Turns out yesterday’s bizarre escaped animal incident in Zanesville, Ohio (east of Columbus) where dozens of exotic animals were put down after they were released into the Ohio countryside before their owner apparently committed suicide? Yeah, you can hang that one on Gov. John Kasich’s neck too.
The tragedy exposes the dangers of wildlife trafficking, in which private collectors actively trade in exotic animals all over the states “in a vibrant and poorly regulated market.” According to the Humane Society, Ohio has long been “the center of the exotic-auction industry.” Ohio’s former Gov. Ted Strickland (D) attempted to “crack down” on the market by issuing an executive order that banned new private ownership of exotic animals. Issued on Jan. 6, 2011, it was one of his last acts as governor and lasted 90 days. His replacement, GOP Gov. John Kasich let it expire. Only now, after the bloodbath, does Kasich see it as “a problem.”
Kasich’s team called the measure “unenforceable.” Only one problem: parts of that executive order were very much enforceable, including the provision that could have prevented this awful event.
If Kasich had extended the emergency ban, “the state would have had the authority to remove [the owner’s] animals” as the owner, 62-year old Tommy Thompson, had been convicted of animal cruelty. Thompson shot himself after releasing the animals yesterday.
So yeah, way to go, Republicans. You could have done the right thing, you could have stopped this mess, instead Kasich said “NO BIGGIE LOL” and let the order and the power the state had that could have prevented this from happening expire. If he wasn’t the most hated Governor in the land, this one pretty much seals it.
Asshole.
r€nato
funny how free market cultists and glibertarians can never be found when the rest of us have to deal with the consequences of their daffy dogma.
Yevgraf
I just wonder what the dead guy (may he rot in hell) used as his Free Republic membername. Freepers from Ohio were always among the nastiest (see matsuidon).
Lysana
But! But! But! The rich are so put-upon! They need solace in these dark days of assaults on their patriotism! So what if it involves buying monkeys with herpes and jungle cats? They’ll have a better life in America! Why do you hate the rich?
r€nato
exotic animals don’t kill people, irresponsible exotic animal owners kill people.
besides, there was no need for government intervention. As we all know, every man is an island unto himself. This fine citizen should have the LIBERTY AND FREEEEDUMMMBBBB to own whatever pets he pleased. If in some way he was irresponsible as an owner, those harmed by his negligence can simply bring a lawsuit against him.
But not using one of those awful trial attorneys, who are a tremendous drag on the economy.
GregB
Kasich is a real-life Dr. Douchelittle.
Davis X. Machina
@r€nato:
Everything that is, can be bought and sold. That which cannot be bought or sold, is not.
Violet
Those poor animals. They didn’t know what had happened when they got released. They were probably scared and afraid and then they got shot. And it all could have been prevented. Fucking Republicans.
MikeJ
How many weeks ago was it that the Republicans put out a press release saying that regulations on pythons was a job killer?
And why don’t I have a python import Snake as job_killer joke ready?
Roger Moore
Whocouldaknown that letting random schmucks own dangerous predators would end up badly? I’m glad to live in a state where the state department of agriculture forbids ordinary citizens from importing non-native species except for common domesticated animals- even if they don’t include ferrets in their list of approved domesticated animals.
Warren Terra
There are fewer than 2,000 Bengal tigers left in the wild. This SOB had 18 of them (all of them dead, of course) and clearly didn’t give a damn about their welfare, or about the species as a whole. Sometimes I wish I weren’t an Atheist, so he could be treated according to his merits.
r€nato
Glibertarianism for Idiots:
1) Deregulate everything.
2) When #1 leads to really bad consequences:
a) diagnose the cause as insufficient deregulation
b) find a Democrat somewhere, anywhere, and blame them
Any questions?
artem1s
Kasich is just piling on now. Like Ripkin. I mean does King John need another 501 bad acts to seal the deal on Worst Governor Ever?
Zifnab
Can I just say that I am appalled at the idea that you think more big government regulation would have solved this problem. If anything, it was big government regulation and the socialist animal prisons you call zoos that created this mess in the first place. If the free market had been put in charge of animal regulation, then these animals could have been bought, sold, and traded as market forces dictated, and we could all be wearing tasteful tiger-lined suites right now, rather than watching this massive burden on the American taxpayer play out.
Zifnab
Can I just say that I am appalled at the idea that you think more big government regulation would have solved this problem. If anything, it was big government regulation and the soci alist animal prisons you call zoos that created this mess in the first place. If the free market had been put in charge of animal regulation, then these animals could have been bought, sold, and traded as market forces dictated, and we could all be wearing tasteful tiger-lined suites right now, rather than watching this massive burden on the American taxpayer play out.
nic danger
I like the post title…but do we have do it like they do on the discovery channel?
Culture of Truth
Recall the recent GOP jobs plan was Giant Deadly Snakes
Mnemosyne
I’m still astounded that the guy could be sentenced to prison for animal cruelty and the state still had no recourse to legally confiscate his animals. WTF is up with that? That’s like sending someone to jail for child abuse and then handing full custody back to him after he gets out.
lamh34
OT, but i didn’t believe it b4, but i believe it now, Marco Rubio is auditioning to become VP. He’s on CNN now speaking shit over Libya
Spaghetti Lee
No one could have predicted that keeping dozens of giant carnivorous animals on your ranch would end badly! No one, do you hear me, NO ONE! We must not doubt the FREE MARKET in this moment of weakness! We must press on! Free bengal tigers from everybody! No cages, no shots, no registration! That’s what we have to do to reaffirm our faith in the free market, God bless its name!
What a sick, sick, rotten story. Just how fucking small does your penis have to be to feel the need to surround yourself by dozens of tigers and wolves? What the fuck do these people think, that it makes them look tougher? Well, congrats, asshole. You’re dead, your “pets” are mostly dead, and whatever jackass point you were trying to prove has been wounded, hopefully fatally.
18 bengal tigers, Jesus Christ. Proportionally, that would be like, what, 100 million humans? Why was this one fucknut even allowed to own such a large percentage of such an endangered animal.
Warren Terra
@Culture of Truth:
OMG, that link is Teh Awesome; some pullquotes:
Culture of Truth
I can imagine the argument going something like, ‘the government hassled him over his animals, which were well-cared for, but the police kept harassing and he couldn’t take it anymore and so he killed himself and the animals were free until trigger-happy big government cops shot them all! Are you happy now, liberals’?!?!
Culture of Truth
“If you were eaten by a tiger, don’t blame the government, blame yourself!”
Urza
Mnemosne, that is pretty much what they do.
http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2011/10/19/347115/perry-child-abuse-funds/
Knowing people abused in Texas and how little they could get out of Child Protective Services makes this a personal issue. Basically if she didn’t have broken bones they couldn’t do anything, and when she did the family blamed it on a car accident so no need to investigate that either.
Villago Delenda Est
Suitable way to deal with fucktards like Kaisch:
Let some exotic animials rip him to shreds.
Then get the animals away from the carcas. We don’t want them to become morons from eating the tainted flesh.
schrodinger's cat
@lamh34: He wants to be the Palin of 2012. Eye candy for the 27%.
Roger Moore
@r€nato:
Absolutely correct. The citizens of Ohio should have been free to implement their own Second Amendment solution to the problem, rather than depending on government bureaucrats to protect them from rampaging wild animals.
walizonia
May not be quite so clear-cut. Maddow had a segment about this last night and had on Jack Hanna who is a representative from a local zoo and seemed knowledgeable about the issues.
His take was that Kasich was reworking the legislation so that it would be enforceable. The problem with shutting down such an operation is what to do with the animals. They can’t just be taken to a local pound and this is the real problem with allowing people to amass such exotic animal collections in the first place.
Culture of Truth
“Yes I approved letting deadly wild predators loose in Ohio, but it was mismanaged!”
Montysano
IIRC, the GOP went to the mat a couple of years ago to defeat onerous new legislation in Missouri to regulate puppy mills.
Spaghetti Lee
Y’all think you’re being ironic by proposing the “libertarian response” to this, but dollars to donuts the same conservation’s going on in Freeperland and RedState, and they’re being dead serious.
Legalize
@r€nato:
Oh, they can be found. They just lie about what happened, and/or feign ignorance over the causal connection to their rancid policies.
Culture of Truth
“This would never have happened with a double wide electrified fence!”
Spaghetti Lee
@Montysano:
They sure did. Republicans from all over the country descending on my adopted home state like so many vultures, swearing and vowing to overturn legislation aimed at preventing skeevy assholes from abusing and torturing puppies. Small-government conservatism at its fucking finest!
gelfling545
@Mnemosyne: Actually that situation with child custody happens far too often. I have seen some returned to abusive/neglectful parents before the parent even came to trial.
Villago Delenda Est
@Spaghetti Lee:
Poe’s Law…it’s everywhere you’ll ever be in our current discourse.
trollhattan
@lamh34:
Yep, I think Rubio’s their Zuper Zecret plan to snag the Hispanic vote.
Not entirely unrelated, a rift in the Republican ranks?
Lindsey Graham says GOP opposed Libya mission because Obama was president.
“I’m very disappointed in Congress,” said Graham. “Congress took an irrational view of the War Powers Act. I guarantee you that a lot Republicans who wanted the War Power Act invoked would not have asked for it to be invoked if President Obama were not president. To me, national security should be as bipartisan as possible.”
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2011/10/20/127842/lindsey-graham-says-gop-opposed.html#ixzz1bM3uVJXA
Keith
An interesting aside – Maddow invited Jack Hanna (Emeritus Director Columbus Zoo) on her show last night to talk about the Zanesville wild animal shoot-em-up that Tommy Thompson’s actions created. Before his entry on screen she outlined the Strickland-Kasich shift in policy on wild animal ownership.
Jack spent the entire first minute or so railing at any suggestion that Kasich was in any way responsible for this, by virtue of knocking down Strickland’s executive order.
I knew Hanna was a long time supporter of many conservative causes, Kasich included, so his trying on the role of right wing spokesperson was not too suprising. But man – he was ultra-defensive about the whole thing. To the point of ignoring Kasich’s own justification at the time for nixing the executive order – with language right out of the Snakes on a Plane = Jobs through less regulation playbook discussed up in this thread.
Hanna also touted his role in finally getting some rules sketched out and mechanisms put in place, that might – six weeks from now – have “prevented this tragedy from happening.”
Missed it by this much I’d say.
opal
@Culture of Truth:
To be fair, beloved family pets being eaten by introduced burmese pythons is a bipartisan issue in Florida.
greenergood
I am so ashamed. I see pictures every day on the tv, in the papers, etc. of starving, dying children, and those pictures disturb me, but I burst out crying when I saw the photo of the dead tigers, bears, wolves, etc. all laid out in the mud. I don’t think this makes me a bad person, but I just can’t figure it out.
lamh34
@schrodinger’s cat: @trollhattan:
IDK, I think he’d be perfect for Romney. He’s slimey and perfectly willing to sell out his own community. He’s got his, and they’ve gotta get theirs with no help from Rubio!
I also think it’s funny Rubio and his GOP brethren called Libya “Obama war in Libya” and yet are pretty quick to dismiss this.
Edgar Allahu Akbar Poe
@walizonia:
I saw the same interview. Hanna was adamant that they hadn’t abandoned the law, and that they didn’t have the capacity/personnel to confiscate let alone move or house such animals. According to him they had been trying to figure it out.
slag
So, am I the only one who, when they saw the title, thought this post was going to pertain to Rick Santorum?
Just wondering.
srv
Before piling on the actions of a possibly crazy/mentally ill guy I have to wonder what the state would have done to this collection of animals if they’d taken them away from him earlier.
I’ve heard there are lots of problems with exotic animals and owners being unable to take care of them, other facilities being overloaded, and no guarantee they’re going to be sent somewhere better than whatever crappy place they’re already at. I think there was even a post here a couple years back about an operation having great difficulty with funding.
Does anyone have a link pointing to the specifics of the animal cruelty conviction? Not finding anything with the google.
jayjaybear
@Mnemosyne: Which happens far too often, too, especially if the abuser is the mother.
Bill E Pilgrim
@Keith:
It’s a cautionary tale about deregulation in general in any case. The zero-regulation fantasy world that Republicans live in just rains lollipops and money, whereas the real version has actual wild animals roaming the streets. Through no fault of their own I might add.
Culture of Truth
“Governor you rounded up all the tigers but the lions ate several people.”
“You’re comparing apples and oranges!”
Heez
If there had been no onerous governmental regulations then all these animals would be long extinct. See? The free market works!
tulip
can some explain why all the animals had to be shot? that’s the part I don’t understand. couldn’t they have been captured? Or did the police just do what the police do now, and shot everything the fuck up.
jayjaybear
Re:Rubio…the birthers have already declared him ineligible.
Martin
I don’t know. I think it worked out perfectly for the GOP.
Smaller government + deregulation ends with a broad application of firearms. Isn’t that the basic formula for all of their policies?
SuzieC
Hanna was actually ripsnorting furious about the whole mess on our local TV but he has to work with Kasich–he is on the task force developing new regs. At the time he let Strickland’s EO expire, Kasich said it would “hurt small business.” As said above, Ohio is the epicenter of exotic animal trading for whatever reason and also has many libertarian militia types. What a recipe for disaster.
Oh, and in other news, the wife of Kasich’s chief of staff is an animal lover, apparently, and went on a twitter rampage against the local sheirff’s deputies who were forced to deal with the mass animal escape, calling them “morons.” She must have been influenced by her husband’s boss, who famously ranted that a cop that pulled him over for ignoring a public safety vehicle was an “idiot.” See Plunderbund for details.
r€nato
@tulip: Not at all feasible given the circumstances.
catclub
@artem1s: Lots of competition:
Walker, Scott, Jan Brewer is falling way behind in the crazy. Also the guy in Maine.
bkny
and those poor animals that were spared will likely be returned to the wife! and she’s likely going to keep the primates that were caged, so posed no threat and weren’t killed.
this is so fucking unbelievable that people are allowed to enslave these animals. too bad that prick was able to commit suicide and wasn’t torn apart and eaten by the tigers and bears.
and i didn’t realize jack hanna was right there at the columbus zoo. i wonder if he’s ever been supportive of the efforts to end this shit. you’d think his celebrity would make passage a no-brainer.
Suffern ACE
Just a quibble, the owner of the animals was Terry not Tommy. No need to drag the former Wisconsin governor into this.
Martin
@tulip: They’re prepared to capture one or two dangerous animal, not dozens. Not enough tranquilizers, nets, ability to contain, etc.
They never prepared to scale the solution up that quickly.
Bill E Pilgrim
@tulip: tulip here’s the article I read this morning that was fairly convincing for me. Read it all and see what you think.
Hypnos
1.3% of the global Bengal tiger population was killed in Ohio.
Let that sink in.
It’s equivalent to 91 million humans.
Roger Moore
@greenergood:
I don’t think that’s something you have to be ashamed about. I think our reaction to children and animals suffering is very similar, largely because we see them in the same category of innocents suffering for somebody else’s faults.
FormerSwingVoter
Off-topic, but this really pisses me off:
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1011/66491.html
God forbid we even consider incarcerating a lower percentage of our citizens than, say, Iran.
SpotWeld
Didn’t Stossel have some sort of nutty show about how these tiger farms were supposed to save endangered species?
The Spy Who Loved Me
Speaking of assholes:
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/blogs/national-affairs/obama-solicits-designers-to-work-unpaid-on-jobs-poster-20111019
The Obama campaign may want to rethink this brilliant idea.
brent
@tulip:
I am not one to spend a lot of time defending the police tulip but I think they really had little choice here. This is not a situation they were really equipped to handle with restraint. It was a fast moving and highly dangerous situation for which they lacked any extensive expertise. They only thing they could do was end the threat as quickly as possible.
Certified Mutant Enemy
@Montysano:
And when the referendum to ban puppy mills passed, the Missouri GOP promptly introduced legislation to undo the ban.
Chris T.
@MikeJ: from exotic_animals import *
The Populist
@bkny:
He was on Maddow last night. Yes, he’s supportive of having a law that allows only legit breeders for zoos (he says thanks to the LEGIT breeders, species can thrive again) where they are inspected regularly. He’s against any Joe Blow owning these animals.
One point of disagreement i have with Mr Hanna is when Rachel pointed out what Kasich had done, Hanna comes on and says all previous governors are at fault for this. Bullshit Jack. Kasich clearly didn’t care and like 9/11 and weather problems, many saw something like this coming.
Scott
The local law enforcement really got handed a terrible situation there — I think they had some tranquilizer, but not enough for as many animals as they had to deal with. And animal tranquilizers don’t work particularly quickly either — they tranked one animal, and it freaked out and charged them. They were stuck with a choice of either shooting the animals or running the risk of people getting mauled by starving tigers and bears… :(
The Populist
@Hypnos: Jack Hanna was very sad about that. Problem is, they couldn’t have caught them and the guy who released them snipped the cages so they couldn’t be herded back into them. Typical suicidal, selfish maniac. He condemned those animals to death once he pulled the trigger on himself.
Marc
@The Spy Who Loved Me:
Because political campaigns have never had volunteers do anything before?
The Obama haters get more pathetic by the day.
The Populist
@SuzieC: That’s fine that Hanna wants to work with Kasich but to give him cover on national tv like he did last night is the height of stupidity.
I have respect for Jack Hanna. But some of it was lost when he decided to play the “all the former governors ignored this too!”
Scott
@The Populist: Kasich chose to deal with the imperfect law the way Wichita tried to deal with the expense of prosecuting domestic violence — by making it legal. That’s the big problem with what he did — he took something that was a serious issue and he made it 100% legal. He dropkicked the issue because he’s a lazy wingnut, and all they’re good for is shoving problems off so someone else will have to deal with them.
The Populist
@Culture of Truth: Don’t forget bananas. Cain did mention bananas too.
The Populist
@Scott: Agreed…I don’t see him as lazy as much as he’s unqualified to lead. They sure as hell love to work hard to defeat common sense proposals and laws.
These people do not want to lead. They want to destroy government so the “dirty hippies” can’t spend, spend, spend to help the less fortunate among us. Argh.
slag
@The Spy Who Loved Me: I understand the underlying sentiment there, but let’s be honest…lots of designers have made money off of the Obama campaign in the past. Some of them gave it all back, but that wasn’t a requirement.
Bill E Pilgrim
The only part I’m not clear about is: was Jack Hanna on Rachael Maddow last night?
snowball
@walizonia:
I saw the same interview with Jack Hanna and his defense of Kasich. If Hanna’s defense was true, then why was nothing done between January (when Kasich took office) and yesterday? Nine months!
So no, while I admire Hanna, I don’t buy his defense of Kasich. There is no excuse for not getting anything done over nine months. Heck, his party had control of the legislature.
AdamK
Since the Burmese pythons are over here, let’s balance things out by sending Kasich and a bunch of Republicans to Burma, and see if they reproduce in the wild.
The Populist
@Marc: I’d rather he solicit people to do this for free than have to pay for it when the campaign will need every dollar for the fight against the right in 12.
Shoot, I’d do it. If it got me some free publicity, cool. If I win, I get tons of pub and a signed copy which will be worth something significant over time.
The Populist
@Bill E Pilgrim: Yes…I just posted that.
lamh34
Marco Rubio’s been all over news auditioning for VP with his BS “the French deserve ALL credit Libya” (no mention of our soldiers btw) so now he’s got out there and the other VP hopefuls and their surrogates are out to let him know not so fast…
Rubio’s parents
“Just beneath the wide assumption that Marco Rubio would be offered the Republican vice presidential nomination has always been a wavelet of chatter from Florida Republicans that he had feet of clay.
And this, well, isn’t good:
It isn’t entirely clear to what degree this was a story Rubio had been told or told himself, and the details include a touch of ambiguity, but it’s not great for the Florida Senator.”
Mnemosyne
@tulip:
Assuming I’m counting correctly, the guy let loose 56 wild animals. All at the same time. They were able to capture 6, shot 48, found one dead, and one (a baboon) is still unaccounted for, though it looks like it may have been eaten by one of the cats.
If 18 tigers and 17 lions were set loose in your rural neighborhood, what’s your plan for tranquilizing all of them before dark?
Though I am darkly amused that it looks like one of the tigers Thompson set loose snacked on the corpse’s head. Seems fair to me.
John S.
@The Spy Who Loved Me:
That’s bullshit. The only thing worse than being asked to do comp work are the assholes who do the comp work. And crowdsourcing. Fuck that bullshit, too. It’s bad enough that companies are constantly seeking to commoditize creativity, but it’s even worse when creative people are willing accomplices in slitting their own throats.
Full disclosure: I’m a 15 year creative professional.
Bill E Pilgrim
Only teasing.
https://balloon-juice.com/2011/10/20/you-and-me-baby-aint-nothin-but-mammals/#comment-2835817
https://balloon-juice.com/2011/10/20/you-and-me-baby-aint-nothin-but-mammals/#comment-2835831
and that’s just the ones with “Maddow”, there were several other mentions of him being on TV that didn’t use her name.
MikeJ
@snowball:
Damned tiger union.
Scott
Part of the problem with asking designers to work for free is that there are some current efforts going on to encourage artists and other designers not to work for free, just because someone says it’ll help you get exposure. Lots of artists see requests to work for free about the same way as someone trying to mooch some free art…
opal
@The Spy Who Loved Me:
If that wasn’t snark, it should have been.
snowball
@MikeJ:
Speaking of unions; Kasich had time to kill the unions, but apparently not enough time to deal with a bill saving exotic animals. The more I think about this, the less respect I have for Hanna.
Grumpy Code Monkey
@snowball:
Those unions weren’t going to bust themselves…
Mnemosyne
@Scott:
It’s tricky, though — there’s a difference between working for free for a company that will make a profit from it and working for free for charity. I guess the question comes down to whether you consider working for a political campaign to be a paying job or a political donation.
opal
@lamh34:
Marco Rubio is merely an avatar for a frustrated Erick Erickson.
Nicole
Unfortunately this is the sort of stupid circumstance (private ownership of exotic animals), that, due to people’s absolute ignorance on the subject (i.e., it’s NEVER a good idea), gets ignored until something awful happens, and then it gets legislated. I would be curious to know under what circumstances the states that have laws against it passed those laws.
This is a horrible tragedy, but at least it is now likely Ohio will be shamed into passing laws, and the tragedy did not involve any innocent people getting killed, which has not always been the case. I still can’t believe that asshole released a monkey with FUCKING HERPES B. There’s a reason primate keepers wear surgical garb when they work with primates and it ain’t just about the monkeys’ health.
And it can’t be said often enough; the officers did the right thing. Accredited zoos also have shoot-to-kill procedures in place if large predators escape. The reason the NYC cops were able to dart the tiger in the apartment is because it was in a confined space. There is just no way to safely dart large predators in an unconfined space.
But that doesn’t make it any less a tragedy. I haven’t looked at any of the photos; I can’t bear it.
Scott
@Mnemosyne: Very much so. I understand why some artists and designers would be eager to work for the campaign, even for free, but I also understand those who say that good work should be something the campaign should be willing to pay for…
Nicole
@snowball: Full disclosure: I worked with Jack Hanna a few times some years ago, so I am biased in that he’s a very, very nice guy and very passionate about what he does.
I think Hanna’s frustration was, if I understood him correctly (the man does talk fast), that the outgoing ban was put in place with no funding or logistics as to how it would be implemented. And I can see that point- it’s all well and good to confiscate animals, but if you have no place to put them, what do you do? You can’t take a grizzly to the ASPCA. The animal needs a habitable space and it needs an awful lot of food and it’s expensive. An adult tiger needs between 9-18 pounds of meat a day. And they need the bones or else calcium supplements and all kinds of other things. It’s expensive as all heck to keep exotics in anything resembling humane conditions.
So, while I hate Kasich like I do evil, I can see the frustration of attempting to blame one governor when the problem has been in place for years, and (from what I can gather) the outgoing one didn’t leave any funding in place to carry out the order.
snowball
@Nicole:
I hear you. And until last night, I have had nothing but admiration for Mr Hanna.
His defense of Kasich was mindboggling. Surely the funding shouldn’t have taken nine months (the amount of time Kasich has been governor) to resolve? That’s where I have a problem with Kasich and Hanna’s defense of Kasich.
Kasich, a shown by him getting the Republican legislature to kill the unions, could easily have gotten the legislature to quickly approve funding for an area etc for these animals. He didn’t. He had other priorities. Instead of Hanna defending him, Hanna should have asked why nothing got done between January and now. I’m at a loss as to why Hanna defended Kasich.
MikeJ
Kasich doesn’t care if your children are eaten by wild animals.
Nicole
@snowball: I suspect, as someone else mentioned, that it has to do with being on a committee trying to get something in place. Kasich is clearly a thin-skinned motherfucker, and trashing him on TV would be just the sort of thing that might get one removed from a committee. I could be wrong; Hanna and Kasich might be besties for all I know, but in this case it seems to me to be an attempt to make sure that what needs to get done gets done and doesn’t get derailed by someone’s hurt fee-fees. Because heaven knows, the GOP will derail a lot over their fee-fees.
I love LOD and Maddow, but I was bothered by the coverage- it seemed to be slanted towards “Here’s something else fucked up Kasich has done” when I wish it would have been, “Why the fuck does Ohio, or any state, allow crazy people to have tigers? Or any people?”
Culture of Truth
The ‘ignore a problem until it’s too late’ mentality is all too evident here, from people who adopt one “cute” baby wild animal and then can’t handle it when it gets bigger, to those who might be able to handle one but not a dozen or more, to a freedom loving property-respecting government that can’t envision 10 Bengal tigers roaming a residential neighborhood in the middle of the night. These too-big-to -live predators were toxic assets safely put out of mind until lives were imminently threatened. When all hell broke loose the only solution was a terrible waste and people wondering what went wrong.
SuzieC
Exactly, Nicole. I didn’t watch the interview in question so don’t know the extent to which Hanna defended Kasich, but it’s true that Hanna wants strict regulations in place and has to work with the arrogant thin-skinned asshole to accomplish this. He had to be diplomatic and it wouldn’t have been smart to trash King K on national TV. And bills attempting to regulate the exotic-animal trade have repeatedly died in the Ohio legislature so there’s plenty of blame to go around.
snowball
@Nicole:
Well, if you are right, I can just say this. Nothing got done for nine months. Whatever Hanna’s approach has been, it is not working. And 56 innocent wild animals are now dead.
Heck, if anything is going to persuade selfish people like Kasich to get something done, it is the pure shame that he should feel now for what he failed to do.
Mnemosyne
@Scott:
Well, they’re not saying, “Do our entire marketing campaign for free.” It’s one freakin’ poster.
Haven’t you ever responded to an RFP? Read the fine print next time — the requester gets to keep all of the work you submit if they reject you and they don’t have to pay you a dime.
Sorry, but the comments on that article were very annoying. Have these people never heard of a frickin’ CONTEST before? Is all design work now reserved to paid professionals and campaigns shouldn’t even be allowed to have a design contest, much less permit lowly amateurs to enter it?
Nicole
@snowball: Nothing got done for decades, really. But again, and I am not defending Ohio, as I don’t think private citizens should own exotic animals at all, thanks to willful ignorance, rarely do things like this get legislated until something awful happens. I would be very curious to know what motivated the states that have bans in place to pass those bans.
And I agree with you, it’s a godawful tragedy, no two ways about it. Just as it’s a tragedy that there are innocent exotics all over the country in inhumane conditions at the mercy of ignorant owners.
I think someone posted this quote here recently, but it’s one of the best quotes from a book full of good quotes:
“Only ignorance! only ignorance! how can you talk about only ignorance? Don’t you know that it is the worst thing in the world, next to wickedness? — and which does the most mischief heaven only knows. If people can say, `Oh! I did not know, I did not mean any harm,’ they think it is all right.”
Tonal Crow
Hey, if the ban on exotic-animal ownership is “unenforceable”, isn’t the state’s ban on pot smoking also unenforceable? Oh, right: “Shut up, he explained.”
snowball
@Nicole:
I guess another question is what motivated Strickland to sign his bill in the first place before he left office.
Great quote!
If we didn’t have such an incredibly dysfunctional Congress, I think there should be a federal law governing this. So, of course it will never happen.
Nicole
@snowball: Absolutely, I agree with you; and why, right before he left? Why not in the years prior when he would have had time to see it implemented?
And I also agree that it should be federal. I just don’t understand how exotic animal breeders could wield that much political power with the GOP. Which is the other reason I was troubled with LOD and Maddow’s coverage. This, of all things, should not be given any opportunity to become a GOP vs. Dem thing.
Calouste
@Tonal Crow: So you suggest that we do the same with confiscated exotic animals as we do with confiscated pot, just throw them in the incinerator?
wenchacha
@Tonal Crow:
Exactly my thoughts, but you beat me to it. Shit, preventing murder is unenforceable, for all that matters.
There are many good things in the state, really, but I hate Ohio.
Tonal Crow
@Calouste:
This demands a wittier response than I can muster just now. Perhaps something about drug warriors as an renewable energy source (after trial, of course)?
debbie
Mnemosyne:
Actually, he went to prison on gun charges.
Bill E Pilgrim:
I don’t know if it made the national broadcasts, but locally, Hanna defended his support for the shootings by telling about the death of a close friend of his who attempted to tranquilize a tiger, and even though it had been darted, the tiger in a single 18-foot bound, decked the man and killed him.
jnfr
@Nicole:
I saw him on Maddow last night and I think your take on it is exactly correct. Hanna was really clear that he didn’t want to get into politics around it, but he was working hard on getting a solution in place. Frankly everything I’ve seen of him shows him utterly crushed by this event.
And let me steal from Nancydarling in the last thread on this and point to this big cat refuge. These animals are tragically dead, but many more still need help.
Roger Moore
Here’s a question I haven’t seen discussed. Tigers are officially a CITES Appendix I animal, meaning international trade in them is banned. How in hell did a private animal collector get a hold of a dozen of them in the first place if international trade is banned? Why weren’t they seized as contraband?
AA+ Bonds
Christ, I should have known deregulation was behind a public health story that gruesome.
In related news, the last stage of Herman Cain’s tax plan was “leaked” to Fox News. He says we should create sweatshop zones in American cities where minimum wage laws and building codes are abolished, not lying here.
Nicole
@Roger Moore: Tigers breed very easily in captivity. I don’t think any of them were born in the wild, or even in another country.
Kris
I join with the others who express respect for Jack Hanna but he is a republican so his defense of Kasich must be seen in that light. http://www.opensecrets.org/usearch/index.php?q=jack+hanna&searchButt_clean.x=0&searchButt_clean.y=0&searchButt_clean=Submit&cx=010677907462955562473%3Anlldkv0jvam&cof=FORID%3A11
I wish they hadn’t had to kill the animals but considering that the missing monkey was found in a tiger’s stomach … well we’re all pretty much monkeys to a pissed off tiger…
WereBear
When was it… two years ago? When a grown chimpanzee, whacked out on Xanax and wine, tore a woman’s face and hands off?
I remember watching C-SPAN and some Republican was making fun of a federal law that would have made such things illegal… it must not have passed.
These things never end well for anyone involved. Ah, makes me sick.
Mnemosyne
@Kris:
As I said in the other thread, we shouldn’t get too cocky about our artificial position at the top of the food chain. Without a gun or at least a spear, a human is pretty much fucked if a big cat decides you looks tasty.
Mr Stagger Lee
I hear if the Baboon survives he may be offered the job as President or athletic director at Ohio State.
ruemara
OT, sorta. I had the misfortune of reading a thread one of my FB friends is one, trying to ‘debate’ with wingnuts. One said,
. Think about that, he thinks the president’s children should be dragged behind the limo to his funeral. He also hoped that they get to string up his
. I’m not sure if these people are even human anymore. The wrong animals are loose.
lawguy
@Mnemosyne: He wasn’t in prison for animal creulty. He was in prison because of illegal firearms.
lawguy
Also, if one would bother one could go to Muskingum County Court’s web page and check out Terry’s charges and convictions. He was convicted once of cruelty to animals, back in 2005. It was a misdeamenor conviction. There were lots of animal running lose charges however.
As much as I hate Kasich, Thompson did not get all those tigers and other animals in the time since Kaisach was elected. In fact I think he was in prison most of that time.
If he did set the animals lose and then kill himself, then he was in all probabilty trying to harm the wife, because she loved the animals and rummor has it she was seeking a divorce.
This thing was god awful, but there is no allegation that I am aware of that the animals were starved or abused prior to being released by the guy.
If someone has any evidence of that I would be more than willing to look at it.
Anna in PDX
What bothers me about this story is that Maddow wanted to spin it and make it about the governor. Sounds like Hanna just did not want to go there and it could have been a much better interview if she had asked questions that weren’t spin “our side vs their side”. It’s about the animals, dammit. Like was pointed out up above there were SO MANY tigers killed, it’s heartbreaking since they are endangered, it is a horrible tragedy and it is not about the damned upcoming elections but a much bigger issue.
I don’t like Maddow very much, she picks her spin and does not deviate from it and then she repeats herself like her audience is extremely dim. I like thoughtful interviewers like Bill Moyers.
Malron
I know it was a fictional radio station, but does this remind anyone else of the “Thanksgiving turkey drop” episode on “WKRP in Cincinnati?”
Samara Morgan
@lawguy: the guy was jailed for three weeks. his wife left the property while he was jailed.
do you know how much meat big cats eat in a week?
10 big cats in a local rescue eat a horse a week.
1200 pound horse in, 600 pounds of bone and hair out one week later.
They had 18 tigers and 17 lions.
3 1/2 horses by my estimate. who runs the forklift?
either the horse has to be dropped and dragged into the feeding pen, or chainsawed up and tossed over the fences.
They were animal hoarders.
this economy is killing the rescues just as surely as its killing the middle class.
of course the animals were starving.
this has nothing to with Kaisch or politics.
this is one of a myriad american tragedies going down very day.
and you bourgie sobsisters weeping over the bengals are totally missing the point.
Samara Morgan
the weirdest thing to me…and maybe someone can explain this….is the sherriff said people were boarding horses there….no one boards horses at a big game rescue/hoarder preserve.
just the smell of predator and the horse will buck you the shit off.
Big cats make horses crazy and unride-able.
never happened.
if there were horses there they were donated food.