Calling Elizabeth Warren “Professor” over and over may not be enough:
President Obama is given a brief cameo in a new ad Wednesday in the Massachusetts Senate race — by Republican Sen. Scott Brown, who has been trailing Democratic challenger Elizabeth Warren in this heavily Democratic state.
“I’ve kept my promise to be an independent voice,” Brown says. “I put people ahead of politics, and now I need your help to keep that independent tradition alive in Massachusetts.”
Audio then plays from Brown making a stump speech, along with images that include a photo of Brown meeting with Obama: “Let me tell you, things would be a lot better in this country if more people in Washington were willing to think for themselves, and work with each other for the good of America.”
Here’s Young Gun Paul Ryan giving Scott Brown his orders, waaaay back in 2010:
Scott Brown’s victory in Massachusetts had made passing Democratic health-care reform through the democratic process impossible. In the campaign, Brown had promised the voters of Massachusetts he would be the 41st vote in the Senate against Obamacare and they took him up on his offer.
And, speaking of health care, this didn’t get a lot of play, but then nothing that’s actually in the health care law gets a lot of play, so I’m not all that surprised:
The Obama administration will soon take on a new role as the sponsor of at least two nationwide health insuranceplans to be operated under contract with the federal government and offered to consumers in every state.
These multistate plans were included in President Obama’s health care lawas a substitute for a pure government-run health insurance program — the public option sought by many liberal Democrats and reviled by Republicans. Supporters of the national plans say they will increase competition in state health insurance markets, many of which are dominated by a handful of companies.
The national plans will compete directly with other private insurers and may have some significant advantages, including a federal seal of approval. Premiums and benefits for the multistate insurance plans will be negotiated by theUnited States Office of Personnel Management, the agency that arranges health benefits for federal employees.
John J. O’Brien, the director of health care and insurance at the agency, said the new plans would be offered to individuals and small employers through the insurance exchanges being set up in every state under the 2010 health care law.
No one knows how many people will sign up for the government-sponsored plans. In preparing cost estimates, the Obama administration told insurers to assume that each national plan would have 750,000 people enrolled in the first year.
Under the Affordable Care Act, at least one of the nationwide plans must be offered by a nonprofit entity. Insurance experts see an obvious candidate for that role: the Government Employees Health Association, a nonprofit group that covers more than 900,000 federal employees, retirees and dependents, making it the second-largest plan for federal workers, after the Blue Cross and Blue Shield program.
It would really make me happy to see Obama, Biden or Clinton make just a token stop in Massachusetts for Warren.
They could just land at Hanscom, give a speech, take off again.
Not necessary, I think, but it would be fun.
Was that snippet from ACA in the Heritage proposal back in the day? anyone know?
Bill Clinton is in Toledo Thursday, all hoarse and tired of explaining everything.
Hey look guys it’s the public option.
The Moar You Know
Scott Brown has the courage of his convictions, so much so that he’s chickened out on the final debate with Warren.
Brave Senator Brown ran away!
GEHA is a great insurance program. We’d use it but for the fact that one of my son’s specialists isn’t on it. We used BCBS FEPBLUE, which while very good, costs more than GEHA for essentially the same coverage.
How Mass can deliver Obummer a 20-30 point victory yet still keep Brown within striking distance (and possibly give the Senate to the GOP, effectively killing Obama’s SC nommys and such) is a question for the ages.
@Soonergrunt: We just took my bride off of her United Health Care and put her on my state BCBS.
No, it is not. It really truly is not. Massachusetts is not only a lot more conservative than people think it is, but we also *know* Mitt Romney. Scott Brown may be a weasel, but he’s a very charming weasel who knows how to campaign in this state and has very significant local media air cover.
I expect Warren will win, but I am worried about it – and working on her campaign (which is impressive, BTW, a first in all my life in Massachusetts – an actual *functional* democratic campaign!)
That latest Globe poll was probably an outlier. Probably. But I bet the final result is within 2%.
@Punchy: To be a ticket-splitter these days you need an awesome amount of ignorance. Which is why we see a lot of it.
It can work in the Dem’s favor as well. Obama is set to lose handily here in MO, but Claire McCaskill is looking good to defeat Akin. One of the votes that will put her in will come from my very Republican mother-in-law.
Is “Professor” an insult in any other country?
Well, if he loses it won’t be an insult here, unless you’re a Republican. I think it was a mistake for him because, honestly, he comes off as not very bright. I don’t know that he wants to invite that comparison.
Gadsden Flag Burner
Perhaps Obama could remind the good citizens that Brown made all of us pay for regulating the banks instead of having the banks pay as a condition of his vote.
Sorry, but that translates to: A lot of Massachussettians are complete and utter dumbasses.
How else do you explain the mindset that says “I want Obama in order to advance a progressive agenda, but I’ll vote for Brown in the hopes that a GOP Senate denies Obama every progressive initiative”? Seriously….WTF?
Complete dumbfuckery out of the Cape State.
The Republicans really screwed up with the Senate races. Hell, even Nebraska is starting to look close.
The bigger picture on Brown is that he’s an anomaly, a GOP senator from a very blue state, who only got in with equal helpings of luck and guile. It would be astonishing if he gets reelected.
I do thing this election is the Republican party’s last chance to cling on to power before demographics renders them irrelevant. They are throwing every thing they have, including a tsunami of Citizens United money combined with the full wurlitzer, during the last parts of a long economic downturn, and it’s just not quite going to do it. If they can’t win this year, they can’t win.
@Punchy: They probably don’t want anyone to advance any particular agenda, they’re probably voting on who they like better.
What year does the ACA non-profit option kick in?
Sounds like President Roadrunner sitting up there in the White House snuck the public option in after all….. meep meep
This just in from Talking Points Memo: Poll, poll, poll, poll, poll, poll, POLL! Poll, poll, poll. Also, new poll, poll, cross-section of polls. Diagram comparing poll, poll, and poll. Poll, too.
Because, like it or not, that’s not the thought process that most Americans in any state use to choose their candidates.
In 2014. The Government Employees Health Association plan already exists, so I imagine it could be on state exchanges immediately.
Oo – I think I found it. The non profit option must be included in the exchanges.
Then I feel for the poor guy, because his surrogacy went from helpful to necessary the moment the first piece of siding got pulled off a building on the Jersey Shore. It’s all pretty much on him and Biden now, quite likely for the duration. The guy deserves a medal.
Question from an idiot, I guess. They have totals of Rep, Dem and indie votes, right. But do they know yet the Obama, Romney totals? Could a disaster be hiding in plain sight, ie. Republican females? Or am I just hoping that those girls will deliver the shiv.
The Moar You Know
@gnomedad: It got your ass killed in China under Mao.
Societies that indulge their resentment of intelligent people either get over it or die. America has a long history of beating on the smart people, with interludes where they are given only grudging respect when we need them for something.
@WaynersT: 2014. When all the exchanges go up. This sucker’s gonna be huge once it comes online and the health insurance cos are gonna be crying. Tough.
I have almost, but not quite, forgiven the Big Dog for Dick Morris and Marc Rich.
I could use a bit of help.
I’m having a bit of a debate on Facebook about the “When Obama Called the Seals got Bin Laden. When the Seals called Obama, they were ignored” crap. The only stuff I can find about it on the internet are links to Limbaugh, Breitbart, Beck, and other such purveyors of “news.”
I’m really not sure how to frame this argument because I can’t find anything to refute it, and my argument to look at the sources and where this is coming from isn’t likely to work on this person.
I’d normally give up, but I’m actually really close to defriending this person and I don’t know if I want to do that.
IMO, he will go over very well in Toledo. They should do Marcy Kaptur, Sherrod Brown and Bill Clinton. That’s like the Toledo Trifecta :)
I am mystified by the campaign that Scott Brown is running. The standout ad to me is the one featuring his wife Gail Huff, complaining about the negative Warren Campaign. This is rich stuff, coming from a campaign based entirely on Warren’s Native American claim, along with a dollop of asbestos.
Brown, despite being the native in the race, does not really understand Massachusetts. He doesn’t understand how he won last time. And as a result he’s going to be giving a concession speech next Tuesday night. Good riddance.
Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God
Re-read this, and let it truly sink in.
Imagine yourself to be one of those self-styled ‘independent’ Massachusetts voters. Romneycare is about four years old. Lots of media coverage as the Dems try to pass ACA. Yet, given the choice, you vote explicitly to deny the same for the other 49 states.
Now imagine what kind of rotten, dead-souled asshole you must be inside, and you will begin to understand the Scott Brown voter.
Old Dan and Little Ann
@Jeff Spender: I saw that one last night from one my douche bag FB “friends” who is also a birther. I ignored it b/c I am tired of yelling into an empty well.
Even if the allegations are true: Chain of command. The President and the Seals are not equals. Obama is the CinC. Period.
@Jeff Spender: The only thing I saw was from a retired major who of course would have first hand knowledge.
Has anyone seen this? Romney Administration Rescinded Reprimand for Meningitis Company
@Old Dan and Little Ann:
The problem is that I don’t mind debating people when they have an array of data and facts to back up their assertions, as well as good arguments. I respect that.
It seems to me as time goes on this gets harder and harder to find. I’m constantly inundated by arguments that driven by emotional-narratives and gut feelings with no basis in reality or fact, and it’s turning into the x-factor that drives me mad.
I can’t ignore it. I used to, but it’s starting to get to me.
@Jeff Spender: Ignored about what? I don’t get it
@Jeff Spender: That meme looks to be a fresh piece of bullshit nobody has debunked yet. Perhaps you could point out the last bit of BS about Benghazi – that Obama didn’t call it a terrorist act – was bullshit, so this one is likely to be as well.
Plus what @Linda Featheringill said.
@Gex: It’s interesting that Brown and Romney received money from the firm. The MSM won’t cover it but maybe it will make some noise in MA.
@Gex: oh please please please please (no articulate enough yet for more cogent. this could be good, and it’s technically oct).
For what it’s worth
Read more: http://www.wptv.com/dpp/news/region_c_palm_beach_county/west_palm_beach/local-gop-memo-dems-cleaning-our-clock#ixzz2AtIlaY9Z
Apparently they called for help and Obama just hung up the phone and went to bed. That’s the new meme. It has no basis in reality but it’s still being reported. I never mistook this person for a crazy, and then she went all born-again and became holier-than-thou.
I’m noticing a correlation.
But thank you for the replies. I’ll come up with something.
@Punchy: The same way NY gave LBJ a walloping landslide in ’64 while barely pulling Bobby Kennedy — the beloved brother of the beloved just-slain president — over the line by a few points. The analogous circumstances: 1) The state is massively Democratic at the presidential level but has long been known to go for “nice” Republicans in state campaigns. 2) The Republican candidate was an incumbent. 3) The Dem challenger was not seen as truly indgenous to the state the way the incumbent was.
@JPL: Which is why I am spreading it far and wide. The Internet can deliver news more broadly and accurately than the MSM can.
@scav: If you read it, there’s no doubt that the Romney administration is to blame. The people on the board that oversee these facilities are appointed by the governor.
Hey preserved Killick, me too. I’m canvassing my ward for Warren on Saturday and Sunday, doorknocking late Monday night (hanging door hanging reminders) and then poll watching on Tuesday. At this point its all about making sure that definite Warren/Obama voters make it to the polls since we have no early voting options (or none that regular people can use other than absentee balloting). Everyone here is going to go for Warren but they just want to lock down their voters and make sure everyone shows. I actually think that for the first time in a long time MA democrats are energized on a personal level by the feeling that their vote counts, even if only symbolically, to push back agains thte tea party and against romney and the right wing. Maybe the polls and the country take for granted that MA is blue, but to individual democratic voters, when you point out that Obama needs a mandate, their vote count a lot symbolically. I also think that seizing the Senate back means a lot to people who took Teddy Kennedy for granted.
These options could make life so much better for friends of mine who freelance, in whole or in part, because health issues preclude them working 9-5 jobs. Their health insurance premiums are huge, assuming they can afford coverage at all.
Please to unmoderate me? Thanks.
@EconWatcher: Yeah, but once you finish with them, you need to start working on forgiving him for Mark Penn.
Belafon (formerly anonevent)
@Jeff Spender: What exactly were they supposed to have called him for?
@Belafon (formerly anonevent): A quick reaction force. They are talking about the “former” Seal.
@SatanicPanic: Or who they think looks better in swimwear.
@eric: No. The Heritage plan was much different from the ACA in almost every detail other than having a mandate.
I basically laugh at people like that and say “You know what makes no sense about this argument? Its not Obama’s money. Why would he short shrift his own fucking troops with taxpayer money? Ask yourself on what planet Obama can both be spendthrift with taxpayer money and also not liberally spending it for his own troops, his own seals, his own people. Look at Michelle Obama and Jill Biden’s work–their obvious, focused, work for the troops, the returning veterans, and the human capital in the military. Even if you think its pandering or something and you feel that its not “sincere” like when Rush holds his fundraisers and goes off with the USO (he does that shit, right? Because Franken always did) the basic fact of the matter is that the Obama administration acts like the Soldiers and their lives matter. Maybe its to garner votes from the military but the method is the same. So its highly, highly, highly, unlikely that “when the SEALS call” Obama he doesn’t pay attention. He paid a lot of attention to Ohio–because he wants their votes. He paid a lot of attention to Chris Christie–because he wants New Jersey’s votes. Any politician who wants to stay in power is going to spend more time making people happy than fucking them over. That’s just common sense.”
@Jeff Spender: Yeah, everything I could find was from The Blaze. What strikes me as odd is that even The Blaze says “CIA operatives asked for help” in a story about SEALS. I hadn’t heard that there were any SEALS on site, and even the Blaze doesn’t say that there were. I’m not a military buff by any means, but I thought the Navy and the CIA were different entities?
@Gex: oh I read it, I’m please please pleasing for wider dissemination. It’s got all the elements.
@Belafon (formerly anonevent): The version I saw, in some wingnut post somewhere, was that the President was watching the attack through the gun camera of a remote drone, but refused to authorize the drone to fire.
I have no idea what, if any, evidence-like information was used to reach this conclusion.
Belafon (formerly anonevent)
@scav: These people make want to puke. Getting reprimanded would be “fatal” to the company.
Seriously, they should go fuck themselves. You don’t get to use that word for going out of business because you are bad at running the business. Protect your name by not poisoning people. This poisoning people and then keeping it quiet only helps until more people die.
I hate them. They are evil.
Its hyperbole. One of the men killed, a local guy to me, was an EX seal. Its just a figure of speech in order to make the comparison more stark.
@Gex: Yep, pulls together regulation, health, the bigger current repubs and all the glory of the W years. If it doesn’t make you puking and then fighting mad, you must run on batteries and have a granite CPU.
@aimai: Two of them were ex-seals.
Tyrone Woods and Glen Doherty were former Navy SEAL commandos working as diplomatic security officers. Sean Smith was a computer expert with an online alter-ego legendary in the gaming world.
Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God
You’re not the only one.
I used to blame GOP voting on ignorance and lack of information, and had sort of assumed that as information got more available and more rich, the tide would turn. We saw some of that in 2006 and 2008.
Since 2010, though, the GOP tactic is to Gaslight the whole country. “Ignore everything they’re telling you, only we know what is truly real.” A tactic popular with both the cult, and the abuser, BTW.
I never thought we’d be spending the early years of the 21st century fighting to keep Reality Itself. But there it is.
@Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God:
Yeah, its crazy turtles all the way down. When you are arguing with these guys you peel back one layer of sickening rumor (the ambassador was raped) and you find another layer of rumor (they personally appealed to Obama for help and he was drunk/lazy/went to bed) and when you challenge the first you get (Muslims always do that sort of thing) and when you challenge the second you get (Obama’s a sekrit muuslim sympathizer) and when you challenge the muslim sympathizer part you get “his church was anti american” and when you explain the entire history of the African American prophetic tradition and the history of African American Christian churches and the role of conversion in Christianity which specifically disallows a “muslim by birth/blood” as a model for understanding an adult Christian conversion you just get vacant stares and they go back to the underlying sex/race scandal.
@aimai: Oh that makes more sense. The Benghazi thing has allowed for some really great Republican overreach. If they stopped at “yeah, Obama messed up” they would maybe get some traction. But the loonies are saying it was an attempt at an October surprise- Stevens was supposed to get kidnapped, the Obama would ride to the rescue.
@aimai: Doesn’t the “drunk/lazy/went to bed” one also violate causality?
(as if they would care)
If things were happening in the afternoon or evening in Benghazi, isn’t that mid-day, afternoon in DC?
Reagan’s naps were always ok.
Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God
Nailing Jello to the Wall.
Platonic-style argument does work, if you have the endurance. (Why do you believe that? Why do you trust that source over all the others? Etc) because, eventually, their only honest answer has to be that they’ll believe what they want to believe, thank you very much, and fuck you.
But most are too cagey (or cowardly) to enter into that sort of dialog.
I’ve come to realize that a lot of these so-called low-info Wingers know damned well that they are completely full of shit, and have probably known it all along. I can forgive ignorance, we all have it. But for willful ignorance, I have nothing but utter contempt.
@catclub: Objection! Assumes round world, whereas Bible distinctly says corners. Commie-socialist-Kenyan-elitist-scientist with an effeminate latte-sipping voice!
@The Moar You Know: Pol Pot wasn’t a big fan either.
At some point in these arguments you don’t have anywhere left to go but right to the point: “the people you [the rightwing friend] are getting your news from are lying to you. That’s despicable, but the fact that you choose to believe them, when you have other choices available to you, means that you’ve got some issues of your own to deal with. I can’t do that for you. Sorry”. At that point, the friendship is probably over, at least until the other person gives up the cool aid.
This is why I keep saying that US politics is the continuation of civil war by other means. Because that is what civil conflicts do, they polarize, they destroy friendships, they split families apart. Which is exactly what politics is doing to this country. And there isn’t much of anything we can do to stop it because the only alternative is surrendering to the other side, which only encourages them to be even more extreme in their politics and even more bullying and abusive in the way they push their fake news onto us whether we ask for it or no.
@aimai: The reason arguments don’t work is because it’s not about any of the things in the arguments; it’s about putting the white back in the White House. The arguments are the means, not the motivation. So if any one argument fails, they simply haul up another.
Discussing any of it with these people is a waste of time. Their side is on the way out demographically, anyway.
Why would SEALS be calling the POTUS? If there were SEALS present, they would be contacting their chain of command, not dialing the White House.
Ask your friend for details of exactly who was calling whom. Also ask for details on sources. Then go from there. Don’t try to debunk — ask them for specifics and press.
@Jeff Spender: This from FOX is apparently the initial source of the story.
It seems that the “President ignored the requests and then went to bed” were embellishments added for extra ni-clang laziness.
GIven how many CIA folks were mixed in with the diplomatic staff, I’m guessing that the Blaze is trying to imply that the former SEALS working security were some of the CIA employees, but they don’t want to come right out and say it.
@Jeff Spender: there are 3 things you should tell your debate opponent. Obama is CinC, he approved the mission, the Seals do not call him to tell him what to do. The Benghazi CONSULATE, which is an important factoid, had it’s security request denied by the Sec o’ State, because that’s as far as those requests got. Third, the request was denied because the House cut the funding for security for our ambassadors and staff earlier, despite warnings that it would put staff at risk if anything happened. http://thehill.com/homenews/house/250237-gop-embassy-security-cuts-draw-democrats-scrutiny.
For bonus points, you can also point out that Darrell Issa, investigative car criminal extraordinaire, revealed CIA assets in his document dump, putting programs and persons still in Syria at risk.
Hmmm . . . Scott Brown has always been billing himself as Democrat Lite® — seems he’s getting liter and liter with each passing day.
@Punchy: Bay State.
@Punchy: Bay State.
If it’ll make you feel better, the emotional gut feeling arguments sometimes work for us too. People a hundred years ago didn’t rally to anti Wall Street populism because are data collection models showing how much more prosperous and efficient the economy could be under a Keynesian model (however true those were). They rallied to populist movements because FUCK BANKERS. It just so happens that in our day that sentiment happens to be directed at liberals.
@Chinn Romney: Actually, having grown up with my fair share of Massholes, Scott Brown’s brand of meanness plays very well with the Herald crowd. Too bad that paper didn’t die when Rupert Murdoch jumped ship.
@SatanicPanic: @Mnemosyne: I have heard that’s not what happened. The SEALs were not working at the consulate but were in town. They rushed over to the consulate when they heard that something was going down.
It is strange that the Republican apparatchiks are trying to disappear the significance of the anti-Muhammed video
The entire thrust of Mitt Romney’s first attack was that the President wasn’t standing up for freedom of speech because the embassy staff in Egypt distanced themselves and the US from that very video.
There is an underlying reason why they want to disappear the video.
Follow the money and see who funded the video.
Romney was crowing to Politico that Obama was going to make a mistake in October that he was going to exploit.
It’s almost like the Romney team planned to have an attack ready to launch on 9/11.
@The Moar You Know:
And for China, that went ‘die’. A hundred million deaths in just one of the famines caused by his hatred of academics. Starvation, environmental damage, corruption, fantastic amounts of pointless suffering, and annihilating the industrial infrastructure every time they built a new one – Mao made China into Hell.
Oh that Chris Christie
He makes Morning Ho swoon
Oh my, he’s so bing and strong!
And bold and brash!
So incredibly bold that he actually says nice things about the president & FEMA when his state gets ravaged by a hurricane and all residents are in dire need of federal assistance!
Oh swoon! How incredibly brave to not bite the hand that feeds you.
I think I just pee’d myself.
According to Wikipedia, the two former Navy SEALs who died in the attack, Glen Doherty and Tyrone Woods, were assigned to consulate security. I’m not sure who these other mythical SEALs were who happened to be in town and showed up to help, but the two SEALs who were killed were consulate employees.
(I have to confess, until I saw his picture, I assumed Tyrone Woods must have been African-American based on his name. That’s what I get for stereotyping.)
That’s why North Carolina is on the verge of having a Republican Governor, Republican Legislature in both Houses for the first time, since Reconstruction.
The demographic shift is overblown. Too many states had their Democratic parties get steam rolled to irrelevance in the 1990’s and the 00’s. There’s no indication of a recovery around the corner and until that happens the demographic shift won’t matter.
A strong Presidential candidate like President Obama maybe able to put a state like North Carolina in play, but Al Gore and Bill Clinton carried states such as Louisiana, Arkansas, and Tennessee 20 years ago and those states are solidly Republican now.
I’m still curious about that, too. One of the alleged consulate attackers was killed by security forces in Egypt, so I still suspect some kind of cross-border plan since the American embassy in Egypt was attacked that same night. I also suspect there are a whole lot of government officials in Egypt running around trying to cover their asses because they thought getting involved in the conspiracy was low-risk.
Also, so far there hasn’t been very much to dilute my theory that the plan was specifically to assassinate Ambassador Christopher Stevens and that the attackers had some foreknowledge that he was going to be in the less-protected consulate rather than at the embassy that night.
Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God
The cops and State Troopers luuurve themselves some Scott Brown. The firemen, who also went Brown in 2010, seem to be going to Warren this time around.
(Just some anecdotal data, worth exactly what you paid for it).
@Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God:
And sure, some did just that thing. They either didn’t like it, or thought that it was up to the other states to do what we’d just done. I’m not defending that opinion, it sucks, but it was out there.
They also voted against the express, stated, deepest desire of someone who had served them for decades, Ted Kennedy. So it’s doubly nasty.
But you had a Coakley campaign that was a truly epic fail: an attitude of “I deserve this seat”, and general complacency that was breathtaking to behold – countered by a guy who is charming and photogenic and one of the guys and who worked his everloving ass off for the job. Plus his little pickup. And he sold himself, *is* selling himself, as an independent.
I wasn’t surprised. I was upset. And I will work my ass off for Warren.
That said, bucket Massachusetts as a state that is deep, deep blue only at your peril. This state has a deep grained conservatism and a desire for a sane republican that could be easily tapped at the national level.
@Mnemosyne: That part of the wiki entry seems thinly sourced, but our respective mileages may vary. From what I understand, they weren’t attached to the ambassador or consulate staff and were at another location when things started.
@gene108: You’re missing the big picture. The white South has gone completely over to the GOP, but they’re the outliers. The rest of the country hasn’t given the Republicans over 300 electoral votes since 1988.
Remember when Dem presidential candidates used to get steamrolled all the time? (McGovern, Carter in ’80, Mondale, Dukakis.) That never happens anymore, and instead the only Republican presidential victories are by tiny electoral margins, while the Dem victories are always decisive, at least in electoral votes.
We’re about to reelect a black man, in the midst of a bad economy. This is a sea change.
If you have a link for that, I’d be interested to see it. Every story I’ve seen said that Doherty and Woods were assigned to the embassy.
D’oh! I meant consulate, but FYWP won’t let me edit my comment.
Yes: in Jesusland….
@Mnemosyne: I think you and GregB have far too lively imaginations.
Either GOP apparatchiks paid for the anti-Mohammed video
_OR_ there was a cross border conspiracy to assassinate a US ambassador. Not both. Not both on 9/11 anniversary.
neither is also a candidate here.
Well, but basically Scott Brown has to lie even about the kind of middling Republican he actually is–he is basically selling himself as a bog standard “independent” Senator with the implication that when the chips are down he votes with the (sane) democrats. Even MA republicans don’t have any quarrel with the Senate Democrats or with Obama (really) on policy issues. But Brown specifically appeals to people who haven’t go a fucking clue what the Senate or the Obama administration does on a daily basis. Brown won’t admit publicly to any of his real votes and obfuscates the meaning of his fake votes as well as his role as a broker or tie braker in the Senate. His ads are all aimed at either attacking warren or lying about his record. Taht’s what MA voters mean when they say they want a good repbulican like Brown. And since he doesn’t even fit the bill he’s marketing himself under its hard to see how that would actually do well nationwide. That was Romney’s shtick as well and the Republicans hated him for it all around the country. They are holding their nose and voting for him now not because he was a sane, middle of the road republican but because they believe he is an even bigger asshole than they have been led to believe by his record.
They were working for the embassy. The guys were buried and a full description of their actual jobs was given at that time. They weren’t wandering around a foreign country as free lance paramilitaries and if they had been nor would it have been appropriate for the Obama administration to jump to the orders of “former seals” i.e. mercenaries hired by private contractors. The people spreading these stories are completely out of touch with reality. A SEAL who is not still employed by the US government is not a “SEAL” in the sense of a permanent status–he’s an ex whose job description and loyalties are owned by his current employer, whoever that may be. The continued invocation of the identity “SEAL” as though it were a title of nobility is part of the weird pornographic jingoism of the fox crowd.
@Mnemosyne: No linky. Sorry. I heard this the old school way, over drinks with people whom I have good reason to believe. As such you can discard it, but this may come out later on. What those guys did was amazing and selfless. Maybe the entirety of the story will come out post-election.
@Punchy: Scott Brown’s appeal? my guess is he dominates the horny white guy demo…..beings that he has a couple attractive young adult daughters that they’d like to bone, while Warren, while a very bright person in her own right, from a physical standpoint doesn’t get their rocks off like a couple of hotties in their early 20’s…….
Actually, I doubt GregB’s theory (sorry, GregB!) and think it was a regional conspiracy between Islamists in Egypt and Libya who are pissed off that democracy seems to actually be working. I suppose that there’s a possibility that the Republicans were somehow tipped off that something was going to happen, but I doubt they had anything to do with the actual attack or planning of the attack.
I’m getting a lot of this from Juan Cole’s blog and the writers he’s been highlighting, FWIW.
@ranchandsyrup: Isn’t that ‘other location’ apparently the CIA safe house that Issa uncovered? So the ex-SEALs were CIA contractors at that time?
Brown’s positioning infuriates me – it really is all BS, but it’s well stated BS. I think Warren does very well with her “follow the votes” reasoning, because that’s where his claims really fall apart.
Yes. I think they’d mostly agree with Obama.
Not sure what I’m doing this weekend yet – poll watching in my town was cancelled as not being necessary, so there are a few poll watching slots in the general area, and canvassing.
@catclub: I’d like to start this comment with a healthy “Fuck Darrell Issa”. I understood that they weren’t direct contractors with the CIA, but were working jointly with CIA.
Here ya go Media Matters
They called for help and it was delivered. A QRT was ordered to respond.
Hope that helps.
Because of weak Democratic parties, you aren’t going to see an 80’s style beat down of any Republican. It doesn’t matter if Texas becomes 50%+ non-white, you need a functional Democratic party to take advantage of those demographics at the state and local level and for Congressional races, which are essential to change the political direction of this country.
Without the 1980’s sort of beat down, you won’t seen any change with Republicans.
Even with Obama’s strong showing in 2008 and a Democratic wave election, you still had McCain carrying 20 states.
300 EV’s is nice and all, but it’s a long way from the 400+ the Republican Presidential candidates carried in the 1980’s and not enough to force the Republicans to change.
What this means is every Republican will be close to becoming President, because of the solidly Republican states and the candidate just needs to flip enough toss-up states to win.
The Democratic challenger has a slight edge in EV votes, since the solidly Democratic states are more heavily populated, but this leaves both candidates needing to grab a few of the same states to become President.
The 2016 Republican candidate will start off with the same number of EV’s in his pocket as Romney has now. Maybe a more uphill battle than his Democratic challenger to becoming President, but not an insurmountable one.
Without strong Democratic parties in red states, even if people wanted to vote against Republicans, they really don’t have a lot of options and you may carry a state at the Presidential level, but that’s not enough to really change the politics of this country.
Looking at the Media Matters link that Lee has in #106, it’s possible that Doherty and Woods were assigned to the annex, not the consulate, and were part of the group that came over from the annex to help at the consulate when they came under attack.
The Republican lies that the consulate requested assistance and were denied may be confusing the issue and making your friends think that the backup assistance from the annex came on their own rather than at the request of the consulate.
It’ll do for a start. Republicans started sweeping the country at the presidential level in the late sixties, but it wasn’t until the early nineties that they solidly established themselves at the congressional level.
@Mnemosyne: I was reading through that myself (my work blocked media matters so I forget to go there sometimes). I recall there being an emphasis on them being at a “different location”. What you say is entirely plausible.
My experience with Massachusetts is it has a very conservative streak, which is similar in many ways to the South, with regards to things like women’s lib and race relations.
What sets Massachusetts apart is you don’t have a strong evangelical community, so people don’t readily identify with Bible thumpers.
The choices left to right-wingers, when you take the Bible thumping element of the GOP away leaves you with people, who are more liberal socially on many issues, like abortion, than their equally intolerant Southern counterparts.
Scott Brown is a running scared punk ass beeyotch.
Since the govt. contracted plans are part of giving people a real choice in the exchange, I would guess they will start at the same time as the exchange does.
This was mentioned in some of the press back when the deal was struck with Lieberman, and I’m sure I’ve mentioned it once or twice since on the threads here, but the public option became such a shibboleth that no-one complaining about the lack of public option addressed the value of this as an an alternative.
James E. Powell
Here’s my ridiculous idea of the moment: in states or parts of states where there is no realistic chance of a Democratic candidate winning, the Democrats should run the most liberal, charismatic person they can find. The sure-to-lose campaign has the advantage of being free from the restraints imposed by particular constituencies or donors on competitive campaigns. These campaigns would function as test laboratories for messages, for policy idea, and for marketing methods.
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