Just got back from the West Virginia-Kentucky game at the Carrier Dome. A couple unrelated things that might interesting you…
The Obama administration made 15 recess appointments including Craig Becker. Here’s something interesting:
To put this in perspective, at this time in 2002, President Bush had only 5 nominees pending on the floor. By contrast, President Obama has 77 nominees currently pending on the floor, 58 of whom have been waiting for over two weeks and 44 of those have been waiting more than a month. And cloture has been filed 16 times on Obama nominees, nine of whom were subsequently confirmed with 60 or more votes or by voice vote. Cloture was not filed on a single Bush nominee in his first year. And despite facing significantly less opposition, President Bush had already made 10 recess appointments by this point in his presidency and he made another five over the spring recess.
Matt Taibbi has a good take on the various excuses the Catholic Church has made about the sex scandals:
Anyone who’s interested in losing his lunch should read the above-mentioned blog entry by New York archbishop Timothy Dolan in defense of Pope Benedict; the archbishop’s incredibly pompous and self-pitying rant is some of the most depraved horseshit I’ve ever seen on the internet, which is saying a lot.
One expects professional slimeballs like the public relations department of Goldman Sachs to pull out the “Well, we weren’t the only thieves!” argument when accused of financial malfeasance. But I almost couldn’t believe my eyes as I read through Dolan’s retort and it dawned on me that he was actually going to use the “We weren’t the only child molesters!” excuse. Dolan must have very roomy man-robes, because it seems to me you’d need a set of balls like two moons of Jupiter to say such a thing in public and expect it to fly.
Bnut
There is no other answer for me: If the the Catholic Church wants forgiveness they have to throw every single priest who EVER did anything to a child gets tossed out and excommunicated. This will never happen. The Church will never be forgiven.
Yutsano
Well since I was taunting BoB about cooking earlier, I suppose I should show the results of my labours:
The bird out of the oven:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/44164793@N05/4468263825/
And the final results on the plate:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/44164793@N05/4468263839/in/photostream/
Yeah I’m scarfing. :)
the Reverend boy
While all of this is bad news for the Italian Church, I cannot help but think that she will come through relatively unscathed. This institution has not endured 2,000 years (give or take a century) to be undermined by this.
Libby
To add more context to the recess appointment thing, from the WHPC’s unofficial stats geek, Mark Knoller tells us
Bush(43) made about 140 recess appointments over 8 years, Clinton 140; Bush(41) 77; Reagan 243.
And I’m out. Good evening to you night owls.
freelancer
Good news/Bad news
Picked up an Australian Cabernet Sauvignon.
Yeah, won’t do that again, it tastes like saccharine piss laden with a hint of apple juice.
Avoid.
and the Bad News:
FX’s Rescue Me is now available on Netflix Instant. There goes my leisure time.
mcc
Three posts on Slacktivist in a semi-series that I’ve been wanting to draw attention to over here for awhile but never found a good opportunity. I think I’ll just link them.
1. Family Feud Politics
2. VIII
3. Lying your way to crazy
#2 is the best but these are all worth reading and some of the clearest analysis I’ve seen of how our political system works right now.
Xenos
@Yutsano: I like chicken pie!
Fresh zucchini? God I’m jealous!
MikeJ
Two popes, one cup.
freelancer
@MikeJ:
My relatives, parents included, would still be defending them, were that the case.
jl
I cannot get outraged over what those old farts say.
I think the Catholic clerical celibacy thing is turning into a disaster (not that it has not been for the 1600 to 1000 years, depending on who you believe re the traditions), but it is getting worse. The wikipedia article says that clerical celibacy is not an official dogma, so why don’t they get rid of it?
I read once that they almost did, but were afraid of a revolt from older priests who would have felt deeply cheated and betrayed, but don’t know if that is true.
I think the olde timey Bad Popes had more fun and were more up front about it. Orgies with full-on grown up babes and willing men. Booze. Party hard till dawn. I am sure some stuff went on that would seem very bad from our point of view (pedophilia, etc). But all in all, their coping mechanisms seemed healthier back then, mutatis mutandis, or whatever Buckley used to say, to adjust for changed mores.
Yutsano
@Xenos: I’m gonna make one up tonight and stick it in the fridge so my brother can have dinner tomorrow. Poor soul can’t cook worth a damn. Plus if all goes well I’ll get a scoop of it when I run home for lunch.
jl
@freelancer:
“saccharine piss laden with a hint of apple juice”
I will take that as ‘wine talk’ with special meanings, and venture that I would probably like it.
MikeJ
Obama tougher than the Rooskies.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/
Roger Moore
Tabi is shrill:
It’s about damn time somebody started seriously talking about treating the Catholic child rape scandal as a RICO case. They’re systematically committing crimes and engaging in witness tampering and obstruction of justice to cover it up. Somebody needs to step up and dismantle the whole organization.
SiubhanDuinne
Frank Rich’s column in the Sunday NYTimes is (as usual) excellent, and makes a very interesting companion piece to Charles Blow’s Saturday column which was discussed in several threads earlier in the day.
For my sins, I also read MoDo’s offering (I think she called it something like “The Pope and the Nope”). I have to agree with her conclusions, although getting there is painful what with all the self-conscious wordplay, the puns and 2×4 parallel constructions and her usual over-reliance on apt alliteration’s artful aid. But if you can put up with her stylistic tics, she does make a couple of good points (not original, but good) about ordination of women, allowing clergy to marry, etc.
But the Rich piece is a keeper.
Amanda in the South Bay
I just finished finals last week, and have lots of stuff planned for spring break next week. Woot!
I’m feeling pretty good about my finals, which is good, since I was homeless for about two weeks, forcibly hospitalized for a night, and thought I’d end up failing my classes.
Survival is a *nice* feeling.
arguingwithsignposts
@MikeJ: Let’s hope so.
DFS
@jl: About 1000 years, plus-minus, it’s been enforced more stringently in different places and different times all over history.
Used to be pretty lax, though. Once saw a hilarious record of a religious court case from I think Italy in the early 11th century, where a bishop was in the dock on account of he was openly carrying on with the bishop of another diocese. The beef wasn’t about the gay love affair, though, the church’s only problem was his influence over his lover’s turf might have constituted pluralism.
michael
Fantastic. I was worried DougJ was going to let a few hours go by without a “Catholic priest are all bad” post. Phew! Most of you here may identify as Democrats but when it comes to Christians in general you all can sure hate like Republicans. (Note: not that Catholic Church in this case doesn’t deserve it but it’s becoming somewhat monotonous.) I mean it’s not like a South Korean ship sunk under mysterious circumstances or anything.
Jimmm
Taibbi can be a douche, but good gravy can he turn a phrase.
Jennifer
They should let Priests marry.
jl
@DFS: You are right that the official edicts that defrocked priests and ordered restorations and dissolutions of marriages, etc, started around 1000, but I’ve read that the unofficial customs and doctrines and pressures on clergy from the some Church pooh-bahs started sometime in the 300s to 400s.
In any case, is the Wikipedia article correct that this celibacy nonsense is not dogma, and that theologically, it would be no biggy if the Church just said the heck with it?
If that is true, then the Church might not be a criminal enterprise, but it sure has become an ossified fossil, following tradition for no other reason than the old fossils who run it are afraid to do anything else. Which is not a feasible principle of operation in a changing world, IMHO.
Actually, clerical celibacy has not been a feasible principle of operation, ever, IMHO, but I am just a degenerate modern liberal, so whadda I know?
gnomedad
@mcc:
That metaphor totally rocks. Thanks for the pointer.
freelancer
@SiubhanDuinne:
Agreed, however, he doesn’t go far enough. Maybe it’s because he works for the LIBERAL NYT, but he soft pedalled the ignorance, and the racism at the heart of the teabagger movement.
Maybe it’s because I have reached an impasse, after 2-3 years of their nonsense, but I am beyond empathy, understanding, and putting myself in their shoes, but I will no longer shy away from calling a spade a spade. Just because they deny why they hate, doesn’t mean they don’t, and their rationale is any less disgusting.
They are ignorant, and should be ashamed.
tammanycall
Check out Kevin Drum’s post on President Obama’s recess appointments to the NLRB.
Yutsano
@tammanycall: The
tearssqueals from the Right over this fact will be delicious.MikeJ
@tammanycall: I didn’t know all the deets on that nomination, like the fact that he had people from both party who were held and he only appointed the Dems.
I am an Obot for life.
Redshift
@DFS: I may be mistaken, but if I recall correctly, the interesting thing about clerical celibacy is that the main reason it was instituted was to eliminate the problem of inheritance (bishops trying to pass on their sees and such) at a time when many churchmen were essentially nobles, controlling territory and wealth. Whereas now, in an age when everyone who is publicly devout seems to be obsessed with Teh Sex, it’s presumed that the reason is that it makes them morally superior to us sinners.
Comrade Kevin
A-fucking-men to that Taibbi article.
Martin
@MikeJ: Tougher than the Israelis too, apparently. I don’t think the GOP has any freaking idea what they’re up against.
gbear
If the catholic church were to allow priests to get married, their opposition to divorce would wither within three months.
Calming Influence
Louis CK learns about the Catholic Church. Who could have guessed?
gbear
NANCY SMASH! says ‘Thanks for the roses!’
Roger Moore
@Redshift:
I think that function- preventing important clerical positions from becoming hereditary- is an important one, and one that hasn’t disappeared. If you think the Catholic Church is corrupt now, imagine how corrupt it would be if the most important positions were hereditary. The corruption would probably be more financial than protecting child rapists, but it would be much more extensive and pervasive.
The Eastern Orthodox churches have an interesting twist on this idea. They allow married priests, but not in the highest levels of the Church. Priests wind up being faced with a choice. If they’re satisfied with being a parish priest for their whole life, they can get married and have children, but if they’re ambitious they can’t. It seems like a good trade off. They don’t have the recruiting problems that the Catholic Church has, but they still manage to avoid having the most important positions be de facto hereditary.
Amanda in the South Bay
@Roger Moore:
Well, to be precise, in Orthodoxy you have to make the decision to get married before you are even ordained as a deacon; once ordained you can’t marry. In the United States most Orthodox parish priests are married; most celibate clergy are monks who, unlike their Western counterparts, rarely go outside of monasteries. There are a few celibate, non-monastic parish clergy, but they are very rare.
I believe there is a bishop in the Orthodox Church in America who was consecrated a few years ago and is a widower-maybe for the Albanian Diocese?
Mike Kay
These recess appointments were unwise.
The republicans will have no choice but to withdraw their bipartisan cooperation.
Comrade Luke
James Fallows on the recess appointments:
—
That’s all supposed to be in blockquote.
FYWP
Mark S.
There are two reasons why the Church isn’t going to change the rules of the priesthood anytime soon. First, as Taibbi states:
The second is, the best I can tell, only four current cardinals haven’t been appointed by JPII or Benedict, and those guys are all pushing ninety.
r€nato
I know I sound like a broken record, but I’ll say it again:
NAMBLA is missing out on a golden opportunity to go legit and get tax-free status too.
1) Wear frocks and silly collars
2) Hang up a big crucifix
3) Profit! and legalized child-fucking!
asiangrrlMN
@gbear: I have a wee bit of a crush on Madame Speaker. Is that wrong?
As for the Catholic Church–they are just like the Republican Party in their denying and spinning and saying everyone else does it. They should be criminally investigated for all this bullshit. And, they need to shut the fuck up with the ‘poor me’ bullshit as well. I have no sympathy for the officials of the Catholic Church–only those who have been abused.
Yutsano
@asiangrrlMN: My latest (and hopefully final) experience in a Catholic church was my grandmother’s funeral. I suppose I’ll have to go one last time when my grandfather passes on, but as he’s almost healthier than I am at 88, I hopefully won’t have to repeat the experience for quite some time.
Jason Bylinowski
I’m going to try and make a serious comment about this, as it’s something I shouldn’t really care about, being non-religious, and yet somehow I do, being still somewhat sentimental for my Catholic upbringing.
As a Confirmed but irredeemably-lapsed Catholic, I can say that all this recent stuff nevertheless makes me very sad, because (& let’s not underestimate here) by and large the clergy of the Church are doing great work and I personally know many priests who have sacrificed so many decades of their social lives to serve a greater good, many of whom I have reason to believe are very likely agnostic at best. To be so dedicated to a cause without the easy belief system to back it up (and being a priest is far more of an intellectual pursuit than any other sort of religious vocation that I know of) is just a Herculean task, and the sadness I feel is primarily based upon my acknowledgment that all of this selfless dedication is just so very hard to sustain.
It is too hard to do, for most people. Poverty, chastity, and obedience…these are the three tenets of the priesthood, and I feel that it is only a matter of time now that these tenets will have to be realigned, not that the vow of chastity per se is the cause of the pedophilia. That would be like saying, as the Right does all the time, that gay people are just one step away from fucking children, horses, or otherwise breaking all manner of similar taboos. No, the way I see it, any profession that requires such austerity as a cost of entry is simply going to be flooded with people who are either trying too hard to escape their demons, or else are bluntly looking for a way to game the system. And with the easy authority that being a priest provides, it is reasonable to suppose that some of these guys have willfully pursued such a vocation with that kind of betrayal in mind, though I’m sure that in most cases it isn’t consciously regarded in such stark terminology.
So in order to get past this disaster (and it is a disaster: my parents, for example, are simply horrified by the whole years-long saga), in order to attract a more healthy ecumenical candidate I think the Vatican has no other choice than to break with the old traditions and just let the clergy start to be have more like the humans they are. I think for starters they’ll see a huge upswing in the number of people heading for the convent (and make no mistake, this would be a huge plus for them, as there has been a perennial decline in the number of young priests entering the field). There will be a huge backlash from the hardliners who still have a bone to pick for the 2nd Vatican Council, and they may even see a split as a result…….. But the alternative is eventual irrelevance or maybe even dissolution, and if that were to happen, even though I’m not really much of this god silliness, I’m willing to wager it would begin a societal decline, particularly in some of the poorer South American countries, which would be very hard to pivot out of through secularization.
It is a very big deal, and I really don’t think that Benedict is anything other than a company man. The Church is in need of a real moral leader, and unfortunately it does not seem to have one at the moment.
Zach
Bush actually faced more opposition. The 107th Congress was split 50/50 in the Senate. Fortunately, enough Democrats weren’t dicks that this didn’t grind the confirmation process to a halt.
Robin G
OT and self-involved, but… I no longer have a hangover! Yay! Only took seventeen hours!
Pigs & Spiders
@Jimmm: Amen. I’d give up my ability to procreate to be able to write half as well as he does.
JackieBinAZ
@mcc: Slacktivist’s weekly mockery of the “Left Behind” series is also a must-read.
Martin
@Comrade Luke: I never thought I’d every say this, but the GOP has finally made even Fallows sound shrill. That’s quite the accomplishment.
Linkmeister
@Jason Bylinowski: Well said. I’ve been wondering how long it would take the Church to figure out the demographics and determine that it would have to accept women as priests or allow married men to become priests. I give it another hundred years, because that institution is slower than molasses in January, but it’s gonna have to be realistic sooner or later.
slightly_peeved
@freelancer:
From the website, looks like an export-only winery. Never heard of it, and googling for it actually comes up with the Black Swan Winery (entirely different wines & logo) in the Hunter Valley.
Some simple tests to sort the world-beating stuff we drink from the shit stuff some conglomerates export:
– If the wine is named after a native animal, don’t drink it.
– If the grapes are described with no location more specific than “South-East Australia”, don’t drink it.
“South-East Australia” is less specific as “South-West United States”, wine-wise.
– If you google the winery and don’t get a website for the actual Australian winery, beware. This also works with google maps – this should give you a physical winery with an actual location.
– If it’s in a cardboard box, don’t drink it, but I’m guessing you knew that one.
Yutsano
@asiangrrlMN: BTW I’m slightly miffed. BoB won’t flirt with me dammit. All I get out of him are idle threats. Am I not worthy? Sheesh!
MikeTheZ
Sorry if this got posted earlier, but it seems it didn’t take long for a teabagger candidate to pick up a felony charge
fucen tarmal
@ slightly_peeved
what if i am drinking it, ironically?
fucen tarmal
mudinfallible.com?
fucen tarmal
mudinfallible.com?
fucen tarmal
mudinfallible.com?
morzer
Well, now one teabagger knows how the American people have felt these last 30 years!
BDeevDad
Dems are getting some balls:
BTW: At the end of the article,
freelancer
@Calming Influence:
“Oh, Indeed.”
-Omar
MikeJ
@MikeTheZ: That is a real pity. I really, really want a teabagger running for senate in NV. Split the evil and the insane vote in the GOP and Reid sails to reëlection.
arguingwithsignposts
@Yutsano:
Eeewww. I’d consider it preventive maintenance. Yick. Ptew! Ptew! You owe me some brain bleach!
Martin
@BDeevDad: The AT&T numbers might actually be right. They have a shitton of union and executive retirees with paid healthcare – and they just lost their tax deduction on those expenses. John Deere and Cat are probably in a similar spot.
Of course, they could turn those retiree plans effectively into Medicare supplemental plans for those retirees over 65 and save a ton of money (which is likely why those deductions got killed.)
Boney Baloney
Oh, hey, the turtle pokes its head out after a prolonged period of silence. Catholic pederasty, three swings for a quarter. Could Taibbi BE any more fearless… I say this in sorrow, because I used to excuse his tiny accomplishments in the name of his fearlessness.
I’m sort of scared he might throw a cup of hot coffee in my face, except not really, because you have to square off against Taibbi in person to get hot coffee thrown in your face these days. He’s harmless enough as long as you don’t confront him directly. A Bernstein without a Woodward, is our Matt. Sad. Didn’t take long in the spotlight, did it?
freelancer
@slightly_peeved:
Oh, don’t get me wrong, just because it has a kangaroo on the label, doesn’t mean it’s high class swill. That’s like thinking ‘Roo’s are awesome running shoes because you can store a condom in your left pocket. I mean, I’m as amorous as the next guy, but what am I, the next Catholic priest? Not hardly.
BDeevDad
@Martin: The tax deduction was bullshit. They were getting a deduction on an expense paid for by the taxpayers. They can still deduct whatever they pay, just not what the fed gov’t pays.
Ruckus
@Jason Bylinowski:
poverty, ha!
I went to a catholic high school for a while, out of about 400 there were about 10 who, like me were not catholic. One day we had to line up outside to meet the local cardinal. This was in the early 60’s and Rolls Royce limos were not normal but up rolls one, chauffeur and all. He steps out, silk robes, and enough jewelry, very large diamonds and rubies mostly, to, at the time, pay off the debt of most third world countries. I commented to the boy next to me, what about the vow of poverty? Oh those aren’t his. I asked, can anyone else wear them? No. Does anyone else get to use the car? No. Then effectively they are his. I asked, why is the money not used to help the poor? To this no answer.
I learned very early in life that the catholic church is a scam, a very powerful one but a scam non the less. It is not the only one but it is the largest and most powerful. I know that there are priests who are good people, I’ve met some. But the disease of power and age has rotted the concept and upper structure of the church. From the looks of it though this has been going on for hundreds of years, we are just seeing the festering sores up close and in some cases personal, now that it is harder to hid them.
slightly_peeved
I just wouldn’t want anyone judging Australian wine by that Black Swan stuff, just like Americans wouldn’t want someone judging US wine by two-buck chuck.
And I’ve never seen Roo running shoes in my life, but since they’d never sell in Australia, that’s a smart move on their part. Wearing the native fauna, unless part of some sporting uniform, is strictly for tourists. It’s like wearing trackpants with the American flag on them.
Well, it’s all booze, so provided you’re not expecting quality, drink it anyway you like. The one time I drunk Fosters was ironically.
Svensker
@Amanda in the South Bay:
Good grief, child. Hope things are better for you. And break a on leg on your finals.
Hugs and best wishes.
nogo postal
Of all the decades watching SNL one moment stands out
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYw8JR1N90o
Now, almost 20 years later she gives some background on why
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/03/25/AR2010032502363.html
Viva BrisVegas
@freelancer:
I’m thinking Qantas might be wanting to have a talk with these guys.
Bruce (formerly Steve S.)
@Roger Moore:
I think this would likely backfire. It would eventually make its way to the Supreme Court, which would not only rule in favor of the RCC it would also declare Roman Catholicism the official state religion.
r€nato
@MikeTheZ: Clearly the prosecutor must be a partisan Democrat. Why aren’t any Democratic candidates being arrested and charged with felonies as well?
That’s how it works in a ‘fair and balanced’ world.
asiangrrlMN
@Amanda in the South Bay: Girl, I didn’t see this last night. You keep on fighting for your right to survive! Positive vibes headed your way.
@Yutsano: I dunno. Maybe he only has the hots for FH#1? And, sometimes, me, I guess. Ew. Consider yourself lucky!