be the Antichrist.”

That’s from a Harris poll that didn’t segment out the teabaggers, but they did publish crosstabs on education levels.

These replies are also strongly correlated with education. The less education people have had the more likely they are to believe all of these statements.

Update: Sorry, that Harris poll is an online poll. Take it with a huge grain of salt. Thanks, demo woman.

Reader Interactions

41Comments

  1. 1.

    DougJ

    Did you see the Kos piece on Rubio supporters versus Crist supporters (among Republicans) along these lines?

    Fascinating.

  2. 2.

    Some Guy

    Too bad they didn’t poll for levels of fear and racism too. My guess is those correlate pretty well with these numbers.

  3. 3.

    pharniel

    that’s been floating around a bit…basically it totally confirms what I already knew.

  4. 4.

    4tehlulz

    I’m starting to think that the Teabaggers oppose only so she’ll ism that cannot be converted directly to cash.

  5. 5.

    beltane

    There is not much point in analyzing the “beliefs” of an emotion-based movement filled with people who lack even the most basic understanding of the world around them. Hatred is a feeling, not a political philosophy, and while these people may regurgitate weirdly juxtaposed bits of Fox propaganda, they are nothing more than the howling id of the racist portion of white America.

    This is a good thing. If the teabaggers had a coherent ideology like the Nazis or Italian Fascists I’d be a lot more worried. However, angry mobs of stupid people are still capable of hurting a lot of people so this is not much of a consolation.

  7. 7.

    The Grand Panjandrum

    Most Americans have lost the ability to think critically. What could possibly go wrong in a political party that is rife with people who believe that working hard and graduating from top notch universities and colleges is a red flag warning that the person is an elitist (especially if that person is not a conservative!)? But it really isn’t just GOP’ers, I would say a substantial percentage of our fellow citizens are just plain ignorant. Most of that ignorance stems from a lack of curiosity and a single minded desire to “live the American Dream.” People will work their asses off to buy big screen TV’s and new cars, but very few will do the hard work of learning about our political system and how it works. They have that right. Unfortunately, this uninformed electorate results in mouth-breathing atavists who have little ability to reason and debate issues of policy. Death panels! Socia1ism! Muslims!

  8. 8.

    beltane

    @Some Guy: Those would be the most important numbers. Asking people who can’t define socialism about their opinions regarding socialism seems like a singularly pointless effort.

  9. 9.

    El Cid

    .

    These replies are also strongly correlated with education. The less education people have had the more likely they are to believe all of these statements.

    All the more reason for the Texan school board to make sure that what seditious education there is teaches nothing related to actual reality.

  10. 10.

    Robin G

    Useful idiots.

    @The Grand Panjandrum:

    Most Americans have lost the ability to think critically.

    Hey, let’s be fair here. The total nutjobs are still hovering around the 27% mark overall. Two-thirds to three-quarters of the country are able, to greater or lesser degrees, to set aside the bullshit — this, in spite of a national news media that is at best lazy and at worse complicit in spreading the Republican lies. When you consider how hard it is for a lot of Americans to get access to the truth (unless they’re wonks like us, and let’s face it, most aren’t), the fact that we’re doing as well as we are is pretty impressive.

    People will work their asses off to buy big screen TV’s and new cars, but very few will do the hard work of learning about our political system and how it works.

    And that’s just unfair. People are working their asses off to keep their heads above the water right now. Don’t blame someone who’s trying to feed their kids by working two jobs for not having the time or energy to read the blogosphere, which is one of the few places they can get in-depth coverage. Most of them don’t even have time to watch the Nightly News.

  11. 11.

    madmommy

    When, exactly, did getting a good education become a bad thing? It is one thing to know what you don’t know and make some effort to learn. It is something else entirely to be willfully, pridefully ignorant and disdainful of anyone who isn’t.

  12. 12.

    geg6

    @The Grand Panjandrum:

    And whatever you do, don’t blame the MSM for any of that ignorance. They have no choice but to submit to rightwing propaganda and vapid commentary about how both parties are exactly the same and that the Teabaggers are the very middle of the political spectrum, doncha know.

  13. 13.

    debit

    @madmommy: I think it boils down to, “How dare you be smarter than me?!” Bush endeared himself to them (his real base) because he was so clearly (and reassuringly) stupid.

  14. 14.

    R-Jud

    @madmommy:

    When, exactly, did getting a good education become a bad thing? It is one thing to know what you don’t know and make some effort to learn. It is something else entirely to be willfully, pridefully ignorant and disdainful of anyone who isn’t.

    I can’t point to specific links right now, but I can think of novels and stories I’ve read from every time period back to the 1700s, and there’s always a character somewhere who’s suspicious of and hostile towards educated people. Flannery O’Connor stories, for instance. I would explain this better, but the allergy medicine stole my brain. Anyway, like a lot of things nowadays, it’s not a new sentiment, just a louder one.

  15. 15.

    mistermix

    @DougJ: No, was it recent? I remember him doing that in the past. BTW, Harris said it’s doing another teabagger poll. Should be interesting.

  16. 16.

    demo woman

    The Harris Poll was an online poll. I’m not disputing the numbers, I’m just not sure how the results of online polls compare to polls conducted by phone.

  17. 17.

    electricgrendel

    Yes. Because completely incomprehensible political values haven’t been a mainstay of the American electorate for years now.

  19. 19.

    demo woman

    In honor of the poll.. I think that John should add “Did President Obama take your gun away today?”to his rotating list.

  20. 20.

    John PM

    I am most amused by the 24 percent who think that Obama is the Antichrist. I was unaware that one of the plagues in the Book of Revelation was giving more Americans health care. I guess that comes before the plague of boils, which would make sense in a way.

  21. 21.

    Steeplejack

    __

    Sorry, that Harris poll is an online poll. Take it with a huge grain of salt. It is worthless.

    Fix’d. Teenagers Bored day traders spoofing from the basement.

  22. 22.

    madmommy

    @debit:

    Who in their right mind would prefer a President who is as intelligent as the average teabagger? Yeah, yeah, I know.

    @R-Jud:

    Nothing new under the sun, but still extremely depressing. Especially since I’m trying to encourage education with the kids. The Texas School Board is certainly not helping matters one little bit!

  24. 24.

    John PM

    @Steeplejack:

    Even though this is an on-line poll, it doesn’t mean that all of the answers are spoofs, and anyway the craziness of Republicans still presents itself in other ways; take it away, Michelle Bachman:

    Bachmann also said that her controversial remarks of more than a year ago – in which she called Obama “anti-American” and suggested members of Congress be investigated for “anti-American activities” – have proven prophetic.

    “I said I had very serious concerns that Barack Obama had anti-American views,” she said. “And now I look like Nostradamus.”

    This is from the Politico, but I am not going to link to it. Backman was speaking at an anti-abortion fundraiser along with Time Pawlenty.

  25. 25.

    boognish

    @John PM: And T-Paw gave his tacit agreement with her.

    Pawlenty and Bachmann were very complimentary of each other – Pawlenty called Bachmann “one of the finest leaders in this country,” while she said he was a “wowzer” of a speaker.

    Also from Politico so forgive the lack of linky-goodness – but it goes to show that the GOP understands that wingnuts are now their base, and any 2012 hopefull needs to appeal to that base early and often.

  26. 26.

    Svensker

    This morning on FOX Steve Doocey was inteviewing some Tea Party idiot, from Arizona I think. She was going on about how horrible HCR was, of course, and Doocey let her talk. Then she said that Obama was a communist. Doocey looked startled and said, “Oh, come on, he’s not a communist.” She fired back, “Glenn Beck is my hero and that’s where I heard it.” Doocey cut her right off.

    Reap what you sow, bitchez.

  29. 29.

    Daddy-O

    It may be an online poll, but for an online poll, it mirrors reality better than any other I’ve ever seen.

    Really, that’s strange, and it still has to be taken with a huge grain of salt, considering the mere multiple voting and freeping possibilities.

    But Kos got nearly the same outrageous numbers. As have other pollsters. They really are insane, which is why John Cole is no longer a Republican.

    We’re all glad for THAT!

  30. 30.

    Daddy-O

    #5 beltane:

    ” Hatred is a feeling, not a political philosophy…”

    Exactly. I agree with your points entirely, including the fact that this isn’t as dangerous a situation as it COULD be, but it’s bad.

  31. 31.

    Bob L

    Bachmann @

    “I said I had very serious concerns that Barack Obama had anti-American views,” she said. “And now I look like Nostradamus.”

    Nostradamus was full of shit too

    Doesn’t she have a subsidy check from her fake farm to cash?

  32. 32.

    Svensker

    @Bob L:

    “And now I look like Nostradamus.” Nostradamus was full of shit too

    I think she was talking about how Nostradamus had those crazy EYES, just like her own, if you KWIM.

  33. 33.

    Lurking Canadian

    Does the wording of the poll rule out the possibility that “government action to create jobs” means “cut taxes”?

    If not, then there is no inherent contradiction.

  34. 34.

    Splitting Image

    I can’t point to specific links right now, but I can think of novels and stories I’ve read from every time period back to the 1700s, and there’s always a character somewhere who’s suspicious of and hostile towards educated people. Flannery O’Connor stories, for instance. I would explain this better, but the allergy medicine stole my brain. Anyway, like a lot of things nowadays, it’s not a new sentiment, just a louder one.

    Further back than that even. Try reading some of Aristophanes’ plays, if you haven’t already. See The Clouds (417 BC), The Wasps (423 BC), and The Acharnians (425 BC), for example. Aristophanes lived in a time when a core group of Athenians were profiting from the war with Sparta and ginning up hatred among the less-educated to keep it going. It says a lot about humanity that someone like him could come back to life after 2,400 years and get back to work without missing a beat.

  35. 35.

    The Raven

    I’m going to rerun something from my own blog, because it’s relevant, and I don’t want to write it again. Converse’s seminal paper on voting behavior, “The nature of belief systems in mass publics,” this is based on is now nearly 50 years and has stood the test of time. I’ve cited it at the end of this comment, but unless you have access to academic databases, you are going to have to go to a library to read it.

    […] Converse found that that was a minority, 11.5% of subjects, 15.5% of voters. The largest plurality of people, 42% of subjects, 45% of voters, in Converse’s five-ranked classification system took positions based on understandings of group allegiances. So, for instance, Converse found a “socialist” who supported privatization of utilities. For the rest, people would answer poll questions, but their answers didn’t correlate, so you’d get, for instance, people who (post-Converse example) support Medicare but are opposed to government-financed health care. The classic and horrible example, of course, is what we are seeing writ large in California, where people have voted for government programs and against the taxes that fund them. Many votes and positions are apparently made and taken at random, and change when the voters are consulted some time later.

    Philip E Converse, “The nature of belief systems in mass publics,” reprinted in Critical Review: A Journal of Politics and Society 18, no. 1 (2006): 1 – 74. The whole journal is a discussion of the paper and it ends with some afterthoughts from Converse himself. I don’t think any of the commentary in that journal is of the stature of Converse’s own work, but it is nonetheless worth at least skimming.

  36. 36.

    Steeplejack

    @John PM:

    Of course not all the answers are spoofs; it just means the poll is unreliable as far as saying anything meaningful about anything.

  37. 37.

    CalD

    These replies are also strongly correlated with education. The less education people have had the more likely they are to believe all of these statements.

    It was presumed by many as far back as Thomas Jefferson’s time that an educated electorate is essential to a functional democracy.

  38. 38.

    Maude

    @Steeplejack:
    Which means that it will be quoted as God’s own truth by the MSM.
    An online poll is not reliable. One can take it 10 times, for instance.
    An online version of clap louder.

  39. 39.

    S. cerevisiae

    It’s so pathetic to watch T-Paw court the teabaggers. It’s like “hey, look at me! I’m just as crazy-really! Anyone? Hello?”

    Bland Midwestern crazy just won’t cut it compared to Sarah Starbursts and Hyuckabee.

  40. 40.

    R. Johnston

    This is not an online poll in the sense that requires an edit or retraction. While there are issues with Harris Interactive’s methodology, they don’t just slap a poll on a website and take all spammers. They’ve got a prescreened list of presumably some hundreds of thousands of people who agree to be polled by them, the poll is conducted among some subset of the prescreened sample, and the mechanics of the poll are conducted online, but the poll is perfectly secure and can’t be spammed or infiltrated. Only the people selected to be polled can answer.

  41. 41.

    bob h

    I thought Socialism was government ownership of the means of production and distribution of goods, which in the Teabagger mind applies to temporary government stakes in a handful of banks and auto companies amounting to probably 1% of the economy.

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