The Minnesota House has passed a proposed constitutional amendment to define marriage as the union of one man and one woman, and as a result Minnesota voters will be asked to vote on the amendment in November 2012.
The final vote was 70-62, largely along the usual party lines.
Unsurprisingly and justifiably, one of our regular commenters is unhappy.
Minnesota used to be a very Democratic state. I had my issues with this state, but I was proud of us politically. That has slowly changed over the past decade or so. Ten years ago, I would have said with some measure of confidence that this shit-for-brains bill would not be approved by the majority of Minnesotans. Today? My totally uneducated odds are 50-50 that discrimination will become embedded into the MN constitution.
One thing I’ve learned from watching the whole Prop H8 drama play out in California: We cannot take for granted that the people of Minnesota will do the right thing. There will be millions of dollars pouring in from out of state to fund the haters. There will be dishonest ads meant to confuse and scare voters. Those of us who stand for equality must be prepared to combat this with a concise, coherent message. We need to work our asses off to ensure that LGBT civil rights are not trampled on.
Mind you, all this and all the anti-choice shit the Republicans are trying to pass despite the fact that they are whining about lack of jobs and the depressed economy. I don’t know how any of this cultural wars shit advances the economic well-being of Minnesota, but I’m not a Minnesota politician, so what do the fuck I know? If you ask me, this is an attempt to gin up the dander of the batshitcrazyrightwingers for the 2012 election. And you know what? It just might work. But you know who else it’s gonna piss off? LGBT folk and allies. There are lots of us. And, we don’t have time for civilized discourse bullshit, respectful conversation, or the vaunted Minnesota Nice. We’re queer, we’re here, and we’re mad as fucking hell. Yeah, that doesn’t rhyme–sue me.
This abomination may very well pass. Like I said, I don’t have as much faith in my fellow Minnesotans as I did ten years ago. But be warned, Mr. Gottwalt and supporters of discrimination and hate–marriage equality is coming. You may be able to stem the tide for a bit and throw up huge obstacles, but it’s coming.
And it’s carrying a rusty pitchfork.
cleek
indeed. see, for example, Ohio, 2004.
(i just got a really good deal on bulk commas!)
PWL
I think it’s funny that when times get tough, Americans seem to revert to some type of quasi-medieval thinking. We seem to be a nation that wants to go back in time, not face the future.
Maude
To keep the pitchfork rusty, use 1/3 plain table salt to 2/3 water and soak overnight.
Served
I like when these votes occur in the legislature, because there’s a record for posterity on who is a bigoted asshole.
That said, we’re passing constitutional amendments to “define words,” which is just insane pants. While we’re at it, can we define “ironic” so that it is only used properly?
Tom Levenson
One day, and soon, this will blow up in the face of the GOP (and in those of the “religious”power brokers that draft in its exhaust).
A (bare) majority of Americans polled already accept gay marriage. The daughter of the most conservative and vicious Veep of modern times is gay. Sulu is gay. And so on.
It won’t be long before what seems blindingly obvious here — that the GOP only rides this pony because the party thinks that this nonsense will help obscure complete failures of governance — becomes the common wisdom.
I hope that’s MN in 2012 — and some smart messaging will help.
(By that I mean — stuff like “While the MN GOP seeks to discriminate against Vice President Cheney’s daughter, 3,000 more Minnesotans lost their health care.”
#whatreallymatters.
(And yeah — I’m a lousy political consultant. But still.)
Nemesis
The gop are masters at getting draconian social issues on the ballots to drive uber conseraturd turnout. Teh gay scare has about run its course.
Chris
Meanwhile, in other news, this: http://www.gallup.com/poll/147662/First-Time-Majority-Americans-Favor-Legal-Gay-Marriage.aspx
The elites are way, way out of line with the general public in terms of gay marriage, and it’s going to get worse before it gets better. Trouble is, very few people are willing to make gay marriage their dealbreaker issue when looking at a candidate, no matter how they may otherwise feel about it.
My commiserations to Minnesota. The fact that Mondale’s home state could have Michelle Bachmann as its most famous politician just two decades later is quite unfortunate.
Served
@Tom Levenson: Number of gay marriages performed in Minnesota: 0. Number of unemployed: (insert whatever number).
Zifnab
I’m just floored that we’ve got 8-9% unemployment, record deficits, two-and-a-half wars, bridges in that state literally falling apart, but somehow gay bashing and force fetusing have climbed to the top of the agenda. Again.
It’s the nineties all over again, minus the economic prosperity. Do voters simply not give a fuck anymore? How is this nonsense still selling?
Yutsano
@Tom Levenson: Muddied, but I bet you could find a local example along similar lines. And my honest fantasy (which I know will never happen) is in the middle of all this a major sports figure in Minnesota comes out just to challenge it.
And wifey done scored with that post. I’m all proudy and stuff.
Thoughtful Black Co-Citizen
Loves me some Asianmngrrl.
El Cid
This sort of ultra-right-wing governance freakishness throughout the mid-West and even beyond is exerting enormous pressure on Southern states to up their game and out-weird them.
You people have gone all-in with your rapid product rollout of crazy, and if we’re stuck repackaging our existing homo-hunting snake handlers and regulation-free business environment, then we’re going to spend the next decades, maybe even just years, thinking we can just drift along on our existing customer base for feudalo-fascism and hoping that our neo-Confederatism can keep them coming back.
If we’re not careful, the South won’t be seen as the utterly dominant source of right wing evil crazy government in the country.
It’s not a title we should so easily relinquish down here. We’ve put a lot into getting it.
Thoughtful Black Co-Citizen
@Zifnab: When the going gets tough, the weak find someone they think won’t fight back and start kicking.
kay
@Tom Levenson:
Agreed. It’s cold comfort, but I’m surprised they’re this weak. They had to do this in 2004 to drag Bush over the finish line, and they’re reduced to trying it again, years later. They still don’t have anything positive to run on.
They won’t be able to weasel out of this, historical view, like they bob and weave on the southern strategy. The state laws they put on will be there for all to see. They own codifying discrimination in 2011, and they’ll own that forever.
I think of the Ohio amendment as part of the noble legacy of George W. Bush. It’s what he had to do to get re-elected, right there in black and white. I hope he’s proud.
Guster
They’re afraid of being branded as hateful bigots for their hateful bigotry–they always freak and play the victim if you just accuse them of what they’re actualy doing–and we’re usually too polite to insist. (By ‘we’, I mean our most visible spokesfolk.)
I would donate to a campaign that instead of saying, ‘this is wrong and a distraction, civil rights for all,’ said, ‘If you hate gays, vote for this. If you simply can’t stand gays, if you despise them, if you think they’re worse than Jews and Chinamen and the Irish combined, vote for this. If you know that gays don’t deserve the same rights as the rest of us, join me in this act of political violence. Hate gays? Vote to deprive them of their rights as Americans. Vote hate in November.”
Chris
@El Cid:
Don’t be so hard on yourselves. You just gave us eight years of Bush. And you did give the world Huckabee.
Y’all’ll bounce back. I have faith.
tkogrumpy
Absolutely! Sharpen the leading two inches to a needle point, smear the sharpened end with heavy grease. plunge the pitchfork up to the tang in the most infested manure pile you can find, and stew for two months before using, making sure you push with enough force to embed the dirty part deep enough.
El Cid
@Chris: Yeah, but even Huckabee would have been a tame, moderated candidate on the national scene.
We would have something with Haley Barbour; that right there’s an opportunity to show the nation what we got.
Ed in NJ
There seems to be a growing movement in professional sports to accept gays, which I find very encouraging. In just the last couple of weeks, you had a team president of the Suns come out, Charles Barkley, Steve Nash and Sean Avery support gay marriage, Avery’s agent suffer tremendous backlash (and financial harm to his agency) by criticizing him, and the SF Giants made a video for It Gets Better.
When the macho world of sports is on the side of gay rights, you’ve lost the war.
alwhite
I grew up in Minnesota and was very proud of our tradition of caring for the weakest members, working as a team to ensure the well being of the whole.
We moved to Florida in the early 90’s I and was stunned and dismayed at how ass-backwards everything there was. I was expecting some of it but nothing like what I saw.
I was thrilled to get out of that toilet with palm trees a few years later but more shocked to discover that MN had fully embraced the race to the bottom. We are now trying desperately to keep down with the Floridas, Alabamas and Arizonas of the world.
The assholes are wining and all we can do is keep fighting.
arguingwithsignposts
where are the jobs?
James E. Powell
@Chris:
There is a very big difference between the American population and the portion of it that votes. As we learned, this is true even in very blue states like California.
The Republicans count on it because it works.
Chris
@Guster:
Most bullies are good at playing the victim. Helps that they tend to be chickenshits on the inside.
eric
@Ed in NJ: Were i planning a media campaign…i would get gay business owners and interview their employees who say that they put food on the table because of the job here in State X and we pass batguano bill/amendment, we lose jobs because good people will leave. I like my boss and I like my job, vote no on hate.
Lojasmo
As a lifelong Minnesotan who hails from the bluest county in the state…I say this: this will not pass. Minnesota is NOT California.
Frankensteinbeck (The ex-Uloborus)
@cleek:
Damn it, Cleek, how do you even get a deal like that?! The speculators and the Comma Bubble are bankrupting me! Do you know, do you have any idea, how much this comment alone cost?
Yutsano
@Ed in NJ: Not to mention Scott Fujita, who is pretty much a DFH to the core. But when one is a whiteboi adopted into a mixed race family, your perspective tends to get interesting.
Chris
@El Cid:
I don’t know: Huckabee will always impress me as that candidate who actually called for ethnic cleansing in the West Bank, which is something a lot of people believe but most candidates in both parties shy away from actually saying out loud. His attempts to bring about the rapture through Middle East policy would’ve been edifying to watch. But alas, he’s unelectable. Barbour is indeed a nice consolation prize, though.
@James E. Powell:
Sadly, yes.
And along with motivation, their base has the advantage of money, and the willingness to primary anyone who doesn’t fit their entire agenda.
grandpajohn
@arguingwithsignposts:
Hmmm good question, now if we could just get someone in the MSM to ask Boner that same question.
andy
Who says the MN GOP isn’t about jobs? The pigs are counting on all the haters and rubes coming out an pulling the lever for this thing. It’s a jobs program- for the MN GOP is what it is. See, another ballot measure in the works is for a balance budget amendment- if that thing passed even if these pigs get swept of office, they will retain the ability to completely hamstring any progress whatsoever. 40 years of progress right down the fucking drain- from the Minnesota Miracle to a cold Alabama. A high minded electorate could fix all of this, but the GOP is a past master at encouraging the helots to knife each other in the back…
alwhite
@tkogrumpy:
I was reading a book about sword fighting a couple of years ago and the author claimed that “drawing a line” came from the practice of dragging the point of a sword through the waste commonly found in the streets of European cities. This signified to your opponent that even a flesh wound from your blade would probably lead to a fatal infection. Having loaded up your weapon you dared the other to step over the line.
shortstop
@El Cid:
You really don’t wanna do that.
Seriously, it’s sad, though. As an upper Midwesterner, I’m appalled by what’s happened and happening in Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michigan, Iowa…even here in Illinois, which is only reliably blue because of Chicago. Only. Because. Of. Chicago. If we had a Republican lege, there’s no doubt in my mind it’d be busy queer bashing and union busting and wimmen hating like all of our neighbor states.
At least we’re not as crazy as the lower Midwest. Yet.
Hungry Joe
I hate to play Pollyanna here — or anywhere, for that matter — but even if this amendment passes, it’ll be, like the passage of Prop 8 in California, the loss of a battle in a war that’s already won. That’s not to say that people won’t suffer in the meantime, and that we shouldn’t continue to fight tooth and nail (not to mention pitchfork), but really, victory is inevitable. We ARE making progress; were you to go back in time 50 years and tell people that mixed-race couples will walk unconcerned on Southern sidewalks, dine unmolested in Southern cafes, people would tell you you’re crazy — and not because you say you’re a time traveler or because the clothes you’re wearing look two sized too big for you.
MAJeff
@Guster:
Not a single one of them rose on the floor of the legislature to defend this monstrosity. The chief sponsor obfuscated, saying it’s just about letting the people have their say and refusing to acknowledge that a vote for the amendment is a vote for the substance of the amendment.
They are, quite simply, hate-filled cowards.
bryanD
Since state regulation of marriage licensing has it origin in preventing the spread of disease, perhaps the lesbians should separate their plea from the male homosexuals’.
Yutsano
@bryanD: FUCK. YOU. Take your bigoted weak sauce elsewhere asshole. I hope you get a fucking time out for this absolute horseshit.
arguingwithsignposts
@bryanD: WTF?
Jennifer
As someone said in other words upthread, this kind of shit wins the day because of timid messaging from the other side.
What we need is an ad like the ones you’re used to seeing, where we get a bunch of “real” Americans each telling their story, one by one. Except in this ad, white haired grandma comes on and says, “the state cut out the Medicaid that paid for caring for my 35-year-old special needs son, and I had to take early retirement and lose my health insurance to stay home and care for him. But keeping gays from marrying made it all worth it.” Next up, burly white middle-aged blue collar guy who says, “now that the union’s gone, my wages and benefits have declined by 25%. And the grants my kid needed to go to college were cut out so the guys who own the factory could get more tax breaks. Thank god gays still can’t get married or I’d be getting nothing out of this.” 30-year-old African American woman: “I’ve been un- and under-employed since the recession began and finally lucked into a full-time clerical position a few months ago. I’m still making a lot less than I was, and now it looks like I might lose that job since the local schools can only afford to stay open 4 days a week and I’ll need to be with my kids an extra day each week. Keeping gays from getting married is the only chance I’ve got of ever again having a prosperous life.”
It’s not hard to make this kind of stuff – and the people who cravenly pander by using it – look every bit as fucking stupid as it is, even without using all the foul language I like to use. It’s not even required that you make fun of the religious beliefs that cause so many of the dumber among us to fall for it. All that’s necessary is to point out how completely the “issue” fails to touch on the real problems people have.
And that would make me feel better a) if Democrats didn’t all too often fall all over themselves attempting to “validate” these peoples’ bigotry, and b) if I didn’t know all too well that only the Democrats could fail so spectacularly at such a simple game of connect the dots.
Xecky Gilchrist
OP: Those of us who stand for equality must be prepared to combat this with a concise, coherent message. We need to work our asses off to ensure that LGBT civil rights are not trampled on.
@Jennifer: this kind of shit wins the day because of timid messaging from the other side…What we need is an ad like the ones you’re used to seeing, where we get a bunch of “real” Americans each telling their story, one by one.
Yes to both of these. The Prop H8 opposition approach of a crappy pushback and idiotic post-facto calls for boycotting Utah totally didn’t work.
MattR
@Ed in NJ: FWIW, the agent who criticized Sean Avery, Todd Reynolds, is not actually Avery’s agent.
Yutsano
@arguingwithsignposts: This is the stupid shit I have to deal with all the fucking time. The perception that gay men are nothing but horny disease spreading factories. I’m starting to think that maybe equality ain’t worth this horseshit, cause I can almost guarantee nothing will change that fuckstick’s mind.
bryanD
@arguingwithsignposts:
Lesbian marriage WILL fly in all 50 states.
The other brand is too expensive. Too many widowers to pay out with SSI. Follow the money.
@Yutsano:
The lonely lady who types out “puppehz”, “haz”, and “kittehz” like a 7-year-old accuses another commenter of “weak sauce”. Funny.
Fred
Well they elected Jessi Ventura for Gov so….it’s not like stupid shit coming out of Minnesota is a surprise anymore.
arguingwithsignposts
@Yutsano: Understandable. And I’m challenging his underlying premise. Sounds like bullshit to me too.
grandpajohn
OT but speaking of Minn, this is hilarious from Political wire
John Weiss
@Tom Levenson: Oh,
Tom, right on.
When I was younger, I was sure that peace, liberty and justice were just a little while away. Now that I’m not so young, I don’t believe that I’ll live to see it, but perhaps my children will. Ya think?
Served
@shortstop: To be fair, my downstate rep voted for the Civil Union bill, but he’d just been voted out. The redness of downstate is fed by demographics: old, white people.
My state senator voted against it and gave an absolutely homophobic speech. He’s getting a wedding invitation when the time comes and a Christmas card of my perfectly happy gay family every year until he’s voted out.
shortstop
@Jennifer: Well done.
@Yutsano: It’s easy to tell someone else not to sweat stuff that has to be sweated, and I don’t mean this to be the least bit dismissive or insensitive to the reality of the bigotry, but there are biased people whose minds can be changed and there are bomb-throwers like bryan who are simply looking for a heated reaction. I hope we can save most of our energies for the former group.
Yutsano
@bryanD: Go the fuck away you fucking bigoted asshole. You spread a vicious lie then try to attack me when I fucking call you on it. You are worse than the religious nuts, you’re a disgusting human being who can’t handle the thought of two men loving each other. You’re also welcome to keep underestimating me, I relish that. You put up a bigoted statement with no basis in fact and expect us to lie down and take it. FUCK. THAT. NOISE.
@shortstop: The thing is, he’s not throwing bombs. He’s bullying gay men. This asshole has shit over a few threads now and only marginally called on it. Not anymore.
shortstop
@Served: I’m not saying there isn’t a significant blue presence downstate. But there’s not enough to carry the state.
And I don’t see any reason why your state sen should stop getting your holiday cards when he’s voted out. You should help him spend the rest of his life witnessing your family’s happiness.
John Weiss
@Hungry Joe: I’m with you HJ. The Society is much more tolerant, that is to say better than it was when I was a kid, you know, back in the “golden” days of the fifties. The fifties. Great time to be alive if you were white, male and well off. Or if you were a kid.
The Snarxist Formerly Known as Kryptik
It upsets me to see the kind of thing that this represents: the fact that we’ve essentially lost the entire country on the state level, outside of a few key states. Sure we might have the governorship in just under half and the legislatures in about as much, but that doesn’t matter when it seems like the GOP has learned how to brilliantly codify the total sabotage of the country on the state level where it’s impossible for the Dems to stay in charge long enough to clean up, before they’re shitcanned either for a ‘change’ or because they get blamed for the consequences of the GOP fuckwaddery.
I’ve honestly just given up at this point, because there literally seems to be no way for this to ever get fixed, by design.
arguingwithsignposts
@bryanD:
You are so full of shit it’s not even funny.
MattR
@bryanD: Go take a long walk off a short pier.
beergoggles
We ran the best campaign we could to defend marriage in Maine and we lost. This is going to pass.
There’s really nothing we can do as long as the media will acquiesce to air lying ads that portray gays and lesbians as being out to get your children. Lying for Jesus, brought to you by the Mormons and the Catholics.
AnotherBruce
@bryanD: Typical thug and very representative of the modern conservative movement. Pick on people that you think can’t defend themselves. Were you always a psychopath or did your unresolved issues with your mother make you this way?
shortstop
@Yutsano: Okay, I didn’t know he had a history. Carry on, baby.
Yutsano
@AnotherBruce: bryanD is the kind of asshole I want to sic a 6’7″ gay Marine on. And yes I know one.
@shortstop: Th funny thing is I’m usually pretty damn easygoing and tolerant about 90% of the time. But when my Scorpio hackles are up, you do NOT want to be near me. I don’t think I’ve ever called for someone to be banned before. But this fuckstain deserves that.
Linnaeus
@shortstop:
I feel the same way, though I don’t live in the Upper Midwest anymore. I’ve thought about moving back to the region for a couple of reasons, one of them being that I’d like to do something about what’s going on there, but I wonder sometimes if it will be worth the effort.
Mike in NC
@El Cid:
There’s a lot riding on Newt’s shoulders at the moment. But odds are he’ll be able to rise to the occasion — before he does a Hindenburg impression on national TV.
Southern Beale
Yes, indeed.
Late last year a lesbian soccer coach at a PRIVATE college in Nashville got fired when she announced that she and her partner were expecting a baby. It created a HUGE stink because the coach was very well loved among students and the school acted like rat dogs when the firing went public. First they claimed that her sexual orientation had nothing to do with it, but they couldn’t back that up with any facts.
The thing is, Nashville/Davidson County contracted with the school for use of athletic fields or some such (I can’t remember). Nashville is a progressive place, and our Metro Council passed an ordinance that would prevent the city from entering into contracts with entities that discriminate, and they included sexual orientation in the ordinance. It didn’t pass overwhelmingly but it passed and we thought all was well, we had done the right thing.
Not so. The Tennessee state legislature, which claims to be all “small government,” decided it knew better. The legislature passed a low allowing it to overturn Nashville’s law. THIS became a huge shit-storm. And here is the repulsive, heinous, lying sack of shit ad that one of the “pro-Family” groups used to target Memphis voters to get them to support the law.
Not surprisingly, they used the same ad materials that a “pro-family” group in Florida had used to defeat a similar measure. Florida, Tennessee — when it comes to hating on gays, these national “pro family” groups will just recycle the same outrageous lies and slap a different legislator’s name on it.
I guarantee you, Minnesotans will see this exact same ad equating non-discrimination with allowing pedophilia. Disgusting.
Jazz Superluminar
@bryanD
fuck off asswipe. Fucking waste of space.
arguingwithsignposts
@Yutsano: Pix and we will cheer when it happens.
Yutsano
@Southern Beale:
And apparently now they have a new attack line with calling gay men virtual lepers. Noted by the jerkwad up above. I am half-tempted to call in sick just to challenge this bullshit. Damn my work ethic. :)
@arguingwithsignposts: Heh. I’d never let him debase himself like that. He’s 275 pounds of solid muscle though. I don’t recommend saying stupid shit like the assholus maximus up above did around him. Suicide by Dawg.
Josie
@Yutsano: I agree completely. I know that some in the comments section got upset with me some time ago for suggesting banning for people who add absolutely nothing to the discussion, but this guy is the perfect example of what I was talking about. The whole idea of banning was invented for assholes like this.
Yutsano
@Josie: I trust the judgment of the blog host when he says he is very judicious about using the ban hammer. In fact I respect him for it. I think in this case it’s warranted.
EDIT: Bah. Time to head to work. I’ll be back though.
bryanD
@Yutsano:
“He’s bullying gay men.”
There we go. The victim card. The *subject* here was How in the Hell could Minnesota dare go all prophylactic on the gay marriage wave?
The cultural war aspect is plain. Moving on to the 800=lbs gorilla: disease. Sorry. But try donating blood if your gay. You’re banned. Why? And why no discrimination lawsuit? (No need to answer, so I’ll spare you your spin so you don’t end up over Mount Hekla)
if you are unwilling to add anything substantive to the comments, i suggest you keep your bigoted mouth shut. you’ve been warned. -ABL
arguingwithsignposts
@bryanD:
The troll is strong in this one. GFY BryanD. post some data or STFU.
Thoughtful Black Co-Citizen
@bryanD: Christ it’s that dipshit from Roy’s pad. Guess it got kicked out.
Jazz Superluminar
The answers here were interesting, informed and most importantly, not homophobic douchebaggery that should disqualify the commenter from any further engagement with the human race. But someone/i> here changed that.
Lojasmo
@bryanD:
Just because your moronic argument is going to be used by IRL fuckwits here in Minnesota does not mean you need to fling your ass-findings here.
STFU. Seriously.
bryanD
@Yutsano:
“bryanD is the kind of asshole I want to sic a 6’7” gay Marine on. And yes I know one.”
Hey, Semper Fi, Yutsano’s probably-imaginary-giant-marine!
I was a jarhead, too! MARBAR/0331. MCRD San Diego, Camp Horno, USNAS Keflavik, C 1/7, Okinawa, Pohang ROK, Philippines. Rifle: 217; .45: don’t ask; M60: 1st C. 16/80/24:00….I am only 6’0 though…:-(
….anyway…
cyntax
There’s an interesting post up at DKos by Robert Kruicshank on the importance of understanding how coalitions work. His contention is basically that conservatives understand how to keep coalitions together better than Democrats, because they know that everyone’s goals in the coalition need to be addressed:
I’m dropping this in because I think it bears on what bryan D is saying about gay men. He [bryanD] is very clearly a troll who doesn’t respect LGBT rights and beyond how wrong that is in and of itself, it’s also the kind of fractiousness that makes it harder to advance any progressive goals.
arguingwithsignposts
@bryanD: can you fax us your credenza? Are the helicopters not laughing yet?
Calouste
@alwhite:
I can’t comment on the “drawing the line” origin, but related to that is the following:
In the 19th and early 20th century the weapon of choice of a number of European police forces was the sabre. One of the tactics they employed when facing hostile crowds was to scrape their sabres over the pavement stones to direct a rain of sparks towards the crowds. This practice was abolished after a few too many protesters died of septicimia resulting from minor cuts they received when the crowds and the police fought.
Chris
@bryanD:
Sure you were.
Ever heard the line “500 SEALs fought in Vietnam, and I’ve met all 20,000 of them?”
Jazz Superluminar
@bryanD
you know, it’s a horrible thing generally to suggest the world would be a better place after the death of a marine, but I’m making an exception in your case.
@aws
you totally stole my lines, goddamnit!
scav
Ah, leave bryanD to talk big all he wants, his very name announces he’s a douche who’s closest approach to his D-cup fantasies necessarily involve D-batteries.
asiangrrlMN
Thanks, Ms. Sarah. I adore you as you know, so it warms the cockle of my heart to know that you feel the same way about me (my mind, my fantasies). In re-reading the excerpt from my post you cited here, I realized that I need to cut down on my swearing.
All kidding aside, I don’t have a good feeling about this. It doesn’t mean we won’t fight, and I’m not at all Minnesota Nice so I’m going to be all, “Fuck you. Straights have been doing such a bang-up job with marriage, haven’t they?” But a tad more eloquently. Last straw. Broken. This is complete and utter bullshit.
@MAJeff: What you said. I was screaming at my monitor as he spoke because he didn’t address the issue at all. They are a bunch of fucking cowards.
@Yutsano: I’m proud of you fighting the good fight. Continue on.
@Thoughtful Black Co-Citizen:
Right back atcha.
asiangrrlMN
@beergoggles: I’m afraid that I agree with you. I don’t have a good feeling about this. But, I’ll go down swinging.
bryand: Prove it. You asswipe. All of it. Since you’re the one making the claims, the burden of proof is on you. Spouting your bigoted, hateful, homophobic rhetoric is NOT the same as presenting, what are those called? Oh yeah, FACTS. Put up or shut the fuck up.
@Josie: I’m with you. Toilet paper like this needs to be flushed.
@Lojasmo: We have a lot of social conservatives here. I’m a lifelong Minnesotan as well. I don’t have nearly the optimism you do.
Elliecat
@Jennifer: I don’t know what the problem is, lack of money or lack of will but we should have ads like these on this and every other social issue.
The other day when every damned time I came to this blog I had to see the “Millions of babies killed on your dime: defund Planned Parenthood” ad, I wondered where the hell are the ads saying “X number of babies born healthy thanks to PP’s prenatal care” or “X number of women’s lives/fertility/etc. saved thanks to PP health care” and so on.
Pongo
Couldn’t agree more with the poster you quoted. Things have really changed here and it’s kind of frightening. ‘Extreme’ never used to be a word you could apply to Minnesotans in any arena, but now we’ve got Michele Bachman, the merry band of morons in the state legislature and a taxpayer-supported Dept of Commerce that works on behalf of the insurance industry.
Extreme conservatism and it’s twin, hateful right wing religion, are pervasive here now and it’s got me debating about going to my 30th reunion from a suburban Mpls. high school. Was really looking forward to it until I started following posts from classmates on Facebook. Every other poster is an Evangelical who feels the need to provide testimony about their incredible relationship with God. It’s like the city got hit by a sanctimonious idiot virus sometime in the past decade and now all the people I went to school with, who were NOT paragons of moral virtue by any standard, have forgotten they once were just normal folk. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t have any objection to people being religious. I object to it being the ONLY interest and topic of conversation they can engage in and to having it constantly and unceasingly thrown in my face. If it’s your personal relationship with Jesus, then keep it personal, buddy.
Maybe it’s just tough times and when things feel unsettled, the majority looks for mystical solutions and for someone else to think for them. The nexus of extreme religion and conservative politics has been poisonous for Minnesota. It creates a logic vacuum. How else do you explain the majority of ‘Christians’ who have supposedly read the Bible and who proudly and loudly proclaim Christ’s name voting in support of corporate greed and protections for the rich (despite Christ’s crystal clear warnings about the love of money and the spiritual emptiness of the rich) while voting against social justice (the application of which was Christ’s main example in scripture) and contrary to their own best interests? How do you explain Michele freakin’ Bachmann?
Pongo
Couldn’t agree more with the poster you quoted. Things have really changed here and it’s kind of frightening. ‘Extreme’ never used to be a word you could apply to Minnesotans in any arena, but now we’ve got Michele Bachman, the merry band of morons in the state legislature and a taxpayer-supported Dept of Commerce that works on behalf of the insurance industry.
Extreme conservatism and it’s twin, hateful right wing religion, are pervasive here now and it’s got me debating about going to my 30th reunion from a suburban Mpls. high school. Was really looking forward to it until I started following posts from classmates on Facebook. Every other poster is an Evangelical who feels the need to provide testimony about their incredible relationship with God. It’s like the city got hit by a sanctimonious idiot virus sometime in the past decade and now all the people I went to school with, who were NOT paragons of moral virtue by any standard, have forgotten they once were just normal folk. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t have any objection to people being religious. I object to it being the ONLY interest and topic of conversation they can engage in and to having it constantly and unceasingly thrown in my face. If it’s your personal relationship with Jesus, then keep it personal, buddy.
Maybe it’s just tough times and when things feel unsettled, the majority looks for mystical solutions and for someone else to think for them. The nexus of extreme religion and conservative politics has been poisonous for Minnesota. It creates a logic vacuum. How else do you explain the majority of ‘Christians’ who have supposedly read the Bible and who proudly and loudly proclaim Christ’s name voting in support of corporate greed and protections for the rich (despite Christ’s crystal clear warnings about the love of money and the spiritual emptiness of the rich) while voting against social justice (the application of which was Christ’s main example in scripture) and contrary to their own best interests? How do you explain Michele freakin’ Bachmann?
asiangrrlMN
@Pongo: I have to say that I unfriended most of my high school classmates on FB because they were rightwingnutjobs. I don’t know what the hell is going on in MN, but I don’t like it. Not one bit.
I will say, though, that Bachmann is the result of a very carefully-gerrymandered district. A whole lotta concentration of hatred and fear in her area.
Gustopher
The quoted commenter answered his/her own question. The economy gets a boost from an infusion of hate money. Haters gonna hate, and spend money in the lovely state of Minnesota.
grandpajohn
@Pongo: the majority of these right wing fundamentalist that call them selves christians are what I call “Old Testament Christians”, in other words before Jesus came and Started teaching all this stuff about love thy brother and forgiveness and not being judgmental of and provide for the poor and needy , Things that like the rich young ruler causes them to go away sorrowful since their worldy possessions are more important to them. Then again maybe they are only christians in name only. As Jesus said, “By their fruits ye shall know them”
shortstop
@asiangrrlMN: A high-school boyfriend friended me on Facebook. Hadn’t had contact with him for 20-something years; probably hadn’t thought of him more than once or twice during that time, as I’m sure he hadn’t me.
In high school, he was an easygoing, fun and funny dude, very live-and-let-live. Our little town was amazingly homogeneous, with everyone white and (at least nominally) Christian except for (I’m not making this up) one black family, one Latino family, one Asian-American family and one Jewish family. Everybody had pretty much the same level of education and $, both above the national average. And this guy’s parents and mine were similarly mildly conservative, nothing rabid, in political temperament, as were most of the people in town.
So out of those identical molds sprang a flaming liberal urbanite (me) and a gun show-attending, bible-thumping tea partier now living in Tupelo (him). Who knows how these things happen? All I know is that I unfriended him after his second Muslim-slamming post. I got a severe case of the willies remembering that my lips had touched his.
Another friend of mine was carrying a torch for a HS girlfriend until he saw photos of her with Sarah Palin on FB. COLD SHOWER.
Chrisd
@bryanD:
You might want to read up on the history of cervical cancer and its cause before you start justifying sexual bigotry on the basis of public health. That sword cuts a lot of ways, Concern Troll.
PhoenixRising
Lesbian marriage WILL fly in all 50 states.
Yeah, we’ve been married over 7 years now and I still can’t fly, dammit!
Srsly, though, sharpen your pitchforks.
Tom’s ad ideas are way better than the dumb crap EQCA ran against Prop 8, and are actually pretty close to the ads that worked on a test basis. With ‘worked’ defined as “moved ethnic-minority Catholics (of which I understand MN may have some) to vote No”.
The trick to this is to cal them liars right to their faces, and make them sputter. This is why Dan Savage is “appalled” to be our community’s most prominent spokes-sissy–he’ll push right back and ask them what they intend to do after they take his kid away.
Mnemosyne
@Zifnab:
To be fair to the voters, Republicans ran on “Where are the jobs?” And then promptly dropped that refrain the second they got elected.
You can argue that the voters should know what Republicans are like by now, but they didn’t willfully decide to elect fetus fans despite the economy.
Rihilism
@Yutsano: I agree with Yutsano. bryanD has posted a bogus and derogatory medical theory as a means to incite. This is the same as trutherism, yet lacking even the desire to inform that some truthers possess.
I am not a fan of banning either. But it escapes me as to why this doesn’t qualify.
Also, bryanD, go fuck yourself you disgusting, pathetic, little freak…
Rihilism
@bryanD:
Actually the ARC, America’s Blood Centers, and the American Association of Blood Banks are all on board. It is just the overly cautious FDA that is hesitant.
As the ARC, ABC and AABB understand, it is behavior, not sexuality that should be the key to deciding who gives blood.
Fun fact: Did you know that heterosexual males who have had sex with prostitute need only wait a year before giving blood.
The More You Know…
Rihilism
Wonkette cracks me up…the double entendres are marvelous…
OzoneR
@Zifnab:
Because 85% of the population is employed.
Nic
The shit is getting heavy here in MN. Between the homophobic nonsense (Those are real questions that came up last week in our Minneapolis paper), the apocalynot and the tornado… And now it looks like our government is either going to temporarily shut down, or pay itself (republican majority) overtime.
Send help.
Gus
@alwhite: Exactly. I’m sick of hearing (ALWAYS from Republicans) “other states have conceal/carry” or “other states are balancing budgets with cuts only.” Minnesota used to think of itself as exceptional. We were supposed to lead and other states could follow. We used to be in the top five for virtually every measure of quality of life. What we’ve become in the last 20 years makes me fucking puke.