Karl Rove told CNN’s John King on Thursday that he wanted President George W. Bush to pick someone else as his running mate.
“[Bush] was set on Cheney for vice president, and I thought it was a bad idea,” he said on Thursday.
“For about 30 to 35 minutes I laid out the reasons why he shouldn’t pick Dick Cheney.”
Update. I’m not saying I believe this. I find it interesting that Rove is trying to distance himself from Cheney in this manner (truthfully or not).
Mystical Chick
My ass, he did. I’d like to think it’s by now common knowledge that Shrubbie was just the puppet and it was Rove AND Cheney and a host of others who were doing all the heavy lifting.
Why oh why oh why does ANYone think Rove is telling the truth about a single thing? Yes, I’m cynical. Yes, you may call me a conspiracy theorist. But I will go to my grave not believing one. single. word. out of his craven mouth.
Bill E Pilgrim
Don’t do that to me for god’s sake, for a moment I thought he was running again.
Michael D.
@Mystical Chick:
It’s not cynicism.
It’s empiricism. :-)
PeakVT
CYA or false? Inquiring minds don’t really care.
Jason Bylinowski
Well nobody ever accused Rove of being a dummy, and I don’t wonder that Bush might agree with this argument, now that it’s all said and done. I’m not sure what Rove’s rationale was, but I always find it questionable when younger leaders choose older men to back them up. The obvious risk is that the older man will just try to take over, and use the authority of age to do it. I worried a bit about Obama’s pick of Joe Biden just for this reason, but as it turns out, it was a great pick because Biden is kind of a natural cheerleader and very happy to serve under such an articulate black man (heh).
rob!
“I wanted to be the one pulling the strings!”
I think Rove saw in Cheney an adversary for control over chimpy.
Warren Terra
Rove’s job was to get Bush elected; there’s little evidence he ever cared about policy except as it affected electability. I don’t doubt he didn’t care for a Cheney nomination purely on these grounds.
Svensker
I would like to hear the reasons that took 30 minutes to detail.
Wonder why Rove is talking about this now? Throwing Dick under the bus to keep some distance between himself/old boss from Darth?
gbear
It’s only intereesting in the sense that it’s entertaining to hear how they lie! differently to suit any given moment. Why bother to start believing a word that comes out of their mouths now?
edit: I see this isn’t a new insight.
Cat Lady
I wonder who would have been Rove’s first choice. Rummy? Could Cheney have done more damage at Defense than as VP?
Stroszek
No surprise here and this is consistent with earlier reports of a Rove/Cheney rivalry. Rove wanted to focus on dismantling the New Deal, Cheney wanted to focus on dismantling the Middle-East.
Stroszek
@Cat Lady: My guess would be a political choice meant to neutralize Gore’s advantage in a swing state and not hold a lot of sway over Dubs after the inauguration. Lamar Alexander would seem to fit the profile.
Violet
Why bring this up now? Oh, yeah – he’s got a book to sell. How do you keep yourself (and your book) in the headlines? Say something provocative!
From the article:
Ugh. I feel queasy. Too much talking about the Catholic church scandal.
Also:
Translation: I need someone to tell me what to do and Cheney will do that.
And as I suspected:
Uh huh. It’s all about the book.
Phoebe
If age/health + close ties to HW were the reasons Rove said it was a bad idea, then this story is pretty boring. If he’d said “I argued that Cheney was an unstable power-mad Rasputin” then ok. He’d be lying, but ok.
I think it only exists to paint Bush as a loyal, non-politics driven, decider, and Cheney as a good decision, because Bush won twice, right? So I guess the question is, why is Rove trying to sell Cheney to us? Is Cheney going to get a spot on a Sunday show? He’s not running for anything, right? Right?
Legalize
And we should believe lying sack of shit, KKKarl Rove, why? Oh right. His book sales must be in the crapper.
kansi
Was he packing his University of Illinois white board?
mellowjohn
correct me if i’m wrong, but iirc, biggus dickus was put in charge of the veep search and after looking around he choose himself.
SRW1
Two thoughts:
One, Karl has concluded that Dick’s reputation is irrecoverably shot and that since Dick really is going to go down in history as the Darth Vader of the Bush the Lesser regime, it might be advisable to put some daylight between himself and Dick.
Two, Karl doesn’t see Dick as having much influence on the Teabaggers or he has concluded that they have peaked, cause he obviously isn’t worried about Dick meting out some retribution by spurring the true believers.
Julia Grey
I would like to hear the reasons that took 30 minutes to detail.
Rilly.
Hey, interviewers: there’s this thing called follow-up. You ever heard of it?
Oh, wait, we’re talking John King here.
(And to think I used to sorta like that sucker.)
Biscuits
History will not be kind to Cheney regardless of his daughters timely protestations. Rove is just positioning himself to avoid being associated with that horrible man. As if that’s possible. These people really are delusional.
dan robinson
Perhaps Bush was trying to find balance in the advice that he was going to get, i.e., he didn’t thing that Rove was right all the time. He also had Rumsfeld to balance Cheney.
But balancing Rove by bringing in Cheney was like thinking that the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse balance each other.
aimai
I love Phoebe’s version, up above. Its so perfectly “hall of mirrors” and it totally fits Rove’s pattern. But I think the important thing to remember about Rove is he’s always lying. I have never seen anyone else, other than Cheney, in public life who is so consistently, obviously, lying about everything. Both of them are very conscious of the viewer/listener as someone to be manipulated. Bush wasn’t that kind of a liar, and many other politicians aren’t, either. They have some core belief, or misbelief, that they actually pursue regardless of how it manipulates or effects the listener. But not Rove. Rove always has a plan for how what he’s saying will get you to believe what he wants.
aimai
WereBear
@Jason Bylinowski: I have accused Rove of being a dummy. He was a one-trick pony who thought he was successful because he was good at it. He was good at dirty tricks; he was not a political genius. Calling him Bush’s Brain insults them both.
One thing that might chap Rove’s thick hide is how little money he makes.
He was bought with acceptance, and money. He worked for rich powerful people and made a lot of money, to him. I figure on a recent epiphany for many of such Bush courtiers.
The courtiers wrestles over salary with the bosses, understanding that the bosses are so rich they could double it on a whim.
And then they don’t.
Soul On Ice
Four words I never thought I’d type:
Karl Rove – making sense
Balconesfault
It is like some kind of advanced logic puzzle to ask “how is one capable of ever discerning when Karl Rove is telling the truth”.
I mean, it must happen, if only by random probability, sheer chance, or the outside possibility that telling the truth might actually serve his interests in some situation. Or perhaps he might tell the truth once in awhile just to muddy the waters.
But without some form of independent verification of every statement he makes, I see no way of actually working this one out.
WereBear
@Balconesfault: That’s a great question. I think that he actively avoids the truth, because then he feels safe.
Everything he says is self-serving. So it is to his advantage not to tell the truth.
HRA
Cheney, Powell and Rumsfeld were picked by Bush Sr. for Bush Jr. I have no doubts of Sr. running the show for Jr. That encompasses why we went to Iraq, too.
I am not a Rove believer 90+% of the time. I believe him in this instance.
scarshapedstar
Rove lied on the same day that the sun came up? Glory be!
burnspbesq
@scarshapedstar:
Hey, wait a sec. Don’t blame the sun for Rove’s lying. Correlation is not causation.
Liberty60
@Balconesfault:
Yeah, thats the trouble with being a liar; Not only is it impossible to tell when they are being truthful, after a while, you just don’t give a damn.
Bt as long as we are talking about The Brain…wait, why exactly are we talking about him?
Even Dick Cheney has serious issues to talk about, evil and twisted as they may be; Rove has never had any input or thought on anything other than short term gaming the system for a few ticks upward on polls and trying to win the daily news cycle.
Like a mayfly, politicos like him have an ephemeral existance, but after the urgency of the moment, he leaves no imprint, no record of existance, and ultimately no meaning or relevance.
He is already, even as we speak, being covered over by the sands of time, and within a very short time be forgotten like a bad dream.
Rick Taylor
I agree with Rove? Brrrrrrrrr. . .
I don’t see why Rove would lie about this; Cheney is popular in wingnut circles and I don’t see why he’d want to piss those off.
darkblack
Self-picked Cheney was in the room the entire time?
This wasn’t advice, this was an exercise in countering oppo research, and now Rove’s creating his own reality again about it for the benefit of those studying judiciously at home.
;>)
Nick
I knew about this actually…Bush really wanted Christine Whitman, but Cheney objected and talked him into nominating him.
maya
Fix’d.
craigie
Who are these “Rove” and “Cheney” guys you’re talking about? Did they used to be important or something?
Polish the Guillotines
This guy is nothing but a reflexive, pathological liar.
Dad: Karl, did you chop down that tree?
Karl: Um, no. It absolutely wasn’t me.
Dad: Well that’s too bad. It needed chopping and I was gonna pay someone to do it.
Karl: Um, yes. It absolutely was me.
The media just doesn’t understand that some people really do have psychological or psychiatric disorders. It’s a messy place to go, but maybe it’s time to go there.
Scamp Dog
@Polish the Guillotines:
What’s disordered about his behavior? He got what he wanted, and faced no adverse consequences. The rest of us? Not so much.
Paul T
Always remember that Dick Cheney led the committee to pick a Bush vice president….and chose himself.
LongHairedWeirdo
Honestly, Cheney has Rove’s fingerprints all over it. If you’re going to do a lot of evil, nasty shit while you’re in office, it’s good to have an evil, nasty shitbird to deflect the blame.
Then, if bad stuff happens, the true believers can think “oh, if only the good and honorable George W. knew what that awful, awful Cheney person was doing. But alas, George trusts Cheney.”
Pair that strategy with all the talk about how Cheney was the most powerful VP in modern times, and tell me this wasn’t the plan all along.
Mike in NC
@rob!:
Nailed it.
Batocchio
I’ve always been interested in the relationship between Rove and Cheney. From the many books on the Bushies I’ve read, most of the time, they were simpactico, or Rove simply didn’t care what policy Cheney was pushing. But Rove’s loyatly was ultimately to himself, then Bush, then those members of the administration perceived to be loyal to Bush. Occasionally there were clashes, as when Cheney didn’t want to tell the Beltway press corps he shot an old man in the face, and Bush eventually had to call him to do it. Bush was always insecure, and surrounded by competiting suck-ups. I agree, “Rove saw in Cheney an adversary for control over chimpy.”
Tim in SF
When someone is as big a liar as Karl Rove, it’s probably best you don’t listen to them at all. Even if he happens to be factually accurate this particular time, it doesn’t mean you should ever believe him.
I think you should add Karl Rove quotes and stories to your no-read list (along with Politico).
Jesse Ewiak
If I remember what I heard on the TV right, Rove supposedly wanted Senator Danforth of Missouri as a running mate. Of course, Danforth has also spoken out against the hard right turn of the GOP so it’s probably BS.
mclaren
The only possible reason for this is that Cheney wouldn’t loan Rove any of the CIA torture tapes for him to jerk off to.
mclaren
The only possible reason for this is that Cheney wouldn’t loan Rove any of the CIA torture tapes for him to jerk off to.
mclaren
The only possible reason for this is that Cheney wouldn’t loan Rove any of the CIA torture tapes for him to jerk off to.
mclaren
The only possible reason for this is that Cheney wouldn’t loan Rove any of the CIA torture tapes for him to jerk off to.