Is Cameron really going to survive Rupertdammerung?
Ed Llewellyn, David Cameron’s chief of staff, turned down the chance to have a briefing on phone hacking, Yates revealed. This is what Sir Paul Stephenson was referring to earlier when he talked about an official wanting to protect David Cameron. But Yates did not say why Llewellyn turned down the offer. But he said the offer was “properly” rejected,
arguingwithsignposts
The Murdochs are in the dock now! CSPAN3.
arguingwithsignposts
James Murdoch: We are really, really *sorry*. Really *sorry*. blah, blah, blah.
ETA: Rupert adds: “This is the most humble day of my life.” – I’d add: so far.
mistermix
@arguingwithsignposts: Rupert has feelings, dammit!
shortstop
So delicious.
serge
I am fetched back to my youth…how much better does it get than to see the abasement of such tools as Agnew, Nixon, the rest of the gang…and now more of the same? Cameron, Murdoch, Stephenson, Yates, the flame-haired and flaming Ms Brooks.
Those were exciting days. Now we need the Brits. Watching the live committee hearing, I can’t help but to despair further about the quality of questioning in such hearings in the US. How have we become so brilliantly stupid, so vapid, venal, and vain?
We in the US are fighting against monstrous imbecility to save our country yet we have only nincompoops to hear out.
R-Jud
Wow. Just wow. Three days ago I said this would hurt Cameron, but not mortally. Now I’m not so sure.
arguingwithsignposts
I want them to ask about The Sun and the Times.
Han's Big Snark Solo
I think Rupert is more likely to survive than Cameron. Cameron is just a pol, they are cheap. Murdoch, however, is the money behind the pols. The money never pays. Quick question: how many days did Ken Lay spend behind bars? How much jail time did the titans of Wall Street earn?
One way (death) or another (political bribery) money almost always gets away with it.
To me, the amazing thing about the Murdoch scandal in the UK, is how terrified the pols were of Murdoch. It sure sounds like Murdoch had perfected a subtle form of blackmail. “You do what I want or News of the World will assassinate your character.”
It reminds me of J. Edgar Hoover without the cross dressing.
arguingwithsignposts
From Felix Salmon’s live blog:
Guster
They’re very sorry and humble. Can we move on now?
GregB
To use a line from Joe Pesci from Goodfellas.
You stuttering prick you.
James doesn’t inspire confidence.
kay
Oooh. Great question, to Murdoch. Why didn’t he know she was paying police?
arguingwithsignposts
Perhaps handsmile or some other Brit can address the extent to which News International had a hold on the politicians in Britain. Certainly to a great extent. But I don’t think you could say they could have the same power in the U.S., could they? Even though we have the Ivy League connections, the Village, etc., the population just seems too large, and the country too geographically spread-out. Just a thought.
kay
“I didn’t hear that”. “That’s the first I’ve heard of that”. “Nope”.
Hah! He’s a remarkably uninformed media mogul.
mistermix
Man, Rupert looks old and out of touch.
MazeDancer
Rupert must have decided to step down.
Because he’s answering like a senile old man.
Doddering, spaced-out. Like “I’m not the monster they say I am”. Interesting approach.
patrick II
I just want to say how totally schizophrenic I am getting. I have never experienced such swings between good news/bad news.
Good news — Rupert, that asshole of assholes, is finally getting his. Bad news — Conservative republicans think that not raising the debt ceiling and the resulting harm to our government is a good thing. Good news — Brooks resigns, Bad news — cut, cap, balance bill is put forward as rational, Good news — destruction of evil media empire seems imminent, Bad news — destriction of only intermittently evil government also seems imminent, Round and round we go.
Rejoice, cry, rejoice, cry. I am going nuts.
arguingwithsignposts
@kay: He’s practicing the Alberto Gonzalez shuffle.
MattF
I’m not watching the proceedings– being that I’m employed and all– but… Is anyone actually believing anything Murdoch says? Is Satan sitting in the back row of the hearing room, with a shit-eating grin? Are the police sounding as stupid as they look?
arguingwithsignposts
@patrick II:
Well, I don’t know anyone outside the GOP who says it’s rational. But it’s been put forward. Any yahoo in congress can put forward a bill.
JGabriel
DougJ @ Top:
Maybe. But then, most people thought Nixon would survive Watergate, up until a few days before he resigned.
.
Villago Delenda Est
The only apology that should be entertained from Rupert Murdoch, his children, or his minions, is a Captain Needa apology.
Violet
Wow, Rupert looks AWFUL. Taking forever to answer things. Looks and sounds very old. Forgetful. And what was up with him banging the table about how many people he rules? Holy cow! Not even covering the content, they’re coming across TERRIBLY on tone, body language, affect, etc.
cathyx
Did anyone really expect him to admit to any knowledge of any wrongdoing? Really?? Imagine if he did. Never will happen.
kay
He’s not doing well, IMO. A long pause then “nope!” on everything is not credible. He doesn’t read the newspaper or watch the news about his own company? Come on.
Ian
Tom Watson is a national hero right now.
Violet
Rupert: “You’re really not saying ‘amnesia’, you’re really saying ‘lying.” OUCH! He’s getting combative and it’s early. Rupert looks BAD.
Villago Delenda Est
It’s important to note that Agnew’s downfall had nothing at all to do with Watergate…it was his own totally independent corruption scandal that involved receiving payoffs for previous services rendered as Governor of Maryland.
Agnew was “out of the loop” on Watergate. He was a useful tool for Nixon, in that he rallied the wingnuts of the time in support of Nixon, but Agnew’s demise was for actions unrelated to Nixon’s.
arguingwithsignposts
@kay:
Oh, I agree, he’s not coming off as credible. And they’re obviously out for his hide. He does look out of touch.
Anyone watching the News Corp. share price atm?
DZ
@ 13 ArguingwithSignposts:
Do you have an issue with people who went to Ivy League universities? All of them?
Violet
@Ian:
YES. And his soft tone is just fabulous. Sounds like a kindly uncle, but he’s a veritable bulldog. Won’t let go. Brilliant stuff.
mistermix
@Ian – he’s doing a great job – respectful and gentle, but tough. And man, did he shut down James just now.
JGabriel
@MazeDancer:
The slower Rupert answers, the fewer questions they can ask him.
.
Violet
James sounds desperate. Keeps trying to answer questions. But to me he comes across as not all that bright and terribly over eager to be nice to the panel in hopes they’ll go easy.
Dennis SGMM
@Violet:
Rupert to an aide in the limo after the hearings:
“I think we fooled those wankers. Now, I want the following people sacked immediately…”
Yurpean
There seems to be no way Rupert can carry on as CEO of News Corp – he’s completely out of touch with the facts of the situation, how can he be in charge of a huge multinational?
arguingwithsignposts
@DZ:
All of them? No. But are you denying the existence of such a club?
eemom
@ Kay
It is ever thus in these situations. The choice is between looking like an idiot or admitting culpability. They go with idiot every time.
Violet
Rupert’s banging on the table again. He is SO used to getting his own way. No clue how to act in this situation.
Yevgraf
He’s trying to look less like the Bond villain that he is.
Conservatism in action – fuck up horribly with evil plots, then play dumb.
Still, it would be awesome if he admitted to the sham of the 2000 Florida machinations while there.
arguingwithsignposts
Kudos to whomever the MP is who told James Murdoch to STFU when he was asking Rupert questions.
MazeDancer
@Violet:
Rupert’s senility act has to be an act. Perhaps an attempt at “can’t attack a sick old man” ploy.
He woke up and started talking in his regular voice defending laying off 200 people.
Violet
@MazeDancer:
But he can’t have it both ways. If he’s the senile old man, how can he run the huge company?
NonyNony
@Han’s Big Snark Solo
Depends on what you mean by “survive”.
If you mean that Rupert is more likely to not go to jail than Cameron, I think neither of them are going to jail. The worst that happens to someone that high up the ladder is that they resign and then the whole thing disappears with a “well that’s justice” and people move on to the next thing.
OTOH if you mean that Rupert is more likely to keep his job than Cameron – that’s more iffy IMO. Rupert has shareholders to answer to and if it looks like he no longer knows what he’s doing – or if he looks like a doddering old man while doing it – they will smell blood in the water and demand his resignation. Watch the News Corp. share price – the more it drops the more likely Murdoch is to be asked to “step down for the good of the company.”
kay
They shouldn’t let James jump in with his slick blather when dad stumbles. Is this a team effort? Rupert is a big boy. Surely he can answer a question. Shut the hell up, James. No one asked you anything.
drkrick
From the previous thread:
File under “lessons Rumsfeld and Cheney drew from Watergate.” For example: David Kelley and the careers of people like Valerie Plame, Ashleigh Banfield and Scott Ritter.
RalfW
re: mistermix @15: Rupert Murdoch is either totally out of touch or a total liar. Either way he’s giving his board plenty of reason to jettison him.
Chris
I’ve seen some Fox News, and “monster” is too mild a term for anyone who spews the kind of crap he does, worldwide, on a daily, 24-hour basis.
That’s not surprising. He’s used to being the power behind the throne, the puppeteer holding the strings, the man in the shadows. Not out in the light where everybody can see him. I doubt if he can even remember the last time he was exposed to the public in an environment he didn’t totally control.
scav
Anybody think the James (let me jump in and explain Horshak Me! Me! Me! dance) and the Rupe (doddering old buffoon shuffle) is designed as a hail mary to help boster James as heir? Cause why in the hell would they antagonize people like this? They’re both annoying
Uh oh, Rupe’s amnesiac doddering is slipping.
Villago Delenda Est
Ronald Reagan on Iran-Contra.
Is he a criminal, or is he merely incompetent?
They’ll go with incompetent every time.
MazeDancer
@Violet:
He has to have decided to step down. James trying to answer for him was like setting James up as the protector.
But Rupert’s having a little trouble sticking to the act.
However, this feels like a set-up for something. Staying out of prison. Something.
Villago Delenda Est
The deserting coward and the Dark Lord Cheney agree to give testimony, but not under oath, and only together.
Uh-huh.
GregB
They are shooting themselves in the head.
Now every person that they have thrown under the bus has an enormous axe to grind.
They are trying to cut off the gangrene but it is too late.
Now the long knives come out.
Han's Big Snark Solo
Is anyone counting the times Murdoch says some version of, “I don’t recall.”
Conservatives have very poor memory, remember Iran-Contra? Because Conservatives don’t and didn’t at the time.
Violet
@Chris:
According to his biographer, it’s been decades since Rupert has been in this position, and he didn’t do well then.
James is a slimy toad. Apologies to toads. He also seems not terribly competent. The only reason he’s got his job is he’s Rupert’s kid. He won’t be able to stand on his own.
JGabriel
A certain motif is emerging in Rupert’s answers regarding wrong-doing at NI: We won’t investigate wrong-doing in our companies, but we’ll co-operate with police if they investigate it.
Neither of the Murdoch’s seems to realize how irresponsible, insensitive, self-interested, and arrogant that looks.
.
mistermix
This new guy asking questions is no Tom Watson. He’d be top of the class in the US Congress, but he’s letting James filibuster and he’s drilling in on dumb stuff (back door of #10).
Yevgraf
Obviously, he needs a tax cut and an end to regulations so that the confusion is minimized.
RalfW
cathyx
I’m sure at the end of the hearing, Murdoch will say in a speech that even though he didn’t know what was going on at his newspapers, he will take full responsibility because it is inexcusable to not be aware of these illegal activities in order to put a stop to them before they hurt people.
Ok, that was really just a joke.
drkrick
Of course not. The point is to see how unbelievable and bad he looks doing dodging the admission. Alberto Gonzalez didn’t admit anything, but he came out of those hearing with about 1% of the career prospects he had walking in.
Some kind of Perry Mason moment is highly unlikely, but R. Murdoch as a diminished figure without the credibility needed to stay in control of his empire is not. And presumably without him at the top it will be more likely that more of the rot comes to light.
Violet
Rupert keeps looking like he’s nodding off. And what’s with the “we can’t hear you” stuff? Although I think some of the issue is the Scottish MP’s accent. I think Rupert is having some trouble with that (I am a bit, so I have a teensy bit of sympathy there).
patrick II
@ arguingwithsignposts
Isn’t there a significant percentage of Americans who identify themselves as republicans? I remember when republicans were conservative but rational. You can’t dismiss their numerical significance as you seem to do because of the irrationality of their position.
I have a nostalgia for rational republicans.
GregB
Meester Blair visited yew, half way around the worreld.
Love the Scottish accent.
martha
The “back door to Number 10 Downing Street” comment may seem like a little thing, but it’s one more knife in the back of David Cameron.
Violet
According to Michael Wolff, Rupert’s biographer, Rupert is desperate to save James. That’s the main goal of this whole testimony.
arguingwithsignposts
@patrick II:
Identifying as Republican and agreeing with the teabagger GOP that is currently somehow in control of the house are two different things. I don’t dismiss their significance, fwiw. They are a danger and a cancer on the nation precisely because of their significance in Congress.
Han's Big Snark Solo
@NonyNony:
You may well be right. What percent of News Corp shares does the Murdoch family own?
With that said I see four possibilities.
1) Cameron and Murdoch keep their positions
2) Murdoch keeps his position and Cameron is sacked
3) Cameron keeps his position and Murdoch is sacked
4) Both the bastards are sacked
Of these I think, sadly, that option 1 is most likely, followed by 2, followed by 4, followed by 3.
Of course, I can’t watch the proceedings right now so I don’t have a feel for how things are going. Nor am I an expert on politics in the UK.
Chris
Yeah, I also remember that they supported the New Deal and civil rights legislation once upon a time.
scav
I do like where James more or less implied that not only are there procedures in place for out of court settlements — hence, they’re routine, but moreover, settlements of this size are chump change, just grab the stuff from petty cash and don’t bother the higher ups.
ETA: oh good, I’m not the only one.
arguingwithsignposts
@Han’s Big Snark Solo:
As I read it, there is a split stock situation with News Corp., sort of like the NYT, which means they are not a totally public company.
arguingwithsignposts
@Chris:
I believe Lincoln fought a war, once upon a time.
catclub
RalfW @ 47 “Either way he’s giving his board plenty of reason to jettison him.”
Check the voting rights on the stock Murdochs own. I think it is heavily weighted in his favor.
This is also part of the reason for the Murdoch discount – stock would be much more valuable if Murdochs were not meddling owners, but stock also is as high as it is because of Murdoch’s longterm control. So who knows.
MazeDancer
@Violet:
“Saving James” as a strategy helps explain some of this incompetency performance. If Rupert too old to go on, who else is there but James kind of reasoning.
And Rupert just interrupted James to add how James was new to the company at a certain wrong-doing discovered moment so couldn’t have been involved.
DZ
@ArguingwithSignposts:
It is quite possible that I am just oblivious to such things, but I went to Brown University from 1966-70, and I’m certainly not part of any club, as you put it, nor do I know anyone from those days who is. It was the 60s. Our primary interests were pot, beer and girls. For me, that evolved to work, pot, wine, my wife and my daughters. I don’t deny the existence of anything – I just don’t know.
Violet
@MazeDancer:
Yeah, Rupert clearly loves his son. He’s doing what he can to save him. But James is nothing without his Daddy. He’d never be able to stand on his own.
arguingwithsignposts
@DZ: Fair enough. FWIW, I wasn’t speaking specifically to Brown, which isn’t in the same stratosphere of political influence as Harvard and Yale. I should perhaps qualify the phrase with that.
ETA: It should perhaps be the Harvard/Yale Club, instead of the Ivy club.
shortstop
What’s with James Murdoch’s accent? It’s an odd amalgam of American, British and Australian. Perfectly calculated, I assume.
Violet
Oh my. The woman MP (don’t know her name) just asked if they’d think twice about some of their headlines, like the “Hillsborough 96”. Rupert replied that he “wasn’t aware” of any wrongdoing and it was a matter of taste. Yikes.
Han's Big Snark Solo
@arguingwithsignposts:
I think Rupert’s ability to maintain control of News Corp is dependent upon how the ownership is structured and what percent of shares he owns.
MazeDancer
@shortstop:
Have puzzled over his accent since his first word.
Certainly had to fight the Brit inflection if you live there long enough. But that accent isn’t going to help if he heads up American enterprises.
JGabriel
Shorter James Murdoch:
.
Violet
@shortstop:
He’s clearly a man without a country. I don’t think that will play all that well, actually. It reinforces the “News Corp is bigger than all your little countries” image.
Aaaannnd Rupert is banging the table again.
Han's Big Snark Solo
Andrew Sullivan has the following exchange up as the most remarkable of the day so far:
I don’t see why this surprises Sullivan. Being a “conservative” these days means never taking responsibility for anything. And whose fault is that omnipresent lack of responsibility? Arguably it is the fault of the right wing media, which is dominated by who? Rupert Murdoch.
Of course Murdoch won’t take responsibility for anything. That is what he does and who he is!
Violet
The committee is letting James talk too much. They need to make Rupert talk again.
MazeDancer
NY Times live blog on the “poor old man” set-up:
“Nick Robinson, The BBC’s political editor, writes on his blog from inside the committee room:
...now I try to be amused
Rupert being an old man concerned about his legacy, I suspect what would hurt him worst is to see James get sacked and the Murdoch media dynasty end. Here’s hoping.
Villago Delenda Est
The military, at least in theory, asserts that a unit’s commander is responsible for everything his command does or fails to do. The reality of course is that if we can pass the blame down the chain of command somewhere, we’ll do so. This is the lesson of My Lai…and Abu Ghraib.
Murdoch isn’t even being this up front about controlling his own organization.
NonyNony
@MazeDancer
It may be that they’re going for “look at the big bad Parliament beating up on the old man” sympathy angle.
But the only thing I can think of are six little words: “Don’t you think he looks tired?”
I don’t see how he survives looking like a doddering old man in front of Parliament. His doddering has already killed off the BSkyB deal. And even if NewsCorp is structured so that he never has to face the wrath of his shareholders, he’s still going to have to deal with the share price. Which is high because everyone assumes that Murdoch is competent and evilly clever. “Doddering old man” doesn’t fit the part.
I think the doddering old man routine is going to backfire on him. Time will tell I guess.
JGabriel
Adrian Sanders, MP:
A bit pointed, that.
ETA: Attribution corrected.
.
Violet
Oooh! Rupert steps in to say they were not EVER guilty of willful blindness.
me
James is a weaselly motherfucker.
Villago Delenda Est
It saved Ronald Reagan.
Remember that SNL skit from the 80’s in which Reagan was portrayed as the “amiable dunce” in public, but once he was in private he was a slave driving dynamo?
I think that’s the effect that Murdoch is going for here.
Bobby Thomson
Power defends itself. With the John Dean of this scandal safely dead, I wouldn’t expect any major changes. Yeah, a 136-year-old man might have to step down.
The Gambino family soldiered on without Paul Castellano.
Violet
Ooh, I like this question, “How often did you talk to your editors?” Because that’s a verifiable fact if they check phone records.
Oh, and now Rupert’s telling them he’s NOT hands-off. Going off script, Rupert!
I think the “I lost sight of NOTW” is not going to fly. Michael Wolff was in the room interviewing Rebekah and Rupert called something like seven times in a two hour period.
arguingwithsignposts
@Bobby Thomson:
Unfortunately for Rupert et. al., the Woodward and Bernstein of this scandal aren’t dead. And they just fired a bunch of NoTW future Deans.
beltane
James Murdoch is such a snivelling little rich-boy douchebag that it’s hard to listen to him. Why do all these so-called productive members of society always come across as such inferior specimens of humanity?
Violet
@beltane:
So true. He’s trying to adopt a “smart, eager puppy” affect, but his inner privileged slime keeps coming through. He’d starve if left on the street without his phone and ATM card. Rupert wouldn’t. He’d find a way to eat.
Nutella
@Villago Delenda Est:
That was largely true until Reagan screwed it up big time by announcing he took personal responsibility for the barracks full of soldiers that was blown up in Lebanon. This prevented an actual investigation and appropriate accountability.
He took a PR approach to a serious, real-life problem. Kind of like the Murdochs today. It shows contempt for the actual victims and for the people who do the actual work at their organizations to treat crimes and tragedies as PR exercises.
MazeDancer
@beltane:
Wonder if weak little snide is not the way James Murdoch comes across in other countries? Is this cultural? Don’t quite understand how an image manipulating empire like News Corps didn’t teach James how he needed to be all rough and tumble, back slapping, good ole boy for US imagery.
...now I try to be amused
Not if he saves James. I think Rupert realizes he can’t save himself.
NonyNony
@Violet
Not really. What saved Reagan was that he was insanely popular before going into the Iran-Contra hearings and he had a solid block of people who believed that “if the President does it it must not be wrong” supporting him.
Murdoch doesn’t have that. He has sharks out for his blood in the media waters in the UK and nobody likes him. What’s more, because of the very nature of the scandal itself his own natural allies have to distance themselves from him otherwise it looks like THEY might be part of it too.
He might survive it, but the doddering old man gambit is a risky one for him to take. I suspect that other folks posting here are right and the desire to protect/promote his son might be the reason for it.
scav
Oh I loved that face change when Rupe had to answer about Les Hinton.
Violet
@NonyNony:
I didn’t say that. It was Villago Delenda Est. But I agree with your assessment, especially:
JGabriel
What the fuck does James Murdoch do at NI?
Hell, I know that the checks for outside legal fees would have been approved by either the head of the Legal Dept (Chief Legal Officer), or the subsidiary’s CEO. And James doesn’t?
And Rupert has to step in to answer it?
.
MazeDancer
@scav:
Perhaps Hinton resigned because he knew Rupert was going to knife him anyway.
asiangrrlMN
Tom Watson? Not the golfer, I presume. Thanks for the updates, peep. I haz no cable. I’m sure I could find it online somewhere.
ETA: CNN to the rescue.
No one who works for the Murdochs is completely blameless. Is this James talking? ‘Coz I want to punch him in the face.
ETA II: Yes, it is him. Gah. What a privileged prick.
beltane
@MazeDancer
I don’t think James Murdoch comes across well in any country except with wingnuts. Remember, most of our homegrown Galtians are hardly the image of “rough and tumble, back slapping” masculinity (see Eric Cantor and Paul Ryan for more examples of this strain of rich-boy douchiness). Murdoch, Jr. seems to fit the Bobo-esque vision of a master class hero quite nicely. The fact that he looks and sounds like a pampered mosquito to normal people is of no consequence.
Violet
@MazeDancer:
There may be some cultural issues, but James is well known to be a sniveling idiot who only has his job because of his dad.
NonyNony
@Violet
Argh stupid “lack of a reply button to protect myself from my inability to distinguish between two completely different names starting with the letter V”. In my defense, I am a moron.
Violet
@asiangrrlMN:
Definitive liveblog is The Guardian: http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/blog/2011/jul/19/phone-hacking-rupert-murdoch-rebekah-brooks-mps
waratah
Rupert has lost his reputation. This is what they are trying to regain.
Father and son trying to protect each other.
MazeDancer
@beltane:
The resemblance between James Murdoch and Eric Cantor is striking.
May have to do more investigation into shifting appeal of imagery on the Right. Women they like MILFy sexpotty and crazy. Perhaps men they now like nasaly, yapping, spoiled boys.
asiangrrlMN
@Violet: The Guardian is the hero of the day. Ta.
God, I want to poke J. Murdoch with my rusty pitchfork.
OOOOoooooh! First time I get to hear Rupert speak. Wow. Doddering old fool, indeed.
P.S. I love the British way of interrogating. Genteel, but with a shiv in the back.
JPL
FYI, I use an antenna and have ROKU. AlJazeera is streaming the questioning live.
Villago Delenda Est
Go for it. It worked for Ronald “amiable dunce” Reagan! :P
Yurpean
I hate these ‘can you tell us more’ questions, it lets James blather on interminably while avoiding giving any damning information.
Tom Watson has been by far the most effective questioner so far.
Violet
Any of these MPs who lets James talk for any length of time is doing no one any favors. Rupert is where the real story is. Go for Rupert.
arguingwithsignposts
Wow, James just invoked the British version of the fifth.
Violet
Okay, James just basically told the committee to STFU. That can’t go over well.
Nutella
Heh. I like this:
Sure is a terrible thing to be hounded by the press, int it?
Yurpean
I don’t think it will backfire – the committee won’t want to be seen as possibly affecting any legal investigation & subsequent trial.
scav
Rupe may be the story but I’m not entirely sure he’s the case. And I don’t think Jr.’s burbling on and on and on is doing them any favors. I’m thinking long-haul here although I’m still hoping for the Yeti in the room to appear.
Nutella
A funny quote from Sullivan:
He’s such a tool.
asiangrrlMN
Does J. Murdoch not realize that smug douchebag doesn’t go over well with most people?
And, this defense is really weak. But, they have nothing else, I guess.
ETA: Need J. Murdoch to stop talking now. kthxbai.
ETA II: My feed just died. Oh, damn. No more J. Murdoch babbling nonsense.
handsmile
Taking a brief break from the hearings and wanted to check in here to read the remarks of fellow obsessives.
While much of the questioning and testimony is really in the weeds even for those who have diligently followed the story, I have found the hearings to be electrifying thus far!
Not so much for the content (of course I’ll be relying on the Guardian to do the necessary sifting there) but for the solemnity, rectitude and conscientiousness of the parliamentary committee members. Unfailingly civil to the witnesses, they possess and deploy exhaustive knowledge on the matters at hand, are concise in their questions, and do not hesitate to interrupt filibustering responses or efforts to divert a line of inquiry, Watson’s repeated smackdowns of james Murdoch were breathtaking in their decorum and incision.
They seem to take seriously their responsibilities as public servants and expect those providing testimony to respect the gravity of the occasion.
Refreshing or inspiring are wholly inadequate words to describe the utter difference from the craven solicitousness, studied indifference, caviling, and pompous orations that characterize public hearings from our Congressional representatives.
Several commenters have mentioned Watergate. I was a high school student at that time and, IIRC, several weeks of my AP History class were devoted to watching the live hearings. That dim memory is being brushed off this morning as I watch, rather than later hearings such as Iran-Contra or any number of Supreme Court nominations by which time the structure and rhythms of public hearings had become more ritualized and ossified. No longer would we hear from a witness like Alexander Butterfield.
As I mentioned yesterday, one connection between Iran-Contra and the unfolding Murdoch scandals is that NewsCorporation has hired Brendan Sullivan to lead its criminal legal team in the event of Justice Department investigations. Sullivan was the attorney for Oliver North at those hearings.
Well, a new pot of coffee has finished brewing. Back to the telly. Thanks for reading and I look forward very much to reading more from you all later.
Oh. Two quick things. Ed Llewellyn’s resignation must already be on Cameron’s desk. And I’m so deeply moved by the tender touches of Mrs. Murdoch as her husband dodderingly testifies. How lucky that poor old man has such a lovely wife and so young too!
...now I try to be amused
@beltane: I will treasure your “pampered mosquito” comment.
MazeDancer
Among the reflex smarm is James’s repeated phrasing “no evidence of wrong-doing”. Emphasis on “evidence”. Wrong-doing, itself, not a problem. But evidence is.
shortstop
Nice work.
Brandon
Apparently they have now released the emails between No. 10 and Yates and they cannot even mention hacking by name. This is such a pathetically transparent attempt to establish plausible deniability for Cameron that there is no way it cannot have repurcussions. And the main question that has yet to be answered is why Stephenson and Yates both lose their jobs for their relationship with Wallis, who has not been arrested or convicted of anything, and yet Cameron has barely accepted any responsibility for Coulson who has been convicted and was recently arrested.
handsmile
Patrick II (#17):
A doff of the top hat (appropriate for this day) for that comment. You wrote my feelings exactly!
Violet
The MP in the yellow jacket (Mr. Farrelly?)succinctly summed up the issue. You can’t tell us who did what, yet you claim you have investigated them. Can’t you see that this is unsatisfactory. Heh.
A Mom Anon
I thought Murdoch was set to retire soon,turning things over to the son anyway. If he gets canned or quits early,I don’t see how that changes a thing. This is a corporate culture(not just at NewsCorp either,this seems to be a feature of corporations in general)thing,not just a Rupert and his immediate minions problem.
MazeDancer
Rupert: Anything seen as crisis comes to me.
So guess bribery, pay-offs, hacking, not a crisis.
Not seeing how Murdochs can save themselves without sacrificing Brooks if “I was too high up and busy to know these things” is part of their posture.
JGabriel
Too much James, not enough Rupert. They should have interviewed these two separately.
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Violet
@A Mom Anon:
Well being canned or being run off is different than leaving on your own terms. And Rupert wants to leave his son James his empire. It now looks like he may not be able to do that. And even if they both leave, there could well be long, drawn out lawsuits. Not exactly the way anyone wants to spend their retirement. And then there’s the issue of “legacy.”
And…Rupert’s banging the table again.
JGabriel
MazeDancer:
(Puzzled expression)
But, that’s just business as usual.
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NonyNony
@MazeDancer
I think they already think Brooks has been sacrificed.
I wonder how much loyalty to the Murdoch clan she actually has, and if she’s willing to serve jail time rather than roll over on them.
Conversely I wonder how stupid she is and if she really did do a bunch of stuff without bothering to let the old man in on what she was doing.
I could see it going both ways, actually.
Note for future potential fall guys – always make sure that if you’re doing illegal shit for your boss that the boss knows. And that you have documentation to prove it. It’s less likely that you end up being thrown under the bus that way.
Typical corporate drones know this maneuver as CYA – cover your ass. I’m a bit surprised that the high-ups often seem to forget to do it themselves.
JGabriel
Murdoch goes there, blames tabloid corruption on the Telegraph instead of accepting responsibility.
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Dexter
Looks like somebody is lying. Further to Rupert Murdoch’s earlier claim that he only spoke very rarely to his News of the World editors, Piers Morgan – a NOTW editor himself at one stage – tweets:
Hmm……..
shortstop
A surprising number of them seem to subscribe to the theory of honor among thieves, then are appalled to find it’s a myth.
I hope we aren’t going to be denied a single scrumptious detail of them all turning on each other, even though I could end up weighing 400 pounds from the potential popcorn consumption.
MazeDancer
@NonyNony:
Really, standard CYA stuff. Totally don’t understand Brooks not having the goods on Rupert. Tape recorder at all times. Tho, Rupert’s office probably has jammers.
Maybe she bought the “fifth daughter” stuff. She certainly had a fast and golden rise.
JGabriel
Shorter JM:
What an oblivious dick.
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someguy
It’s funny how everybody here is just talking about the little external fluff. WTF… this sounds *just* like Casey Anthony Pt. II.
Seems to me that DOJ has a pretty good case for shutting down the Murdoch empire in the U.S., seizing the network and newspapers, kicking out the employees, to prevent destruction of evidence. There’s probable cause of violations under the Foreign Corrupt Practices Act and RICO; marshalls ought to be storming the place right now, locking the employees out, and beginning a search for evidence of illegal wiretaps and bribes. With a little luck the Fox media empire will turn into an Enron-shaped cloud as a result. There probably won’t be another opportunity this good for a long time.
Yurpean
Somebody should ask him if he’s impressed by the Guardian’s investigative reporting.
R-Jud
Regarding Junior’s voice, I agree with Charlie Brooker:
“James Murdoch always sounds like he’s flatly narrating an educational video about how plastic is made.”
shortstop
HE DID NOT SAY THAT! (Did he?! Really?!)
I would not assume that because she hasn’t grassed on him yet, she’s not going to — especially to keep herself out of jail.
Dexter
The tubes are a funny place. There is now an Ask Murdoch search Engine.Its responses are limited to “Pardon?” “I don’t know” and “You’d better ask James that one.”
JGabriel
The Guardian:
Shorter Murdoch: I think it’s a damn shame that people are reduced to accepting our bribes!
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JGabriel
@shortstop:
No, it’s a ‘shorter’. But it’s really close to what he actually said.
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Xecky Gilchrist
Shorter Murdoch: I think it’s a damn shame that people are reduced to accepting our bribes!
cf. British Petro’s defense that oil industry regulators were at fault for the Gulf spill because they accepted BP’s bribes.
shortstop
Shoot. I was hoping it was verbatim, JGabriel.
Better this way. Need to moderate the outrage, like insulin.
ETA: Oops, just saw your “shorter” in the original comment. MC.
scav
mmm, RM trying to be funny with the Oh, won’t all those PMs leave me alone! side bit.
OK, what happened?
Dexter
Something happened. The sitting is suspended for 10 mins and I saw cops running in the room.
Nutella
@JGabriel:
That’s the Spiro Agnew defense. He said he had to accept bribes when he was governor of Maryland because the pay was so low.
JGabriel
What the hell just happened? Seems like someone to RM’s rear left stood up and fainted. Anyone catch who it was?
Update from The Guardian:
There’s a bunch a white stuff on the attacker’s face and Murdoch’s shoulder. Did he just get pied?
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Jewish Steel
Whoa! What just happened?
Someone tried to hit Rupert.
shortstop
And thus do two threads come together in the intertwined magic that is BJ.
Dexter
According to Guardian…Someone has just tried to attack Rupert Murdoch. His wife Wendi seemed to slap the person. A young man in a checked shirt has been detained by police.
drkrick
Once the boss figures out you’re doing that, you’re going to be history. Potential fall guys need to understand the risk they’re taking and decide whether they’re better off going somewhere where “fall guy” isn’t part of the job description.
scav
Yeti sighting. ye gods.
Dexter
I think we have “Yeti walked into the room” moment. This incidence will be the news.
drkrick
A slap was enough to stop him? I wonder if this was a Murdoch setup in case the “doddering old man” routine didn’t appear to be working.
me
Tried to squirt Rupert with Shaving Cream?
Dexter
According to the Torygraph (aka Telegraph):
OTOH, Guardian says:
JPL
The Murdoch’s destroy people without blinking an eye. I’m not surprised that someone tried to attack them.
JGabriel
Yep, Murdoch got pied with shaving foam. Should we call it foamed?
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waratah
CNN British talking head commenting on hearing called James accent Donald Duck. LOL He also commented on Ruperts back door to Prime Minister the seamy side of politics. CNN cut him off just as I was enjoying this so lost me as a viewer.
me
“Plate of shaving foam”? Pie seems more probable.
JGabriel
waratah:
It’s basically a Mid-Atlantic accent, a sort of Brit/NE American/boarding school amalgam. James’s accent seems to add a touch of Aussie to the mix, probably picked up from his father.
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MazeDancer
Tweet from Murdoch Foam Pie Perp, called Johnny Marbles.
asiangrrlMN
Damn. That’s why the feed got cut off! I miss all the good shit!
R-Jud
Fucking UK Uncut. I can’t believe this. Why couldn’t he have waited until after the hearing?
JPL
They’re back!
scav
oh, the blond. not at all slowed down by pie or foam in the room.
GregB
The Al Pieda asshole has set the frame that is already being highlighted by Drudge and AOL.
Old man attacked!
Nice job asshole.
JGabriel
That they can’t answer this unequivocally is what’s so damning.
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Redshift
JGabriel:
I know it’s not an exact quote, but that seems like a bad line to be taking with relation to the Foreign Corrupt Practices Act. Gets them on the wrong side of “a few bad apples” vs. the general conduct of the business.
Violet
@R-Jud:
Yeah, no kidding. Way to give Rupert Murdoch some sympathy he doesn’t deserve. And there he sits, giving his testimony in his shirt sleeves. UGH. STUPID IDIOTS UK Uncut!
Redshift
GregB:
They may try, but I don’t think they’ll be able to make that stick. There’s just too much juicy stuff, and trying to get people to feel sympathy for Rupert Murdoch is a fool’s errand.
licensed to kill time
Rupert Murdoch forced to eat Humble Foam Pie.
asiangrrlMN
“All British tabloids do it, so your people thought it was fine, too, amirite?”
I see what she’s trying to say, but what an odd way of phrasing it. And, J. Murdoch gets to sound all sanctimonious.
TooManyJens
I’m hearing now that the pie-er is not from UK Uncut, but is just an idiot comedian.
JGabriel
@asiangrrlMN:
The MP asking that is Louise Mensch, a Tory.
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R-Jud
@TooManyJens: He’s done activism for them before. They’re distancing themselves from him. But still, that’s the frame people are going to run with: Rupert Murdoch Pied By Liberal Pro-Tax Terrorist Lumberjack!
asiangrrlMN
@JGabriel: Got it.
R. Murdoch: Throwing everyone under the bus ‘coz I’m the man best to clean up this mess!
Glimpses of the meglomaniac shine through.
Mr. Watson back up to bat. He’s good.
R. Murdoch: I really rock. I’ve made a few mistakes, but this? No. It’s everyone else but me!
ETA: But telling lies about people? Let’s get it on!
MazeDancer
@asiangrrlMN:
Have noticed that throughout. The crack in the doddering gramps act is that he keeps reminding everyone how he’s so important. Big job, big ship, at the top.
JPL
Murdoch coming across as frail and old already was getting the sympathy vote before the attack.
Violet
So Rebekah Brooks is going to testify? Oooh! That might be good.
They should have questioned them each separately. James got to talk too much and Rupert got to play the old, doddering card.
asiangrrlMN
@MazeDancer: Yeah. It was fascinating to watch him try the frail old man thing and then to see the real Murdoch burst through in opportune moments. It’s too bad they couldn’t keep him talking.
Joel
Rupert = Avon Barksdale
James = Stringer Bell
scav
Seriously, is the blond woman’s name actually Mensch? Don’t know how effect her questioning was but she certainly whipped the momentum right back up and didn’t seem to pull back from her prepared line.
Yurpean
Mensch is her married name. She used to write chick-lit under the name Louise Bagshawe, before becoming an MP.
Yurpean
Ding-ding-ding!
Time for round two.
JGabriel
Rebekah Brooks is up! Can we get a new thread devoted to this subject?
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licensed to kill time
Aaaaannnnd here comes the Titian-Haired “daughter” !
scav
Yurpean: ah, so she’s the one. Thanks.
JGabriel
Way to clarify, Bekka.
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asiangrrlMN
@asiangrrlMN: “Inopportune moment”, I meant, but it stands as originally written as well.
Joel
That fuckface Jonnie Marbles almost ruined the hearings today.
Violet
Oh my. Rebekah Brooks reminds me very much of an English relative of mine that I do not like very much at all. Not the hair, their hair is different, but her face, voice, inflection, accent, manner. It’s like this relative is sitting there wearing a wig. Shudder.
JGabriel
Shorter Bekka: No, News of the World didn’t use private detectives — Fleet Street did! And, uh, we were a part of Fleet Street…
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MazeDancer
@licensed to kill time:
But her hair’s not candy flame red anymore!
asiangrrlMN
Wow. Rebekah Brooks is going for surly and truculent. Not sure that’s a good choice.
ETA: Is this Tom Watson? I quite like this guy.
@Violet: Ah. I see. What we have is a failure in her synapses to actually come across the way she would like. Gotcha.
ETA II: What is up with this “I didn’t know nothing” bullshit? Then again, what else have they got?
ETA III: It’s REALLY hard to act if you have no idea how it actually is to be what you are pretending to be. Convoluted, but you get the gist, I think.
Violet
@asiangrrlMN:
Oh, no. She’s going for calm and cooperative. She’s achieving surly and truculent. Which is exactly how this relative of mine I mentioned above behaves. I’m very familiar with this type of behavior.
Evolved Deep Southerner
What the fuck is it with pies and “glitter bombs” and such? How fucking silly.
licensed to kill time
@MazeDancer:
Her hair color does look a bit more subdued now. Not quite flaming.
Titian means gold-tinged or brownish auburn, after the color most favored by the painter Titian. Fits, I think!
asiangrrlMN
Pro tip, Rebekah: Using an exasperated tone is guaranteed to set teeth on edge, as is the uttering of the phrase, “I have said repeatedly.” Just trying to help you out!
@JGabriel: Ah. I missed the very beginning. These people really cannot do humble and conciliatory at all.
JGabriel
asiangrrlMN:
Violet:
Brooks was going for contrite and cooperative at the beginning, but she can’t help letting her inner light of defensive truculence and exasperated condescending arrogance shine through.
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scav
Oh really, Bek, you know nothing more about the workings of the NOtW than a parliamentary committee? got it.
Alex S.
Ms Brooks has no poker face. Also, I hope the name of this ‘comedian’ will be erased from the records and never be uttered again.
JGabriel
Tory Mensch (love that name) still trying to blame NI’s problems on the culture of Fleet Street, not NI specifically.
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Violet
@JGabriel:
Yes, she’s thinking, “How DARE these peon MPs question me in this manner. Don’t they know who I am? I can ruin them in the press!” She hasn’t yet absorbed that she has zero power to do anything anymore.
Alex S.
Oh, FYWP…..
So here it is again:
Ms Brooks has no p0ker face. Also, I hope the name of this ‘comedian’ will be erased from the records and never be uttered again.
kay
But they say they’re humble! That means they’re humble. None of these admirable qualities they attribute to themselves have anything at all do with their actions.
asiangrrlMN
She’s talking as if she’s still part of the empire. You’re a pauper now, Rebekah. Oh, and mistakes were made? Rephrase, please.
Dexter
Kay, can we have a new Murdoch-gate thread please?
Nutella
@asiangrrlMN:
Not a member of the empire any more, but not a pauper. I read somewhere she got something like $8-10 mill in severance.
karen marie
How did the guy get the pie in the room? You don’t suppose he had help from security, do you?
MazeDancer
Tech note: Have been informed on Twitter that Ms. Brooks considerable hair still considerably red.
Apparently my cable company has a red filter, because on both CNN and MSNBC, as well as all feeds online, she’s gone brown. Thought she’d toned it down for the hearings.
Nutella
I like Mensch’s line that all the papers did it and everyone knew that everyone did it, but that even so Brooks didn’t really know anything about it. That doesn’t seem to be a really good line of defense.
Violet
New Murdoch/Brooks testimony thread up. Thanks Kay!
JGabriel
New Thread Up Top!
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