Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

A last alliance of elves and men. also pet photos.

I’d try pessimism, but it probably wouldn’t work.

This really is a full service blog.

Just because you believe it, that doesn’t make it true.

Let me eat cake. The rest of you could stand to lose some weight, frankly.

The words do not have to be perfect.

JFC, are there no editors left at that goddamn rag?

This blog will pay for itself.

A democracy can’t function when people can’t distinguish facts from lies.

Shallow, uninformed, and lacking identity

No offense, but this thread hasn’t been about you for quite a while.

Tick tock motherfuckers!

When someone says they “love freedom”, rest assured they don’t mean yours.

“But what about the lurkers?”

… pundit janitors mopping up after the GOP

After roe, women are no longer free.

But frankly mr. cole, I’ll be happier when you get back to telling us to go fuck ourselves.

Infrastructure week. at last.

A snarling mass of vitriolic jackals

Putin must be throwing ketchup at the walls.

Damn right I heard that as a threat.

They traffic in fear. it is their only currency. if we are fearful, they are winning.

A Senator Walker would also be an insult to reason, rationality, and decency.

if you can’t see it, then you are useless in the fight to stop it.

You are here: Home / Past Elections / Election 2012 / I Sure Do Enjoy a Good Gloat

Reader Interactions

116Comments

  1. 1.

    Baud

    the gold medalist of this event by far is Dick Morris, who sits there on the Fox set like a betumored walrus on an ice floe assuring his viewers not to worry.

    That’s totally unfair to walruses (walrusi?)

  3. 3.

    gene108

    I hate to point this out, but even with the total clusterfuck that Mitt’s campaign is in right now, he’ll probably win 20 states.

    Obama will have a solid win, but nowhere near the blowouts of Reagan/Carter, Reagan/Mondale and GHWB/Dukakis, where Carter and Dukakis won about 12 states+DC and Mondale won MN and DC.

    As long as Republicans can sit back and safely win Utah, Texas, Nebraska, Idaho, South Dakota, South Carolina, Georgia, Lousiana, Tennessee, Arkansas, Mississippi, Kansas, etc., they will always be thinking they are a few swing states away from taking the Presidency.

    I don’t know, if we can actually effect the same sort of domination the Republicans did in the 1980’s, because otherwise, there’ll be no reason for Republicans to really do the soul searching and change we need to have a functional country again.

  5. 5.

    IowaOldLady

    Today was the first day of early voting in Iowa, so after I finished at the library, I swung by the court house and filled out my ballot. At 1:30, I was voter number 26. In 2008, more than a third of Iowa voters voted early.

    Go ahead and redefine yourself all you want, Romney. Too late.

  7. 7.

    dmsilev

    I like what the Rude Pundit had to say yesterday:

    On the right, the punditry and reporting ranges from resigned recognition of imminent failure, with a vague hope of stanching the bleed out in congressional races, to desperately hammering away at the same points against Obama because repeating lies has worked so well before. It’s pathetic, like watching a wounded seal try to get back to the safety of the shore before the killer whale finishes it off.
    __
    On the left, even though champagne corks are shaking in their bottles, that range is from disbelief that it’s been this easy to cocky “told-you-so” crowing (guilty as charged). Yeah, there’s always that show-off orca that likes to toss around the seal prior to devouring it.

  9. 9.

    jwb

    @gene108: The big thing now is not Obama taking more states, though that would be nice, but taking the House. I’m sure Obama’s team will be making calculations as to where their spending will do the most good downticket.

  10. 10.

    catclub

    @gene108: True, but if Texas and Arizona go away from the automatic GOP win column, it gets much tougher for the GOP.

    ETA: NC, VA and GA could drift blue also. If so, the presidency would be almost always impossible for the GOP.
    The problem is that the GOP at the state level is better organized than the Democrats in too many states.

  13. 13.

    gwangung

    @jwb:

    The big thing now is not Obama taking more states, though that would be nice, but taking the House. I’m sure Obama’s team will be making calculations as to where their spending will do the most good downticket.

    This what I would do if I were in their shoes.

    The thing is…they’ve proven to me that they’re WAYYYYY smarter than me.

    That’s pretty damn satisfying.

  14. 14.

    Emma

    OT but not: TPM reports Soros has donated one million dollars to the Obama SuperPac. Brains have been heard exploding as far as Orange County, CA.

  15. 15.

    General Stuck

    The wingnut desperation is frantically looking for a golden goose to swarm to victory around. And have pretty much forgot about the election in the frenzy to prove Obama let terrorists kill our ambassador. While there is likely room for some honest critique of the situation, I don’t know what they are thinking throwing themselves at this event in a total manner, unless they are deluded into thinking this time, they got the meme to discredit Obama fully in the eyes of the public.

    I don’t think it is that, at all, but I do think there is a point to where it will backfire on them, like everything else. If they go too far, which is pretty much SOP these days for the nutters.

  17. 17.

    hueyplong

    “OT but not: TPM reports Soros has donated one million dollars to the Obama SuperPac. Brains have been heard exploding as far as Orange County, CA”

    If so, then he should donate another million right the fk now.

    More bang for the bucks.

    Literally.

  18. 18.

    Forum Transmitted Disease

    I disagree with the linked article on only one point: watching Mitt Romney flail around with no clue as to what he is doing is the most satisfying thing I’ve ever watched in my life.

    Watching him kill Paul Ryan’s political future in the process is a bonus.

  19. 19.

    dr. bloor

    Eh, I’ll save my gloating until after Obama is re-elected and the Dems get workable majorities in both the house and the senate. Having a big dose of reality isn’t going to make the Republican congress critters a whit less nihilistic, and you can be sure they’ll continue to set fire to the ship of state next term, if only out of spite.

  24. 24.

    Brachiator

    I Sure Do Enjoy a Good Gloat

    Damn. Read this at first as “goat.”

    @jwb:

    The big thing now is not Obama taking more states, though that would be nice, but taking the House.

    This would be big. Very big. Huge.

    Especially if we can get some co-operation from congressional Democrats. Yeah, I know.

    Here’s the deal. It’s not just the Bush tax cuts, but a boatload of tax provisions expire in 2012. It will be very hard for Congress to get away with just kicking the can down the road with short term budget resolutions. Somebody is going to have to write some serious law and get it passed.

    If the GOP retains the House, it will be much more difficult for Obama to get anything done.

  27. 27.

    japa21

    Being business minded like the right tends to be, they do realize that these polling companies are businesses, don’t they? And that if all these polling companies are way off base that they would have difficulty getting additional business? And that even Rasmussen, for all its early ideological pull tends to start doing more realistic polling towrds the election?

    Generally speaking, when I see the cross tabs of most of these polls, I still see them underweighting minorities, specifically latino voters. And yes, Dems are about right being weighted +7, because a lot of people who self-identified as Republican in the past now identify themselves as independents. Most of these polls are showing an increase in independents in their weighting than 4 years ago.

  29. 29.

    ? Martin

    Politics of beer.

    Pleased to see the Most Interesting Man in the World is an Obama supporter. I also take it as a positive my preferred beers aren’t even listed. That must mean I’m a foreigner.

  34. 34.

    Xecky Gilchrist

    I’m hoping this election not only delivers the presidency and Congress but puts to rest some pernicious myths: that Republicans are good for the economy, that supply-siders care about the little guy, that the asshole CEOs we’ve been yelled at to worship since the 80s are even remotely civilized.

    If we can puncture these stupid misconceptions good and hard, I’ll send Romney a thank-you postcard for doing his part.

  38. 38.

    joes527

    @Brachiator:

    Especially if we can get some co-operation from congressional Democrats. Yeah, I know.

    Even if the House remained a haven for barking lunatics, and blue dogs insisted in being blue in name only, putting the gavel back into Pelosi’s hands would make a world of difference.

    Not that I believe it will happen. If Obama is reelected and the D team holds the Senate they will have outperformed every reasonable expectation. Taking the House is just a nice dream.

  39. 39.

    catclub

    @PeakVT: I think you can make a timeline of Israeli alarms that the Iranians are within
    n years ( where n is a small integer) of having a deliverable bomb, continuously, since about 1993. The boy who cried wolf did not end up well.

    Not to mention Bush screwed the pooch badly in 2003-4 when the Iranians were very willing to talk and were rebuffed.
    Of course, if avoiding doing anything about al Qaeda was the goal, then NOT cooperating with their enemy was the M.O.

  40. 40.

    22over7

    @japa21:

    The short answer is no, the conspiracists haven’t thought about the business of polling and how perhaps Gallup and Fox and all the newspapers and other pollsters might not want to ruin their business for their “boyfriend” or whatever. Because they’re morons.

    But the whole thing makes sense to me. They’ve disowned biology, geology, and physics. Now they’re disowning mathematics (the statistics and probability part, anyway).

    I mean, have you ever SEEN a mathematical paper? All those squiggles and some kind of odd language that can only be Satanic.

  41. 41.

    Dennis SGMM

    I’ll forestall gloating until I can mix it with a hearty dose of schadenfreude after Obama is elected. IMHO a Romney loss will make it imperative to retake the House. Otherwise Republican payback is going to make their first-term obstructionism look like a Sunday School picnic.

  43. 43.

    jwb

    @Xecky Gilchrist: That’s kind of weird, because it looks like it was supposed to be 73% for Obama vs 27% for Romney, but that would be down massively from the numbers that were posting earlier today (Obama above 80%).

    ETA: The Nowcast numbers are similarly broken and they really make no sense, so who knows what this represents.

  49. 49.

    Dennis SGMM

    @Ash Can:
    I just did a search; yes, Bibi actually used a cartoon of a bomb to illustrate the existential threat posed by Iran. No wonder he and Romney get along so well.

  52. 52.

    22over7

    @rlrr:

    lololol! As you can see by my nic, I don’t hold with that nonsense. A good old-fashioned American fraction for me.

  53. 53.

    ThatLeftTurnInABQ

    @joes527:

    Obviously the values hit a threshold that some web programmer thought would never be reached in a million years.

    GOP support < 27% = politicarthimetic underflow error

  55. 55.

    joes527

    @jwb: Whatever happened,it isn’t that simple, because if you look at the NowCast, Romney is doing even better (289% chance of winning to Obama’s mere 370% chance)

    We have hit the Y2K of poll results I think.

  57. 57.

    General Stuck

    Fox News has a bombshell article up on Benghazi.
    Wingnuts are swarming, pheromone levels high.

    US officials knew Libya attack was terrorism within 24 hours, sources confirm

    Two senior U.S. officials said that the Obama administration internally labeled the attack terrorism from the first day in order to unlock and mobilize certain resources to respond, and that officials were looking for one specific suspect.

    By all means. Obama should have announced they knew what it was, and who did it, to properly please the raging political beast known as the GOP. So the person they were after could have a heads up. Morons

  58. 58.

    Anoniminous

    @joes527:

    With the info we have there’s no way of predicting whether:

    1. The Republicans hold the House, barely

    2. The Democrats regain the House

    3. The Democrats landslide into the House

    I think it’s safe to conclude the GOP are going to lose House seats. First, serial dog killers have a higher approval rating than Congress. Second, there’s just no way Obama doesn’t have coattails. The Great Unknown is how far, IF it does, actual voting diverges from historic norms, throwing off the benefits of gerrymandering.

  60. 60.

    Linda Featheringill

    @22over7: #40

    I mean, have you ever SEEN a mathematical paper? All those squiggles and some kind of odd language that can only be Satanic.

    Yes. And mathematicians most definitely do not speak English.

    :-)

  61. 61.

    different-church-lady

    Cole, after reading the comments over there at that linked article, all I can do is commend you for somehow managing to make your own joint free from that kind of inane, deluded babbling. It was a real perspective giver: if any of you think BJ is bad, take a look at what it could be and you’ll thank your stars.

  62. 62.

    Amir Khalid

    @dmsilev:

    … On the left, even though champagne corks are shaking in their bottles, …

    Ahem. That’s not where champagne corks go. I guess Rude Pundit’s not much more of a wine drinker than I am.

    Seriously, though, Rude Pundit’s quite right. Mitt’s campaign has been a master class in ineptitudity. He’s shown the profound empathy and humility of Thurston Howell III, the inspiring leadership of the Pointy-Haired Boss, and the unerring moral compass of Gordon Gekko.

    He was widely disliked when he ran in 2008, and not that popular this time either. He was the nominee only because the rest of the field were utterly hopeless. The surprise isn’t that the wheels have come off the campaign, it’s that they didn’t come off even sooner.

  64. 64.

    Anoniminous

    @rlrr:

    HA! Me mommy didn’t raise no fool. I won’t take the other side of that bet.

    Have difficulty thinking the GOP will keep control the House. Too many barriers are in their way.

  66. 66.

    Cris (without an H)

    @rlrr: I predict if the Republicans manage to hold the House, they will attempt to impeach Obama.

    Walter Jones (R-NC) is trying to lay a formal groundwork for this already.

    Expressing the sense of Congress that the use of offensive military force by a President without prior and clear authorization of an Act of Congress constitutes an impeachable high crime and misdemeanor under Article II, section 4 of the Constitution.

    Co-signed by Ron Paul and Dennis Kucinich, of course.

  67. 67.

    Brachiator

    @? Martin:

    @ThatLeftTurnInABQ:

    Now why did you have to go and drag Mickey Kaus into this?

    It was just too easy.

    @joes527:

    If Obama is reelected and the D team holds the Senate they will have outperformed every reasonable expectation. Taking the House is just a nice dream.

    The budget, which will be the critical issue for 2013. If the Democrats keep the Senate, they are going to have to use it to put big pressure on the House.

    And the Democrats are going to have to make a huge effort to retake the House in 2014. The fight is going to get nastier, but the Dems have got to find a way to blunt the Republicans and actually govern.

    And even though we will hear the inevitable stuff about Obama as a lame duck president, the Dems have got to lay the groundwork for 2016.

  68. 68.

    catclub

    @MikeJ: Yeah, so not all analogies fit all the details.

    It bugs me that it is standard operating procedure to ignore the 200 or so nuclear weapons that Israel has (including sea launched cruise missiles, I think) and focus instead on the _possibility_ that Iran will get one bomb.

    Given how cowed the rest of the middle east has been by Israel’s nuclear superiority – which I rate as not very –
    why should Israel suddenly be coerced into surrender, or change of policy, by the Iranians having one bomb?

  69. 69.

    Linda Featheringill

    @Anoniminous:

    The House:

    Another unknown is that significant portions of two of the traditional Republican strongholds, over 65 and males, are morphing into Obama supporters. I really don’t know if they’ll take a cold, hard look at House candidates while they’re at it.

    If they’re turning against the Rs because of Medicaid and Medicare, these voters might be interested in the voting records of incumbents. If they have other reasons, I don’t know what they’ll do.

  70. 70.

    Napoleon

    @Dennis SGMM:

    I just did a search; yes, Bibi actually used a cartoon of a bomb to illustrate the existential threat posed by Iran

    Over on TPM they refer to it as Bibi’s Wyli E Coyote moment.

  71. 71.

    joes527

    @Amir Khalid: That’s the funniest part. _everyone_ (and I mean EV-ERY-ONE) knew that no one likes Mitt right at the beginning of the primary. The fact that the Republicans dislike him almost as much as the democrats was openly discussed.

    And yet, they nominated him. What were they expecting to happen?

  73. 73.

    jwb

    @General Stuck: Seriously? Did anyone think it was something other than a well coordinated terrorist plan using the protests over that dumb video as cover? I seem to recall that was the immediate speculation from pretty much all quarters.

  74. 74.

    Bubblegum Tate

    Appropriately enough, a wingnut I know went on a tirade yesterday, listing all the reasons Romney is going to win and win big in November:

    Center-right nation!
    2010 elections!
    Scott Walker survived recall!
    Biased polls are lying!
    Fiscal cliff!
    Mitt Romney has a plan!

    As his talking points got dismantled, he just got more and more belligerent about them. It was a beautiful thing, seeing him reduced to sputtering, incoherent rage.

  78. 78.

    different-church-lady

    @Ash Can: Yes, and it’s a barstool made of out solid snark, which I think is an important psychological advantage. There is nothing a conservative troll wants more than an earnest rebuttal. Give ’em one and before you know it the thread is running off the right side of the screen (which I think of as “the stupid side”).

    Here we dispense with all that. When a troll shows up we go right for the straight up ridicule.

  79. 79.

    Brachiator

    @General Stuck:

    Fox News has a bombshell article up on Benghazi.
    Wingnuts are swarming, pheromone levels high.

    This makes Romney and the conservative gas machine look even more foolish.

    But I can see the Fox trying to hit at Obama’s foreign policy strong area and prop Romney up as some kind of steely Mormon American Warrior.

  80. 80.

    Dennis SGMM

    @Napoleon:

    Over on TPM they refer to it as Bibi’s Wyli E Coyote moment.

    “And our intelligence agents in Iran have reliable information that Ahmadinejad recently ordered one ACME Nuclear Bomb kit. The United States must attack Iran. Monday would be good. Oh, and send more money, those settlements won’t build themselves.”

  81. 81.

    General Stuck

    @jwb:

    Yea, and is what Susan Rice said, as well as others. But rarely does a WH spit out what it suspects until it has the evidence, and we still don’t know the level of planning versus the opportunity with the riots, that were not only in Libya, but across the MENA. The obvious conclusion from the whinging wingnuts, that all of those riots were created by AQ as well.

    The Fox article states flatly they were in pursuit of one person very soon after the attacks. It would be like local cops going into detail of their evidence in a murder investigation, from the git go. Just not how it’s done by smart people.

    It is a valid inquiry as to over all security provided at the embassy. But that takes time. And the nutters only have 40 days and nights to change the tide of defeat coming their way.

  82. 82.

    Or something like that.Suffern Ace

    @Amir Khalid: Yeah. But who disliked him on the republican side? The other candidates and their people? Someone liked him enough to invite him back.

  85. 85.

    catclub

    @Amir Khalid: This. “He was widely disliked when he ran in 2008, and not that popular this time either. He was the nominee only because the rest of the field were utterly hopeless ”

    And he still was opposed by a majority of GOP primary voters up until he was down to only one opponent.

  87. 87.

    ThatLeftTurnInABQ

    @Or something like that.Suffern Ace:

    But who disliked him on the republican side? The other candidates and their people? Someone liked him enough to invite him back.

    Seekrit liburls infiltrated the GOP primaries. That’s why next time voters will have to give DNA samples and take polygraph tests before they are allowed to vote in the Republican primaries. Oh, and long-form birf certificates too; can’t forget about those.

  88. 88.

    Brachiator

    @catclub:

    It bugs me that it is standard operating procedure to ignore the 200 or so nuclear weapons that Israel has (including sea launched cruise missiles, I think) and focus instead on the possibility that Iran will get one bomb.

    It’s not just one bomb. That’s not how it works.

    India and Pakistan are estimated to have up to 100 nuclear warheads each. South Africa probably had 6 warheads in the 80s and wisely got rid of them.

    The other problem is that Israel will do everything they can to prevent Iran from being able to develop nuclear weapons. And Iran could immediately defuse the situation and gain wide international support by giving inspectors wide and open access to all their facilities if their claim is that their nuclear ambitions do not include military uses.

    Sad thing is that neither side is going to give ground.

  91. 91.

    catclub

    @Brachiator: “The other problem is that Israel will do everything they can to prevent Iran from being able to develop nuclear weapons.”

    I bet they would not permit mutual inspections to show they have no nuclear weapons. Would they do that if Iran offered to submit to the same?

    Also, the facts on India and Pakistan buttress my point.
    India is not bossing Pakistan around any more or less than before.

  92. 92.

    ? Martin

    @Brachiator: And toss in the complications by Saudi Arabia who says that if Iran develops a bomb, they’ll need to seek them as well – possibly buying them from Pakistan.

    I’m not quite sure who Saudi Arabia is more distrustful of – Israel or Iran. It’s a bit of a tossup. Threeways are always awkward when everyone thinks they’re entitled to be in charge.

  94. 94.

    Mnemosyne

    @jwb:

    ETA: The Nowcast numbers are similarly broken and they really make no sense, so who knows what this represents.

    Most likely it represents somebody screwing up a formula in Excel that produced a weird number.

    Or, as IT guys like to say, the problem happened between the keyboard and the monitor.

  95. 95.

    Mnemosyne

    @jwb:

    Apparently the right’s immediate assumption was that Those People are just murderous corpse-raping assholes who can’t stop themselves from killing people whenever they hear someone say, “Mohammed.”

    Personally, I’m eagerly waiting to hear this meme come out of the mouths of the exact same Republicans who complained that we revealed too soon that we had killed OBL and should have kept it quiet longer.

  96. 96.

    Jay C

    @Cris (without an H): @rlrr:

    Well, IIRC, Walter Jones is that odd duck in American politics, a right-wing anti-war nut (I think he tried to “indict” Bush over these same grounds) – so it’s no surprise he’d be behind this “resolution” – which, though I’m no legislative expert, appears to be really weak grounds – a seriousness level about that of a post-office-naming.

    That said, I think I’d really like to see a GOP-run House try to impeach President Obama: I can think of few things more likely to destroy whatever might remain of the Republicans’ political credibility than an attempt to get rid of their boogeyman Obama via some hoked-up BS “impeachment” circus. Barack is no Bill Clinton: he keeps his finances open, and his zipper closed. Obscure Constitutional niceties over war-making powers probably won’t cut it….

  98. 98.

    ? Martin

    @catclub:

    Also, the facts on India and Pakistan buttress my point.
    India is not bossing Pakistan around any more or less than before.

    You can’t draw that conclusion. Pakistan did their tests in 1998. They had a coup in 1999. The two countries came to a standoff in 2001 with the Parliament attack in late 2001, but we were climbing up their asses by late 2001/early 2002 in a seriously pissed off mood and not going to deal with anyones shit. India isn’t in a position to boss Pakistan around with us there – nor do they have a need to. The true test won’t be until we leave Afghanistan. We’ll see what happens then.

  99. 99.

    gene108

    @catclub:

    I’m just pointing out the big win Obama had in 2008 and what looks like a repeat in 2012 (fingers crossed, don’t jinx) isn’t enough to force the Republican party to reorganize.

    It’s nowhere near the level of domination Reagan and Bush, Sr. had in the 1980’s over their Democratic opponents.

    Yes Republicans are better organized at the state level in many places. The vestiges of the Democratic party that garnered confidence in places like Georgia, Louisiana, etc. that enabled people to win state wide races for governor and Senator were swept aside in the 1990’s.

    That’s the real damage from the MSM parroting right-wing controversy about President Clinton*, because it effectively alienated the South from the Democratic party. Bush &Co.’s use of the DoJ to attack elected Democrats in the South just put the final nails in the coffin.

    *Look up the electoral map for the 1992 Presidential election.

    Clinton and Gore carried states, we’d by default assume are GOP locks, like Georgia, Louisiana, and their home state of Arkansas and Tennessee.

    If Clinton hadn’t been hounded by Whitewater – which had nothing to do with his time in office and really was the start of the witch hunt to make President Clinton’s administration seem as corrupt as Reagan’s and Nixon’s – right out of the gate, I think we may have seen a big shift back towards Democrats.

    As it is the process to hand the GOP the string of defeats needed to force changes this country needs from them will take many more election cycles than the 3 wins in 8 years the GOP dealt the Democrats in the 1980’s.

  100. 100.

    Brachiator

    @catclub:

    RE: The other problem is that Israel will do everything they can to prevent Iran from being able to develop nuclear weapons.”

    I bet they would not permit mutual inspections to show they have no nuclear weapons. Would they do that if Iran offered to submit to the same?

    Interesting proposition. Iran claims that their nuclear program is non-military. Israel is not making a similar claim.

    The situations are not equivalent.

    Also, the facts on India and Pakistan buttress my point. India is not bossing Pakistan around any more or less than before.

    Pakistan sponsored an outrageous terrorist attack against India in 2008 knowing that India would not declare war and risk a tactical nuclear response.

    So yeah, let’s give Iran the bomb (even though liberals are supposed to be anti-nukes). I’m sure that peace will break out all over the Middle East.

    @? Martin:

    And toss in the complications by Saudi Arabia who says that if Iran develops a bomb, they’ll need to seek them as well – possibly buying them from Pakistan.

    Yeah, classic definition of a cluster bleep.

  101. 101.

    gene108

    @catclub:

    India, Pakistan and Israel never signed the NPT.

    Iran did.

    North Korea did.

    The NPT’s been, from whatever estimates I’ve read, effective in limiting the spread of nuclear weapons throughout the world. If NPT member countries start violating the treaty, then what’s to prevent a nuclear arms race that was feared 45 years ago?

    It’s one thing if a handful of states – India, Pakistan and Israel – opt out.

    If everyone else, who actually signed the treaty, starts arming you can create serious problems.

    If Iran was serious about peaceful nuclear power, they’d be more forthcoming, when the IAEA comes to inspect their facilities. Hell, they’d probably have GE lobbying the U.S. to help finish the power plants they were building for the Shah back in the 1970’s.

    At some level Iran and Pakistan are their own worst enemies. Iran by playing games with IAEA inspectors.

    Pakistan by having their official government position as giving “moral support” to terrorists, who attack India over the past two decades. At some point, when you have terrorists training and running around your country and you have encouraged them, don’t cry about the U.S. doing your job for you by bombing them. A responsible government would not allow third party actors to carry out international attacks against your neighbors from within your borders.

  104. 104.

    gene108

    @Brachiator:

    Pakistan sponsored an outrageous terrorist attack against India in 2008 knowing that India would not declare war and risk a tactical nuclear response.

    If India could get Pakistan to go away and leave them alone they would.

    India has a bigger place in the world than getting into pissing contests with Pakistan.

    In the four wars the countries have fought India has always held back and conceded territorial gains, when peace talks began. I think the past it may have been some degree of Gandhian idealism that caused this.

    Right now it has more to do with the fact the material cost to India for war with Pakistan isn’t worth what little benefit it will derive. India is growing and Pakistan in stagnant. India knows this.

  107. 107.

    Anoniminous

    @Linda Featheringill:

    This election is so bizarrely off-the-charts weird I think we can take our preconceptions and toss ’em; everything We Know is huh?

    My gut feeling is telling me it’s going to be a landslide. Countering that is the last time I followed my gut feeling I ate a plate of jellied eels with oyster sauce over brown rice. (The aftermath was double-plus ungood.)

  109. 109.

    NonyNony

    @Bubblegum Tate:

    Center-right nation! … 2010 elections! … Scott Walker survived recall! … Biased polls are lying! … Fiscal cliff! … Mitt Romney has a plan!

    BINGO!

    Oh, I’m sorry. Weren’t we playing Wingnut Bingo?

  112. 112.

    kindness

    I think the walrus analogy is a good one for Morris. I’d change a couple things though:

    the gold medalist of this event by far is Dick Morris, who sits there on the Fox set like a betumored walrus on an ice floe assuring his viewers not to worry, even as he is circled by a pack of hungry Orcas who occasionally surface to eye their fat prize and occasionally nudge the ice to topple the Walrus off. Sadly for the Walrus, there will be no glories of sucked toes with these Orcas.

  113. 113.

    Catsy

    @daryljfontaine:

    Always get your point across that gays shouldn’t marry or have any rights.

    I call bullshit. They gave away the satire with this line.

    It’s good stuff, but I’d bet just about anything that it’s a spoof.

  114. 114.

    David in NY

    @daryljfontaine: Only “truthiness” not truth. The rules for trolls are not at all the rules that I see them follow here and on other similar blogs. They aren’t very good rules, and the trolls I run into are much craftier than the script would suggest (although they may have a script of their own).

    Unlike Catsy, I don’t even think this is “good stuff,” in the sense of good satire, but chacun a son gout.

    @Catsy:

  115. 115.

    danielx

    With Obama’s lead in several swing states becoming insurmountable, the right has begun to panic—by denying reality altogether.

    Begun to panic, I can buy (and enjoy – greatly). But begun to deny reality altogether? This is neither new or news either one, it’s more or less standard operating procedure for wingnuts. The reality-based community is alive and well, the unreality-based community is alive.

    Well? Not so much.

  116. 116.

    catclub

    @gene108: “At some level Iran and Pakistan are their own worst enemies. Iran by playing games with IAEA inspectors.”

    I fully agree. And to the same extent that I did not understand why
    Saddam Hussein did not make it easier for inspectors, I do not really understand their motivation. But it seems that maximum uncertainty for your neighbors, as to your capabilities, is the common thread between the two.

    @Brachiator:

    “The situations are not equivalent.” Indeed, they are not.
    But I was just pointing out something I doubted Israel would do to avoid Iran getting nuclear weapons.

    “So yeah, let’s give Iran the bomb (even though liberals are supposed to be anti-nukes). I’m sure that peace will break out all over the Middle East.”
    I don’t think acquiescing is the same as giving them the bomb.
    I don’t think peace is breaking out under present conditions, and I doubt it would be much worse if Iran did have nuclear weapons.

    Gene’s point that Iran signed the NPT is relevant.

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