I’ve already established my clueless male bona fides in other posts, so I think I’m entitled to ask this: why is it that Cain could withstand reports of legally actionable sexual harassment but not news of a consensual affair? It’s strange, right, that having an affair is worse than regularly pushing your employees’ heads towards your crotch?
Or is it just that this is the straw that broke the camel’s back?
jrg
Phone records.
Napoleon
It could be the straw that broke the camels back, or it could be it was easy for him to sell his wife on the ideas that the others were just people making stuff up, particularly since only one of them went public, where as this last one is impossible to explain away and now he has a marriage to go home to try and save.
schrodinger's cat
Straw that broke the camel’s back.
BGinCHI
Republicans are allowed to get away with sinning if they keep their ideology where it belongs. You can throw your dick around, but you aren’t allowed to raise taxes or make any claims on the makers for the benefit of takers.
But then if you lie too much about it, instead of winking at the wanking, the Village worries about its Seriousness. Then they start doing some minor reporting and your lying looks foolish, like you aren’t gonna be able to protect the Galts from the people on the other side of the tracks.
And so they find someone else. That’s our morality now.
sukabi
I think it’s Sugar Cain Fatigue… how many shoes can one man drop?
I think the ‘prayer’ goes something like this…. ‘Jesus Christ, what now?’
daveNYC
Sexual harassment is an impossible thing that can’t exist because white* males are always the real victims. A consensual affair is much more believable for them.
* All GOP frontrunners get a free upgrade to this status.
The Bearded Blogger
Abuse of power is ok. Consensual relationship? Not so much.
BTD
Cain was basically done anyway. This is just an excuse.
Other possibility, Mrs. Cain was not aware of this one and Cain is not exactly denying it vehemently.
feebog
I’m voting straw. Let’s remember that he has taken a huge hit in the polls as a result of the sexual harassment charges. This will be enough to sink him to sub-Bachman levels. He was in it for the book sales anyway, so WTF.
Stillwater
Doug, your question assumes there’s a rational answer. We’re talking about conservatives here.
But I’ll try. Sexually harassing people is just boys being boys, just a bit of lighthearted animal lust. But a consensual affair undermines the sanctity of the institution of marriage which accords a man power over only one woman at a time.
cleter
Put me down for straw and camel’s back.
I wonder if Frontrunner Newt is frantically deleting mistress emails now.
Loneoak
I don’t think you’re a clueless male, but rather Republicans have their moral system entirely backwards. Sexual harassment doesn’t exist by definition, but affairs do.
trollhattan
I vote “straw.” And to mix the metaphor, even the dumbest voter must eventually conclude the giant cloud of smoke emanating from Herm’s pole indicates the presence of actual fire.
mistermix
Straw, camel’s back for both his campaign and probably his long-suffering wife.
Culture of Truth
Because supporting an ignorant, unqualified, lying, serial harrasser of women pisses off liberals, but now Cain is just a guy who had a long consensual extra martial affair.
It’s like finding out your parents don’t disapprove of the guy you’re dating because he’s cool; he’s just a cheater. Where’s the fun in that?
RossinDetroit
@Stillwater:
What he said. Very concise.
Jonathan
Cain should turn a lemon into lemonade by simply announcing he’s divorcing his wife to marry the woman with whom he’s been having the affair. Newt did this twice and is now wildly popular in the family values party. (Better for Cain, of course, if he can simultaneously announce that his wife is gravely ill.)
Omnes Omnibus
He was a fine idea at the time; now he’s brilliant mistake.
trollhattan
Also, too, if he ever returns home again, he’d best sleep with one eye open lest the suffering frau Cain brain him with a canned ham.
Donut
I think it’s just pile-on time-so, camel’s back. The dude was done for, anyway. Gingrich was already sucking off (I know I should use “siphoning”, but I wanted to say “sucking off”) his support already, and he has served his purpose as much as possible. By that I mean I think the Koch’s and other donors just shoveled money at him because he was the only non-white Republican who could step out and say all the same crazy shit the other candidates said about the President – but Cain could get away with a little bit more of it, because Cain is also African American. I have nothing but my intuition to back that up, but I think that other than milking the cash cow for himself, this was his true raison d’etre for being in the race. He never had a path to the nomination – he could never, ever, ever, ever win any GOP primaries in the South.
John Weiss
Herman Cain is a wanker. So, what else is new?
gelfling545
Mrs. Cain, I expect. She was going along with his “they’re all lying sluts” or just a terrible misunderstanding or some such explanation but this just took it over the top & she can’t keep the blinders on anymore.
Satanicpanic
It’s OK to push women around, but once you spend money on them you have stopped being a true conservative. Or pimp.
Dave
Nah, the sexual harassment charges really boil down to he-said, she-said. There is no real, solid proof. Yes, there was a settlement, and everyone knows it’s true, but the lack of evidence provides a fig-leaf. It allows the villagers and/or the idiots to say “maybe Cain is really telling the truth, and these vicious women and trying to destroy a good man!”
This one, though, has phone records. And there’s really no way to explain away 4AM text messages to and from a woman who’s not your wife.
fasteddie9318
Is it too much to hope that he lasts long enough for me to hear him utter the phrase “I disagree that this woman and I were having an affair because…no…wait…that’s a different lady…I got all these ladies swirling around in my head…”?
different-church-lady
He was a fine idea at the time.Now he’s a brilliant mistake.Read… the… damn… comments… before… making… one…
Mattminus
The sexual harassment claims were neatly obscured by non-disclosure agreements etc. and were mostly one time events that could be reduced to a “he said/she said”.
In the newest case, it was likely to keep dripping and chewing up news cycles. Once he issued a denial that could be falsified, or at least thrown into doubt, he was damaged goods because the bleeding could not be staunched.
rb
The 2-ton anvil that broke the camel’s back.
Jay in Oregon
I was curious if we’d ever find someone who responded positively to his advances. I wasn’t counting on finding out about a 13-year affair.
I guess the South is improving in race relations, because in the “good ol’ days” a black man who was harassing or having an affair with a white woman could at best find himself run out of town on a rail. Nevermind the worst-case scenario…
Amir Khalid
Herman Cain is a Baptist minister or something, isn’t he? Perhaps it’s the hypocrisy of a minister having an extramarital affair that turns people off. (Although, for the life of me, I can’t see the difference between that and the hypocrisy of a minister sexually harassing women.)
Or maybe people were just getting tired of Cain anyway, now that he’s had his turn in the spotlight.
ThatLeftTurnInABQ
So it appears that the group consensus is for straw meets camel. Next up, we need a headline reading: Cain tops out in camel-backing straw poll.
Politico, eat yer heart out.
Roc
Yeah, it’s all about the evidence.
In “He Said, She Said” the press plays up the doubt angle to cover their asses, which plays right into our social tendency to doubt the harlot and trust the rich guy in the suit. But when there’s evidence, the press swings a little heavier, because their legal risk is lower.
It’s not so different than Clinton. None of his dalliances really hurt him. Until there was a DNA swab.
Studly Pantload, the emotionally unavailable unicorn
I’m surprised he lasted as long as he did. He very obviously was using his “campaign” solely as a vehicle for self-promotion, and had no serious thoughts about actually grabbing the nomination. Thus, I figured he’d drop out once the accusations started to surface and running was no longer A Fun Thing To Do. Maybe his sudden (and unexpected) ascension in the polls made him giddy enough to try to ride out the initial accusations. But now that the balloon has popped, sobriety is kicking in and he’s finally realizing he’s doing too much damage to his brand (& likely straining his marriage).
JGabriel
Because consent implies desire, pleasure, enjoyment. And, in the Republican worldview, if the woman is enjoying sex, you’re doing it wrong.
.
Napoleon
@Jay in Oregon:
Is she white? I thought she was potentially a very light AA woman.
different-church-lady
I agree that it’s mostly a straw/camel ratio problem.
However, I do suspect there’s an unspoken strain of American culture that still finds adultery a worse trespass than harassment. After all the former is in the ten commandments.
Paul in KY
@John Weiss: Maybe more wanking would have saved him from this situation?
Gex
@JGabriel: Truth.
Zifnab
Why does everyone keep assuming that a man with a 13-year affair and numerous sexual misconduct allegations gives two shits about his marriage?
He’s done, politically, and now he’s bowing out before he has to face any more media scrutiny. He’ll hide out for a few years, then write another autobiography blaming everything on whomever will pay him top dollar to blame.
Donut
@Studly Pantload, the emotionally unavailable unicorn:
I don’t have anything to add to your comment, I just wanted to say, you have selected the best.user.name.ever. That’s all, carry on.
pk
Because the affair was 13 yrs long. That is a long time to cheat on your wife. Plus I’m sure it’s not a he said she said thing. Tea partiers can delude themselves into believing the women are lying about the harassment, or what happened was far less than what the women are claiming, but not this. Newt looks better, he cheated and then married the mistress. It’s a fine distinction, but that is how you thread that needle I believe.
The Dangerman
Not so much a straw as he was done in by his lawyer releasing a statement saying “yeah, he did her, but it’s none of your business”. In AD 2011 and after BC (meaning, Bill and Monica), that “none of your business” shit is going to fly. Even Republican brains can’t deal with that level of hypocrisy.
slag
I’m just wondering who will be Republicans’ new black friend after Cain goes.
4tehlulz
I vote straw; if he didn’t dive after the harassment allegations, then he wouldn’t be out, but since he has, this was it.
Quaker in a Basement
One-word explanation: penetration.
catclub
How many potential presidential candidates look on a thirteen year long extramarital affair and think, “Maybe I should not run for president, that is likely to come out”, and how many think, “No problem.”?
Wow.
Great comments.
I also agree with Jay in Oregon @ 28. In spite of our lack of coming all the way, the actual progress is pretty amazing.
dmsilev
@slag: Michael Steele is probably available. As is, I’m sure, Alan Keyes.
different-church-lady
@fasteddie9318: Never have I wanted to be a writer for Saturday Night Live more than this very moment, just so we could use that.
Mnemosyne
It’s because he didn’t follow Republican morality: when you get caught cheating, you’re supposed to declare that it’s “true love,” divorce your wife (who was old and used-up anyway, amirite?) and then marry your mistress. See also John McCain, Newt Gingrich, Bob Dole, etc. etc. etc., all the way back to the sainted Ronald Reagan.
I still contend that if Bill Clinton had divorced Hillary and married Monica, it would have been no harm, no foul as far as Republicans were concerned.
Suzan
I find it odd that she reported it. Maybe she really did fear it would come to light and she wanted to get on top of it (sorry) but that doesn’t sound right. She had a 13 year affair with the guy. She must like him so why destroy him? Is she mad because he stopped calling her in mid September? He also must have thought she’d keep quiet. He’s on his way out so why did she speak out now? He’ll be old news in a month or two so it might not have come out. I can see why the victims spoke out but a lover?
Kane
Don’t know nothing about foreign policy? No big deal.
Your economic policy is eerily similar to the Sims? Not a problem.
A flock of women accuse you of sexual harassment? It’s the liberal media.
Experience a brain freeze while discussing policy? We can shrug that off.
Having a 13 year affair? This, we can not stand.
It is amazing how long republicans defended the indefensible and made excuses to cover for this guy.
Cris (without an H)
I have no idea where the post title comes from, so I’ll assume it’s Elvis Costello.
slag
@dmsilev: I don’t know. I heard that, once you quit Steele, it’s a done deal.
Brachiator
@catclub:
Gary Hart, poster child for sexual hubris.
The rest is Monkey Business.
mclaren
No, it’s not strange at all.
Look…sexual harrassment has large elements of subjectivity to it. One of my former girlfriends defined sexual harrassment to me thusly: “If I ask a guy I’m in bed with to touch my left breast and he touches my right, that’s sexual harrassment.” We had a big argument about that one.
But a consensual affair is, basically, fucking someone other than your wife. There’s no subjectivity about that. You’re Doing the Nasty with somebody you’re not married to. That’s straight up adultery, no ifs, ands or buts.
This has been another edition of “simple answers to simple questions.”
Studly Pantload, the emotionally unavailable unicorn
@Donut: Why, thank you, fellow Human Being. (“Community” references, for those not in the know.)
Studly Pantload, the emotionally unavailable unicorn
@Donut: Why, thank you, fellow Human Being. (“Community” references, for those not in the know.)
Jesse Ewiak
As other people have said, it’s fairly easy to shrug off sexual harassment complaints as the liberal media targeting Cain because he’s a Strong Black Conservative.
An affair? With phone records? And Cain responding quickly to a text from the woman’s number? Even Republican primary voters can’t ignore a house on fire in front of them.
Surly Duff
@Stillwater:
This needs an addendum: However, an affair can be forgiven over time if the adulterer pays a stiff penance for his crimes by marrying the woman (or women) he committed said affair with.
Laertes
He was sunk the instant his first accuser got in front of a camera and every Republican could see that she was white.
Not long after, Gingrich took over as not-Romney-in-Chief. This latest accusation is just a convenient time to make the departure that’s been certain for weeks.
different-church-lady
@Kane: The first four items aren’t in the ten commandments!
Satanicpanic
@Mnemosyne: This. At this point, Newt’s infidelities provide him a great redemption story because now he can talk about how Jesus saved him and he’s repented, etc.
gnomedad
The right will tolerate impulsive, boys-will-be-boys stuff, however outrageous, especially if Jebus forgives you. A 13-year affair doesn’t quite fit this mold.
sven
@JGabriel: This. Conservatives like to pretend that ‘good Christians’ don’t even have the same drives as other people. Now that we know Cain does in fact enjoy the sex, who know what other immorality he has been pursuing.
Kane
Phone records have a liberal bias.
different-church-lady
@Mnemosyne:
You’re usually smarter than that.
slag
@mclaren: Wow. Your ex-girlfriend sounds even creepier and dumber than you do sometimes. Sexual harassment is pretty easily defined in many cases. And you do realize that women were actually awarded money for Cain’s behavior?
schrodinger's cat
@slag: Alan Keyes? The congressman from Florida, I forget his name..
Benjamin Franklin
Sorry for the OT, but you will understand when I ask my question;
I understand why righty blogs are ignoring the news in which Iranians, ala ‘79
have stormed an Embassy (UK). It is counter-intuitive to their War Drums. If the sanctions are working, bibi, who must have roses strewn on his path to war, has to experience some coitus interruptus. We can’t let the momentum reduce one iota.
But, why do I not see it in the thinking blogs?
MikeJ
Imagination is a powerful deceiver.
Oh, you can follow your dreams, oh but please don’t lead me on,
If you wanna bleed in my face, you were here and now you’re gone
Benjamin Franklin
Quaker ! Howzit?
This is Semanticleio
Legalize
All of this makes sense if you look at the Cain “candidacy” for what it really is: a publicity tour. He’s not running for president and never was. He has a “wife” because he is required to by the shit-stains who enable him. The wingnuts will still buy his stupid books and he’ll still get a gig on FOX. The wingnut welfare train will roll on unabated for Herman Cain. He might get regular appearances on Hard Ball to give his Very Serious take on why the Kenyan keeps fucking up.
Benjamin Franklin
Semanticleo—sheesh
sven
@Cris (without an H): Ha! This blog does love itself some Elvis. I would love to see the breakdown of posts by artist. The Clash would also be right up there.
Soonergrunt
At this point it’s like finding out that the serial killer is also a habitual gambler.
pluege
you need to be a little more refined in your questions:
republicans: sexual harassment and extramarital affairs will never hurt a republican with the republicans – it is in fact a badge of accomplishment.
democrats: sexual harassment will for the most part seriously damage democrats with their base as this is manner of assault on women.
As long as its not too egregious, extramarital affairs will for the most part not hurt democrats with democratic voters as its deemed a private consideration related to relationships.
Cain may be cooked with republicans only because he’s looking unelectable, not because he did anything wrong in their eyes.
Kane
@different-church-lady: I’m no expert, but I think sexual harassment might fall under the commandments of not committing adultery and not coveting thy neighbour’s wife.
agrippa
@mclaren:
mclaren, every time you post, you demonstrate your stupidity.
Conclusion: you are proud of being stupid.
different-church-lady
@slag: I’m just surprised he had a girlfriend at one point.
David Koch
This is Great News for McCain!
Yevgraf
@slag:
Talking about a high bar….
Punchy
Banging a broad for 13 years w/o the wife knowing is an amazing logistical triumph. Clearly presidential material. Think of all the military records he could hide from the Soviets until 2026.
Turgidson
If you consider the few days of angry blowhards rallying around Cain after the harassment accusations began, followed by him not-so-slowly becoming an afterthought and a punchline with steadily dipping poll numbers to be “surviving,” then sure, he survived that.
But even if one accepts the premise that he was ever a serious candidate (I don’t), he’s been done since shortly after that news broke – despite the early support he got from the Limbaugh faction, which resembled a dead cat bounce to me – and really done since his “ok….Libya…Obama…uh, supported….the rebels, correct?” performance art. This latest drama is probably the excuse he needs to officially leave the race, because he can credibly claim that he needs to spend more time with his family (if his wife will have him back). But he’s so cluelessly brash that he might just keep going for a while yet.
different-church-lady
@Kane: You’d have to shoe-horn it in. Especially if both parties were single.
El Tiburon
@Stillwater:
Furthermore, according to the Phyllis Schafly rulebook: wives can’t be raped by their husbands.
The corollary being women can’t be sexually harassed by their superiors. Women, especially conservative women can be sexually harassed by those beneath them, such as democrats, blacks, browns, the poor, liberals, and Bill Clinton.
So, when Herman Cain denied he sexually harassed those women, in his mind, and in the minds of conservatives, he was telling the truth.
FlipYrWhig
@Surly Duff:
It was the failure to control his stiff penance that contributed to his crimes.
Hawes
First, who’s to say he wasn’t sunk already?
Second, I think this is more about his wife finally realizing that “ARA Convention” is the new “Hiking the Appalachian Trail”. Herman was never about political calculation, he was about political performance art. This is personal and will fuck up his home life.
Third, how many more are out there? Wealthy, rich, powerful, somewhat charismatic guy.
If he gets out now, no one will care about the other women who HAVEN’T come forward.
licensed to kill time
Anybody link to the new poll out on The Borowitz Report yet?
(pasted from last Cain thread cuz I got here late)
Hawes
@David Koch: This is great news for Newt Gingrich.
Seriously. Newt’s tiny little penis just got a wee erection.
different-church-lady
@Hawes:
Benjamin Franklin
“Fixed.”
Naw, he’s just selling books, like Palin and Gingrich. They’re ‘Free Marketers’ for free advertising.
Hawes
@licensed to kill time:
I like this part:
slag
@schrodinger’s cat: Keyes? For 2012? How awesome would a Keyes-Obama rematch be?
Ben Cisco
@Napoleon: I have used the Orb of Time to see what happens when he gets home.
The Ancient Randonneur
Dave Weigel linked to this gem earlier today on Twitter. The post has the audio from the Hermanator.
I guess it depends on what meaning of “skeletons” is.
Face
/giggles
I’d be facing about 603 charges, plus whatever else they call it when I skipped past the left and right breast and went straight to the panties.
metricpenny
Hey! Are you calling Cain a camel? Ok. No problem.
I think it was the confirmed “relationship”.
The sexual harrassment charges could have been trumped up. I know from experience that it happens. I was the Controller for a small company that paid a receptionist $5,000 to “settle” a sexual harrassment claim she leveled against her gay supervisor. The leadership just wanted it (and her) to go away.
JGabriel
@sven:
Are you there God? It’s me, Herman …
.
licensed to kill time
@Hawes: This is win, too:
different-church-lady
@The Ancient Randonneur: Oh no, he’s not a necrophiliac too, is he?
MikeJ
@different-church-lady: It would be irresponsible not to speculate.
Villago Delenda Est
@Kane:
Not really. He was their “we’re not racist, really!” get out of jail free card.
Lynn Dee
Another possible explanation: The right is inclined to see sexual harassment as a liberal pet cause and is therefore more likely to “circle the wagons” when some “feminazi working woman” comes forward to charge bad behavior on the part of a “job creator.”
That solidarity starts to crumble when it’s just another consensual affair.
rikryah
@Suzan:
She’s a woman who allowed herself to be strung along for 13 YEARS. Then, she finds out that she’s not the ‘only’ one. (see sexual harassment cases).
On another blog, we’ve discussed that she went to the ‘ go to’ reporter in Atlanta tv, if you want to get someone’s business ‘ all out in the street’.
Why now?
Well, we discussed that she has been egged on by the ‘girlfriends’ who have held their tongues for the last decade about good old Herbie baby. they’ve been waiting and have practiced the speech that they would give to Ginger when the opportune moment came.
that moment has come.
note to men here: when one has had a Ho for 13 years, one should not believe that they can stop paying for said HO under any circumstances if one has a public life of any sort.
catclub
@licensed to kill time:From the article:
Mr. Cain added, “My message to the American people remains the same, and that message is, ‘I told you not to call me here.’”
Borowitz is a professional, after all.
Turgidson
@Lynn Dee:
I think there’s something to this. And it dovetails nicely with conservatives’ ability to see a vast left wing conspiracy or scheming liberal under every rock.
If we liberals were 1/10th as organized and conniving as they accuse us of being, they’d never win an election outside the rural south and Utah.
Kilkee
Within 24 hours I expect the Cole/DougJ post re Herman’s imminent departure: “You’re Gonna Make Me Lonesome When You Go.”
peach flavored shampoo
OT:
Ann Coulter being a complete douchebag
I know…sun rises in the west, bites dog man….
aimai
Does nobody else wish he’d tried holding a press conference with her and saying:
“I can no longer go on…without the women I love?”
no? Maybe I’m the only one old enough to get that line.
aimai
scav
@Suzan:
Someone deep in the rabbit hole of the Levenson inquiry waves and points out Fox involvement (even local) and henhouse guarding — besides, phone-records cam emerge from a variety of original sources, not just the ones they appear next to in the finished product. Does the field possibly need tiding and to whose benefit is that? Still, living as I do down the rabbit hole . . tsp. of sea-salt and all that
RareSanity
@Suzan:
I’m guessing that Cain ended the relationship, and probably more importantly, any financial support he may been providing.
I’m pretty sure that I heard that she is currently unemployed. After spending 13 years in an intimate relationship with someone, and then feeling as though you have been cast aside, and a pile of bills…
May have been a little, “woman scorned”, and little, “I need some money”.
These are just my opinions, I have no idea what the woman’s motivation is. It could be that she felt that this person had no business being President, and wanted to make sure the rest of the country knew.
bemused
@peach flavored shampoo:
I was wondering what the horror Coulter had said to warrant several bleeps.
Oh no, not another one. I didn’t hear that Megan McCain has been hired by MSNBC. This is hiring of celebrity kids getting more than ridiculous. Cain should be a shoo in at Fox.
Kathy in St. Louis
He never had a chance in the first place. He was just big with the right because they loved pushing the BLACK conservative because they knew he irritated the hell out of the liberals. But the fatigue factor has kicked in which means that the novelty of having a conservative BLACK to push liberal buttons is outweighed by the boredom of dealing with a guy who doesn’t seem to have any sense.
Percysowner
Two words Community Property. Whatever else Herman Cain wants, giving up 50% of his company is probably not one of them.
Turgidson
@bemused:
I agree, but I must add that I’d be less terrified of a Megan McCain presidency than I am of the prospect of any of the idiots currently running for the GOP nomination winning.
Except maybe Huntsman, who I think would be a shitty but not cataclysmically disastrous president.
RossinDetroit
It’s kind of funny/sad that the Republicans’ Designated Black Guy turned out to embody one of their worst racist stereotypes about black guys: rampant horndog.
HRA
Good comments – not much for me to add to them.
Rikryah at #104 You said it.
Seems like a lot of you think Mrs.Cain does not know Herman’s wanderings -seems like she would have to be dumb, deaf and blind to not know.
Time to close the office down and go home.
Y’all have a good evening.
ET
I am going with the straw that broke the camel’s back. Before the GOP could say it was some plot and the fear of the GOP that keeps the media in line would mean that the story while big never seemed to what some might have though it would- kill Cain’s campaign earlier. This is someone willingly coming forward that can’t be dissed as some Democratic plot.
bemused
@Turgidson:
Jenna, Luke, Chelsea and now Meghan. Have I missed any others? They get to move to the head of the line largely because of who their parents are, not getting there through their own efforts. It makes me even more grateful that someone like Chris Hayes has his own show now.
pk
She probably thought she was the only one and one day he’ll leave the wife for her. Now she finds out he is just a lowlife harasser. And he won’t answer her calls. What else is a scorned woman to do? Not everyone can boil a rabbit. Most settle for blabbing to the media.
RossinDetroit
@bemused:
They belong to the 1% of the political elite. Therefore all resources are theirs for the asking. The 99% can just get Journalism degrees and wait for a spot to open up carrying coffee for the political spawn.
Ben Cisco
@peach flavored shampoo:
That’s what they get for having her on the air in the first place. Dumbassery!
Catsy
Combination of factors, as others have noted, but to sum up, ordered more or less by impact:
1. Conservative orthodoxy rejects the validity of sexual harassment as a concept. IOKIYAR applies to affairs, but at least they acknowledge that cheating on your wife is wrong in principle.
2. There is evidence supporting this allegation that didn’t exist for the others, which were he-said-she-said. Settling a SH case doesn’t count as evidence to them, it only reinforces their perception of SH cases as a fundamentally illegitimate way for women to scam employers.
3. Drip, drip, drip.
geg6
@Amir Khalid:
The problem is, Amir, that you actually believe that there is such a thing as sexual harassment. GOPers don’t believe in any such thing, especially the white males among them.
Hell, I know white male Dems who don’t believe sexual harassment actually exists.
licensed to kill time
I don’t know, my initial impression of Cain was that it was just a matter of time before he melted down in some semi-spectacular fashion. His whole affect screams ‘arrogant know-it-all who’s mighty pleased with himself’.
So naturally he was gonna crash-and-burn. And he did it all to himself, which makes it all the funnier.
Brachiator
@Catsy:
Whoa! Sorry, and it’s not just SH, but settling a case, especially when there is a confidentiality agreement, is not evidence. A settlement may short circuit any criminal or civil investigation. And while people may want to assume that a settlement indicates some kind of guilt about something, it ain’t necessarily so.
And do you really want to suggest that a settlement is evidence of a bad act? For example:
Is Bill Clinton a sexual harasser?
And note, for the sake of the slow in the room, I think that Bill Clinton was a very good president, but a man with junky appetites who let himself be wounded by his enemies. And the impeachment circus was bullshit for days.
I agree with you about this big time. There is often a stupid, sullen resentment expressed by men over this issue.
Veritas
It’s down to Newt and Romney. I’m still for Mitt but Newt looks very strong and appealing now, and some liberals on the other thread seem to be in pants-shitting fear of Newt, one even afraid he would be “the next Nixon”.
Reality.Check
Veritas
BTW, looks like the South got some Global Warming and got it bad!
RealityCheck
Turgidson
@bemused:
Yeah, I’m in full agreement that being the offspring of an established journalist or pundit (or in Megan McCain’s case, daughter of pundits’ favorite politician ever) should not qualify as a credential for said job.
As obnoxious as Olbermann became as his notoriety grew, I am thankful that he helped set up the pipeline of halfway-decent anchors MSNBC has. Maddow ain’t perfect, but she’s among the best to choose from right now and he helped get her that show. And he introduced Chris Hayes to the world as a frequent guest on Countdown, if I remember correctly. Hopefully Hayes will eventually get a better/more frequent time slot. In a perfect world he’d have Morning Joke’s job.
Maus
Republicans have no problems with fuck & run, it’s the ones who show genuine affection who get steamrollered. I suppose the same opportunism goes for their politics and opinion of the People as well.
shortstop
Those others were just lying crazyass bitches trying to bring a good man down for money or attention. This lying crazyass bitch has records.
Cris (without an H)
@Veritas: omg if global warming is real why is it snowing derp
Veritas
@Cris (without an H):
Snowing in the deep south. In NOVEMBER.
RealityCheck
Cris (without an H)
@Veritas: herp derp
Veritas
@Cris (without an H):
Weather and cimate are different. Unless it’s a Category 4 hurricane, or a drought in Texas, or a wildfire in California, then it’s totally ZOMG THIS PROVES GLOBAL WARMING, right?
RealityCheck
licensed to kill time
@Veritas:
Satire V, you need to check that version of reality you are smoking, sounds like it got laced with some bad shit.
trollhattan
@Veritas:
Here you go, girlfriend.
http://droughtmonitor.unl.edu/
chopper
@slag:
i’m just amazed mclaren found someone even more self-righteous than he is.
Veritas
@trollhattan:
Bu.bu..WEATHER ISN’T CLIAMTE(TM)*!
RealityCheck
*void where prohibited
xian
@Suzan: from what I can glean, it was leaking out and she was getting pestered. but then she also seems to be broke…
chopper
@Veritas:
and here in nyc it’s in the 60’s.
chopper
@Veritas:
no, weather isn’t “cliamte”. nor is a year-long crazy drought ‘weather’.
Veritas
@chopper:
Texas had a worse drought in the 1950s, the most severe in its history.
RealityCheck
trollhattan
@Veritas:
So how long before the current one exceeds it? This one’s not done, not by a longshot. And if it becomes the worst, then what, “Just a fleshwound”?
http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/expert_assessment/seasonal_drought.html
Slippery slopes are slippery.
Brachiator
@Veritas:
Are you seriously denying climate change? With lame anecdotes?
Go here.
Have a nice day.
Veritas
@trollhattan:
No, clearly then it will be a sign of
The RaptureClimate Apocalypse.Algore said in 2007 that we have TEN YEARS TO SAVE THE PLANET!!!! Or its all over. I’ve been counting down ever since.
RealityCheck
chopper
@Veritas:
definitely bad for the CLIAMTE.
Catsy
@Brachiator: I didn’t mean to imply that the settlement was evidence of wrongdoing, just that it was evidence that there was more substance to this than some random woman coming out of the woodwork now that he’s a candidate and making an unsourced claim in order to gain fame. Which is the disgusting tack that a lot of conservative pundits have been taking.
Count me in the corner of thinking both that real sexual harassment is a far-too-common and serious offense that shouldn’t be minimized or excused, and that there are legitimate reasons to think that a nontrivial number of “sexual harassment” cases do boil down to either an overzealous HR department forsaking the spirit of the rules for the sake of the letter, or one unreasonable party or another being in desperate need of a sense of humor transplant.
Unfortunately, dealing with that quandary is something of a zero-sum balancing act, and in order to ensure a safe working environment and reliable recourse for the vast majority of reasonable people without exposing a business to litigation, you have to tailor the rules in an inflexible way that caters to the lowest common denominator, without a lot of wiggle room for weighing the circumstances. That kind of discretion or wiggle room is too easy too abuse by an unscrupulous boss. And when it all comes down to it, one person’s right to feel safe and comfortable in the workplace outweighs another person’s desire to not feel like they have to watch everything they say.
Unfortunately, this is a nuanced view that doesn’t really fit on a bumper sticker.
Brachiator
@Catsy:
I agree with you here.
I agree with you here, but it’s not just bad bosses.
Safety I agree with. Comfort can get wildly subjective.
I’ve personally observed two situations where a person made a claim, not to make money, but to punish a co-worker she had personal problems with. And, as a supervisor, I once had to counsel a gay male who had a habit of not wearing underwear who was creating an uncomfortable work environment for women employees, who were offended by what appeared to be unnecessary “swagger.”
But these are small exceptions.
Catsy
@Brachiator: I agree with you on the subjectivity of “comfort”–I think the problem is that you have to have a category of non-safety-related behavior that covers things like telling someone they have nice tits (which is way out of line for almost any workplace), but any such criteria is also going to give an opening for someone to take offense to, say, being told they look really nice today. It’s not a safety issue, but there is a line. And yes, I’ve observed a former coworker exploiting the HR process to get rid of someone she didn’t like; it does happen.
Personally, the annual tasteless and ostentatious Christmas celebrations make me very uncomfortable, because I spent a good chunk of my childhood (and time at more than one job as an adult) being pressured and ostracized because I don’t celebrate Christmas and hate having the holiday shoved down my throat every year by people who assume everyone else should like the holiday as much as they do. I find it very offensive. But I at least have enough self-awareness and perspective to understand that different people are offended by different stuff and that shouldn’t necessarily be grounds for being punished at work.
Jack Hughes
All the women must have been liars except the one with proof.
faway koten tree na fin fo se
@RossinDetroit:
I’ve long suspected that was part of Cain’s appeal to the Gooper base: he provided affirmation.
Cain was the GOP’s Steppin Fetchit, their Uncle Tom, their House Negro who knew his place. What more could a white republican asshole want? How about dumb, incurious, ingnorant and yet with bit of the what-for-I-need-book-learning-for-muthafucka attitude? Perfect! (I’m thinking ubeki-beki-beki-stan-stan and foreign policy here). It all fit the mold.
But no fist bumps. That’s totally not OK with old racist white people.
Even when Cain broke the stereotype it didn’t change things for the gooper base. They used it not to question their own stereotypical beliefs but to make those stereotypes more difficult to question. Cain was a successful businessman when it was useful to defend the bullshit he was spouting. Like when he was calling poor people lazy. For the gooper base, lazy+poor = black. And a black man was saying it. Which means it’s true! So they loved it. Affirmation.
Cain did everything the republicans know deep in their hearts a good negro ought to do — defer to powerful white people, sing minstrels, do the white man’s bidding in attacking uppity black men who don’t know their place, and parrot the rich white bigots, telling the poor they are that way because they are lazy. No wonder Goopers thought of him as ‘our black guy’.
Goopers liked Cain. He was useful. It was all ironic and up-is-down and yet still willing to be the darkie enough to reassure the uneasy bigots in the time of Obama but we’re-not-racist-now and no way they were really going to nominate him, all of which they loved.
Cain was sort of a post-modernist fake candidate, the kind the GOP has discovered it loves, Palinesque, a stalking horse for the usual conservative cultural and economic bullshit and bigotry, taken as gospel truth by the same people who have never moved beyond standing athwart modernity, yelling ‘You lie!’
Of course Cain’s a horndog. He’s black. The Gooper base knew that all along. They *expected* that. They’ve been telling you libs for years that’s just how things are, but you silly libtards just can’t accept what everyone knows is true, that that’s just how God made ’em.
Of course, that does mean he can’t continue running for president.
That’s why they loved them some Cain. He was everything they wanted him to be, including a presidential candidate who could never win.
faway koten tree na fin fo se
Shorter faway:
Cain: Republicans’ Favorite Black Guy in Blackface
Ecks
@Studly Pantload, the emotionally unavailable unicorn:
Adding nothing to say that your name would be EVEN MORE awesome if you dropped the “un” from “unavailable”. That’s how I misread it at first, and I nearly fell off my chair laughing. It flips it from delicious irony to deliciously ironic social commentary, with waves of self-contradictory satire that my mind can’t even fully wrap its head around.