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Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

The low info voters probably won’t even notice or remember by their next lap around the goldfish bowl.

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Peak wingnut was a lie.

SCOTUS: It’s not “bribery” unless it comes from the Bribery region of France. Otherwise, it’s merely “sparkling malfeasance”.

Sadly, there is no cure for stupid.

They were going to turn on one another at some point. It was inevitable.

There are no moderate republicans – only extremists and cowards.

These days, even the boring Republicans are nuts.

Disagreements are healthy; personal attacks are not.

Take hopelessness and turn it into resilience.

It’s pointless to bring up problems that can only be solved with a time machine.

Balloon Juice, where there is always someone who will say you’re doing it wrong.

The words do not have to be perfect.

When I decide to be condescending, you won’t have to dream up a fantasy about it.

The line between political reporting and fan fiction continues to blur.

Marge, god is saying you’re stupid.

This fight is for everything.

Hey hey, RFK, how many kids did you kill today?

Too often we confuse noise with substance. too often we confuse setbacks with defeat.

If you still can’t see these things even now, maybe politics isn’t your forte and you should stop writing about it.

“When somebody takes the time to draw up a playbook, they’re gonna use it.”

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If ‘weird’ was the finish line, they ran through the tape and kept running.

Republicans: The threats are dire, but my tickets are non-refundable!

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You are here: Home / Elections / Election 2012 / Open Thread: Voters Not Giving Up on Obama

Open Thread: Voters Not Giving Up on Obama

by Anne Laurie|  August 31, 20125:42 pm| 109 Comments

This post is in: Election 2012, Open Threads, Republican Stupidity, All we want is life beyond the thunderdome, Our Failed Media Experiment, Romney of the Uncanny Valley, Schadenfreude

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Much to the disappointment of the horse-race-oriented media, eventheliberal NYTimes:

…After month after month of disappointing job numbers, poll after poll showing dissatisfaction in his economic performance and hundreds of millions of dollars in negative advertisements, a large portion of wavering voters maintain a personal attachment to Mr. Obama, and a tentative willingness to give him more time to get it right, top strategists with both campaigns agree.

That is a testament, perhaps, to the power of that scene four years ago when Mr. Obama and his family crossed the threshold of the White House as its first African-American tenants, “an inspiring moment that so many have awaited so long” as former President George W. Bush — the man he was so hard on in 2008 — put it then….

Most challengers face the relatively clinical task of persuading voters to fire the incumbent. Mr. Romney faces the more fraught mission of persuading them to break up with the incumbent….

It is Mr. Romney’s job now to convince them that it is beyond repair; that the risks of staying in it are larger than the risks of starting anew with him, that he and Mr. Ryan represent a fresh start akin to a generational change.

But leading these voters — many of them women — to that conclusion takes finesse and delicacy, Republican strategists say. The sort of visceral attacks that conservative talk show hosts are calling for risk sending them into a defense posture on behalf of Mr. Obama and, more to the point, of their own decisions four years ago.

Rather, strategists say, it requires providing a path that gives them permission to make a break. They need to be told that it is O.K. to remain proud of their initial support for Mr. Obama, but that they can be equally at peace with a decision to change their minds now….

… [I]n what amounted to perhaps the most forceful and effective portion of his address, Mr. Romney sought to give Mr. Obama’s wavering 2008 voters a strong nudge from what he portrayed as a reverie, saying they have given the president time enough. “Americans have been patient; Americans have supported this president in good faith,” he said to a roar in the hall. “Today the time has come to turn the page.” …

And that goes to the other part of the equation here: Even if Mr. Romney’s campaign continues to make inroads on the firing part, it has to make up ground on the hiring part, with polls showing him as lagging Mr. Obama on several personal “likability” measures.

“They see this guy as wealthy, disconnected, not like me,” Margaret Spellings, Mr. Bush’s former education secretary, said of wavering Obama voters during an interview here on Thursday. She said those voters were looking for “the humanity side,” of Mr. Romney, which his campaign did so much to present during this convention.

Ms. Spellings suggested that Mr. Romney had so far failed to overcome Mr. Obama decisively among undecided voters only because “some of them haven’t been paying attention.” …

Shorter GOP strategists: Stupid frigging voters! We blew hundreds of millions offering the best simulacra of a ‘new & improved’ presidential-administration-to-be money could buy, and you’re channel-surfing or hitting the can! No fair That Black Man in Our White House should rudely insist on being competent AND charismatic at the same time!

At least they have the consolation of knowing that Willard “Mitt” Romney is going to take the brunt of the post-election abuse, since that guy can’t even sell raw greed and naked prejudice to an arena full of RNC delegates with any success.

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109Comments

  1. 1.

    TenguPhule

    August 31, 2012 at 5:49 pm

    , since that guy can’t even sell raw greed and naked prejudice to an arena full of RNC delegates with any success.

    Untrue. The Dogs will follow him as long as there is bloody red meat in his hands. When there isn’t, they’ll devour him.

    /with all due apologies to dogs, of course.

  2. 2.

    David Koch

    August 31, 2012 at 5:50 pm

    Go ahead, make my day, Twitter.

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/08/31/1126187/-Eastwood-Punks-Romney

  3. 3.

    danah gaz (fka gaz)

    August 31, 2012 at 5:50 pm

    “Most challengers face the relatively clinical task of persuading voters to fire the incumbent. Mr. Romney faces the more fraught mission of persuading them to break up with the incumbent….”

    In any normal election cycle, given the state of the economy, this would be a no brainer. I wonder why Romney’s having such a hard go of it then, hmmm? Maybe he’s a terrible candidate that nobody genuinely likes…

    “But leading these voters — many of them women — to that conclusion takes finesse and delicacy, Republican strategists say.”

    How about considering that in terms of likely voters, women are a larger segment than men? How about, oh, I don’t know, maybe not trying to shove things in their vaginas and defining rape down to something like a parking ticket, or trying to treat it as a blessing? FFS, the term “Republican Strategist” is an oxymoron.

  4. 4.

    agorabum

    August 31, 2012 at 5:50 pm

    We need more media reminders that the reason why there has not been more progress on the economic front (i.e. the argument that Obama hasn’t been “doing a good job”) is that the Republican Congress has blocked everything he’s proposed to help, while offering nothing but austerity.
    Just sayin…

  5. 5.

    Jay C

    August 31, 2012 at 5:51 pm

    “Americans have been patient; Americans have supported this president in good faith,” he said to a roar in the hall. “Today the time has come to turn the page.” …

    Down to the fundamental problem with this year’s Republican nominee/nomination: they may see a desire to “turn the page”: but don’t seem to realize that turning the page to a rant out of Atlas Shrugged might not be the most popular option….

  6. 6.

    cathyx

    August 31, 2012 at 5:53 pm

    If American’s would just pay attention, they would love Mitt Romney.

  7. 7.

    Hunter Gathers

    August 31, 2012 at 5:54 pm

    They remember the last ‘businessman’ that occupied that office. He was a complete fuck-up. The current ‘businessman’ vying for that office also happens to be a complete fuck-up.

  8. 8.

    Honest Observations

    August 31, 2012 at 5:54 pm

    What the hell are you smoking? Obambi had a brief lead in the summer, yes, but he’s spent all his money and blown his wad. Since the Olympics ended and the Ryan pick Romney has been slowly but surely climbing up, and now the race is TCTC, and remember that’s BEFORE any convention bounce.

  9. 9.

    Violet

    August 31, 2012 at 5:55 pm

    And the RomBot is back:

    Romney in Louisiana, per pool: “Did the water come from the sky, or the rivers, or the ocean?”

  10. 10.

    Honest Observations

    August 31, 2012 at 5:55 pm

    Ryan’s “faded posters” line was perhaps THE political one-liner of the whole year. It will work so well on apprehensive former Obama voters.

  11. 11.

    Thoughtcrime

    August 31, 2012 at 5:55 pm

    The expression coming out of the 2008 RNC was: MILF!

    In 2012 it’s: WTF?

  12. 12.

    cathyx

    August 31, 2012 at 5:56 pm

    Since Republicans never take the blame for anything, the fact that no one likes Mitt can’t be Mitt’s fault.

  13. 13.

    jl

    August 31, 2012 at 5:56 pm

    @Violet:

    You have a problem with a philosopher-oligarch?

    Edit: “faded posters” could be good campaign line, also an apt self description in a blog comment section.

  14. 14.

    Balconesfault

    August 31, 2012 at 5:58 pm

    Americans have supported this president in good faith

    Was Romney saying that Republicans aren’t Americans?

  15. 15.

    slag

    August 31, 2012 at 5:58 pm

    That is a testament, perhaps, to the power of that scene four years ago when Mr. Obama and his family crossed the threshold of the White House as its first African-American tenants, “an inspiring moment that so many have awaited so long” as former President George W. Bush — the man he was so hard on in 2008 — put it then….

    Oh screw these people. “Perhaps” that is a testament to the power of Barack Obama wiping the floor with House Republicans (one of whom is currently on the GOP ticket) back in their 2010 debate. Or “perhaps” that is a testament to the fact that Obama is secretly blackmailing all these voters into supporting him by threatening to publish all their high school yearbook photos on Facebook.

    Wildly unsubstantiated speculation! How does it fucking work?

  16. 16.

    PeakVT

    August 31, 2012 at 5:58 pm

    Fallows has a good selection of articles on the post-truth era today.

  17. 17.

    different-church-lady

    August 31, 2012 at 5:59 pm

    @Honest Observations: Whatever it is, it most certainly is not as potent as what you’ve got in your own bong.

  18. 18.

    Balconesfault

    August 31, 2012 at 5:59 pm

    @Hunter Gathers: Yeah, but they moved from a businessman who relied on the Saudis to bail out his business problems, to one who relied on the US Government to do so.

  19. 19.

    jwb

    August 31, 2012 at 6:01 pm

    Man, BoB seems to make a return under a new name last night and now RC makes a return under a new name today. Like old times! VICTORY!

  20. 20.

    different-church-lady

    August 31, 2012 at 6:01 pm

    “They see this guy as wealthy, disconnected, not like me,” Margaret Spellings, Mr. Bush’s former education secretary, said of wavering Obama voters during an interview here on Thursday. (snip) Ms. Spellings suggested that Mr. Romney had so far failed to overcome Mr. Obama decisively among undecided voters only because “some of them haven’t been paying attention.”

    Sounds to me like they’ve been paying attention pretty well, actually.

  21. 21.

    Violet

    August 31, 2012 at 6:02 pm

    @jl: Philosopher-oligarch! And here I was thinking it was just another example of Republican science.

  22. 22.

    MikeBoyScout

    August 31, 2012 at 6:02 pm

    Conservatism cannot fail, it can only be failed.

    When Romneybot goes down to miserable failure all we will hear is what a terrible candidate he was. And he is a terrible candidate. But he is the best the Republicans and conservatives can offer.

  23. 23.

    pseudonymous in nc

    August 31, 2012 at 6:04 pm

    @agorabum:

    We need more media reminders that the reason why there has not been more progress on the economic front (i.e. the argument that Obama hasn’t been “doing a good job”) is that the Republican Congress has blocked everything he’s proposed to help, while offering nothing but austerity.

    I think it’s a problem that goes beyond the media and extends to the presidential system, where the election for the top job is, for the most part, fought in a kind of bubble, which in turn feeds into the Green Lantern theory of the presidency — that Obama could have done something different if he’d just wanted it more. The separation of powers — encompassing the fact that voters, collectively, chose to vote for gridlock two years ago — is honoured more in the breach than the observance, because the election is cast as Emperor vs. Pretender.

    It’s also complicated by the fact that Mittens has been busy Running For President over the past forever years, and has no recent record in that deadlocked Congress to dump on. That’s where pAyn Ryand becomes useful, especially if the tack from Camp Obama is to run on the Norquist concept that Mittens will just be holding the pen while Ryan dictates the words.

  24. 24.

    Chyron HR

    August 31, 2012 at 6:05 pm

    @Honest Observations:

    Once again, I must point out that changing your name and pretending to be a different person only works when you actually pretend to be a different person.

  25. 25.

    Violet

    August 31, 2012 at 6:05 pm

    @PeakVT: I love that respected people like Fallows are calling it “post-truth”. That sort of comment is becoming more common and will eventually be mainstream. That is not good news for Romney and the GOP.

  26. 26.

    Mnemosyne

    August 31, 2012 at 6:07 pm

    @Honest Observations:

    I don’t remember the “faded posters” line. I do remember Romney saying that it’s better to have two $9 an hour jobs than one $22 an hour job.

    When do you think think last time was that Mitt worked for $9 an hour, much less two full-time jobs just so he could make $4 an hour less than his previous job?

  27. 27.

    cathyx

    August 31, 2012 at 6:07 pm

    @Chyron HR: He’s not pretending to be a different person. He was banned under the old names and he has to come back under a different name.

  28. 28.

    John O

    August 31, 2012 at 6:08 pm

    @agorabum:

    This.

    But it won’t happen, unless the media goes completely into the tank for Obama. You know, like they are now!

    I’d just as soon get it over with…I think I know what to do if Romney gets elected.

  29. 29.

    quannlace

    August 31, 2012 at 6:08 pm

    Shorter GOP strategists: Stupid frigging voters! We blew hundreds of milli

    On one NPR show, they were interviewing a delegate at the RNC. She happened to be African-American, and so much of what she was saying was basically apologia for the Party. But she kept hitting on her point that if only other African-Americans would just listen and really get to know what the Repub Party stands for and ‘they’re not racist, not at all..” And it all started to distill down to ‘they’re just too blind or stupid to vote the right way..”
    And I was thinking, ‘I’m white, and I’m offended by this.”

  30. 30.

    cathyx

    August 31, 2012 at 6:10 pm

    @Mnemosyne: When was the last time he worked for $22 an hour? I doubt he even got that little in allowance when he was a boy.

  31. 31.

    les

    August 31, 2012 at 6:10 pm

    @Violet:

    I love that respected people like Fallows are calling it “post-truth”. That sort of comment is becoming more common and will eventually be mainstream. That is not good news for Romney and the GOP.

    I hope that’s right. But I notice that even the “journalists” who notice the lying, don’t seem to actually treat it as something negative. They mostly go straight into how effectively he lied, and how attractive to voters the lies are, and how big the liar’s bounce will be.

  32. 32.

    John O

    August 31, 2012 at 6:13 pm

    @les:

    Yep, it’s/we’re down to, “How well did the lie play?”

  33. 33.

    Honest Observations

    August 31, 2012 at 6:13 pm

    They mostly go straight into how effectively he lied, and how attractive to voters the lies are, and how big the liar’s bounce will be.

    You got it. The Medicare attacks are working. The Welfare attacks are working.

    WE’RE WINNING.

    And all you can do is whiiiiiiiiiiiiine about how unfair it all is.

  34. 34.

    Chuck Butcher

    August 31, 2012 at 6:14 pm

    I know that Charles Pierce gets huge play here, but this

    on the r-Money speech is prbably worth a read. (and not for reinforcement of the loser R/R campaign)

  35. 35.

    Chuck Butcher

    August 31, 2012 at 6:16 pm

    @Chuck Butcher:
    goddam WP

  36. 36.

    Chris Andersen

    August 31, 2012 at 6:16 pm

    For once I agree with those who say that voters are essentially conservative.

    They won’t vote out the current guy unless they think he will make things much worse and they won’t vote in the new guy unless they think he will make things much better.

    If the best they can say about the challenger is that he might do okay and the worst they can say about the incumbent is that he might do just as bad then they will probably stick with what they have.

  37. 37.

    Turgidson

    August 31, 2012 at 6:17 pm

    Ms. Spellings suggested that Mr. Romney had so far failed to overcome Mr. Obama decisively among undecided voters only because “some of them haven’t been paying attention.” …

    Ah yes. Anyone who still supports the president is an idiot.

    I admit to having felt that way about Bush supporters in 2004 and anyone who would dare put Sarah freaking Palin anywhere near the levers of power in 2008. So maybe I shouldn’t throw stones. But anyway, I’m proud to support a president who:

    -got bin Laden
    -passed a health care bill that extends coverage to 30 million people
    -rescued the auto industry from oblivion and prevented several million MORE people from losing their jobs
    -passed a stimulus bill that kept us out of Great Depression 2 – Starving to death Boogaloo
    -helped get a Wall Street reform bill passed through what is a thorougly corrupt legislative branch
    -supports gay marriage
    -supports green energy
    -supports gender equality and walks the talk (Lily Ledbetter)
    -isn’t enough of a braindead warmongering moron to attack Iran
    -can handle a natural disaster response without humiliating himself and the government
    -followed through on leaving Iraq
    -ejected Qaddafi without American loss of life

    if supporting the president who did those things and has kept his poise despite the most hostile, insulting, and frankly treasonous political opposition this country has seen since the antebellum period makes me an idiot, I’ll wear the label as a badge of fucking honor.

    Also too, I’m not a Republican precisely because I do pay attention, assface Bush lackey.

  38. 38.

    Publius39

    August 31, 2012 at 6:18 pm

    @Honest Observations:

    Ryan’s “faded posters” line was perhaps THE political one-liner of the whole year. It will work so well on apprehensive former Obama voters.

    Most of those voters are disaffected because they believe that Obama is not liberal enough. They are more likely to stay home because Obama hurt their fee-fees as opposed to voting for Romney.

  39. 39.

    ShadeTail

    August 31, 2012 at 6:19 pm

    But leading these voters — many of them women — to that conclusion takes finesse and delicacy, Republican strategists say. The sort of visceral attacks that conservative talk show hosts are calling for risk sending them into a defense posture on behalf of Mr. Obama and, more to the point, of their own decisions four years ago.

    Or maybe, you mucking forons, we just like Obama better than we like assholes like you.

  40. 40.

    TG Chicago

    August 31, 2012 at 6:19 pm

    Speaking of naked prejudice…

    Via Sullivan, I saw for the first time (ever? In a long time?) the “Go ahead; make my day” scene.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ishbTwXf1g

    Good golly is that thing racist!

    It’s total conservative porn. You’ve got the bad guys who are all young, dark-skinned black caricatures who are terrorizing the white women (“You comin’ with me, mama. We gonna have us a party!”). Then the tough white man comes in, calls them “boys”, and starts shooting up the place… yet somehow only the black bad guys get shot! Just like in real life!

  41. 41.

    Honest Observations

    August 31, 2012 at 6:19 pm

    @Publius39:

    Getting them to stay home is almost as good as getting them to vote for Romney.

    I think Ryan can reel in a not insignificant portion of the youth vote too due to his age and athleticism.

  42. 42.

    Turgidson

    August 31, 2012 at 6:21 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    It’s actually $13 less an hour, unless the person can somehow do two jobs at once.

    Two $9 jobs an hour vs. one $22 job an hour means working more than twice as many hours to make equivalent pay. America fuck yeah!

  43. 43.

    Tom Q

    August 31, 2012 at 6:21 pm

    OK, I’ll say what I always say when this thesis (the voters want to fire Obama, they’re just leery of Romney) comes up:

    If 8% unemployment is so devastating that any president facing it should get thumped out, how did FDR carry all but two states with 16% unemployment? How did Reagan, with not-much-better 7.5% unemployment, get to campaign with “It’s Morning in America” and carry 49 states?

    There’s a wildly persistent strain in the media that thinks a weak but non-recessionary economy is lethal to an incumbent. This view is based on nothing beyone media gut consensus. It overlooks not just the voters’ personal connection to Obama (though that doesn’t hurt), but the totality of his accomplishents: the foreign policy triumph of killing bin Laden, the nearly-century-in-the-making breakthrough on health care, and, yes, the rescue of the economy from what could clearly (see: Europe) have been a much worse outcome.

    Obama is going to be re-elected ON HIS OWN TERMS — not because a poor campaign failed to capitalize on his vulnerabilities.

  44. 44.

    Sophie Amrain

    August 31, 2012 at 6:21 pm

    @Honest Observations: Well, well, let us not exxagerate here. It was a slick line, but nothing spectacular. In particular, because any Obama 2008 voter that was disappointed by the President only going from 0 to 5 instead of 10 will not see any reason to vote for somebody who will bring us back to minus ten! Numbers are made up, but you get my drift, I hope.

  45. 45.

    les

    August 31, 2012 at 6:22 pm

    @Honest Observations:
    Definitely something to be proud of, when you have absolutely nothing else to be proud of.

  46. 46.

    Hunter Gathers

    August 31, 2012 at 6:23 pm

    @Honest Observations:

    WE’RE WINNING.

    That’s what you idiots said exactly four years ago to the day. And we curb stomped that old man and his wet nurse. And we’re going to curb stomp your android and his maintenance man in less than 70 days. You’ll probably bitch about ACORN and voter fraud like you did last time. You’ll whine and cry like the little bitches that you are. And I’ll feast on the sweet tears you’ll shed when VICTORY is denied to you once again.

  47. 47.

    Publius39

    August 31, 2012 at 6:23 pm

    @Honest Observations:

    I think Ryan can reel in a not insignificant portion of the youth vote too due to his age and athleticism.

    Nonsense. You have to be kidding me if you really think that young voters give two shits about this. And spare me any anecdotal evidence.

  48. 48.

    John O

    August 31, 2012 at 6:26 pm

    @Sophie Amrain:

    I agree, but you also describe exactly why it’s going to be a lot closer this time, IN, VA, and NC being totally in play if not “you’ll see” if not already solid (R).

  49. 49.

    Publius39

    August 31, 2012 at 6:26 pm

    @Tom Q:

    Obama is going to be re-elected ON HIS OWN TERMS —not because a poor campaign failed to capitalize on his vulnerabilities.

    Indeed. I’m getting sick and tired of the Villagers trying to tell the public that Obama is vulnerable, or that his campaign is desperate. The man beat the fucking Clinton political machine! Full fucking stop. The man can campaign his ass off and he’s a brilliant political strategist.

  50. 50.

    Violet

    August 31, 2012 at 6:27 pm

    @les: The fact that journalists are saying a Presidential or VP candidate is telling lies is an amazing thing in and of itself, given our crappy media. It seems like some of them were offended about the “screw the fact checkers” comments the Romney campaign made. There’s no better way to get the media to check your facts than to tell them it’s not necessary. Just ask Gary Hart.

    The media is slow to change, but they are changing.

  51. 51.

    Honest Observations

    August 31, 2012 at 6:28 pm

    @Publius39:

    Who do you think will impress the youth more in the VP debate? A young, smooth, athletic guy like Ryan or an aging, semi-senile overweight big mouth like Joe Bitme?

  52. 52.

    lamh35

    August 31, 2012 at 6:29 pm

    Dude, really??? Somebody please tell me this is a parody??? The Onion right?

    Romney in Louisiana, per pool: “Did the water come from the sky, or the rivers, or the ocean?” — @elisefoley via TweetDeck

  53. 53.

    Mnemosyne

    August 31, 2012 at 6:29 pm

    @Tom Q:

    There’s a wildly persistent strain in the media that thinks a weak but non-recessionary economy is lethal to an incumbent. This view is based on nothing beyone media gut consensus.

    I sometimes think it’s leftover Clinton Derangement — they still can’t believe that patrician Poppy Bush, the guy who brought them all of those pretty pictures of Gulf War I, lost to that frickin’ redneck nobody from Bumblefuck, Arkansas. It must have been because of the weak economy, not because people liked Clinton better or thought he had better ideas.

  54. 54.

    Publius39

    August 31, 2012 at 6:29 pm

    @Honest Observations: Stop being infantile and childish when you refer to public figures. It makes me think that you are a troll.

  55. 55.

    encephalopath

    August 31, 2012 at 6:31 pm

    Because our troops were unable to break through the enemy blockade, I’m going to switch my allegiance to those running the blockade. Yep… that will get me fed.

    That’s how both the Republicans and the media think the decision making process of voters operate.

    That makes no effing sense.

  56. 56.

    Honest Observations

    August 31, 2012 at 6:31 pm

    @Publius39:

    Right, no Democrats were ever infantile and childish when they called Bush “the smirking chimp” or “Dumbya” or any other number of insults. It’s our turn now, fuckers.

  57. 57.

    cathyx

    August 31, 2012 at 6:32 pm

    He wasn’t lying. The marathon was a race that he ran against his brothers when he was a teenager. There is no record of it, but I’m sure his brothers would back him up.

    See how easy it is to make the statement true?

  58. 58.

    Mnemosyne

    August 31, 2012 at 6:32 pm

    @Honest Observations:

    A young, smooth, athletic guy dorky guy in an ill-fitting suit like Ryan or an aging, semi-senile overweight big mouth like Joe Bitme?

    Fix’d. Seriously, my brother the house painter has a nicer, better-tailored suit than anything I’ve seen Ryan wear.

    Ryan looks like a kid wearing his big brother’s best Sunday suit. He’s going to get eaten alive by a career politician like Biden, because it’s going to be very clear by the end of the debate that Ryan is not ready to play with the big boys. Kid shoulda stuck with tee-ball.

  59. 59.

    cathyx

    August 31, 2012 at 6:33 pm

    @lamh35: With every bit of kidding is a little bit of truth.

  60. 60.

    Publius39

    August 31, 2012 at 6:34 pm

    @Honest Observations:

    Then go troll away with your false equivalence rationale; the adults have shit to take care of.

  61. 61.

    Honest Observations

    August 31, 2012 at 6:34 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    Well, you did admit Biden is a semi-senile overweight bigmouth anyway.

  62. 62.

    Publius39

    August 31, 2012 at 6:36 pm

    @Mnemosyne: This. For all the talk of how much of a policy wonk Ryan is, Biden will demolish Ryan, who will revert to substituting facts with lies. After the debate, the glorious MSM will either say that Ryan won the debate, or that it was fought to a draw.

  63. 63.

    Mnemosyne

    August 31, 2012 at 6:37 pm

    @lamh35:

    Well, if you dig down, I guess it’s not a completely stupid question — he seems to be ask if the flooding happened because of the rain, or if there was another cause, like the levees breaking again.

    It’s just that, like W, he didn’t bother to find out what the right terminology was before he asked the question and thought he could just wing it.

  64. 64.

    Rita R.

    August 31, 2012 at 6:38 pm

    @Honest Observations:

    Oh now I get it, you feel that special warmth down below for young Ryan. Those abs, the tight ass, the sad blue eyes, they get you all a-tingle for some sweet objectivist love. Guess we can’t help who gets our hormones flowing.

  65. 65.

    Mnemosyne

    August 31, 2012 at 6:38 pm

    @Honest Observations:

    Well, you did admit Biden is a semi-senile overweight bigmouth anyway.

    Biden is all of those things, and yet he’s going to wipe the floor with your boy, because Biden’s a clever politician and Ryan is a guy who thinks Ayn Rand had deep insights into economics and human nature.

  66. 66.

    ThatLeftTurnInABQ

    August 31, 2012 at 6:40 pm

    “Americans have supported this president in good faith”

    but Republicans have most emphatically not supported this president, in either good faith or in bad. Therefore, logically speaking, Republicans must not be Americans.

    ETA: Note to self: read the thread first. I see that Balconesfault got there in #14.

  67. 67.

    Bostondreams

    August 31, 2012 at 6:40 pm

    Well, as this is an open thread and I know there are some gamers here, I just wanted to express my disappointment that NCSoft has announced the end of City of Heroes as of November 30. Goodbye Paragon City. Only MMO I ever played consistently for the past five years. Totally unexpected.

  68. 68.

    Violet

    August 31, 2012 at 6:43 pm

    @Mnemosyne: Did you see Ryan today during the tarmac pre-flight sendoff with the Romneys and Ryans? His casual clothes look too big too. Billowy shirt with too-large sleeves and roomy khakis cinched up with a belt. Looked like his clothes were out of the early 90’s when men wore clothes like that. By contrast, Mitt’s clothes seemed to fit. Someone needs to get Ryan some clothes that actually fit. His wife’s clothes fit her, so there’s someone with some fashion sense in the family. Paul Ryan needs an intervention.

  69. 69.

    trollhattan

    August 31, 2012 at 6:45 pm

    @Honest Observations:
    Oh jayzuz, it’s the return of UNLIMITED CORPORATE CASH!

    Sleep off the convention already? I give it three hours before the next banhammer.

  70. 70.

    LanceThruster

    August 31, 2012 at 6:50 pm

    @Violet:

    While they’re at it, Mrs. Mitt should get a good Republican cloth coat.

  71. 71.

    Suffern Ace

    August 31, 2012 at 6:52 pm

    @Violet: We keep hearing about this physique but he refuses to show. There must be some locker room where he shows it off.

  72. 72.

    trollhattan

    August 31, 2012 at 6:52 pm

    @LanceThruster:
    Wouldn’t that necessarily lead to a discussion of “Keeping the dog?”

  73. 73.

    Violet

    August 31, 2012 at 6:54 pm

    @LanceThruster: Did you see Mrs. Mitt’s sloppy attire today as they got off the plane in New Orleans? She looked a wreck. And was that her Magic Underwear completely visible through her thin shirt? The whole thing was not flattering.

  74. 74.

    Suffern Ace

    August 31, 2012 at 6:54 pm

    @Mnemosyne: Umm. Since when does overweight describe Biden?

  75. 75.

    Linda Featheringill

    August 31, 2012 at 6:56 pm

    http://www.nola.com/politics/index.ssf/2012/08/mitt_romney_makes_hurricane_is.html

    Article about Romney’s visit. Includes “Where did the water come from?”

  76. 76.

    Joel

    August 31, 2012 at 6:56 pm

    @Honest Observations: VICTORY!!!!

  77. 77.

    Joel

    August 31, 2012 at 6:56 pm

    @Honest Observations: VICTORY!!!!

  78. 78.

    trollhattan

    August 31, 2012 at 7:03 pm

    @Linda Featheringill:
    Anything about the trees being “immersed to just the right depth”?

  79. 79.

    bjacques

    August 31, 2012 at 7:11 pm

    Even shorter GOP strategists: A moment of silence, please, for the Mittster and his wingman stuck in the friendzone.

  80. 80.

    EriktheRed

    August 31, 2012 at 7:11 pm

    At least they have the consolation of knowing that Willard “Mitt” Romney is going to take the brunt of the post-election abuse, since that guy can’t even sell raw greed and naked prejudice to an arena full of RNC delegates with any success.

    Think you’re right about what happens IF he loses, but I wish I could be as optimistic that he will.

  81. 81.

    Monala

    August 31, 2012 at 7:25 pm

    @Honest Observations: Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Oh, you were serious? Well, if youth and athleticism were all it took to attract young voters, then why do many young people like the very clearly old Ron Paul*? Could it be that maybe he speaks to some of their interests, such as ending the drug war and ending foreign wars? Unlike Paul Ryan’s plan to end Medicare as we know it for anyone under 55.

    ————

    * Note: I’m not a Ron Paul fan, but I recognize that he does speak to some issues that young people care about.

  82. 82.

    quannlace

    August 31, 2012 at 7:33 pm

    I think Ryan can reel in a not insignificant portion of the youth vote too due

    Ha-ha-ha. Maybe cause he looks like Scoopy-Do. Kids love a goofy cartoon.

  83. 83.

    quannlace

    August 31, 2012 at 7:38 pm

    Article about Romney’s visit. Includes “Where did the water come from?”
    Reply

    Sweet Jesus, what’s next? Is he gonna ask, “Why is the sky blue?’

  84. 84.

    Tonal Crow

    August 31, 2012 at 7:38 pm

    Who would you rather have a beer with?

    President Obama or the Mittatronic Model Gr763763EEd628678324h878773e87783A999D?

    —
    Romney’s like Sarah Palin, only much less attractive and far more dishonest.

  85. 85.

    Davis X. Machina

    August 31, 2012 at 7:41 pm

    …a large portion of wavering voters maintain a personal attachment to Mr. Obama, and a tentative willingness to give him more time to get it right,

    There is a tradition of this sort of thing happening to Illinois state-house hacks with thin one-term Congressional resumés.

  86. 86.

    Randy P

    August 31, 2012 at 7:42 pm

    @Honest Observations: Joe “This is a Big F-ing Deal” Biden obviously. Hell, that phrase was everywhere.

  87. 87.

    Tonal Crow

    August 31, 2012 at 7:46 pm

    @Honest Observations: Getting Palin “starbursts” again?

  88. 88.

    Tonal Crow

    August 31, 2012 at 7:57 pm

    Maybe voters aren’t “giving up” on Obama because they understand that he’s done pretty well despite Republicans sabotaging America every step of the way.

  89. 89.

    Rome Again

    August 31, 2012 at 7:59 pm

    @different-church-lady:

    Winner!

  90. 90.

    Lojasmo

    August 31, 2012 at 7:59 pm

    @Honest Observations:

    I think Ryan can reel in a not insignificant portion of the youth vote too due to his age and athleticism

    Like Palin locked in the womenfolk?

  91. 91.

    Lojasmo

    August 31, 2012 at 8:02 pm

    @Publius39:

    She is a troll…many times banned here.

  92. 92.

    Rome Again

    August 31, 2012 at 8:03 pm

    @Monala:

    I keep hearing the guy to watch for 2016 is Chris Christie… I am not aware of his athleticism though. What’s he bench pressing these days?

  93. 93.

    Rome Again

    August 31, 2012 at 8:05 pm

    @Honest Observations:

    We never called him a foreigner or blocked his legislation. What you’re doing is NOT the same thing at all.

  94. 94.

    Rome Again

    August 31, 2012 at 8:09 pm

    @Suffern Ace:

    We keep hearing about this physique but he refuses to show. There must be some locker room where he shows it off.

    I think he flagellates himself and so he won’t be showing off that physique anytime soon. He IS Catholic, ya know… Opus Dei perhaps?

  95. 95.

    gogol's wife

    August 31, 2012 at 8:14 pm

    @TG Chicago:

    I’ve never been able to understand how such a racist scene can have survived as a cute catchphrase. It nauseated me the first time I saw it, back when the film was new.

  96. 96.

    Catsy

    August 31, 2012 at 8:33 pm

    @Honest Observations: Oh look, resident mendacious troll Clime Acts or one of his clones is back with a new username. How adorable. I was wondering how long he’d feel he had to wait after #RomneyShambles to go back to his usual habit of trolling the thread with counterfactual braying about how Romney is winning without looking even more embarrassingly unhinged than usual.

    Keep fucking that chicken, Sparky. Nobody’s buying a ticket to your act.

  97. 97.

    different-church-lady

    August 31, 2012 at 8:33 pm

    @Honest Observations: Is there going to be a swimsuit competition or something?

  98. 98.

    trollhattan

    August 31, 2012 at 8:35 pm

    @Rome Again:

    What’s he bench pressing these days?

    Pizza. Bile pizza,

  99. 99.

    Anne Laurie

    August 31, 2012 at 8:39 pm

    @Catsy:

    Oh look, resident mendacious troll Clime Acts or one of his clones is back with a new username.

    Clime Acts can act the troll, but “Honest Observation” (‘Dishonest Spin’) is the paid Rethug shill who used to use Cato, Victory!, and a dozen similar talkingpoint banners to earn his nickel-a-post. By the end of the long weekend, he’ll lose control and sink from dog-whistles to straight-out racism, and get his sorry arse banned again.

  100. 100.

    different-church-lady

    August 31, 2012 at 8:41 pm

    @Anne Laurie: Whoever’s paying him, they ain’t getting their money’s worth.

  101. 101.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    August 31, 2012 at 8:44 pm

    @different-church-lady: It’s the UNLIMITED CORPORATE CASH.

  102. 102.

    Cain

    August 31, 2012 at 8:47 pm

    @Violet:

    By contrast, Mitt’s clothes seemed to fit. Someone needs to get Ryan some clothes that actually fit. His wife’s clothes fit her, so there’s someone with some fashion sense in the family. Paul Ryan needs an intervention.

    What he needs is a queer eye.

  103. 103.

    Publius39

    August 31, 2012 at 8:48 pm

    @Lojasmo: Thanks for the heads-up. I’m actually shocked that I actually ran into a Romney troll. I haven’t seen one since he started running for president. MEt plenty of Paultards, but no Mittbots.

  104. 104.

    Anne Laurie

    August 31, 2012 at 9:09 pm

    @Publius39:

    I’m actually shocked that I actually ran into a Romney troll.

    Remember “UNLIMITED CORPORATE DOLLARS!”? That was this guy. Mitt can’t make even the Rethuglicans shill him for love, but he’s willing to buy the closest available approximation.

    Who knows, maybe that’s where Romney’s speech writers came up with the ’12 million jobs’ line — he’ll pay those luzers a nickel a post to troll political websites.

  105. 105.

    Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism

    August 31, 2012 at 9:19 pm

    @Violet: I alternate between being reminded of a kid whose momma bought his clothes too big so they would last longer and being reminded of my bulimic grandmother, who could never believe that she didn’t need half-sized dresses. Women’s sizes, they’re called now.

  106. 106.

    Anoniminous

    August 31, 2012 at 10:37 pm

    @Rome Again:

    Christie bench presses about 350 pounds. Every time he sits on one.

  107. 107.

    Thatgaljill

    August 31, 2012 at 11:40 pm

    I’m sorry for not reading all 106 comments before me. but OMFG… are they basically strategizing based on “it’s a woman’s perogative to change her mind?” (facepalm)

    for the love of peanut butter cups already

  108. 108.

    mclaren

    September 1, 2012 at 5:06 pm

    Been saying this for nearly four years now, but it’s still true: you can slam Obama for a bunch of things, but his performance on the economy ain’t one of them. Back in 2008, nobody had a clue that this recession would be as deep and as brutally long-lived as it has been. No one. Not one economist was speaking out for a stimulus of twice the size Obama proposed.

    Under these circumstances, you just can’t fault Obama’s economic package. He listened to the best economists he could find and followed their advice. There just isn’t much more he could’ve done, especially faced with the ferociously partisan congress he had to deal with.

  109. 109.

    Rome Again

    September 1, 2012 at 6:03 pm

    @mclaren:

    No one had a clue that the Republicans were going to block our economic recovery and jobs package either. The economists’ numbers were most likely right but the choice to gut the economy to make Obama suffer greatly contributed to the need for more stimulus.

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