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A consequence of cucumbers

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You are here: Home / Why Resign?

Why Resign?

by John Cole|  August 3, 20112:13 pm| 91 Comments

This post is in: General Stupidity

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I simply have no idea why men keep sending nude pictures of themselves to women- Ladies, does that really turn you on? Most of the single women my age would rather have me send them a picture of me fully clothed vacuuming their living room or washing their car or doing something really sexy, like changing the litter box or cleaning out the basement. But I digress. Why should this guy resign:

A politician who emailed a woman nude photos of himself that were posted on a GOP activist’s website has resigned and said he will consider all legal options to have the pictures taken down.

New Jersey democrat Louis Magazzu, 53, admitted sending the photos to the woman he said he had been corresponding with online for several years.

He claims she requested the pictures but was working with an ‘avowed political enemy’ at the time and that he did not know.

In an email statement, the Cumberland County freeholder apologised to family, friends and constituents but indicated that he thought he was being set up.

It’s a free country, man. Single people, however misguided, should not be punished for sending pictures of their junk to willing recipients. I don’t get it. He’s separated from his wife, and this isn’t some random woman he just accosted over twitter. The only thing I can think is that there might be more women with stories to tell that happened before his separation.

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Reader Interactions

91Comments

  1. 1.

    The Moar You Know

    August 3, 2011 at 2:17 pm

    He shouldn’t resign. That is ludicrous.

    This is just another example of the Democratic attachment to “taking the high road” that will insure our electoral irrelevance for decades to come.

  2. 2.

    Scott

    August 3, 2011 at 2:18 pm

    It’s kinda creepy that this woman was masquerading as a friend/girlfriend for “several years.” That’s a heck of a long time to spend on a political sting of a lowly state legislator.

    Not to downplay Magazzu’s creepiness. I’ve never really understood the urge to take pix of my dangly bits to send online anyway…

  3. 3.

    sb

    August 3, 2011 at 2:18 pm

    I like how the GOP activist said “I’m sorry it had to end this way.” I bet these repugs can say this shit and drink a glass of water at the same time.

  4. 4.

    Hunter Gathers

    August 3, 2011 at 2:20 pm

    Let’s not forget that DeadBeat Dad Joe Walsh, who owes his ex-wife over $100,000, has the full backing of his party.

    IOKIYAR

  5. 5.

    AlphaLiberal

    August 3, 2011 at 2:21 pm

    I agree. It’s like when Elliot Spitzer paid for whores with his own money. Whoop dee doo.

  6. 6.

    merrinc

    August 3, 2011 at 2:22 pm

    @sb:

    Republicans have no sense of fair play. None.

    John Cole, send me a pic of you cleaning the litter box, please. I want to show it to my husband and threaten tell him that I’m considering having an affair with you.

    An aside to Mama Cole: Thank you, ma’am, for encouraging your son to give us a Reply button. As you might guess, we can now go on to find plenty of other things to whine about.

  7. 7.

    Rosalita

    August 3, 2011 at 2:22 pm

    a picture of you not dressed as the Lone Ranger at age 7 (or whatever) would be a good start.

  8. 8.

    cathyx

    August 3, 2011 at 2:22 pm

    You have that so right. pron for women is just what you said. And it’s definitely not a picture of him naked.
    The sexiest words are, “here, let me do that for you.”

  9. 9.

    kdaug

    August 3, 2011 at 2:22 pm

    Or he’s a coward who shrinks when the national press’s klieg lights come on. Either way, the proper response is “Fuck off”.

    The R’s will continue their O’Keefe routines until someone punches them in the neck.

  10. 10.

    schrodinger's cat

    August 3, 2011 at 2:23 pm

    John Cole@ top

    I simply have no idea why men keep sending nude pictures of themselves to women- Ladies, does that really turn you on?

    No.
    The one photo/s I want to see right now is Tunch! How is our beautiful big kitteh?

  11. 11.

    trollhattan

    August 3, 2011 at 2:24 pm

    Huh, he’s separated for two years? I agree, there’s no cause to resign, other than the humiliation aspect. And what the hell does this mean?

    His brand of politics is harmful to the entire political process.

  12. 12.

    Violet

    August 3, 2011 at 2:25 pm

    I simply have no idea why men keep sending nude pictures of themselves to women- Ladies, does that really turn you on?

    No, no, no and NO. I can’t figure out why a guy would do that. Maybe I’m just old. Mostly I think I’d just laugh. So if some guy wants me to laugh at his naked body, then I guess that’s a reason for sending a photo like that. Don’t think that’s the response men are looking for.

    The guy shouldn’t resign. He should tell everyone it was between consenting adults and people need to grow up.

  13. 13.

    Kane

    August 3, 2011 at 2:25 pm

    These older guys don’t seem to understand the power of the web. Keep your camera away from your junk. Most women don’t want to see nude photos of guys via the web, and perhaps one should question corresponding with those women who do.

  14. 14.

    Jay in Oregon

    August 3, 2011 at 2:26 pm

    John Cole @top:

    I’ve used this as a forum icon in the past: http://history.icanhascheezburger.com/2011/07/18/funny-pictures-history-what-turns-women-on/

  15. 15.

    Brachiator

    August 3, 2011 at 2:26 pm

    I simply have no idea why men keep sending nude pictures of themselves to women.

    Uh, dude, lots of men want to see pictures of nekkid women. It fuels the Internets. A lot of these guys, apparently, wrongly, assume that wimmens think the same way they does. Wimmens, being pure spirits, just want to cuddle. And do sexting. And write slash.

    It’s a free country, man. Single people, however misguided, should not be punished for sending pictures of their junk to willing recipients.

    This is the United States of Puritan America. All non vanilla activities which become public must be punished. Some model associated with NASCAR was fired because nude photos done years earlier solely and privately for her college boyfriend surfaced on the Internets. It had absolutely nothing to do with any current behavior, and even if it did, is should have been irrelevant. But she was canned anyway.

    It’s not just a political issue. But the claims that a political enemy was aware of these pictures and sought a way to use them to political advantage makes this case especially troubling.

  16. 16.

    jl

    August 3, 2011 at 2:26 pm

    Some say that this post sounds like a (failed, just you wait and see) attempt to get out ahead of the coming Balloon Juice Cole nude moping pic scandal.

  17. 17.

    Maude

    August 3, 2011 at 2:27 pm

    @schrodinger’s cat:
    You beat me to it.

  18. 18.

    jl

    August 3, 2011 at 2:30 pm

    Watch out people, I think that Tunch is nude in those pics that pervert Cole posts. Download and save at your own risk.

  19. 19.

    Noah Brand

    August 3, 2011 at 2:30 pm

    John, I respect you and love the blog, but you don’t need to repeat the old women-aren’t-attracted-to-men lie. Here, have a couple links and see what the data looks like in the wild: http://noseriouslywhatabouttehmenz.wordpress.com/2011/06/27/on-libido-part-three/

    https://noseriouslywhatabouttehmenz.wordpress.com/2011/07/12/cocks-rock-part-one-penises-are-attractive/

    Or, if you don’t believe us, believe XKCD: http://xkcd.com/714/

  20. 20.

    jayackroyd

    August 3, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    In David Brin’s The Transparent Society, he predicted that this kind of thing would stop mattering–that so many people do embarrassing things that are going to be more and more difficult to keep secret that nobody will care after a while.

    It’s a more interesting question what effect will stem from the difficulty of keeping your sex life secret from your spouse, or, even, each other. Right now, most people seem to practice a policy of Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell. But that’s hard to do when incontrovertible evidence shows up, like when the GPS on his phone says he’s at a strip joint, not the office. Or that she’s at a motel, not the tennis club.

  21. 21.

    Jay in Oregon

    August 3, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    @schrodinger’s cat:

    Gah!

    Too…many…petting kitty…jokes…

  22. 22.

    no video at work

    August 3, 2011 at 2:32 pm

    It really isn’t that hard. Don’t get BJs from someone you are not married to (hang on – we are getting marriage for you guys too), don’t send photos of your genitalia or you just stepping out of the shower with a wash cloth, don’t frequent hookers, don’t hang around washrooms tapping out requests for sex with strangers, don’t ‘come on to’ people you are not in a committed long-term relationship with. None of that is difficult. I have been in a LTCR for 40 years now & never once have I done any of those things or anything else that would put me in a position of having to explain how I got there.

    Do we also need a list, don’t steal from the collection plate, don’t urinate on a police officer, don’t stick you tongue in a light socket . . . how stupid are these dick heads?

  23. 23.

    Amir_Khalid

    August 3, 2011 at 2:32 pm

    @jl:

    the coming Balloon Juice Cole nude moping pic scandal

    You mean, John Cole took pix of himself sitting around naked and looking gloomy?

  24. 24.

    Citizen_X

    August 3, 2011 at 2:33 pm

    the coming Balloon Juice Cole nude moping pic scandal

    I have those pics. They’re in a safe place, along with the Whitey Tape.

    ETA @Amir_Khalid: LOL. Well, Cole has been awfully emo lately, right?

  25. 25.

    boss bitch

    August 3, 2011 at 2:34 pm

    He should resign because he’s stupid. Was he not paying attention to Weiner’s story?

  26. 26.

    Maude

    August 3, 2011 at 2:35 pm

    @jayackroyd:
    A lot of people haven’t caught onto the internet and how invasive and pervasive it is. This guy is one of them.
    Teens have to be warned that what they put online stays online. I used to do that when I was a tech and my end users were teens. I used to post articles and all that. They are computer savvy but can’t imagine a future employer pulling up a picture of them doing something stupid.

  27. 27.

    jl

    August 3, 2011 at 2:36 pm

    Sorry, nude MOPPING pics.

    But I didn’t know there were nude MOPING pics too.

  28. 28.

    bemused

    August 3, 2011 at 2:36 pm

    No. I don’t know of any woman who would not be totally turned OFF by a guy who would send a nude pic of himself. What I want to know is why these guys actually think women are.

    What woman could resist photos of a (clothed) guy who knows how to cook well presenting a mouth-watering meal followed by bonus photo of cleaning up after. Photos of carpentry skills, furniture, shelving, etc would be a close second.

  29. 29.

    cathyx

    August 3, 2011 at 2:36 pm

    Women do want to see their man naked, but not til after the man does all those awful jobs around the house. Women call those tedious chores being done “foreplay”.

  30. 30.

    BombIranForChrist

    August 3, 2011 at 2:39 pm

    I am 100% with you, John.

    I think, at this point, that the Punditry – Politician axis has developed an algorithm for automatically handling all scandals that involve the booty sex.

    * Pictures come out.
    * Pundits express outrage, couched in cocktail party wit and nuance, in order to not seem like Church Lady scolds, which would affect their ability to attend more cocktail parties.
    * If the politician has psychological problems, which is most of them, they will engage in some truly bizarre attempt to avoid resigning. In many ways, the bizarre reaction is far worse than the original “sin”.
    * They will resign.

    It’s Hive Mind at this point. Borg. It’s written into the system. Only Neo can save us.

  31. 31.

    quannlace

    August 3, 2011 at 2:45 pm

    Ladies, does that really turn you on?
    No, no, no and NO. I can’t figure out why a guy would do that.

    Made me immediately think of Elaine in that Seinfeld ‘shrinkage’ episode.

    “I don’t know how you guys walk around with those things”

  32. 32.

    jayackroyd

    August 3, 2011 at 2:45 pm

    Maude–

    Brin’s argument is the opposite–that embarrassing photos will be so ubiquitous as not to matter. I certainly see some evidence of that among young people, who have been living in public since early adolescence.

    He’s turned out to be right about some other things–especially the effect of the ubiquity of cameras. We’re seeing one part of his argument being played out now, with video recording of citizen/police encounters.

    We have had something like a Don’t Ask Don’t Tell attitude regarding police procedures, and perjury that cameras are making it increasingly difficult to sustain.

  33. 33.

    artem1s

    August 3, 2011 at 2:47 pm

    He claims she requested the pictures

    really, because he said or thinks so? does he know what Jeebus wants too?

  34. 34.

    Jason

    August 3, 2011 at 2:47 pm

    I don’t know, I’d be questioning corresponding with women who’d rather see me cleaning than see my junk. Is Maureen Dowd just sockpuppeting here, or do people really think “send me pics of you cleaning the toilet to turn me on” is funny and not at all depressing

  35. 35.

    Judas Escargot

    August 3, 2011 at 2:48 pm

    @Scott:

    It’s kinda creepy that this woman was masquerading as a friend/girlfriend for “several years.” That’s a heck of a long time to spend on a political sting of a lowly state legislator.

    That was my first thought, too. WTF?

    Does every Dem politician, major or minor, have a ‘sleeper’ assigned to them or something, just in case???

  36. 36.

    HRA

    August 3, 2011 at 2:50 pm

    How difficult is it to understand there is always someone trying to discredit you if you are a politician? It boggles the mind to see these people evidently not pay attention to all those who have fallen before them.

    The answer to your question about being turned on, John, is no.

  37. 37.

    Maude

    August 3, 2011 at 2:54 pm

    @jayackroyd:
    I say he’s wrong because this country has such hang ups about anything that comes close to sex.
    Rather than making such images commonplace, it will be easier to disgrace someone or refuse them employment.
    Britain is camera overload on the London streets. People are not happy with it.
    Here, cameras are beginning to come into play in every day life. People may not be aware of them. The sense of stove..hot isn’t common yet as far as don’t put pix of yer privates online.
    I am aware if there is a camera anywhere around me. That’s because I learned how to make movies and have always been behind a camera and never wanted to be in front of one.
    I bet I barely made sense.

  38. 38.

    arguingwithsignposts

    August 3, 2011 at 2:54 pm

    I’m curious about a couple of things. are the responses re: women wanting such photos really falling into gender stereotypes? There seems to be quite a bit of this type of stuff going on these days. Is it possible that some women do like that sort of thing? They may ask for them? Or there is some sort of back-and-forth exchange involved?

    Also, from the story:

    Mr Johnson said he started his website three years ago after a dispute with Magazzu over claims about property taxes.
    __
    He decided to post the photos because Magazzu had brought up Johnson’s family and back child support payments during their squabble, he said.
    __
    ‘I started the blog three years ago after a nasty freeholder meeting…it started as a way to expose the dirty underbelly of Cumberland County politics.
    ‘No one did anything in the party without him having his say.’

    WTF is a “freeholder?” And there seems to be a very personal vendetta involved here.

  39. 39.

    jayackroyd

    August 3, 2011 at 2:59 pm

    @arguing…

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Board_of_Chosen_Freeholders

    They’re county commissioners. And “jughandles” are rotaries.

  40. 40.

    Maude

    August 3, 2011 at 3:01 pm

    @arguingwithsignposts:
    County freeholders decide how money is spent. Here, they decided to double the bus fare a couple of years ago. It isn’t public transportation, but for seniors etc. People are still complaining about it.
    It is a powerful position. Can be quite an ego trip for them.

  41. 41.

    Hawkeye

    August 3, 2011 at 3:07 pm

    Men aren’t sexy when they vacuum. That’s Oprah/Dr. Phil idiocy that just reinforces stereotypes about women’s sexual interest being tied to what she can get out of a man (golddigger, etc.). The idea women don’t really care about what men look like is “Men are from Mars and Women are from Venus” crap that should have died in the nineties.

  42. 42.

    Nutella

    August 3, 2011 at 3:07 pm

    But I digress.

    Now we know why John was mopping nude. He was posing for the ultimate turn-on photo.

  43. 43.

    Norwonk

    August 3, 2011 at 3:09 pm

    Well, I can think of a couple of reasons to resign:

    1. He’s very silly.
    2. His resignation makes room for a fellow Democrat who won’t be a laughing stock.

  44. 44.

    jibeaux

    August 3, 2011 at 3:09 pm

    @Jason:

    Yeah, this would be all women. It’s not that we’re not visual at all, there’s a visual aspect there, but pictures of your junk are not what women are looking for. Gay men, perhaps, I dunno, can’t speak to that, but not women.
    I have a bit of a crush lately on the guy who plays Raylan in Justified. His looks are fine, but he just oozes sex appeal. And mostly he’s clothed.

  45. 45.

    no video at work

    August 3, 2011 at 3:09 pm

    Does every Dem politician, major or minor, have a ‘sleeper’ assigned to them or something, just in case???

    Back in the late 60s early 70s the Kochs ran an outfit know as the “Minutemen” their job was to get into Dem campaigns and, if possible, get office jobs after the election. From there they were to insult contributors, misdirect their bosses and generally undermine Dems.

    I assume they have been successful given my experiences in dealing with Amy Klobuchar’s people.

    EDIT: and now that I think about it that would explain a certain amount of stuff coming out of the White House!

  46. 46.

    Admiral_Komack

    August 3, 2011 at 3:10 pm

    Why should this guy resign?

    Because it brings his judgement into question.
    Translation: he is a fucking idiot.

  47. 47.

    PaminBB

    August 3, 2011 at 3:13 pm

    What boss bitch said at #25. It’s not the nudity, it’s the stupidity.

    And without seeing the pix, this is just speculation, but perhaps he’s a bit embarassed about Little Lou?

  48. 48.

    kc

    August 3, 2011 at 3:17 pm

    Geez, Scott Brown posed nude for the whole world to see and no one is asking HIM to resign.

  49. 49.

    Admiral_Komack

    August 3, 2011 at 3:19 pm

    @25. boss bitch:
    August 3rd, 2011 at 2:34 pm
    He should resign because he’s stupid. Was he not paying attention to Weiner’s story?

    Hee, hee, hee!

  50. 50.

    El Tiburon

    August 3, 2011 at 3:22 pm

    Look, both sides do it, to wit:

    1. Democratic politicians like to send pictures of their one-eyed willie to other consenting adults.

    Republican politicians like to:
    1. get head from strangers in public restrooms
    2. Dress up in diapers while paying a prostitute* while married.
    3. Fuck their best friends wife while said best friend and wife are on the payroll, then have parents pay off the friend and family.
    4. Fly to Argentina to be with mistress while allegedly walking the Appalachian trail.
    5. Divorce their wives while wife is completing chemotherapy in the hospital.
    6. Announce their divorce on national TV while strolling along with new girlfriend.
    7. Have a completely separate family with kids and all.
    8. Chase after underage congressional pages.

    *Yes, Elliot Spitzer kind of fucks up my little list here a bit.

  51. 51.

    Amir_Khalid

    August 3, 2011 at 3:30 pm

    @jayackroyd: That there’s a generation coming of age to whom, because of the way they use social media, embarrassment is an alien concept strikes me as frightening.

  52. 52.

    Brachiator

    August 3, 2011 at 3:35 pm

    @El Tiburon:

    Look, both sides do it, to wit:
    Republican politicians like to:
    3. Fuck their best friends wife while said best friend and wife are on the payroll, then have parents pay off the friend and family.

    Two words: Gavin Newsom. Current Democratic Lieutenant Governor of California.

    San Francisco Mayor Gavin Newsom’s re-election campaign manager resigned Wednesday after confronting the mayor about an affair Newsom had with his wife while she worked in the mayor’s office, City Hall sources said.
    __
    Alex Tourk, 39, who served as Newsom’s deputy chief of staff before becoming his campaign manager in September, confronted the mayor after his wife, Ruby Rippey-Tourk, told him of the affair as part of a rehabilitation program she had been undergoing for substance abuse, said the sources, who had direct knowledge of Wednesday’s meeting.

    People’s lives are messy, and don’t neatly line up with political affiliation.

  53. 53.

    D-Chance.

    August 3, 2011 at 3:45 pm

    Waaaaaaaah! But… but… those… those REPUBLCIANS…. waaaaaah!

    There, that covers 90% of the thread responses.

    You’re welcome, Sir.

  54. 54.

    Kathy in St. Louis

    August 3, 2011 at 3:46 pm

    Could this be the reason for his “separation”? Or, just a hypothetical, could his “separation” be recent enough that his wife finally got sick and tired of crass behavior like this and this was the final straw?

    I have utterly know idea why these guys don’t seem to understand that there is no expectation of privacy once you’ve mailed junk like this off. One of my personal mottoes has always been, “Never put it in writing” when it comes to personal attacks or other emotional issues. Now, with the internet I’d say it’s important to add, “…and for Christ’s sweet sake, don’t send someone a picture of anything you wouldn’t send your mom or your kid.”

  55. 55.

    Suffern ACE

    August 3, 2011 at 3:47 pm

    @Brachiator: Which is why I wish we’d just drop the “which side has more perverts” arguments. Every damn affair means we have to go over the damn toe tapping, intern tickling, page suggestive texting while drunk, making your actress wife go swinging, list to see what the score is. It’s a very long list.

  56. 56.

    Violet

    August 3, 2011 at 3:57 pm

    @Suffern ACE:
    Yeah, it’s really stupid to play the “which side is worse” game. People are people and those on both sides of the political aisle are going to do dumb things.

    However, it’s probably realistic to guess that more Republicans than Democrats are in the closet, since Republicans just don’t allow out gays to seek office. And that issue makes it perhaps more likely that Republicans will be hiding their gay encounters than Democrats. But outside of that issue, politicians on both sides will do stupid things.

  57. 57.

    Deb T

    August 3, 2011 at 4:01 pm

    I’d rather see a picture of their dog than their junk. If I want to see that, I want to see it in person at my request.

  58. 58.

    Stefan

    August 3, 2011 at 4:03 pm

    It really isn’t that hard. Don’t get BJs from someone you are not married to (hang on – we are getting marriage for you guys too), don’t send photos of your genitalia or you just stepping out of the shower with a wash cloth, don’t frequent hookers, don’t hang around washrooms tapping out requests for sex with strangers,

    Man, way to take all the fun out of life.

    don’t ‘come on to’ people you are not in a committed long-term relationship with.

    How exactly are you ever going to end up in a committed long-term relationship if you can’t ever come on to anybody?

  59. 59.

    Mnemosyne

    August 3, 2011 at 4:04 pm

    If George Clooney wanted to send me naked pictures of himself, I sure wouldn’t turn him down, and I’ve been a woman all my life. Maybe it’s a generational thing? (Though I’m 42, so I don’t think it’s that huge of a gap here.) I get to see G scoop the cat boxes every morning and let me tell you, ladies, it ain’t as arousing as you’d think.

    As far as the actual situation goes, I don’t see anything creepy about sending nude photos of yourself to your girlfriend of two or three years if you’re single. I see a fuckload of creepy in your girlfriend of two or three years turning those photos over to your political enemies because it turns out she’s been working with them all along.

  60. 60.

    Stefan

    August 3, 2011 at 4:05 pm

    Is it possible that some women do like that sort of thing? They may ask for them?

    Yes and yes.

  61. 61.

    Stefan

    August 3, 2011 at 4:08 pm

    What boss bitch said at #25. It’s not the nudity, it’s the stupidity.

    Bit of a tautology, though, isn’t it? You say it’s not the nude pictures, it’s the stupidity…but the stupidity is evidenced by him sending nude pictures. If he sent fully-clothed pictures no one would think him stupid, so it seems that it is indeed the nudity that’s at issue.

  62. 62.

    Jason

    August 3, 2011 at 4:13 pm

    @jibeaux: I mean obviously I’ve met a few who dug it (though sadly not my junk. My webcam languishes, unpolluted). The whole happy housemaker retort seems pretty smug and kind of weird. As a sort of projecting, like the stereotype of middle-aged men in cherry-red, expensive cars.

    I mean, haha, who would describe vaginas as “bacon and silly putty” but an underutilized tool, right? But whenever this happens it’s like “ewww penis icky” –

    Disclaimer, of course, that unsolicited pictures are doubly bad as harassment and spam.

  63. 63.

    duck-billed placelot

    August 3, 2011 at 4:17 pm

    Amanda addressed this issue quite well during Weinergate:

    you know what never happens when a naked picture that a woman sent to a paramour gets out? The “ewwww” reaction. No one ever says, “Why would any man want to see that?!” or suggest that the distinction between wanted and unwanted pictures is unimportant because there’s no such thing as a man who would find it arousing to have that kind of picture sent to him.

    Also the ‘the only thing women find sexy is housework’ is a not very veiled way to say that women have sex as payment instead of out of desire.

  64. 64.

    jayackroyd

    August 3, 2011 at 4:27 pm

    @Amir_Khalid:

    The opening argument Brin makes is that privacy is an aberration in human history, a product of urbanization and the industrial revolution. Before then, people spent their lives in small communities, and knew everything about everyone.

    cameras, gps phones, social media, automatic toll cards…..

    Like Mcnealy said

  65. 65.

    Snarla

    August 3, 2011 at 4:28 pm

    What Violet said. Sure, send me a naked picture of yourself…if you want me to laugh.

  66. 66.

    Violet

    August 3, 2011 at 4:32 pm

    @duck-billed placelot:
    Not it’s not. It’s not the housework itself that’s sexy. It’s the desire of the man to do something to please the woman in his life. If what she needs or wants is for him to help do some chores, then she’ll light up if he recognizes that and does it without her having to ask.

    Housework being sexy is shorthand for a man seeing a woman’s need and desire and acting upon it in an effort to please her. But really it’s the seeing her need, the acting upon it and the desire to please her that is the sexy part.

    And if those things are “payment” then what is a woman putting on some sexy lingerie that her man likes her to wear, just because it makes him happy? Is that payment too? Sex and relationships are full of negotiation. It’s not always “payment.”

  67. 67.

    cathyx

    August 3, 2011 at 4:38 pm

    @Violet: Exactly what you said. The only thing I would add is a man doing those things without being asked.

  68. 68.

    Violet

    August 3, 2011 at 4:41 pm

    @cathyx:
    Yeah, I mentioned that in the first paragraph of my comment. If he does it without having to be asked, that is truly sexy. He’s paying attention! He sees ME! He knows what I need! Sexy, sexy, sexy.

  69. 69.

    Brachiator

    August 3, 2011 at 4:46 pm

    @Violet:

    However, it’s probably realistic to guess that more Republicans than Democrats are in the closet, since Republicans just don’t allow out gays to seek office. And that issue makes it perhaps more likely that Republicans will be hiding their gay encounters than Democrats. But outside of that issue, politicians on both sides will do stupid things

    I don’t know if this is true. Even in the Village, it turns out that there is an odd hypocrisy that underlies a lot of this stuff. Reporters and other members of Congress knew that Mark Foley lived semi-out in Florida. Many Republican and Democratic Congress critters have ghey staffers, but they pretend to be excessively pro marriage and anti ghey for the benefit of their more bigoted constituents.

    One of the Congress critters in my area has been identified as ghey a number of times, but denies it and so is taken at his word by reporters. His constituents just don’t want to know.

    Anyhow, my main point here is that there are still many people in the public eye, including politicians, who are straight for political reasons, even if most of their constituents would not care.

    OT, but in the ballpark. I recently listened to an interview with Jack Larson, who played Jimmy Olsen in the old “Superman” TV show of the 1950s. I knew that he was a very talented writer as well as an underrated actor.

    I did not know that he was the life partner of director James Bridges (The Paper Chase, Urban Cowboy). The interview, on the KPCC public radio program Air Talk, was just amazingly insightful.

    James Bridges was a reclusive and respected film director best known for such seminal films as The Paper Chase, The China Syndrome and Urban Cowboy. Bridges rarely gave interviews over his lengthy career, but he did share a productive artistic relationship with his life partner of 35 years, Jack Larson. Larson is a revered writer in his own right, having turned to writing for the stage and screen after getting his start in show business playing the youthful photographer and reporter Jimmy Olsen on the TV series The Adventures of Superman. A new book on Bridges’ life, The Films of James Bridges, serves as a touchstone for Larson’s recollections of his partner’s life and work.

    These are just extremely talented people whose work in film and TV has made millions of people happy. It just boggles the mind that who they are and who they loved should ever had been an issue for anyone.

  70. 70.

    Violet

    August 3, 2011 at 4:55 pm

    @Brachiator:

    ven in the Village, it turns out that there is an odd hypocrisy that underlies a lot of this stuff. Reporters and other members of Congress knew that Mark Foley lived semi-out in Florida. Many Republican and Democratic Congress critters have ghey staffers, but they pretend to be excessively pro marriage and anti ghey for the benefit of their more bigoted constituents.

    But Mark Foley was a Republican. Doesn’t that sort of make my point?

    I’m not saying there are no closeted Democrats, just that it’s less of an issue to be out if you’re a Democrat. There just aren’t that many (any?) openly gay elected Republicans, but there are openly gay elected Democrats.

    So given the lack of acceptance of being out and gay as an elected Republican official, it seems more likely that any Republicans who are gay will be in the closet, whether completely, or semi (as with Foley, in your example) or sadly using wide stances in public restrooms.

  71. 71.

    catclub

    August 3, 2011 at 4:58 pm

    @Violet: “she’ll light up if he recognizes that and does it without her having to ask.”

    This reminds me of the occasional double bind of relationships and implicit communications.
    Women are supposed to be the great communicators in comparison with men, but can women ( as we tell children)
    ‘use their words’ to communicate a desire? No, the guy has to understand without being told (‘her having to ask’).

    Why is it that women who are supposedly better at communication than men, and more sensitive to feelings, do not realize when their implicit desires are not actually detected?

    NB: This is an oversimplification. In many cases, words have probably been tried and got no response. I am actually rejecting the stereotype that women are naturally better communicators than men. The actual variations within type are probably larger than the mean differences — hey a ‘Bell Curve’ refutation — where is Levenson when I need him?

  72. 72.

    Violet

    August 3, 2011 at 5:12 pm

    @catclub:

    Women are supposed to be the great communicators in comparison with men, but can women ( as we tell children) ‘use their words’ to communicate a desire? No, the guy has to understand without being told (‘her having to ask’).

    Women can and do use their words. I certainly have. What is nice is when someone, anyone really, sees a need of yours and fills it. What human doesn’t like that? If you’re in a relationship and your partner does that, it’s really great.

    That’s really the point. It’s about seeing the other person, recognizing their need, and filling it.

  73. 73.

    Brachiator

    August 3, 2011 at 5:13 pm

    @Violet:

    But Mark Foley was a Republican. Doesn’t that sort of make my point?

    Not really. Foley was more open than some people want to admit. Hell, pages were running from him. How closeted really was his behavior? People just professionally looked away. The local Congress critter I referred to who is professionally straight, but deep in the closet is a very prominent Democrat.

    But also, it is not just about being ghey or straight. There are people who lead “unconventional” sex lives, but who when they appear in public are all nuclear family. Quick example: A close friend worked as a dominatrix on the East Coast when she was younger. She still does not reveal identifying secrets, but mentions very powerful and prominent men and women who had a thing for receiving punishment. I doubt that any of these people, running for office, would openly speak about stopping off after work for some relaxing BDSM action.

  74. 74.

    Djur

    August 3, 2011 at 5:14 pm

    but pictures of your junk are not what women are looking for

    You really shouldn’t speak for all women. I can speak from personal experience and from bona fide anecdotes that there are at least some women in this world who will ask for dick pix. The context is usually providing visual aids for sex talk over the phone/text messages/etc.

    That’s completely distinct from the guys who think a picture of their boner is a great way to introduce themselves to a woman.

    And yes, the “what women RILLY want is a man who VACUUMS” material is the worst, just completely airline-food territory.

  75. 75.

    Brachiator

    August 3, 2011 at 5:35 pm

    @Violet:

    Women can and do use their words. I certainly have. What is nice is when someone, anyone really, sees a need of yours and fills it. What human doesn’t like that? If you’re in a relationship and your partner does that, it’s really great.
    __
    That’s really the point. It’s about seeing the other person, recognizing their need, and filling it.

    This gets really interesting. This also seems to be more a thing among some American women (doubly refuting any simple gender thing).

    One of the biggest semi-stereotypical male gripes is “She never just comes out and says what she wants.” And here I know a lot of guys whose lives are made easier by partners who anticipate their needs, but are kinda dumb to the effort made by the other person. They would be just as happy if the person just asked, “Hey, whadda ya want?”

    And on the other side, it is interesting that some women apparently feel that “being seen” happens more completely when a partner recognizes a deliberately unstated need and fulfills it.

    It’s funny how the communicating styles and expectations often work at cross purposes.

    And yes, for the record, I once had a girl friend who actually, really (I ain’t lying) uttered those magic words, “If you really loved me, you would just know what I wanted without my having to say anything.” I am still amused by this.

    But in the words of Doctor Evil:

    Right, people you have to tell me these things, okay? I’ve been frozen for thirty years, okay? Throw me a frickin’ bone here! I’m the boss! Need the info.

  76. 76.

    Amir_Khalid

    August 3, 2011 at 5:46 pm

    @jayackroyd:

    I confess I haven’t read Brin’s book, but …
    Privacy is an aberrant product of urbanization and the industrial revolution? Hmm. Urbanization preceded industrialization by thousands of years. Was the desire for privacy unknown to humankind before industrialization came along? Did people really not keep secrets before that? Where and when does Brin say modesty arose?

  77. 77.

    cathyx

    August 3, 2011 at 5:47 pm

    Yes, even though you can see that the dishwasher needs to be emptied as well as I can, that the garbage needs to go out and the laundry is piled up high in the basket, all we need to do is ask you to do it. This is what we are talking about when we say you should know without asking.

  78. 78.

    Shinobi

    August 3, 2011 at 5:49 pm

    @Djur: I have to say I’ve never actually requested a picture of a dick, and yet, I have seen quite a few. So there are certainly a number of men who enjoy sending pictures of their genitals to women who do not want to see them.

  79. 79.

    Djur

    August 3, 2011 at 5:55 pm

    @Shinobi: Oh, sure. I’m just saying not to conflate the two. Men who send unrequested pictures of dick are idiots. Of course, I’d be kind of weirded out if some woman sent me an unrequested picture of her junk, too. (Actually, that’s happened. With an ex-girlfriend, though. It was in fact creepy.)

  80. 80.

    Shinobi

    August 3, 2011 at 6:02 pm

    @Djur: I find that it is typically from total strangers. An ex would be considerably less creepy to me. I often feel like it is the technological equivalent of flashing.

  81. 81.

    Brachiator

    August 3, 2011 at 6:11 pm

    @jayackroyd:

    The opening argument Brin makes is that privacy is an aberration in human history, a product of urbanization and the industrial revolution. Before then, people spent their lives in small communities, and knew everything about everyone.

    And people spent probably spent an equal amount of time trying to get away from prying eyes in those small communities.

    I don’t think this holds up. For example, our hominid cousins, chimps, bonobos, etc, have been observed moving away from the group to apparently get some privacy (especially to do a little mating).

  82. 82.

    lou

    August 3, 2011 at 6:28 pm

    There’s definitely a big difference between this case, where the guy claims that his girlfriend asked for the pictures, and what (ahem) Weiner did when he sent unsolicited pics.

    I have a friend who was recently divorced in an ugly way (hub left her for another woman). She signed up for an online dating services set up a meeting with a guy, and got a picture of his dick after he stood her up. Apparently while he was waiting for her to arrive at the watering hole, he met some hot blonde instead. The pic was his “apology.” Dick.

    And 2 more prospects did the dick-shots too. She dropped that online service.

    As others have said, there’s a big difference between getting nude photos from a loved man and a total stranger.

    Re: Mark Foley. I knew him back when I lived in Florida. At that time most pols and media folks knew he was gay and nobody blinked an eye. He was also a moderate Republican. He defeated a long-time moderate Democrat for the seat. Then Gingrich brainwashed him, or threatened him.

    But Republicans aren’t the only in-the-closet pols. Witness Jim McGreevey.

  83. 83.

    Older

    August 3, 2011 at 7:57 pm

    I don’t suppose you need more testimony, but here it is regardless: I find my sweetie’s junk very attractive. Actually, I find all of him very attractive, but his genitalia are a real turn-on, and I’m in my 70’s.

    I don’t think housework is “foreplay” or that people should know what I want without my telling them, but I do think that my housemates, whoever they are, should regard the vacuum cleaner as just another tool, and be willing to use it whenever it’s called for.

    My standards for housework are kind of loose, not to say college-studently, but it’s important to me that my sweetie’s standards and mine should not be too different, and that where they differ, it should not be regarded as a serious defect in one or the other of us. Once that’s settled (and we have settled it), let the good times roll!

    As to sending nude pics, I’d like to think that the outrage is just another adjustment to advancing technology, but really, sometimes it seems like we’re going the other way, and that’s scary.

  84. 84.

    Stefan

    August 3, 2011 at 8:20 pm

    The opening argument Brin makes is that privacy is an aberration in human history, a product of urbanization and the industrial revolution. Before then, people spent their lives in small communities, and knew everything about everyone.

    Um, large cities predate the industrial revolution by thousands of years. Ancient Babylon had over 200,000 inhabitants, while ancient Rome at its height had over half-a-million inhabitants, as did its imperial successor Constantinople. Baghdad circa 700 reached about a million. In eastern Asia, Changan in present day China had 400-500 thousand in the second century AD. Angkor Wat is thought to have had room for a million people, and even in the Americas, Tenochlitan in pre-Columbian Mexico had over 250,000 people.

    Plenty of room for privacy in large, sprawling cities such as those, particularly when there were no pictures or fingerprints to fix your identity — all you needed was a name change and you could disappear.

  85. 85.

    Robin G.

    August 3, 2011 at 8:29 pm

    @Noah Brand: Came here to say this, but you totally beat me to it — including the very xkcd comic I intended to link to!

    I simply have no idea why men keep sending nude pictures of themselves to women- Ladies, does that really turn you on?

    Yes. Yes it does. If the man is reasonably attractive, I get hot. I’m a heterosexual woman and naked men turn me on.

    I don’t get why that’s surprising.

  86. 86.

    hilzoy

    August 3, 2011 at 9:19 pm

    “Ladies, does that really turn you on?”

    No.

    Consider the ice cream cone. Yummy! And yet, much as I like to eat ice cream cones, this does not begin to translate into liking to watch other people eat ice cream cones, liking to look at ice cream cones or pictures of them, looking at pictures of other people’s ice cream cones, watching ice cream cone videos, listening to ice cream cones, etc. The total delight of eating an ice cream cones does not spill over into other media at all.

    Similarly with sex and genitalia, as far as I’m concerned.

  87. 87.

    4jkb4ia

    August 3, 2011 at 9:24 pm

    Violet:

    And not because you refused to do it for a week and he decided just to do it himself.

    (This is part of why John shouldn’t be called gay for his cooking experiments. John is being an adult.)

  88. 88.

    4jkb4ia

    August 3, 2011 at 9:44 pm

    Ladies, does this really turn you on?

    Not unless the person turned me on already. There, that was completely bland, and maybe not even bullshit.

    I hate doing housework so much that nothing relating to it could be sexy. Part of what being sexy is I can’t describe anything better than “I’d rather laugh with the sinners and cry with the saints”. Being a sexual creature doesn’t make you afraid. You get strength from sexuality that is like a stream of water and nutrients up from the ground. That strength allows you to be fully alive and passionate in whatever you might do–it feeds your thirst for good also.

    87 has happened in the 4jkb4ia household as far as mopping the kitchen floor.

  89. 89.

    EmmATX

    August 3, 2011 at 9:47 pm

    Ladies, does that really turn you on?

    From a random stranger, no. From a boyfriend, totally.

  90. 90.

    Djur

    August 3, 2011 at 10:17 pm

    @hilzoy: Apparently some people do, though, or else the Food Network wouldn’t exist, and the term “food porn” would never have been coined.

  91. 91.

    Paul in KY

    August 4, 2011 at 10:09 am

    @Amir_Khalid: For most early urban dwellers, your ‘flat’ was probably a one room 12′ X 12′ area where 10 people lived. Your neighbors lived about the same.

    The wealthier city inhabitants would have more rooms, courtyard, etc.

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