Here’s a pretty remarkable interview with independent stock and forex trader Alessio Rastani on the BBC this morning, in which he’s either being perfectly candid about how traders are viewing the Eurozone crisis, or he’s just trolling. Anyway, he’s a sociopath.
He says that the euro’s collapse is inevitable and that the “savings of millions of people are going to vanish,” within the next year, and there’s not much that governments can do about it — not that he cares one way or the other:
“For most traders we don’t really care about having a fixed economy, having a fixed situation, our job is to make money from it,” he said. “Personally, I’ve been dreaming of this moment for three years. I go to bed every night and I dream of another recession.”
It’s all in the game, I know. But future generations will question the wisdom of worshipping these guys as job-creating geniuses. If there are future generations.
Evolved Deep Southerner
Forex trader? Condoms?
Corner Stone
Traders don’t care up or down. It may as well be left or right.
They trade prices, not livelihoods.
DougJ, if you have a plugged in bankster buddy you know this doesn’t mean a thing to them.
KG
The moment it became a game, we all lost. That’s the lesson of the last decade or two. We separated the pursuit of income from the production of goods or the provision of services, we got screwed
Shinobi
Fuck those fucking fuckers.
KG
@Evolved Deep Southerner: Foreign exchange… They trade currency
Big Baby DougJ
@Corner Stone:
It’s more complicated than that. Not everyone in that world is a currency trader.
West of the Cascades
@Evolved Deep Southerner: That would be foreskin traders. Forex traders trade currency in the foreign exchange markets.
El Cid
You just hate people for their success.
J. Michael Neal
@KG: It became a game centuries, if not millenia, ago. South Sea Bubble? Tulip craze? I’d bet that some of Akhenaton’s subjects made and lost millions of whatever they used for currency speculating on grain harvests.
The problem is not that you have traders who treat it like a game. The problem is that there isn’t enough regulation to prevent too much of the economy from being devoted to finance.
I should also point out that most of the people in the business aren’t sociopaths. Too many of them are, but it’s not a majority. Some of the traders I worked with are some of the nicest people I know, even if one of them did give me a Michael Savage book for a graduation present.
It was a *joke*.
slag
Imagine that.
I’m starting to see the percentage in letting professional traders write our financial laws. It’s the same percentage I see in letting professional thieves write our property laws. And in letting professional hitmen write our homicide laws. Lowest crime rate ever!
Evolved Deep Southerner
@KG: I’uz jokin’.
Evolved Deep Southerner
@KG: Like Soros?
(ducks)
Evolved Deep Southerner
@West of the Cascades: Christ. Fuck snarking around this place. It just doesn’t pay.
Corner Stone
@Big Baby DougJ: Who are you arguing with? Because it’s not me.
Chris
Oh, there’ll be future generations. They’ll just be living in shit. If the worshippees have their way.
And quotes like that one are why it might’ve been a mistake to think that the Masters Of The Universe would really have seen it as a deal-breaker if the U.S. did default on its debt, or if other things completely broke the economy’s back. Like I posted a few days ago – are they supposed to be afraid that we’ll turn into a third world country? Economic elites live very well in third world countries.
Big Baby DougJ
@Corner Stone:
Yeah, you’re right. My bankster friend hates traders even more than we do.
Vixen Strangely
I view the mentality of these people like gambling addicts who are positive they are on to the big score–logic be daned. “A (long odds) is A (big payout)”. They are not any better than lottery hopefuls–with the dread example of having won a little. They look forward to the crash in the hopes that creditors, enemies, people with better-looking cars and nicer luggage, will be knocked off their pivot and they (Rand’s Own) will rise to the top like cream. Which is why I’m always skeptical of people who talk about the invisible hand or the genius of the market, because sometimes, you can see what the fingers are doing or actually meet the subgeniuses in the business. And its really unsettling to consider that small investors and pension portfolios might really be at the mercy of people whose adolescent inferiority complex combined with just tghe right reading material could result in a “withholding of productivity” or withdrawal of capital sufficient to wreak chaos.
In a better-managed world, I’d ruther it be that that kind of hubris were swiftly met with a sampling of the realities of subsistence-farming or managing a stall in some remote bazaar. You know, just so that they understood how privilege manages the board in the game of Real Life. Sadly, I just know they’ll retire and play a bunch of discgolf and leave a packet to their progeny. It’s the circle of life.
patrick II
After you get past the sociopaty, that is at the core of what he is saying. The governments of Europe will not create the rescue package necessary to save the Euro because the banks would have to take too big of a loss, and the banks rule. He is being realistic — but he shouldn’t enjoy it so much.
Not unlike here three years ago. the big banks (after Lehman) came out fine and we pay the price.
suzanne
Dude, there will ALWAYS be future generations.
Fucking is still free, and birth control still, too often, is not.
Linnaeus
Neofeudalism, people. It’s knocking on our door.
Dustin
If there’s one thing history class in HS and college taught me it’s that a ruling class of people with that sort of mentality do just fine… right up until the point where their heads roll. Call me a bastard, but I’ll be pulling out the popcorn when it gets that far.
PeakVT
Be sure to scroll down at Gawker for a sharp-looking image in the comments.
Calouste
Btw, on the banksters as sociopaths meme, keep in mind that these people typically have the best education money can buy. It’s quite an indictment on the Harvards and Oxfords of the world that they produce these kind of people in such significant numbers.
Big Baby DougJ
@Calouste:
I went to Harvard and I knew my classmates were largely sociopaths by my sophomore year. It’s worse than you think: the future trader/investment banker types I knew were among the nicer people I met. I am not kidding.
Ailuridae
Traders and bankers still aren’t the same thing no matter how often the comments here try to conflate the two. Just figured I would chime in with that. Again.
Ailuridae
@Big Baby DougJ:
I had a similar experience. By far the most evil people I encountered in school (@Chicago) ended up not in finance or I-Banking or trading but in publishing and medicine
Big Baby DougJ
@Ailuridae:
I was going to say medicine and law. What freaked me out most was meeting these assholes who had gone into law five and six years later and learning that even they found working at a big New York law firm to be intolerably dehumanizing.
Dustin
@Ailuridae:
You’re right, trader’s gather vast fortunes suckering rubes into pumping money into the stock market, and bankers (as we know them today) do the same by suckering those rubes into getting home loans they can’t afford and then selling them off before their mark defaults.
Yep, totally different.
Can I have my stodgy banker who’s only job is to store my money, not invest it in some short term scheme, back? Please? How about long term investment to grow my business and not the type dominated by computerized millisecond parasitic transactions the stock market’s become?
The simple fact of the matter is they may not be the same but they’re both financial instruments that have gone from being aids to commerce to being parasites on the system, as a general rule. We’d be better off scrapping the lot and starting over.
pete
@PeakVT: Nice
Cliff in NH
Big fucking difference between (individual;Non-institutional)traders and brokers.
Brokers are sociopaths.
If you don’t know the difference…
(trade Your money, or someone else’s, there is a Big F’n Difference.)
Arundel
But the Wall Street protesters stink of patchouli and some of them have breasts, that the media tells me they have been lasciviously showing when they’re not doing Pot Drugs and having Encounter Yogabortion Workshop Groups funded by Jane Fonda.
Therefore, we should really leave things as they are.
Big Baby DougJ
@Dustin:
I’m actually not even sure it’s that bad, I just think they shouldn’t be given so much influence.
Cliff in NH
@Dustin:
Fuck You. that’s broker’s you moron
Fixt your moronosity.
Cliff in NH
@Dustin:
Oh, checking account? savings account? You So lazy you equate risk with safety, you are f’n stupid if you think a investment bank or trading account is the same as a checking account.
Moron.
Dustin
My my Cliff, do the ad hominem attacks really make your point better or should we just pull out rulers and get on with the dick measuring contest?
You want to draw a distinction between trader’s and their middlemen? Go ahead, I don’t because at the end of the day the results are the same. Or do you dispute the fact that someone with level 1 access to the Nasdaq system doesn’t stand a snowballs chance in hell of competing against pros with level 2 access?
Same with banks. When my savings account and home loan are both run by the same bank, and my loan is sold piecemeal as an investment medium, I’m going to hold the whole damn place accountable for it.
You know what people hate more than morons? Pedantic assholes who draw distinctions where there’s no difference.
@Big Baby DougJ:
I specifically painted a worst-case scenario because, at the end of the day, corruption is a compounding problem. It’s a feed-forward situation where, at this point, regulatory capture’s pretty much called the game. Regular peaceful means very likely won’t be able to fix the problem. Whether that means a global meltdown or one restricted to just one area of the world remains to be seen, but until the people that caused the problem are held accountable (as a culture) they’ll content themselves to thinking their particular safe haven is fine and won’t change.
Cliff in NH
Don’t Trade Stocks then.
Long term investment to improve your business?
Invest in your PEOPLE, They are what makes a business you moron, Who does the work?! Its not the bankers! It’s not the traders! It’s NOT THE OWNERS! It’s the guys on the factory floor! The people who Do stuff and Make stuff for a living! THEY are the ones you must protect and cultivate to build a successful business.
They! are the people you must invest in, Not some Stocks or bonds on a international market! INVEST IN PEOPLE and you will have a successful business.
Cliff in NH
@Dustin:
So, set up a non revokable trust, Pay your mortgage to the trust until the bank you were paying can prove it owns your loan.
You have to make them prove you should be paying them.
Do some research on MERS, see who holds your loan.
Make a difference by standing up and DEMANDING real paperwork to show that they own your loan.
Magic words: Show Me The Note (with proper paperwork and filings)
Gwiwer
One wonders how long an oncologist would be able to keep their job if they publicly admitted that they go to bed every night dreaming of a massive cancer epidemic and that they just wish that the government would bugger off with all of their anti-smoking, pollution preventing, healthy-living endorsing interruptions to his ability to get very very rich off of other people’s disease and suffering.
Cain
@Big Baby DougJ:
Thank God I was in Computer Science. We have nice people in general here. The management types though are kinda psychotic I thought, especially the marketing folks.. bleah.
Cliff in NH
@Dustin:
You clearly have no faith in the courts.
There Are laws, They have to follow them too, YOU just have to Force THEM to follow the law through the proper procedures.
We have a system of laws for a reason, and whether you believe it or not, The reason is NOT so that the rich get richer.
Dustin
@Cliff in NH:
You missed the point. Gathering long-term investors, who have a stake in the company, to start a venture because the founder doesn’t have sufficient startup capital on their own is a tried and true way to start a company. Offering additional long-term shares to investors as a way to raise capital to expand a company also works well. It’s when you get down to the fractions of a cent profit trades possible with fast access, proper algorithms, and no regulatory or tax-code restrictions that shit hits the proverbial fan. Things go from an investment to a Vegas-style siphon, and we’re living through the results of that system now.
It’s funny you should try to shift this to some sort of owners vs workers attack because, if you had a fucking clue about my history here, you’d know that I AM one of those floor guys. Since you seem to be on a tangent I’ll join you there.
For my day job I work for a multi-billion dollar privately held company that is run by second generation owner like it’s on the public exchange. He’s always on about the next quarter (but no further). I ALSO help out at my local brewpub roughly 30-40 hrs a week, because I enjoy it, and they operate under the motto “First our employees, then our customers, then our community.”. I’ll give you a guess as to which one will still be around in 15 years.
@40
Are you really that naive Cliff? Do you want me to start listing off instances of regulatory capture and bought political and legal influence in the American political system? Corruptions practically a national pastime, or have you not been paying attention AT ALL?
Cliff in NH
@Dustin:
Contact your local DA if you suspect fraud (aka, your loan is registered through MERS) They CAN’T intimidate every single county DA in the country.
It’s impossible.
Cliff in NH
Dustin, It sounds Like you are living in Somalia right?
You got fraud? you got evidence? there are courts you know.
Dustin
Alrighty Cliff, I’m done pounding my head against a brick wall. You win the internet.
Sorry folks, I believe I just threadjacked this one. Carry one, won’t happen again.
Cliff in NH
But its NOT.
and anyway day to day trading has nothing to do with funding, Thats what IPOs are for.
Anyway If you depend on trading to fund your business you shouldn’t be in business.
G’nite
JenJen
My first instinct to this story was complete disgust and revulsion, and what’s sad is that a few hours later I’m still only getting complete disgust and revulsion.
Jump, you fuckers. Would it impolite to joke that I’m feeling bullish on guillotines?
isildur
This story puts me in mind of Richard Morgan’s Market Forces. How long until they’re openly admitting to gambling on wars in the third world?
Cliff in NH
@Dustin:
Dustin, Sorry to say , but you are wrong again, It’s impossible to threadjack a open thread.
Cliff in NH
@JenJen:
Nope, Hell no, I’ve been there since Late dec 2006, Unf the courts move incredibly slowly even in the face of what seems like stupidly obvious evidence of wrongdoing.. (could be that they only got their asses kicked into gear on January 21, 2009)
Yutsano
@JenJen: To lighten your mood:
The new one or the original? This matters.
Lord Stanley’s tableware pics. Also. Too.
Cliff in NH
@isildur:
Um, Halliburton?
just assume you bought HAL right before war was declared.
Say 6-10 months before.
lonesomerobot
What’s stupid is that the BBC let this psychopath go on their network and pimp his panic agenda.
What else was he going to say? He admits in the video that he wants to cash in on another collapse; it’s actually almost a parody, it’s so obviously self-serving.
JenJen
@Yutsano: The new Hockey Night in Canada theme, which I don’t love nearly as much as the old one, but nonetheless just hearing it awakens an excited, change-of-seasons mood.
I SO owe you Lord Stanley puppeh pics. He’s 6 months old and a week now. He’s well into his bratty phase and is testing my patience, but HE IS SO TEH CUTE.
Yutsano
@JenJen:
My little girl is a year old and in exactly the same phase! She’s next to me purring right now.
Sleep time, early shifts all this week only. Oh and some time soon we need to discuss Laphroaig. Yes there’s a Dawg involved. :)
jomo
Something tells me that’s the kind of an interview that makes someone a scapegoat. I bet he regrets doing coke before going on air
russell
I’ve met mafiosi who were lovely people.
It’s not about their personalities, it’s about what they do.
“Jump, you fuckers” is really not an irrational response.
Robert Waldmann
Randroids dream of electoral sheep
I think that today your title won the internet.
GregInMA
Thirty-five years ago, the movie Network was over-the top satire. Now, it’s documentary, or prophecy if you will. As Arthur Jensen tells Howard Beale in one scene:
Sigh
NCSteve
Wow! That’s just, like, a totally amazing coincidence, because I’ve been having dreams lately that are totally closely related to his. Of course, my dreams involve guillotines and tumbrels, rather than recessions, but the coincidence is still amazing.
And, hey, I’m not saying they’re pleasant dreams, if only because once the Peepul run out of heads on people like him his to trim with the National Razor, they tend to start looking at the ones on former fellow-travelers like me . . .
Sloegin
Adolf Merckle was a very nice guy as well. If more traders wound up like him, the world might be a better place.
Li
I am happy that some of my fellow BJ commenters are latching onto the real admission in this shockingly honest interview; that Goldman and Co. are running the world, and since they don’t give a shit about saving Europe (or the US, for that matter), and stand to make plenty of money on the downside, they would prefer to bring on the pain.
People starving to death means another Ferrari in the garage to these people. They have perfected the alchemy of converting misery into money, and now they are out to make us all as miserable as possible.
But remember, if just you elect the right Goldman owned politicians, everything will be swell!
Frankensteinbeck
@slag:
Law enforcement consults with former professional criminals all the time, especially con men. They don’t care about the bite being put on OTHER criminals, and they know all the truly nasty and devious tricks no honest man would perform.
@Chris:
You’ve highlighted the biggest problem I have with the ‘Masters Of The Universe’ argument I hear so frequently here. ‘Rich people’ =/= ‘Bankers’. The ultra-wealthy are a diverse group with often conflicting interests. What benefits the bankers and particularly the hardcore stock traders does not necessarily benefit the insurance CEOs or the car company execs or the entertainment industry. About all they can agree on is ‘low taxes plz’. The arrogant and power-mad and sociopathic make remarkably poor conspirators because they’ll always shaft the rest of the conspiracy for their own short-sighted gain.
Money talks, but it shouts in a lot of different directions. When you talk about creating a recession, you’re especially pitting groups against each other.
@Dustin:
You think there’s no point in regulation? Regulatory capture is the EXCEPTION. Read The Jungle and notice how you don’t live in that world. Regulation works pretty damn well, which is why the Reaganites have worked so hard to deregulate.