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You are here: Home / Foreign Affairs / Military / Chelsea Manning / Open Thread and News Round Up

Open Thread and News Round Up

by Soonergrunt|  June 7, 20123:19 pm| 72 Comments

This post is in: Chelsea Manning, Open Threads, Science & Technology

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Wikileaks Court Martial May Be Delayed–The Defense has accused the Trial Counsel of foot dragging on discovery.  This Military Judge, COL Denise Lind, is the same judge that presided at Birther Terry Lakin’s court martial for missing movement and conduct unbecoming an officer.

Noted Conservative Curt Schilling’s Video Game Company Files For Bankruptcy–I guess that he couldn’t figure out how to pull himself up without more taxpayer assistance.

The moon screwed with the Large Hadron Collider–tidal forces caused by the moon’s gravitational field have affected several experiments.

The RNC and the Romney campaign both claim to have raised more money than the Obama campaign recently–Not particularly surprising, that.

Man cleared of rape charge after 5 years in prison gets NFL tryout.–No matter what happens, I’m rooting for Brian Banks.

The US and Viet Nam are in talks to allow the US to base some naval assets in Cam Ranh Bay, and additional talks are under way to sell weapons to the Vietnamese.  The world turns, doesn’t it?

Cost to repair the nuclear-powered attack submarine USS Miami after a fire in her torpedo and sonar spaces in drydock a couple weeks ago?  $400 million.

 

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Reader Interactions

72Comments

  1. 1.

    piratedan

    June 7, 2012 at 3:23 pm

    what…. someone in the Navy needs to have a link to SERVPRO?

    http://www.servpro.com/

    isn’t this a job for the free market? can’t they simply reference Angie’s List?

  2. 2.

    4tehlulz

    June 7, 2012 at 3:24 pm

    Also, I thought Mitt was supposed to redraw to the center. He’s doing it wrong, if so (possible).

    One must ask whether we will still be a free enterprise nation and whether we will still have economic freedom. America is on the cusp of having a government-run economy. President Obama is transforming America into something very different than the land of the free and the land of opportunity.

  3. 3.

    Baud

    June 7, 2012 at 3:28 pm

    @4tehlulz:

    One must ask whether we will still be a free enterprise nation and whether we will still have economic freedom. America is on the cusp of having a government-run economy. President Obama is transforming America into something very different than the land of the free and the land of opportunity black.

    FTFY

  4. 4.

    rlrr

    June 7, 2012 at 3:28 pm

    @4tehlulz:

    The one remotely soc1alist thing Obama did, the auto bailout, Mitt Romney is taking credit for. Someone needs to press Romney for some examples of Obama making this country have a government-run economy.

  5. 5.

    gbear

    June 7, 2012 at 3:29 pm

    One must ask whether we will still be a free enterprise nation and whether we will still have economic freedom

    …says the asshole with $250,000,000.00

    I’m sure he feels positively straightjacketed.

  6. 6.

    Bnut

    June 7, 2012 at 3:29 pm

    Cam Ranh Bay sounds like a better PCS than Okinawa or Japan. Or Hawaii for that matter.

  7. 7.

    Raven

    June 7, 2012 at 3:29 pm

    Cam Rahn is ok, deep water port but Nha Trang and Dalat are where it’s at!

  8. 8.

    Mark S.

    June 7, 2012 at 3:29 pm

    From the link, it sounds like it could get a lot worse for ol’ Curt:

    Col. Steven G. O’Donnell, superintendent of the Rhode Island State Police, told the Journal today that his agency, the FBI, the U.S. Attorney’s office and the Rhode Island attorney general “are working together to investigate activities that have recently come to light at 38 Studios.”

    I wonder what that’s about.

  9. 9.

    Yutsano

    June 7, 2012 at 3:31 pm

    @Mark S.: Curiouser and curiouser said Alice.

  10. 10.

    rlrr

    June 7, 2012 at 3:31 pm

    Cost to repair the nuclear-powered attack submarine USS Miami after a fire in her torpedo and sonar spaces in drydock a couple weeks ago? $400 million.

    1/6 the cost of a brand new nuclear attack submarine.

    OR

    About the cost of an almost equally capable non-nuclear attack submarine.

  11. 11.

    SatanicPanic

    June 7, 2012 at 3:34 pm

    @4tehlulz: Damn, he’s going straight up Bircher. When does he start complaining about Flouride in our water supply?

  12. 12.

    rlrr

    June 7, 2012 at 3:37 pm

    @SatanicPanic:

    Purity of Essence and all that.

  13. 13.

    Rafer Janders

    June 7, 2012 at 3:37 pm

    tidal forces caused by the moon’s gravitational field have affected several experiments.

    Tides go in, tides go out. You can’t explain that.

  14. 14.

    rlrr

    June 7, 2012 at 3:39 pm

    @Rafer Janders:

    Bread goes in, toast comes out. You can’t explain that.

  15. 15.

    Jeff Spender

    June 7, 2012 at 3:39 pm

    @Rafer Janders:

    Tides go in, tides go out. You can’t explain that.

    Dude. Aliens.

    So Rmoney managed to get more money than Obama? Hardly surprising.

    November is going to be difficult. But I like a good fight.

  16. 16.

    Baud

    June 7, 2012 at 3:41 pm

    Obama is using the monthly fundraising loss in their donation emails. These two stats from the email are incredible:

    We know that only 15 percent of Romney’s May totals came from people giving less than $250, compared to 98 percent in that category for us.

    Together, our team raised more than $60 million in May — even more impressive when you hear that the average donation was about $55.

  17. 17.

    Belafon (formerly anonevent)

    June 7, 2012 at 3:41 pm

    @rlrr: You’ve got a sub that can stay under water for 3 months at a time, and the only reason for that short of a time is to get food?

  18. 18.

    rlrr

    June 7, 2012 at 3:43 pm

    Yes. But there’s only a few roles for attack subs which require that kind of endurance.

  19. 19.

    Jeff Spender

    June 7, 2012 at 3:43 pm

    @Baud:

    Obama is using the monthly fundraising loss in their donation emails. These two stats from the email are incredible…

    There’s no doubt Obama is getting more small donations than Romney, but Rmoney has the big money in his pocket. So the question is this: is it the amount of money or the number of donors that really matters.

    I’m not even going to go to the media for that answer, because I’m likely to get a shit-sandwich from those assholes. This is where you read the data and make your own conclusions, and ignore those bastards.

    And what the fuck is up with Jon Stewart lately? The show has been fucking awful. I am disappoint.

  20. 20.

    Amanda in the South Bay

    June 7, 2012 at 3:44 pm

    @rlrr:

    How exactly is a non-nuclear submarine just as capable?
    The only problem with fixing Miami is that she’s not getting any younger. I realize there’s a tendency to want to cut the military budget, but by sacrificing quality you get crap that the Navy doesn’t want (just like in the 70s, when Zumwalt wanted all those low end ships).

  21. 21.

    rlrr

    June 7, 2012 at 3:46 pm

    @Amanda in the South Bay:

    The one big advantage nuclear subs have is endurance. Many roles submarines fulfill do not require such endurance (being part of a carrier task force, for example).

  22. 22.

    slag

    June 7, 2012 at 3:47 pm

    @rlrr: Sure you can.

  23. 23.

    flukebucket

    June 7, 2012 at 3:47 pm

    With you 100% on Brian Banks. A sickening story that I would love to see have a happy ending.

    The Maurice Clarett story always made me kind of sick too but hell at least he was responsible for his mess.

  24. 24.

    Litlebritdifrnt

    June 7, 2012 at 3:48 pm

    Another headline long in the making. Charles Dyer, Oathkeeper, sentenced to 30 years for raping his 6 year old daughter.

    http://www.splcenter.org/blog/2012/06/05/oath-keeper-sentenced-to-30-years-for-daughters-rape/

    Of course all the wingnuts will claim he was framed.

  25. 25.

    rlrr

    June 7, 2012 at 3:48 pm

    @Amanda in the South Bay:

    At least nobody wants to bring back battleships (which have been obsolete since WWII) like Reagan did…

  26. 26.

    Argive

    June 7, 2012 at 3:50 pm

    @rlrr:

    But without battleships, how will we fight aliens?

  27. 27.

    gorram

    June 7, 2012 at 3:51 pm

    Is the new chapter in Vietnam-US relations because we both want to contain China?

  28. 28.

    rlrr

    June 7, 2012 at 3:52 pm

    @Argive:

    With Macintosh computers…

  29. 29.

    Raven

    June 7, 2012 at 3:56 pm

    @rlrr: They are moving the Iowa to Long Beach I hear.

  30. 30.

    j

    June 7, 2012 at 3:57 pm

    That $400 million submarine fire was caused by a faulty shop vac?!

    http://news.bostonherald.com/news/national/northeast/view/20120607navy_400_million_fire_on_nuke_sub_started_in_vacuum/srvc=home&position=recent

    I wonder how much that vacuum cost (once the mark-up was figured in)?

  31. 31.

    Baud

    June 7, 2012 at 3:57 pm

    @Jeff Spender:

    is it the amount of money or the number of donors that really matters.

    It’s the number of votes that matters, but I don’t know whether amount of money or number of donors is a better predictor of who will get the most votes.

    And what the fuck is up with Jon Stewart lately? The show has been fucking awful. I am disappoint.

    I haven’t watched him in months, but I could see signs of decline a while back. For some reason, some liberals have difficulty making the transition from one political era to another (for example, Olbermann, many lefty blogs, for Bush to Obama; Nader for a longer period of time).

  32. 32.

    Linda Featheringill

    June 7, 2012 at 3:59 pm

    @Litlebritdifrnt:

    Charles Dyer, Oathkeeper, sentenced to 30 years for raping his 6 year old daughter.

    That is good news. My best wishes go out to the child. And to folks like myself who never got justice.

    Maybe things are getting a little bit better. Just a little.

  33. 33.

    Soonergrunt

    June 7, 2012 at 3:59 pm

    @Argive: It seems that very few people really wanted to see the answer to that question.
    One thing they could do is cut the damaged part of of Miami and graft an undamaged front end from another sub that will be getting (or was recently) decommissioned. If memory serves, they’ve already done this once with a 788i boat that had been in a collision but I can’t remember which one.

  34. 34.

    Brachiator

    June 7, 2012 at 3:59 pm

    @Soonergrunt:

    Man cleared of rape charge after 5 years in prison gets NFL tryout.—No matter what happens, I’m rooting for Brian Banks.

    I listened to an interview with Mr Banks on one of the local radio stations here. A very sad story. I’m with you in rooting for the guy.

  35. 35.

    Ben Franklin

    June 7, 2012 at 4:00 pm

    Mannings lawyers are doing their job; defending him with vigor. The documents might be ‘fishing’, but it is quite possible there is exculpatory evidence. It is not unthinkable, they would withhold evidence that doesn’t help their prosecution.

    ‘Classified’ is a term used with great military convenience.

  36. 36.

    Raven

    June 7, 2012 at 4:00 pm

    @Raven: Pedro, I guess.

  37. 37.

    Amanda in the South Bay

    June 7, 2012 at 4:01 pm

    @rlrr:
    Which is a big problem, since our most likely adversary in a future war is China, and (I also believe the Navy has shifted most of its submarines to the Pacific already) the vast distances to go across the Pacific don’t help either. That’s assuming, of course, that the main job of Pacific fleet submarines will be to spend lots of time off the coast of China, to do stuff like lob cruise missiles, hunt Chinese SSBNs (making sure they are always covered) and protecting American carrier battle groups.

  38. 38.

    Roger Moore

    June 7, 2012 at 4:01 pm

    @rlrr:

    About the cost of an almost equally capable non-nuclear attack submarine.

    Ain’t no such thing. Diesel subs are better than nukes at some things- they’re damn quiet on batteries- but they simply can’t touch nukes on endurance, either for long range deployment or simply staying under water for a long time. Given that we’re very likely to be using our nukes a long way from home, it doesn’t make much sense to buy diesels; they just can’t do what we need them to.

  39. 39.

    S. cerevisiae

    June 7, 2012 at 4:10 pm

    @Soonergrunt: I can see them having to replace a lot of the hull, the fire may have made it more brittle. A ten hour fire is a hell of a lot of heat.

  40. 40.

    Ben Franklin

    June 7, 2012 at 4:12 pm

    @Roger Moore:

    One of the challenges of batteries is the technology is old. A Manhattan style project, or a prize (similar to the private space program) is needed to bring us into the 21st century, then we can dump those nukes.

  41. 41.

    rlrr

    June 7, 2012 at 4:14 pm

    @Roger Moore:

    One could use the same argument that all surface ships should be nuclear powered…

  42. 42.

    Soonergrunt

    June 7, 2012 at 4:16 pm

    @Ben Franklin: I agree with you 100% I’ve never suggested otherwise.
    That seems to me to be preparation for a case in mitigation, though. Whether something was improperly classified, or whether the result was damaging or not is immaterial to his guilt or innocence in downloading things he was not authorized to download and then sharing that information with a person or people to whom he was not authorized to share it.

  43. 43.

    Bex

    June 7, 2012 at 4:25 pm

    Rmoney impersonated a police officer in his youth? Saw the story just now on Kos and Huff Post.

  44. 44.

    yopd1

    June 7, 2012 at 4:26 pm

    I read the Brian Banks story and could not believe the calm manner in which he dealt with his accuser and the little things that were denied to him even after prison that he appreciated, like going to Sea World with his family.

    Seems fitting that he is probably going to the Seahawks and Pete Carroll, since he was originally supposed to go to USC. I also heard he got a job offer from the Diamondbacks in case he did not make a team.

  45. 45.

    Ben Franklin

    June 7, 2012 at 4:26 pm

    @Soonergrunt:

    case in mitigation

    It would seem so, since only 10 of 22 counts are being defended

  46. 46.

    Cluttered Mind

    June 7, 2012 at 4:31 pm

    Tide comes in, tide goes out. Tide interferes with Large Hadron Collidor. Never a miscommunication. You can’t explain that.

  47. 47.

    mai naem

    June 7, 2012 at 4:35 pm

    I don’t know crap abut submarines beyond the sandwich and the yellow one but, hey, if Mitt Romney and Sarah Palin can be experts so can I. How the fcuk can it cost 400 million dollars to fix, well, really anything? That is ridiculous. Just sayin’

    Also too, was channel surfing and was stupid enough to tune into Neal Conan and TOTN and they were discussing Native American ancestry – basically a response to Elizabeth Warren. Really?????? I don’t listen to TOTN precisely because of this crap. Just wondering if they’ve covered Scott Brown and his hypocritical votes.

  48. 48.

    Amanda in the South Bay

    June 7, 2012 at 4:37 pm

    @Soonergrunt:
    Yeah, that’s the real problem-the 688s are getting old. I suppose the correct answer depends on how old Miami is, and how much longer she has to go.

  49. 49.

    The Dangerman

    June 7, 2012 at 4:38 pm

    No matter what happens, I’m rooting for Brian Banks.

    Indeed…

    …and I’m also rooting for the young woman that got $1.5M for her lie to have to cough it back up. I try not to use the word Bitch in the direction of a specific person, but this fucking bitch needs to be ruined.

    If Banks catches on with a team, can I buy in to the futures on his book/movie? One hell of a story if it has a really happy ending (it’s already happy, now let’s see if he gets to the “really happy” ending).

  50. 50.

    fuzz

    June 7, 2012 at 4:42 pm

    @gorram:

    Everything I’ve heard and read points to yes. It makes sense, we both have the same interests in this case and remember that Vietnam fought a war with China not long ago, they’ve never really been allies, even during the war with us Vietnam was always more of a Moscow proxy.

  51. 51.

    FlipYrWhig

    June 7, 2012 at 4:43 pm

    @Jeff Spender: Do you mean the WI recall stuff?

  52. 52.

    Amir Khalid

    June 7, 2012 at 4:44 pm

    @Litlebritdifrnt:
    A side note. This story names a rapist and describes his family connection to the victim — who is thus publicly identified, even though she’s not explicitly named. Given the stigma unfairly suffered by victims of sex crimes, it’s not news media practice to identify them unless/until they publicly identify themselves first. I would have omitted the rapist’s name or left the relationship unmentioned to avoid identifying the victim, who in this case was a very young minor.

  53. 53.

    Brachiator

    June 7, 2012 at 4:48 pm

    Odd and sad little story from Jezebel

    Only 1 in 3 Women Think War Has Been Declared on Them
    __
    Kaiser’s May 2012 poll focused on the sort of private-made-public issues that have probably been driving your blood pressure up for the last few months (abortion restrictions, forced ultrasounds, conservative pandering, liberal counterpandering, men complaining to Congress that women exercising their rights was a violation of their religious freedom, the Violence Against Some Women Act, opposition to fair pay, contraception-related slut shaming, shame shaming, shame slutting, etc). Pollsters asked women how they felt about all the fuckery that’s been going on over the last year, whether they think there’s a “wide-scale effort to limit women’s reproductive health choices and services, such as abortion, family planning, and contraception.” Only 31% said that they agreed that a conspiracy was afoot. A full 45% said that gee gosh by golly, it sure seemed like there was a lot of lady related stuff going on, but that it’s all probably just unrelated, independent stuff not tied to any central group or long-term strategy.

    There’s a Roland Kirk jazz tune that comes to mind, Volunteer Slavery

  54. 54.

    Roger Moore

    June 7, 2012 at 4:49 pm

    @rlrr:

    One could use the same argument that all surface ships should be nuclear powered…

    Surface ships don’t have trouble getting air to run their engines. A sub is really only worth something when it’s submerged and free to operate as deep as it needs to go. Bring a diesel sub to the surface to run under diesel power and/or recharge its batteries, and it’s basically a slow, isolated, poorly defended surface ship.

  55. 55.

    gelfling545

    June 7, 2012 at 4:53 pm

    @rlrr: Goodness, no. That would be rude and uncivil.

  56. 56.

    Amanda in the South Bay

    June 7, 2012 at 4:55 pm

    @Roger Moore:

    I think there’s also the value in a peak oil world of having your navy being independent of dwindling oil supplies.

  57. 57.

    JGabriel

    June 7, 2012 at 4:56 pm

    The US and Viet Nam are in talks to allow the US to base some naval assets in Cam Ranh Bay

    But Cuba is still embargoed … why, again? I mean, the embargo has been in place for 52 years and Fidel is still there. The Cold War ended in 1989, 23 years ago. At what point do we say, hey, maybe this embargo thingamabob isn’t working that good?

    .

  58. 58.

    Soonergrunt

    June 7, 2012 at 4:56 pm

    @mai naem: The main way it can cost that much money is because the submarines of that class ceased construction in 1996. Of the original 62 built, the last 42 are currently operational, and they upgrade and change the class over time. Result is that many of the parts that were destroyed will have to be fabricated by hand by a very very select few people who know how to do that, and many of the parts will have to be one-off’s since all of the 688i boats are still in service, there’s not much that can be recycled from deactivated boats.

  59. 59.

    Soonergrunt

    June 7, 2012 at 4:58 pm

    @JGabriel: “But Cuba is still embargoed … why, again?” Because the Vietnamese-American community is not as concentrated in any one swing state like the Cuban-American community. SATSQ.

  60. 60.

    Judas Escargot, Your Postmodern Neighbor

    June 7, 2012 at 5:03 pm

    @j:

    I wonder how much that vacuum cost

    What’s funny is that in some filing cabinet somewhere, there’s a document with a title along the lines of:

    WS 54321: HARDWARE REQUIREMENTS SPECIFICATION FOR THE ELECTRICALLY-POWERED RAPID AIR INTAKE MOBILE CLEANING APPLIANCE (EPRAIMCA), (designation Mk99B), Rev A-“.

    Paper trails are important…

  61. 61.

    Heliopause

    June 7, 2012 at 5:07 pm

    I haven’t read all the comments in all the open threads but has anybody brought up ABL’s pseudo-apology to Glenn Greenwald?

  62. 62.

    Roger Moore

    June 7, 2012 at 5:09 pm

    @Amanda in the South Bay:

    I think there’s also the value in a peak oil world of having your navy being independent of dwindling oil supplies.

    Too bad the Republicans are trying to stop our military from experimenting with biofuels, then, isn’t it.

  63. 63.

    Mnemosyne

    June 7, 2012 at 5:15 pm

    @The Dangerman:

    I wouldn’t worry too much about punishment for her — prosecutors really, really don’t like it when you make them look like fools in front of the entire country, and Los Angeles County prosecutors are especially vindictive like that. (See also Polanski, Roman.)

    I’m guessing that any plea deal that she’s offered for what will probably be multiple charges of making a false report and perjury will include at least a little jail time.

    Though, really, WTF is up with contacting her victim through Facebook? Like he’s going to say, “Oh, ha-ha, yeah, making me spend five years in prison for a crime I didn’t commit was a funny joke. Let’s let bygones be bygones.”

  64. 64.

    Mnemosyne

    June 7, 2012 at 5:16 pm

    @Heliopause:

    Yes. So you’re bringing up a dead issue because … ?

  65. 65.

    PJ

    June 7, 2012 at 5:19 pm

    @gorram:
    The Vietnamese, even the Communists, always wanted to be friends with the US. Ho Chi Minh looked to the US to keep the French from reestablishing their empire after WWII and got the cold shoulder. They were kind of naive about it, too – they approached the State Dept. after the Vietnam War to see if the US would be so kind as to send aid dollars to rebuild the country. (They didn’t realize that the difference between rebuilding Germany and Japan after WWII and their case was the difference between winning and losing.) And, yes, the Vietnamese distrust and fear the Chinese and would rather have our presence than theirs.

  66. 66.

    Brachiator

    June 7, 2012 at 6:08 pm

    @Heliopause:

    I haven’t read all the comments in all the open threads but has anybody brought up ABL’s pseudo-apology to Glenn Greenwald?

    I don’t even know what the underlying controversy was about, let alone any apologies, pseudo or otherwise.

  67. 67.

    David Koch

    June 7, 2012 at 6:36 pm

    tidal forces caused by the moon’s gravitational field have affected several experiments.

    Who’s gonna break the news to BillO?

  68. 68.

    MCA1

    June 7, 2012 at 6:43 pm

    Can we just note the irony in pulled by his own bootstraps bloody socks Schilling now using the bankruptcy courts run by the overregulating gubmint to unwind his failure of a business enterprise? I know it’s just a cherry on top of the taking gov’t loan guarantees and other funding, but it’s sort of humorous, anyway.

    Is it Chapter 7 or 13? Given that they pinkslipped all the employees a few weeks ago, I’m guessing this is 7. It’ll be interesting to hear what his real, actual equity loss is. Also, it might be Peak Schadenfreude if it turns out the extra shenanigans the RI AG is apparently investigating included some kind of accounting trickery, and we learn he hasn’t actually put his own money into the venture the way he says he has (or that, contrarily, he has, and proves to the world he’s dumber than a sack of fucking hammers and has lost $70M).

  69. 69.

    Heliopause

    June 7, 2012 at 6:47 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    Yes.

    Cool, can you tell me which thread it was in? Thanks.

    @Brachiator:

    This is a link to a piece by Raw Story’s editor, it contains a link at the end to ABL’s piece. I assume you can find Greenwald’s blog if you wish to read his perspective.

  70. 70.

    Roger Moore

    June 7, 2012 at 6:52 pm

    @PJ:

    And, yes, the Vietnamese distrust and fear the Chinese and would rather have our presence than theirs.

    The US interfered when Vietnam was having a Civil War. China invaded. The worst thing they can expect the US to do to them is to meddle. China could plausibly try to annex the country. Preferring us to China is completely sensible realpolitic.

  71. 71.

    Just Some Fuckhead

    June 7, 2012 at 7:55 pm

    The US and Viet Nam are in talks to allow the US to base some naval assets in Cam Ranh Bay, and additional talks are under way to sell weapons to the Vietnamese. The world turns, doesn’t it?

    Damn, it almost makes me regret spitting on soldiers returning from Vietnam.

  72. 72.

    j

    June 7, 2012 at 8:36 pm

    @Judas Escargot, Your Postmodern Neighbor: HA! Don’t I know it. I worked for a place that had government contracts and we had no idea what they were talking about with all those stupid acronyms.

    We just renamed them, so if the boss came by and asked how things were going we’d say “We’re working on goose farts, fish piss and pig burps” and he’s tell us to keep up the good work. (He was a “hands off” kind of boss when it came to the stuff he didn’t understand, but “hands on” the Jack Daniels during work hours, just so he didn’t have to understand stuff. As long as we were making him money is all that mattered.

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