How do you all deal with chronic pain? I ran out of advil yesterday, so I didn’t take my morning dose of two pills to deal with my always aching shoulder and fingers. With my fingers it is an aching and throbbing in the joints, and with my shoulder it is a dull pain with occasional stabs of sharp pain if I move the wrong way. I’ve broken every one of my fingers twice-three times, and you all remember the shoulder injury. So I just usually take my advil every day and soldier on. Without it today, though, I was just fucking miserable.
I know this is going to sound insane, but I’ve never told my (new) doctor about the shoulder or finger pain, because I guess I have the old paradigm of health insurance in mind still. I just don’t want him to know about it because I don’t want it in my medical records so insurance companies could use it against me. I have great insurance, but one day I may not. Obviously they are aware of the injuries, because those are in my records, but I never discuss the fact that pretty much every day all day I’m in pain. Again, if I take advil or alleve, I’m cool, so it doesn’t seem worth mentioning, but if I miss a dose like I did today, it sucks.
And I have absolutely NO desire to take anything stronger than advil. When I was on all that percocet with my shoulder injury, I was just miserable. Opiates give me a horrible histamine effect, and I sweat and itch, on top of which I am groggy and confused and doing stupid shit like using softsoap on my tooth brush. I just hate those damned pills.
Again, it’s not anything debilitating, and it isn’t ruining my life. It’s more irritating than anything else, and again, can be solved with two advils. But I imagine one day as I age it is going to get worse, so I should probably look at more creative ways to deal with it.
cathyx
Buy more advil.
Jade Jordan
John if you can’t take hillbilly heroin for your pain why bother living in WV.
Xboxershorts
Marijuana.
I’m being serious too.
Don’t knock it unless you’ve tried it. It really does have pain mitigating characteristics.
PS…Chronic pain is a major contributor to depression.
Baud
You won’t have to worry about this anymore once Obamacare fully kicks in.
Oh wait, I forgot…John Roberts.
Nevermind.
cathyx
I take ibuprofin almost every night also. It helps me be able to fall back asleep if I wake up in the middle of the night. If I don’t take it, then I lay awake because any one position hurts after a while.
Valdivia
I am so sorry for your pain John. Chronic pain really grinds you down.
For regular pain I use Aleve. But I have been dosing myself up on felxeril (muscle relaxer) and Anaprox (like Aleve but super strength) twice a day since my back went out getting my dad out of the hospital after his surgery. If thing continue like this I am going to just go get a shot of cortisone and put myself out of my pain.
The worse part for me is not being able to work out which usually makes me feel like I have my back under control. Sigh. I am hobbling these days and that is a major accomplishment.
Stuck in the Funhouse
TENS unit.
It has worked for me with certain kinds of joint and muscle pain. I use Heroin now, though.
gelfling545
I deal with chronic pain (fibromyalgia and an impingement in the shoulder) with Tai Chi. It helps amazingly and no, I didn’t really believe it would do any good when I first tried it but 2-3 weeks into the beginner course before I even knew the whole set I could feel a difference. It came as quite a surprise to me.I recommend learning through a branch of the Taoist Tai Chi Society which focuses on wellness/health recovery and has branches in many states. It is the only exercise I have ever done that didn’t make me hurt afterwards. Also, the instructors are infinitely patient which helped because I am outstandingly uncoordinated.
4tehlulz
spoiler: you’re getting old, so they’ll use that against you. Get that shit checked, especially the shoulder, before you end up needing rotator cuff surgery.
Mnemosyne
I know people who swear by acupuncture for chronic pain, especially joint pain. It’s probably mostly the placebo effect at work, but people discount how powerful that effect can be.
Kifaru1
I would advise continuing the pain medication, but start seeing a sports therapist for your shoulder….it will get worse over time and then it will take YEARS to fix it. I had a shoulder injury in 2005 that became chronic pain in 2008 (rib twisted into a nerve near my spin…apparently no-one medical specialty covers ribs, so it wasn’t noticed until I saw a chiropractor). I am just now seeing the pain diminish. It took a long time to break down all the muscle tissue that was scarred and tight…..By the way, if you take it long enough advil-motrin-tylenol all stop working:(
Applejinx
You are such a fellow American, John.
“God help us all”.
Nah, too emo.
How about we overthrow this ridiculous system, before it kills and mutilates too many of us?
Raven
You’ve heard it before. I broke my leg in 18 places in the early 60’s, fractured mt 6th thoracic vertebrae in 1975 resulting in harrington rods and a bone graft on my spine, broken nose, dislocated fingers, broken toes and other small shit. I’m 63 and I swim close to a mile a day and walk two. I hit a 200mg ibuprofen most nights and try to stay as active as I can. I can’t handle opiates either.
slag
Weird. I totally do this too.
FWIW, my foot doc says that you can take two Alleve and 1 Tylenol every day forever, and it won’t hurt you. I don’t know how true that is.
Lojasmo
@john cole
Using ibuprofen for over two years increases the chance of renal failure by 12%
Also, too. ANYBODY with any arthritic symptoms should STOP EATING ALL GRAINS (wheat, rice, corn, barley) for a few weeks. Symptoms may clear up entirely. Can’t hurt, could
help.
MikeBoyScout
@1 cathyx:
Adding…
If advil works for you load up on your inventory.
Keep spare bottles in your car, your bike bag, backpack, Mom’s place, etc.
Raven
@Kifaru1: So you go to someone who believes that the spine can be “realigned” by jerking it?
J. Michael Neal
@Valdivia: Yeah, I’m on cyclobenzaprine (Flexeril generic), too. I have times where I’m completely unable to get various muscles to relax. Most often my right quadricep but it’s a general problem. It’s almost certainly a mental health thing, but the drug works.
Which is more than I can say for meditation. I’ve been trying to get that to work for years but I just can’t. If I’m not actively trying to relax I tense right back up.
Lojasmo
FYWP: no edit.
Also, too…vitamin D3 5000 units per day
And fish oil 3 grams per day.
jeff
@Lojasmo:
As skeptical as I am, I have chronic pain so bad I’d be willing to read up on anything you may have to support this plan of avoiding all grain. If you have anything handy linkwise, otherwise no worries!
BTW, for some kinds of inflammation I used to have, I swear to goodness cherries seemed to help.
rammalamadingdong
I’m in so much pain I am tired of talking about it. I’m on hydrocodone but it doesn’t really make much of a difference. I use Thermacare wraps on the joints, and a deep tissue massager from Brookstone because pain radiates everywhere and it just loosens things up. Rub on on Aspercreme. Red wine really helps a lot, don’t know why. Found something strange on YouTube (go figure), but it also helps. A dude rubs lotion on his joints and wraps them in Saran Wrap at night. It does take away the throbbing. This doesn’t get any better and insurance is going to do what it is going to do. Talk to your doctor.
EZSmirkzz
Well John, I’m no Doctor Frist, but I’ve heard that the same guy that is his own lawyer is also his own doctor. Unless you’ve changed insurance companies it’s a continuing condition, and theoretically your doctor is supposed to be on your side and keep your conversations on the QT, anyway.
If all else fails offer him a couple of chickens. If he accepts give him some farm fresh eggs and tell him to sit on them until they hatch. Tell him it’s an investment strategy.
Just Some Fuckhead
I just man up.
Exurban Mom
You do need to be careful about Aleve and other NSAIDS. They can wreak havoc on your stomach. A relative of mine was pounding the Aleve for severe pain, and had a lovely perforated ulcer in her stomach that nearly killed her. Observe the recommended dosages, and Aleve is recommended to be taken with a bit of food.
Sorry about the chronic pain, sir, I hope you stocked up and have some relief now.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@slag: You, me, Cole, Littlebrit.. seems to be a theme today. I guess my insurance is pretty good, but I swear in ten years I’ve barely charged them for what I now pay in premiums every month.
But I sure am glad I have the liberty of paying through the nose to a for-profit corporation to make sure I’ll go broke a little slower if I ever get that catastrophic disease or car accident! Nobody treading’ on this freeborn motherfucker!
Liberal Sandlapper
I alternate generic Aleve and Anacin for everyday aches and pains, of which I have plenty. I use each for two or three days in a row and then change it up. I believe that avoids the tolerance issues that can occur when you use them often.
When it gets bad, I use Naprosyn, which is simply 400mg of Aleve.
I don’t do narcotics at all, unless I am coming off surgery and then only for two or three days at most. Cant handle that shit.
J. Michael Neal
@Mnemosyne: I love the recent research that suggests that the placebo effect still exists even of you tell the subject that he’s getting the placebo. I have to think that just having someone take you seriously helps.
Dug
On my Doctor’s advice, I’ve started seeing an acupuncturist for chronic shoulder pain. She’s been helpful.
Erin
Raven – that is a pretty simplistic view of Chiropractic care. A good chiropractor looks to temporarily improve misalignments with treatment, but looks for a long term solution in diagnosing the cause of the misalignment (poor posture, physical stress due to work situations, bad sleeping habits, etc) and work on fixing that.
Olivia
My husband had such horrible hip pain before he had his hip replacement. He took a lot of ibuprofin and ultimately became so allergic to it that it almost killed him. He took 2 advil one evening and went into anaphylactic shock. I have had very good luck with acupuncture for joint pain. I have arthritic joints in my hands and acupuncture has helped immensely with the pain. It doesn’t remove the knobby joints though.
Zastrozzi
@Lojasmo:
I second your recommendation to avoid grains, including corn. And regular exercise, even a thirty-minute walk, helps immensely. I’ve been gluten-free since the start of the year and never felt better. Old shoulder pain and lower back pain is gone.
Elie
John:
I do use NSAIDs but I also do some swimming for my shoulder arthritis (which it sounds like you may have a touch of). The swimming (nothing rigorous – I actually use a styrofoam noodle to help stay afloat so there is little pressure on my shoulders) — lengthens my muscles and relaxes my body. I also use good massage once a month (with accupressure) and some friends of mine have been successful with acupuncture, which I am going to also start. Its important to stay gently active with whatever affected joints you have, but to listen to what is too much or too little. You have to use pain relief. Sorry. If you are in pain, you tighten your muscles and the circulation to your joints is impaired. Also, dancing is good…
Laugh when you can. Also. When I am happy/glad — everything falls into place and I generally feel better also.
Raven
@Erin: Help yourself.
Comrade Mary
John, you’re 40. With any luck, you’re going to be toting that body around for another 35-40 years. You want those years to carry as little extra pain as is reasonably possible.
A sports medicine clinic and a physiotherapist can probably assess and treat your pain by getting to root causes.
For example, if you don’t have full range of motion in your shoulders, you may have some degree of impingement and will need massage and re-positioning, as well as a set of home exercises, to get your shoulder moving smoothly and to strengthen some of the muscles that may have weakened.
The pain you feel right now could be “simple” inflammation, or you could be laying down adhesions and calcium deposits that are a bugger to get rid of, and which will lead to more pain in the future if left untreated.
Please, just see someone at a sports medicine clinic. The costs of physio are pretty damn low and are probably covered by your current insurance. Letting things get worse to the point where you may need surgery again in order to function will really hose your health records much more badly.
Alison
@Xboxershorts: I’m sure you mean well, and of course I don’t claim to speak for John, but God damn does this get tiresome. I mean, if John doesn’t want to take pills stronger than Advil, likely he’s not interested in pot. And anyway, these days I think if someone wanted to try pot as medicine, they would have done so. It’s not like it’s some mystery concept.
But also, it really is not the same for everyone. You did say “don’t knock it till you’ve tried it”, which at least shows that you realize some folks might knock it after having tried it, so that’s better than many others. I’m currently dealing with a severe chronic illness for which everyone and their damn mother, none of whom are doctors, seem to think pot is the SURE-FIRE CURE and I’ve had it suggested to me about 80 thousand times. I used to be a huge stoner but have not smoked in many years, and not only do I not want to now, but actually my illness would make it a really really BAD idea, contrary to everyone’s Internet Diagnoses. And being high is kind of the last feeling I actually want, which is so hard for people to get, but it’s true.
Again, I know you’re trying to be helpful, but this is just a pet peeve of mine since becoming ill. yes, I think pot is a great thing for many sick people and 1000% support legalizing it full stop anyway, but nothing works for everyone, and not everyone wants to get baked just to feel better.
slag
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
If you’re going to die early, might as well be for a good cause, is my motto.
Actually, my real motto is: We have a civilization–let’s use it! But apparently my motto isn’t as sexy as the lyrics to Free Bird.
Raven
A “serpent-handling” West Virginia pastor died after his rattlesnake bit him during a church ritual, just as the man had apparently watched a snake kill his father years before
Go see these people.
.
Elie
THIS is why I love BJ…:-)
Heliopause
There is no other responsible answer than to tell you to go to a doctor.
For common, everyday aches and pains (wink, wink) Ibuprofen almost always does the job for me (don’t waste money on name brands, I’ve never run into a generic that didn’t work as well). I take Aspirin for common headache. Also, have you considered accepting Jesus Christ as your personal Lord and Saviour?
the Conster
Go see a doctor of Chinese medicine. It’s inflammation, and there are herbs and dietary changes that can take care of it. Eat less meat, and make your internal environment more alkaline. Google alkalinity and health, and then eat way more of the things that will make you feel better. It’s not hard, once you start feeling good. Believe me, health all starts with what you ingest.
Redshift
In addition to many of the things other people have mentioned, Ms. Redshift uses prescription Lidocaine patches, especially overnight and when traveling.
Baud
@Raven: That’s one way to get rid of chronic pain.
Raven
@Baud: almost heaven
RedKitten
I also highly recommend acupuncture. I had chronic pain below my shoulder blade and more pain lodged somewhere between my hip and my spine. I’d tried massage, chiro, but nothing was helping.
I went for one acupuncture session, and it was GONE. Seriously. Gone. It was the weirdest goddamn thing — at one point, she inserted the acupuncture needle somewhere in the vicinity of the start of my sciatic nerve, and I actually felt something sproing loose. The only way I can describe it is a tightly wound spring just letting go.
The pain is still gone. And it’s been months.
Seriously, John. Give it a try.
Elie
@Comrade Mary:
Good recommendation.
(just my experience, of course) I had a partial shoulder replacement about 4 years ago and after about 4-6 months of rehab with swimming, I totally celebrate the decision.
You have to keep the old body in the best shape you can. My Mom (90 years) has had both knees and one shoulder replaced and is looking to fixing the other shoulder. She is skating around with her walker, doing just fine. Not saying that is for everybody, but I believe in hot lights and cold steel when the situation warrants. Aint none of us going to be around forever, but I see absolutely no reason to suffer if you can avoid it with decent care. I also subscribe to alternative remedies and accupuncture. Do something!
Linda Featheringill
@jeff:
grains and arthritic pain:
I really don’t know why but cutting wheat down to almost nothing helped my joint pain a lot. Seriously. It’s worth a try.
the Conster
@RedKitten:
I just posted my acupuncture comment in the other open thread. I had a terrible fall and inflamed the cluster of nerves that was giving me excruciating pain when I walked, and felt better after one treatment, but way better after the 4th. The only thing my western doctor could do for me was muscle relaxants and pain killers, and I have to go to work every day.
Steeplejack (phone)
Sitting at the USA-Brazil soccer match at FedEx Field. Weather perfect, beer cold. USA down 3-1, but I’m sitting between two gorgeous Brazilian women. Not bad. Attendance just announced at 68.000.
p.a.
@Kifaru1: I remember John’s shoulder accident but (obviously) don’t know the medical details, but if the pain is constant years later it may be time for a visit to a new doc. I swear by naproxen, but I need it maybe a few times a month. daily use is a concern with any pain med. I know long term ibuprofen use can cause kidneystones.
Svensker
@rammalamadingdong:
Y’all are going to think I’m nuts but have you tried Traumeel? http://www.traumeel.com/
A friend suggested it for my husband’s chronic tendonitis and the improvement was dramatic. It’s homeopathic so it “doesn’t work” — except it does! Or at least it did for him.
MikeJ
Nothing can heal the pain inside. Numb yourself with alcohol and masturbation.
Jeff(the other one)
@Exurban Mom: As a provider who works with chronic pain, I can say that most of this is good advice. There are also topical creams and patches (non narcotic ) which are effective with relieving pain, and many of the anti-convulsants (seizure meds) have been found to be effective for some people for chronic neuropathic pain.
TooManyJens
My advice would be not to listen to internetz doctors and nutritionists, and go consult people with actual training. Not that they’re always right, but it beats people who got their degrees from Google University. But I’m a bit of a grouch about this sort of thing. There’s a lot to be said for educating oneself, but part of being educated is realizing how much you don’t know. Too many people declare that a thing that worked for them or that they read about on the internet is the One Right Solution for everyone. It’s why I try to stay out of threads where people talk about diet, because they almost always devolve into that shit.
RedKitten
@the Conster: Yeah, it’s pretty amazing. When you find a good practitioner, it’s like gold. Mine was trained in China and goes back regularly for courses. I have no qualm with modern medicine, but a lot of times with pain, they really DO tend to rely too much on muscle relaxants and painkillers. I was skeptical when I went the first time, but I’m now a total believer. She also does myofascial release, which has been a godsend for me, as I have chronic lateral compartment syndrome and could barely walk three blocks without agony.
Alison
@Steeplejack (phone): Watching it on TV and wondering who put the damn hex on the ball that we should have had one if not two more goals at this point, but for crazy clearances…siiiiiiigh.
Genine
In addition to Vitamin D, Magnesium and Fish oil- I highly recommend massage and/or acupuncture. It will take some time and it may hurt a bit in the beginning but regular massage will be a huge help.
mainsailset
After years of chronic pain I accidentally discovered Fast Joint, a product that’s been successfully through clinical trials. You can buy a 10 day trial size, and for me after that 10 day dose, I could actually move without screaming, after a month all other meds stayed on the medicine shelf. Everyone I’ve told about it that’s tried it has reported similar results.
The Vit D is a good suggestion, as long as you co-take Calcium & Magnesium.
Pain’s a bitch, better to manage it than see saw with meds and end up having to up the doseages just to get relief.
Ruckus
@4tehlulz:
rotator cuff surgery
Had that. Movement was/is much better, pain is now back to about 70-80% of that before surgery, most days. Ibuprofen does a pretty good job. Buy it by the generic 500 count bottle. Of course it’s the hip, one or the other knees or the shoulder at least 5 days a week. Some times several of the above at the same time. I think I may have lead an unreasonable life so far. Rode hard, put away half dead. But then I don’t have to worry about screwing up my health insurance, which I no longer have. So over the counter pain management is all I get.
John
Take care of your problems now, fuck the insurance companies, otherwise you will probably regret it in 20-30 yrs. And you don’t have good insurance if you are more worried about screwing up your insurance than getting better.
Sarah
Definitely try acupuncture. I’ve found it to be remarkably effective for pain, and improving my sense of well being in general. So another vote for little needles.
Cassidy
Switch to Aleve or Tylenol as stated upthread. Long term use of Ibuprofen, especially higher doses, will cause liver damage. If I remember right you’re not supposed to take it more than 30 days continuously.
Secondly, you need to get some resistance bands and start working out your shoulder, physical therapy style. A visit will do you some good, but the exercises can be found online. Same for the fingers; you need to move them and loosen them up.
Yutsano
@RedKitten: I pretty much exhausted all of the options for my back so I finally relented to do the slicey-dicey on my back. I may be paying for it a lot later, but the only pain I have now is from the surgery. The compression on the discs is gone. The six week paid vacation from work is a nice gravy too. :)
Kbeagle
I have found great relief from back and shoulder pain through a course called “Mindfulness Based Stress Reduction”. It uses meditation and yoga to help you get more in touch with your body and just calm everything down. When you are in pain, you start to resist and push back on all the sensations from your body until you become disconnected. This helps change the pain into something that is much more bearable, and reduces the need for drugs of any kind. You can find books on this by John Kabat-Zinn. One of the things this taught me is that suffering is pain + resistance. You may still have the pain, but if you can change the resistance, the suffering will ease.
I am in my mid-50’s, and everyone I know seems to have aches and pains now. It has been a great discovery to find something that helps and calms me down without drugs. Helps your sleep too!
http://www.mindfullivingprograms.com/whatMBSR.php
karen
Depending on the type of pain, some low doses of anti-depressants like nortryptaline (which I take for TMJ) and gabapentin (aka Neurontin) have been known to help. I have fibromyalgia so I take cymbalta which helps with that and depression. Celebrex helps too.
If all of those are not options for you, do what I did: go into Canada, buy “canadian candy” which you can get OTC and bring some into the States. Or have a friend who is either in Canada and visiting you or is visiting Canada and you do it. The “candy” is only 8 mg but mixed with caffeine and tylenol (or aspirin) you’d be surprised how helpful it is.
If that’s not an option, try Anacin which also has caffeine and tylenol. Not as good as with candy but it’s the best substitute you’ll get in the States since apparently we no longer sell Excedrin.
Sarah
I want to add that I’d also suggest exercise and flexibility training – I know you’ll laugh, but yoga is great for strengthening joints. Gentle strength training and stretching can do wonders.
karen
ACCUPUNCTURE!!!!! If there is a Chinese community in your area, go there, to someone trained in China. Guarantee it will work!
Mr Stagger Lee
@Steeplejack (phone): Watching the Seattle Mariners blowing out the Texas Rangers(17-0), Nolan Ryan looks like he could use some Oxy with a shot of Jack Daniels.
Lolis
Yoga. It takes more time than popping advil, but it has done wonders for my body, mood, and overall health. My good cholesterol was off the chart provided by the doctor.
Xboxershorts
@Alison:
I separated my shoulder in a drunken horsing around at 18. Untreated.
I got my neck broken in the Navy.
A NAVY Dentist inadvertently broke my jaw pulling my wisdom teeth.
I have broken every finger as well. Including a lengthwise split of the large bone in my right pinkie finger witch I could not afford the recommended treatment of.
My teeth rotted out of my head in the 90’s when I spent that decade without any health insurance.
I know pain and I live without NSAIDs (most of the time).
And I don’t give a fuck if you look down your nose at me. But your arrogant public lecture directed at someone you do not know and who’s lived with chronic pain from injuries for decades now and is now over 50, for whom that treatment actually works, is an insult to the millions who follow that prescription.
But hey, we’re not reliving that scene from JAWS are we?
RedKitten
@Yutsano: I was WONDERING what had happened…I’d seen M. making references to it on your FB, but didn’t want to pry. Are you doing okay? It sounds like the surgery was successful — will you need to do physio or anything afterwards?
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
Some thoughts on an anti-inflammatory diet, back with lots of hard science, can be found in Anticancer: A New Way of Life, written by David Servan Schreiber, a psychiatrist who survived two brain tumors. It was recommended to me by my physician who found it when his wife was treating for cancer.
Bottom line, lots of fruits and vegetables, no refined grains, no hydrogenated fats, n-6/n-3 ratio as light as possible on n-6. Well worth the read. Minimizing inflammation is key for me to keep the MS under control. It’s also good for joint issues.
mac
Aspirin is stronger than the other two because it actually kills the pain receptors. Obviously you can’t take it chronically, but it’s fine when the pain is intermittent.
All of those over-the-counter drugs recommend doctor’s advice on more than 2 weeks continuous use, so you might want to reconsider on this; most pain medicine does liver damage if you take it too heavily.
Physical therapy can help too, even long after the injury…
khead
Serious answer:
I am very glad to have never had any health problems that have resulted in chronic pain.
Snarky internet answer:
Dude, you live in fucking WV. While I recognize that you live in northern WV, all it would take is one weekend trip to southern WV to fill all of your oxycontin needs. Pick up a gallon of moonshine while you are there.
Southern Beale
Aleve works well. I dunno, I don’t have chronic pain.
What I do have is a sick kitten. Came on the little feller like a ton of bricks, suddenly he’s lethargic and has quite a fever spike. I happened to have some Clavamox so I gave him a dose but I sure hope I don’t have to take him to the ER. He’s FIV positive so any little thing could be serious. But he’s just a baby, not quite a year old yet.
nick
John, you’re 40(ish) and it’s all about maintenance from here on. Treating symptoms rather than causes is short sighted. Yoga and resistance exercise are useful to slow down the inevitable decrepitude accompanying aging.
I didn’t follow your shoulder injury carefully, but I’ve recently had a nasty bout of what I’m guessing is a rotator cuff injury. Strengthening exercises are a google away.
Ibuprofen, recent research has shown, is actually harmful for tendonitis injuries in that it weakens the tendons (or something like that).
Time to go to the gym.
PhoenixRising
Cut down then out your NSAID use before you develop an ulcer.
Ask your doc for a referral to a sports medicine clinic. They will hook you up with PT and massage, for the shoulder. You will feel better and might even meet someone you like at workout. Good luck.
PhoenixRising
Cut down then out your NSAID use before you develop an ulcer.
Ask your doc for a referral to a sports medicine clinic. They will hook you up with PT and massage, for the shoulder. You will feel better and might even meet someone you like at workout. Good luck.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Yutsano: Hope you’re feeling way better post-op. Been thinking of you.
Yutsano
@RedKitten: Still in the do as little as possible recovery mode (it was only two weeks ago!) but when I get back to Seattle (at my parents place 200 miles southeast of there) I have two really good physios waiting to get their mitts on me. And my mom said I’m taking the full six weeks off so I can recover as much as possible. I am doing some light exercises but it’s mostly Percocet and sleep right now. Poor me. :)
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): The nice part is I know for certain it worked. Any pain I feel from standing is from the surgery not from the compressions. I am very satisfied with the results.
Alison
@Xboxershorts: I do NOT look down my nose at you, nor did I say anything about it not working. In fact, I specifically said I know it DOES work for a LOT of people, and that’s great, and those people who need/want it should be able to have it legally and safely. I know people who use medical pot and it’s been a blessing for them, and I support that 100%.
I was not lecturing you on how to treat your pain. I didn’t even know you did, so how could I have been? I was simply pointing out that, as you seem to agree, you can never know what’s right for someone else. My experience with my own illness has been to have many people immediately say TRY SMOKING POT, with no knowledge whatsoever of the intricacies of my illness or my personal issues with drugs. So in the same sense that you wouldn’t want someone telling you what not to do – and you are totally right not to want that, and I was not doing that – I was simply pointing out that something working for some people, or many people, or even most people, doesn’t mean it will work the same for everyone. And also just noting that pretty much everyone knows about pot as a medicine and if someone is inclined to try it, they likely would do so on their own volition.
I absolutely did not intend to anger you, only to say that there’s more than one side to the medical pot concept.
Anne Laurie
@Erin:
Seconded. And don’t overlook the “Hands On Effect” — our primate brains are wired to respond powerfully to being touched by a fellow primate, and the cascade of brain chemicals released by the touch of a trained manipulator can be indistinguishable from the effects of chemical opiates but wihtout getting the FDA all up in your grill.
Cole, since you respond so well to pedicures / foot massages, it seems that looking for a massage therapist might be a winner for you. Your insurance might even cover it — more plans are offering at least some “alternative” treatments (massage, chiropractic, nutrition) as a cheaper alternative to surgeries-that-don’t-always-work. Don’t know how available a proper “sports medicine” clinic might be in WV, but plain-vanilla massage chains are being franchised these days…
Laura
@the Conster:
I have heard tumeric – I put it in tea or coffee (with milk) and it does seem to work. Vitamin D, E & Magnesium too. Good luck!
Southern Beale
@Yutsano:
Yeeesh what an ordeal! Here’s to a speedy recovery. Get well!
bystander
As someone upthread has already posited, unless you’ve changed insurance companies between your shoulder injury and now, they probably already have a record. And, even if you did change companies, there’s probably something in the fine print that lets them access your history from your previous insurance provider. And, possibly, withholding information from your insurance provider can be grounds for cancellation with some insurance contracts. And, even so, the NSA now has the information on file in Utah and they’ll tell on you.
In my world, nothing beats a good sports medicine doc and a physical therapist. I’ve broken/ripped/torn/mangled both ankles, both knees, a shoulder, an elbow, any number of fingers and some cervical discs. Well started in my AARP years, docs trained in sports medicine and an array of PT folks have patched me together so I’m riding a bike, running, swimming, and dancin’ up a storm. Had to give up the hunter-jumper bit because of the neck stuff, but I can still hop on a horse for a pleasure ride. All of it totally pain free.
You’re cheating yourself out of the comfort of your own skin by relying on pain meds, and likely making your liver or kidneys unhappy depending on which meds you take. And, perhaps, more critically, what isn’t addressed now while you’re still fairly young, will come back and bite you in the ass – in spades – 20 years from now.
Keith
Lay off the chronic ibuprofen use. It is not good for the kidneys long-term (trust me on this…as a kidney patient, it is something I cannot take at all)
Ruckus
@Just Some Fuckhead:
I just man up.
I use this method as often as possible. I figure the pain is chronic, meaning it’s going to come back, and often. And besides as my sister said, pain from cancer that killed her is quite a bit less than the pain from the migraines that we both suffer(ed) from. A good one of those puppies will set you straight on pain. Some of my chronic pain will rise to a level 6 or 7 and that ain’t nothing compared to a nice migraine.
Violet
I second and third all the comments about treating inflammation as a systemic issue and focusing on diet and other alternative medicine stuff (like acupuncture). I could also suggest some other alternative medicine stuff, but I’m not go into go into it on a public forum. If you’re interested, you can email me. All I will say is that it worked when nothing else did.
As for treating some of your chronic mobility issues, try looking into myofascial release as a form of massage. I see a guy for fascia work related to my hip injury and he’s worked wonders. I highly recommend it.
chrismealy
I had wrist pain. That Sarno book cured it.
I had really bad knee pain for 15 years. After getting the runaround from doctors and PTS over the years I kinda just decided to live with it, but it got bad enough that I couldn’t sleep. I finally saw the right kind of physical therapist (McKenzie method) and they taught me a couple simple of stretches to do on my own. After a few weeks I got results, and after two months I was cured. They’re not common but I googled for it and it looks there are some MM PTs in WV.
Whatever you do, keep trying. There are plenty of options. Something might work. I didn’t realize how much my chronic pain was holding me back until is was gone.
Chuck Derperton
I know people who swear by cherry extract pills.
Even if it just a placebo effect how bad could side effects be?
mainmati
@Valdivia: I have a (so far) slght inherited tendency for hand joint pain, which Aleve completely resolves. Probably inherited from my Mom’s arthritis. My work alternates between computer based work and field based, physically active work overseas so Aleve has been good for me (so far).
J. Michael Neal
@Steeplejack (phone): Soccer is still nothing but slow paced ice hockey on a field that’s too big.
MobiusKlein
Waiiit – you are worried about it being in your permanent record, so you fucking blab it all over the interwebs?
https://www.google.com/?q=john+cole+chronic+pain
Rather, you should consider telling your doctor all the meds you regularly take, because of drug interactions.
Angela
I live with chronic pain too. From Rheumatoid Arthritis and some overlapping symptoms of Lupus. Second the rec for acupuncture, diet changes ( Seamus Mullen (a chef who has RA just came out with a new cookbook called Hero Food that is great!), Jon Kabat Zinn, and Yoga. Mostly though I recommend another book – A Resilient Life, by Kat Elton who is a PT and has RA and her chapter Pain is a four letter word, is the best I have ever read on understanding and living with chronic and acute pain.
Pain sucks and its ramifications on living are tremendous. Thanks for starting this post, I had no idea so many people live with chronic pain.
Alison
@J. Michael Neal: PFFFFFFFFFFFFT.
I’ll be nice and assume you’re at least half-kidding. But even so: PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFTTTTTTTT.
:)
JGabriel
John Cole:
Well, uh, I don’t know how to tell you this, so I’ll be blunt. You’ve just told the entire internet. If an insurance company ever goes to court with you to deny treatment, they’ll probably find this post and use it, if they can.
So, that’s that. On the other hand, the good news is: you may as well go ahead and tell the doctor now.
.
JenPo
john, from the heart, you must not continue to take advil or aleve every day. you must must must start doing yoga, just a few simple back and shoulder exercises to relieve the pain (although it will hurt at first). also, you could tell your doctor and get some physical therapy. or you could go off the reservation and see a chiropractor (but get a recommendation and don’t go more than a few times a year for adjustments). email me if you want some yoga exercises to get started.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@Angela: Thanks for the book tip! Eating in a fashion that doesn’t promote inflammation is important for everyone, as inflammation drives heart disease more than fat does, for example. New data, to be sure, but it’s pretty compelling. The contemporary American diet is way too heavy on n-6, which promotes inflammation, and too light on n-6, which reduce inflammation. These ratios have neurological implications as well – I saw a presentation last month outlining some of the data on that, at a med school psychiatry department conference.
Culture of Truth
I’m not in pain but I agree.
Narcissus
Booze helps.
Culture of Truth
Seriously though, I suspect any doctor will tell you that such constant pain should be checked out – its underlying cause might be fixed, and it might get much worse.
ruemara
qi gong. I got the use of my leg back after DVT, it has kept carpal tunnel at bay and it helps my hypertension from swelling my fingers for months (yes, months) at a time.
The prophet Nostradumbass
@Cassidy: Tylenol (Acetominophen) is actually the leading cause of liver failure in the United States.
amk
carpal tunnel syndrome. check it out.
JWL
You’re getting old, Cole. Happens to us all.
Barbara
I haven’t read through all the comments, but find a moderate exercise that you like — it can be pilates, yoga or one of the Asian disciplines, or just low impact aerobics. People with chronic conditions of all kinds actually need to make sure they keep their activity level up, because exercise really does aid in all those things like circulation and digestion that make you function better. It’s also really important especially for your shoulder that you exercise it to keep it from becoming permanently stiff. Well-conditioned muscles also cushion your joints better. I have mild RA and these are all things I try to carry out in my daily life.
This won’t really help with the fingers, of course, or at least not as much, but it should help everywhere else.
zoej
I had chronic hip pain (bone on bone)until it was replaced. I had very good luck with tumeric and bromelain. It worked as well as vicodan but not as well as hill billy heroin. It made life bearable for those last 6 months when I was forbidden ibuprofen due to kidney issues. I still use it as ibuprofen is still forbidden. Honest ibuprofen is a kidney killer.
ps A vet told me to use it for the dog and she said she used it exclusively for her own pain. I trust vets more than doctors…
karen
@Angela:
I’ve got RA too, along with Fibro and Sjogrens. Did your change in diet put you into remission? Do you take anything like methotrexate or Enbrel (which I take)? I love that Enbrel works for me but what screws me up is that I always get infections which means I have to go off Enbrel and it’s a vicious cycle. My insurance company made me try MTX first but it made me so sick that I couldn’t take it after a while.
stoned stats
Pot. That is all.
WereBear (itouch)
Are we up to fourthing the recc for no grains? My arthritis is getting better all the time.
Lizzi
John,
Consider both an Acupuncturist and a Rolfer. Use the acupuncturist if you think the pain is from nerve impingement, the rolfer if you think that the original injury(ies) has caused you to adjust the way you hold your body in some compensating way.
Anecdotal examples: my daughter played violin from the age of 5. At 14 she started running cross country and was having all kinds of knee and foot problems. At the rolfer’s we discovered that the asymmetrical position of playing a violin had caused a shift in her posture that resulted in a 4″ gap from hip bone to rib cage on the left side and an 8″ gap on the right. Four sessions and she was the 4th fastest kid on the team of 40.
Second example: I sat down on an airplane, crossed my right leg over the left, and couldn’t breathe because the pain that shot through my torso, up my back and down my leg was so excruciating. Doctor offered to refer me to an arthritis specialist and muscle relaxers. Acupuncturist relieved acute pain in one session and residual pain over 2-3 more.
Do either or both of these then consider a practitioner of the Alexander technique to learn long term control.
J. Michael Neal
@Alison: We’ve got overtime hockey tonight. No way soccer can match that.
In other words, I was joking, but that is also how I feel about the relative merits of the two games.
asiangrrlMN
Tai chi has helped tremendously. Unfortunately, starting the Sword Form has triggered something similar to carpal tunnel syndrome in my left wrist that I once had surgery for in my right (a decade-plus ago). My tai chi teacher recommended acupuncture, and I’ll let you know how it goes – otherwise, surgery.
Gus diZerega
When I had very severe whip lash the Chinese healing methods involved in Qi gong (many different spellings, alas) not only were more effective than anything else, I have had no pain at all for about 20 years. I know many others with similar stories of pain being eliminated.
Qi gong, or if you cannot find a qualified person, a GOOD acupuncturist with a track record, is well worth checking out. No real expensive and it won’t get on your record since they work outside Western medicine.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@The prophet Nostradumbass: Exactly. Stay the hell away from acetamenophen. The margin between therapeutic and toxic is quite narrow, and the consequences of crossing it are severe.
Gus diZerega
@ruemara: After my post I was reading upwards. Another endorsement!
Keith G
If you aren’t going to level with your medical professionals, then I do not want to hear your bull shit complaints.
And Another Thing...
Find a massage therapist who does myofascial release.
I am so not new-agey, but it really works. I’ve had multiple orthopedic injuries, surgeries, wear and tear arthritis & shoulder & back problems from using crutches for 50 years. I reduced pain killers by 90% & dramatically improved range of motion.
Nicole
Isn’t the whole point of having good health insurance that you can get treated for things like chronic pain?
So the insurance industry is now terrifying people who have insurance into not getting care because they don’t want the insurance company to know they need it. Best health care in the world! WOOHOO!
Please tell your doctor and get it treated. Chronic pain only gets worse and if you do find yourself without great insurance at some point in the future, the condition may be worse than if you deal with it now.
By the way, I have dealt with my chronic pain by telling my doctor, who sends me off to physical therapy for awhile, but I don’t have as many broken bones as you do, so I don’t know if yours is the sort physical therapy can help, but if it can, your doctor will probably prescribe it.
J. Michael Neal
I’m rooting for the Devils in this series, if I have to pick one of these teams, but that would have been a very impressive goal to end it if I didn’t think Kopitar was trying to elevate it and fanned on the shot.
MM
As mentioned above: physical therapy. Even if you go for one or two sessions just to get the exercises down, then do them on your own. I have arthritis in my foot, a few formerly broken fingers, I broke the tip of my humerus and I have a partially torn ACL. The best any of those ever feel is when I do the right exercises to strengthen the muscles around them. NSAIDS help, but PT is way better.
Xboxershorts
@Alison:
That’s how your comment struck me.
I’m sorry if I over reacted.
I’m bitchy right now because my preferred pain treatment is not available to me seeing as I’m unemployed and interviewing and subject to screening.
Vixen Strangely
I can take just about nothing–opiates basically don’t work for me, Tylenol makes me queasy, pot is not my bag, and sadly, ibuprofen & naproxen, even though they kind of work….(too much information coming) kind of seem to bind me. You know, in the “prune juice chaser” way. Vitamin D, d-phenyalanine, and turmeric seem to have taken the edge off my arthritis, and I’ve worked on cutting grains & sugar to fight inflammation. The one actually pain-killing thing that I keep coming back to? Booze. It’s so temporary. But so effective. But if you have the swollen/hot type pain, ice packs do in a pinch. (Altho’ having schlepped around with frozen lima bean shoved in my socks for bad ankles, I admit it has its practical limits when you have stuff to do.)
BonnyAnne
@Yutsano:
take your time coming back! It’s been pretty quiet around here. :) Glad to hear you’re feeling decent post-op.
Alison
@Xboxershorts: I’m sorry for having worded it in a way that let it come across that way. As I said, was totally not my intention.
And you have every right to be pissed about not being able to use the medicine that works for you. People who are against it baffle the fuck out of me. How can you wish pain and suffering on someone just because OH NOES THEY MIGHT GET HIGH TOO. It’s horrible. Hopefully we’re moving away from that, but…who knows how long it’ll take.
karen
@ruemara:
I had a DVT back in 2001 so I know how painful that is. What is Qi Gong?
The Pale Scot
I guess my comment got caught in the spam blocker, hope it gets posted.
pseudonymous in nc
Pain clinics have made a huge difference in how chronic pain gets treated over the past few decades — because it’s not something to suck up and deal with, it’s a genuine problem for which there is now help.
I know people who’ve done mindfulness stuff for chronic pain — admittedly, in another country with universal healthcare, where it’s partly funded from the healthcare budget.
marina
To #73, Southern Beale, please get your kitten to a vet as soon as possible. Infections are extremely dangerous…Also, once you start giving Clavamox, you have to continue until the prescription is finished–otherwise the bacteria can become resistant. I wouldn’t know if you live near a Costco, but, if you do, they’ve started selling pet medications, and their prices for Baytril and Clavamox are very, very affordable. With best wishes…
Lauren
Sports medicine doctor prescribed “cockup splints” for me, which immobilize your wrists in the just-past-straight position. I just wear them loosely at night, and not at all during the day – they keep my hands from curling up into claws while I sleep. These are the things you see super market checkers wearing for carpal tunnel syndrome. Don’t let the person fitting them trim the straps – you want to wear them as loose as you can for bed.
These things have helped me tremendously – I went from a lot of pain (especially in the thumbs) and not being able to hold a beer one-handed to being almost pain free and nearly fully functional (with zero pain meds). Apparently nerves and other stuff are routed through the narrow channel of your carpal tunnel at the base of your thumb. When your hands/wrists fold up in sleep, this pinches off the channel and fucks everything up.
Brother Shotgun of Sweet Reason
Lower back pain here. Not chronic, but a flare-up like getting hit with a cattle prod when I do something stupid every couple of years.
Just finished a month of physical therapy and I am determined to keep up with the core stabilization exercises this time. I’m really tired of this business.
My recommendation, which I haven’t seen here yet, is ultrasound. Had a back episode 10 years ago and one session with the ultrasound took the pain away.
But overall, I recommend PT. And I’ve never had any issues with insurance with a problem that’s been going on for decades.
Angela
@karen: I wish I was in remission! The change in diet helps my inflammation, it really helps my skin, and my gastrointestinal symptoms, but I still have days where the fatigue and joint pain is pretty overwhelming.
I have tried a lot of the biologics, including Enbrel, Remicade, Orencia, and Cimzia. Enbrel worked for a while, Cimzia worked great for me. But when I changed to the University of Penn med center, we made a choice to take me off it. Bad choice. That vicious cycle with Enbrel/biologics and infection is so hard.
I have been on Alleve (my liver couldn’t take it), oral methotrexate, it made me sick too, and now I am on plaquenil and injectable methotrexate. I can tolerate the injectable, as long as I take 3 mg of folic acid, 800 mcg of megafolinic, and a B complex vitamin all daily.
I find Hatha Yoga helpful, any other kind, including restorative will send me into a small flare. And walking is good for me too.
Can you do any exercise? Does it help?
protected static
@The prophet Nostradumbass: This. My wife (a clinical psychologist in an academic medicine setting) has seen more than one young woman die of liver and kidney failure after a failed suicide attempt w/ acetaminophen. It’s a long, slow, lingering death. Her dad is an MD/PhD who has seen lots of Tylenol-related deaths – he personally thinks acetaminophen should be Rx only.
Ash Can
I don’t have the patience to read through this entire thread, so I’m pretty confident this solution has already been mentioned multiple times: Try slow, deep, relaxed stretching. Yoga-type. And breathing exercises. Minimize your stress, and then, and only then, assess your problems.
Angela
@protected static: I have had a few docs tell me that Tylenol would never make it through the approval process these days, because of its impact on the kidneys/liver.
Watching my sister in pain from a perforated ulcer from NDSAIDS when I was young has made me committed to finding other relief from my chronic pain.
maurinsky
I live with chronic pain because I was born with hip displaysia, and I now have severe osteoarthritis in my left hip. I take naproxen (Aleve) when it’s really bad, but the things that help the most are stretching and deep breathing/meditation. I lie down and breathe deeply and imagine the breath going through my body, and then I imagine the pain as a bright color and I breathe it out of my body. It sounds crazy, but it does help.
Angela
@maurinsky: Gonna try this next time the joints/synovial fluid in my face gets inflamed. Thanks!
The Pale Scot
After reading all these pain stories, lemme try this.
T•r•a•m•a•d3•o•l is a non-narcotic that works on the opiate receptors. But it is a partial antagonist, that means it doesn’t fit perfectly into the receptors so you don’t get doped up. And taking more doesn’t get you doped either, if anything it’s like drinking too much expresso. it works well, there’s twinges but they do not wear you out. And it also for me anyway seems to prevent my muscles from spasming after a long day. reduces pain> muscles don’t tighten to compensate> ergo no spasms.
And it’s cheap. And I have had dependence issues in the past but have been on the same dose for 4 years.
Like others have said, cox enzyme inhibitors A:vil are more dangerous than is admitted by big pharma
LT
12 years now, intermittently, sometimes gone for months, sometimes many times daily – an electric needle, or icepick, sticks in my back, between the inside edge of my left shoulder blade and my spine. No movement necessary, no lifting – just sitting, standing, whatever, suddenly there. Sometimes it is just mindwrecking. Can’t work, sleep.
Tried chiropractor (that’s how I know it was 12 years – my chiro in the states told me, ‘Holy shit, you first came for this in 1999!”). Since moving to Oz, physio, x-ray, MRI, bone scan – nothing. Best they could guess is bone wear from slouching posture over many years – and I do have better posture now! Hmmph.
I lived on ibuprophren for many years. Lots every day. And alcohol. Now – Panadene, although it’s not in a wicked bad era right now. And alcohol.
(When I was 11 or so a “friend” who is possibly in a psych ward now shot me in the center of my back with a 20-gauge shotgun wad (he’d taken the pellets out) from about fifteen feet. Threw me to the ground, hurt like hell. Was that it? Have to wonder…)
LT
Reading everyone’s comments: My “spot” was never as bad as it was during the leadup to and after moving out of the country. They say moving is stressful – moving abroad even more so I guess, and the spot when absolutely nuts for about a year-and-a-half.
Maybe I really do need to get back into meditation.
Mnemosyne
Since we’re all talking about alternative treatments, does anyone have experience with Cogmed for ADHD? My therapist recommended it. It’s pretty expensive, but it sounds as though the results can be dramatic if you do the work.
Comrade Mary
@Mnemosyne: I’m probably getting formally assessed for ADHD soon (insurance permitting), so I’ll look into Cogmed.
They do have webinars: have you checked out any of those? It looks as if it’s really all about working memory, which may or may not be an issue for me.
TheOtherWA
I have arthritis and take naproxen twice a day. Since my doc gives me a prescription for the stronger version than OTC aleve, I get a bottle of 100 for about $6. Yes, the stronger version is cheaper than the non-prescription. Go figure.
Mnemosyne
@Comrade Mary:
If you do have ADHD, the latest research shows that it seems to be primarily a working memory/executive functioning problem and not actually a problem with “attention.” (Also, too, join the club of late ADHD diagnoses — I didn’t get diagnosed until last year when I was 42 years old.)
As I understand it, the current thinking is that the problem for people with ADHD is that we have trouble pulling thoughts into working memory, which leads to the problems with inattentiveness, impulsivity, etc. Stimulants work by doing something to dopamine in the brain, which makes it easier for the brain to keep things in working memory for a longer time.
ETA: Also, too, don’t be afraid of stimulants if they decide to prescribe them to you. I was skeptical, but they gave me Concerta and it really does seem to help slow the buzzing thoughts down.
feebog
I highly recommend Scotch. Johnny Walker Black if you can afford it. But don’t mind me, I’ve been listening to attorneys perform endless direct and cross examination of one witness for the entire day, I just need everything to be numb.
Comrade Mary
@Mnemosyne: Hmm. I always thought my short term/working memory was decent, at least when I was in a competitive situation like a psych experiment, but in day to day life, I’m reeeeally good at losing the thread. I’ll Google around for more on that issue.
Mnemosyne
@Comrade Mary:
Google “hyperfocus” and I think you’ll recognize yourself in those psych experiments. :-) Working memory is apparently something different because it’s the mechanism that lets you move things around from place to place in your brain.
So, like in my case, I can have it floating around in my mind for weeks that my aunt sent me a check and I need to write her a thank-you note for it, but it’s really hard for me to take that thought and move it up to the front where I’ll actually sit down and do it. As I understand it, it’s your working memory that lets you do that.
But there are also a lot of other learning disabilities that have crossover with ADHD (including Asperger’s and autism spectrum problems), so getting screened by a professional is definitely the way to go.
Maude
@The Pale Scot:
I’ve been on the same dose for 6 years. I just got up because I was asleep, the pain woke me up and I had to to take the pills. Once in a while, I take an aspirin with it. It has made the difference between functioning and not functioning at all. It is such a relief when I take it later than usual and it kicks in.
Mark van Roojen
Apologies for not having scrolled through all the comments and likely this has been said before, but given that you’ve just blogged about it, not telling your doctor is not a strategy for keeping the pain secret. You’ve got good care now, as you say. Use it.
Who knows what the future will bring. There are scenarios on which we are all screwed. (As in President Romney, Speaker Boehner, and Majority Leader . . . what’s that idiot’s name again? Oh yeah, McConnell.) Might as well take advantage of the good care while you have it. And popping advil or aleve has heart risks over the long term too, so it isn’t obvious that the prudent course is to try to keep it secret.
Wish I had a good positive bit of advice, but it looks like folks upthread have that covered. . .
Gretchen
I broke my shoulder 18 months ago. Physical therapy helped a lot, as has massage. My masseuse says the shoulder is very tight, but she is making progress each time, getting it a little looser. The less you move it, the more it tightens up and causes more pain in the long run. I’ll be swimming now that the pool is open. I find that yoga is great for flexibility, but so much of it involves downward-facing dog, which I find difficult with the shoulder – I don’t have full mobility, and it’s weak.
Mnemosyne
@Gretchen:
If yoga works for you, you might want to try Pilates. It’s based on a lot of the same movements, but it was originally developed to be done by people with limited mobility (as in, WWI veterans in hospital beds) so it’s a lot easier to adapt to various physical limitations.
gaz's wife
John, are there any Mexican stores in your area? Around here what we do when we need medication and either can’t afford to go to a doctor or don’t want to talk to the doctor about the condition is go down to the local Mexican store. You can get practically anything you want and some of the stores do special orders. Anyway, I know you said that you only really want Advil but if you ever did need to take something else the Mexican stores will probably be able to help you.
cthulhu
Probably best to take this offline, but one major step is finding a pain specialist that is well-versed in both pharmacologic and behavioral interventions and can do a comprehensive work-up. Your pain/inflammation may have multiple etiologies which may require a more complex regimen of treatments and, depending on other factors, some options may carry bad risk/benefit given your personal situation (e.g., cox-2 drugs like Celebrex increase cardiovascular risk in some patients that may outweigh the improvements in inflammation reduction). Chronic inflammation is far more serious long-term though the subjective pain is more notable and frustrating.
One of the cutting edge chronic pain treatments is neuro-modulation but it sounds like you have more run-of-the-mill type pain issues.
As an aside, acetaminophen/paracetamol (Tylenol) is kind of a fascinating drug. It’s the only one left on the market in its drug class despite being one of the most, if not the most, utilized drug currently (all the others proved to be too risky). And, after more than 60 years of common use (it was discovered more than 100 years ago), it’s such a messy drug that it still remains unclear how it works exactly.
Finally, definitely beware of quackery; it’s a big market in the pain management arena because you’ve got an often desperate patient population that can be more easily sold on the quick fix.
Darkrose
I deal with chronic pain from migraines, RSIs and now my fucked-up ankle by large quantities of drugs. I have a prescription for Vicodin and for the 800 mg ibuprofen.
I’m a big believer in Better Living Through Chemistry. Yeah, Big Pharma blah blah blah, but years of talk therapy did nothing to dent my depression until I started taking antidepressants. Odds are good that I’d have finally succeeded in a suicide attempt if I hadn’t gotten on meds when I did. I’ve also seen the difference in my wife when she’s on bipolar meds and when she’s not. Medication doesn’t solve everything, but it can help get you to a point where you can start trying to deal with the underlying problem.
Steeplejack
Home from the soccer match and soon to go to bed. Haven’t read the whole thread, but I’ll throw in my 2¢ on chronic pain.
I have had chronic discomfort, occasionally rising to the level of pain, since a bad broken jaw five years ago (two breaks, one a compound fracture). It’s a mixture of numbness, soreness and nerve damage (tingling, prickly feeling like when your foot goes to sleep) on the right side of my mouth and face. Not currently taking any medication except (rarely) Aleve, which helps a little when I’m having a bad patch.
Cole, I highly recommend some sort of physical/“energy” work like tai chi, qi gong or yoga (in that order of preference). They are all low-stress and low-impact (I’m talking about old-school hatha yoga, not astanga or “hot” yoga or any of the newfangled stuff), and they seem to work in some subtle, “I don’t know how but I’ll take it” way. Going through the physical motions and strengthening your body’s energy systems really help with whatever localized problems you’re having. (There aren’t any specific “exercises” or therapy I can do for my jaw and face.) Tai chi, especially, helps with the feeling that the nerves on my jaw line are inflamed or misfiring (subjective description).
Also, for your shoulder, I recommend Thai massage (from someone who is accredited and/or knows how to do it). It’s sort of like “directed yoga,” where the masseur gently pushes and pulls your body through various movements. No oil is involved, and you wear loose, comfortable clothing throughout. It is incredibly relaxing and very healing, in my experience. You just lie there and let the masseur do the work. It was the only thing that worked for me once when I had an excruciating period of sciatica. (Valdivia, you should check it out too!)
Here is a demonstration of shoulder work in the northern style of Thai massage.
Gretchen
@Mnemosyne:
Thanks for the tip. I’ll look into that.
One more problem with tylenol is you shouldn’t take it with alcohol. Double-whammy on the liver.
And who wants to give up beer?
moderateindy
After 20 years of playing Lacrosse as well as high school football and high school and college wrestling multiple knee surgeries and more injuries than I can remember, I can relate to chronic and acute pain and the need for relief. Add to that the occasional Gout attack and the idea of pain being not just inconvenient but totally debilitating is all too familiar. Many people have said stay away from the NSAIDS and I don’t think this can be stressed enough. Tylenol will destroy the liver and Ibuprofen the kidneys. I haven’t seen much about Aleve but it’s still early in it’s OTC life.
Do what you can to cut down on these.
Yoga helped a bit. Meditation was definitely helpful. Acupuncture was very relaxing but didn’t seem to help with the pain.Though I have friends that swear by it. Just light exercise was helpful for my overall mood if not the pain. Marijuana is great and actually was very helpful during a couple of really bad gout episodes, but who wants to be constantly stoned? Plus its efficacy might have depended on the fact that it was used so infrequently. Basically, the few times I used it medicinally I was so stoned I couldn’t feel the pain or remember my name. I wonder how well it would work if it was back in high school (which was aptly named in my case) and I was constantly stoned.
The point is there are a lot of good alternatives that were delineated here. See what works for you, just get away from the NSAIDS as often as possible. But if it does turn out that Aleve or Ibuprofen are the only thing that works, well hell better you croak from Liver or Kidney failure 10-20 years from now than spend that time in misery
Omnes Omnibus
Reading through this thread, I suppose my takeaway is that I should not be surprised at how ill-tempered and cranky everyone frequenting this site can be.
Graham Brown
I am recommending Grounding or Earthing if you prefer. It has
certainly worked for me and has improved my sleep and relieved
my chronic pain from a broken hip. The recommended dose is 8
hours of uninterrupted sleep while grounded has served me well. Give it a try, it is cheap and cannot hurt and may fix your pain. I now “ground” every night and will not do without it.
otto schmidlap
Try DMSO. It works.
http://www.fieldhealth.com/Where_to_Buy_Dmso?oo=13755
gopher2b
Cardio and yoga. I’ve lost 25 lbs and cannot began to describe all the positive changes its had on my body.
Unfortunately, it also required cutting way back on the booze. I do miss all the booze.
bcinaz
STOP EATING WHEAT!!! I kid you not. Just do it for a couple of days and see if it makes a difference. The absence of pain is subtle, however, if you have a wheat sensitivity, it’ll be pretty obvious.
Tom
John- I use glucosamine/condroitin and fish oil daily for stuff like this. I find it does help me.
kc
Say, do you have any of those Percocets left over?
OK, never mind . . .
noabsolutes
I hear from people with chronic pain that a) acupuncture b) qi gong and c) marijuana all work. They’re pretty tried and tested. It would be awful to get screwed over legally about the latter, but hopefully you can get away with it.
I’m a bad socialist, so forgive this question: Is it impossible for you to get coverage from the VA, so that you have healthcare that allows you to, you know, tell your doctors about your healthcare needs?
Deb T
@the Conster:
the Conster Says:
“I just posted my acupuncture comment in the other open thread. I had a terrible fall and inflamed the cluster of nerves that was giving me excruciating pain when I walked, and felt better after one treatment, but way better after the 4th. The only thing my western doctor could do for me was muscle relaxants and pain killers, and I have to go to work every day.”
I had a similar fall with long lasting, excruciating pain. After I went through all the pain meds the doctor would give me, I finally went to physical therapy. I’d had pt before for back pain and the care was so sloppy and ineffectual, it made me skeptical of all pt. This time I got a really good therapist who worked with me, constantly checking where it hurt, flexibility, numbness, extra sensitivity, etc. She ended the session with a warm moist heating pad. I had immediate relief and after 4 sessions was pretty much healed (after 3 weeks of sharp pain). It also helped my headaches and made me understand they started in my neck. But maybe it depends on who you get to help you?
nastybrutishntall
@Kifaru1: A bad acupuncturist is riding placebo effect. Good acupuncture is remarkably specific. Until you are getting the entire area affected, really getting to the source of the pain, the relief is partial. Then you get the right point and wham – ROM returns, the pain is gone. The funny thing about the placebo effect argument and acupuncture is that most people come to acupuncture after having tried out several therapies. So the placebo effect should have kicked in already, unless human beings are somehow programmed to see needles as inherently superior medicine to pharma, massage, chiro, PT, and surgery, in which case, as an acupuncturist, I’m a lucky ducky since people will believe anything I do and I can just jerk off all day and eat good food.
noabsolutes
@Keith G: Um, hi, I suppose you’ve never read this blog. Because if you have, you would recognize that the way our healthcare system and entire society work don’t always make “leveling” such a transparently advantageous thing to do. Look around.
shortstop
@noabsolutes: Yeah, Keith, I have to say you called this one wrong. There are many things that are better left out of medical records if one is trying to preserve insurability under this system. Not sure whether or not this is one of them, but there are plenty of solid examples.
Rainy Day
Daily doses of: Glucosamine/Chondroitin
It takes about a week before it kicks in. But once it kicks in, it works very well. And you don’t have to worry about it giving you high blood pressure like using Advil daily.
It’s in the Vitamin section.
Knight of Nothing
Hello Mr Cole: I add my voice to the chorus of folks recommending that you try a dietary change – going completely grain-free really does help with inflammation. It is not quackery – there is quite a bit of science behind it – and it definitely not a quick or easy fix. But dietary changes can help with all kinds of chronic pain caused by inflammation. One caveat: people have said it works within a few days, but that was not the case for me – it took a few weeks. I’d give it 30 days.
See http://www.gnolls.org/ and http://whole9life.com/testimonials/ for more information. Even if you don’t follow the diet, I think you’d like the Gnolls blog – very pithy and funny.
John M. Burt
@Mnemosyne: Acupuncture and acupressure have been clinically studied and been shown to provide pain relief beyond what the placebo effect can provide.
phil
If you’re looking for an anti-inflammatory, try Boswellia (Boswellic acid). Non-addictive and from a natural source, it’s an extract from Boswellia serrata. It’s an Ayurvedic Herb that’s been in use for a couple thousand years. Some brands are better than others; as an extract, the quality can differ between brands. I took Solaray’s Boswellia and can recommend it. Check out the wiki entry.
I heard about it first from an MD on a Consumer’s Report segment on my local TV news.
Older
John “if I miss a dose, it sucks”. Well, don’t miss a dose. Be sure you have a little securely fastened container of your chosen pain killer on your person at all times.
Speaking as a member of the chronic pain community, I have to say, it took me a while to learn this. The only pain medications I can take, due to my numerous weird conditions, are codeine derivatives and analogs. When I started, my doctor had me sign a statement that I wouldn’t sue him if I became addicted. I was spooked by this, so it took me a while to learn, but now I know: Always Carry Some!
By the way, we have a family chiropractic doctor as well as all the other specialists, and although she rarely does “adjustments”, her treatments are such that we always leave her office feeling better than when we arrived. This was also true of the acupuncture I had for the pain while I was suffering from avascular degeneration of the hip. I can’t say this about any other doctor.
IrishGirl
I have a constant pain from carpal tunnel syndrome in both hands and it is actually the result of my pregnancies and exacerbated by my profession. Can’t take the meds for it (even OTC Ibuprofen I can’t take) and can’t do surgery (no time, no money, not always effective).
I also have IBS and NOTHING makes that better and no one really understands it. I could eat a completely BRAT diet and still be in pain. My gastro doc has tried to put me on meds for it but they make me dopey and useless. So I suffer and eat whatever I want, within reason. It often does get in the way of having a normal life though.
Constant pain feeds into a person’s sense of hopelessness and frustration, and it can be isolating. If I am in so much pain I can’t stand up, I can’t go out and be with friends, or play my kids, or go to a protest. All that feeds into Depression and make it worse. I have had both, constant pain and depression, since I was 6 years old. I have turned to more alternative type treatments such as massage, meditation (including self-hypnosis), and marijuana (which MIGHT soon be made legal for depression here in AZ). I haven’t tried Acupuncture but I wouldn’t rule it out.
So my best advice is keep an open mind and try alternative therapies (within reason, of course).
Andree-Anne Desmedt
How about physical therapy?
Mnemosyne
@IrishGirl:
For my IBS, the two most helpful things were staying hydrated (ie at least 64 oz. of water a day) and yogurt with live cultures. My IBS was definitely aggravated by being lactose intolerant — I never realized what a common additive lactose was until I started looking for it. Medication did zero for me except make me loopy.
You might want to make sure it’s not something else with similar symptoms, though — ulcerative colitis has similar symptoms but can be dangerous if you let it go on too long.
Binky Bear
@Erin: I went to a chiropractor that also specialized in sports medicine. They didn’t have a huge focus on the “magic” portion of chiropracty which is hard to swallow but they did a lot of physical therapy practice-stretches, excercises, and meditation-plus some adjustment and some meds to get a slipped disc back into its hole and shrunk up. Tai Chi might help too-the body is a set of simple systems working together and sometimes the inflammation perceived as pain is needed simply to get the body focused on fixing things. Focused meditation is another helpful way to get at discomfort. Mindful meditation, full catastrophe living, etc. etc.