Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Conservatism: there are some people the law protects but does not bind and others who the law binds but does not protect.

Just because you believe it, that doesn’t make it true.

Something needs to be done about our bogus SCOTUS.

Russian mouthpiece, go fuck yourself.

I’m pretty sure there’s only one Jack Smith.

This has so much WTF written all over it that it is hard to comprehend.

When do we start airlifting the women and children out of Texas?

Let’s not be the monsters we hate.

Only Democrats have agency, apparently.

I see no possible difficulties whatsoever with this fool-proof plan.

Authoritarian republicans are opposed to freedom for the rest of us.

Motto for the House: Flip 5 and lose none.

This really is a full service blog.

Reality always lies in wait for … Democrats.

We are aware of all internet traditions.

Everybody saw this coming.

I’ve spoken to my cat about this, but it doesn’t seem to do any good.

Today’s GOP: why go just far enough when too far is right there?

The truth is, these are not very bright guys, and things got out of hand.

If you tweet it in all caps, that makes it true!

That’s my take and I am available for criticism at this time.

“What are Republicans afraid of?” Everything.

Take hopelessness and turn it into resilience.

The words do not have to be perfect.

You are here: Home / Civil Rights / Racial Justice / Post-racial America / Speaking of Losers

Reader Interactions

227Comments

  2. 2.

    Warren Terra

    Given whom you linked to for coverage, i’d like to repeat my request that ABL resume posting here.

  3. 3.

    gaz

    Wait, I thought ABL covered this already.

    Is this a different story? It seems similar. Does anyone have a link to the either old, or original story, whichever the case may be?

    Or is this kind of crap catching on? A new trend?

    *headdesk*

    “Post-Racial America” my pasty white ass.

  4. 4.

    GregB

    I’m sure this cretin is the local GOP precinct captain or some other leadership post in the tea-party.

  7. 7.

    Mark S.

    But she told ABC News in December that she collects antiques. She said the sign, which was dated 1931 and from Alabama, was a gift from a friend.

    Which she decided to hang in public.

  8. 8.

    deep

    And finally, if you’re going to be racist, just be RACIST. Own it! Why make up nonsense about cloudy pool water? Just go ahead and let your racist freak flag fly!

    I love ABL.

  11. 11.

    Comrade Dread

    Well, if I’ve learned anything from my conservative friends it’s that the evil government should respect this woman’s property rights to bar anyone from her pool and if black children want to swim, they’re welcome to pack up and move to a facility that caters to them. A separate facility that provides equal services.

  12. 12.

    The Moar You Know

    Own that shit indeed. Now they’ve pissed off both the blacks in the area AND the racists.

  13. 13.

    Tim I

    Bring back ABL, Cole. Tell her you wrong. Admit that you screwed up due to some latent Libertarian flashback. She’ll forgive you and we will no longer be deprived of her excellent writing and reporting.

  14. 14.

    opie jeanne

    @Mark S.: I can see African Americans collecting stuff like this, and museums, both to make sure we never forget it.

    I can’t see any legit reason other than racism a white person would want to own something like this.

  15. 15.

    geg6

    And finally, if you’re going to be racist, just be RACIST. Own it!

    This. Motherfucking THIS.

    I have taken to saying exactly this to people IRL when they make their snide little comments that sound racist to me but that they swear they never meant in that way.

    I’m sick of this shit, this dancing around it. I already know what they are. I just want them to own it.

    Sadly, I usually just get told that I cannot take a joke and that they ARE NOT RACISTS. To which I say, you may be right, but that doesn’t change the fact that what you said is very much racist (or misogynist or both).

  16. 16.

    hueyplong

    Not sure the “gift” argument is the strongest one. “I’m such a blatant racist that people who know me well realize that a WHITES ONLY sign is a perfect gift for me.”

  17. 17.

    Napoleon

    @Legalize:

    What kills me is when Ohio built a mueseum to the Underground Railroad they put it in that freaking town instead of somewhere that was actually more active in it.

  22. 22.

    p.a.

    The freakin’ sign actually reads PUBLIC SWIMMING POOL WHITES ONLY. I guess you can’t expect intelligence from your garden variety bigot, but your ‘better type’ racists would know that if the sign said “Private Swimming Pool” they might have a shot. Am I wrong in thinking that non-public entities not receiving gvt. $$$ can pretty much do as they please?

  23. 23.

    Napoleon

    @opie jeanne:

    I can see African Americans collecting stuff like this, and museums, both to make sure we never forget it.

    I know I have read in the past of some AAs who collect slave “memorabilia”.

  24. 24.

    Jay in Oregon

    Maybe I missed something?

    ABL’s decision to stop posting here and take her name off the masthead was her choice.

    Cole said she’s still welcome to post here. If she chooses not to, then the person you need to be talking to is ABL, not John. (And the sincerity of an apology is usually inversely proportional to the pressure to offer one.)

  25. 25.

    The Ancient Randonneur

    @Tim I:

    Bring back ABL, Cole. Tell her you wrong.

    I personally want video posted here of Cole climbing up on the roof of his house, ripping his shirt off, then beating his chest while screaming an apology to her! Nothing less. OK, maybe a picture of Rosie, but it better really fvcking cute.

  26. 26.

    Napoleon

    @Legalize:

    Maybe, but so were other parts of the state. I just found it odd that the city in the state that is most identified with retrograde views on race got something like that.

  28. 28.

    geg6

    @Jay in Oregon:

    ABL has already discussed why she would no longer be posting here. Personally, I think she has a point but I just go to her blog now. That way I can also talk to all the people who either got chased out by the anti-ABL/Firebagger/GG fanboi trolls (especially asiangrrlMN) or who left BJ over the kerfluffle.

    @Napoleon:

    I know several who do. I know one woman who has the sales papers for her own great-great grandfather. Personally, I think only AAs should collect that stuff, but I know that is not how it is.

  29. 29.

    Waynski

    Is it just my screen or me being a moran, or does the sign actually say WHITE ONEY? I’d encourage racists to learn how to spell, but then it would harder to know who they are.

  30. 30.

    MikeJ

    @opie jeanne:

    I can see African Americans collecting stuff like this, and museums, both to make sure we never forget it.

    I was in college when students were trying to get unis to divest from South Africa. A group put “Whites Only” or “Colored Only” on every door, every water fountain, every restroom on campus. A powerful demonstration for people too young to have ever seen the real thing.

    @Napoleon:

    I just found it odd that the city in the state that is most identified with retrograde views on race got something like that.

    They need it most. Same with Memphis getting a civil rights museum because MLK was murdered there.

  31. 31.

    Kola Noscopy

    WTF is with giving ACL stealth page clicks thru blind links, Cole? Warnings, please, for those of us who would rather not give traffic to bad, one note bloggers who flounce.

    I must admire, however, the way in which you have managed its departure from BJ in such a way that it appears you did not wish it to be so. VERY clever.

    You’re scary that way.

  32. 32.

    Napoleon

    @MikeJ:

    They need it most. Same with Memphis getting a civil rights museum because MLK was murdered there.

    Funny, I never thought to analogize it to Memphis, and it has always made sense to me to have that in Memphis. By the way the Memphis mueseum is worth the visit, IMO.

  34. 34.

    opie jeanne

    @geg6: I missed the kerfuffle and everything else, although I knew something was happening from comments in other threads.

    It was probably the one thread I didn’t read that day.

    I’m really sorry ABL and Asiangrrl are gone.

  37. 37.

    gingergene

    They actually sell replicas of these types of signs on Amazon. I can see a valid reason for owning an original (for reasons stated by others), but I fail utterly to understand why there is a market for faux-aged replicas. Maybe to hang on the walls of some racism-themed chain restaurant?

  41. 41.

    opie jeanne

    @MikeJ: That would make a really strong statement.
    I was in college a little before you, when going to Vietnam was one of the great worries, but Civil Rights was still a really hot issue.

  42. 42.

    Raven

    @opie jeanne: Going to Vietnam WAS a civil rights issue!

    “Over the past two years, as I have moved to break the betrayal of my own silences and to speak from the burnings of my own heart, as I have called for radical departures from the destruction of Vietnam, many persons have questioned me about the wisdom of my path. At the heart of their concerns this query has often loomed large and loud: “Why are you speaking about the war, Dr. King?” “Why are you joining the voices of dissent?” “Peace and civil rights don’t mix,” they say. “Aren’t you hurting the cause of your people,” they ask? And when I hear them, though I often understand the source of their concern, I am nevertheless greatly saddened, for such questions mean that the inquirers have not really known me, my commitment or my calling. Indeed, their questions suggest that they do not know the world in which they live.”

  44. 44.

    FlipYrWhig

    You know what father-son team of zealous defenders of “civil liberties” would have no problem with such a policy? :P

  45. 45.

    geg6

    @sharl:

    Inspired by the Stone Mountain Park annual laser/light show, apparently put on to honor the memory of those long deceased fightin’ boys in gray.

    I got dragged to this disgusting display once by friends who lived in Atlanta who my ex and I were visiting. I think it’s safe to say that I didn’t make any friends at that venue. I kept loudly asking why anyone would put on such a display for a bunch of traitors.

    And I don’t think it’s an annual thing. I think they do it every single weekend, at least in the summer.

  48. 48.

    Raven

    @geg6: yup, they had big ass Klan rallies there back in the day.

    “Atlanta Police Chief Herbert T. Jenkins and Mayor Hartsfield integrated the Atlanta Police Force in 1948 after aggressive and long term political pressure from black voting organizations. The following is a passage from Where Peachtree Meets Sweet Auburn by Gary Pomerantz, page 162:
    ….In 1931, Jenkins had followed the ritual of all Atlanta Police recruits by joining the Shriners and the Ku Klux Klan. The Klan was “your ID card, the badge of honor with the in group” Jenkins later wrote. As part of the Klan initiation, Jenkins stood before a burning cross on near-by Stone Mountain, where the modern Klan was founded.”

  49. 49.

    Roger Moore

    @gingergene:

    I can see a valid reason for owning an original (for reasons stated by others), but I fail utterly to understand why there is a market for faux-aged replicas.

    Maybe there are more African Americans who want to collect them as a way of remembering the past than there are authentic signs to go around. Stranger things have happened, and I notice that they seem to be selling more “colored only” type signs than “whites only”, which are the kind I assume racist whites would want.

  50. 50.

    opie jeanne

    @kindness: I’m sorry, but what?

    I know about the turkey drop (as God is my witness I thought turkeys could fly), but I have no clue what you mean.

  51. 51.

    kindness

    @opie jeanne: Let’s hope they both come back from time to time if only to comment in threads once in a while. Let’s face it though, people come, people go. The BJ community is much larger than it was when I started. Lots of the names have changed. Sometimes this place reminds me more of the GOS that used to get pilloried here on a regular basis, as far as the political stances go. But for many reasons, most here come back.

    But let’s also wish those folks who go elsewhere the best with their lives. They aren’t forgotten. They probably aren’t much different. We just don’t know what’s on their immediate minds so much any longer.

    @Lolis: Do you really want to revisit that again? Really?

    @opie jeanne: You mentioned a WKRP reference upthread. I added to it.

  54. 54.

    sharl

    @geg6: Thanks for the correction on the weekly-vs-annual thing; I was led astray by how folks were titling their Stone Mountain videos.

    The Adult Swim thing seriously cracked me up, while simultaneously leading me to think how inappropriate it was. But once I took at look at the Stone Mountain show, I realized that such an insanely over-the-top treatment was a most appropriate response.

  55. 55.

    opie jeanne

    @Raven: I hadn’t heard that statement by MLK before, or possibly forgotten it by now.

    I was speaking of the draft in a more immediate sense, that worry that kept the boys in college longer than they were really interested in being there, or made them run to Canada

  56. 56.

    gaz

    @RSA: Also, too: That site kicks ass. Not safe while drinking coffee:

    _________________________________________________
    Anonymous asked: My iPhone corrected something to “injuns”.

    7TH JAN 2012 | 137 NOTES

    HAHA IT MUST HAVE BEEN THE WHITE IPHONE YOU FEEL ME?!?!?!

    __________________________________________________

    LOL

  59. 59.

    Kola Noscopy

    @gogol’s wife:

    I wish she were here and you weren’t.

    Sucks to be you then. I would suggest you go hang out at ACLC ALL the time so you can read bad, one note writing AND not have to deal with me.

    Win-win.

  61. 61.

    Cargo

    She could always just say she didn’t authorize whoever hung that sign, didn’t know about it or even notice it was there until it was pointed out by militant statists. And now that it’s up, should it be taken down by jack booted PC thugs in defiance of whoever it was’s First Amendment rights? That’s another debate! Also whites-only pools should be up to the states to decide.

  63. 63.

    Raven

    @opie jeanne: I went to college when I came home. Many people think that King’s opposition to the war is what got him killed. As long as he was seen as keeping the devisiveness of race going he was tolerated but when he made the connection between racism at home and racism there, well, you know.

  64. 64.

    Kola Noscopy

    @Soonergrunt:

    Its? Really? Its? What kind of hopped up bigoted fucked-in-the-head shit is this?

    Hmmmm…please explain how using the word “its” to diss a poster/commenter on this blog is in any way a sign of “bigotry.”

    Oh, and while you’re at it, please explain why, when other commenters have repeatedly called me vile names and referred to me directly and indirectly as “IT” you did not at those times take this new, brave stance against the forces of bigotry?

    Thanks.

    You really are a low life dumbshit, Killer.

  66. 66.

    opie jeanne

    @wrb: I wish I could get that thing to work on my computer, but it’s a Mac. I have fought with it several times with no success. I’d add this jerk to my filter if I could.

  67. 67.

    The Dangerman

    It wasn’t racist! It was how she likes her eggs!! Whites only.

    OK, that was a bad yolk; sorry.

  69. 69.

    Kola Noscopy

    @geg6:

    It’s the same bullshit that leads him to call her ACL. Cuz she’s colored, you know.

    Wow, nothing brings out the repressed racism in ACL defenders than trying to defend her.

    ACL is for Angry Clown Lady, you dumbass. The fact that YOU thought of “colored” and it never even occurred to ME is telling. Which of us is the racist, I wonder?

  73. 73.

    Soonergrunt

    @geg6: First I have to shake my head at that. The openness about the racism, not the racism itself. Then I have to punch myself for not seeing something so obvious, which just confirms my suspicions.

  76. 76.

    opie jeanne

    @Raven: So did a lot of my friends from HS. They wanted to go; most of those guys didn’t need the GI Bill for tuition (including a long-term boyfriend). When they got back most of them had changed their minds about a lot of stuff, if not just changed. We had broken up long before he left for Vietnam, but he came back with the 1000 yard stare.

    The guys in college I knew who were trying hard to stay out, a lot of them weren’t all that interested in Civil Rights. Some were, now that I think back (it was 1968) but a lot were apolitical except regarding the possibility of getting their asses shot off. I was only on campus for that year and part of 1969. By the time I returned to school the war was over.

  79. 79.

    Soonergrunt

    @Kola Noscopy: I never paid enough attention to you-because you aren’t worth the attention-until something like that pops up. And if people were calling you ‘it’ I can only assume after reading the shit stream you call comments, that it probably has to do with your subhuman personality and not any kind of physical attribute or other such.
    As for the other crap you put up there, just know that I was front page here before I ever heard of you, I’ll be front paging long after you leave, and in the mean time I drink your tears of impotent rage with relish.

  80. 80.

    rb

    @geg6: I got dragged to this disgusting display once by friends who lived in Atlanta who my ex and I were visiting. I think it’s safe to say that I didn’t make any friends at that venue.

    Ha, I had the same experience, almost word for word (except for “ex”). I predicted lee superpatriot greenwood’s “proud to be an american” would be the soundtrack for the finale (‘no way,’ said my wife), and almost wet myself laughing – loudly – when my prediction came true. Hard to remember whether she was more annoyed with me or the blatant revisionism on display. I definitely got some unfriendly looks from folks nearby.

  82. 82.

    Raven

    @opie jeanne: It focused the mind. Seger had a good song on this

    Leanin on My Dream.

    well I got up and turned off the tv set
    and to tell you I was feelin’ mean
    an I thought a while
    tryin to make some sense
    out of everything that I have seen
    I was addin’ the score when there’s a knock on the door
    was a letter addressed to me
    It read ‘greetings from the president, united states’
    I fell down on my knees
    The next day I was on the picket line
    and Lord you should have heard me scream
    ‘you know you’re leanin’ on my dream’
    ‘hey man you’re leanin’ on my dream’

  83. 83.

    geg6

    @Soonergrunt:

    Oh, he claims that he means “Clown” with that C, but we all know better. If his misogyny is any indication, his racial views are something to be desired.

  85. 85.

    Spaghetti Lee

    @Kola Noscopy:

    You know, I don’t really know what made you so infamous, but you seem to be the type of commenter that this blog attracts depressingly often-the kind who thinks everyone here is idiots, but keeps posting for whatever inexplicable reason. If you went along on your merry way to another website, we’d both be much happier.

  86. 86.

    Kola Noscopy

    @Soonergrunt:

    As for the other crap you put up there, just know that I was front page here before I ever heard of you

    You’re a liar. I’ve been posting here for years and years, and you have responded directly to my comments on numerous occasions. But your lying fit right in with your front paging bullshit and your fondness for military facism.

    I’ll be front paging long after you leave,

    And a fantasist.

    So, how many DID you kill? You never answer.

  87. 87.

    Warren Terra

    @Kola Noscopy:

    when other commenters have repeatedly called me vile names

    You behave abominably, and thus inspire unfriendly behavior. And someone who’s named themselves over their tendency to stick their head up their own ass can hardly complain about being called vile names.

  88. 88.

    Woodrowfan

    I can’t see any legit reason other than racism a white person would want to own something like this.

    I own one. I don’t display it, but I use it in my American history classes. it’s one thing to see an old B&W photo of one in your textbook, but quite another to have one dropped on the desk in front of you (it’s metal and quite heavy). I think it makes the awfulness of Jim Crow seem a bit more real and less “just something I read about in class”…

    However, the woman in the story doesn’t quite strike me as the history prof type….

  93. 93.

    FlipYrWhig

    @Spaghetti Lee: I think Kola used to post as “Tim” and then “Tim, interrupted,” and may have had other incarnations before and after those. If not, I’ll stand corrected.

  95. 95.

    wrb

    @Kola Noscopy:

    When the world feels cold and chilly, nothing makes me feel better than eating a warm chicken pot pie

    I’m grateful for the bright comments and tips you’ve offered lately. You make the world a little sunnier.

  96. 96.

    Kola Noscopy

    @geg6:

    but we all know better.

    Oh do WE now?

    You are a pathetic, desperate little tribal person. Your clique here on an Internet blog is very important to you, I see.

    And your superior mind reading skills are…sad as well.

  97. 97.

    eric

    @Kola Noscopy: you are repulsive, not for racism or sexism, but because you make an otherwise pleasant place less so with your presence. You will be all “eff you, who made you the blog police,” but go to sleep tonight remembering that your words are simply hurtful attempts to get attention. The rest of us will go on with more meaningful lives. peace.

  98. 98.

    kdaug

    @MikeJ:

    I was in college when students were trying to get unis to divest from South Africa. A group put “Whites Only” or “Colored Only” on every door, every water fountain, every restroom on campus. A powerful demonstration for people too young to have ever seen the real thing.

    Me, too.

    UT.

    And I still believe it switched some young Texas Republicans to the cause (i.e., the protests tripled in size in a week).

  99. 99.

    Jennifer

    @opie jeanne: I can see some white person owning it as part of a historical collection…but I can’t see displaying it. Here’s why I think this: I have a doll that my grandmother bought on one of her trips down south in the 50’s – I think she picked it up in Florida. Anyway, it’s a flip doll with a long dress. Flipped one way, it’s a little girl with blond braids in a sunbonnet; flipped the other way, it’s a sterotypical mammy with a red doo-rag on her head. And when I was a little kid, I loved that doll. The mammy one. Not because it was a racist stereotype but because I thought she was very beautiful and exotic looking. I loved her doo-rag. And it’s in my house right now, out in the open even. So I think there are people who aren’t racist, who can have attachments to things that clearly are racist, not because of but in spite of the racist connotations.

    I’ll admit something else: as a kid I loved the Little Black Sambo book; again because of the pictures of his fancy clothes, the tiger, etc. As an adult I looked up the version of it I saw as a child and whoo boy, it is BAD. But I didn’t remember any negative stereotypes from seeing it as a child, so it was pretty shocking to see how bad it really was. This was the Little Golden Book edition and it presents multiple offenses in both print and some of the illustrations. One of those, I would not want a copy of, though I think it’s a prime candidate for a non-racist re-write, because the story itself is great. The difference there is that first of all, the negative stereotyping in the book is really way way over the top, but second of all, I associate the doll with being at my grandmother’s and a lot of other very positive things.

  100. 100.

    Amir Khalid

    @Colo Noscopy:
    Again you demonstrate your genius at derailing a thread. Congratulations! No other troll here is so adept at marshaling beside-the-point complaints, personal insults to all and sundry, a personal vendetta against a former front-pager, and overwhelming narcissism. and now you have succeeded in distracting people from a conversation about the deplorable persistence of casual racism in America. You, sir, are a champion among attention-seekers.

    I was just wondering, though: is there any chance at all that you might, someday, have something to say about the subject at hand? Something informative? Something enlightening? Some sobering or hopeful reflection? Some of us may still be eager to see what other talents you have.

  102. 102.

    Kola Noscopy

    @Raven:

    “One too few that’s for sure.”

    Now THAT is a great example of the mindset of a military-fetishist such as yourself. Fuck off, killer wannabe.

  103. 103.

    Soonergrunt

    @Amir Khalid:

    I was just wondering, though: is there any chance at all that you might, someday, have something to say about the subject at hand? Something informative? Something enlightening? Some sobering or hopeful reflection? Some of us may still be eager to see what other talents you have.

    Being a racist, the only thing he will have to say is that he’s sorry that he didn’t think to put up such a sign himself.

  104. 104.

    dmbeaster

    @opie jeanne:

    I can see African Americans collecting stuff like this, and museums, both to make sure we never forget it.

    The classic racist collectible are the lynching postcards.

    It is pretty clear that the sign is an antique “Whites Only” sign since it references a public swimming pool. And now we know the answer to the question, “what do you get for the racist who has everything.”

  106. 106.

    Kola Noscopy

    @eric:

    You’re a sad little person. So unself aware it is frightening.

    Many of the comments and stupidity of you and your Obot friends are hurtful to thinking people such as myself, yet you persist. Where is YOUR shame?

  108. 108.

    Legalize

    Sorry, way OT:

    Grammar experts: what is the possessive form of an acronym that ends in the letter S? The acronym in question is a business name.

    They were UPS’s trucks.

    OR

    They were UPS’ trucks.

    I don’t know if this complicates things, but the acronym in question is one that you can pronounce as a word, like “SARS”.

    Thanks!

  110. 110.

    ruemara

    @Soonergrunt: Ok, bookmark this, because here I will defend Kola. I do not believe he or she is a bigot. At least, not any more prejudiced as any other human being who may not be aware of things they take for granted. It’s just a case of shit stirring for the hell of it and should regarded as thus. Toxic, but not bigoted.

  111. 111.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    Actually the sign posting itslef is an older story, and the Ohio Civil Rights Commission ruled it discriminatory in fall 2011, which I thought had been covered here at the time. The “gift recipient” then requested reconsideration, and today the OCRC unanimously denied that request. Hence the new post by ABL, I’m guessing.

    The case will now head to an ALJ, where a staff attorney from the civil rights section of the Ohio AG’s office will represent the commission in a hearing to determine penalties to be imposed. The “recipient” (most likely of some penalties at that stage) can then appeal to the Court of Common Fleas in Hamilton County, which has a few judges who might take offense at her attitude.

  112. 112.

    Kola Noscopy

    @Amir Khalid:

    Obots and cliquesters ignore all such comments of mine, because I am not an Obot or cliquester. But when I post comments that touch a nerve with their core of truth, you Bots and cliquesters slither and squirm to the bait.

    Is that my fault? It is your own secret guilt that causes you to swarm.

    For instance, you claim to want to have a conversation about casual racism and how awesome ACL is. But anyone who comments here disagreeing with the established BJ kool kid narrative on those subjects is instantly harassed, not with facts but with bile.

    BTW, thanks for the compliments. I had no idea I was so powerful.

  114. 114.

    Soonergrunt

    @Legalize: I would go with the second one.
    One easy way to test it is to say it out loud and see which one works. This test doesn’t ALWAYS work, but it’s useful most of the time.

    UPS’ trucks would be said “Ups trucks” and UPS’s trucks would be said “Upses Trucks.” Also, the spell checker in Firefox alerts on “UPS’s”, but not “UPS'” so that’s a sign too.

  116. 116.

    Jax6655

    @Napoleon:

    Just a historical ‘nit’ but a Whites Only sign is actually from the Jim Crow era, and is not slave memorabilia. This type of stuff (Whites Only sign) is vastly different from collecting legal documents like ownership papers, ship manifests, even shackles, etc. from the slavery era, which provide a historical/ancestral perspective.

    @opie jeanne:

    I can see African Americans collecting stuff like this, and museums, both to make sure we never forget it.

    I can’t see any legit reason other than racism a white person would want to own something like this.

    IMO–Although I know there are a few AAs who collect mammy cookie jars, pickaninny dolls, and the like [not my cup of tea] I don’t think many AAs actually want to own a Jim Crow sign.

    YMMV

    *edited to fix blockquote fail

  117. 117.

    Belafon (formerly anonevent)

    @sharl: There was a post the other day where someone was asking about shows that were critical of Conservatives and I wanted to point out Squidbillies.

  118. 118.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @Colon Blow:

    I beg your pardon.

    Some of the smartest guys I knew in the Army were infantrymen. Now, admittedly, there are more smart cannon cockers than grunts, at least among the fire direction and spotting guys. They have do do some math, under bad conditions, you see. Gun bunnies don’t need to be terribly smart. Lightning guys like me (“Hey, Sparks!”) had to out think both groups, if only to come up with plausible reasons why the damn radios were not working.

    Treadheads, OTOH, tend to be as slow as their tanks. That makes them a lot faster than you, bucko.

  119. 119.

    Kola Noscopy

    @Soonergrunt:

    Being a racist,

    Fuck you, Killer. Can you give me a detailed analysis of how you know I’m a “racist?” Let’s see you try…

    How many Vietnamese people did you kill in the white war against the yellow communist hordes? Or was it one of the white wars against the brown Moozlims in which you killed? How many? What races? Come clean.

    I’ve never murdered anyone of any race. How about you?

  120. 120.

    MikeJ

    Hah! I’d never seen the pie image in a comment before this thread! I didn’t think you could use img tags here.

    @Legalize: I’d go with ‘s. I’d pronounce the possessive of SARS “sarzes”. If you would pronounce the extra es on the end, make it ‘s. If you would pronounce the possessive “sars”, then just s’.

  121. 121.

    Kola Noscopy

    @ruemara:

    You’re wrong about the shit stirring part, but thanks for that, I think.

    ABL is a horrible writer, for instance, and it annoys me to hear her lionized; especially with the instant accusation of racism.

    Why can’t I say that out loud here without the swarming?

  122. 122.

    Soonergrunt

    @ruemara: If KN is actually Tim and Tim, Interrupted as has been suggested, then yes, he is a bigot.
    @somegayname: When and where have I ever dehumanized him? Because I have never referred to him with “it” for a gender, nor have I ever referred to him as an object or otherwise as less than human. I have referred to him constantly as the type of human that he is–a miserable racist little shit-stain, who if he were on fire, I wouldn’t piss on him to put him out, but he’s still a human. That fact is a blight on the rest of the 5 billion members of this species, but it’s not something I’ve ever denied. You know who else was human?

  123. 123.

    patroclus

    @Raven:

    Why thank you! Overnight ratings were awful – the lowest ever – but the final ratings (which included Birmingham, which pulled something like a 96 share) were not as bad. Roll Tide!

    By the way, I agree with Kola that ACL’s are awesome. If you don’t agree, try tearing yours…

  125. 125.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @ Colonoscopy: Fuck off yourself. Any killing done by soonergrunt and stuckinred was in the course of military service – you know, protecting your right to be an asshole without the government locking you up for assholery? And your military service was in what capacity please. Did you serve your country like the sons of Mormon Mittens by doing campaign work? Or not at all.

  129. 129.

    ruemara

    @Soonergrunt: I know the handle T&T, but, to be frank, my eyes glaze over when I see the internet brat syndrome on display. Even the bigoted ones. The way I see it, if this is JC’s living room and he lets in someone who shits on the floor, it’s his call. I forget their name instantly. I leave it to your judgement on further engagement.

  130. 130.

    Kola Noscopy

    @a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q):

    Fuck off yourself. Any killing done by soonergrunt and stuckinred was in the course of military service – you know, protecting your right to be an asshole without the government locking you up for assholery?

    Seriously? In 2012 you want to use THAT old worn out trope that’s been used to justify any and all of the U.S. bogus military adventures? Killers aren’t responsible for their victims because they were “just following orders?”

    Really? Tell it to the millions and millions of 20th Century war dead, killed by soldiers of many nations who were just following orders. You should be ashamed.

    Was Ho Chi Minh and the yellow hordes poised at the Canadian border?

    hahahaha…sad and weak. The idea that on a progressive blog the “they were military so they’re not responsible for their own actions” line would be tolerated, is hilariously sad.

  132. 132.

    Amir Khalid

    @Legalize:
    This is one of those questions grammar and punctuation geeks fight over. There seems to be no universal rule. The best I can tell you is that the answer depends on whom you’re writing for. If it’s for a publishing house, or some kind of publication, they may have a house style guide and/or a copy editor you can consult. If it’s for an organization that doesn’t have such, ask the person receiving the piece of writing what their preference is, then go with that. If it’s for yourself, go with whatever style reference you trust. (What sayeth the Chicago Manual of Style?)

    My own preference is to always omit the possessive S after an apostrophe following a final S, whether the word is singular or plural, pronounceable or not. Thus: SARS’ not SARS’s.

  133. 133.

    Jax6655

    @Jennifer:

    I think there are people who aren’t racist, who can have attachments to things that clearly are racist, not because of but in spite of the racist connotations.

    No.

    *But keep plucking that chicken, Jennifer.

  134. 134.

    Kola Noscopy

    @geg6:

    Probably because you’re too much of a coward to serve.

    Well, that was original, you stupid military fetishist. Do you kill yourself, or just enable and cheer on those who do?

    Did I get a bad link to some psycho right wing site?

  136. 136.

    gogol's wife

    OT: We need an open thread so I can tell everyone to watch “The Life and Death of Colonel Blimp” tonight at 8:00 ET on TCM. Roger Livesey is so great, Deborah Kerr too, in a triple role. It’s the guys who did “The Red Shoes” and “I Know Where I’m Going.”

  137. 137.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @ VDE: We 13As never believed your BS about sunspots when we could move the FDC track two meters and everthing worked fine.

    Timmy, unlike, for example, m_c who can provide insight or info along with annoyance, is 0% signal, 100% noise.

  138. 138.

    Kola Noscopy

    @Soonergrunt:

    Sooner, dear, all I want to know is how many people you have killed?

    So that we can support and encourage this behavior, and thank you for their deaths, you know, in a completely patriotic and military fetish kind of way.

    Why won’t you share the specifics with us? I don’t understand.

  139. 139.

    gogol's wife

    Just for the record re ABL: She was funny and never boring, whether or not you always agreed with her. Not being boring is an extremely important virtue on a blog, in my opinion. I miss her. (Compare some of the resident trolls.)

  140. 140.

    flukebucket

    Not completely off topic but it is impossible to reason with a Ron Paul supporter isn’t it? I have tried everything I know to do. What is it about the guy that draws such a loyal and blind following? And are they all 25 years old or younger?

  142. 142.

    Jennifer

    @Jax6655: You remind me of a friend of mine, who wants to pretend like she never called her little brother “fa**ot” back in the 70’s because now, both because the times have changed and she’s an adult, she knows it’s not acceptable. Whatever.

    I’m keeping the doll and really don’t give a rat’s rear about your stupid opinion as to why I’m keeping it.

  144. 144.

    ruemara

    @flukebucket: Dude. Why do you hate freedom and WEEEEED? They grow out of it. Thankfully. Otherwise they head into IT. Apologies in advance to the saner IT persons amongst us.

  145. 145.

    opie jeanne

    @Jay in Oregon: Right now I’m using Safari, th one that came with it.

    I added Firefox just so that I could download Cleek’s pie filter, and it just sits there and looks at me. I have gone over the steps at the pie filter site, and I must be missing something. I’ll go check it again.

  148. 148.

    Ruckus

    @Amir Khalid:
    I have wondered in the last few years why adding the second s seemed wrong but could never remember how I had learned it should be, or why. Your example is what I learned but had forgotten, low theses many decades ago.

  152. 152.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @kdaug: I tease my friends on that bench with that court name so much that I appear to type it now. It was an actual typo, but one of thought rather than digital placement. Oops.

  153. 153.

    Soonergrunt

    @Kola Noscopy: Calling HER a military fetishist? LOL!
    geg6 and I agree on a few things, but to call the commenter who once declared that “the military mind is sick!” a “military fetishist” is just beyond stupid and pathetic.

    @Kola Noscopy: I was three years old when the US left Viet Nam, you stupid bastard. IF you’d been around here commenting for years as you claim you’d know that.

  154. 154.

    Satanicpanic

    @flukebucket: A good friend of mine voted for RP in 2008 but lately has flipped. Wants to keep his guns but thinks healthcare and education need to be state run. He wasn’t a guy I would imagine putting up freeway signs tho.

  156. 156.

    scav

    Nolo Comprende, we get it, you would pee in your mother’s mouth to get attention. You’ve out stupided the NYT and they made an own goal by committee today.

    Course, given the title of this thread, it does follow you’d hog center stage.

    Least I learned where to go with my common flea issues.

  157. 157.

    burnspbesq

    @Soonergrunt:

    Not like it’s a surprise.

    Agreed. How frequently are these recommendations overturned as they make their way up the chain of command?

  158. 158.

    The Moar You Know

    Mr. Cole: Please tag ABL links as such. I, personally, do not want to give her blog any page hits. Thanks.

  160. 160.

    dogwood

    Remember that story the other day about the man who was wounded and whose wife died last year in Tucson? The “Gabby Giffords makes me puke.” guy? I think that guy is KN.

  162. 162.

    Kola Noscopy

    @Soonergrunt:

    I was three years old when the US left Viet Nam, you stupid bastard.

    I asked above which white war of aggression you fought in; you declined to answer, so I took a guess, you ignorant pustule.

    So you killed BROWN people, not yellow then? Where? How many? Did you like it?

    Share the patriotism!!!!

  163. 163.

    Jax6655

    @Jennifer:

    Well, Jennifer. I never called my little brother a f****t when we were little. As a Black child of the 50s and 60s my parents didn’t allow us to call anyone any names. We couldn’t even call someone stupid or say ‘shut up’ or we were in serious trouble.

    If you are somehow implying that I once owned a mammy doll and am now being hypocritical about your owning one . . . ? Or something? I can only respond by saying I can’t stand mammy imagery. I won’t even buy Aunt Jemima-brand products for that very reason. Oh, and I’m Black in case you didn’t catch that above

    I loved that doll. The mammy one. . . And it’s in my house right now, out in the open even.

    Keep your friggin’ doll. After all, if no African Americans visit your house anyway, no one will be offended by your ‘display.’

    Otherwise you might want to rethink this since MAMMY IS OFFENSIVE TO MANY BLACK PEOPLE.

    Just sayin’

  166. 166.

    Soonergrunt

    @burnspbesq: It is exceedingly rare for the IO to recommend charges and the Convening Authority to not then convene a Court-Martial. My military lawyer friends don’t have any recollection of that happening, nor are there any notorious or famous instances to which they could point.
    The other way–the IO recommending NO charges, but the Convening Authority sends to General Court-Martial happens much more often, particularly in cases of accusations of sexual assault or rape. Political creatures that they are, very few General Officers will not convene on such charges because of the political issue surrounding them, regardless of what the evidence may or may not show. CAs will convene just about any type far more often than they will pass for just about any charge. And the accused is still then subject to Special Court-Martial as convened by the first O-6 in their chain of command, or punishment under Article 15, UCMJ.

  167. 167.

    Brachiator

    @gogol’s wife:

    We need an open thread so I can tell everyone to watch “The Life and Death of Colonel Blimp” tonight at 8:00 ET on TCM. Roger Livesey is so great, Deborah Kerr too, in a triple role. It’s the guys who did “The Red Shoes” and “I Know Where I’m Going.”

    Great film. Done by The Archers, the team of the great Michael Powell and Emeric Pressburger, who shared direction, production and writing credits.

    Has great use of technicolor, but I don’t know how this comes across on TV screens.

  170. 170.

    opie jeanne

    @Jennifer: I had a doll that I only remember the name of: Sampy. Probably named after Little Black Sambo, and I had a version of that book too. The pictures were pretty and I was very little, but I always assumed Sambo was from India mainly because of the tigers. (Yes, I was THAT kid, even back then) but also because of the way he was dressed. I know what’s wrong with the book now.

    I don’t know who gave me that doll but my dad got rid of it almost immediately. My parents’ official explanation to me was that it made him sneeze, triggered some allergy. I was probably 3 and I don’t remember the doll at all, just remember asking where it was. It was a ‘mammy’ doll, and Dad was really upset that someone had given this thing to one of his kids.

  172. 172.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    One time when I was in Germany, convoying back to Wiesbaden from Wildflecken, we picked up Fort Stewart, GA Range Control on our VRC-12 series radios. They picked us up as well and wanted to know WTF we were doing on their freq. Weird ducting thing going on.

    “Sunspots” is better used as an excuse for why the RATT isn’t working :)

  173. 173.

    dogwood

    @The Moar You Know:

    Mr. Cole: Please tag ABL links as such. I, personally, do not want to give her blog any page hits. Thanks.

    Sounds reasonable to me. Would you be willing to ban KN in return for ABL alerts? Seems like that would be a win-win for most of the people around here.

  174. 174.

    JC

    Well, this thread degenerate quickly.

    For the record, isn’t it possible for people to be very complicated? I wish people would stop with the demon/angel, good/bad binary-isms that seem to infect things.

    TO WIT:

    ABL good qualities:

    a. Funny
    b. Smart
    c. Brings a lot of energy
    d. A very different – and welcome perspective

    ABL bad qualities:

    a. Never admits she is wrong (bad to do on a blog, just ratchets up the pressure and invective), but is always right. Trollish behavior, or troll-like.
    b. Hypocrital – she can be ‘angry’ at whoever she pleases, but heaven forbit someone be angry at her.
    c. Used a version of ‘racist comments’, to dishonestly discredit a person – such as Michael Moore – rather than actually engaging the arguments – and then expects everyone to go along with her excommunications.
    d. Splits and divides communities – again, into good and bad.

    Lots of us predicted what would happen with ABL. I certainly did. She would engage in point C above, and she did so with GG (how could he say that!! Oh my God you are a horrible horrible person, no one should ever hear what you have to say!), did so with Moore, did so with a commentator that she got bannned, and in the end, did so with Cole. He was horrible to support GG.

    And a lot of us KNEW and were RIGHT that it would go down this way.

    I don’t know why Kola is stirring so much shit right now – but I would urge EVERYONE to understand that, people are complicated.

    You can like all of ABL’s great qualities – and I do – while also disliking her crappy qualities. And I am she isn’t posting here, because all she really wants, in the end, is to be Right, and have the crowd praise her wit and wisdom. She does NOT want to actually engage in a give and take. That is for certain.

    And, E.D. Kain was the same, at first – he was RIGHT, and full of himself, and inevitabl, the blog backlash is what he created. No different.

  175. 175.

    Ruckus

    @Jax6655:
    I think, I hope mightily that I fully understand your point of view. My parents taught me the same thing, even though my father used some racially offensive language on rare occasion. But as a white child growing up in the 50’and 60’s I was exposed to the same stories as Jennifer. I also grew up and recognized them to be offensive and racist. But they triggered a positive memory for Jennifer, that of her grandmother. Not just a negative memory of the racism inherent in the doll or the stories. All of us sometimes(OK many times!) have to overcome the upbringings we receive. Many of us have, if not completely successful at it, tried to overcome the crappy parts of our upbringings. Not enough of us have been successful that’s for sure, but many have been reasonably so.

  178. 178.

    Billy Rae Valentine

    @Raven:

    Those comments about the new local pool near the Rockford projects are frightening!

    It’s good, I guess, to see people giving REAL reactions, though. Nothing PC about those comments; their disdain for the urban community is clear. But it’s sad and never stops being sad to me no matter how many times I see it.

  179. 179.

    Billy Rae Valentine

    this thread is derailed.

    honestly, the worst part of coming to this blog is the trolls. it’s really bad.

    i just want to hear discussion of issues. but i have to scroll past so much back-and-forth name-calling and nonsense that it is not worth it sometimes.

  180. 180.

    General Stuck

    You know what the doctor said when finishing the colonoscopy?

    answer below

    wolb ti tuo ruoy ssa

  181. 181.

    General Stuck

    ABL bad qualities: a. Never admits she is wrong (bad to do on a blog, just ratchets up the pressure and invective), but is always right. Trollish behavior, or troll-like.
    b. Hypocrital – she can be ‘angry’ at whoever she pleases, but heaven forbit someone be angry at her.
    c. Used a version of ‘racist comments’, to dishonestly discredit a person – such as Michael Moore – rather than actually engaging the arguments – and then expects everyone to go along with her excommunications.
    d. Splits and divides communities – again, into good and bad.

    Load of crap on all counts.

  183. 183.

    General Stuck

    @Ruckus:

    It’s comments like that is why ABL left. I suspect. There is no future in crossing the street rightfully with the light, when all the drivers are mean and crazy

  185. 185.

    jayboat

    Wow. Someone on this thread sure sounds like one unhappy individual. Hanging out in place where no one much cares for his opinions and yet he repeatedly exclaims that his questions, however provocative and irrelevant, must be answered or the questionee is… some kind of bad name.

    I admit that I don’t get it. Perhaps someone here would be kind enough to enlighten me, because at the very least, it sure seems like a complete waste of time.

    Also, too- I enjoy pie from time to time.

  186. 186.

    General Stuck

    @jayboat:

    It happens in every thread on BJ that ABL’s handle is said. And each time it is a looking glass to the very epitome of white male privilege, and other unsavory motives.

    edit – that should be white liberal privilege

  187. 187.

    Raven

    @Billy Rae Valentine: Yea, Rocksprings is a tough area. I ran all the pools for the city 27 years ago and I could tell you some stories that would make your hair stand on end. The Athens paper is notorious for being a hotbed of mouth breathers.

  188. 188.

    JC

    @General Stuck: With regard to Kolo, perhaps, but really, it’s a partial perspective that you offer. E.D. Kain’s silly stupidities were gone after with equal relish, just without the racism charges.

    In other news – hasn’t Obama been great recently, in a lot of ways?

    This Baltimore case, where the Justice department comes and says the obvious, that people have a right to record police officers, is awesome.

  189. 189.

    JC

    @General Stuck: Nope – all true – and I have the benefit of being right, months ago.

    I’m fine with you disagreeing – you are one of those, who see people as ‘all good’, and ‘all bad’, and can’t seem to see complexities.

  190. 190.

    General Stuck

    @JC:

    I’m fine with you disagreeing

    I’m not disagreeing, I’m saying you are full of shit. Or maybe a spoof of sorts. You can prove me wrong by offering up some evidence, other than the echo chamber claptrap between your ears.

    edit – ABL has her faults, but they are not the crappola you regurgitated

  191. 191.

    JC

    @General Stuck: Sigh.

    Stuck, come on, man.

    Let’s take the first, most obvious truth.

    Cole didn’t make ABL go away. That’s first. Cole defended GG’s right to say what he said, ABL found that ‘out of bounds’ and unacceptable, and WALKED AWAY.

    That is the truth – that is what happened. She wasn’t kicked out. She wasn’t thrown out. She left.

    And this is EXACTLY what I said:

    Used a version of ‘racist comments’, to dishonestly discredit a person – such as Michael Moore – rather than actually engaging the arguments – and then expects everyone to go along with her excommunications.

    She found GG’s comments out of bounds. EDIT – tried to discredit GG, by finding GG out of bounds. Cole disagreed. So then ABL found COLE out of bounds, and walked. And then said something like ‘fat chance fucker’, on twitter ABOUT Cole.

    The tick-tock on this is pretty clear, bud.

  192. 192.

    gaz

    I think JC correctly states ABL’s good qualities, and AFAIAC, overstates her bad ones a bit. Personally, I don’t mind her more abrasive traits. She posts as “Angry Black Lady”, I know what I am getting, and I’m 100% cool with that – even if she does provoke. And frankly, I think her choice of screen name is utter genius. think “Angry Black Man(tm)” for a sec – and all the baggage that brings. She stirs the shit on purpose, and in the context of discussing race and racism, it’s needed. I’ll read Coates when I want a more level headed commentary on race. ABL brings the fuck you. And I for one will miss her here. Even if I disagreed with much of her obama fluffing – always have.

    And I think she left more because of JC than GG, that, and I suspect she grew tired of the inevitable overarching double standard applied to her here. In my view it was both racially motivated, and self inflicted (insomuch as the very name she chose). You wouldn’t see Zandar facing that stuff here because of the people that even pay attention and know he’s black – and he doesn’t write angry posts.

    If DougJ came in every day on a stink, and wrote some negative post on here every time he FP’d a lot of people would still dislike him, but it would have looked different than what happened here over the course (again, IMO) ABL’s tenure here.

    Then again, I wasn’t around for Ed Kain. And I don’t feel sorry for ABL at all – because she signed up for it – knew she was gonna stir shit up and did it for as long as she could handle. I’ll miss her here. She added a lot to this blog.

    If this post sounds overly nuanced, it probably is. If I sound full of shit, oh well. This is my $0.02. And if you’re glad she’s gone, good for you – you got what you wanted, in the end. Feels good, I bet. So leave well enough alone.

    Also too, if I skip the first half of JC’s post, and skip to the second, I pretty much agree

  193. 193.

    General Stuck

    okay, I will flesh out my calling bullshit on JC’s bullshit

    b. Hypocrital – she can be ‘angry’ at whoever she pleases, but heaven forbit someone be angry at her

    Laughable. Her threads are like the rage virus scenes from I Am Legend. Ravenous misanthropes snarling incoherent slurs and grunts for the uppity race relations messenger

    c. Used a version of ‘racist comments’, to dishonestly discredit a person – such as Michael Moore – rather than actually engaging the arguments – and then expects everyone to go along with her excommunications.

    It was Michael Moore using a version of “racist comments” calling Obama a coward and other coded terms for the standard racist “inadequate black man” frame. Not to mention his entitled ass lecturing black folk on how much white liberals have done for them, taking credit for civil rights they earned themselves with blood and tears for generations.

    d. Splits and divides communities – again, into good and bad.

    This blog, like all the others on the left, were already split before ABL showed up, with myself and a few others railing at Cole to do something about the increasing racist speak on his blog. I don’t know if that factored in to him bringing ABL on board, or was just a welcome coincidence.

  194. 194.

    gaz

    when I said GG vs JC I meant John Cole.

    sorry for any confusion I caused about that in my previous post.

  195. 195.

    General Stuck

    @JC:

    Let’s take the first, most obvious truth. Cole didn’t make ABL go away.

    I didn’t say it was. I said it was more the likes of the brain dead comment of yours on this thread. Did you not get the news of all the most ugly racist shit being deleted by Cole before it posted in comments? I think ABL, and any normal sane person could not hold up under all that withering hate directed at them without the blog owner being square in their corner. Cole has been, up till the GG garbage that spawned this clusterfuck. I think he got caught in the middle of two people he liked, (though for the life of me, I’ll never understand his support of Greenwald) and made an unfortunate spur of the moment choice that was lose lose, unless he had kept his mouth shut, but didn’t.

  196. 196.

    JGabriel

    Speaking of race, here’s the latest from Santorum in SC on why Romney would be a bad nominee:

    [Mr. Santorum] said the party can win back the White House only by offering a “clear contrast” with President Obama. “We need contrasts,” Mr. Santorum said, “not just a paler shade of what we have.”
    __
    (h/t Powder Blue Satan)

    It’s the racial subtext that gives South Carolina GOP Primaries that special spice.

    Edited To Add: How long before someone calls Mitt a “wigger”?

    .

  197. 197.

    13th Generation

    @ general stuck

    She took her ball and went home, Cole had nothing to do with it and you know it, you sanctimonious prick.

  198. 198.

    JC

    @General Stuck:

    You know, this is really just a lonely conversation now, in a thread that everyone else has forgotten about? :)

    Laughable. Her threads are like the rage virus scenes from I Am Legend.

    Very true – but E.D. Kain’s read like that as well, although not as vicious, admittedly.

    But that’s a red herring argument. People could be angry at her, but that didn’t mean she ever acknowledged that they may have a point – while one of her motifs was to get people to ADMIT they have been ‘out of bounds’. So again, that is hypocritical. What was good for the goose – those she wrote about – was never good for the gander – her.

    It was Michael Moore using a version of “racist comments” calling Obama a coward and other coded terms for the standard racist “inadequate black man” frame.

    Let’s not re-legislate that – suffice to say, Cornel West was saying the same thing, but I didn’t see ABL calling Cornel West ‘racist’, she just called Cornel West being ‘ridiculous and stupid’. And, AFTER I pointed out how Cornel West said the same thing, then she posted on Cornel West being ridiculous and stupid.

    My point there is that, like Cornel West, Michael Moore may have been being ridiculous, but not racist.

    This blog, like all the others on the left, were already split before ABL showed up, with myself and a few others railing at Cole to do something about the increasing racist speak on his blog

    Well, it got more split, in my opinion.

    While I enjoy arguing with you, since I’ve done this dance with you before, I know you cannot help but have the last word. But I will note that you don’t really engage my last comment.

    At some point, you may want to grant your arguer, me, that there are valid points in what I’m saying, and that I’m doing so from an honest point of view.

    You and I have done this dance before – so why the ‘full of shit’ and ‘spoof of sorts?’. You know better than that.

    Gaz may be right though, and I’m overstating the case. Just perceiving the best I can.

  199. 199.

    gaz

    @General Stuck: Basically, this.

    Adding that I bet it didn’t help that JCole piled on w/ several front page posts, one (if not all of which) pretty much amounted to ABL sucks. If this were not a donation based blog, I’d use the term unprofessional. Although I still think that was poor judgement on Cole’s part. You have the back of your cobloggers damn it. Don’t make public spectacles of them to your audience. That’s just unfair. If you disagree, do it in an adult fashion. And respectfully. I’ve chastised a gas station manager because I watched her berate a clerk in front of me – and what JC did on the week leading up to that felt a lot like the same kinda thing to me.

    I mean – who the fuck does that?

    I don’t blame ABL for leaving. And it wasn’t just the GG incident. It was a bunch of shit, I think leading to that. some was probably the invective of the commenters (a human can only endure so much hate!), but I’m guessing when the “staff” started piling on. Fuck. whatcha gonna do? really?

  200. 200.

    Benjamin Franklin

    @gaz:

    Maybe you can tell me. Why are there so many shit-stains who just want to be argumentative?

  201. 201.

    General Stuck

    @13th Generation:

    Gawd you people are dense. Off course Cole had something to do with it, but he didn’t fire her,

    My point there is that, like Cornel West, Michael Moore may have been being ridiculous, but not racist.

    Your mind is closed, and no one can do anything about it.

    And again, your characterizations of ABL’s behavior on this blog is a crock of shit. You seem so tuned in to bashing her, shirley you have some actual threads and quotes bookmarked or memorized to back up your BS.

  202. 202.

    JC

    @General Stuck:

    One more – “brain dead”. “full of shit”. “spoof of sorts”. “echo chamber claptrap between your ears”.

    For someone who is so concerned about ABL, because ABL took a lot of unfair blog heat – you certainly can throw your insults mixed with your arguments, can’t you? Why is it when you insult, it’s all good, but when others do so, it’s out of bounds?

    Myself, let’s keep it ON THE ARGUMENTS. You can save the insults for those who enjoy that interplay with you.

  204. 204.

    Elie

    I miss ABL but what I am most amazed about is the playground antics of some who come here to exchange ideas and even tussle a bit. Did some of you expect everyone would think like you?

    There is no doubt that ABL was abused by some of the folks who comment here… I have no idea truly what she triggered in some of you, but it was definitely over the top in some instances. Most of all, I was taken aback by the passion and intensity some showed against her..

    I dunno. It was a good thing that I missed the hoo ha — being taken up with my own life and such — grateful for a new job but had to move, etc. It let me re-introduce a little emotional balance and I suspect a few who comment here might could use a little break. Some could also maybe use some medications, electrodes applied to the scalp and a few volts. Also.

    This is going to be a rockin year in the run up to the election. Troll traffic will be past 20 on a 10 point scale. I will have to pace myself.

    Let me say this… all of you who truly want good things for our country and believe in helping everyone to the best citizenship they can achieve — I love you and hope that your hearts and the spirit you have to give will infect this country. I am deep down an optimist … and if I am wrong, I want the error term in that direction anyway…

  205. 205.

    General Stuck

    @Elie:

    I too missed this particular drama, while off the grid. This is really the first time I’ve addressed it in any detail. But I sense it is a bubbling lava flow beneath the surface here. I support ABL’s decision, as sometimes the only way to win is stop playing. Concerning trolls, this blog has long been a hopeless cesspool. And totally mind blowing to me, that it almost always comes from the center left. Chalk it up to the cost of freedom to say anything you want.

  206. 206.

    Brachiator

    @JC:

    My point there is that, like Cornel West, Michael Moore may have been being ridiculous, but not racist.

    Actually, both were racist. It comes down to morans thinking that they can define what an authentic black, Latino, whatever, is supposed to be. A skit on Jon Stewart nailed it.

    It’s interesting how often people use “stupid and ridiculous” when they cannot acknowledge the racist or sexist aspects of a comment.

    Just my half cents worth, without rehashing all the ABL controversy. See a little difference than some of the stuff with Kain, who was often just arguing from ignorance and ideology.

  207. 207.

    Elie

    Hey Stuck — Happy New Year!

    The “left” or mock “left” trolls have inflicted damage… their targets have always been the morale of people who supported Obama but also understand complexity and fairness..

    I believe that the uncivil tone here and everywhere — teevee reality shows, politics, have just contaminated us beyond measure. Its really hard to not keep adding to it myself and when I hang around here too much I get to be in the same frame…

    Anyway — lots of things to love about BJ and I always lurk even if I con’t/can’t comment. I am amazed by so many here and laugh my ass off a lot.

    ABL can take care of herself. I hope she changes her mind and makes “guest appearances”, but if not, well, that is her choice…

  208. 208.

    JC

    @Brachiator: Yes, well, that’s above my pay grade, really. And someone came in that thread, and schooled me – handed me my a$$ and deservedly so – as I, as stupid white guy, started wandering far afield, into ‘what IS racist anyway? Is it comments? Is it behavior?”. :)

    But, still, I merely note that – ABL thought it fine to employ ‘racism’ as a tactic to Michael Moore, but not the same tactic, to Cornel West.

    And there is something off there, about that inconsistency.

    IMHO.

  209. 209.

    Brachiator

    @JC:

    And there is something off there, about that inconsistency

    Obviously, I think that ABL was wrong here, even though I admire her and miss her presence.

    Go figure.

  210. 210.

    General Stuck

    @JC:

    I’m pretty sure if it was racism from Cornell West when he said the same stuff as Michael Moore, it would have been Cornell West addressing his comments to a person in other than his own race. duh. It may have been stupid and self serving in some way what he said, but not racist.

    Next, you’ll be calling black people racists for using the word nigger in whatever way.

    edit – you all realize the premise for this stuff is not equal, or both sides do it. don’t you?

  211. 211.

    Can't Be Bothered

    Jesus, she doesn’t even have to actuallybe posted for it to be a fairly useless, hyperbolic, trolly thread. Please, don’t let this thaw mean a return and the invariable blogwide meltdowns every couple weeks. Please. If I want meta dramatic hyperbole, I’ll just go on back to the GOS.

  212. 212.

    Gian

    Oh boy. anthoner thread about the latest time that ABL walked away. If I recall this is the third time.

    To me the issues are fairly complex, she no doubt gets reactions that other front pagers who share a simliar pigment don’t seem to get.

    She’s also prone to the whole drama routine with this being the third leaving of this blog in a huff routine.

    Some of the never being wrong issue is pretty clear with her – and it is also clear with Glenn. I suspect it might be something to do with both being lawyers. How many lawyers do you know who readily admit error?

  213. 213.

    John Cole

    Adding that I bet it didn’t help that JCole piled on w/ several front page posts, one (if not all of which) pretty much amounted to ABL sucks.

    What color is the sky on your planet? I made one post on the issue, and it was in response to ABL. Not only that, I didn’t pile on her, I explained I wasn’t even talking about her.

    Jesus.

  214. 214.

    Kola Noscopy

    @John Cole:

    What color is the sky on your planet? I made one post on the issue, and it was in response to ABL. Not only that, I didn’t pile on her, I explained I wasn’t even talking about her.

    Typical white male redneck privilege. RACIST

  215. 215.

    dead existentialist

    What a wonderful thread. John links to ABL and all hell breaks loose. In fact, there are more comments by at least a factor of 3 here than at ABL’s site.

    Way to steal the page hits, Cole ;)

    ETA: Aw, Timmeh, I thought Soonergrunt put you in the playpen for the night. You are too predictable.

  216. 216.

    Cain

    @General Stuck:

    their corner. Cole has been, up till the GG garbage that spawned this clusterfuck. I think he got caught in the middle of two people he liked, (though for the life of me, I’ll never understand his support of Greenwald) and made an unfortunate spur of the moment choice that was lose lose, unless he had kept his mouth shut, but didn’t.

    Yeah, I’m afraid I agree. He should have kept his mouth shut. If he was married or had a girlfriend he would have known this. :-)

  217. 217.

    Cain

    @General Stuck:

    I too missed this particular drama, while off the grid. This is really the first time I’ve addressed it in any detail. But I sense it is a bubbling lava flow beneath the surface here. I support ABL’s decision, as sometimes the only way to win is stop playing. Concerning trolls, this blog has long been a hopeless cesspool. And totally mind blowing to me, that it almost always comes from the center left. Chalk it up to the cost of freedom to say anything you want.

    I’m very disapointed that people continue to engage trolls. I don’t understand why pepole can’t just not engage them. What is the point exactly? Everytime you do, you encourage to hang around.

  221. 221.

    gaz

    @John Cole: John, to be fair, after reading 3000 comments on that whole fucking thing in like 2 days, I don’t even know anymore. You may be right about that post – there’s a great chance I read a lot into it. But it left a bad taste in my mouth. And certainly seemed like a pile on at the time.

    But then again, maybe I was so used to the ABL pile on shit, that even hearing you allude to that shit about how ABL did bad job on that NDAA story was too much. In the end, I’d say to be completely magnanimous, that it didn’t at leave the impression with more of a few of us, than maybe you were intending.

    I’m not saying your a bad guy. I love you. I love your work here, I really do. I still think you fucking stepped in it, and maybe when I have more energy to comb through the archives I’ll recount the specifics that left me with that VERY distinct impression. Not that it matters – I’m just another commenter, and relatively new at that.

    Honestly the whole fucking thing though was top to bottom drama on everyone’s part. Seems, mistakes were made. I said some stupid shit about the NDAA thing too, I’m sure – I commented on it enough, the odds are good.

    But again, stick by your co bloggers. Let someone else call ABL out. It’s not like nobody else would. It’s ABL, FFS. It just shouldn’t have been you. Maybe you guys didn’t have a classic employer/employee relationship, but she was staff – you stick by them. If you must, disagree with her in the comment sections of your own blog. I’m not even gonna get into the nun-rape thing. Because. Fuck. The original commenter was a complete asshole. GG made it 10x worse.

    None of this really matters of course. ABL doesn’t want my defense, I don’t feel sorry for her, or the choice she made. One thing I find seriously * weak * was that GG basically was able to BOMB this blog like that. If anyone was in a position to prevent that, it was you and ABL. When you could have stepped up for the blog, you stepped up and defended a guy who needs no defending, and it cost you a front pager. Even you should see that.

    But fuckit whatever. I don’t run a blog. And I like yours. And you – even if we disagree on the color of the sky.

  222. 222.

    JR in WVa

    Sometimes the sky is pink, or purple, or looming black gobs of cloud.

    Regarding possessives, even if it is properly written as word-ending-in-S’ I tend to pronounce it aloud as word-ending-in-S’s or UPS’s for example.

    I like ABL, and I think it’s a shame she took offense and went away. I can only put so many links under poly-sci-blogs menu item in my bookmark list.

    I wish I could go to sleep…

  223. 223.

    A Humble Lurker

    Come on, Cole. We all know you’re madly in love with your baby mama (as you’ve called her on twitter) and didn’t want to look to Greenwald like that made you biased (for some reason) so you stepped in where you shouldn’t have. This will not end until you’re on her front lawn with boom box held high over your head.

    Also, because it can never be linked enough times.

  224. 224.

    Kola Noscopy

    @A Humble Lurker:

    Thanks for linking to what I wrote, Fumbled Lurcher.

    I stand by every single word. The universe of human sexuality doesn’t conform, thankfully, to your small-minded need for black and white categories and boundaries. Embrace the gray.

    Your fantasies about John and ACL continue to be juvenile and borderline stalkerish. Grow up.

Comments are closed.