And I’m too old to cry:
Via Josh Rosenau’s fine blog Thoughts from Kansas, this video compilation of Miss USA thoughts on evolution seems a perfect comedy/tragedy hit to engross whilst consuming the first of the weekend cocktails:
<div align=”center”><iframe width=”425″ height=”349″ src=”http://www.youtube.com/embed/UkBmhM0R2A0″ frameborder=”0″ allowfullscreen></iframe></div>
Miss Connecticut gets the prize for stating the obvious with no fuss or bother. As for the rest, I couldn’t stick to it long enough to tally the full march of folly. Fortunately, Josh kindly provides a complete transcript at the link above, for those gluttonous for punishment.
But of course, this is nothing that a voucher + religious charter school education reform can’t solve.
If the Soviets launched Sputnik today, we’d ramp up to match them with a private sector RFP seeking designs for the flying dinosaur that carried Jesus to heaven.
But I can’t get too worked up on this fine afternoon. The only question I’m going to tackle is how much lime to put into that lowball glass.
Cheers! (and consider this a summer surfeit of open threaded goodness).
Mike in DC
The parody of this clip: Should Math Be Taught In Schools?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QBv2CFTSWU
Cliff in NH
My Brain Hurts.
I couldn’t finish it .. maybe later.
‘I took evolution in collage’
ReaganRaisedTaxes
In fairness, Miss Alaska makes slightly more sense on this issue than a certain ex-half-term governor of her state would.
Violet
I watched about five minutes of it. That’s so depressing.
Extending most contestants’ belief that “both sides should be taught”, perhaps schools should also teach that “Miss America contestants are dumber than posts” and let the students make up their minds.
JCT
Barbie says “Math is hard!”
Not to mention history and biology and tying one’s shoes .
Race to the bottom, hell yes!
capt
Keep theocracy off my democracy.
Dave
CT for the win! We may be small and boring, but we ain’t stupid.
beltane
@Reagan Raised Taxes
That’s why this certain ex-governor only managed to be the runner-up Miss Alaska.
mr. whipple
OMFG.
barath
Well if we haven’t settled evolution after roughly a century, I don’t have much hope getting people (or congress) to realize that god isn’t going to put more oil in the ground and that this is where we are.
Dave
I think both sides of the gravity issue should be taught in schools. I know some people believe it is a natural phenomenon by which physical bodies attract with a force proportional to their mass. Other people think trolls deep below the Earth walk in a circle holding giant magnets. We should teach both sides and let the children decide what works best for them.
Villago Delenda Est
CT had the most succinct correct answer, I think.
The answer of course is that evolution is the best explanation we have that is supported by the facts available to us. The mythology of a bunch of goat herders in the middle east does not constitute “fact”.
chopper
what about the contestant from “like such as in South Africa and, uh, the Iraq”?
Rick Massimo
The whole question is a softball disguised as a hardball: “Should evolution be taught in schools?” It lets the Christianists off the hook by letting them say “Sure, teach evolution in school; kids should know both sides.”
Now, “Should phony God stories be taught in school?” That’s a question I’d watch the pageant to hear answered.
Citizen_X
There.
Mark S.
It seems like only Miss Connecticut said unequivocally it should be taught in schools. About 40 of them said it should be presented as one theory along with presumably Creationism, so that “Teach the Controversy” campaign is really working.
The Other Chuck
Miss Vermont displayed something resembling relevant knowledge. A bit wishy-washy in the tone, but bang on for facts.
Mark S.
@Dave:
I agree. Next year’s pageant should feature:
How da Moon get dere?
How da Moon get dere?
How da Moon get dere?
How da Moon get dere?
How da Moon get dere?
Carl Nyberg
There’s a theory that the government played a role in enabling the 9/11 attacks.
As long as we’re all about teaching both sides of the issues, let’s include teaching this theory too.
It does seem that some version of post modernism has won the day in the United States. There is no truth. We should be sensitive to the perspective of people who are clearly ignorant.
All these people who think the schools should be teaching creationism… how serious are they about their faith?
If you were serious about your religious ideology, would you want it taught by a public school teacher who probably doesn’t share your faith?
MikeJ
@The Other Chuck:
The job of Miss America isn’t to go around telling people, “you’re a fucking moron”, even if they are. At least I don’t think so. I’m not real clear on what Miss America’s “job” is. But I’m pretty sure telling people the truth about themselves doesn’t fall in there.
Linda Featheringill
So now we get to choose our own facts and run with them? Yeah.
Montysano
Pretty girls spouting nonsense: such a dilemma for this shallow male….
MattR
Miss Louisiana was not bad either. Not that definitive and no actual rationale (though the same can be made for Miss CT) but no mention of teach both sides and letting people decide.
@MikeJ:
I was gonna mention this. I am sure they are coached to try and provide a middle of the road, vanilla answer.
FlipYrWhig
Some people want to see kids learn about inches and feet, but the Bible uses cubits, so why not teach both sides? What’s the harm? Not that Eurohomosocia1ist metric system, though.
Mark S.
I actually like Miss Virginia’s answer:
When her pageant days are behind her, she would be perfect for a conservative think tank.
JC
I really don’t understand this idiocy. I mean, you can believe in evolution, and still believe – be a Deist, of a sort – that an intelligence created/maintains the whole system.
Right?
Odorless, colorless insubstantial mathematical theorems ‘run’ the Universe. And this includes evolution, in our specific case of Earth.
Where you then make the philosophical choice is the Universe as it is:
a. Just because/by accident
b. We live in a Matrix. (deeper layer of order/intelligence guides the Universe)
Neither of these requires the Bible, of course, which is a mythology.
Martin
Actually, I wonder if perhaps it’s just that all but one of them know who the audience for Miss America really is.
Amir_Khalid
Misses California and Wisconsin also sound like they’re all for it. Only Miss Alabama actually declares herself a creationist. But oh my goodness, it looks like most of these young women are resorting to that both-sides weaseling so as not to offend any creationists on the judges’ panel, or anyone watching at home. I think that’s the saddest thing here.
Citizen_X
Agreed. That is the job of Miss Punk Rock America.
PurpleGirl
Yes. Ms Connecticut and Ms. Vermont did answer in the affirmative about evolution; they do seem more intelligent than the others. Most of the other women are dumber than a sack of hair. (“Dumber than a sack of hair” taken from a Law & Order episode.)
Pet Peeve (I was a science geek for years): VA: I think little bits and pieces of evolution should be taught in schools because it is a theory and after all we all need to know about different theories so that we can figure out what we want to believe is true.
Ah, I don’t think that words means what you think it means. She means HYPOTHESIS. Theories have evidence to back them up as being true statement. Things start had an HYPOTHESIS and becomes a theory as evidence and proof and produced and replicated.
AAAAAAAARRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
chopper
oh, LA times, i love you so…
LOL. i totes forgot that Ryan was the GOP’s economic braintrust.
GOP rabble: so Paul, what would happen if we defaulted?
Ryan: well..uh…guys, let’s see…the dollars would…taxes, and small business…gosh!
j low
@Carl Nyber #18- Good point. And while we are teaching both sides, shouldn’t we be teaching terrorism too? Let the kids make up their own minds.
sukabi
Well it’s clear that our education system has been under assault for decades… the amount of jaw-dropping ignorance on display was epic… heaven forbid that we actually LEARN or TEACH something that might benefit someone… we should all just decide what we want to believe based on nothing more than fairy tales and ‘some guy said’…
it’s my belief and theory that 95% of those girls wouldn’t have passed a 5th grade class of 50 years ago…
middlewest
If you really want to be depressed, try doing the same thing with congress.
joes527
meh.
These are pageant answers.
They don’t represent what the speakers think or know (or don’t think or don’t know) about the topic. It is what they think will get them to the next level. Nothing more, nothing less.
The point of the question was to see if the contestant could address a topic that people feel strongly about without actually taking a position that might offend someone.
The “correct” response was to fill time with words w/o sounding incoherent and w/o actually saying anything.
Or did you think that the question was about evolution or education?
General Stuck
Dear gawd. Made it through the 5 minute mark, when miss Kentucky blew my mind and I had to stop before the drooling started.
sukabi
well I look forward to Pastafarinism and Islam being taught in schools as part of a well rounded religious education along side evolution… gotta get all sides so the children can make up their minds on what to believe…
oy, listening to that Q & A causes contact brain damage.
PurpleGirl
Argh indeed; proofreading fail.
Ah, I don’t think that word means what you think it means. She means HYPOTHESIS. Theories have evidence to back them up as being true statements. Things start out as an HYPOTHESIS and become a theory as evidence and proof are produced and replicated.
Bruce S
Good news for John McCain!
http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2011/07/15/270498/sarah-palin-premier-empty/
joes527
General Stuck
Dude.
They elected Rand Paul.
What were you expecting?
Mike Kay (Democrat of the Century)
none of these girls are hot :(
Poor Bert Parks is rolling over in grave.
ArchPundit
Miss Minnesota FTW even understanding that Catholics accept evolution and there is no incompatibility with faith.
You can dismiss them as just dim bulb pageant dingbats and largely be correct, but they aren’t far off what much of the public thinks.
Mike G
Seeking scientific knowledge from beauty contestants is like like seeking truth and accuracy from Fox News. You’re looking in the wrong place to begin with.
beltane
Wonkette has given us advance warning of an upcoming ugly pageant, aka Tea Party Twitter Debate http://wonkette.com/449564/actual-twits-to-tweet-in-tea-party-presidential-twitter-debate
Moderated by S.E. Cupp and Rusty Humphries (I.P. Daily and Dick Hertz must have prior engagements).
Zach
Spot-on Nancy-Grace-Face by Miss Louisiana @ 5:45.
A majority of these folks seem to have gotten through high school and college without ever being taught (or knowing they were being taught) evolution. Despite attacks, evolutionary principles are on just about every state science curriculum. Weird.
Mike Kay (Democrat of the Century)
Michelle Bachmann’s church thinks the Pope is the anti-christ.
So Romney belongs to a cult church and Bachmann belongs to a Klan church.
Ed Marshall
I watched Roger and Me the other day, and there is the part where he tries to ambush Miss Michigan about GM. She obviously is pretty damn savvy because she senses the trap and even says, “I’m trying to win Miss America in a month, and I’m trying not to take sides”.
The problem isn’t that they are idiots, it’s that it is totally not controversial to dismiss evolution, but it is highly controversial to dismiss creationism.
scav
Not watching, but evidently this was a bevy of beauties 100% in support of Gov Moonbeam’s teaching that alternative history, you know, the one where homosexuals actually did things. Christianity or Islam? Teach the Controversy!
JPL
One of the one hundred and one reasons I could never be a contestant. My answer is WTF, isn’t this 2011? Creationism is not a science.
MonkeyBoy
beeryblog posted a map and transcript of Miss USA responses.
I think he concluded that they were often trying to express what they thought the folks back home would want to hear.
They couldn’t have gotten far in the state contests if they hadn’t, and even if they won Miss USA (or didn’t) they didn’t want go home and be attacked by a howling mob or be denied opportunities to make money at grand reopening of local car dealerships.
But then again, many have the intelligence of a caterpillar.
JPL
Somehow I feel like we have lost the last forty years. I’m shocked that they seem to think evolution and creationism should be taught in the same way. WTF… How could the seventies be more enlightened. What is happening to our country? What happened to the Constitution about separation of Church and State…WTF..
Turgidson
I chuckled.
Waratah
What does it mean that so many thought this was a tough or trick question and clearly were uncomfortable answering.
I would love to see the answers of this question in similar contests in other countries.
Calouste
You’d think that, considering the Papacy had complete control over the contents of the Scripture for more than a millenium, the Antichrist would have removed any incriminating bits if he/she/it indeed was the Papacy.
Mike in NC
@ Mark S
FOX News probably has a talent agent at these pageants, scouting for prospective blond white anchorbots.
gelfling545
@PurpleGirl: Had some discussion last night with a young family friend about how difficult his years in a fundamentalist Christian High School made his college science courses, He had no clue & apparently the people teaching science there didn’t either so he was hideously unprepared starting with their total ignorance about what theory means in scientific parlance. They seemed to equate it with “Here’s an idea!”
JPL
Simple question.. Isn’t evolution still taught in schools? What was the purpose of the question?
Turgidson
…followed by: “this isn’t in my Atlas Shrugged cliff notes, so, it can’t be real.”
The Other Chuck
@Citizen_X:
I would totally watch a Punk Pageant.
JWL
Miss CT: “I do think evolution should be taught in school”.
Get out of this bed RIGHT NOW!
JPL
Tom, In response to your question And I’m too old to cry
NO..In fact sobbing is okay.
lamh34
New Orleans Native Ruby Bridges Visits White House as legendary Norman Rockwell painting is placed on WH wall leading into the Oval Office! This school was in my neighborhood, and a few of my family members children later attended this school before it was closed. 9TH WARD REPRESENT…lol!
Ruby Bridges Visits the White House
Joel
New Mexico isn’t concise but she’s pretty vocal in support of teaching scientific fact. So she gets a point, too.
BO_Bill
Ignore these ignorant paleo-hicks from Kansas who argue that mankind is the consequence of divinity. The suggestion that man is created in the image of God is laughable. Instead, HEED my words my Believers.
Evolution DID IN FACT EXIST, a long long time ago, in the jungles of sub-Saharan Africa. And then, 30,000 years ago Al Gore’s grandfather came down from the mountain and declared:
My children, BEHOLD my words that, from this day forward, EVOLUTION SHALL STOP, with the exception of outward physical features which are too difficult to deny. HENCEFORTH, some of you head north, out of humanities tender cradle. Remember that thou art not to undergo mutations that would otherwise modify you (with the exception of outward physical features which are too difficult to deny) to better withstand the rigors of the seasons, of metals, of agriculture, of gunpowder, and finally of industrialization.
Now go forth and prosper. Those of you who HEED my words will be allowed to teach at college. Heretics who doubt me shall die in a fire. Now, remember my words, FOREVER:
Diversity is Strength
…
We are all The Same
…
I will close the Achievement Gap (in exchange for cash)
Nellcote
What in the hell happened to Talking Points Memo? Now they’re using Halperin’s “BAM” in their big headline for the Prez. Their headlines have been degenrating for months but this is really a new low.
Mark S.
Dear fucking God
PurpleGirl
JPL:
Most of the women failed at that too — many ums and other filler sounds and words. (I stutter, I know filler words and sounds.)
Anne Laurie
Monkeyboy:
Quoted for Mfing truth. These are young women who have devoted many, many hours of physical labor (exercise, diet, practice) towards achieving “The Win” in a contest with arcane rules run by a tiny, inbred clique of aging Experts for the benefit of a spectator class with big
arsesmouths and small brains. The male equivalent would be:Some of them have weighed their future employment options against the risks of getting caught/injured. Some of them are using their underdeveloped prefrontal-lobe judgement skills to play ‘bad stuff can’t happen to me‘. Some of them are intimidated by their parents / coaches / social milieu into doing things they know (suspect) aren’t in their best interests. And some of them are just dumb ignorant kids who will end up as dumb ignorant adults, a tiny percentage of whom will become Roger Clement or Sarah Palin.
Not that it isn’t fun to mock these kids (especially for those of us whose high school years were not the best of our lives), but blaming them for being idiots is like blaming a labrador for splashing into a tank of sewage in pursuit of a stick. The animal is what it is — it’s the jerk who threw the stick into the sewage who deserves to be smacked.
Bludger
How do you defeat this enemy? Miss Progressive USA contest?
JPL
OT>> Another Repub family value marriage fails.. In this case I hope the wife said dear, you are batshit crazy and I have had enough.. Copied from the Guardian
DALLAS (AP) — Republican Rep. Pete Sessions, of Texas, says he and his wife of 27 years are separating.
Friday Night Dumps…
Bill Murray
at least you can now truthfully say you were blown by a Miss USA candidate
dead existentialist
I nominate her for Miss Punk USA.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GbQ43sFDQTM
Mike Kay (Democrat of the Century)
I blame the new gay marriage law.
Violet
OT — According to the official Sarah Palin movie Twitter feed:
That just depresses me. Apparently a bunch of showings have sold out.
Mike Kay (Democrat of the Century)
it’s not too hard to sell out a phone booth.
CalD
Is it life or is it The Onion. It’s getting harder and harder to tell.
mr. whipple
Uh huh. Just like the wingnut books are ‘best sellers’. Bought in bulk and given away for nothin’.
MattR
@Violet:
Sold out or filled with people who were given free tickets?
beltane
@Violet
The people who pack the theaters to see the Palin movie are the same ones who pack the crazy-house churches every Sunday morning. They are addicted to their lurid little fairy-tales aren’t they.
MikeJ
@Anne Laurie: Clemens
bkny
the last thing you’d want is an effective advocate for consumers … mr hopey changey dumps elizabeth warren. guess he’s thinking he’s got enough cover with the debt ceiling talks and rupert — not to mention late friday nite, that press coverage won’t be a problem.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-07-15/obama-eliminates-warren-as-consumer-head.html
lamh34
@bkmy,
Word on the twitterverse is that Warren is heading to Mass to run for Senate against Brown.
JPL
bkny..didn’t she say that although she would set up the organization, she did not want it full time. Maybe she’ll run for Senate… That is one debate I would watch.. Warren against Brown..
JPL
Ah..lamh34 beat me again, not that I’m keeping score or anything.
mr. whipple
Oh no, St. Elizabeth can now run for Senate or primary Obama.
The horrah, the horrah.
JC
BKNY,
Yes, can’t give progressives any wins. It might get the Rethugs mad, or even worse, the banksters mad.
WaterGirl
I would vote for Elizabeth Warren for Senate in a heartbeat! (wrong state, though)
And I pity the poor bastard who would have to debate Elizabeth Warren!
JC
I haven’t seen that, and I’ve read a lot of articles on her.
Southern Beale
I’m actually surprised at how many of these women said they thought evolution should be taught in schools. I expected it to be 99% “that’s from the devil, we need to teach our precious grown fetus people about Adam and Eve!”
Lolis
@lamh34:
OMG. I would love Warren to run!!!!!!!!!!!!!
MattR
@JC: On Bill Maher’s show several months ago she said she did not want to be nominated because she knew the process would take forever and while she was in limbo she would not be able to be involved in setting up the organization. At that point in time (can’t remember exactly how long ago this was), she viewed setting up the organization as the better option.
bkny
lamh34/JPL
hadn’t heard about the mass senate run; and jpl, all indications were that she wanted that consumer position and would have been terrific in it. she’s been travelling across the country meeting with local bankers — who came out in support of her. but it was the banksters who wanted her gone. and obama gave em what they wanted. again.
JPL
OT…………From Friday Night Dumps to Friday Night Lights.
There is still thirty minutes left and I already have tears in my eyes. Any other fans around? We lived in Dallas for five years and my youngest was in third grade when we moved. Today we spoke about the difference in high school stadiums when we moved to GA. Of course football is big in GA but it ain’t Texas.
mr. whipple
You need to keep up with the ‘progressive movement’, who first said she was the only person in the world who could run the new agency, only to try to draft her for Senate a couple months later.
JPL
bkny..she was pretty clear that she did not want to go through the process. Yes she would have been great but she understood the cards that Obama was dealt. She WILL make a great Senator.
SiubhanDuinne
Any news from Halteclere on the new baby? I’ve tried checking some of the other threads but may have just missed the announcement.
– – –
Or maybe there’s nothing to report yet.
JPL
SiubhanDuinne, I think we need to plan some type of GA meetup in the near future. Sometimes I feel like I have been sleeping under a rock since they are now asking beauty contestants whether or not evolution should be taught in schools.
hilts
Good article on Rick Perry
Rick Perry’s Army of God
h/t https://www.texasobserver.org/cover-story/rick-perrys-army-of-god
OzoneR
Good, the last thing we need is to send her into a hopeless confirmation process that will only end with her demonized and marginalized.
She was NEVER going to get confirmed…EVER. Why is this so hard to wrap around? We can’t even get the Republicans to NOT destroy the country by sending it into default, do you really think we can get them to confirm Warren. Get real.
NobodySpecial
@mr. whipple: Way to revision history there.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
How, exactly, would nominating her to a doomed nomination, which filibuster would be met with resounding indifference by the public at large, be a “win” for “progressives”? It would just give you another reason to bitch about Obama for something Republicans did….
Oh, I answered my own question.
SiubhanDuinne
@JPL 97: I would love to meet up with you and I’ve talked to SIA from time to time and know she would too. If you want to email me privately any time I’m at [email protected]. If we all wear/carry our TunchLily gear it should be pretty easy to recognize each other :-)
SiubhanDuinne
Okay, I give up. Whythehell did the first chunk of my reply to JPL end up block quoted?? I don’t understand and FYWP.
JPL: my personal email is SiubhanDuinne (at) gmail (dot) com
OzoneR
Yes, but she didn’t want to go through the confirmation process.
The 47 Republicans who vowed to filibuster her nomination had nothing to do with it, sure.
stuckinred
JPL
Have you read the book? What they did to that film was a crime. There was no happy ending to the Permian Panthers story. I bailed on Billy Bob after that travesty.
OzoneR
Because a fight is worth having or something and Republicans will be forced to vote for her, just ask Circuit Court Judge Goodwin Liu.
SiubhanDuinne
A thought: maybe using the @ symbol twice is an automatic block quote. That must have been what happened. Live, learn, rinse, repeat.
OzoneR
She’ll never beat Scott Brown unfortunately, but the silver lining is we get to watch the left twist themselves in knots trying to figure out why Brown beat her so badly. My guess is “Obama didn’t do enough to get her elected” becomes the excuse.
stuckinred
JPL
Speaking of tearful, we just watched Runnin on Empty with River Phoenix about anti-Vietnam radicals on the run after a bombing. Very good film, very sad.
Bruce S
OMFG!!!!
Lawrence O’Donnell Just Said Something!!!
He said that Adam Green and the folks protesting – with threats of witholding their campaign volunteerism and dollars – any notion of Obama doing spending cuts that impact Medicare, Medicaid or Social Security are HELPING the President. Strengthening his hand! Called Green “a friend of this program.”
Lawrence O’Donnell’s brain has obviously been kidnapped and he’s been replaced by a Firebagging Friend of Jane Hamsher.
(Actually I don’t really give a shit what Lawrence O’Donnell says in terms of my making up my mind about anything. Not even close to an essential commentator. Rachel is the only cable host who even occasionally commits acts of journalism. LO’D also had a riff tonite that was utterly stupid – about the folks who don’t want eligibility ages raised on Medicare or SS not having opposed the current eligibility increases enacted back in the ’80s. That’s a ridiculous stretch and beyond irrelevant.
O’Donnell is fun, but he’s best taken with grains of salt and, frankly, I rarely have heard him bloviate on anything that I didn’t already get. And he chooses his outrage to match “du jour” – I’ve seen him raging against the very notion of putting deficit reduction “on the table” in the midst of deep recession on Scarborough’s train wreck of a show just as passionately as he is now promoting the awesomeness of Obama’s deficit reduction gambit. I don’t think there’s much question but that his best television role has been as President Bartlett’s father.)
mr. whipple
I hope she can beat Brown. I’ll send her some $ towards that end.
But what will be really funny, if she wins, will be hissy fits that will ensue when she breaks from progressive sainthood. I’ll happily send some $ in the anticipation of seeing that happen!
stuckinred
Bruce S
Bullshit, his point is that all this crap from the “professional left” drives people TO Ombana. Get a grip.
OzoneR
That’s probably true, yeah. The average voters hates teabaggers and hates the left, so if the left is attacking the President, the “moderate independent” voters who don’t stand for anything except being “moderate independents” think he must be doing a good job, regardless of what they attacking him for.
It’s called triangulation. The left hates it cause it works.
Anne Laurie
Bkny:
Yeah, this is depressing. Assuming this is actually what the President intends to do, and not just a “some people say” trial balloon — since 65% of our politics and 87% of its media coverage now falls into that category — it’s a godsdamned shame and a giant waste-of-talent FAIL, to be divided between the GOPer thugs who yowled about Warren at the behest of their paymasters and those members of the Obama administration more concerned with electoral calculations than actual government.
From everything I’ve read, Professor Warren (being a grownup, and a very gracious woman) decided around this time last year that it was more important to have a CFPB than to waste precious time (which would be used by the banksters & Kochsuckers to cripple the bureau in its cradle) battling the GOP morons looking to grandstand. I think she would certain like to be the first head of the agency she worked so hard to creat, but I would like to lose weight without dieting or exercise and I’m not getting my wish, either.
As for the MA senate seat… first, I’m not convinced Warren wants to turn freelance politician at this stage of her life and career. She’s got a family she actually seems to like, she’s got tenure at a prestigious university, she’s co-written a couple excellent finance books for general readers and could no doubt get a decent advance to write another (or her memoirs), and she might even think she’d have more power upholding the goals of the CFPB from outside than she would without having to pre-clear her every offhand comment with David Axelrod.
There are half-a-dozen Democratic candidates already lined up to contest Scott “Cosmo Boy” Brown for the Senate seat. Most of them have run for office before, and some of them have already locked up key donors and/or campaign managers. IF Warren were to announce that she wanted to join the scrum, I’d be thrilled to the full allowable monetary extent and would immediately sign up to do whatever I could as a volunteer. But it’s not going to break my heart if she chooses (as I suspect she will) not to do so.
Either way, the Hallelujah Troll Chorus is going to attack her, because they’ve decided that any praise for a left-of-center-right political figure notPresident Obama is a defection, if not outright theft. These people have turned themselves into a cult just as demented as the “if yer not with us yer with the terrrists” post-9/11 gibberers, and the rest of us sane people are just going to have to live with the screaming and shit-flinging.
JPL
stuckinred nope..but my closest neighbor in Dallas grew up in Odessa. She met her husband at Texas Tech which was not accepted by her father-in-law since his son went to Tech. I always knew her father-in-law lived and breathed A & M football but when we moved to GA, I found out he was banned from the games because he gave players jobs during the summer along with cars and condos, etc. The only reason they didn’t get the death penalty was because of the SMU debacle.
Our neighborhood was interesting. We are not talking about a neighborhood of mcmansions but a neighborhood of ranch houses. I went to PTA meetings with the wife of the athletic director of SMU when they got the death penalty. He had turned down the AD job with Ohio State the year before because he thought they could clean up the program before they got caught. Well that didn’t work out. The interesting thing about knowing the AD of SMU at that time was they told me if my sons ever wanted to play football not to use school issued supplies. Fortunately that was not an option.
Texas and football is just different.
OzoneR
Yes that would be fun too, listening how she’s betraying the principles she ran on (which she likely won’t run on) and how we need to primary her in 2018!
Mike Kay (Democrat of the Century)
Sainthood is irrevocable, no matter what you do. Just look at Weiner. A married man sending unsolicited nude photos to complete strangers couldn’t get him kicked out of the club.
Howard Dean went on MSNBC Tuesday and called for cuts in social security and medicare, and just 3 weeks ago he was the keynote speaker at Nutroots.
St. Feingold voted for John Roberts for chief justice, as well as Ashcroft, Rumsfeld, and that loser Rice. He voted against Elizabeth Warren’s Consumer Financial Protection Bureau and refused to support ….. wait for it…. the public option. And he’s still an idol, worshiped by the rank and file.
OzoneR
I’m not sure I’d label spending months and months with a new agency with no head because she’s languishing in the Senate without a confirmation as “governing.”
I think I’d label THAT a “political calculation.”
mr. whipple
Didn’t the real progressives call for Bernie Sanders to be primaried over his support of HCR?
stuckinred
JPL
Read the book. The author lived there for a year and carefully documented the abusive environment at “Mojo”. As far as Texas football, whatever. I served with a moron Aggie and I was not impressed. When Machovich left Illinois it was with great pleasure that I saw him crash and burn at Austin in short order. Almost as much fun as watching them implode last year. Bunch of loudmouth assholes in football like everything else.. Fuck Texas.
Mike Kay (Democrat of the Century)
so why do you watch his show?
stuckinred
Mike Kay
Lawrence predicted exactly when Trump would bail. He’s a bit overbearing but he knows what he’s talking about.
Mike Kay (Democrat of the Century)
nah, only hamsher did, and she’s not a progressive, she’s a republican-consultant
Mike Kay (Democrat of the Century)
stuckinred
I like O’Donnell’s show. I was only asking “Bruce S” why he watches O’Donnell when he says he hates the show.
stuckinred
Mike Kay
I’m witcha
Lolis
@OzoneR:
I think Warren could beat Brown. It would take a lot of work but she has a better shot than anyone else in the ring so far.
Mike Kay (Democrat of the Century)
Anne Laurie
Who has attacked her?
All that garden blogger has left you with nothing but straw men.
piratedan
@OzoneR: in Massachusetts? She has no shot?
what are you smokin?
The only reason that Brown won the last time is that Martha Coakley ran one of the most idiotic campaigns known to mankind. She REFUSED to go out and engage the voters, was quoted as showing her disdain for the voters and in doing so, treated the election as if it was a forgone conclusion and in no surprise got her ass handed to her.
For someone as smart as Warren is, I certainly wouldn’t expect that kind of idiocy and if you think Brown is a “safe seat” based on his voting record and portfolio then why in the hell should anyone bother?
Anne Laurie
See, it’s started already.
“We don’t care whether people who agree with our purported political goals win or lose! What’s really important is punishing Our Internal Enemies, even if that means rewarding the people who are actively working against us!”
As Miss Manners would say: Your mother must be very proud.
OzoneR
Yes, even polling has put Scott Brown 20 points ahead of Warren and over 50 percent. Will it be closer? sure, but Scott Brown is popular in Massachusetts, this is an undeniable fact and as been a thorn in the ass of Democrats and liberals for over year, and this state elected Republican governors in four straight elections.
JPL
stuckinred, At the time in the early eighties, Athletic Directors were earning maybe 100,000 at the most and look at what they are earning now. Winning is everything was the motto but the boosters ran the program. SMU tried to clean up their program but were told by the Gov. Clements that they had to honor their contracts with players including the red corvettes and all. When SMU got caught, they only had one player left on the contract. Even though every one with the program got axed they honored the contract with the Hitch’s family. I don’t blame coaches and AD’s demanding millions because they also can be put on the street the next day.
Lolis
@Mike Kay (Democrat of the Century):
Yes, the Howard Dean stuff is funny. The other day on DKOs someone floated Howard’s name as a person who should primary Obama over the debt ceiling negotiations. I replied that Dean had just endorsed the cuts that were being floated regarding Medicare and SS. These people are annoying.
gwangung
You think she has a good shot? As you say, she’d certainly run a much sharper campaign…but is that enough to overcome a more experienced opponent who has incumbency on his side?
OzoneR
Hey, I’d love for her to win, but in the likely event she doesn’t, I’ll nurse my wounds with watching the left’s reaction.
Lolis
@OzoneR:
That just means outside groups and Dems have a lot of negative ads to run on Brown’s voting record. This is the best year to oust Brown. Yes we can.
harlana
Lolis: What do you know about it? Did you do or say anything when we invaded Iraq? Just curious.
Oh! OMG! I mentioned principles! So sorry!
OzoneR
Brown hasn’t voted for anything egregious or against anything remarkably popular.
The only vote I can see him taking that attackable is his vote against Elena Kagen, and it’s hard to run against a candidate the grounds he voted against someone’s confirmation.
He voted for DADT repeal, he opposed Ryan’s budget, I’m not sure what the smoking gun is. He gets to use those as proof that he’s a “moderate independent”
The Raven
The ghost of Lysenko is snickering.
harlana
Oh, and everybody seems to agree NOW that we should not be waging wars in the Middle East when we’re unable to employ our own people for a living wage. At the same time, all those before you who had the good sense to say “STOP” are having to bear the brunt of all the rest of you who were just tripping along in their ordinary, comfortable lives, thinking, well this will never affect US!
THANKS! Luv ya! Have enjoyed this horrific, wild ride. Again, thank you, it’s been a real character-building episode.
harlana
Let’s seeee (checks calculator) I think it’s been, hmmm, 5, 6 years since I fucking beat my brains out to save you people who despise people like me. If I have to read one more comment about how people like me should STFU, let me put you in a frickin time machine and you can live it. What were you doing in 2004-2005? Oh, you just woke up, here’s a cuppa jo.
JPL
Next year I think the contestants should be asked if they think the world is flat and if so or not why?
karen marie
beltane: Also, too, how many people in the theater bought their own tickets as opposed to a rightwing sugar daddy buying out the theater and giving the tickets away.
watergirl: I live in Massachusetts, and I’m not sure Warren could beat Brown, sad to say. He hasn’t done anything horrible (other than being a Republican and he had that against him the first time round) or said anything especially stupid. For an allegedly Democratic-leaning state, the western half of the state is pretty conservative.
WaterGirl
well, it seems like it would be easier to beat him after being a one-termer than to wait and try to beat him after yet another term.
as i said, i would love to see someone as smart and practical as Elizabeth Warren get elected to the Senate. on the other hand, I would think the senate (as is) would be a maddening experience for someone like her.
it just seems to me that warren is truly a populist, not someone who plays a populist on tv, so I would think voters would LOVE her.
fasteddie9318
I don’t really care if they nominate Warren, Bill Ayers, or Eric Cantor; they don’t actually expect to get anybody confirmed, do they? If the White House is expecting the whackjobs to gratefully confirm whoever they do nominate, they really haven’t been paying attention.
fasteddie9318
Thank goodness you’ll be able to feel better in such a constructive way.
MaximusNYC
I am not attacking Warren, nor am I a troll, but I think it’s pathetic and bizarre that she has been anointed the latest white knight who can save us from Obama.
There is a certain strain of infantile hero-worship in the emosphere — the flip side of Rahmophobia and similar fixations.
These people all have their strengths and weaknesses. Best not to idolize or demonize them, but to focus on policies rather than personalities.
OzoneR
He lost the western half of the state by a huge margin, it was the Boston and Worcester suburbs that were the problem.
OzoneR
Who says it’s constructive?
OzoneR
So why the hell sent Elizabeth Warren to slaughter?
OzoneR
because the voters like populists?
Anne Laurie
Karen Marie:
So is the eastern half. And they’re both pretty sexist, too. Sure, Coakley, and Jane Swift, and their fellow Y-chromosome-challenged contenders have run fairly terrible campaigns. But part of the problem is that Masshole politicians on both sides of the aisle suffer from such corrosive cases of “Aiee! Girl Cooties!” that only “non-threatening”, i.e. “ineffective” women are permitted to win on the lower levels. And the same ineffectiveness that endears them to the party elites makes it impossible for them to win state-wide campaigns. Wondering why Coakley ran such a tonedeaf campaign is like wondering why Michael Steele couldn’t use his position as RNC chair to make his party a little less blatantly racist — if they’d had such firebrand intentions, they wouldn’t have gotten those jobs in the first place.
karen marie
ozone: Really? I knew about Worcester/Boston suburbs but I guess I put the “ass” in “assume” on that one. Even so still, I think he’d be hard to unseat except if he started with the crazy talk and I don’t think that’s going to happen. I’m in SE Mass where Coakley won big, but we’re Barney Frank territory.
karen marie
Anne Laurie @ 151: I’ve always lived in the most Democratic-leaning parts of the state — downtown Boston and now, for the last 10 years, in SE Mass. I’m always taken aback by the reality of the rest of the state.
OzoneR
Actually I’m pretty sure Scott Brown won Frank’s district
http://offensivepolitics.net/blog/2010/01/mapping-ma-election-results/
OzoneR
Massachusetts went pretty strongly for Hillary in the primary. Are they more racist then sexist?
Bruce S
#124 – Mike Kay – You said I hate Lawrence O’Donnell’s show. I didn’t. I mostly enjoy it as long as I don’t sit through the entire hour. I just said he wasn’t an essential commenter. I don’t think that Jon Stewart is an “essential commenter” either, but I watch bits of both of their shows – FF thru for the best stuff – because they both can be entertaining and insightful. O’Donnell is almost as funny as Stewart in a completely different, dead-pan way. (Paul Krugman is an “essential commenter” IMHO, because I learn stuff that’s not reliant on his having an opinion. Ezra Klein is an “essential commenter” IMHO, because he is prolific and digs into issues with some depth and persistence. Lawrence is a bit too much like Scarborough, in that he’ll always take you back to his days when he worked on the budget committee.)
And the reason I take Maddow at least a bit more seriously than O’Donnell is because she’s actually done stuff that’s not jsut sitting in a chair in front of a teleprompter. Gone to Baghdad and Kabul with Richard Engel in tow. My guess is I’ll never see Lawrence do that kind of shit.
fasteddie9318
I don’t recall saying that they should.
OzoneR
So now you don’t agree she should be appointed? WTF?