We’ll be up and running on the CoverItLive machine around 8:30 tonight. I sent any front pager who participated last time an invite. Hopefully Joe Patrice will also liveblog in a post without comments so we can hear what a real debate expert has to say. Joe has an interesting post up about how Obama should handle the Benghazi question, which was written before Hillary took the blame but is still relevant.
Mark Halperin finally did something useful and dug up the debate rules. Here are some highlights from Elspeth Reeve at the Atlantic (via OTB):
No reaction shots. “To the best of the Commission’s abilities, there will be no TV cut-aways to any candidate who is not responding to a question while another candidate is answering a question or to a candidate who is not giving a closing statement while another candidate is doing so.” TV guys, you so broke this rule.
The town hall will be strictly regulated. In the town hall debate Tuesday, Candy Crowley “shall select the questioners, but she may not ‘coach’ the questioners.” Questioners cannot ad lib their questions. Crowley cannot ask follow-ups. If a questioner tries to as a follow-up, they will cut off his microphone.
No show of hands. This could be because Obama keeps attacking Romney for raising his hand at a Republican primary debate when the candidates were asked whether they’d take a deal that was 10 parts spending cuts to 1 part tax increases. Or it’s just because those questions are inexact and frustrating.
No shout outs. The candidates are forbidden from calling out to a person in the audience unless it’s a family member.
No accessories. Romney is not allowed to bring his PowerPoint or any other “tangible things.”
No direct questions. Obama and Romney aren’t supposed to ask each other stuff, like “What about the Dingell-Norwood bill?”
No demanding anyone take a pledge.
No audience clapping.
No sweat. “The Commission shall use best efforts to maintain an appropriate temperature as agreed to by the campaigns.”
As in many other things in life, rules so goddam stupid and overcomplicated end up being broken on the fly as both candidates push and the moderator does what s/he thinks best.
barath
As I mentioned in another thread, Crowley has never met a GOP talking point she doesn’t like, so if she injects herself into the debate, it’s to throw the debate for Romney…
Meanwhile, Paul Ryan has been doing some volunteering:
boomantribune.com/story/2012/10/16/8140/9796
Hunter Gathers
A good drinking game would involve chugging a beer every time Crowley says ‘Some people say’. You’ll be praying to the porcelain goddess before the first commercial.
Zandar
Too bad Dickwhisperer immediately followed up that useful thing he did by awarding Romney the states of Florida, North Carolina, Virginia and Ohio, setting off another week of DEMS IN DISARRAY.
amk
@Hunter Gathers: Is that cow allowed to ask such stupid questions ? I thought she was supposed to be justa post box for audience questions.
Ash Can
@barath: I don’t like the fact that she’s the one choosing the questions. Look for Romney to be asked what his favorite color is and for Obama to be asked to recite Joyce’s Ulysses by heart.
comrade scott's agenda of rage
@barath:
She’s already yammering about doing exactly that:
dailykos.com/story/2012/10/15/1144881/-In-pre-debate-planning-Candy-Crowley-and-the-Villagers-go-rog…
The next time somebody says anything about a level playing field, I’ll point out the shitastic debate “moderators” this time around. Lehrer’s always been overrated and his performance last time finally let people see the man behind the curtain. Crowley, as noted above, is a Repup stenographer on a good day. Schieffer is on par with Lehrer.
If Candeeeee decides to ignore the rules and interject herself into the process, the Prez better have his A-game running because it’ll be 2-On-1 up there on the stage.
Quarks
What’s wrong with follow up questions?
comrade scott's agenda of rage
@Quarks:
The piece I link to over at Teh Orange goes into that a little bit:
Anya
@amk: Not cool calling a woman a “cow” even if she’s a tool. You should know better.
Robin G.
Yay Joe Patrice! I want him to label the exact moment where Romney’s solvency crumbles to dust under the weight of Obama’s disads.
barath
Meanwhile, here’s a subtext for this election, if you thought the stakes couldn’t get higher:
and
Quarks
@comrade scott’s agenda of rage: Yeah, I can see putting some sort of time limit on the audience questions, or saying, ok, you have a max of three questions, but I can’t see any good reason for not letting an audience member ask a follow up question if either the person thought the question wasn’t really answered (which happens a lot in these debates) or if the answer to the question itself brought up more questions, which happens in real life conversations all the time.
mai naem
@barath: If you watch the Ryan video at the soup kitchen, it’s kind of disconcerting how non-chalantly he grabs the clean pans and starts washing it. He even manages to almost succeed in keeping the inside of the pan facing away from the camera. I just have to think he’s done it a bunch of times before to pull it off so smoothly. Also, they brought the aprons with them? Wow. These campaigns think of everything don’t they.
Keith G
Over the weekend on PBS I watched an ” animals in the wild” program who’s key element was a contest for dominance and leadership between two males. I was fascinated by the parallels. In such contests, nature seems to favor the tactics and displays of the more aggressive; yet, those traits may not be the best for the day to day running of the family group.
In the case of this program (upper level mammals I’m not saying anything more), the more aggressive male did win and then overtime proceeded to dismantle what had been a long running success of the original family group. Territorial conflicts with neighboring family groups just took its toll on the increasingly ragged group of mammals
mai naem
@Zandar: Now you got me all confused I thought dickwhisperer was Dana Millbank. I thought Halperin was Atrios’ douchebag of the decade.
barath
@mai naem:
I hear Joe Biden did a photo op the other week washing clean Trans Ams, so both sides do it.
Kane
Doesn’t Obama have to win this one so that the media can sell their Thrilla in Manila for next week?
comrade scott's agenda of rage
@Quarks:
Again, the piece I link to asks exactly that question. I know some folks here have a distaste for Teh Orange but the vast majority of the Front Pagers know their shit and it’s worth reading.
Almost nothing else there is worth reading to include the comment section.
barath
@Keith G:
You should check out Schneier’s recent book Liars and Outliars – it’s a fascinating exploration of that topic (and much more).
gogol's wife
@mai naem:
Dickwhisperer is definitely Milbank. Halperin said it out loud on national television.
quannlace
You gotta love somebody named Elspeth.
******
Aargh, what will I have for my background noise today? All the news channels will be ‘debate-debate-debate’ and all the public radio stations have started their begathons!
Trapped!
Joe Patrice
For the record, I’m not sure Hilary’s statement changes the approach the President should take. In fact, I think it supercharges it. Now he can explain what we all should have known already — that the POTUS does not make individual staffing assignments for every facility in the world — while saying he accepts ultimate responsibility as the chief executive and that’s why he fought for more security and why he will never apologize for taking the aggressive steps to fight al Qaeda that angered these terrorists.
AND I think this whole thing may be a big trap that Romney is waltzing into…Hilary accepts responsibility as the person who actually had a role and then the President jumping in and saying, “true, but I always bear ultimate responsibility” then becomes the tool for bludgeoning Mitt Romney as he tries to worm out of Bain Capital arguments saying, “I was the CEO still, but I’d left the day-to-day management of Bain.”
Princess
Honestly, I think Obama does better if Candy goes all in on Team Romney. He’s always better against an aggressive opponent. I think that was why he seemed somewhat passive in the first debate — Lehrer was too mushy. The worst interview I ever saw Obama give was with Olbermann. The best was when he took on the whole Republican congress. He’s better with hardballs than softballs.
Steve Crickmore
The candidates may not ask each other direct questions during any of the debates .
That would be be very unpleasant in a presidential debate, in a republic. Candidates being able to ask each other a direct question, in which we might actually see the candidates engaged and learn something from their answers and questions.
This prohibition pretty well nullifies the point of having a debate, unlike say, question period in the British House of Commons. No wonder, most of the time Obama looks like a grinning turkey up on stage, and Romney’s smile looks like it is ready to crack.
Central Planning
I think we should list some other rules of the debate.
For example:
Romney addressing Obama All responses must begin with “Ni*clang* please!”
Palli
Fundamental changes in the debate structure and “guidelines” (since rules are ignored) would make our country so much better informed. I liked many of Lawrence O’Donnell’s ideas last week, including, notes on the podium, advance questions (though the spectrum of politically media viable issues is pretty obvious now).
videocafe.crooksandliars.com/heather/lawrence-odonnell-rewrites-rules-president
Robin G.
@Joe Patrice: Oooh. Oooh, I like that. Have I mentioned recently that you are awesome? Excuse me while I inappropriately fangirl.
amk
It’s finally here. The details of mittbot’s tax plan..
It’s fabulous.
Villago Delenda Est
Crowley is Rethug scum. I’d say fuck her, but I wouldn’t fuck that skank with Mitt Romney’s small dick.
That having been said, these rules are bullshit. We do not have ‘debates’. We have joint press conferences. I’d like the candidates to be given a question, then have a back and forth between them about the question. That of course will never happen, because Obama would kick Rmoney’s parasite ass all over the fucking stage and the horse race narrative would be annihilated in the process.
Our media must be burned to the ground and rebuilt.
Robin G.
@amk: That is glorious. GLORIOUS.
catclub
No cut away shots are in the rules, but how about split screens? Golf announcers while they are answering? Gongs?
Be creative here!
Villago Delenda Est
@mai naem:
Halperin might be the douche of the decade, but the wanker of the decade is the Moustache of Understanding.
catclub
@Central Planning: So obama comes back with Honky and ‘whitebread’ ?
Could be funny. Until Mitt Romney has the football with the nuclear codes and someone loses more than an eye.
Yutsano
@catclub: Entertainment people, ENTERTAINMENT!! Gotta get those eyeballs dontchaknow.
Villago Delenda Est
@Ash Can:
Crowley (to Rmoney): He who would cross the bridge of death must answer me these questions three, ere the other side he see!
Rmoney: Ask me the questions, bridgekeeper, I’m not afraid!
Crowley: What is your name?
Rmoney: Mitt Romney
Crowley: What is your quest?
Rmoney: To be President of the United States
Crowley: What is your favorite color?
Rmoney: Red
Crowley: OK, off you go!
Crowley (to Obama): STOP! He who would cross the bridge of death must answer me these questions three, ere the other side he see!
Obama: Right, I’ve heard all that. Ask away.
Crowley: What is your name?
Obama: Barack HUSSEIN Obama.
(Crowley shudders a bit on the “HUSSEIN” part)
Crowley: What is your quest?
Obama: To be win reelection to the Presidency.
Crowley: What is the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow?
Obama: What do you mean? An African or European swallow?
Crowley: What? I don’t know that….aieeeeeeeeeeeee!
Biden: How do you know so much about swallows?
Obama: Well, you have to know these sort of things when you’re a black President, you know…
Ash Can
@quannlace:
If you like classical music, you could livestream WFMT, and if you like jazz you could livestream WDCB. :)
Kirbster
If those are the actual rules, why even have a live audience? Who cares if someone in the auditorium with a crappy microphone stands up to ask a pre-selected question? Candy Crowley will probably have to repeat the question anyway so that the candidates and people watching at home can hear it clearly. No applause? No reaction shots? Why do the candidates even have to be in the same city, much less on the same stage?
Ash Can
@amk: HAHAHAHAHA! And it’s a DNC site too! Love it!
amk
Updated Iowa early voting
Total votes 241,178 (15.6% of 2008 votes)
Dem 51.4%
Rep 29.1%
None/Others 19.5%
bcinaz
I liked these things better when they were run by the League of Women Voters and were, you know, debates.
LanceThruster
No coloring outside of the Kabuki dance lines.
LanceThruster
@bcinaz:
So true. And I also miss the position statement comparisons done as they do in newspapers for the local elections.
The LoWV should just put out an extensive blank questionnaire in grid form like a scorecard and let the voters fill in the blanks based on the answers/positions of the candidates (with amended/dated sections for candidate revisions – Mitten’s scribble sheet would highlight how he’s been all over the map).
Prominence could be given to questions that deserve answers but were not asked by the MSM nor answered by the respective parties/candidates (this would have been nice/helpful during previous primaries in order to keep the views of the Ron Pauls and Ralph Naders from being marginalized/ignored).
Furthermore, omissions could be spotlighted by opposition candidates such as drawing attention to what exactly OvenMitt could be hiding in his unreleased tax returns.
I truly despise how poorly voters are served in the process, and we need to find some way collectively to demand an end to the pablum we’re spoon fed every election cycle.
vernonlee
@Quarks:
Right!
Also, too: It would be smart for Obama to ask follow-ups of the town hall guests.
blingee
Regardless of so called “Rules” I expect a disprportionate amount of ‘gotcha’ questions for Obama. I expect Crowley to be in instigator of a lot of these by picking old white southern looking people. I expect Crowley to pull a few other stunts as well.
Rmoney will have some tricks too. I expect he will probably try act like the man to beat rather than the aggressor last time and the Village will say afterwards how Obama was such a meany. Someone on CNN and/or Faux will call Obama an angry black man at which point everyone should put down their shot glasses and inject heroin into their neck.
Maude
Hillary Clinton said her piece in Lima Peru last night. The day before the second debate.
She is sabotaging. Now Obama has to make the ultimately responsible statement.
The Republicans will have fun with this.
If Clinton really thought she was responsible for the security at Benghazi, she would have immediately resigned after the attack.
Her statement just made it harder for Obama. Thanks, Clinton.
Tractarian
Unbelievable. Recall that it was the split-screen during the Denver debate that revealed Obama’s sneering, looking down, and generally poor optics for the President.
There is no doubt that the split-screen was a big reason that Romney was deemed to have dominated that debate.
And the split-screen was against the rules.
JustRuss
My memory’s not perfect, but I’d swear I read yesterday that Crowley thinks follow-ups are part of her role as moderator. So did she not even read the rules (yes, I expect a lot, I know), or just decide to blow them off?