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Glad to see john eastman going through some things.

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Peak wingnut was a lie.

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You are here: Home / Politics / Domestic Politics / Boston Open Thread

Boston Open Thread

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Not sure if you are watching the coverage, but they just pumped about 1000 rounds into a boat in some suburb where the suspect was apparently hiding. They are all now standing around waiting to clear the area because they are concerned about explosives. Listening the amount of gunfire that was pumped into this dinghy, they should just move everyone back a couple hundred yards and chuck a damned grenade in the boat, because the decision to kill the kid was already made and carried through.

At any rate, all your Boston talk can go here.

Reader Interactions

204Comments

  5. 5.

    thundermonkey

    Nytimes blog shows twitter comments indicating those rounds were actually flash-bangs

  6. 6.

    JCT

    They are flash-banging the boat. Trying to confuse him – persistent concerns that he has an explosive vest.

  7. 7.

    Susan K of the tech support

    Tech support note/discovery: When you have multiple browser windows and tabs open (Chrome), with a couple of news live video feeds, and Flash crashes in another window and tab, don’t click the “Stop plugin” button if you don’t want to interrupt the live video feeds. Clicking that button stops Flash everywhere.

  11. 11.

    Violet

    Someone told NBC news that the boat may have a full tank of gas in it. Probably don’t want to risk that exploding. Nor the potential that the suspect has an explosive vest on.

  12. 12.

    mistermix

    Poor Deval Patrick. If they had put off that news conference for a half hour, he’d look like a genius.

  14. 14.

    tbunny

    It’s not some suburb. It’s Watertown. Learn some respect. I’ve only seen reports of 20 rounds, not a 1000. It’s happening about 200 yards from where all the police were assembling, press conferences were happening today.

  15. 15.

    Ben Franklin

    They’re waiting for him to bleed out. No witnesses. Suspect motives will die with them

    ‘Natch.

  21. 21.

    Ted & Hellen

    John…um, you’re kind of rumor mongering. The boat has not been peppered with gun fire.

  23. 23.

    Comrade Mary

    John, if they had put 1000 rounds into a boat with a half full tank, I think that neighbourhood would be rather BRIGHT right now. I really don’t think they’re trying to kill him. I think they want a live prisoner and some answers.

    CBS local station has confirmed flash grenades, no bullets, and there are reports that a negotiator may be coming in.

  25. 25.

    lamh35

    Jeez. this feels like the OJ Broncho chase for a new generation. everyone looking at TV mesmorized

  29. 29.

    magurakurin

    @raven:

    They keep showing the clip on the live feed. I don’t know a flash bang from a gunshot sound, but either way it was way, way more than 20. And if it was flash bangs, there must have been a hundred guys throwing grenades at the same time. Either that or they had a string of of a hundred like fire crackers.

  32. 32.

    quannlace

    God, the rumors flying around can put your eye out.

    Today they just affirmed that the two brothers never held up a 7/11.

  33. 33.

    Fort Geek

    I counted around 40 rounds (ignoring what sounded like echoes), but that could be one gun closer to the mic drowning the others out.

    8:17pm–fire reported aboard the boat…

  35. 35.

    Mr Stagger Lee

    Bravo to Exxon Cares Y’All(@aExxon Cares)via twitter about Arkansas newest celebrity, Nate Bell(I know Bobby Petrino is relieved)

    If @NateBell4AR resigns over this tweet (http://bit.ly/118aE6r ), we’ll hire him for our crisis communications. AR “Apology” experts needed!

  38. 38.

    Ben Franklin

    @raven:

    I understand there’s been a report that the older bro was wrapped in an IED (John King?0

    I understand the concern about boms. Just saying it’s convenient.

  41. 41.

    Narcissus

    Apparently the boat is on fire now.

    I’d say the boat was peppered by gunfire, it sounded like a giant friggin’ jiffy pop.

  43. 43.

    gogol's wife

    Boy, I turned on CBS although I have an ironclad rule to never watch any television that doesn’t involve Robert Osborne or Laura Linney, and it is UNBEARABLE to listen to them talking about nothing while they wait for more bang-bang. I think I have to just follow this through the Balloon Juice filter.

  44. 44.

    pat

    Don’t they usually send someone out with a megaphone pleading with the suspect to give himself up? Or is that only in the movies.

    Thousands of police closing in on one kid. Wow.

  45. 45.

    Susan K of the tech support

    @Urza: and yet, the video feeds were going strong even as another tab had the Flash belly-up notice.

  46. 46.

    Ben Franklin

    @raven:

    I have never believed they would be taken alive. You tellin’ me you don’t smell some bullshit?

  50. 50.

    cyntax

    @MattR:
    Are we sure John King’s idiocy is bound by conventional physics? Should we expand the range out -1000 to 1000 just to be safe?

  51. 51.

    raven

    OK, they may have thrown in a flash grenade first and then opened up but it is definitely what is known as a fusillade.

  52. 52.

    Feudalism Now!

    If that boat has gas in it, it goes boom anyways. Is the block evacuated of residents?

  59. 59.

    MikeJ

    @Feudalism Now!:

    If that boat has gas in it, it goes boom anyways. Is the block evacuated of residents?

    It’s really pretty difficult to make either gasoline or diesel explode.

  61. 61.

    raven

    @DarrenG: From live Boston

    NBC News is reporting that there was a small fire in the boat the bombing suspect is hiding in and that the suspect is bleeding heavily.

  64. 64.

    cyntax

    @Ben Franklin:

    Meaning what exactly? You were flogging your vague innuendo in the previous thread. If you’re suspicious, what exactly are you suspicious of? Spit out your alternate theory or put a sock in it.

  67. 67.

    JPL

    @rikyrah: My son thought they could take him alive, just to find out why.
    My opinion is those fuckers have screwed the Dream Act.

  68. 68.

    pat

    NBC reporting a “negotiator” on the scene, but are they actually at the boat, talking to him?

  70. 70.

    Violet

    @rikyrah: Taking him alive means they have a chance to find out if there are others involved. I think they want him alive so they can get info.

    NBC reporting police negotiator is on the scene to try to coax him out.

  72. 72.

    tbunny

    Sounded like 20 to me. Multiple witnesses interviewed on the scene said 20. Maybe there was a fusillade after that I don’t know.

  74. 74.

    pat

    I can’t believe they would just let this kid bleed out if they could TALK TO HIM and try to convince him to surrender.

  75. 75.

    Feudalism Now!

    ABC is reporting owner of the boat saw blood down side and lifted tarp to see body. He then called the police.

  76. 76.

    Suffern ACE

    @JPL: ok. Really, how? The republicans were going to come up with something to kill this reform, anyway. Seriously, people alive is better than people dead.

  79. 79.

    gogol's wife

    @raven:

    I don’t see what these people think the police could do if he doesn’t want to be taken alive.

  80. 80.

    Ben Franklin

    @cyntax:

    You know, I ask a question and I get a question. I am not pimping for any particular theory, except the theory that I am discussing important matters with intelligent humans. Consider something other than the tribe’s Mantra. Of course, that means you will be verklempt with the Hive.

    Now, ask me a question that makes sense, like; “Do you think this resembles any other National/International crises’.

    Then you might get a genuine response.

  81. 81.

    Violet

    @Feudalism Now!: That’s a dumb thing for the boat owner to do, if it’s true. NBC said homeowner or neighbor noticed a ladder next to the boat where there wasn’t one before and called police to report it.

  82. 82.

    raven

    @tbunny: AR 15 Rate of fire 800 rounds/min. That’s 13 rounds per second. The clip is at least 10 seconds long and it’s more than one weapon.

  83. 83.

    Morzer

    @Ben Franklin:

    Are you capable of writing intelligible, coherent English or are we stuck with your ignorance of multiple languages at the same time?

  86. 86.

    Violet

    Boston Globe twitter:

    BREAKING NEWS: Three people taken into custody in New Bedford as part of Boston Marathon terror bombing investigation.

  91. 91.

    Morzer

    @Ben Franklin:

    So, still unable to put your big theory on the table, eh, Benny? I guess that tinfoil hat must be impeding the decoder in your fillings.

  98. 98.

    cyntax

    @Ben Franklin:

    Tribe’s mantra nothing. You’re the one who found it suspicious that there was information about these guys available on the internet.

    The irony of posting these suspicions on an internet forum seems to still escape you.

    Asking uninformed questions for the sake of simply asking questions in no way represents the pursuit of wisdom or critical thought.

  101. 101.

    mclaren

    I already posted Bruce Schneier’s admonition to “keep calm and carry on” on another thread, to the usual shitstorm of raging insults and hysterical name-calling.

    Now it’s time to post Rich Pearlstein’s article urging everyone to calm down and stop the wild overreaction:

    A terrorist attack in Boston, followed by a state-of-the-art witch hunt: a cellphone picture of two Moroccans near the finish line, posted online, soon plastered on the front page of the New York Post, and suddenly lives are turned upside down for fear of vigilante justice. A Saudi national detained at the hospital, suspicious because he was “running” (running after an explosion: how suspicious), ginned up into a claim on Fox News that “he is now going to be deported on national security grounds,” then escalated by professional shrieker Pamela Geller into an obvious cover-up by the Saudi royal family in cahoots with B. Hussein Obama. (..)

    A calamitous explosion near Waco. Waco! My friend who texted is a libertarian—which sets me to thinking that if even libertarians suspect some latter-day Timothy McVeigh must be responsible, I should be speculating that, too…. And then, no: not terrorism. Just austerity, deregulation, a laggard Occupational Safety and Health Administration.(..)

    Ricin-infested letters sent to Obama and Senator Roger Wicker . The FBI arrests in a man named Paul Kevin Curtis. I find my way to the web site of the Jacksonville Clarion Ledger, hastily comb my way through “Who Is Paul Kevin Curtis?”: Elvis, Johnny Cash, Prince (??), and Bon Jovi impersonator; apparently politically motivated (“I am KC and I approve this message,” his letters read), and then—bingo! Something posted this on Facebook after the Boston bombing: “We have let God down. We removed prayer from schools in 62.” (..)

    What does it all add up to? Nothing, probably. As ghastly, evil, overwhelming, tragic, as the events this week in Boston, Texas, the Capitol mail rooms, have been, it’s easy to forget, in our oh-so-American narcissism, enveloped in the wall-to-wall coverage that makes our present catastrophe feel like the most important events in the universe, how safe and secure Americans truly are by any rational standard. Terror shatters us here precisely because ours is not a terrifying place compared to so much of the rest of the world. And also not really an objectively terrifying time, compared other periods in the American past: for instance, Christmastime, 1975, when an explosion equivalent to twenty-five sticks of dynamite exploded in a baggage claim area, leaving severed heads and other body parts scattered among some two dozen corpses; no one ever claimed responsibility; no one ever was caught; but pretty much, the event was forgotten, life went on, and no one anywhere said “everything changed.”

    A less narcissistic time, perhaps. Not now. Now, we let trauma consume us. Now, our desperate longing to know—to find easy, immediate answers—confines us, makes us frantic, reduces us to our basest cognitive instincts.

    Source: “On Our Politics of Fear,” Rick Pearlstein, The Nation, 19 April 2012.

    All too many of the commenters on this forum have become demented with baseless fear. Stop it. Just stop. Calm down. This is not a major incident, the police and FBI will catch the guy, and life will go on.

  102. 102.

    tbunny

    This is the most important conversation ever. John said 1000, I said not a 1000, you’re saying not 20. Let’s give ourselves nobels.

  103. 103.

    Violet

    Boston Glob twitter account:

    BREAKING NEWS: Globe photographer can hear police say, “We know you’re in there. Come out on your own terms. Come out with your hands up.”

  105. 105.

    magurakurin

    @Ben Franklin:

    You know, I ask a question and I get a question.

    The same, boring, endless act of innocence. Every time, every issue you act as if there is no past history with you. Yet, everyone here has read through countless derailed threads where your “questions” lead to a tiresome, useless downward spiral. Yes, if you had never posted here before your “question” could be seen as an innocent, genuine inquiry. Except that shit ain’t the truth…and we all know it, all too well…

  106. 106.

    Morzer

    @Ben Franklin:

    And as usual you can’t put your big conspiracy theory on the table, because you don’t have one.

    You may now return to howling on demand.

    Yap away, little clown.

  111. 111.

    Morzer

    @magurakurin:

    I am getting the impression that not many people in the real world want to talk to our little blog-stalker. I guess they prefer to be friends without Benny.

  112. 112.

    Feudalism Now!

    The boat owner went out after the ban was lifted according to neighbor and was getting some air in his back yard. He saw blood and saw shape under shrink wrap.

  113. 113.

    Ben Franklin

    @cyntax:

    And asking supercilious questions which ostensibly makes me incredible, whilst dancing like a Whirling Dervish around those matters you don’t wish to think about, makes you about the dumbest fuck on Earth. Capiche ?

  122. 122.

    beltane

    Police scanner: Suspect in custody! Medic, medic!

    There could be many suspects for all kinds of crimes in Watertown at any given moment though.

    What is code 17?

  123. 123.

    Sammi

    This reminds me of the 1997 search for Andrew Cunanan, killer of Gianni Versace and others. Miami Beach was not on lockdown but was scared about killer who was on the loose for a few days. He was found on a boat.

  130. 130.

    magurakurin

    they got him alive…quick call Huckleberry Grahm so we can greenlight his flight to Gitmo…

  132. 132.

    Unsympathetic

    @Ben Franklin: And acting like you’re above it all makes you dumber than him. Capiche? If you want an intelligent discussion, YOU are responsible for that outcome. You want to have a discussion with someone? Then YOU stop taking personal offense or crafting strawmen. YOU subtly re-route it to your desired outcome. If you don’t, YOU are the ass. You’re always responsible for 50% of conversation – you’re never above it. Don’t like it? Deal, leave, and never come back — you won’t be missed.

    While i was typing that, he surrendered and is out of the boat.

    It’s over. Thank God.

  134. 134.

    gbear

    @Comrade Mary: Thanks for that link. I’ve been hooked for the last 10 minutes. They’re just doing good reporting without speculation.

    Just heard that cheering has broken out at the site and police are walking away.

  136. 136.

    Morzer

    @Ben Franklin:

    Poor Benny Shill, your conspiracy theory just disintegrated into a cloud of bull-farts.

    Why does this always happen to you, I wonder?

  137. 137.

    Comrade Mary

    CBS is reporting a sense of relief and even a lot of applause at the scene.

    Because they’re all bloodthirsty and genuinely wanted to kill the guy?

    Nope. They got him alive.

  141. 141.

    jo6pac

    The main theme is we as a country don’t want to hear what he has to say. Then again why would we want to. I’m sorry but tin foil hat on this this doesn’t add up.

  144. 144.

    Mr Stagger Lee

    And when the trial begins, it will be cable TV bonanza bigger than Casey Anthony.

  148. 148.

    TooManyJens

    @Morzer:

    Poor Benny Shill, your conspiracy theory just disintegrated into a cloud of bull-farts.

    I can’t wait to read the updated theory. This will all prove BF’s point. Somehow.

  150. 150.

    Keith G

    Now…Let’s stick a shive in fucking Lindsey Graham and do this process by the numbers.

  152. 152.

    cyntax

    @Ben Franklin:

    Try Ecclesiastes 1:9.

    Oh, and looks like at least one of your “suspicions” was wrong: they seem to have the second suspect in custody. Is your next original thought to raise “suspicions” about how he’ll be Jack Ruby-ed?

  154. 154.

    NotMax

    C’mon, reporters. It’s a trivial sidebar point, but what is the name of the boat?

  155. 155.

    ChrisNYC

    @raven: No, no, no. You don’t understand the new internetty version of due process. You do whatever you want, kill, harm whoever you want and then hole up, preferably taking shots at the cops outside. The important part is — whatever you do, refuse to submit to process. Then, when you decide to commit suicide by cop, you were DENIED process. And, you were not killed, you were assassinated. You are now a martyr. It’s very tricky.

  156. 156.

    Bobby Thomson

    That is surprising. Really excellent work.

    I hope the boat owner has good homeowner’s insurance.

  158. 158.

    Feudalism Now!

    Shots were fired by suspect not police. Police instructed not to return fire and use stun grenades and robots to rock boat and knock it over.

  159. 159.

    Unsympathetic

    @jo6pac:

    All conspiracy theories fail Occam’s Razor. This isn’t a false flag operation, this isn’t TheNextGreatPlotToStealGuns!!11ELEVENTY

  160. 160.

    MattR

    @TooManyJens: Didn’t you know the older brother isn’t really dead but the gov’t is whisking him away to Gitmo in secret? I am actually shocked I have not heard this conspiracy floated yet followed by calls to allow the public to see the body.

  161. 161.

    lojasmo

    I’m sure Ben Franklin will toddle along to eat crow in one of the next few comments.

  164. 164.

    lamh35

    Ok, I am now a CBS News and Scott Pelley convert. CBS news has been the most calm, cool and collected of all the national nets and cable news net. Mr Pelley’s calm demeanor and the news staff cautionary reporting was well appreciated in comparison to the other idiot news programs.

  167. 167.

    Morzer

    @lojasmo:

    Oh Clown Prince Benny will turn up to explain that this just proves that law enforcement had planned to kill the guy, but once he told the world the TRUTH (in kook kapitals) they decided to keep the guy alive just to cover up the real conspiracy.

  168. 168.

    D

    NBC reports that suspect has been captured. Idiot talking head immediately begins “rhetorically” asking whether or not he should be subject to “military style” interrogation or given a Miranda warning. I had totally forgot that such beliefs were even plausible until NBC helpfully reminded me that “some people believe” that we should torture (ahem, “military style” I mean) this kid, and “others disagree. Great example of how our establishment media legitimizes positions that all right thinking people think are atrocious.

  169. 169.

    Violet

    Boston Globe twitter:

    Tsarnaev going to Mount Auburn Hospital Cambridge, same hospital where Transit Police officer is recovering from gunshot wound.

  172. 172.

    Elizabelle

    And now, the next time our Tea Partying relatives start whingeing about do nothing government employees and why do we pay taxes …

    This has been the week to put the lie to that.

    Thank you, first responders and law enforcement in so many jurisdictions.

  174. 174.

    cyntax

    @Ben Franklin:

    Depends how you mean that. If you’re talking about logistical issues and whether they had help, then yes.

    As to his motivations, maybe. He may not be able to explain his actions in any way that is meaningful to the rest of us.

  175. 175.

    Unsympathetic

    @lojasmo:

    Of course he won’t reply when he’s called out and proven wrong. He’s not man enough – he’s just a pathetic troll who can’t deal with anyone who doesn’t knuckle under to his bullying.

    The less respect shown to Ben Franklin the better this community will be. His entire plan is to ride out the people who call him out.

    Nothing ever said by Ben Franklin is ever correct – or will ever be considerate.

  176. 176.

    Keith G

    BTW, I am buoyed by the smiles I see on BPD officers. I am sure they have taken this very personally. Good for them. They have acted with great sill and honor.

    Huzzah!

  177. 177.

    Violet

    Boston Globe twitter:

    “Alive, conscious, captured” we’re told

    Conscious. Amazing.

  185. 185.

    Svensker

    I was really hoping for the kid’s sake that he would have died. He’s 19, screwed up by his big brother, will be in prison for the rest of his life, hated by all — choice of living in solitary or having snot beat out of him regularly, or worse, by other prisoners. It’s just a terrible tragedy. He would have been better off dead.

  186. 186.

    Odie Hugh Manatee

    Good thing that this is over, the epileptics in the Boston area can stop having seizures from all of the flashing lights.

  187. 187.

    Darkrose

    @Feudalism Now!: Psych! The gazebo is really a level 80 shapeshifting dracolich! Roll a d20 to see if there’s enough left for a Resurrect, or if you’re going to need a Wish spell.

    (This is why I don’t GM.)

  188. 188.

    Elizabelle

    @Svensker:

    I dunno, does that happen in federal prisons? I really don’t know.

    I am thinking he has some shot at redemption down the line, and a life of remorse, and he must like to read.

    His future is not what he expected, but he’s got one. Unlike little Martin Richard.

  193. 193.

    ChrisNYC

    @Svensker: I frankly couldn’t care less about him. I wasn’t all that horrified by any of it until the video of the two of them yesterday. And just, the backward caps, the striding around their soon-to-be-victims — that knowing, imagine walking around among people, seeing their faces and carrying that fucking knowing (“some of you may be dead soon because of my backpack”) and going through with it. Ugh. Sickening. You killed an 8 year old, tough guys. And gave his mother a brain injury. He can read, he can walk, he can think, he can eat, he can see the sun. It’s more than he gave to others.

  194. 194.

    Mr Stagger Lee

    So I guess the movie script is being written right now and I think Ben Affleck will play the negotiator and Matt Damon as an FBI investigator. Got to throw in Donnie and Mark Wahlberg in there too.

  198. 198.

    Svensker

    @Elizabelle: @Keith G:

    Oh, I agree with all those things. It’s just that I’m a mom with a kid who not long ago was 19 and that’s terribly young. What he’s facing, unless he’s a monster and I don’t think he is, may be less preferable than death, for him.

    Well, we shall see. I hope we get answers, I hope the system works, and I hope there’s redemption. What a fucking waste the whole thing has been.

    On a positive note, BPD seems to have done a fantastic job. They really should be proud of themselves.

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