• Menu
  • Skip to primary navigation
  • Skip to main content
  • Skip to primary sidebar

Before Header

  • About Us
  • Lexicon
  • Contact Us
  • Our Store
  • ↑
  • ↓
  • ←
  • →

Balloon Juice

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Anyone who bans teaching American history has no right to shape America’s future.

White supremacy is terrorism.

We cannot abandon the truth and remain a free nation.

In my day, never was longer.

So it was an October Surprise A Day, like an Advent calendar but for crime.

You come for women, you’re gonna get your ass kicked.

You cannot shame the shameless.

Historically it was a little unusual for the president to be an incoherent babbling moron.

Bark louder, little dog.

There are a lot more evil idiots than evil geniuses.

Why is it so hard for them to condemn hate?

Red lights blinking on democracy’s dashboard

But frankly mr. cole, I’ll be happier when you get back to telling us to go fuck ourselves.

If you’re pissed about Biden’s speech, he was talking about you.

If you are in line to indict donald trump, stay in line.

The Supreme Court cannot be allowed to become the ultimate, unaccountable arbiter of everything.

Happy indictment week to all who celebrate!

The Giant Orange Man Baby is having a bad day.

When your entire life is steeped in white supremacy, equality feels like discrimination.

Quote tweet friends, screenshot enemies.

Bad news for Ron DeSantis is great news for America.

The GOP is a fucking disgrace.

That pie keeps getting more and more forks, reducing anyone’s chance of even a Perot.

New McCarthy, same old McCarthyism.

Mobile Menu

  • Four Directions Montana
  • Donate with Venmo, Zelle & PayPal
  • Site Feedback
  • War in Ukraine
  • Submit Photos to On the Road
  • Politics
  • On The Road
  • Open Threads
  • Topics
  • COVID-19 Coronavirus
  • Authors
  • About Us
  • Contact Us
  • Lexicon
  • Our Store
  • Politics
  • Open Threads
  • War in Ukraine
  • Garden Chats
  • On The Road
  • 2021-22 Fundraising!
You are here: Home / Politics / Politicans / David Brooks Giving A Seminar At The Aspen Institute / An Exaltation of Larks, A Surfeit of Targets

An Exaltation of Larks, A Surfeit of Targets

by Tom Levenson|  February 1, 201212:11 am| 83 Comments

This post is in: David Brooks Giving A Seminar At The Aspen Institute, Daydream Believers, DC Press Corpse, Decline and Fall

FacebookTweetEmail

Maybe it really is too late.

Classical empires lasted centuries:  the Han Dynasty held sway for 400 years, barring that brief unpleasantness with Wang Mang.  The Romans had a similar run, depending on how you choose to bracket the rise and fall.  The Mongols were a little less permanent, but for all their brutal kin-slaughter approach to succession, they still managed to dominate Eurasia for a century and a half.  That empire on which the sun never set rose twice, in the eighteenth century, with British imperial ambition centered on North America, and then again in South Asia, the Pacific, and Africa from the latter half of the 1700s onwards, for quite a run.

The American Imperium?  Well if you count the continental expansion from Plymouth Rock and the Chesapeake west to San Francisco and the northwest rain belt — that’ll stick around for a while, I’m sure.  But our 100 years as the global power?  I’ve got no good feelings there.

That may not be so terrible.  Empires are not what you’d call friendly institutions.  But what depresses me even from within the comfort of my luxe corner of Faux America is the way the Wormtongues of our modern media village are working so hard to persuade us just to give up, to accept a world in which Mitt Romney is plausibly a President.

Others here and amongst our friends have written about just about everything that’s caught my horror-and-despair sensor in just the last 24 hours.  Brooks’ call for the running dogs of liberalism to take their turn growing turnips in the camps.  A breast cancer advocacy group choosing to kill women (welcome back ABL!) rather than suffer the taint of some of their dollars rubbing shoulders with other dollars that might pay for an abortion.  Theocrats with bully pulpits screaming victimhood unless the rest of us keep giving them tax breaks to discriminate.*  I’m exhausted by the very existence of Mitt Romney, and the fact that his whole candidacy is premised on the relentless repetition of the whatever distortion of the fabric of reality seems to play best at the moment.

But, as I say, the good folks that write this blog have been on the case — which is great, as it leaves me for now with just this little bit to add.

That would be that for all the willed and conscious bad faith that folks like Brooks sling so readily and so constantly; for all the sense that there was indeed something of an American promise, now betrayed by the figures celebrated and defended by our Village idiots; for all the three a.m. night-terrors at the thought of the world my son may inherit…for all of that, the real world of fact and reasoning can still rise up to bite the bozos in the ass.

Recall that Brooks called Murray’s book an account of “the most important trends in American society.”

And yet, strangely, that society for Murray, and hence for Brooks, includes only White Americans.  Which vision, if you are trying to study trends of significance for the next few decades, poses just a wee difficulty.  As I’m sure readers of this blog know, the numbers about these matters ain’t what they used to be, demographically speaking.

Via the US Census Bureau, we find that right now, the White non-Hispanic fraction of the US population comes in at roughly two thirds of the total.  You’d think that number counts as a datum in an important trend given that the proportion was around 88% in 1900, and remained as high as 75% in 1990.  Already, California is majority-minority, as are Texas, Hawaii and New Mexico — and most important, the entire nation will achieve that status sometime between 2040 and 2050.  And behind those blunt numbers lies a wealth of particular ways in which different people have figured out how to make it through each day; to take pleasure in life; to cook this or that flavor that would never have made it across the border when I was my son’s age; to make cultures that we may, if we’re far luckier than we seem at present to deserve, continue to weave into what we call American culture.

All of which is to say that daily, we live in a different country.  That’s more or less how I think of the current election:  either we try to work with that country as it continuously rearranges itself — or we live with the delusions of folks like Brooks who want to pretend that the last 50 years didn’t happen and the next 50 won’t.

In my better moments, I can see past the bluster and the facile assertions of this or that immutable trend — and smell the fear lies behind every word.  I have no idea what the United States of my dotage will be like; I do know that it will not resemble whatever fantasy tthat Brooks uses to sent himself off to sleep each night.

Which, amidst all the mounds of steaming horsesh*t that we mush navigate each day, still gives me hope.  And schadenfreude.

*Why yes.  I am trawling for a Moore Award.  Why do you ask?

Image:  Albrecht Dürer, Emperor Maximillian I, 1519

FacebookTweetEmail
Previous Post: « I wish I knew how to quit Newt
Next Post: Arizona GOP: I Spit On Your Union Grave »

Reader Interactions

83Comments

  1. 1.

    Nom de Plume

    February 1, 2012 at 12:22 am

    either we try to work with that country as it continuously rearranges itself—or we live with the delusions of folks like Brooks who want to pretend that the last 50 years didn’t happen and the next 50 won’t.

    That’s a good summary. People need to somehow drive it through their heads that demographics are a force of nature. Go ahead and bitch about changing demographics, but you would do just as well to shake your fist at a thunderstorm. People have migrated since before history.

    When certain people say “take my country back”, they bloody well mean it. They mean take it back in time. And they’re serious, they really think they can do that.

  2. 2.

    trollhattan

    February 1, 2012 at 12:23 am

    …working so hard to persuade us just to give up, to accept a world in which Mitt Romney is plausibly a President.

    The last time I felt so discomforted by a Republican candidate was W in 2000, and I knew far less of him than I do of Mittens. It’s not a flattering comparison, either (W could actually have the edge).

    Yet, Mittens seems to emit some sort of Romney Rays(tm) that have otherwise bright folks like Benen giving him the benefit of considerable doubts and presuming he’ll magically turn normal upon election.

    I don’t share this belief for one second.

  3. 3.

    slag

    February 1, 2012 at 12:26 am

    Tom, I love your perspective, so please don’t take this the wrong way…methinks you are overwriting your posts of late. Speak from the heart, man. Don’t be shy.

  4. 4.

    The Fat Kate Middleton

    February 1, 2012 at 12:27 am

    And I think it’s important to remember what the Hapsburgs eventually came to:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_II_of_Spain

  5. 5.

    Comrade Mary

    February 1, 2012 at 12:28 am

    Who the FUCK is the condescending, racist twerp talking to Sharpton on MSNBC right now?

    (Sorry, have nothing cogent to say about a thoughtful post, but I haven’t wanted to punch someone in the throat so badly for ages.)

  6. 6.

    Tom levenson

    February 1, 2012 at 12:29 am

    @slag: ‘course I’m going to take this the wrong way! ;)

    You could be right. But what is a blog for if you can’t bellow from time to time?

  7. 7.

    cckids

    February 1, 2012 at 12:33 am

    @Comrade Mary:

    Who the FUCK is the condescending, racist twerp talking to Sharpton on MSNBC right now?

    I asked that same question; my 17-yr old daughter, after tuning in for 30 seconds, said “Some Republican asshole”.

    Works for me.

    *actually, I guess he works in some capacity for the Newt.

  8. 8.

    The Snarxist Formerly Known As Kryptik

    February 1, 2012 at 12:34 am

    You sound far more optimistic than me, friend. Sadly, the way I’m seeing it is a GOP and a right-wing that sees the storm on the horizon, which is precisely why they’re doing everything they can now to ensure their bullshit is fully entrenched for decades to come, and winning beyond all measure on that scale. Global Warming is essentially a dead issue in this country, abortion is functionally outlawed in more than half the country now, most of the country still seems like they’d rather lord and worship the 1% than dare allow higher taxes when push comes to shove, more Right-To-Work spreads while Unions wither and die…and did I mention the disenfranchisement? That’s the other thing, that demographic shift is almost assured to be completely blunted by voter disenfranchsement under the guise of ‘anti-fraud’. Most of this shit being entrenched in little under 2 fucking years.

    I see so precious little to be optimistic about now. I mean, even with Obama as president, it feels like the die is cast especially with the fuckwits that populate Congress stonewalling everything and the GOP essentially owning the rest of the country on the state level. And even if we somehow manage to get majorities in to turn the tide, it’ll take decades to pull things out, by which time the country will probably have already decided ‘You libby libs had your time, GOP TOTAL CONTROL FOR 30 YEARS!!!!’

  9. 9.

    slag

    February 1, 2012 at 12:34 am

    @Tom levenson: Oh don’t get me wrong…I fully support bellowing. Barbaric yawps are symphonic. Especially when they emanate more from the diaphragm than from the cranial cavities.

    ETA Not that I don’t appreciate the craft…I really do!

    ETA (2) On second thought, ignore me. I’ve been way too particular lately what with the world not bending to my will on a minutely basis. I should just shut up now and ride the wave.

  10. 10.

    Jewish Steel

    February 1, 2012 at 12:36 am

    I think your prose is as clear and harmonious as ever, Tom.

  11. 11.

    jl

    February 1, 2012 at 12:48 am

    Majority minority demographics is working out pretty good so far in California. No Republican state office holders. With more honest districts on the way, promise of fewer GOPper in state leg or Congress. People are friendly.

    Come on board, America!

  12. 12.

    Eric U.

    February 1, 2012 at 12:50 am

    I thought GWB would turn reasonable after he was elected. I was sadly mistaken. There is no center to Mitt, so there is no reason to think you can predict what would happen. The second term Mitt might be acceptable, but I doubt first-term Mitt would be good for the country

  13. 13.

    Skippy-san

    February 1, 2012 at 12:51 am

    I think you need to re-read Brooks and the rest for a quite different point. Its not the death of White America, its the death of an English descended America, which anyone regardless of race or gender was supposed to assimilate into. Murray is watching idiocy like Scottish independence movements and rightfully wondering how the Brits got there and how we could too.

  14. 14.

    DanielX

    February 1, 2012 at 12:53 am

    @Nom de Plume:

    That’s a good summary. People need to somehow drive it through their heads that demographics are a force of nature. Go ahead and bitch about changing demographics, but you would do just as well to shake your fist at a thunderstorm. People have migrated since before history. When certain people say “take my country back”, they bloody well mean it. They mean take it back in time. And they’re serious, they really think they can do that.

    That’s pretty much the long and short of it, and that’s what is really yanking Bobo’s weenie (and Murray’s too). Barring civil war or mass vote suppression, whites are going to lose more and more political power to black and brown people over the next 25-30 years, and there’s no escaping that reality. It has not escaped the notice of those in the current political power structure that black and brown elected officials are probably going to have somewhat different priorities. That is, priorities other than covering the failed bets of Wall Street, putting half of discretionary spending into defense, and screaming about socialism whenever a program is introduced that actually shows promise of having a positive effect on the average citizen’s life.

    The process of political change is occurring now. It seems to have (finally!) come to the notice of working class Americans (however you define working class) that whether they like black or brown people or not, they have more in common with Those People, politically speaking, than they do with the likes of Lloyd Blankfein or Jamie Dimon. Or, for that matter, Mitt Romney.

    From Brook’s perspective, can’t have that. Proles actually feeling some sense of class solidarity, getting above their station by the very act of thinking about class distinctions? Re-educate them!

  15. 15.

    SIA

    February 1, 2012 at 12:57 am

    I’m exhausted by the very existence of Mitt Romney

    Best sentence EVAH

  16. 16.

    Linkmeister

    February 1, 2012 at 1:04 am

    “to cook this or that flavor”

    How the hell did you know I made taco salad tonight?

  17. 17.

    Roger Moore

    February 1, 2012 at 1:06 am

    @Nom de Plume:

    People need to somehow drive it through their heads that demographics are a force of nature. Go ahead and bitch about changing demographics, but you would do just as well to shake your fist at a thunderstorm. People have migrated since before history.

    Of course you can do something about demographics, provided you’re not constrained by moral scruples. Look at how effective African American demographics were in earning political power in the American South from 1789 to 1964. I’m pretty sure that’s part of the wingnuts’ proposed solution to demographic changes in the US. They may also look to the Czech and Polish solution to their German minorities in the post-WWII era. And, of course, there are even more drastic solutions available to the utterly evil.

  18. 18.

    jl

    February 1, 2012 at 1:06 am

    @Skippy-san:

    I don’t understand what Murray, or maybe you, mean by ‘Scottish independence movements and rightfully wondering how the Brits got there’

    The English got there by taking over the place and crushing its culture, impoverishing and persecuting the Scots.

    I do not remember a constitutional convention where Ireland, Wales and Scotland agreed to union with the English.

    Feelings are better now, after the English upper class decided a little over a century ago, that Scotland was ‘high class’ for vacations, nature tours, hunting and fishing, and of course, playing the hilarious and asinine game called golf.

    If Murray is watching Scottish independence movements and worrying that will happen in the US, then that shows how well his head works.

    Unless of course, he is thinking about maybe the reactionary whites of this country trying to secede again. But somehow I doubt that.

  19. 19.

    Linkmeister

    February 1, 2012 at 1:07 am

    @Eric U.: I suspect a first-term Mitt would be so beholden to the Tea Partiers who will claim they put him over the top that he’d do extensive damage to the country.

  20. 20.

    burnspbesq

    February 1, 2012 at 1:08 am

    Tonight’s “que lastima” moment is courtesy of Steve Benen:

    Rep. Dan Burton (R) of Indiana, facing another serious primary challenger, announced this morning that he will not seek re-election.

    http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/01/31/10280340-dan-burton-exits-stage-right

  21. 21.

    Arundel

    February 1, 2012 at 1:15 am

    “Classical empires lasted centuries.”- This is a bit of an aside, but it reminds me of a point made in one of the books I read in the 90’s that had a profound effect on me: Voltaire’s Bastards: The Dictatorship of Reason in the West by John Ralston Saul. I read it when Gingrich was raging and the idea that smaller government, drownable in the bathtub, was self-evidently a virtuous thing. And that continues to this day in our mainstream media, that “smaller” government is inherently desirable. This is taken as a truth, but it’s never explained why this is true. It seems a peculiarly American thing.

    In this book, John Ralston Saul notes that the Roman Empire functioned competently for four centuries across a sprawling dominion, with a vast beauracracy to administer it. With varying timeframes, so did empires and mini-empires like the British, Dutch, Ottoman, Venetian, even the Vatican. Size of “government” is value-neutral; throughout history, empires did quite well with huge beauracracies, departments, agencies. Size and scale had nothing to do with it- “scalable” was considered an admirable quality in say, Internet companies last I looked- you hire people as the job gets bigger. The Roman Empire was a rather big job to oversee.

    No one criticizes megacoporations for their size, but this peculiar idea that American government should be as small as possible- well, I wish they’d tell us why this is inherently a positive. They can’t, because it actually isn’t. We’re 300 million people. A decent civil service on that scale is the least we deserve. But the jackals of privatization and deregulation and plunder simply can’t say that. There’s actually nothing wrong with the scale of “Big Government”- we’re a damned big country. The way right-wingers talk openly of shrinking, strangling government of any kind.. well I’d be hard pressed to think of another Western country where such sentiments are so mainstreamed and not considered treason.

  22. 22.

    jj

    February 1, 2012 at 1:17 am

    You’re going to have to do a lot better than that for a Moore Award. The choosing to kill women-argument is a nice start, but ratchet it up a notch – compare them to Nazis or tobacco companies or something. That’s how you get a Moore Award.

  23. 23.

    jl

    February 1, 2012 at 1:17 am

    @Roger Moore: Your comment made me think that there is a safe and sane, moral and ethical, perfectly proper way to speed the arrival of majority minority demographics for each and everyone of these great United States.

    Send a copy of the silly column Brooks just wrote and send to all of your conservative white friends and relatives. Point out to them the advantages of acting all nice, repressed and proper better class of whites.

    Tell them to scare their kids away from sex or having kids, in order to preserve the family wealth, and emulate their whitey betters.

  24. 24.

    Joey Maloney

    February 1, 2012 at 1:17 am

    As happy as I am to see Watermelon Dan leaving elected office, I can’t imagine his replacement will be any better.

  25. 25.

    dogwood

    February 1, 2012 at 1:18 am

    @trollhattan:

    The last time I felt so discomforted by a Republican candidate was W in 2000, and I knew far less of him than I do of Mittens. It’s not a flattering comparison, either (W could actually have the edge).

    W was a guy with decent political skills, but no actual world view or political view beyond tax breaks for the rich and handouts to oil companies. What did W’s presidency in was the fact that his bravado masked his personal insecurity. He wasn’t confident enough to bring his father’s people on board. In fact he put some of his father’s enemies like Rumsfeld in key positions and took their world view as his own. A Romney presidency will be trouble because even though he is smarter than W he has no political skills and no secure place in the party. He will do whatever it takes to keep the right wingers happy even if it means going against his own judgment.

  26. 26.

    burnspbesq

    February 1, 2012 at 1:23 am

    That’s quite a snake you’ve got there, mister.

    Actually, this isn’t even a tiny bit funny. As if we don’t have enough environmental problems in this country, we keep throwing non-native species into the mix, with predictably terrible results.

  27. 27.

    pseudonymous in nc

    February 1, 2012 at 1:24 am

    folks like Brooks who want to pretend that the last 50 years didn’t happen and the next 50 won’t.

    I’ll go further — Bobo’s sense of what happened 50 years ago wasn’t actually what happened 50 years ago, but is instead what got shown on TV 50 years ago. Let’s call it the “Leave It To Bobo” model of nostalgia for Monochrome America.

  28. 28.

    burnspbesq

    February 1, 2012 at 1:29 am

    As long as there are people like Fintan O’Toole about, there is still hope for Ireland.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2012/0103/1224309734610.html

  29. 29.

    jl

    February 1, 2012 at 1:30 am

    @pseudonymous in nc: We can guess where Brooks got all of his childhood experiences, then.

  30. 30.

    Amir Khalid

    February 1, 2012 at 1:32 am

    America has had a decent post-WWII run as an empire version 2.0, i.e. a superpower. It was fun while it lasted, I’m sure, but now the ruinous costs and the limits of superpowering are starting to make themselves felt. They’e already done one superpower in, the USSR, and the USA should get out of the game before it goes the same way. Enjoy the memories of “leadership of the free world” and the lingering prestige, but don’t kid yourselves that America needs to bestride the world again. No nation ever really did.

    Oh, by the way: please advise the blog host that from here the loading time problem only seems to be getting worse.

  31. 31.

    pseudonymous in nc

    February 1, 2012 at 1:35 am

    @Skippy-san:

    Murray is watching idiocy like Scottish independence movements and rightfully wondering how the Brits got there and how we could too.

    The SNP may shit its own bed on that one; from what I can tell, the Scots are very happy with the kind of devolved powers that keep right-wing assholes from fucking them over down in London. Canadians were like that with the separatists, voting for them on the basis of all their policies apart from separatism.

    @jl:

    I do not remember a constitutional convention where Ireland, Wales and Scotland agreed to union with the English.

    Oh, calm the fuck down with the Braveheart act. The Scots bankrupted themselves trying to establish an independent foreign empire in Panama, and went to the English cap in hand for union. That doesn’t excuse the clearances or countless other crappy instances of the sassanachs fucking over the Scots, but the Act of Union itself was far more of a constitutional settlement than the Irish or Welsh got.

  32. 32.

    PanurgeATL

    February 1, 2012 at 1:38 am

    @pseudonymous in nc:

    Ding, ding!

    Actually, when it comes to certain things, in particular men’s fashion and grooming and the built environment, conservatives have done an absolutely bang-up job (with the unwitting aid of hipster “postmodernists”) in implementing this model. And all the McMansions and “neo-traditional” buildings will lock in at least some of that mindspace’s hold for a long time unless somebody gets busy fixing Modernism (which does seem to be making some comeback) or doing something genuinely new.

  33. 33.

    Yutsano

    February 1, 2012 at 1:45 am

    @Arundel:

    There’s actually nothing wrong with the scale of “Big Government”- we’re a damned big country. The way right-wingers talk openly of shrinking, strangling government of any kind.. well I’d be hard pressed to think of another Western country where such sentiments are so mainstreamed and not considered treason.

    If there is even the remotest possibility that someone other than a white straight Christian male will benefit from a government program, then it must be derided and destroyed as wasteful. It’s not about the size, it’s about who gets the benefits of a large government. And rich white men don’t like sharing if they don;t have to.

  34. 34.

    John Weiss

    February 1, 2012 at 1:56 am

    Brooks: pffft.

    Why does anyone pay attention to that rat’s ass?

  35. 35.

    Roger Moore

    February 1, 2012 at 2:01 am

    @pseudonymous in nc:

    I’ll go further—Bobo’s sense of what happened 50 years ago wasn’t actually what happened 50 years ago, but is instead what got shown on TV 50 years ago.

    Or, at the very least, it was what happened in nice middle class white neighborhoods 50 years ago. He didn’t get to see much of what was happening in poor white neighborhoods, poor black neighborhoods, or desperately poor rural areas. And I doubt he saw exactly how his nice middle class white neighborhood managed to stay 100% white.

  36. 36.

    Sarah Proud and Tall

    February 1, 2012 at 2:32 am

    I am trawling for a Moore Award.  Why do you ask?

    There’s a category tag for that, you know.

    How do I adore thee, Mr Levenson? After a particularly crappy day, this post made me smile.

    Empires come and go, but nations are sometimes a little more resilient, I suspect. I wish Mr Brooks and his kind long life, so they can watch this country veer ever further from what they think it was and what they hope it will be. I wish them a long dotage, which they can spend ranting about the good old days and becoming ever more irrelevant.

  37. 37.

    Sarah Proud and Tall

    February 1, 2012 at 2:36 am

    @cckids:

    my 17-yr old daughter, after tuning in for 30 seconds, said “Some Republican asshole”

    I hope you immediately chided her for her potty mouth commended her for her acute political insight.

  38. 38.

    Origuy

    February 1, 2012 at 2:41 am

    @pseudonymous in nc: Darien was a damfool idea, but London did everything possible to ensure it failed. The Clearances were the fault of the Scottish nobility more than the English; another example of the 1% screwing over the majority.

  39. 39.

    Yutsano

    February 1, 2012 at 2:42 am

    @Sarah Proud and Tall:

    I wish Mr Brooks and his kind long life, so they can watch this country veer ever further from what they think it was and what they hope it will be.

    It already has, several times over. They just chose to ignore the warning signs even though it was blatantly screaming into their faces. Genies cannot be put back into bottles. This country is on an inevitable course to social and economic justice and universal health care. Bobo just thinks he can stop what is already inevitable.

  40. 40.

    jl

    February 1, 2012 at 2:48 am

    @pseudonymous in nc: Oh, yeah, I’m still so mad about those English devils I’m reaching for my claymore right now. Or, whatever.

    Your little potted history is irrelevant to what the majority of the ordinary Scots felt, and the feelings of the majority of the common people are what fuels independence movements.

    Anyway, Murray is kind of unimaginative, and frankly goofy, if the Scottish independence movement is the scariest one he can find to worry about. Probably alarmed by the human sacrifices going on in the Holyrood chamber.

    So, if I left out some of the BS schemes of the country’s elites that led to the union, so what? My point stands.

    Edited for typos, including changing Hollyrood to Holyrood. Some aspects of Scottish independence remind me of Hollywood, for some reason.

  41. 41.

    FlipYrWhig

    February 1, 2012 at 2:56 am

    @Yutsano: Even then they don’t see it as “benefiting from a government program.” Perish the thought. No, they see it as getting back what they paid in for their whole lives. IOW, it’s not government money, it’s their own hard-earned cash coming back home.

  42. 42.

    The prophet Nostradumbass

    February 1, 2012 at 2:57 am

    @burnspbesq: I do like Fintan O’Toole, I found him through a link on Slugger O’Toole (no relation, HA).

  43. 43.

    The prophet Nostradumbass

    February 1, 2012 at 3:03 am

    On another subject, for some reason Juan Cole has decided to let Taylor Marsh flog her PUMA “book” on his blog.

  44. 44.

    Cacti

    February 1, 2012 at 3:10 am

    @DanielX:

    Barring civil war or mass vote suppression, whites are going to lose more and more political power to black and brown people over the next 25-30 years, and there’s no escaping that reality. It has not escaped the notice of those in the current political power structure that black and brown elected officials are probably going to have somewhat different priorities.

    That’s why they so completely lost their shit with the election of President Obama.

    In Obama, they saw the vanguard of the 21st century electoral calculus, one in which carrying 55% of the white vote is no longer a king-maker.

    In Obama they saw the death of the “southern strategy” that has sustained them for 5 decades.

    I expect they’ll grow even more frantic and reactionary as the curtain continues to fall.

  45. 45.

    freelancer

    February 1, 2012 at 3:19 am

    I went bowling tonight, I don’t mean to brag…

  46. 46.

    Calouste

    February 1, 2012 at 3:20 am

    @Skippy-san:

    Nothing to do with the fact that Scotland existed as an independent country for the best part of a millenium and still had their own language, laws, legal system, banknotes, national church, sports teams, and a whole host of other things even after they became part of the United Kingdom?

    It would be f’ing surprising if they didn’t have an independence movement.

  47. 47.

    The prophet Nostradumbass

    February 1, 2012 at 3:24 am

    @Calouste: Er, when do you think Scotland became part of Great Britain?

    ETA: changed UK to Great Britain.

  48. 48.

    Odie Hugh Manatee

    February 1, 2012 at 3:26 am

    @slag:

    Too many on our side take the short route to expressing an opinion or explaining something. There’s something to be said about reading something that is thoughtful, actually says something and is interesting to read. Even a few members here take the short route too often and it’s nice to read something of substance.

    People like Dengre, Thomas and ABL have something to say and I enjoy reading it.

    PS: I caught your post @ #9, just politely expressing another view! :)

  49. 49.

    Chuck Butcher

    February 1, 2012 at 3:29 am

    Holy shit. Maybe a lot of you are mistaking Democratic voting in the face of GOP blatant racism with liberal/progressive leanings. There are a shit load of other than white conservatives with a choice of racism or Democrats and that won’t hold forever.

    A whole lot of you made the same damn mistake regarding gun owners in the other direction and it took some lost elections for Democrats to get the fucking idea and I do think Democrats are a bit smarter than GOPers. It will take them some real time to get past the racist bullshit, but the costs will eventually dissuade them – or they’ll get replaced with another version.

    (edit) yes, regarding Gore and Kerry both the exit polling says that minus their publicized gun stances they’d have won by not losing the votes they could have had without that factor. You can make statements about how “smart” that was for voters, but I offer the GOP and its stances on race.

  50. 50.

    Origuy

    February 1, 2012 at 4:03 am

    @The prophet Nostradumbass:
    Great Britain was created when the Scottish Parliament dissolved in 1707. The Union of the Crowns in 1603 brought England and Scotland together under James the Sixth and First, but Scotland was administered from Edinburgh. When Scotland started is hard to say, but according to legend Kenneth MacAlpin united the Scots and the Picts around 840. Except for about 22 years under Edward I and II, Scotland was pretty much independent for 800 years or so.

  51. 51.

    Arundel

    February 1, 2012 at 4:25 am

    About The Scottish Question in Britain: The prevailing temperament in England is, go the fuck ahead and secede, we won’t miss you. Good luck!

    I side with the English here. Because the Scots really, really enjoyed the privileges that came with being part of the British Empire. Now that it doesn’t suit them, they’re in a pout. Ha, too bad.

    My parents are both from Ireland, the Republic and the UK North (b.1937 and 1939). Both with a tremendous love for Ireland, and aware of the massive assaults, rapes and raids against the Irish. It was simply life and the truth. They weren’t terrorist supporters. My mom was a midwife in England, bicycling among villages when she was young. English people and irish people were meant to be at odds, but life is complex.

    You know who really hated the Irish though? The Scots. So it’s funny to see them claiming their Gaelic and their Celtic ethnicity when they’ve spent 150 years denying it. Scots people loathed Irish rebels as they enjoyed the protections of the British Empire. Scots people have stepped on Ireland and never apparently given a fuck about “Celtic heritage”. Scottish people have always been immensely meanspirited towards Ireland and it’s rebellions towards the Empire that Scottish people have embraced . Suddenly they’re all about their Gaelic and their fake-ass kilts and such 19th century inventions, fake-ass history.

    Oh, suddenly now the union with the UK is inconvenient? Suddenly now you don’t want to bow to the crown? Well, maybe Ireland had a point in resisting that, no? Scottish people will be the last to ever say that, because they really are annoying and cheap and meanspirited with a tad of hate in their hearts. (Check the bios of the worst Republican televangelist scum in the US, they’re all from Scots Ulsterman stock, as in “invasion of”. “Plantation” doesn’t do it justice. )

    I’m Irish, but I like English people far better. Good luck with your petulant Scottish secession! Cheap ass bitter meanspirited Irish-hating fuckos. I’ve never met more pinched, snide and bitter people than the Scots. Working-class themselves, they condescended to my face when I was a kid because I was Irish, here in America. Someone to feel superior to! I was 9. So great Scots are rediscovering their great Celtic heritage. How fucking convenient.

  52. 52.

    Skippy-san

    February 1, 2012 at 4:32 am

    @Calouste:

    Scottish independence would be disastorous for both England and Scotland, not to mention the last thing the world needs right now is another nation. There are about 140 too many as it is.

    Of course if I had my way-Britain would still rule 1/4 of the planet. Rule Britannia

  53. 53.

    Pat In Massachusetts

    February 1, 2012 at 5:43 am

    @Arundel: My mom was from the Republic of Ireland too so I found your post interesting.

    Speaking of how sour and unreasonable Scots are, we have to look no further than to John McCain! Remember the debate picture, where he is “stalking” behind Obama on stage? Now that was a scary Scotsman!

  54. 54.

    Fucen Pneumatic Fuck Wrench Tarmal

    February 1, 2012 at 5:50 am

    @Chuck Butcher:

    this.

    absolutely there is evidence that many non-default americans aren’t so liberal after all. of course compare that with what they KNOW they will get from republicans, and thus there isn’t really a choice.

    i also know personally, numerous gun owners who were democrats on social and economic issues, or would have been. once they started tuning their cultural radios to the right side of the dial, they lost contact with why they should resist any of the programming.

    i don’t know if i can imagine a gop that doesn’t use race as an agent of fermentation. i do know that it would be the next great transformation.

  55. 55.

    MikeJ

    February 1, 2012 at 5:50 am

    @Skippy-san:

    Of course if I had my way-Britain would still rule 1/4 of the planet. Rule Britannia

    You like Cameron much more than I.

  56. 56.

    Jeffro

    February 1, 2012 at 6:04 am

    @Cacti: Yup!

    In Obama they saw the death of the “southern strategy” that has sustained them for 5 decades.

    That is 110% dead on. A (relatively) young African-American from (relatively) out of nowhere beat a well-connected establishment Republican, and a ‘war hero’ at that.

  57. 57.

    Raven

    February 1, 2012 at 6:06 am

    @Pat In Massachusetts: And that asshole Jim Webb.

  58. 58.

    Citizen_X

    February 1, 2012 at 6:12 am

    @Arundel: Fucking bigot.

  59. 59.

    harlana

    February 1, 2012 at 6:22 am

    haha, Morning Ho made the mistake of wearing what Mika calls a “Thurston Howell” sweater this morning – she seems to be smacking him around a bit these days which is hard with the endless blustery interruptions. Like this morning, and his little male minions just sit their and grin silently like self-conscious, naughty schoolboys.

  60. 60.

    harlana

    February 1, 2012 at 6:28 am

    i think i will term that “Halperinesque” behavior

  61. 61.

    Viva BrisVegas

    February 1, 2012 at 6:33 am

    @Arundel:

    You know who really hated the Irish though? The Scots. So it’s funny to see them claiming their Gaelic and their Celtic ethnicity

    Just for future reference Scots is not a Celtic ethnicity, it’s a Germanic one. Lowland Scots were a northern branch of the Saxon invasion of England. These are the people who later migrated to northern Ireland and formed the Scots-Irish.

    Gaels in Scotland are mostly limited to the highlands and islands.

  62. 62.

    magurakurin

    February 1, 2012 at 6:41 am

    @Arundel: wow. That’s a World Cup level rant.

    Made me think of this

    It’s shite being Scottish

  63. 63.

    Linda Featheringill

    February 1, 2012 at 6:49 am

    Minority, majority, whatever:

    A few years ago, the city of Cleveland reached the turning point where whites were in the minority. The Plain Dealer featured the story on the front page and all of us, of all colors, stood around and said “Hmmm.”

    But the interesting thing that happened was that nothing happened. The good in Cleveland remained good and the bad in Cleveland remained bad. The trains still ran sort of on time and the sun came up in the East every morning.

    I don’t know if this experience will translate well into a whole nation where us white folks are sliding into the minority. But it might. Maybe we could just keep on chugging along.

    Changes in ethnic/racial makeup in the US are not going to alter other problems. We’ll still have to deal with climate change, rising sea level, peak oil, and a capitalist system that is going to have to adjust its goals or collapse. We’ll just look a little different while we try to cope with these changes.

  64. 64.

    DanielX

    February 1, 2012 at 6:59 am

    @Joey Maloney:

    I’m sorry to say that you underestimate the level of idiocy among Indiana voters. It is distinctly possible that we’ll do worse than Dan Burton, though I admit that on the shithead scale of 1 to 10, good ol’ Danny rates at least an 8. He hasn’t quite reached the depths of Louie Gohmert or Crazy Eyes Bachman.

  65. 65.

    Arclite

    February 1, 2012 at 7:09 am

    Others here and amongst our friends have written about just about everything that’s caught my horror-and-despair sensor in just the last 24 hours. Brooks’ call for the running dogs of liberalism to take their turn growing turnips in the camps. A breast cancer advocacy group choosing to kill women (welcome back ABL!) rather than suffer the taint of some of their dollars rubbing shoulders with other dollars that might pay for an abortion. Theocrats with bully pulpits screaming victimhood unless the rest of us keep giving them tax breaks to discriminate.* I’m exhausted by the very existence of Mitt Romney, and the fact that his whole candidacy is premised on the relentless repetition of the whatever distortion of the fabric of reality seems to play best at the moment.

    These are at best minor distractions. Well, maybe if Mitt became president that would accelerate the US decline, but everything else is just bumps in the road, and there have always been bumps in the road in the history of this great nation. But why worry about bumps in the road when the car engine is on fire, there’s a bomb in the trunk, and you’re about to drive off a cliff? Just consider:

    * Continuous foreign military adventurism, overseas bases, and an unnecessarily large standing military continues to drive up the debt to record levels.
    * Global warming threatens to turn the US breadbasket into an unusable desert and flood coastal areas where millions of Americans currently live.
    * Relatedly, the breadbasket is currently irrigated using the Ogallala aquifer, which is being over pumped and could run out of water in as little as 25 years. It supplies water to 30% of us cropland.
    * World oil production has remained flat since 2005 despite some very high prices. Peak oil is here. Expect wildly fluctuating prices, and then oil production decline within a decade, maybe a bit longer.
    * With oil in decline, look for natural gas to start to replace oil as a fuel of choice. Fracking will become necessary over large sections of the USA, poisoning a lot of wells and causing earthquakes.
    * Don’t count on the green economy to rescue us. The Chinese control a stunning 95% of the supply of rare earth metals used in producing all electronic devices, including windmills and lithium batteries for cars. There are no substitutes, and the Chinese also now have all the expertise to produce them. The rest of the world is literally 20 years behind. As they continue to ramp up, expect them to divert supplies to their own needs.

    These are huge, vital issues. Some affect the very existence of American lives. Others can doom our nation to third world status if not correctly and deftly addressed. Honestly, I could care less Komen or Brooks. They are minnows, and we need to fry grouper and shark.

  66. 66.

    mothra

    February 1, 2012 at 7:26 am

    A good post,Tom…

  67. 67.

    amk

    February 1, 2012 at 7:28 am

    brits pull the knighthood of discredited ex rbs chief and the bidness peeps aren’t happy about it.

  68. 68.

    Belafon (formerly anonevent)

    February 1, 2012 at 7:42 am

    I figure in when they look back on us and write our history, we’ll be viewed as a continuation of the British Empire.

  69. 69.

    Don Quijote

    February 1, 2012 at 7:42 am

    White is a made up ethnicity, the Irish were not considered White in the nineteenth century, neither were Italians or Eastern European Jews, today they are all Whites.
    My guess is that in the not too far future as second generation Asians and Hispanics marry Whites, their children will be considered Whites.
    The definition of White will expand in such a fashion that 75% to 80% of the population will be White. Basically anyone who is not of African descent will redefined as White.

  70. 70.

    greennotGreen

    February 1, 2012 at 8:01 am

    Tom, don’t you teach college? Aren’t you surrounded by young people? They’re our hope. They’re why bigots fighting gay rights are trying to hold back the ocean, why the very idea that a white majority is desirable is on its way out. Look at the chart, and buck up, m’laddie.

  71. 71.

    gene108

    February 1, 2012 at 8:16 am

    @Joey Maloney:

    He’s leaving office because of primary challenges, which I assume are people further to the right than he is.

    His replacement, therefore will be worse, unless a Dem can pick up the seat because the primary winner will be so whacked out.

  72. 72.

    Samara Morgan

    February 1, 2012 at 9:09 am

    That is why i keep reccomending Nobel Prize winner Johan Galtung’s The Fall of the US Empire…And Then What?
    He postulates that the US will either descend into fascism or blossom as a kind of Switzerland of creativity and generosity after it is forced out of the empire business.
    Galtung is the father of Peace and Conflict Doctrine.
    His daughter was on Utoya.
    She is The Girl That Lived.

    it is globally and empirically obvious that the US Empire is falling.
    the only humans that deny that are the conservative part of America.

  73. 73.

    Paul in KY

    February 1, 2012 at 9:40 am

    @Eric U.: If you thought GWB would be reasonable, you should doubt any and all of your political ruminations.

  74. 74.

    Paul in KY

    February 1, 2012 at 9:43 am

    @burnspbesq: People need to trap them & eat them. Lot of meat on a big python.

  75. 75.

    Paul in KY

    February 1, 2012 at 9:46 am

    @The prophet Nostradumbass: 1730 or thereabouts?

  76. 76.

    cat

    February 1, 2012 at 10:19 am

    either we try to work with that country as it continuously rearranges itself—or we live with the delusions of folks like Brooks who want to pretend that the last 50 years didn’t happen and the next 50 won’t.

    You are being to generous to Brooks. He and his kind don’t want the last 50 years rolled back, they want last 500.

    They want to take us back to a time when well breed white men rulled and nobody made complaints about the injustice of it all or if they did the sheriffs promptly put them in their place.

  77. 77.

    kth

    February 1, 2012 at 10:26 am

    Murray isn’t saying that non-whites don’t matter, but that by considering only whites, one can discount any racist effect and concentrate on why it’s those white proles’ own fault if they are poor. We should probably get his argument right; not that an asshole like Murray is entitled to be read correctly, but because this argument is likely to be ubiquitous among the Beltway well-heeled and will only grow roots if it isn’t met directly (easy enough; Murray’s thinks, wrongly, that the effects of poverty (unstable marriages, incomplete education) are actually the causes of poverty).

  78. 78.

    cat

    February 1, 2012 at 10:31 am

    @Samara Morgan:

    Galtung is the father of Peace and Conflict Doctrine

    Hardly, The Art of War clearly lays out non-violent conflict resolution its just the majority of people can’t look past the fact the book also lays out violent conflict resolution as a viable alternative to non-violent.

  79. 79.

    ShadeTail

    February 1, 2012 at 10:53 am

    @trollhattan:

    Yet, Mittens seems to emit some sort of Romney Rays™ that have otherwise bright folks like Benen giving him the benefit of considerable doubts and presuming he’ll magically turn normal upon election.

    …? Say what? If you really think Mr. Benen believes that, then you haven’t been reading his articles for the past year or so.

  80. 80.

    Tom Levenson

    February 1, 2012 at 11:03 am

    @kth: You have a sort of good point. The issue I have with Murray is different fron that I have with Brooks. Brooks makes explicit the claim that is implicit in the presentation Murray’s book: that a study of class structure in White America maps appropriately on American as a whole –an assumption less and less in evidence.

    There’s more, but that’s what I got in the midst of the maelstrom.

  81. 81.

    pseudonymous in nc

    February 1, 2012 at 1:30 pm

    @Arundel:

    The prevailing temperament in England is, go the fuck ahead and secede, we won’t miss you. Good luck!

    I don’t know where you’re prevailing from, but I’m guessing it’s London and environs; contrariwise, an independent Scotland might well find its southern border running from Liverpool to Hull.

  82. 82.

    Samara Morgan

    February 2, 2012 at 5:48 am

    @cat: Galtung got a Nobel. Sun-Tzu has been dead since…..at least 500 BC?

    @Tom Levenson: oh, but Murray is spot on here.

    The graph represents the percentage of people who answered “extremely liberal” or “liberal” minus the percentage of people who answered “extremely conservative” or “conservative” in any given survey. I won’t go into the statistical details (for that, buy the book in a couple of years), but think of the classes this way:
    __
    Traditional Upper: Someone at the 95th percentile of income, with a graduate degree, who is a business executive, physician, engineer, etc.
    __
    Intellectual Upper: Also at the 95th percentile of income and with a graduate degree, but a lawyer, academic, scientist (hard or soft) outside academia, writer, in the news media, or a creator of entertainment programming (film and television).
    __
    Traditional Middle: Same occupations as the Traditional Uppers, but with just a bachelor’s degree and at the 75th percentile of income.
    __
    Technical Middle: Someone working in the many technical specialties that have proliferated in health, information technology, and industrial technology, with an associate’s degree and at the 50th percentile of income.
    __
    Working: Someone working in a skilled blue-collar job, with just a high school diploma and at the 25th percentile of income.
    __
    Lower: Someone working at a low-skill job who didn’t finish high school, at the 5th percentile of income.

    now think about it Levenson.
    who are the culture creators? the intellectual uppers, who are all extreme liberal.
    who are the culture consumers?
    everbody else.

  83. 83.

    Samara Morgan

    February 2, 2012 at 5:52 am

    Giving up in A-stan.

    its about time.
    ;)

Comments are closed.

Primary Sidebar

2024 Pet Calendars Spreadsheets

2024 Pet Calendar A (Nyms A-K)
2024 Pet Calendar A (Nyms L-Z)
2024 Pet Calendar B (Nyms A-K)
2024 Pet Calendar B (Nyms L-Z)

Recent Comments

  • lowtechcyclist on Cold Grey Pre-Dawn Open Thread: Elon Musk Blames All of Us (And We’re Glad to Take Credit) (Dec 2, 2023 @ 7:01am)
  • Mousebumples on Cold Grey Pre-Dawn Open Thread: Elon Musk Blames All of Us (And We’re Glad to Take Credit) (Dec 2, 2023 @ 7:00am)
  • Matt McIrvin on Cold Grey Pre-Dawn Open Thread: Elon Musk Blames All of Us (And We’re Glad to Take Credit) (Dec 2, 2023 @ 6:59am)
  • The Thin Black Duke on Cold Grey Pre-Dawn Open Thread: Elon Musk Blames All of Us (And We’re Glad to Take Credit) (Dec 2, 2023 @ 6:58am)
  • satby on Cold Grey Pre-Dawn Open Thread: Elon Musk Blames All of Us (And We’re Glad to Take Credit) (Dec 2, 2023 @ 6:53am)

🎈Keep Balloon Juice Ad Free

Become a Balloon Juice Patreon
Donate with Venmo, Zelle or PayPal

Balloon Juice Posts

View by Topic
View by Author
View by Month & Year
View by Past Author

Fundraising 2023-24

Wis*Dems Supreme Court + SD-8
Virginia House Races
Four Directions: Montana

Featuring

Medium Cool
Artists in Our Midst
Authors in Our Midst
We All Need A Little Kindness
What Has Biden Done for You Lately?

Calling All Jackals

Site Feedback
Nominate a Rotating Tag
Submit Photos to On the Road
Balloon Juice Mailing List Signup
Balloon Juice Anniversary (All Links)
Balloon Juice Anniversary (All Posts)

Balloon Juice for Ukraine

Donate

Twitter / Spoutible

Balloon Juice (Spoutible)
WaterGirl (Spoutible)
TaMara (Spoutible)
John Cole
DougJ (aka NYT Pitchbot)
Betty Cracker
Tom Levenson
David Anderson
Major Major Major Major
ActualCitizensUnited

Cole & Friends Learn Español

Introductory Post
Cole & Friends Learn Español

Four Directions Montana

Donate

Site Footer

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

  • Facebook
  • RSS
  • Twitter
  • YouTube
  • Comment Policy
  • Our Authors
  • Blogroll
  • Our Artists
  • Privacy Policy

Copyright © 2023 Dev Balloon Juice · All Rights Reserved · Powered by BizBudding Inc

Share this ArticleLike this article? Email it to a friend!

Email sent!