Father Benedict Groeschel calls Jerry Sandusky a “poor guy” and adds this (via Atrios):
“People have this picture in their minds of a person planning to – a psychopath. But that’s not the case. Suppose you have a man having a nervous breakdown, and a youngster comes after him. A lot of the cases, the youngster — 14, 16, 18 — is the seducer,” Groeschel is quoted as saying in the interview, which is no longer available on the paper’s website.
The interview, billed as a reflection on the 25 years since Groeschel founded the Franciscan Friars of the Renewal order, covered many topics, but has gained attention for Groeschel’s comments on child sex abuse.
“Well, it’s not so hard to see. A kid looking for a father and didn’t have his own — and they won’t be planning to get into heavy-duty sex, but almost romantic, embracing, kissing, perhaps sleeping, but not having intercourse or anything like that. I’s an understandable thing, and you know where you find it, among other clergy or important people; you look at teachers, attorneys, judges, social workers,” he said.
So I guess when a priest rapes, it’s not legitimate rape? Or is it non-forcible rape? Between the Republicans and Catholics lately, I just can’t keep my rape types straight. All I know is that when you ask old white guys about rape, you find that there’s very little of it, and most of it was solicited in some often imperceptable way.
BTW, this guy has a PhD in Psychology from Columbia.
Richard
Vile.
tulip
Sometimes I so wish that there was a hell so these motherfuckers could burn forever in it.
Every.last.one.of.them.
Villago Delenda Est
This asshole first needs to be defrocked, and then be beheaded.
c u n d gulag
Ok, someone please explain to me one more time how it is that we Liberals are the moral degenerates?
wenchacha
Dude belongs at the Church of Jesus H. Christ.
Captain Haddock
If it were up to me I’d be getting a search warrant for this guys computer posthaste. He’s just a little too sympathetic on this issue.
Cassidy
I think he should go ask the, now adult, victim if he was asking for it…to his face. I’d imagine it won’t end well.
Brachiator
Benedict Groeschel is a despicable piece of shit.
Hawes
As far as his PhD goes, that’s like giving robbers MBAs.
Oh, we did that already.
beltane
@Captain Haddock: Makes you wonder how many children have “seduced” this dirty old lecher.
Elizabelle
Someone’s career and contacts are about to receive a fine-toothed combing.
Projection? Trying to disperse the guilt?
That Ph.D. might be an attempt at “physician, heal thyself.”
Elizabelle
The previous blogpost title could fit this post as well.
Linda Featheringill
That statement is interesting because Sandusky didn’t get into trouble for going after 16-year-old guys. One wonders why the Good Father is so upset about hypersexual teenagers? Hmmm?
jgaugust
I know we can’t retroactively take back degrees, but man, I wish my alma mater could do that right now. This “man of God” is vile and disgusting.
Legalize
Anyone who calls Sandusky a “poor guy” needs a knock on the door from the FBI.
Villago Delenda Est
@Elizabelle:
A very perceptive observation.
Fits perfectly.
Fits right into the general notion that there are very few examples of “legitimate” rape, because, nearly every single time, the rapist is the true victim of foul seduction.
Dork
Repugnant
NancyDarling
Moral depravity, thy name is Benedict Groeschel.
john personna
I need to go wash my eyeballs.
SatanicPanic
Speak for yourself creep.
Hoodie
You left out the worst part:
Wow.
dr. bloor
Wiki has him as an Ed.D., and yes, there’s a difference.
Of course, he’s an asshole regardless.
Peter
I propose that the category ‘assholes’ be amended to read ‘disgusting assholes’.
All in favor?
Schlemizel
He really must know that his company sells pure bullshit. If there was even the slightest chance that there really is a Hell he would be a lot more careful about this sort of sin.
Nethead Jay
I don’t have words harsh enough for this.
Other than yeah, search warrant for his house and computer, stat.
David Hunt
The fact that this individual was not instantly smote by lightning after uttering those words (notwithstanding his probable presence inside a building) is strong evidence against the existence of a just god.
jgaugust
@Hoodie: Is it sad that I’m not even surprised people say this kind of putrid bullshit anymore?
gene108
Finally, someone coming out and standing up for what’s right.
Sluts are ruining this country, by shamelessly corrupting the morals of men – both young and old – and it’s about time people quit trembling in fear of offending these sluts.
It’s even worse, when you have gay sluts corrupting priests.
/snark.
JustAnotherBob
If the Roman Catholic Church had any morals at all Father Benedict Groeschel would already be on a plane to a remote mountain monastery where he would spend the rest of his life in silent prayer.
Villago Delenda Est
@gene108:
This really is one of those Akin moments, where they tell us exactly what they think, and what they mean.
We’re the victims, here. These foul incubi/succubi are draining our precious bodily fluids! The pedophile is the innocent, pure as the driven snow victim of these tiny sexual predators.
Through the looking glass, indeed.
danah gaz (fka gaz)
Ignoring the obvious question of course:
If an adult is approached by a child, and the child attempts (for whatever reason) to seduce said adult, does the adult:
A) Engage in sexual activities with the child?
B) Not engage in sexual activities with the minor, and depending on the particulars of the situation maybe attempt to contact the parents of said minor, or whatever the situation warrants.
I mean, FFS, who is the ADULT in the situation?
Ethics, they haz it.
/headdesk.
kindness
Naaa. This guy has a PhD in Bullshit.
Linda Featheringill
@Villago Delenda Est: #16
Very true. And very like the Taliban.
Roger Moore
@Hoodie:
Ugh. I’m thinking, “Well, when the
Presidenta priest does it, that means that it is not illegal.”Zifnab
@Schlemizel: This. No one turned me on to Atheism faster than the various religious “leaders” in this country. How true a believe can you possibly be if you’re willing to act this shamelessly?
tulip
@JustAnotherBob:
Fuck that.
He should be in prison, trying to distinguish between forcible rape and legitimate rape.
edit: that’s assuming he’s done the sexual thing with little boys that is.
trollhattan
Jesus, that’s pathological, quite literally. Why can’t we open a RICO case on these assholes?
Linda Featheringill
@Schlemizel:
That has been true of Princes of the Church for a long time.
Although not necessarily true of the Religious People lower down in the organization. To use a Renaissance example, just because the Pope is a fornicating asshole it doesn’t follow that every nun is a harlot.
Brachiator
@Hoodie:
There is something very perverse about the way that he talks about “any responsible person.”
He appears to reverse the idea that a clergyman or teacher has a duty to protect the young, and instead wants to present “responsible people” as inherently innocent, preyed upon by lacivious teens who are seeking to force themselves on hapless adults who they trick into having sex.
Truly repulsive.
Villago Delenda Est
Those teenage hustlers, they’re controlling my mind! And my dick! I can’t stop myself! Someone saaaaaaaave me!
danah gaz (fka gaz)
@trollhattan: Like wall street – the longer they go unpunished, the worse it will get. =(
But hey! let’s just put some more money in the collection plate. Who does it hurt, amirite? It’s TRADITION! or something.
The Red Pen
@c u n d gulag:
Because shut up.
Liberals are the real racists, also too.
LanceThruster
@tulip:
Interesting point. As an atheist, I’ve remarked that you could almost consider them “our” people, as who but someone who knows their Magic Sky Daddy is bullshlt would so hypocritically use it to violate children. I mean, if they really felt there was a deep dark corner of hell reserved for them, and could still go ahead with it, then they’re either full-on masochists, or their monkey is just that strong.
Percysowner
It sounds like Father Benedict Groeschel has a nice TV gig. If I were a parent and he happened to have been in my parish at any time when he had access to my underaged child, I would be asking that child some pretty pointed questions, even if my kid was 50 and I was 74. To quote Cordelia on Angel “There’s not enough ick in the world,”.
Anoniminous
A unique interpretation of “Let the little children come unto me” but not, on the whole, a moral one.
Very much NOT Safe for Work.
Interrobang
@Hoodie: I think I just threw up in my mouth. Lunch was nowhere near as good the second time.
Ew ew ew. I’ve about had it up to here with rape apologists. I can well imagine what actual rape survivors (rather than just the garden variety sexual assault stuff I’ve been through) must be feeling about this, because it makes me want to run off and join a female-separatist commune.
shortstop
@Villago Delenda Est: The real outrage here is your threat of violence in a blog comment thread against this man, and…wait, what? Raped children?
Oh. Right. Let me be the last to say that raping children = bad.
/frankburnsesq
danimal
@danah gaz (fka gaz): There is nothing a 14 year old could say or do that would seduce me. And I don’t think that makes me special, it just makes me adult. Jeez. It’s beyond words that this ‘priest’ could blame the victim in this way.
Are we sure this quote isn’t from The Onion?
LGRooney
So, a position of authority or responsibility doesn’t really mean what I have thought it meant all these years?
Culture of Truth
That’s some sick shit.
He’s remarkably candid here, though I must say.
Not to go all Godwin, what would be the point, but here we have a true clash a values.
No, I don’t think we’re (we, normal moral humans) are going to find any “common ground” with this fiend.
Gin & Tonic
What’s amusing is that the way the ABC headline abbreviates down to a URL, it comes out as abcnews.go.com/US/catholic-priest-rev-benedict-groeschel-defends-child-sex/ which, if you ask me, is more accurate and revealing than the actual headline.
? Martin
Like so many things, it’s only easy to see if you are trying really hard to see it.
Alias Undercover
(Semi Regular Poster here, posting under a pseudonym for reasons which will become clear in a moment)
You know, I’m in one of the professions named by Father Groeschel. And I have been in the situation where “a kid looking for a father and didnāt have his [in my case her] own,” etc. offered me intimacy. And I will go farther and say I was in a pretty bad way emotionally myself at the time.
And you know what? I still didn’t fuck the child. Because I was clinically depressed, not a goddamn monster.
Hoodie
@Brachiator: This kind of perversion of the duty of care is rampant, particularly in modern conservative politics, but it’s particularly disturbing in someone who is supposed to be a “servant.” Do these guys even read the shit they say they believe in?
Mnemosyne
And Jerry Sandusky was just unlucky enough to run across 12 of “those kinds” of kids? He must be the unluckiest man in the world for it to have coincidentally happened to him so many times.
To one extent, he’s kind of right — troubled teenagers do sometimes throw themselves at adults, usually because they were molested previously and think that any adult being kind to them is doing it to get sex. But he seems to have missed the whole part of morality where it’s the adult’s responsibility to reject any advances.
danah gaz (fka gaz)
@danimal: I find it sad, if not more than a bit frightening, that so many people put their faith into these people (literally) as some sort of moral and spiritual leaders.
They are perverts, opportunists, and sociopaths. Full stop.
And when you call one of their followers/enablers out they are like – it’s okay, har har, you’re a bigot and I’m only a cafeteria Catholic – and hey! look! over there! – or one of the endless variations on those themes.
There’s no daylight between the RCC and NAMBLA. Own it, assholes.
SatanicPanic
@danah gaz (fka gaz): It still shocks me that in this day and age they came on to me is still being offered as an excuse
danah gaz (fka gaz)
@SatanicPanic: yeah, no kidding.
Reggie Mantle
Well, WP ate my original, so let’s try again.
I’m a semi regular poster, posting under a pseudonym for reasons which will become clear in a moment.
You know what? I’m in one of those professions the Father described, and I’ve had a “kid looking for a father and didnāt have his own [her in my case]” offer me intimacy. And, truth be told, I was in a pretty bad emotional place at the time. But I didn’t fuck a child. Because I was clinically depressed, not a goddamn monster.
Rommie
Yeah, it not so hard to see things when seeing them will blow up your worldview. You’d think admission of an error was Sin #1 in the Holy Bible sometimes.
LanceThruster
@danah gaz (fka gaz):
And the RNC, also too, because Alan Keyes and Rick Santorum both spoke about the temptation of homosexuality.
Btw, I know “homosexual” does not in any way equal “pedophile” but rather was commenting on the similar claim/defense that forces stronger than their will is what they struggle with.
danah gaz (fka gaz)
@LanceThruster: to be fair, I’m not willing to go that far.
Why?
Because when I say the RCC, it’s enablers – it’s supporters, are proponents of child-rape I MEAN EVERY FUCKING WORD. I can draw a clear and direct line between anybody that puts money in the plate, and child-rape. Period.
I wouldn’t go there with the RNC, and frankly, I think it diminishes the atrocity of the Catholic Church, and it’s apologists/supporters.
Betsy
Jeez!
As between the two people who had the sex, how about we believe the person who says they *didn’t* agree to it instead of the person who *did* want it.
And, as between a child and an adult, how about we expect the adult to be accountable for what took place, instead of the child??
Where on EARTH did this fartwink get his values?
The Ancient Randonneur
I always thought Franciscans would be more into bestiality. Oh well, shows you what I know.
LanceThruster
@danah gaz (fka gaz):
Fair enough. Maybe I’ve just been conditioned by seeing IOKIYAR applied to literally every possible outrage.
danah gaz (fka gaz)
@The Ancient Randonneur: that made me laugh. considering the subject of this thread, that’s no small feat.
Dream On
Stay away from him on a Saturday night.
danah gaz (fka gaz)
@LanceThruster: OTOH, I think it’s fair to say that Paul Ryan is not only anti-woman, but pro-rapist.
danah gaz (fka gaz)
@Dream On: also on sundays.
cay
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtzqvqzBdUQ&feature=player_embedded
Villago Delenda Est
@Betsy:
The Vatican City discount values emporium.
The Moar You Know
Raping kids is awesome, especially when they ask you to do it.
Kathy in St. Louis
I don’t know about you folks, but to me, this sounds just a whole lot like a guy who has used this excuse to cover up for himself or his friends for a long time. Must make him feel a whole lot better. Only one flaw.
There is a reason that so many of these fatherless boys would do this, if his argument had any merit. It would be because they were chosen by the perps who became sexaully active with them just because they were fatherless boys, and, therefore, vulnerable. What an incredibly creepy bullshit excuse this is. If I were there policde department anywhere this man has ever lived, I’d be checking him out against any unsolved sex abuse crimes in the community.
Violet
This is so horrible. Hell isn’t bad enough for them.
Villago Delenda Est
@Kathy in St. Louis:
That was the entire thrust of Jerry Sandusky’s foundation. To take in “troubled boys” who would be prime material in exactly this way. He insinuated himself into a target rich environment for precisely that reason, knowing that these kids were going to be much more vulnerable, more suggestable, and probably less likely to report what was done to them.
Kathy in St. Louis
@Mnemosyne: Very well said. He also seemed to miss the point about responsiblity and his own personal vows. I don’t trust a man who would make such an argument in Sandusky’s defense not to have been involved in similar situations. It sounds far too close to personal justification for me.
I couldn’t help but think of Fr. Maciel, who founded the Legionaries of Christ and diddled countless young men put into his care by their pious Catholic families to study for the priesthood.
Kathy in St. Louis
@Villago Delenda Est: I also think Sandusky, being an important guy who coached teams, made them feel more important because he was semi famous in their area. Football tickets and access to a college program probably made up for some of the things they missed from a father. To say that guys like this are despicable is a true understatement. To listen to this priest defend him makes me want to throw up.
Suffern ACE
@Mnemosyne: That’s kind of what I was thinking. But then that’s the risk you take when you set up a foundation to do charitable works for these at risk fatherless kids types. Think of his acts as his ultimate sacrifice the children and it looks very different.
Suffern ACE
@Mnemosyne: That’s kind of what I was thinking. But then that’s the risk you take when you set up a foundation to do charitable works for these at risk fatherless kids types. Think of his acts as his ultimate sacrifice the children and it looks very different.
kerFuFFler
One simple FACT gives lie to his repulsive premise that the youths seduce their pedophile rapists. Pedophiles victimize a string of children a la Sandusky. If the children were seducing the adults you would not be seeing adults who had been seduced over and over by a series of children.
I suspect many of these creeps believe they were seduced—–but only because they are wrong in the head.
Comrade Dread
Bull. Shit.
You do not defend child rapists. It is a child whose innocence you are destroying.
And as I recall, Jesus said it would be better to have a heavy stone tied around your neck and get thrown into the ocean than if you harmed a child. Even if you weren’t an active participant, I can’t imagine He’d be all that happy if you were covering it up for your buddies and defending their conduct by blaming their victims.
God, this disgusts me.
kerFuFFler
One simple FACT gives lie to his repulsive premise that the youths seduce their pedophile rapists. Pedophiles victimize a string of children a la Sandusky. If the children were seducing the adults you would not be seeing adults who had been seduced over and over by a series of children.
I suspect many of these creeps believe they were seduced—–but only because they are wrong in the head.
hoppipolla
that the RC church presumes to any moral authority at all is beyond my capacity to understand. ditto that anyone at this late date would voluntarily associate themselves with this pack of depraved scum. i’m looking at you, Garry Wills (whom i otherwise respect hugely).
and how did i manage to inhabit this earth for 56+ years without ever before encountering the word “fartwink”? i’m going to use it at least twice a day from here on out.
D0n Camillo
If those kids hadn’t been wearing those slutty little altar boy outfits, this never would have happened. They were asking for it.
hoppipolla
that the RC church presumes to any moral authority at all is beyond my capacity to understand. ditto that anyone at this late date would voluntarily associate themselves with this pack of depraved scum. i’m looking at you, Garry Wills (whom i otherwise respect hugely).
and how did i manage to inhabit this earth for 56+ years without ever before encountering the word “fartwink”? i’m going to use it at least twice a day from here on out.
D0n Camillo
If those kids hadn’t been wearing those slutty little altar boy outfits, this never would have happened. They were asking for it.
hoppipolla
that the RC church presumes to any moral authority at all is beyond my capacity to understand. ditto that anyone at this late date would voluntarily associate themselves with this pack of depraved scum. i’m looking at you, Garry Wills (whom i otherwise respect hugely).
and how did i manage to inhabit this earth for 56+ years without ever before encountering the word “fartwink”? i’m going to use it at least twice a day from here on out.
NCSteve
Who could ever have dreamed that the Church would put an old guy in a cassock who would ever say such a thing on the Vatican
propagandatelevision station? And my faith in the probity and moral authority of the Church was so high before this.NCSteve
Who could ever have dreamed that the Church would put an old guy in a cassock on the Vatican
propagandatelevision station to say such a thing? And my trust in the moral authority of the Church and probity of its clergy was so high before this.RedKitten
You know, that’s actually not a bad idea. Too bad Jesus’ followers seem to be happy to ignore those particular words.
It depresses me. I can understand parents trusting priests back before the lid blew off this thing. But nowadays? I know some priests who seem to be very nice men. I still wouldn’t let my kid spend any time alone with any of them.
greenergood
“Suppose you have a man having a nervous breakdown, and a youngster comes after him. A lot of the cases, the youngsterā14, 16, 18āis the seducer,ā
I read this, my jaw dropped, literally, and then I started to cry because my Bronx Irish-Catholic 80-odd year old mom will believe this bas***d,and I will have to either grit-my-teeth listen, or try and argue with her when I see her. I cannot believe how many Catholics (Ireland, USA, UK, etc.) let stuff go like this because they think it’s more important that the church just carry regardless.
ruemara
Covenant House. I used to help fundraise for them. I truly believed in what they were doing. When the founder was accused of sex abuse, that was the last time I ever trusted a priest.
hoppipolla
sorry about the triple post. i swear i hit submit button only once! FYWP
NorthLeft12
As a Catholic who no longer attends church or supports the church in any way, comments like these just reinforce that my wife and I have made the right decision.
I never had an issue with the church supporting those Priests who committed these
sinscrimes, but not to the point that they covered up their crimes, further punish and persecute the victims of those crimes, and finally try and rationalize or blame the victims for those crimes. Really, is that so much to ask?LanceThruster
@hoppipolla:
Word Press must be very proud that they have an acronym meme (FYWP).
Mandalay
@mistermix
Somewhat OT, but don’t forget “honest rape” as well, courtesy of Ron Paul:
https://balloon-juice.com/2012/02/05/ron-paul-abortion-and-honest-rape/
At the time I was amazed that his comments were largely ignored, especially given that he was advocating a morning-after-abortion (only) for “honest” rape. So it is hardly surprising that when other Republicans were piling on Todd “Legitimate Rape” Akin, Ron “Honest Rape” Paul refused to comment.
Sgaile-beairt
Interesting how the media is leaving out that Rev. Groeschel started one of those “ex-gays” programs many years ago….
http://www.renewamerica.com/columns/abbott/071013
El Cid
This main is politely screaming to all who might hear ‘I AM A PEDOPHILE’.
danah gaz (fka gaz)
@El Cid: I hear the new pope-mobile plays the Mr. Softee theme song and has “Free Candy” painted on the side
ms badger
@Peter: Aye, fucking Aye!
ms badger
@Peter: Aye, fucking Aye!
PS. Read every day, don’t post unless a comment about assholes pisses me really off.
jon
@Betsy: Fartwink? That man needs to be kept far from any twinks. And HE knows what that means.
AA+ Bonds
That’s a strange way to talk about Catholics who were raped as young men.
Narcissus
these fuckers are just evil
Lyrebird
@Alias Undercover:
Yeah.
(pardon boring word choice.)
Apparently in a dark hour you *did* remember who was the adult in the situation. (thank you danah gaz)
What makes me triply ill reading this guys quotes is that I still remember little nuances from the Sandusky trial testimony. Young man after young man talking about edging away and avoiding and disliking the very very beginning stages of their abuser’s abuse. (vocab fail again. this does make me ill.)
This supposed reverend… UGH.