At about 10:15 in this video, you’ll get a glimpse of what Nancy Pelosi’s is made of:
That’s when a bunch of firebaggers start heckling her. At 12:40, a member of her security detail arrives to tell her that she has to leave because the crowd is throwing things. Pelosi responds, “I’m not leaving.” Then she gives her speech over the yelling.
In addition to giving the crowd a chance to exercise their vocal cords, this little event gave the media a chance to exercise their narratives. For Dana Milbank, who’s always eager to find Democrats falling apart, this shows Progressives “imploding in real time”. Firedoglake, where louder yelling is always better argument, says “while Pelosi delivered a pretty decent performance above the din, hopefully she heard the concerns, too.”
Pelosi’s daughter and baby granddaughter were in the audience. I’m sure they “heard the concerns” too.
I cannot begin to understand the mentality of any group that thinks that this protest was effective advocacy.
Lisa K.
They see that yelling enables the tea baggers to take over the GOP…they are hoping to duplicate that success!!!
DougJ
I really hate phrases like “imploding in real time”.
dino
Naw, just therapy.
JG
There’s always one group to blame for everything over here – firebaggers.
Apparently, disabled rights activists can now be safely lumped in with “firebaggers.” As can any and all on the left that we don’t like.
arguingwithsignposts
The audio quality on the whole video is awful. I had to crank the volume all the way up just to make out what the Speaker was saying. What were these people griping about again?
And I’m also unimpressed with the whole “shout down a speaker” style of activism, especially when it’s done to people who are ostensibly on your side. Now if they’d done it at a John Boehner or Mitch McConnell speech, I’d understand a little bit more.
vtr
Someone please tell what they were talking about. I couldn’t understand what they were yelling.
chopper
@vtr:
they’re firebaggers, it’s gibberish to start.
arguingwithsignposts
@vtr: Reading Milbanks’ column, it appears they were disability activists who want more access to community health services or they will end up in nursing homes. It had a strain of “death panels” the way he was making it out.
I’m not sure on the specifics of the legislation they are protesting about.
mistermix
@JG: “Irrational, politically tone-deaf, ineffective and strident” just didn’t trip off the keyboard as well as “firebagger” this morning.
Also, just in case you think I’m being unfair, read that FDL piece. The group yelling claims it has 215 votes for ther bill, HR1670, and blames Pelosi for not getting the other 5 votes needed to pass it. Right now, the bill is stuck in committee and has 126 co-sponsors. To say that they’re over-estimating the bill’s chances for success is a gross understatement.
That said, I’m sure Pelosi ran back to her office and called a caucus meeting to put this at the top of the House agenda. Mission accomplished.
kay
@JG:
Ah, but that works both ways. Did you read the article? People who are unhappy about the health care bill are now insisting they also represent people who are unhappy with the lack of progress on immigration reform.
Which isn’t true. Hispanic Democrats overwhelmingly supported passage of health care reform, as drafted. They need health care.
If you don’t want mistermix “lumping people together” stop lumping people together.
stuckinred
@mistermix: Have you read Jane’s bullshit from last night?
bkny
gotta agree — i do not understand what is to be gained by shouting throughout the speeches of invited speakers to a conference.
Bostondreams
I’m interested in reading the Firedog pieces on the election in Arkansas. How will they take the Big Dog pushing Lincoln over the top against Halter and the unions?
Linda Featheringill
Yeah, the lady is tough. Not mean, not macho, and not violent. She is resilient.
You have to be in order to be re-elected as often as she has.
stuckinred
@Bostondreams: Jane jumped on it last night. . .pitiful and they are all falling all over each other with how fucking great she is and how “next time” they are going to kick ass and take names.
MMonides
She’s Pe-Lo-Si and she’s tougher than leather! (h/t to Run DMC)
Singing aside Mistermix,
my take on the Firebagger crowd is that they’re confusing catharsis with effective advocacy. The fact that these kinds of protests primarily cause legislators to consider them immature fools isn’t nearly as important as the feeling of being righteous. And righteousness, in their world, is best demonstrated not by speaking truth to power, but by yelling it in power’s general vicinity.
Nothing annoys me quite so much as advocacy done poorly.
Nick
@Bostondreams: Of course it was a smashing success because they put Blue Dogs “on notice” or something.
In the meantime, $10 million did not go into the campaign coffers of labor supporters in tough races in labor-friendly states, but hey, revenge on Blanche for butthurt is far more important.
Walter
The firebaggers are in a fit today. They lost against the “establishment, man.” They are losers.
DJShay
I don’t care what issue you are advocating, that behavior is unacceptable. I can see it on the right, but “throwing things” at the speaker? Just stupid. And call me crazy, but there is an “epistemic closure” happening on the left too. It’s not as prominent on the left because the elected dem officials aren’t proclaiming every dem a corporatist shill like the elected GOP does to who doesn’t believe Obama is the reincarnation of Hitler. And one more thing. AR is conservative. I’m no fan of Lincoln, but in a conservative state, how do progressives expect Halter to win by being more liberal than Lincoln? The seat is a probable GOP pickup no matter who won the dem primary.
homerhk
To people who like to look back at President Obama’s supposedly naive desire to work with Republicans, I think this episode demonstrates quite clearly why that didn’t work. It wasn’t that Obama was suddenly filled with gracious thought that Republicans might actually genuinely want to work with him; it was that through his election and inauguration it was apparent that there was wide support for him across the country which would force the republicans (or at least some of them) to play ball.
Where he was naive – I think – was in thinking that the US public – and particularly the liberal wing of the democratic party – would continue their support of Obama; or at the very least would not be clamouring for appearances on every news show around to critique Obama for some imagined sleight or another. Now, it may be that he hasn’t lost all support from the liberal wing – but when the loudest voices on the left complaining about something or another are the ones broadcast combined with the right wing nuttery every day what is that supposed to do to his support country wide?
Now forget Obama but Pelosi – who has done so much in the past 18 months to pursue the liberal agenda – gets shouted down for an entire speech because of someone’s other pet issue. I think it just shows the selfishness of the US public and the expectation that unless politicians do something to make their own individual lives better (and address their own individual top priorities) those politicians are simply corrupt, useless or betrayers. How I long for a grown up US public – I thought it had arrived in 2008 but sadly, no.
El Cid
@JG: I was thinking the same thing — I had read about this earlier. The protesters were from a group called ADAPT, which has protested at a variety of Pelosi events.
Here’s ADAPT’s statement.
That’s what they were shouting about, wisely or no.
I also recall a number of other protests throughout the years of groups like ACT UP! who sometimes got loud in front of public officials, interrupting them.
Outside this blog, nobody knows who the fuck you’re talking about with the term ‘firebagger’, but there have been protesters willing to shout loud in front of public officials at public events for a lot longer than there have been the interwebs.
stuckinred
El Cid: So who cares what people outside this blag know about something that is posted on this blog? I’m a refugee from FDL and I think jane and her worshipers are fucking idiots.
Bostondreams
@Nick:
Been reading Hamsher’s piece. I’m in the comments. Apparently, Obama is going to become so unpopular that Hillary will primary him. And I am not sure that I see the difference between Progressives who say the Dems lose because they are not left enough, and Conservatives who say the Republicans lose because they are not right enough. The Massachusetts election was a wake up call to the Dem establishment? What, did Brown run as a leftie? What message do they think the Dems might take from that?
Don’t these folks see the problems with what they are saying?
Oh, and I love the calls for a new Bonus Army. THAT ended well, historically. And a general strike, as if its the 19th century and we are some European social democracy. But we aren’t; that word that begins with ‘s’ is such an anathema to many Americans, unfortunately. I always thought that Progressives were part of the reality based community?
Woodrow "asim" Jarvis Hill
Exactly. The problem isn’t their goals, with I support. Nor even their tone –they have a right to yell and scream at anyone, in my opinion, in public.
The issue is that this + write screeds on blogs is the end of their activism, all too often. They infantalize their supporters with the belief that Daddy Obama or Mama Pelosi will rubber-stamp their wishes into law, if they throw a big enough temper tantrum. It’s politics via toddler tactics, and it’s utterly useless.
I really hate to keep calling it, but they really should look to the Civil Rights movement, and see how engaged not just MLK, but many others, were in the political process. But since “politics” is now an evil, dirty word, they want the effects without the work. And that just mires their worthy causes in a deep ditch, and they keep digging the hole.
El Cid
@stuckinred: I dunno, I guess I was just noticing that things that don’t have much to do with Jane Hamsher or FDL usually attract people to jack off about how much they can’t stand Jane Hamsher.
I say we call these people firecripples, or maybe gimpbaggers.
El Cid
@Bostondreams:
Not to mention, nobody even came close to promising us a bonus. Last thing I heard that even sounded like that was the ‘peace dividend’, and that got lost somewhere.
par4
The only thing you need to know about Pelosi is that she took impeachment off the table.In a functioning democracy she would have lost her seat just for that reason. We are no longer a nation where ‘the law is King’.
Malron
Congrats to Jane Hamsher for helping another candidate lose in a national contest. I’m sure the speaking engagements for her are really piling up as I type this…
Hunter Gathers
@Nick:
It was more about keeping the seat in the Dem caucus next year. Big Dog can camp out in Arkansas from now ’till November, and Lincoln and her cheesy neckties are still going get their collective ass kicked. Halter polled better than Lincoln did. She’s going to get killed. At least she can join the board of Wal-Mart sooner than expected.
joeyess
Well, Dana Milbank is a douche-bag, isn’t he?
kay
@Hunter Gathers:
This absolute fealty to polls kills me. Halter lost. The polls are irrelevant.
The conventional blog wisdom was set, and you never deviated. Arkansas is a rural, Appalachian state. You can’t overlay this national template over any random state and then start collecting data that proves your thesis.
Lincoln holds a powerful committee chair that is important to Arkansas. It is entirely likely that a state like hers will back her because they need federal money, despite the national theme that there is a “populist uprising”. They need the money.
“Anti-incumbency fever” is the conventional wisdom in both the commercial media and blogs. It didn’t play out there. Rather than look honestly at that, you’ve ceded the general, based on polls taken in May.
Why are you looking at polls when people just voted? How in the hell is that “populist”, anyway?
John Cole
I think the protest methods were stupid, but you know what- at least they got off their asses and are fighting for what they believe in. The Democratic party as a whole could use a little bit more of that.
Where were the pissed off mobs during the HCR debate? We got our asses kicked in the press by every pasty, pudgy, elderly geezer dressed in a fanny pack and USA t-shirt screaming “keep medicare out of government.”
It seems to me that if the left wants to move the Overton window, this is the BEST type of venue for them to kick it up a notch.
Violet
NANCY SMASH! She’s just awesome. I wasn’t all that impressed with her when she first became Speaker, but watching her in action with various bills, especially health care, has left me very impressed. That woman is tough as nails with a backbone of pure steel. Love her.
danimal
@El Cid: fizzlebaggers?
kay
@El Cid:
It’s fair game, El Cid. If Hamsher wants to be taken as an individual, maybe she should stop insisting she represents some electoral majority, composed of vast sectors of the Democratic base.
She’s doing that because she wants to be perceived as a powerful force. But she can’t have it both ways. Either she’s a scrappy slice of the Democratic base, fighting alone, or she speaks for 40% of Democrats.
The disgruntled organizer in the piece at the top of the page looks at a small group of protesters, and reads off a laundry list of interest groups within the Democratic Party that the protesters allegedly represent. He’s pulling that completely out of his ass, and it’s deliberate. It’s political. A tactic. I don’t even object to it. But they can’t pretend they aren’t claiming majority status. They are.
Michael
@JG:
Who gives a fuck what they demand? I don’t, especially now.
SiubhanDuinne
@Violet: Thanks for saving me a lot of typing. You said, almost word for word, what I was about to say, including “NancySMASH!” and how I started out not being impressed and how impressive she has proven to be and even the “tough as nails” part.
Hmm, guess you didn’t really save me any typing since I went even longer here than my original planned comment :-)
El Cid
@kay: Well, that’s why I depend on these comments to let me know what all Hamsher says & does, because otherwise I’m usually not aware.
John Cole
The Hamsher hate gets a little tedious. I can’t stand some of the things she does, and have said as much when she does them. But a lot of people can’t separate the person from the actions, and have some sort of creepy/obsessive need to drag her into every discussion. Mike Kay- I’m looking at you.
Hunter Gathers
@kay: She’s going to get killed because she’s a shitty politician.
kay
@El Cid:
I sort of fundamentally object to the idea that she can jump into the national political fray and then pick and choose her critics.
Correct me if I’m wrong, El Cid, but this is a person who regularly appears on national political programs and acts as a critic to the Democratic President, the Democratic Party, and the entire process.
There is no issue she hasn’t weighed in on. I don’t know why she’s this delicate flower who can throw punches but not take them.
I didn’t tell her to anoint herself leader of a movement. I’m buying that she is. That means she’s in it, and she shouldn’t be given special dispensation.
If she wants to slug it out with the President, great. She put herself on a national stage, the people here didn’t. They’re not appearing on cable shows opining. She is.
kay
@Hunter Gathers:
All I’m saying is accepting the results of an election is fairly important. Citing polls the morning after voters elected Lincoln goes against that.
I think Senate races are state races. More like a governor and less like a President. She’ll argue that she’s positioned within a majority to bring federal money back to Arkansas, and that’s a populist argument, despite the fact that anti-government folks in media won’t admit it.
I don’t accept the conventional wisdom on incumbency, or “populism”. I think it’s more nuanced and local than that.
General Egali Tarian Stuck
@John Cole: Uhmm! Health Care Reform passed. Recent polling shows the public is getting sick of tea bag screamers and will like even less their mirror reflection on the left. And Harry Reid now has a chance to get reelected from having a tea bag loon to run against, and he is not alone. A mob of screaming fools will not fit through any Overton Window, left or right.
I remember you once saying similar stuff about screamer politics. Is this now a deep cover Cole self parody?
El Cid
@kay: I’m not protecting her or FDL or whatever, certainly not the ‘delicate flower’ thing, it just seems a bit too much of an addictive topic here. Yeah, absolutely, sometimes it’s really, really relevant. Other times it just seems to me like an uncontrollable tic. Maybe I’m wrong, and she/FDL have a bigger impact than I’m thinking. On the plus side, it has replaced the obsession with continuously mentioning Nader voters from 2000.
mistermix
@John Cole:
I went to a couple of Massa town hall meetings during that time, and there were plenty of single-payer supporters there. They were fairly vocal, had signs, etc.
Part of the problem with the HCR spectacle was that Democratic Members of Congress hid out instead of having town hall meetings. A lot of people didn’t get off their asses because there was nowhere to go in their district. Pelosi illustrates the kind of temperament that I wish more Members of Congress had: willing to stand up to hecklers.
kay
@Hunter Gathers:
I like primaries. I think they’re generally good for the process. I also know, though, because I was a union member, that unions are relentlessly practical and hard-headed, and they’re going to honestly look at their decision to invest ten million dollars here. It’s not their money. They’re not claiming Lincoln was a loser out of the gate. They’re saying she didn’t support their priorities. That’s honest.
She’ll court them and make concessions, because she needs them. It’s a negotiation, not a battle.
Kryptik
@John Cole:
I doubt that would’ve worked much at all, John. I mean….us dirty effin’ hippies held protests constantly for things like immigration reform, anti-war shiz, bank excesses, etc. Repeatedly and consistently, the protests were minimalized, marginalized, and given as little coverage as possible, justified by underreporting numbers where at all possible.
Tea Baggers…just the opposite. Despite their smaller sizes and not being significantly louder (just maybe more unhinged), they get branded as ‘real American outrage’, ‘populist uprising’, and all other sorts of glowing terms.
In other words: IOKIYAR. Protests won’t matter a fuck as long as the coverage of any left protest ends up demeaning both protest and issue in favor of the right.
kay
@El Cid:
I think that’s the first time I’ve written her name. She’s not a huge priority of mine. I never read the site, and I’m still not completely clear on who she is: I don’t remember hearing her name prior to Bush, second term.
I do think that “comments” are a way for people with a less influential media platform than she has garnered to weigh in, and that strikes me as absolutely “fair”. She’s still got the advantage, actually. You can’t be a populist and reject the peons, and you can’t be a pundit and claim powerlessness.
cleek
@Kryptik:
the tea baggers get noticed and mentioned largely because they have enough high-profile supporters and sympathizers – including an entire TV network, plenty of congresscritters, radio personalities, etc. – keeping them in the news. lefty protesters don’t have that support, so they go unmentioned.
Hunter Gathers
@kay: Halter was out-polling Lincoln months ago. At least a good while before the first primary. I just don’t think the whole “I work for you, the people, but please don’t pay attention as I eliminate the estate tax and complain about everything else” shtick is going to cut against a GOPer who will tear her to shreds and keep her on the defensive the whole time. That and the whole black president thing. This seat was going to flip no matter who was running. I just thought Halter had a slightly better shot. The union I’m in didn’t get involved, but if it was my money they just blew, I’d be pissed off too.
Kryptik
@cleek:
Well, that’s a good part of my point. Protests aren’t going to help something that’s much more endemic, much deeper than getting bodies and voices out there. And it’s kind of upsetting that the most active activists on the left side seem to be taking the wrong lesson to heart and thinking it’s being unhinged and extremely loud that gets one noticed.
There has to be focused on breaking apart the institutionalized entrenchment the Republicans and conservatives have that essentially enable them to win every time even when they lose.
Yossarian
I certainly can’t stand Lincoln and hoped that Halter would win, but the electability argument, post-actual election, strikes me as a little absurd. I mean, Halter lost a Democratic primary. To argue after last night that Halter would have had a better chance at winning the general election requires us to believe that the more progressive, more proudly Democratic candidate would pull in more Republican and “independent” voters than the centrist Blue Dog incumbent. This after he lost among Democrats. It strikes me as wishful thinking at best.
burnspbesq
@John Cole:
Another example of life as junior high. Mikey has a crush on Janey, and he can’t figure out how to express it in a mature and appropriate way, which frustrates him and makes him lash out.
General Egali Tarian Stuck
You all hate Lincoln, you would have really hated her AR counterpart Mark Pryor when he ran for reelection a few years ago and did the wingnut shuffle to get the votes to win in that southern state. Lincoln is just caught in the Obama and dem resurgence headlights is all, so she gets noticed. Her voting record over time is at least as liberal as Pryor’s, and if she lucks out and wins, a lot of her winger posturing will dissolve, until she is up for reelection again. Same is true for most red state dem senators.
Joey Maloney
@par4: It’s a gigantic stain on her tenure, but it’s not all you need to know about her.
Protip: people do good things and bad things, often at the same time. No one is all one thing. Hitler, so I’m told, liked dogs.
fourmorewars
@Yossarian: Yeah, Reagan should’ve just owned up to his failure and quit after ’76.
gil mann
@MMonides:
I stayed out of the Helen Thomas pile-on, but this? This is just unacceptable. You do not give a hat tip to Run-DMC. You give them props.
Jeez, just because they did a duet with Aerosmith doesn’t mean they deserve to be invoked with such dorky, dorky whiteness.
For future reference, when quoting LL Cool J, a “k/t” is in order. I trust I don’t need to explain.
CalD
Very nicely put. I first thought read it as “louder yelling is always better yelling,” but I like both.
Calvin Jones and the 13th Apostle
@kay: Whatever. Bill Clinton had to come back to Arkansas to campaign for her. That’s what saved her bacon. And he trashed unions and the party base in the process. Not exactly a strategy to win the GE.
burnspbesq
@Calvin Jones and the 13th Apostle:
I agree that that would likely not be a winning strategy in Pennsylvania, Ohio, or Illinois. However, Lincoln is not running in any of those places. She is running in Arkansas. And that makes a difference.
tkogrumpy
@MMonides: Beautiful!
Sheila
It’s amusing that anyone considers Firedoglake representative of the left. I have a large network of friends spread out across the county who work both within mainstream politics and on the sidelines, and hardly any of them have ever heard of Firedoglake, and the few who have never pay any attention to it.
tkogrumpy
@par4: The only thing I need to know?, the only thing I need to know? And to think I’ve wasted my whole life trying to gain as much knowledge as possible from as many sources as I could find. If I had only known how simple it was to fulfill my civic duty, I could have spent so much more time watching Gilligan’s island reruns.
tkogrumpy
And thanks to mastermix for putting this video out there. It’s a perfect example of why I would go to the wall for this woman. You can’t focus group her reaction to the hecklers, which tells me what kind of person the speaker is Ask yourself how long that heckling would have gone on if Darth Cheney were the speaker?
El Tiburon
Congratulations Mistermix. You have created a post as flimsy as DougJ’s a couple of months ago regarding the alleged financial shenanigans by Hamsher and Greenwald.
Those Firebaggers who were “heckling” Pelosi were with ADAPT, an organization advocating in-home care for the disabled.
So the message that Dayden at FDL hoped that Pelosi heard was not some crazed idea that Obama is a Nazi intent on killing Granny, but for the rights of disabled to live at home. It really is so convenient how you fail to mention this in your post. You just call ’em firebaggers and say they were heckling and your job is done. Nice. If you’re Red State or Michelle Malkin.
Oh noes! How traumatic! I hope the little darlings recover. Perhaps if rowdy democracy is so traumatic, daughters and granddaughters should stay home and watch Lifetime. I really can’t even believe you wrote that.
Oh, and what were the “concerns” you are sure they heard? Who knows, you certainly didn’t tell us in your post. But if you read the post at FDL you realize maybe they were legitimate concerns and Pelosi’s granddaughter is better for hearing them.
Just so I’m clear, perhaps the only effective protest are the ones where the protester’s say “please” are not too disruptive, stay in free-speech zones behind a fence and STFU.
Got it. Great job.
cusanus
I think we should get out of the habit of calling corporatist Dems “centrist” and “moderate”. That’s how they want to be perceived, but that’s not who they are. Their political posture is not what matters–it’s whose interests they serve. When commenters at a blog like this one accept as a basic assumption blue dogs are centrists, they show they don’t know they are being fleeced by the corporate Dem long con.
Paris
Now we know what the the Fifth International was like (or whatever the last big commie get together was called) . Thanks for the history lesson, Firebaggers. Sarah Palin would be proud.
El Cid
@El Tiburon: Clearly they were a bunch of firegimps or cripplebaggers. This must have been the first time ever in the history of politics that disability activists were loud in front of public officials. Ever. Because this all started with that one website. All of it.
mds
@El Cid:
Since I love you like a brother, I beg you: Forget it. Any and all criticism of the Democratic Party from “the left,” or from advocacy groups, is crazy Jane Hamsher firebagging now. It’s already been demonstrated that the substance of the criticism is irrelevant; now even the actual source is officially irrelevant. I mean, it’s come to the point where a conventional southern quasi-populist running against a Dem incumbent who helped block a more effective stimulus, helped gut the estate tax, opposes EFCA, flip-flopped on HCR, and only started getting tough on financial reform because she was facing a primary challenge, is some sort of loony leftist windmill joust, just because FDL was one of the groups supporting the guy. Along with those drug-legalizing polyamorous hippie abortionists at the AFL-CIO.
Seriously, it’s come to this. Putative Democrats* getting together to openly gloat about how they stuck it to those stupid unions and their quixotic desire to push for actual pro-labor candidates. For an encore, tell African-Americans to shut up and vote for who they’re told to, and the Dems will really be sitting pretty.
This is more like it. Lincoln thought she could take her electoral base for granted, and they informed her that she was mistaken. Now she’ll either have to bargain a little, or try even harder to occupy the ideological space already occupied by her Republican opponent, and the latter is a fool’s game.
*Certain of the people who don’t hesitate to yell “firebagger” at all advocacy from anywhere to the left of Heath Shuler were also involved in jumping all over Richard “Doomed” Blumenthal. They have a rather … unconventional approach to supporting the Democratic Party.
NR
You guys’ obsession with Jane Hamsher has become utterly comical these days.
NR
@El Tiburon: No, you don’t understand. If anyone to the left of Glenn Beck is the slightest bit unhappy about anything, it must be Jane Hamsher and the firebaggers’ fault. That’s just the way the world works. Get with the program, man.
mapaghimagsik
@John Cole:
I agree here. I also think there’s a lot of frustration because its not like Pelosi has trouble getting her message out. I don’t always agree with her, but she’s got the forum.
Nonsensical ranting does not help get your message across normally, but I don’t know what else to suggest. I’m sure these people are also calling, sending out emails, encouraging their friends to call and send emails…much of it doesn’t sink in because its not cash, which seems to be what congresscritters listen to most.
And yeah, when you watch people bend over backward for the raw crazy of the Tea Party, you kind of have to think that might be something that works. But the Tea Party is only “working” because they have a nice handy megaphone in Fox News — who might not agree all the time, but gives them a sympathetic ear.
Tom65
@NR: I’d agree, but Jane has a proclivity for making herself a target. It’s not like people make shit up about her without cause. That whole Norquist episode, and her willingness to repeat every wingnut talking point if it gets her press, is going to stick to her for a while.
Sucks to be her, but she has it coming IMO.
Mike Kay
OH MY GOD STOP PUNCHING US HIPPIES YOU CIRCULAR FIRING SQUAD CORPORATIST MESSIANIC AUTOMATONS HOW DARE YOU QUESTION OUR PURITY! JUST REMEMBER YOU STARTED THIS NOT US!
Corner Stone
oh no…firebaggers…coming to {yaaaaawwwnn} kill us…all.
mumble mumble snort snoooooz
Mike Kay
@burnspbesq: any you call yourself a lawyer? by that logic, Janey has a big crush on Rahm. It doesn’t matter what the event or issue, she always steers the post to evil puppet master rahm. Then there’s her obsession with loserman. But it’s okay if you’re jane hamsher.
El Cid
Again, how are yelling disability activists — who have done this for years and years and years before the internet — “firebaggers”? Was Jane Hamsher running things in the Reagan or Carter era too?
Mike Kay
@John Cole:
I don’t get you? This post BASHING THE FUCK OUTTA THE FIREBAGGERS was written by your collegue and the comments are full of hamsher hate, (NONE MADE BY ME), yet you focus on me. I realize I’m high profile and polorizing, but you should focus on people who actually posted comments in the thread, not to mention the post itself. Because you see, even if I’m not here, the Hamsher thing will still go on. Perhaps she’s a tad polorizing, in addition to being cute.
Mike Kay
@burnspbesq:
PS Mets Suck!
MoeLarryAndJesus
The people!
United!
Have often been
Defeated!
Mike Kay
@John Cole:
I envy you. you have the ability to seperate Michelle Bachmann from her actions. I mean, bachmann and blonde BOTH want to repeal HCR, they BOTH want to kill the Kagan nomination. But you’re right, I should judge Bachman or Palin personally by their words and actions.
I also find it hilarious that as a life long Democrat who participated in his first campaign at age 9, that I’m being lectured on how to be an activist or loyalist by a ex-hollywood producer who didn’t become active in politics until 2005 and a newly minted Democrat, circa 2005.
Justin
@El Tiburon:
You’re right that the woman was yelling that she was not going to live in a nursing home. I imagine this has to do with California and the situation with the cruel game the Republicans are playing in California. It’s kind of a mirror for the US Senate right now. Supermajority required for budget, GOP/Arnie has enough votes to block any budget they want if they vote as a bloc, only ones they will let through are ones with huge cuts in services like in-home care. She has every right to be upset.
Problem is, being Speaker of the US House, other than speaking out about it (and I’m sure she has) what is Nancy Pelosi supposed to do about it? No one in California seems to have a solution other than changing the state constitution to remove the supermajority requirement, or voting out Republicans. Either could be done, but both require us to abstain from the circular firing squad of accusations of bad faith and baseless smears of President Obama, Nancy Pelosi, etc. What I never hear from the people making these incredible claims is how they would resolve the problems they complain that Obama has so failed on.
I was a big Hillary supporter, came to support President Obama after the primaries, and I have been saddened to see a certain segment of the left (including so-called firebaggers” and relic PUMA’s), egged on by an unprecedented number of conservative trolls posing as disgruntled Democrats, supposedly ready to sit out the election because they’re pissed Obama isn’t waving his magic wand and fixing everything we’ve broken overnight.
Kewalo
I remember when I first started going to FDL. I had just become a little more political and they were right on top of the Plame issue. I read it faithfully everyday and followed the trial word for word. I was a proud FDLer.
Now, I wish I could put my finger on what happend that changed it all for me. They no longer spoke to or for me. And it makes me very sad. Did it happen that we were either with FDL or against them? Did it happen that we were somehow forced to take sides, rather then just disagree and get on with leftie politics? I just don’t know.
I think Pelosi is wonderful. I don’t agree with her all the time and certainly there are things she has done that angers me. But damn, that’s true of most people isn’t it?
And why am I posting this? I think I just want to share my sadness about FDL and my delight that Pelosi is such a good woman. That’s all, just that.
iriedc
@Kewalo:
Cosign.
Mike Kay
@Justin: This!
Mike Kay
Wow. All these people independently taking FDL and hamster to task without any instigation of the meanie/bully mike kay.
MJ
@gil mann:
And a Kangol tip right back at you. Well played, Gil Mann! Very well played!
John Bird
It’s funny – I can’t view the video but totally believe that these activists used unproductive tactics.
I also totally believe that many of the people commenting here are disgusted by the idea of an activist left that attempts to make the Democratic Party live up to its stated platform.
I’ve got little patience for angry activists who can’t put their time and efforts into methods that will actually spur Democratic officials to represent their supporters.
But I’ve got even less patience for party boosters who think the Democratic Party is valuable in and of itself. How dense do you have to be to have bought into this?
Here’s an American value: don’t fucking trust politicians. They’re looking out for themselves, not you, and they’re going to do a lot of nothing if it can get them reelected.
John Bird
@John Cole:
There were, in fact, town-hall activists for “left-wing” (i.e., sane) positions on health care. I was one of them, and there were plenty of people around me.
But neither the media nor the party cared at the time; the latter manifestation of apathy appeared to be organized from the top down.
And the totally great attitude that Party-line scrap-feeders have toward activism in general continues to aid and abet the Republicans and their allies. Good job, guys; I hope your fantasies of Beltway martinis keep you warm at night and healthy when your insurance disappears.